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github.com/moarvm/moarvm | IRC logs at colabti.org/irclogger/irclogger_logs/moarvm Set by AlexDaniel on 12 June 2018. |
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| nwc10 | good *, #moarvm | 08:11 | |
| 3 months later, still no update: blog.pyston.org/ | |||
| (monetising infrastructure assumed to be free is hard. Let's go shopping) | 08:12 | ||
| moritz | good morning, nwc10, * | 08:35 | |
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| moritz | yes, maintaining a separate compiler/JIT/VM is really quite some work, thankless and hard to get paid for | 08:36 | |
| there are several such projects in the python world, and whenever I try them, they don't quite work for my use case | 08:37 | ||
| nuitka is one of those | |||
| nwc10 | I've heard of that one, but (like all of them) not tried it, and I forget exactly what it does. Static compiler to C? | 08:38 | |
| IIRC it's the one that Guido has dumped on. At least, the only one that I remember that Guido actually noticed enough to say that he thought something about it was not actually a sustainable idea. (But I forget why or when) | 08:39 | ||
| moritz | yes, that's the python to C compiler | 08:44 | |
| and it just had another release 4 days ago. Noice | 08:46 | ||
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| jnthn | good * | 10:19 | |
| So...can I assemble the new coffee machine before it has produced a cup of coffee? | |||
| nwc10 | this is a bootstrapping problem? | 10:28 | |
| jnthn | Pretty much | 10:29 | |
| nwc10 | in normal times this would not a problem - you'd just pop out to a nearby cafe for a "DR site" coffee | 10:31 | |
| jnthn | OK, there is coffee in my cup. It's only half full, and I can't yet figure out how to resolve that. | 10:57 | |
| nwc10 | redundant array of inexpensive cups? | ||
| just iterate on half cups until you find a solution? | 10:58 | ||
| find inspiration, I meant | |||
| jnthn | The original one was a lever-style one and I just had a water on/off switch and waited until the cup was full | 10:59 | |
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| jnthn | This is one of the fancy automatic ones that I can - once I finish my supply of ground coffee - put beans in and get freshly ground. But it wants to own the whole process. :) | 11:00 | |
| Hm, this does paste pretty good at least. | |||
| nwc10 | no, don't *paste* coffee. It will ruin your keyboard | ||
| jnthn | oops, *taste | 11:01 | |
| apparently I need to drink more of it :) | |||
| nwc10 | yes. | ||
| have you firewalled it yet? | |||
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| jnthn | I...I don't think it tries to connect to the internets. But given half the washing machines I found when I was shopping for one of those last year did, maybe I should be worried... :) | 11:04 | |
| Why do I want my washing machine online?! | |||
| nwc10 | so that someone else can mine bitcoin with it! | ||
| well, d'oh! | |||
| jnthn | OK, so finally I'm maybe ready to write some code... :) | 11:06 | |
| nwc10 | I was misremembering. CVE-2017-7240 was a *dishwasher*, not a washing machine. | ||
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| nwc10 | oh, actually it's more fun than that. I hadn't read this official grovelling admission before: www.miele.de/en/m/miele-admits-com...h-4072.htm | 11:08 | |
| jnthn | aha, I found how you configure cup size, so I can get a full cup soon :) | ||
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| [Coke] | whew | 13:40 | |
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| ggoebel | our coffee machine recently gave up the ghost too. Only 5 years old. Our experience has been that the more complicated the coffee machine is, the shorter it lasts. We now use a hot water kettle and french press. | 13:48 | |
| jnthn | Darn, this new one is more complicated than the 13-year one it replaces :) | 13:51 | |
| [Coke] | I do miss the "going to work" part of the day where you could pick up a coffee on the way (I switched to mostly work from home even before the pandemic) | ||
| jnthn | I suspect the old one may well be fixable by somebody with some sort of clue what they're doing (or me if I researched it a bit); it seems like a rubber seal has decayed | 13:55 | |
| OK, so..."just" the stateful bit of dispatch resumptions to go, and then in theory I have enough to write a test case for a dispatcher doing basic method deferral | 14:53 | ||
| jnthn wonders how long until he sees the light at the end of the new-disp tunnel... | 14:54 | ||
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| nwc10 | nine: I think I have it figured out. If you look at the camera lean on www.youtube.com/watch?v=hpqoqJxbNpw&t=0s currently - when SN9 "fell over", it was only trying to get vertical. | 18:58 | |
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| MasterDuke | www.sba-research.org/wp-content/up...coop10.pdf i just gave it a quick skim, but it looks kind of like the specializations spesh does? | 19:48 | |
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| jnthn | MasterDuke: I've looked through that one before, and yes, it's in the same solution space | 20:35 | |
| MasterDuke | ah ha, glad i'm not completely off base | 20:46 | |
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| jnthn is gradually starting to feel comfortable with the dispatch resumption design that he's implementing | 21:29 | ||
| The pieces I've put in place today have each worked first time (silly thinkos aside, but really I mean there weren't any unexpected design issues). | 21:30 | ||
| And I can see how they'll handle the gnarly stuff like nextcallee and lastcall | |||
| nwc10 | [Coke]: actually, my definition wasn't quite accurate - Wet Dress Rehersal is where you test everything about your launch process, right up to the point of (not) lighting the engines. With real fuel. | 21:33 | |
| side effect (obviously) is that you also get to test the "how to make it safe again" process that you'd have if your (for real) launch aborts before ignition. | 21:34 | ||
| jnthn | I'm also fairly happy that in a steady state of deferrals it can be allocation free, and that it will let us do the calculation of the method to defer through once-ish per `callsame` site and cache it, rather than having to calculate it every time. | 21:35 | |
| Plus that the dispatch programs it stacks up at the inline caches will provide information that will let us do specialization linking and, where size allows, inlining. | |||
| A couple of unknowns on inlining still remain, though nothing that overly worries me | 21:36 | ||
| nine | nwc10: that's an.....explanation :D | ||
| MasterDuke | jnthn: so mostly a smop left? | 21:48 | |
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| El_Che | Hi, I am able to build moarvm on 20+ distro/version combinations, except on Fedora Rawhide (the dev, next-to-be-latest OS): github.com/nxadm/rakudo-pkg/runs/1...step:5:308 | 22:04 | |
| Now building rakudo on the released fedoras 31 and 32 | 22:05 | ||
| MasterDuke | El_Che: it looks like the 3rdparty/libatomicops submodule didn't get clones/pulled somehow? | 22:10 | |
| El_Che | no | 22:11 | |
| I download the tag.gz in an action before running the container | |||
| and all the containers get the same tar.gz | |||
| (a copy) | |||
| MasterDuke | huh. then i really couldn't say | 22:12 | |
| El_Che | same here | ||
| :) | |||
| fedora 31 builds fine | 22:14 | ||
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| jnthn | No guesses either, fwiw. It's the same tarball used over all distros? Is it reproducible? | 22:46 | |
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| jnthn | MasterDuke: There's still some non-simple things to go, but at least by now I feel I'm making progress; when I last looked at this in the autumn I went through a bunch of designs that each didn't work | 22:48 | |
| Even on paper, let alone in implementation | |||
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| El_Che | jnthn: same file, reproducible | 22:53 | |
| my github flow is: | |||
| - step 1: download the sources and keep them as artefacts | 22:54 | ||
| - step 2: in parallel build the source for all the distros | |||
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| El_Che | (fedora 32 builds fine as well) | 22:55 | |
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| El_Che | so something changed between distros | 22:56 | |
| (we've seen it before in the past) | 22:57 | ||
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| El_Che | I am trying to add the next-stable releases so we can catch things like that early on | 23:00 | |
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| jnthn | El_Che: Thanks, it's really good to do that. | 23:01 | |
| El_Che: I'm not surprised that things change between distros. I *am* surprised about this particular failure mode | 23:02 | ||
| El_Che | I told lizmat earlier, that the idea to allow to run it with commits for every components as well, eg moarvm/nqp releae 2020.12 and rakudo@acdsomehash | 23:03 | |
| fork the repo, edit the version file and push and the action will run | 23:04 | ||
| work in progress :) | |||
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| El_Che | jnthn: alpine edge (dev release) fails earlier while the released alpines build fine: github.com/nxadm/rakudo-pkg/runs/1...focus=true | 23:13 | |
| I think something like new coreutils | |||
| I have seen it before | |||
| when errors don't make sense, look at the build tooling :) | 23:14 | ||
| jnthn | hah, that's an interesting one :d | 23:15 | |
| *:D | |||
| El_Che | I meant binutils | ||
| I did this for the 2020 release: | |||
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| El_Che | # binutils bug | 23:15 | |
| wget \ | |||
| de.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/m..._amd64.deb && \ | |||
| dpkg -i *.deb && rm -rf *.deb && | |||
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| El_Che | retrieved deb from an older ubuntu release | 23:15 | |
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| El_Che | all builds with the 2 aforemetioned disabled: github.com/nxadm/rakudo-pkg/action.../522238929 | 23:21 | |
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| El_Che | all green, I like that :) | 23:25 | |
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