»ö« Welcome to Perl 6! | perl6.org/ | evalbot usage: 'p6: say 3;' or rakudo:, or /msg camelia p6: ... | irclog: irc.perl6.org or colabti.org/irclogger/irclogger_logs/perl6 | UTF-8 is our friend!
Set by moritz on 22 December 2015.
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Todd_ Hi Everyone. I need to ask a question about zef. I am about to install a module with it. Is there a way to tell zef I want the module stored in the universal location and not some user's profile? 00:37
Actaully, how do I tell the zef creator I also want zef stored globally? 00:39
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Todd_ okay, I jsut did a global find on zef and removed everything. Then reinstalled zef and it when into /usr/lib64/perl6/site/bin which makes me happy. 00:44
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Todd_ `ln -s /usr/lib64/perl6/site/bin/zef /usr/bin/zef` helps too 00:48
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Todd_ just out of curiousity, where would I download Net::SMTP from? 00:56
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Todd_ foudn it: github.com/jpve/perl6-net-pcap 00:59
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Todd_ oops: github.com/retupmoca/P6-Net-SMTP 00:59
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Todd_ zef put Net::SMTP into `/home/linuxutil/P6-Net-SMTP/lib/Net` How do I fix this? 01:07
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Todd_ well, my program now runs without whining, so it must have been insalled somewhere else too 01:11
Bye bye
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zostay Zoffix: in this case they'd be the same, I just find it curious that I'm allowed to create an Array[Pair] filled with Str through the use of » 01:56
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ugexe lol... over the course of an hour, and 10 straight messages to himself, he solved all his own problems 03:47
AlexDaniel ugexe: rubber duck debugging done right 03:50
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tbrowder hi #perl6 10:23
lizmat tbrowder o/ 10:25
tbrowder i think the docs need a new entry under Language, called something like Core Modules, that lists modules included with Perl 6. they probably should also be listed in modules.perl6.org. opinions? hi, lizmat! 10:26
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lizmat tbrowder: re CORE Modules, seems like a good idea 10:27
re modules.perl6.org listing: not so sure 10:28
tbrowder yeah, i keep wasting time looking for Pod::To::Text...
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tbrowder and forgetting it is in rakudo 10:29
lizmat well, maybe that *should* live as a module, similarly to TAP.pm6 perhaps ?
tbrowder hm, sounds good to me. 10:31
which of the core modules really need to be in core? 10:33
perl 5 over the years has moved out some core modules 10:34
lizmat well, I think the list that can be moved is actually pretty small 10:35
tbrowder anyhoo, that's probably something for another time...i'll try to add a doc chunk later 10:37
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nadim Hi all. FYI: Just noticed that Panda is still referenced in INSTALL.txt 10:39
tbrowder hi, nadim, good catch, PR 10:40
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lizmat nadim tbrowder: fixed it 10:44
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nadim I also noticed that p6 --version gives this: This is Rakudo version 2017.04.3-303-gabc0509, the commit is 20 mn old (thanks lizmat) and the build is 5 mn old but the date 2017.04.03 is comming from ... well I don 10:47
I don't know where 10:48
lizmat because we had 4 .point release on 2017.04 ?
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robertle tony-o: travis works for my branch of pluggable, so I guess you just need to enable it and it would work for yours as well. also forgot to mention that the README.md is now a rendering of the pod 11:26
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tbrowder lizmat: i have a doc entry almost ready, but i notice all the core modules under rakudo/lib have a pm6 extension *except* CompUnit/Repository/Staging.pm (probably because it is used so much by zef). 11:58
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Zoffix tbrowder: don't add TAP.pm to the list. It'll be removed after today's release 12:01
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tbrowder roger! 12:01
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lizmat If you're in the Oslo area: blogs.perl.org/users/damian_conway/...-perl.html 13:24
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lizmat your chance to see Damian in action! 13:24
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lizmat although at a price and it's not about Perl 6 13:26
:-(
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Geth doc: tbrowder++ created pull request #1316:
add new doc with list of core modules		 13:33
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lizmat tbrowder: seems to be missing some empty lines between =items ? 13:45
also: I would say "Used by installers such as zef" instead of "Used by zef" 13:46
tbrowder hm, i'll check. i tried to build the docs locally but have a pod-bigpage failure with rakudo n 13:47
a recent rakudo nom 13:48
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tbrowder lizmat: see if that's better 13:57
lizmat tbrowder: looks good 13:58
re CompUnit/Repository/Staging.pm being a .pm rather than a .pm6
feels to me this is an oversight rather than an intentional thing
nine ugexe tony-o: opinions ^^^ ?
Geth doc: 28df7e46e6 | (Tom Browder)++ | doc/Language/modules-core.pod6
add new doc with list of core modules
 13:59
doc: 396e0d8304 | (Tom Browder)++ | doc/Language/modules-core.pod6
remove blank lines, mod comment per lizmat
doc: 06bf3a92de | (Tom Browder)++ (committed using GitHub Web editor) | doc/Language/modules-core.pod6
Merge pull request #1316 from tbrowder/core-mod

add new doc with list of core modules
nine tbrowder: CompUnit::Repository::Staging is _not_ for zef. It's for installing modules into a staging area and moving them into their final position later on, i.e. creating distro packages. 14:01
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nine lizmat: yes, I'm just still not used to using .pm6 as extension :) 14:02
lizmat ok, propose we change that after the release :-)
tbrowder nine: so it should be listed under internal modules then?? 14:03
lizmat tbrowder: no, it's about .pm vs .pm6 14:04
nadim not using .pm6 either, maybe I should change alll the modules I have while I have so few. do we have a P6 syntax for vim somewhere? 14:05
tbrowder i was referring to nine's comment about the use of compunit...staging
should i move it to the list of internal-use modules? 14:06
MasterDuke nadim: i think it's built-in to recent versions of vim now 14:08
yoleaux 10:47Z <brrt> MasterDuke: i'll look into it
tbrowder i'll remove the use comment anyway...
nadim can someone have a look at travis,yml at github.com/nkh/P6-Data-Dump-Tree and tell me if they see something obviously wrong?
tbrowder change panda to zef 14:09
nadim ok
what would be the exact config? still need a "rekudobrew something" in the yaml file? 14:11
I mean: how does Zef get installed?
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Geth doc: tbrowder++ created pull request #1317:
correct comment		 14:16
doc: a99ec90956 | (Tom Browder)++ | doc/Language/modules-core.pod6
correct comment
 14:17
doc: b81b16aa0d | (Tom Browder)++ (committed using GitHub Web editor) | doc/Language/modules-core.pod6
Merge pull request #1317 from tbrowder/mod-core-fix

correct comment
tbrowder nadim: "rakudobrew build-zef\nzef installdeps ." 14:20
with "-" in front of each line
nadim: sorry, last line i use is "- zef install --depsonly ." 14:21
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tbrowder www.irccloud.com/pastebin/mMJhB4yA/ 14:23
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tbrowder ref my doc change: ugly! working on it... 14:25
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Geth doc: tbrowder++ created pull request #1318:
correct head tags, add subtitle		 14:30
doc: fc26eb614b | (Tom Browder)++ | doc/Language/modules-core.pod6
correct head tags, add subtitle
doc: a55dd8ebf6 | (Tom Browder)++ (committed using GitHub Web editor) | doc/Language/modules-core.pod6
Merge pull request #1318 from tbrowder/mdoc-fix

correct head tags, add subtitle
doc: tbrowder++ created pull request #1319:
correct links		 14:36
doc: 56e2701dfb | (Tom Browder)++ | doc/Language/modules-core.pod6
correct links
doc: 9e5d047f27 | (Tom Browder)++ (committed using GitHub Web editor) | doc/Language/modules-core.pod6
Merge pull request #1319 from tbrowder/mdoc-fix2

correct links
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ugexe lizmat: I think that module used to live in src/ (not lib/) where the convention is .pm 14:58
n/m too late 14:59
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nadim I have an object that does a few roles, the roles are added in different places, later I get the object and want to know if it does a specific role; How do get that information? 15:24
ah! .does 15:25
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moritz nadim: or you could just do smart matching 15:28
against the role 15:29
m: role R1 { }; role R2 { }; (({} does R1) does R2) ~~ R1
camelia ( no output )
moritz m: role R1 { }; role R2 { }; say (({} does R1) does R2) ~~ R1
camelia True
moritz m: role R1 { }; role R2 { }; say (({} does R1) does R2) ~~ R2
camelia True
moritz m: role R1 { }; role R2 { }; role R3 { }; say (({} does R1) does R2) ~~ R3
camelia False
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nadim right! it looks better but I had to use 'can' instead. the base class needs a role to implement a specific method and there are multiple roles that could implement it, including roles that the end user could define 15:33
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ugexe fwiw there is some instance where I ended up reaching for .^find_method instead of .^can 15:36
so if .^can doesn't do what you want in some instance try .^find_method just to see 15:37
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nadim ugexe: good to know but I didn't use .^can but .can, there is no difference as long as a role doe not implement 'can' I guess 15:52
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Geth doc: 56613a1de7 | (Zoffix Znet)++ (committed using GitHub Web editor) | doc/Language/modules-core.pod6
Clarify Test.pm6

  - Link to testing page
  - Not all modules use Test.pm6 for testing (viva la Testo.pm6!)		 15:52
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araraloren hi 16:12
How can I use a github repo branch as a source-url in MATE6 file 16:13
If anybody know how to, please tell me. 16:15
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Geth doc: tbrowder++ created pull request #1320:
make a single list and don't speculate about use		 16:20
doc: 2798c8d5ba | (Tom Browder)++ | doc/Language/modules-core.pod6
make a single list and don't speculate about use
 16:21
doc: 31993dc019 | (Tom Browder)++ (committed using GitHub Web editor) | doc/Language/modules-core.pod6
Merge pull request #1320 from tbrowder/mdoc-fix3

make a single list and don't speculate about use
tbrowder araraloren: I recommend you refer to a release instead of a branch. That will look something like this: "source-url" : "github.com/tbrowder/Text-More-Perl....1.4.zip", 16:26
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Geth modules.perl6.org: f0dbaed8e9 | (Tom Browder)++ (committed using GitHub Web editor) | templates/root/index.html.ep
add ref to new core module list
 17:07
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Zoffix araraloren: I think ugexe++ was going to add a helper unzip script to zef so that `unzip` command is not required. So then the Issue I opened wouldn't matter 17:12
araraloren: OR, upload to CPAN. zef now defaults to it, as I understand
araraloren: and I see Inline::Perl5 links in ecosystem like this: github.com/perl6/ecosystem/blob/ma....list#L277 and look at the source URL... A CPAN dist: raw.githubusercontent.com/niner/In...META6.json 17:14
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Zoffix araraloren: and to upload to cpan... I think mi6 now has support, or you can do it manually on PAUSE's site: pause.perl.org/pause/query 17:15
buggable: eco mi6
buggable Zoffix, App::Mi6 'minimal authoring tool for Perl6': github.com/skaji/mi6
Zoffix &
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araraloren tbrowder, Yeah, I use that format, current in my module 17:18
.tell Zoffix Em, thanks, I'll look at `upload to CPAN` 17:22
yoleaux araraloren: I'll pass your message to Zoffix.
araraloren Maybe better change `zip` to `.tar.gz`. 17:26
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tbrowder ugexe recommends zip version release for cross-platform use 17:37
ugexe tbrowder: eh Zoffix proved me wrong when his linux dist didnt have a way to unzip 17:38
tbrowder well he needs to add zip package to it 17:39
ugexe the same can be said from the other side
tbrowder we linux peops are much more forgiving than msw
ugexe .tar.gz should be cross platform enough. just not on windows without perl5 in PATH 17:40
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tbrowder so do we now need two source url entries? 17:41
araraloren Use a zip module as backend would be better. It's reliable than zip command.
nadim not using .pm6 either, maybe I should change alll the modules I have while I have so few. do we have a P6 syntax for vim somewhere? pretend it is not installed even if it is? 17:43
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araraloren Vim has a perl5 syntax hightlight 17:44
perl6
s/perl5/perl6/ 17:45
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tbrowder ahem, at some point it seems to me we need some kind of module check for minimum requirements before a module can be entered into the ecosystem. there are new entries without any functionality at all--basically a skeleton WIP. 17:45
nadim thanks araraloren, the message above is garbage, half an old question and half a new one. typo of the day :)
araraloren oh 17:46
nadim is it possible to tell prove to "not find a module" even if it is installed? I want to test as if Term::ANSIColors wasn't there without modifying 50 tests. 17:51
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moritz nadim: are you doing the conditional loading in the tests, or in the code you're testing? 18:16
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moritz twitter.com/nogoodnickleft/status/...7455987712 # if you're not on twitter, you can register your vote here as well :-) 18:29
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MasterDuke moritz: 1,3,2 (ranked order of preference) 18:35
moritz MasterDuke: thanks 18:36
mst 1 (I did vote), because the other two I think I can grok from the reference docs 18:40
moritz I wonder if a Perl 6 version of "Mastering Regular Expressions" is in order 18:46
does anybody here know Jeffrey Friedl personally, and would be willing to introduce me to him? 18:49
MasterDuke i love that book. one of the only two reference/programming books i've read cover-to-cover (the other being programming perl)
moritz I love it too, and regularly recommend it 18:51
he, so far there are 8 responses, and the percentages are 75, 13, 12 18:54
rounding in action, I suppose :-)
mst oh dear 18:55
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moritz I've actually written code that does similarly horrible rounding 18:58
exporting invoice data to the finacial accounting system, breaking it down into cost centers 18:59
and it's super important that the book entries sum up to the total on the invoice, but much less important if one of the cost centres is a cent off 19:00
if the rounding error is 0.01, I can just put it on "misc", but -0.01 isn't acceptable, so I have add that randomly to one of the other cost centers 19:01
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tbrowder moritz: +1 for 1 19:06
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haxmeister Thank you all for Perl 6.. my new favorite language. it is truly next level! 19:10
AlexDaniel \o/
moritz you're welcome (on behalf of #perl6) :-)
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haxmeister \o/ :-D 19:12
chaining functions with dot notation is my new favorite syntax to abuse :-D 19:14
AlexDaniel abuse it is :) 19:20
haxmeister well that is what many people secretly love about perl right?.. all that syntactic sugar that we can abuse in our own scripts.. you know those scripts we keep for ourselves and hopefully never show to anybody else 19:22
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moritz or not so secretly :-) 19:24
mst I'm pretty much ok with the idea that perls are expressive, and that gives you the potential to write both extremely readable and extremely unreadable code 19:26
haxmeister I tend to lean towards the "wth is that?" readability rating lol 19:27
sometimes the "why did you do it like that?" zone as well 19:28
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Geth ecosystem: e2d465c489 | loren++ (committed using GitHub Web editor) | META.list
Update Getopt::Kinoko to v0.3.5
 19:52
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Voldenet the thing I'll ask now is very evil, but I'll ask anyway 21:05
can you run perl6 with python interpreter?
jnthn Haven't heard of a bridge in that direction, no. You can via Inline::Python use python modules from Perl 6, though (which works by embedding a Python interpreter). :) 21:07
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nadim moritz: I want to make sure Term::ANSIColor is not loaded during tests as the module generates a different output when it is found. 21:23
jnthn nadim: Does it do a runtime require of it? 21:25
(Guarded with try?) 21:26
It's not an especially "clever" solution, but I'd probably just env var it.
(Have an env var that, if set, causes the require to not be attempted) 21:27
Another potential (though utter hack) option is to have a t/hack/Term/ANSIColor.pm6 that simply dies upon being loaded and the -It/hack so it takes precedence and hides the real one 21:28
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nadim what is returned whn qx is given a command that does not exist? 21:47
It may be explained in the documentation but not where qx is documented
and do we have a way to detect terminal width in windows (I guess windows is also a target) on unix (and so far by default) I use stty. 21:49
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Zoffix nadim: appears to return an empty string on my box. For terminal width, see Terminal::Width (it's used by Test::Notice if you wanted to see usage) 22:40
buggable: eco Terminal::Width
buggable Zoffix, Terminal::Width 'Get the current width of the terminal': github.com/zoffixznet/perl6-Terminal-Width
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Geth doc: 1d548f13a2 | (Trey Harris)++ | doc/Language/glossary.pod6
Glossary: add 'Value type' entry

The term "value type" is thrown around a few other places in the docs, so this is an attempt to explain it in terms not requiring much CS theory.		 22:43
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tbrowder can someone give a ref to some guidance on unpacking a pod object? i can extract a pod object from a file, but it is an array and doesn't seem amenable to breaking it down to individual pod objects. do i need to test each piece t 23:06
forget the last partial sentence 23:07
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mscha How do I return two separate lists from a sub? 23:49
m: sub foo { my @a = (1,2,3); my @b = <a b c>; return @a, @b; }; my (@a, @b) = foo; say "a = @a[]; b = @b[]"; # Not like this, apparently
camelia a = 1 2 3 a b c; b =
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AlexDaniel mscha: well, yes, that's how you return two arrays :) 23:53
m: sub foo { my @a = (1,2,3); my @b = <a b c>; return @a, @b; }; dd foo
camelia ([1, 2, 3], ["a", "b", "c"])
AlexDaniel but do you get them out… hmmm 23:54
how*
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AlexDaniel m: sub foo { my @a = 1,2,3; my @b = <a b c>; return @a, @b; }; my (@a; @b) = flat foo; dd @a; dd @b 23:56
camelia Array @a = [1, 2, 3, "a", "b", "c"]
Array @b = []
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AlexDaniel oops 23:56
well, that's too flat…
timotimo sooo 23:57
i moved house toda
today
i.e. my bed and my desk and computer
and i'll sleep here tonight
and there's two cats
i'll sleep a night in a cat household for the first time <3 23:58
AlexDaniel timotimo: if cats are arrays, and you have a list of cats, how do you put them into @a and @b ?
timotimo huh, i meant to write this in a different channel 23:59
i should maybe put on my glasses for computer use
no matter
AlexDaniel m: sub foo { my @a = 1,2,3; my @b = <a b c>; return @a, @b; }; my ($a, $b) = foo; dd $a; dd $b
camelia Array $a = $[1, 2, 3]
Array $b = $["a", "b", "c"]
AlexDaniel that's one way to do it, but what if I insist on @a and @b?

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