pugscode.org/ | nopaste: sial.org/pbot/perl6 | ?eval [~] <m oo se> | We do Haskell, too | > reverse . show $ foldl1 (*) [1..4] | irclog: irc.pugscode.org/
Set by diakopter on 11 July 2007.
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dduncan opinion question ... I'm thinking now of accelerating my plans to separate my Muldis D language spec (all documentation) and my Muldis DB virtual machine (implements said language) into separate distros ... so that there is then just one official repo for the language spec, which the Perl 5 and Perl 6 and Parrot and whatever Muldis DB can just refer to it externally as Pugs, Parrot, v6.pm, et al refer to the Perl 6 synopsis now ... my c 02:40
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Tene dduncan: cut off after "... my c" 02:48
dduncan oh, it didn't for me 02:49
will nopaste
or not 02:50
split paste ...
opinion question ... I'm thinking now of accelerating my plans to separate my Muldis D language spec (all documentation) and my Muldis DB virtual machine (implements said language) into separate distros ... so that there is then just one official repo for the language spec, which the Perl 5 and Perl 6 and Parrot and whatever Muldis DB can just refer to it externally as Pugs, Parrot, v6.pm, et al refer to the Perl 6 synopsis now ...
my current question is, perhaps, what alternate namespace to use for the Muldis D language docs, rather than Muldis::DB::Language ... I was thinking perhaps Language::MuldisD, or maybe Muldis::D ...
there's also the question of what CPAN category this docs-only distro should go in, eg "Database Interfaces" versus "Language Interfaces" versus "String Language Text Processing" etc ... feedback, asap, is appreciated, particularly concerning what namespace to use, thanks 02:51
that's all
I think that split before the cut-off you saw
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spinclad yes, endings i see are 'now ...', 'Muldis::D ...', 'use, thanks' 02:52
dduncan right 02:53
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dduncan I guess my IRC client displays to me what I sent, even if others don't get it 02:53
sort of like some telnet clients, displaying what is sent
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dduncan I'm about to send the same question to modules@ and another list, but thought I'd ask via fast IRC first 02:55
avar Everything under Muldis:: is probably a nice idea 02:59
and Muldis::Doc/Manual/Spec or something
spinclad as i don't really understand your intent with the terms 'Muldis' and 'D' ('DB' i have an inkling of), i can't say much on the namespace ... 03:00
dduncan 'Muldis' is a word I made up, it means "multiverse of discourse", and intend to brand a whole product line with. 03:01
Muldis::DB is one product
spinclad re category, can it be listed in multiple categories? 'DB interface' and 'Language interface'?
dduncan Muldis D is the name of a programming language; it is a 'D' language according to Darwen and Date
technically the language spec transcends an implementation
I'm not aware that CPAN lets you pick multiple categories 03:02
I personally prefer it goes under 'DB Interface', but other 'Language::' modules are under the other
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dduncan not that this means the same thing per se ... the 'D' distro is more of a 'synopsis' than an interface implementation 03:03
spinclad personally i see nothing wrong with a 'Language::' module being listed under 'DB interfaces'
dduncan I don't either
so I could request that combination
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dduncan skipping the mailing list thing, I think I'll just submit a PAUSE namespace request for Language::MuldisD under the category "Database Interfaces" and see what happens 03:08
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dduncan namespace request to PAUSE is done 03:44
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dduncan finally, the namespace request for Language::MuldisD was granted by PAUSE, so expect split distros on CPAN tomorrow 05:06
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Alias_ finally? 05:07
Dude, I only just logged in
:)
(knows that dduncan has left)
(but expects him to read the logs) :) 05:08
\o
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popt is agentzh here 05:26
I want to introduce my 2 friends to him
Alias_ seen agentzh? 05:27
buubot Alias_: Sorry, I haven't seen agentzh?
Alias_ 1. It appears not
2. I think buubot is screwy :)
popt isn't this channel the place he lurk around?
Alias_ Yes, it is 05:28
hence 2.
popt lol
revdiablo seen agentzh
buubot revdiablo: Seen at Sun Jul 22 07:30:50 2007: <agentzh> "In file included from /usr/lib/ghc-6.6.1/include/HsUnix.h:12,"
popt thanks both 05:29
revdiablo Nice to see the datestamp does not include a time zone
Alias_ heh
seen Alias_
buubot Alias_: Seen at Sun Jul 22 22:29:23 2007: <Alias_> heh
Alias_ Well it's not zulu :/
revdiablo Ah, it's in pacific time
Which makes sense I guess, since buu lives in LA 05:30
Alias_ Suddenly the genius of "X hours ago" makes sense
revdiablo Time is hard (tm)
Alias_ indeed
<-- written a bad time library before 05:31
<-- still struggling to convert it to DateTime in the enormous application
revdiablo I foolishly try to use epoch times for everything
Alias_ bad bad man
I finally managed to evolve past that this year 05:32
revdiablo It's so wonderfully convenient... but yeah.
Alias_ The accumulated suck of epoch time finally reached my breaking point 05:33
Mostly because I keep having to go back and revisit code 05:35
And that's something that smells to high heaven for me
So I gave up and let DateTime use whatever CPU cycles it needs to
revdiablo For me it's a matter of learning the interface, not resource usage 05:36
I really should just do it 05:37
Alias_ indeed
The key thing to understand DateTime is that you have to really understand that certain things are just not possible
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Alias_ And that DateTime would prefer to NOT give you a result, rather than trivialize something that's hard and provide an estimate 05:38
Which is annoying at first, until you learn to trust that when it won't give you a value that you want, you are probably asking it the wrong question :)
So you revisit you question :) 05:39
your
revdiablo heh
Alias_ Most of the complaints I see from people are "why don't Datetime give me the number of whatevers between this and that"
The answer being of course, "That's a stupid question, and you're a stupid programmer, learn what a 'day' actually means" or something :) 05:40
SamB well, if "whatevers" is months...
revdiablo So sort of a guard against XY problems
Alias_ SamB: It tends to vary based on the situation :)
SamB then it's kinda clear why its
not a good idea
Alias_ Not at first
Time is *hard*
SamB well, months aren't even all the same length 05:41
not even close
_moritz_ it is indeed hard ;)
Alias_ The other annoyance for DateTime is the strict exception model
But once you realise how much pain it's saving you, it's worth the extra decoration :)
But yeah, it does take a little work to learn the PAI 05:42
API
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ingy hi Alias_ 05:55
Alias_ hi!
Shit, I wanted to talk to you about something 05:56
ingy me too
Alias_ But I'm afraid I've forgotten what it was
_moritz_ talking is totally overrated ;)
Alias_ (it wasn't about BCPAN, but I'm sure I'll want to hear about that too eventually) :)
er BPAN
ingy yeah y 05:58
sorry I just lost net for a sec 05:59
Alias_ n/p
How is the hand btw?
ingy I want to talk to you about bpan, but I think it's best to get a protoype going first
Alias_ Or a definition :) 06:00
ingy my hand is coming along
Alias_ Good good, I'd hate to see you have to do an RMS
ingy BPAN == Best Practical Anarchist Nubiles 06:01
Alias_ oh dear
ingy or nonesuch
Alias_ :)
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Drummer_CCS hola 06:57
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pugs_svnbot r17120 | fglock++ | [kp6] fixed 'self' 09:05
diff: dev.pugscode.org/changeset/17120
masak fglock++ # fixing self
fglock fixing myself 09:06
lambdabot fglock: You have 1 new message. '/msg lambdabot @messages' to read it.
masak fglock: yes, I liked the commit message precisely because of that ambiguity
the trac page is feeling a wee bit ill today: dev.pugscode.org/changeset/17120 09:08
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pugs_svnbot r17121 | fglock++ | [kp6] MOP - Class.add_attribute(), Class.add_role() - untested 09:14
diff: dev.pugscode.org/changeset/17121
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pugs_svnbot r17122 | fglock++ | [kp6] Perl 5 Runtime - added substr(), infix:<-> 09:17
diff: dev.pugscode.org/changeset/17122
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fglock_ a Perl 5 question: substr( @args ) # Not enough arguments for substr ... near "@args )" 10:04
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pugs_svnbot r17123 | fglock++ | [kp6] fixed substr() 10:17
diff: dev.pugscode.org/changeset/17123
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avar $ perl5.9.5 -E 'say prototype "CORE::substr"' 11:09
$$;$$
fglock_: proto coerces it
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firestorm hi...looking for something that will step through my perl program much like "bash -x" does in shell programming...suggestions? 13:20
[particle] perl -d ? 13:21
btw this is a channel for perl 6 developers--you're likely using perl 5, and would get more on-topic help at #perl 13:22
firestorm thankyou 13:23
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pugs_svnbot r17124 | fglock++ | [kp6] added accessor test (not working) 13:34
diff: dev.pugscode.org/changeset/17124
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masak the database of dev.pugscode.org is still in sad mode... 14:08
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pugs_svnbot r17125 | fglock++ | [kp6] pass accessor tests 14:13
diff: dev.pugscode.org/changeset/17125
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avar trac broken 14:27
masak avar: my point exactly
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meppl gugu 14:31
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masak ?eval "meppl: " ~ <g u g u>.pick(*) 14:48
evalbot_r17041 "meppl: g u u g"
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meppl :D 14:52
hello masak
masak meppl: y0 14:53
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masak is lurking on this channel, silently waiting for audreyt++'s return and 6.28.0++'s arrival, at which point he will write a new script using p6 OO 14:54
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rho is away: (watching house) 16:11
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rho is back 16:44
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Limbic_Region wow 17:14
connected for 14 minutes, this is some kind of a record
diakopter Limbic_Region: :[ :) 17:15
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Limbic_Region so anything new and/or exciting happening? 17:16
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diakopter I have a long todo list of fun things, that you can help with if you want :) 17:17
Limbic_Region well, anything that I participate in will have to be restricted to activities that can be completed within a day or two 17:19
I do not have the luxury of taking on comittments longer than that ATM
diakopter oh cool.. it's a bunch of short things, I think. 17:20
Limbic_Region let me know 17:21
diakopter I listed them all on irc, I think, last Friday 17:22
diakopter finds the url
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diakopter Limbic_Region: you'd like #1 I'm sure... moritz.faui2k3.org/irclog/out.pl?ch...19#id_l318 although #7 is the generalization of that.... moritz.faui2k3.org/irclog/out.pl?ch...19#id_l441 17:31
lambdabot Title: IRC log for #perl6, 2007-07-19, tinyurl.com/2erfo8
Limbic_Region the target ref didn't work but I will scroll through it to see if I can find what you are talking about
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diakopter hm, you're right... it works in Firefox, but doesn't work in IE (the #id_l318) 17:33
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Limbic_Region I don't understand #1 17:34
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Limbic_Region are you talking about the languages/perl6 branch in parrot 17:34
or about pugs targeting parrot?
diakopter languages/perl6 17:35
Limbic_Region if the former - already done though I do not know if evalbot would be supported
oh, well I have that running on Win32/MinGW and Win32/Cygwin
great - connection fubar
diakopter your messages came through, at least some of them 17:36
Limbic_Region: it needs to be in its own private chroot
imho
Limbic_Region diakopter - ok, I can only find todo items 1 & 2 17:37
and with regards to number 1 - languages/perl6 works out of the box on every platform I have tried so you will need to define what specifically is "todo" about the item 17:38
[particle] Limbic_Region: search for "# 3" 17:41
on the 18th
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Limbic_Region on the 18th? interesting 17:41
diakopter on the 19th for me - search 14:42 17:42
Limbic_Region I I find no '# 3' on the 18th
diakopter I frankly don't know why those anchors don't work in IE 17:43
@tell moritz weird bug where line number anchors in the irc logs don't work in IE6
lambdabot Consider it noted.
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Limbic_Region ok, found the rest of the list but it doesn't really look like anything I could personally do in a day or two 17:44
and as I said, # 1 needs more definition before I could say for sure if it is something that I could do or not 17:45
diakopter Limbic_Region: ok. you're right; most of #1 will be dependent on how that new evalbot wrapper works (the chroot and such) 17:46
Limbic_Region I suspect though that the perl6 implementation on parrot is not far enough along for evalbot
[particle] no eval yet ,for one ;)
Limbic_Region heh
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jisom searchsecurity.techtarget.com/origi...16,00.html something we need to consider in parrot 18:02
lambdabot Title: New hacking technique exploits common programming error, tinyurl.com/yowy2u
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jisom oops, wrong channel 18:03
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diakopter ugh; lots of rogue APs at OSCON. 18:18
[particle]: eval() isn't necessary for evalbot :P
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dduncan APs? 18:25
never mind
diakopter access points 18:26
dduncan thought so
but I didn't pick up on that the first time
diakopter they're all using the same ssid as the official one ("OSCON"), but they provide nonfunctional DHCP servers. 18:27
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_moritz_ diakopter: did you use the tinyurl? 19:28
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moritz diakopter: the anchor is not included in the tinyurl-link :( 19:29
lambdabot moritz: You have 1 new message. '/msg lambdabot @messages' to read it.
moritz @massages 19:30
lambdabot diakopter said 1h 47m 6s ago: weird bug where line number anchors in the irc logs don't work in IE6
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Aankhen`` moritz: Probably wouldn't make sense for the anchor to be included, since it has to do redirect 'n' all. 19:31
moritz Aankhen``: aye
Aankhen``: I'm just hoping that's what's causing the problem, because I have no IE and I'm not very keen on debugging any IE stuff 19:32
Aankhen`` Dang, I don't have IE6 installed here.
moritz there are wors things than not having IE6 19:33
like, for example, having it ;)
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moritz anyway, sleep (or something) & 19:43
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pugs_svnbot r17126 | Darren_Duncan++ | ext/Muldis-DB/ : the all-Pod Muldis D language spec has been split off to its own repo, is no longer distrib with Muldis DB, nor is in the Pugs distro any longer 20:12
diff: dev.pugscode.org/changeset/17126
dduncan note, the Pugs Trac "database is locked" error has been going on continuously for several days now ... I think something on the server needs kicking 20:15
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diakopter lurks at "A Taste of Haskell" this afternoon 20:34
dduncan so how's it taste? 20:39
diakopter dduncan: I dunno yet. Mr. GHC Himself presenting. Just began. 20:40
dduncan: thanks, restarted apache2 and commitbit
[particle] it'll take hours to find out, even on modern hardware. 20:41
dduncan okay
diakopter [particle]: :D
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meppl good night 22:04
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juerd power outage + fsck 22:15
afk
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pmichaud my server cut out123456 22:42
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Limbic_Region repo down? 23:38
diakopter oops 23:41
silly apache1.3 :)
try now 23:42
pugs_svnbot r17126 | Darren_Duncan++ | ext/Muldis-DB/ : the all-Pod Muldis D language spec has been split off to its own repo, is no longer distrib with Muldis DB, nor is in the Pugs distro any longer
diff: dev.pugscode.org/changeset/17126
lambdabot Title: Changeset 17126 - Pugs - Trac
diakopter eh? that's odd
unless...... :)
Limbic_Region also - the journals link on pugscode.org is no longer pointing to planet perl6 23:43
repo is working again though
;-) 23:44
hrm
maybe not
it appears to have just hung in mid fetch
nevermind, it finished 23:45
diakopter well if you clicked it when apache1.3 was running (instead of apache2), then it might've pointed someplace nonexistent
(I disabled apache 1.3 now) :) 23:48
(from being started up upon (accidental) reboot) 23:49
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diakopter learns Haskell from its creator 23:52
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