»ö« Welcome to Perl 6! | perl6.org/ | evalbot usage: 'perl6: say 3;' or rakudo:, niecza:, std:, or /msg camelia perl6: ... | irclog: irc.perl6.org | UTF-8 is our friend!
Set by sorear on 25 June 2013.
00:14 Hor|zon joined 00:19 Hor|zon left, araujo joined
[Coke] waves as he catches up, briefly, with scrollback. 00:25
arnsholt Wow. 00:33
Compiling NQP and Rakudo with Moar for the first time
That's... a LOT faster than Parrot and JVM used to be 00:34
Very speed, such quick
colomon yup. :) 00:40
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[Coke] ho, arnsholt 00:41
colomon \o 00:42
arnsholt o/ 00:47
Way too long since I've done anything Perl 6-y 00:48
colomon building rakudo-m is a good first step.
arnsholt Indeed
colomon though I tried building it on a 2001 iMac with 256 MB ram this week, and gave up after 72 hours. 00:51
:)
With the latest PowerPC Linux on it, it's actually seems to be surprisingly useful machine, but it really can't handle Rakudo levels of memory usage. 00:53
s/it's/it/
arnsholt =D 00:54
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BenGoldberg jnthn, A question about OO::Monitors Conditions: which conventional function is meet-condition more like: cond_signal or cond_broadcast? 02:37
If it's like cond_broadcast, and wakes up all waiting threads, then that can be inefficient. If it's like cond_signal, and wakes up one waiting thread, then the BoundedQueue example has a race condition in it. 02:39
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japhb .tell BenGoldberg if you're thinking of take-task(), I asked about that after the talk, and jnthn++ explained that it was smarter than he initially let on -- meet-condition sets the condition *without* releasing the method lock, which only gets released at actual method exit, which is when other threads can notice the condition was met. 04:46
yoleaux japhb: I'll pass your message to BenGoldberg.
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japhb .tell timotimo My plan for getting to the hackathon venue is to take the train from the main station near us to Salzburg Aigen, which is the stop just past the venue, and then backtrack a couple blocks on foot. 04:54
yoleaux japhb: I'll pass your message to timotimo.
japhb .tell timotimo Takes about 11 minutes according to the schedule, running every half hour at :21 and :51 it looks like. 04:55
yoleaux japhb: I'll pass your message to timotimo.
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moritz \o 05:21
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mauke I'm going to try the bus 05:34
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FROGGS peteretep: I am at a hackathon in two hours... will that be okay for you? 05:54
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peteretep FROGGS: I'll be here all year, whenever is convenient :-) 06:24
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FROGGS peteretep: :o) 06:43
TimToady std: 1 >>=>> 2
camelia std f214dca: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Missing << or >> at /tmp/hFRzOH5Q4i line 1:␤------> 1 >>=>⏏> 2␤ expecting infix_circumfix_meta_operator␤Parse failed␤FAILED 00:01 139m␤»
nine anyone at the Plainbruecke need a ride to the hackathon?
TimToady std: 1 »=» 2
camelia std f214dca: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Cannot hyper with = because list assignment operators are too fiddly at /tmp/aF2eN7HL6o line 1:␤------> 1 »=»⏏ 2␤Check failed␤FAILED 00:01 140m␤»
japhb Next train leaving Salzburg Hbf. to Salzburg Aigen is at 9:21. If you enter the station from the Forum-1 shopping center side, tickets are partway into the main hallway, on the right. 2.50 one way, or 5.50 round trip. I'm not sure why round trip costs more than double, but whatever ... 06:44
TimToady well, the syntax works
maybe they think you might come back not on Sunday
dalek c: a57f595 | moritz++ | lib/Language/regexes.pod:
[regexes] Anchors

at least some of them		 06:45
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japhb Anyone happen to know what the 'Hbf.' stands for in 'Salzburg Hbf.'? 06:47
moritz japhb: "main railway station"
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moritz Hauptbahnhof 06:48
peteretep The High House of Hoff
japhb Ah, OK, I had a feeling it was something like that
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FROGGS_ japhb: it is common (in germany at least) that a round trip costs more than two one way tickets 06:49
a round trip is often an 24 hours tickets and is about a factor of 2.2 of a one way ticket
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japhb That's so odd. 06:50
japhb shrugs
FROGGS_ std: eval ""; EVAL "" 06:51
japhb is from the land of "Supersize for just 30 cents more!" ... increasing your purchase is almost always a savings.
camelia std f214dca: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Undeclared name:␤ 'EVAL' used at line 1␤Check failed␤FAILED 00:06 139m␤»
moritz well, often there aren't really round trip tickets, just time-limited tickets
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leont Morning 06:51
moritz and it's an advantage if you want to take more than two rides
japhb Time limited? Meaning, I could keep traveling around for those 24 hours?
Ah, OK, that makes sense. 06:52
moritz yes
(though of course I don't know what your ticket actually says, that's just my experience with public transport systems in .de, .at and uk)
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dalek c: 09d7e13 | moritz++ | lib/Language/regexes.pod:
[regexes] fix markup
 06:56
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japhb I'd totally believe it, and the few words I've translated from the ticket tend to support that theory. 06:58
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timotimo o/ 07:05
yoleaux 04:54Z <japhb> timotimo: My plan for getting to the hackathon venue is to take the train from the main station near us to Salzburg Aigen, which is the stop just past the venue, and then backtrack a couple blocks on foot.
04:55Z <japhb> timotimo: Takes about 11 minutes according to the schedule, running every half hour at :21 and :51 it looks like.
timotimo maybe i'll spend some time trying to "properly" jit the nativecallinvoke op on moarvm 07:12
it's probably not terribly difficult, just a lot of work
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timotimo also, performance analysis will be "why the fuck is this fast" rather than "why the fuck is this slow" today 07:13
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moritz tries to runs perl6/doc's htmlify.p6 with --profile 07:23
first shutting down all browsers and MUAs to save memory 07:25
3 minutes in, we're at 630M virt memory 07:26
not too bad
dalek c: a21764b | moritz++ | lib/Language/regexes.pod:
fix word-o
 07:27
moritz m: say 'abc'.index('b').^name 07:30
camelia rakudo-moar b6c6ae: OUTPUT«Int␤»
moritz profiler terminated with "Killed"
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dalek p: 98e6cf4 | moritz++ | t/nqp/59-nqpop.t:
tests for nqp::index with three arguments

partially stolen/adapted from roast		 07:37
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moritz is it normal that rakudo on moarvm wants to allocate a chunk of 160MB? 07:39
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dalek c: 0e96ce1 | moritz++ | htmlify.p6:
[htmlify] add --sparse option to process only some files

useful for profilingy htmlify		 08:03
moritz even with --sparse=20 (process only 1/20th of all .pod files), htmlify.p6 with --profile OOMs (on 3GB RAM)
dies even with --sparse=30 08:05
I'm now wondering if the problem is not actually with the runtime/memory requirements of the program, but with the profiler itself 08:06
timotimo aye
japhb moritz: How many files does --sparse=30 actually process?
timotimo try my branch?
moritz japhb: 6 type files, 2 language files
timotimo: which branch? 08:07
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japhb IIRC for Devel::NYTProf, Tim had to gzip the profile data stream in order to scale, so we may need to do the same. 08:07
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japhb I'm beginning to think perl6-stress would share so much code with perl6-bench, that it's better if I extend the functionality of perl6-bench to support stress testing, record failure outputs, and so on. 08:17
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TimToady finally back up at hackathon 08:19
timbunce_ waves
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azawawi hi everyone 08:20
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japhb o/ azawawi 08:22
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mauke i.imgur.com/JU4nhCp.gif 08:24
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jnthn hackathon \o/ 08:27
nine jnthn: want to see the weirdest bug ever? 08:29
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jnthn nine: I'm sure I'll have seen worse before :P 08:31
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azawawi starts profiling File::Find slowness 08:33
moritz like a segfault that happens only during presentations? :-)
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nine moritz: no that's strange but I'm sure there's some reasonable explanation 08:35
azawawi moritz: same here... i tried farabi6 on my machine... everything ok... i deploy it on feather.perl6.nl... boom :)
timbunce_ What's the status of github.com/perl6/book ?
(Only 1 commit since 2012)
timotimo moritz: now i'm at the venue and i can help you again
nine moritz: the one I've now is t//callables.t failing with a panic: MUTEX_LOCK _only_ when run from make test from within vim.
pmichaud good morning #perl6, from the hackathon 08:36
lizmat waves from NCM as well 08:37
pmichaud timbunce_: I suspect the book is very out of date
japhb o/ all
timbunce_ pmichaud: seems to be a common problem with perl6 stuff :/ 08:38
dalek c: eb46cc2 | Mouq++ | lib/Language/objects.pod:
Fix formattos
pmichaud timbunce_: alas, yes. 08:39
timbunce_ perl6.org points to perl6.org/getting-started/ which points to github.com/perl6/book/downloads
japhb timbunce_: Well, at least the previous documentation projects. Though moritz, Mouq, etc. seem to be pushing hard on the current one
timbunce_ japhb: what's "the current one"?
timotimo moritz: finite_callgraph_depth
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azawawi why is ListIter.reify called 156834 for 789 files in this find-file test script pastebin.com/vFZr8it6 ? :) 08:40
nine timotimo: doc.perl6.org
jnthn azawawi: To ensure it performs awfully, apparently... 08:41
Ven :(
azawawi jnthn: :)
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mauke for posix compliance 08:41
brrt o/ proud #perl6 hackers
pmichaud azawawi: how many times would you expect it to be called? 08:42
timotimo nine: huh?
nine timbunce_: doc.perl6.org
timotimo: sorry wrong autocomplete
timotimo OK :)
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japhb timbunce_: The doc project that you see commits in channel for 08:43
lizmat moritz: trying to do a profile run now
pmichaud my commit yesterday to syn_index.html hasn't propagated to the web site :-/ 08:44
azawawi pmichaud: the test folder has 1159 directories and/or files. 789 files.
lizmat moritz: Writing type graph images to html/images/ ...
dot command failed! (did you install Graphviz?)
is this a panda dependency?
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japhb lizmat: It's the thing that turns .dot files into .svg 08:44
timotimo it's a native thing
pmichaud azawawi: A ListIter will be used for every list (and intermediate list) used
timotimo we can't depend on native packages properly ;( 08:45
azawawi pmichaud: i see
pmichaud and there are a lot of those in Perl 6
timotimo .o( though it would be cool )
japhb timotimo: Annoying that every packaging system has its own naming conventions, so that even if we did have native dependencies, it would be a combinatoric pain to add the package dependencies to all of our module distros. 08:47
timotimo aye.
japhb OTOH, we could at least *detect* that e.g. particular binaries are not in the path, or that C/C++ headers do or do not exist.
timotimo that is true; however: 08:48
many package systems have a "what package provides this file?" command
yum provides, apt-file search, ...
FROGGS japhb: well, usually you would specify what lib/tool you want and the packaging should pick the dist that provides it
timotimo if we find one or more of these package managers, we can at least make proper suggestions
FROGGS japhb: you do not keep a list of .deb packages for examples
-s
nine jnthn: I can reproduce it using kate instead of vim. Removing anything (even the superfluous "use NativeCall;") from the test script hides the bug again.
japhb FROGGS: Fair enough -- are you considering teaching panda about that proper command in each of N packaging systems (not saying this is a bad idea, trying to understand your meaning) 08:49
(That was to timotimo as well, of course)
FROGGS japhb: I'm not sure if that might be within panda... I am more hoping that packagers would make use of that information
(debian, suse, whatever)-packagers 08:50
jnthn When I profile File::Find here, I see that 73% of the time is spent in cannon-cat
Ven m: role F[::T] { method f { say T } }; F["foo".tc].f
camelia rakudo-moar b6c6ae: OUTPUT«(Str)␤»
japhb FROGGS: How would they make use of that information?
Ven mmh..
azawawi jnthn: I am trying to simplify the use of --profile by making it a farabi6 menu option to open the profile*.html directory in a second tab
jnthn Which in turn spends a huge amount of itme in subst
Ven I'm stupid...
japhb Oh! You mean when they package some given module?
FROGGS japhb: they would now on what lib your dist depends
and can set the dependencies right
azawawi jnthn: is there an option for --profile to be in some format (e.g. json)? 08:51
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FROGGS so we get rid of all of the Alien:: dists that compile C libraries for you so you can be sure that C library is there 08:51
japhb FROGGS: OK, I see what you mean. I don't think this is awesome enough though, because that depends on OS distros packaging all the Perl 6 modules people care about, rather than us being able to make suggestions even for unpackaged Perl 6 modules
FROGGS though, having plugins in panda for each OS distro that can install libs/tools for you would be sweet
this could also be maintained my OS distro authors 08:52
japhb: true
TimToady it's kinda weird that in the operator docs, the set operators are "from" the Texas versions of the operators, which are probably less explanatory than the actual set operators (for those who know Sets/Bags)
japhb Yes, this is closer to what I want
nine FROGGS: one feature I've always wanted in cpan was that it should first try to install a distro package and only if that's not available install something from cpan 08:54
jnthn azawawi: Not at the moment
azawawi: Though if we can figure a way to convey that's what we want (or other profiler settings) then we can get it to do that easily 08:55
Since at the moment it generates a JSON blob and then sticks it into the HTML.
FROGGS nine: interesting idea
jnthn Could even env-var it...
lizmat moritz: doing doc still, below 1G still...
jnthn looks at !canon-cat on Windows and despairs a bit over how much work it's doing. 08:56
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Ven m: role F[::T $a] { method f { say $a } }; F["foo".tc].f 08:58
camelia rakudo-moar b6c6ae: OUTPUT«Foo␤»
Ven must've been fixed at some point... Because it crashes here.
ooh, I'm just redefining it -.- ...
pmurias why would adding package dependencies lead to combinatorical pain?
lizmat moritz: processing complete, now clocking at ~ 6GB 08:59
azawawi is there an online video or article to show how to use profiler results? what to ignore? what to focus on? as an perl 6 application programmer that is.
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moritz azawawi: I mostly do two things: check the Routines tab, and sort by exclusive time; look if there are any routines gobbling up the majority of time 09:00
azawawi: if not, I sort again by inclusive time, and scroll down to where the numbers become significantly less than 100%, and see if there are any routines involved that are not part of the normal startup procedure 09:01
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lizmat moritz: still busy at 11 minutes, still around 6GB 09:02
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moritz lizmat: if you manage to get a profile, please upload it somewhere 09:03
lizmat that's the plan... :-)
Ven m: role A[::T] { subset _t of T; method x { _t } }; say A[Int].x # ??
camelia rakudo-moar b6c6ae: OUTPUT«Cannot type check against type variable T␤ in any type_check at src/gen/m-Metamodel.nqp:297␤ in any type_check at src/gen/m-Metamodel.nqp:2821␤ in block <unit> at /tmp/apyiNeLQsy:1␤␤»
timotimo moritz: if your call graph is big, the profiler will end up creating a gigantic data structure inside nqp code and then recurses around to build a json string from that 09:04
Ven Not sure what's going on here :D. Sorry I'm trying fun stuff again.
timotimo even for "regular" runs, the json ends up like 15mb easily
sometimes 100
you're probably reaching the point where the string is 160 mb big?
japhb pmurias: Because of all the different OS distros, with different package managers, with different package names in different OS versions, and so forth.
Ven m: role A[::T] { subset _t of T; method x { _t } }; say A[Int].perl # ?? again
camelia rakudo-moar b6c6ae: OUTPUT«A[Int]␤»
Ven m: role A[::T] { subset _t of T; method x { _t } }; say A[Int].x.perl # ?? again 09:05
camelia rakudo-moar b6c6ae: OUTPUT«No such method 'perl' for invocant of type '_t'␤ in block <unit> at /tmp/OpZeBAuyps:1␤␤»
timotimo japhb: supporting at least rpm and dpkg would be simple enough (well, really it'd be yum, dnf and (an optional feature of) apt-get)
japhb pmurias: The suggestion to just use the package manager's facility for looking up package by file/lib name turns it into a much more tractable problem.
"an optional feature of"?
timotimo japhb: if we don't find any of these methods we know about, we can still just say "sorry, we were expecting to find blahblah.so, but we couldn't. please figure out how to install that"
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japhb True, I'm just trying to aim high before we start compromising 09:06
dalek href="https://perl6.org:">perl6.org: 816f003 | timbo++ | README.md:
add hint: cpanm App::Mowyw Text::VimColor
href="https://perl6.org:">perl6.org: d5ab2ae | timbo++ | README.md:
add link for how to enter a non-breaking space
timotimo i'm not sure if apt-file is available on any given apt system
japhb (Don't design for LTA, I mean)
timotimo ah
japhb Great, we just make apt-file a dependency on Debian variants! :-)
timotimo it seems like tat'd be a pluggable design and you could i ntheory install more modules :P 09:07
moritz apt-file is not part of a standard installation
and it needs an 'apt-file update' (like, recently)
timotimo actually, the distribution could be asked to ship a custom perl6 module that knows stuff about the package management solution that is in use
moritz: yup; on yum/dnf that happens automatically whenever you use it
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timotimo also, there's this "packagekit" thing on linux; i don't know how widespread it is and if it gives access to a "what package(s) provide this file?" feature easily 09:08
japhb moritz: If you're already installing new packages, you can usually assume the person has access to a package repo, and it's fairly edge case for that not to include being able to run apt-file update
(Note: I simplified that logic a bit from what's in my head.)
pmichaud what is nqp::handle ? 09:09
timotimo pmichaud: it's for exception handlers i believe
japhb: there's a lot of people who want to install stuff "inside their home" or "for each project separately"
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japhb Ah abspath, my old enemy ... 09:11
Ven darkness, darkness. my odl friend
s/odl/old/
japhb "I've come to talk with you again" 09:12
timotimo: From the apt-file info: "You can also run 'apt-file update' as 09:14
normal user to use a cache in the user's home directory."
timotimo oooh
tthat's not bad
yum/dnf provides will also let a regular user fetch updated data
japhb We have a winning path forward, methinks 09:15
timotimo yays 09:16
nine jnthn: running in gdb makes the bug go away, too. So it is a Heisenbug indeed.
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timotimo i hope nobody minds that i took off my shoes :P 09:17
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moritz doesn't mind, at least :-) 09:17
timotimo :D 09:18
thanks
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dalek d: bd22b5c | (Tobias Leich)++ | / (2 files):
rename built-in "eval" to "EVAL"
 09:18
nine Taking off shoes is allowed? Excellent! 09:19
FROGGS /o\
timotimo i'll just claim i started that trend
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pmurias japhb: combining both those methods seems best 09:21
so if an exact package name is specified use that, if not we can improvise 09:22
timotimo aye 09:23
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japhb pmurias: So that each perl 6 module distro would include a list of depended-on binaries/libs/other files, and then a map of OS + package manager to possibly sufficient packages? 09:24
Hmmm, some of the files will be named differently on different OSen
timotimo the names are usually the same, but not the paths
like fedora moving everything to /usr or something like that 09:25
japhb timotimo: except on windows. And for OS X, libraries
timotimo we are supporting windows?!
fuck that, i'm outta here.
:P
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FROGGS timotimo: we need to support windows since you took off your shoes :P 09:26
nine Probably good to know: rpm supports capabilities. So for example on openSUSE one can do zypper install 'perl(Foo::Bar)' and it installs the perl-Foo-Bar package 09:27
timotimo damn it, i foiled my own plans again
lizmat moritz: still going strong at 33 mins :-)
pmurias japhb: yes 09:29
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sjn d3zPERad0 09:37
yeah
dammit
moritz another password to change :-)
japhb Heh
Good choice of references, though 09:38
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japhb nine: Ah yes, I remember using that at a CentOS shop. 09:38
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Ven m: say Hash[Str].perl 09:42
camelia rakudo-moar b6c6ae: OUTPUT«Hash[Str]␤»
Ven m: say Hash[Str, Int].perl
camelia rakudo-moar b6c6ae: OUTPUT«Hash[Str,Int]␤»
Ven m: sub parse(Str $txt --> :(Hash[Str, Str] --> Str)) is export { return Nil } 09:43
camelia rakudo-moar b6c6ae: OUTPUT«===SORRY!=== Error while compiling /tmp/NvSNXGa3XY␤Missing block␤at /tmp/NvSNXGa3XY:1␤------> sub parse(Str $txt --> ⏏:(Hash[Str, Str] --> Str)) is export { r␤ expecting any of:␤ statement list␤ …»
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dalek kudo/nom: 5bb0d46 | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | src/core/IO/Path.pm:
.IO on IO::Path is now a noop for performance
 09:44
isBEKaml .u 263a
yoleaux U+263A WHITE SMILING FACE [So] (☺)
dalek href="https://perl6.org:">perl6.org: be5929a | timbo++ | source/index.html:
Add 'Getting started' to Documentation panel. Remove 'Using Perl 6' book link.
 09:45
href="https://perl6.org:">perl6.org: ba47496 | timbo++ | source/documentation/index.html:
Put Advent calendar links in reverse order. Clean up "Using Perl 6" link.
09:45 kurahaupo left
isBEKaml is "Using Perl 6" dead? 09:45
sjn moritz: yeah, I really liked that password too :-|
moritz isBEKaml: mostly
timotimo pretty much, but you can resurrect it if youl ike, isBEKaml
moritz isBEKaml: I'm trying to salvage the remains for doc.perl6.org
sjn thinks the book project is very much worth salvaging 09:46
timotimo m: sub parse(Str $txt) returns :(Hash[Str, Str] --> Str) is export { return Nil }
camelia rakudo-moar b6c6ae: OUTPUT«===SORRY!=== Error while compiling /tmp/OOPmmKsh52␤Missing block␤at /tmp/OOPmmKsh52:1␤------> sub parse(Str $txt) returns ⏏:(Hash[Str, Str] --> Str) is export { re␤ expecting any of:␤ statement lis…»
isBEKaml moritz: ah, so all effort is now directed at doc.perl6.org?
timotimo m: sub parse(Str $txt) returns &:(Hash[Str, Str] --> Str) is export { return Nil }
camelia rakudo-moar b6c6ae: OUTPUT«===SORRY!=== Error while compiling /tmp/lLElVwc0as␤Missing block␤at /tmp/lLElVwc0as:1␤------> sub parse(Str $txt) returns ⏏&:(Hash[Str, Str] --> Str) is export { r␤ expecting any of:␤ statement lis…»
moritz isBEKaml: s/all/moritz's/
isBEKaml moritz: I wanted to say "all doc efforts" but I'm not too good at English today. :-) 09:47
moritz I can't speak for all doc efforts either 09:48
I think lichtkind++ occasionally still works on his tablets thingy
lizmat__ moritz: seems profile is reaching the end: memory use dropped < 2GB
09:48 lizmat__ is now known as lizmat
isBEKaml moritz: well, I don't see any other documentation for perl6 [except the "kid of light" ] 09:48
Ven TimToady: are we supposed to be able to use signatures as return types?
isBEKaml moritz: I wanted to ask - do we have a reference point for doc tablets anywhere? Any prior work showcasing knowledge in the form of "tablets"? 09:50
lichtkind: ^^
moritz no use hilighting lichtkind when he's not on the channel :-) 09:51
Ven isBEKaml: if you're looking for something more akin to a tutorial – which, I think, are what the tablets are – you might be interested in learnxinyminutes.com/docs/perl6/
:P
isBEKaml moritz: well, I'm just surprised that I typed his nick correctly. :-) 09:52
Ven m: class A { method PARAMETERIZE_TYPE(|c) { say "Hey"; }}; say A[Int, Int, Str]
camelia rakudo-moar b6c6ae: OUTPUT«Hey␤True␤»
Ven ooh :-). Is that specced somewhere? considered implementation details?
isBEKaml Ven: LXYM == tablets? My question is about prior work than details. :-)
Ven isBEKaml: not the same, no. But I think same idea 09:53
timbunce__ Is rakudobrew the recommended way to install rakudo (at least on *nix)? It's not mentioned on rakudo.org/how-to-get-rakudo/
sjn likes rakudobrew 09:54
isBEKaml is on windows, so nothing to do with brewing 09:55
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moritz timbunce__: there is no one recommended way. If you follow rakudo from a distance, the monthly releases might be recommended. If you hack on rakudo primarily, you use git. If you hack on modules, but often have to update rakudo, rakudobrew is easiest 09:55
Ven moritz: I'm next to somebody who's stuck because he used the release 09:57
and now he can't use panda
isBEKaml Ven: that's the main usecase for rakudobrew, IIRC.
ISTR tadzik++ writing a script to help him with panda issues. That later turned into rakudobrew 09:58
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moritz Ven: then using the star release helps, it comes with a working panda 09:59
Ven not as fun :-)
isBEKaml Heh. by "the release", I read it as "Star" 10:00
timbunce__ moritz: umm, so what should perl6.org/getting-started/ recommend? I'll add some wording along those lines for now. 10:02
moritz timbunce__: rakudo star 10:03
timbunce__ moritz: ok. 10:04
tadzik rakudobrew is mostly a tribal knowledge at this point 10:06
timbunce__ Can rakudobrew + panda be used to get the same set of modules installed as rakudo star? Is there an easy way to do that (like a 'bundle')? 10:08
xiaomiao if you use gentoo you have updated packages anyway ;) 10:09
moritz xiaomiao: ... if oyu actually update
*you
xiaomiao moritz: well duh
I would kinda recommend updating to get up to date packages
pmichaud also observing from a distance... I wonder if rakudobrew might be useful as a distribution
moritz xiaomiao: I've seen enough out-of-date systems of all kinds to find that worth mentioning 10:10
isBEKaml moritz: that's true - that's also why I found it funny to see people scrambling to update all their machines/servers after "shellshock" 10:11
xiaomiao moritz: whenever I get access to a centos box the first thing I do is punch it 3-5 years forward
just 20 minutes ago I did about 3 years of updates on a machine that was installed and then "ignored"
tadzik timbunce__: there's a Task::Star module 10:12
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timbunce__ tadzik: great. Is that what R* actually uses when the distro is being built? (so it's kept in sync) 10:13
isBEKaml tadzik: I just noticed it - is it manually updated? :O
tadzik timbunce__: no, it's not synchronized in any other way that me patching Task::Star every now and then :(
to my defense, star module list doesn't change all that often :) 10:14
dalek c: 3780c14 | moritz++ | lib/Language/ (2 files):
[regexes] document some best practices
 10:15
timbunce__ tadzik: could you update the README in the rakudobrew and panda repos to add "panda install Task::Star" as an example? (I could send pull requests if you'd prefer)
tadzik timbunce__: I don't see why not :) 10:17
timbunce__ tadzik: sweet, thanks. 10:18
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pepl timbunce__: the blog entry from pedro regarding messaging you mentioned at yesterday was www.simplicidade.org/notes/archive...aging.html - right? 10:24
timbunce__ pepl: yes, that's a great, detailed, "voice of experience" post. 10:26
dalek nda: 5dc45a9 | tadzik++ | README.md:
Use Task::Star as a usage example
 10:28
tadzik timbunce__: there you go :)
pepl photos-3.dropbox.com/t/1/AAD6t5Ki3...e=1024x768 # TimToady cowboy pose :-) 10:31
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virtualsue is there a hackathon irc channel? 10:44
(for austrian perl workshop attendees and friends)
mephinet besides #perl6 and #austria.pm ? 10:45
virtualsue hey if this is it, cool. just checking 10:46
azawawi moritz: thanks for the advice regarding the --profile output. Will use it next time. moritz++ jnthn++ 10:47
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timbunce__ tadzik++ 10:52
moritz lizmat: did you get a profile html by now?
azawawi: you're welcome
timbunce__ panda install Digest::MD5 failed with t/perl5-compat.t ... No subtests run - known problem? 10:53
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itz perl6 --help claims " Output from --profile can be visualized by kcachegrind." 10:54
moritz timbunce__: I can reproduce it; seems to be a new one
itz: that's the old parrot profiling thingy; I guess we shoul update the help message 10:55
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azawawi do we have a Perl 6 module to Test HTTP routes? 10:57
japhb moritz: lizmat is chatting with jnthn, pmichaud, timotimo, and nwc10, all AFK.
timbunce__ Any reason Task::Star isn't listed on modules.perl6.org ? 10:59
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tadzik that's news to me 11:02
11:02 colomon joined
tadzik timbunce__: it is for me 11:02
itz Salzburg airport has good wifi BTW :)
timbunce__ Gah. The page load stalled and I thought it had finished. Sorry. 11:03
moritz timbunce__: fixed at github.com/cosimo/perl6-digest-md5/pull/8 11:05
11:07 noganex_ left, Ven joined
itz I have a v minor * pull request at github.com/rakudo/star/pull/39 if anyone is able to look at it? 11:08
dalek ar: e2c9f4d | (Steve Mynott)++ | tools/build/Makefile.in:
add p6doc-index to build -f data file for p6doc
 11:10
ar: 9dca1ca | moritz++ | tools/build/Makefile.in:
Merge pull request #39 from stmuk/master

add p6doc-index to build -f data file for p6doc
timbunce__ moritz: thanks 11:11
moritz itz: commit bit sent your way
itz thanis 11:13
err thanks even
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timotimo o/ 11:14
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timbunce__ The perl6.org/getting-started page suggests "Ask Perl 6 questions on perlmonks" - should it? I see that perlmonks isn't mentioned on the perl6.org/community page. Should it be? 11:16
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TimToady Ven: you're supposed to be able to declare an "out" parameter for the return value, but that's not implemented 11:19
but presumably a parameter can submatch a signature
not sure what that would mean in a return parameter
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TimToady std: sub foo ($a,$b --> True) {...} 11:20
camelia std bd22b5c: OUTPUT«(timeout)»
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japhb moritz: lizmat has returned :-) 11:25
lizmat moritz: still running after 2.5 hours
colomon how is the day going at APW?
lizmat memory usage now flipping between 1.5GB and 9GB within seconds
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Ven std: sub foo(Str $ --> :(Hash[Str] --> Str)) {} 11:28
japhb colomon: Pretty well. Lots of people hacking and/or discussing
camelia std bd22b5c: OUTPUT«ok 00:01 148m␤»
Ven TimToady: right, it's just ENOTIMPLEMENTED
colomon \o/ 11:29
discussing hacking, I hope. ;)
japhb colomon: Mostly. A little SF discussion as well. :-)
Ven I have two people trying out perl6 besides me
japhb Ven: \o/
colomon japhb: :)
dalek href="https://perl6.org:">perl6.org: 19f092c | timbo++ | source/getting-started/index.html:
Refer to Rakudo Star as distro+modules, remove mention of parrot.
 11:31
href="https://perl6.org:">perl6.org: 7864ca3 | timbo++ | source/getting-started/index.html:
Change github perl6/book/downloads link to /documentation
href="https://perl6.org:">perl6.org: bf85273 | timbo++ | source/getting-started/index.html:
Change rt.perl.org link to refer directly to perl6 bug queue
href="https://perl6.org:">perl6.org: f10e3e7 | timbo++ | source/getting-started/index.html:
Replace dead planetsix.perl.org/ link with pl6anet.org/
href="https://perl6.org:">perl6.org: 4a4c618 | timbo++ | source/getting-started/index.html:
Remove perlmonks.org link as we already have a /community page link
Ven timbotimbo \o/
TimToady Ven: that sig is starting to look suspiciously like Haskell...
Ven TimToady: sorry? :P
*g*
TimToady multiple --> for currying and such 11:32
Ven can I do --> --> ?
:P
lizmat moritz: ok, if it doesn't finish after 3 CPU hours, I'm going to kill it as the resulting file is too large to be useful anyway 11:39
what would be a suggested setting to try it again, then?
11:44 ghostlines left
colomon Zlib and SSL modules started failing overnight. :\ 11:45
moritz lizmat: --sparse=10
lizmat: as an option to htmlify,p6
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lizmat gotcha 11:45
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lizmat restarted 11:49
processing complete, I guess it's now working on the profile 11:52
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brrt bartolin: wrt 112678 - where is this behavior specced? 11:58
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dalek ecs: 03b0723 | pmichaud++ | S05-regex.pod:
[S05]: Based on #apw2014 discussion, mark PEG tiebreaker #5 as conjectural.
 12:06
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pmichaud Instead of Supply.interval(1), I wonder if it's worth considering (1..*).supply(:interval(1)) 12:23
that would also enable things like
(1,2,4 ... *).supply # provide powers-of-two at 1 second intervals 12:24
lines().supply # read lines from a file
etc.
pmichaud is reading S17. :-)
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mephinet $base_path.IO.watch.act consumes 100% cpu on my machine... 12:29
japhb mephinet: Which backend? 12:30
masak rezzes
masak backlogs, heavily
mephinet moarvm
JimmyZ known issue.
japhb listens to the sound effect of masak rezzing in
mephinet JimmyZ: ok, thanks
12:31 cognome joined
masak I was gone. this is the first time I've been wanting to use the term "disruptive", in a *good* way, of my family, on my apartment. wow. 12:31
they came. they saw. they IKEA'd.
dalek line-Python: ef75a9f | nine++ | / (9 files):
Implement initialization of Python and eval without return values.
 12:33
timbunce__ Is Blizkost (mentioned on perl6.org/compilers) dead now we have Inline::Perl5? 12:36
masak thinks "no" 12:37
though likely it will find much less use, perhaps? 12:39
Ven ooh inline::python
masak anyway, Inline::Perl5 should probably be mentioned instead of Blizkost. 12:40
wiw, Inline::Python.
wow*
Ven goes to nine to glance over his shoulder :o)
masak it's almost as if the old Parrot dream is coming true...
dalek href="https://perl6.org:">perl6.org: 3ab06f6 | timbo++ | source/getting-started/involved.html:
Minor tweaks to getting-started/involved
href="https://perl6.org:">perl6.org: ff74ec0 | timbo++ | source/community/index.html:
Minor tweaks to community/index
href="https://perl6.org:">perl6.org: 3bf0553 | timbo++ | source/compilers/index.html:
Switch Compilers list from ul to dt. Add Inline::Perl5 to Supplementals.
masak "one VM, all languages"
Ven hehe.
well that's cheating but :P
masak troo 12:41
but we can do less cheating gradually
and in the meantime, it'll still teach us stuff
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masak like how to exchange rich objects across the rift 12:41
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JimmyZ yeah, since we have toy php/ruby compilers on nqp 12:41
:)
dalek p: 3047e97 | TimToady++ | src/QRegex/Cursor.nqp:
AND fates with 0xffffffff, prep for longest-lits
 12:43
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timbunce__ perl6.org/compilers has a link to "Rakudo's setting library" with no further description. Can someone give me a sentence or two to describe it?
laben hello #perl6'ers, are you hackaton'ing? 12:44
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laben FROGGS++: i used your pull req for Digest::MD5 to fix it and make it run 12:46
FROGGS ohh, that sounds good :o) 12:47
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laben i am backlogging now, but today was especially active ;P 12:48
japhb laben: *hackhackhack* 12:50
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masak .oO( hacktive ) 12:51
laben wow, nine++, inline python seems very interesting
gonna try to build it now
japhb timbunce__: A Perl 6 setting defines all of the classes, routines, and terms available when your script starts -- in Perl 5 parlance, it's roughly all the things you can see in perlfunc, perlop, etc. 12:52
timbunce__ japhb++
laben nine: which python version does your module require? 12:53
japhb There are different settings for default use, restricted (for unsafe environments, like camelia), etc.
timotimo are spec tests supposed to be clean at the moment? 12:54
masak aren't they supposed to be clean always?
timotimo well, yeah
er, i meant:
with a normal rakudo on master, should i expect it to pass all everythings?
because right now i see a few fails :( 12:55
japhb Well, we known S17 tests are flakey (which is why I'm working on extending perl6-bench to support stress tests that we can use to root out said flakiness), but I'm not sure about anything else.
*we know
masak timotimo: without knowing more, I would say "yes, you should".
timotimo :)
masak and all errors should be reported somewhere centrally, and ideally flagged up and investigated. 12:56
timotimo i'm seeing too many fails, i shall build a clean master rakudo
oh, i should remove that debug say statement from the middle of rakudo's bootstrap %)
japhb That would probably help. :-)
masak oops :)
timotimo "expected 'blah' but got 'DEBUGblahDEBUGDEBUG'" 12:57
masak DEBUGlolDEBUG
laben whoa, a single .pm file blows up to a 3.2MB .moarvm file, how is this even possible?
masak pmurias: irclog.perlgeek.de/perl6/2014-10-10#i_9487876 -- very yes! 13:01
timotimo spec tests look much better this time 13:02
mephinet Another beginner's perl5 question: which module to use for http access? LWP::Simple?
tadzik HTTP::UserAgent
timotimo we actually have one that's a bit better
yes, that one
ohai tadzik :)
tadzik ohai :)
timotimo have you checked out my super awesome game yet?
13:02 chenryn left
mephinet tadzik: thanks! 13:03
tadzik timotimo: no, I only heard of the lightning talk :)
colomon timotimo: looked to me like I'd need to install cairo to try it? 13:04
tadzik timotimo: where do I find it?
timotimo that's right 13:05
rurban Updated parrot profiles for improved utf8_substr handling: github.com/parrot/parrot/issues/1097
jnthn timbunce__: I'd say Blizkost is pretty dead 13:06
timotimo sadly won't be easy on a mac ;(
tadzik, colomon: github.com/timo/gtk_cairo_shooter
arrow keys left/right and space bar 13:07
dalek href="https://perl6.org:">perl6.org: 397ba99 | timbo++ | source/compilers/index.html:
Add note on NQP, and description for Settings to /compilers
timbunce__ jnthn: the page now says "(Mostly superseded by Inline::Perl5.)" - or will when updated next
colomon timotimo: I already had that page open in my browser
jnthn timbunce__: OK. But given I don't think it even works against current Rakudo, it's probably dead. There's no reason to resurect it because Inline::Perl5 works, and does more.
timotimo i had some local changes to moarvm that made trigonometry explode
but other than that ...
timbunce__ jnthn: ok, I'll remove it 13:08
jnthn timbunce__: Thanks.
colomon decides he might as well try it to verify he doesn't have everything needed to make it work.
colomon is pretty sure GTk::Simple is not going to work 13:09
laben nine: i tried Inline::Python and it seems to work only with Python 2, is that correct?
colomon and it doesn't
nwc10 good *, #perl6 13:11
masak nwc10! \o/ UGT to you, sir! 13:12
masak .oO( 'tis the season for universal greetings, and a good will towards all )
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timotimo merry christmas, nwc10! 13:17
masak and a happy new year!
JimmyZ Stage parse : 67.588 # moar on my thinkpad ...
masak m: say "Is It Christmas?" ~~ * # in Perl 6, any time is Christmas... 13:18
camelia rakudo-moar 5bb0d4: OUTPUT«True␤»
masak \o/
nwc10 It's Christmas in Heaven | There's great films on TV | The Sound of Music twice an hour
mauke m: say *
camelia rakudo-moar 5bb0d4: OUTPUT«*␤»
mauke well then
nwc10 it's vaguely appropriate :-)
masak what-*ever*
masak rolls his eyes 13:19
mauke *,*
brrt anybody with special experience knows how to negate a floating point on x86-64 13:25
tadzik hmm, I seem to be missing libgobject-2.0 for GTK::Simple, weird 13:26
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timotimo may be the wrong name 13:28
tadzik I have glib2.0-dev installed alright
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timotimo you don't need the -dev for the .so 13:28
brrt: i've tried that, too
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timotimo my attempt was like xor the xmm0 with xmm0, then subtract the number from thar 13:29
that*
masak updated rt.perl.org/Ticket/Display.html?id=118867 -- forgot to cc p6-c.
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nwc10 masak: only confusion is that it's very very sunny in Salzberg 13:29
I can't spell Salzburg, oops 13:30
masak "You might say that positive lookaheads are opaque to LTM, but negative lookaheads are transparent to LTM." -- this is now my favorite sentence in all of the spec^Wsynopses.
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masak very poetic. 13:30
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Ven masak: I've actually been trying to convince FROGGS to plug v5 into nine's I::P5, actually :D 13:34
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pmurias Ven: how do you want it plugged? 13:36
Ven pmurias: actions class calling inline::p5
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masak yeah, I don't understand either :) 13:36
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Ven so you have BOTH v5's "nice" syntax, and i::p5 usefulness 13:37
masak I think I know too little about how Inline::Perl5 works to see the beauty of your proposal.
Ven well, inline::p5 forces you to do stuff like $i5.use('...') and stuff.
if we could do what I think we can, we would have {use v5; use Module;} 13:38
masak aha
yes, then I can see the charm
Ven I just decided what I was going to hack on, basically :P 13:39
brrt it's annoying
brrt afk for a bit
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Ven erm, I was trying to base off what you did, masak, in your indented-stuff parsing, but I just threw it out because it can't work while parsing :P 13:39
but FROGGS++ helped me think through that. Recursion is the key! :P
masak yeah
Ven: I've been re-thinking the indent stuff, but I haven't written up the rethink as a module. 13:40
if I did, that new module would probably replace the old one.
Ven masak: so now, I have rule line($indent = 0)
and it tries to parse $indent+1 lines
masak oki 13:41
sounds rather nice :)
Ven yes. Also, in your case, you get the indented stuff "after" the "current line". Which I don't want - I want it as a children list
masak aha. 13:42
yeah.
would be nice to extract these new learnings into a module. :)
maybe we can collaborate on that at some point? 13:43
Ven just come tomorrow :P
sorry. I'll try to work on that tomorrow, and report back
masak cool. 13:44
consider the Text::Indented namespace to be yours if you have ideas that can reach longer than what's currently there :) 13:45
moritz m: my regex ws { b+ }; given 'abba' { say so m:r/a a/ } 13:54
camelia rakudo-moar 5bb0d4: OUTPUT«False␤»
moritz m: grammar A { regex ws { b+ }; token rule TOP {a a}}; say A.parse('abba')
camelia rakudo-moar 5bb0d4: OUTPUT«===SORRY!=== Error while compiling /tmp/0KK3ncBtgL␤Malformed regex␤at /tmp/0KK3ncBtgL:1␤------> grammar A { regex ws { b+ }; token rule ⏏TOP {a a}}; say A.parse('abba')␤ expecting any of:␤ statemen…»
moritz m: grammar A { regex ws { b+ }; rule TOP {a a}}; say A.parse('abba') 13:55
camelia rakudo-moar 5bb0d4: OUTPUT«｢abba｣␤␤»
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dalek line-Python: dac3ee9 | nine++ | / (4 files):
Implement conversion of Python integer to Int
 14:02
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nine laben: quite possible. That reminds me that I should update my local Perl 5 Inline::Python to the current version which supports Python 3 already... 14:03
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mephinet m: IO::Path.new(:basename("foo"), :directory("/bar")).path 14:04
camelia ( no output )
mephinet m: say IO::Path.new(:basename("foo"), :directory("/bar")).path 14:05
camelia rakudo-moar 5bb0d4: OUTPUT«foo␤»
mephinet m: say IO::Path.new(:basename("foo"), :directory("/bar")).Str
camelia rakudo-moar 5bb0d4: OUTPUT«foo␤»
mephinet ^ shouldn't this return /bar/foo, according to doc.perl6.org/type/IO%3A%3APath#method_Str 14:06
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moritz mephinet: I think the spec changed recently, and doc.perl6.org hasn't caught up :( 14:07
mephinet ok, so I'll take a look into the source, maybe I'll figure out a way to get what I want... 14:08
moritz m: say IO::Path.new(:basename("foo"), :directory("/bar"))
camelia rakudo-moar 5bb0d4: OUTPUT«"/home/p6eval/foo".IO␤»
moritz mephinet: abspath, I think
m: say IO::Path.new(:basename("foo"), :directory("/bar")).abspath 14:09
camelia rakudo-moar 5bb0d4: OUTPUT«/home/p6eval/foo␤»
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dalek c: 9c96bbc | moritz++ | lib/Type/IO/Path.pod:
document abspath
 14:11
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laben nine: basically if i change configure.pl6 to use python2 instead of python (which is python3 on my system) everything works as inteded, while using py3 it gives warnings while compiling pyhelper.c and then cannot find the resulting .so file for the tests 14:19
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laben if i define a sub or a method as multi, i need to use multi for every definition and not only the first, right? 14:22
moritz laben: right
laben can i have a mutli submethod BUILD? 14:23
multi*
moritz I have no idea if multi submethods are supported 14:24
m: class A { multi submethod x() { 1 }; multi submethod x(Int) { 2 } }; say A.x; say A.x(42)
laben ok, so i would need to make a multi new and then a signle BUILD. that is fine, right?
camelia rakudo-moar 5bb0d4: OUTPUT«1␤2␤»
moritz laben: seems to work 14:25
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timotimo why is a "rotor" method specced for Supply, but not for Iterables in general? 14:30
moritz what does it do?
mephinet moritz: so abspath doesn't do the trick as well, right? 14:31
moritz mephinet: what do you want to get?
mephinet I think /foo/bar would be the correct result for IO::Path.new(:basename("foo"), :directory("/bar")) 14:32
ah, /bar/foo
laben mephinet: try changing $*CWD 14:33
moritz m: say IO::Path.new(:basename("foo"), :directory("/bar")).abspath 14:34
camelia rakudo-moar 5bb0d4: OUTPUT«/home/p6eval/foo␤»
laben mephinet: afaik there should be a CWD parameter for IO::Path
14:34 lizmat joined
moritz huh, that feels wrong 14:34
where's the directory gone?
oh, it's now called dirname 14:35
pmichaud (rotor method) I was remarking to lizmat+jnthn that some of the Supply methods need renaming or reconsideration
mephinet ah, the name of the parameter changed, and :directory is ignored now! 14:36
isBEKaml Hello, pmichaud - good to see you here. How's life back? :-)
mephinet moritz, laben: thanks
pmichaud isBEKaml: life is good... not sure it's "back" yet but I'm hopeful. :)
masak then we're hopeful too! 14:37
isBEKaml pmichaud: so's hope. :-)
laben is it normal that the object.new function silently ignores unrequired named parameters while complaining for unrequired positionals? 14:38
masak laben: yes 14:39
laben: not just the .new method -- all methods work like that.
laben: for details, see "Interface consistency" in S12.
laben masak: thanks, i'll read that now, but is there a profound reason? 14:40
moritz yes
isBEKaml masak: "Interface consistency" -- why do I get the feeling that it's AMOP all over? :-)
masak laben: the profound reason is what you're about to read :)
isBEKaml: AMOP?
isBEKaml masak: Kiczales, Gregor et al 14:41
masak .oO( Asynchronous Matter Of Programming )
laben masak: i mean, why there isn't a slurpy array? what's the reason for not having that?
masak isBEKaml: Aspect-Oriented Programming?
isBEKaml masak: Art of MOP
masak oh, oh.
right.
yes, I see it now :) 14:42
isBEKaml: I think it's a little bit less deep than that, actually.
timotimo m: say "banana".comb.rotor(3, 1).perl
camelia rakudo-moar 5bb0d4: OUTPUT«($("b", "a", "n"), $("n", "a", "n"), $("n", "a")).list␤»
timotimo m: say "banana".comb.rotor(4, 1).perl
camelia rakudo-moar 5bb0d4: OUTPUT«($("b", "a", "n", "a"), $("a", "n", "a")).list␤»
masak isBEKaml: it's just safe-guarding OO extensibility.
timotimo why does it produce a two-element list in the n=3 case and a 3-element list in the n=4 case?
masak isBEKaml: in class-space, not meta-space.
timotimo just me not understanding rotor, or a bug in rotor?
isBEKaml masak: I recently had the time to read through some of AMOP and it dawned on me that some of p6's OO design were taken from AMOP. 14:43
dalek c: 7d9684d | moritz++ | lib/Type/IO/Path.pod:
[IO::Path] Track method/attribute name changes
isBEKaml masak: for eg., multi-methods (called overloads in Java,C# land) are exactly called that in AMOP, along with their callnext, callsame conventions.
moritz isBEKaml: no surprise here, there isn't much else documentation on MOPs
masak jnthn++ read AMOP while implementing 6model. 14:44
isBEKaml moritz: it shouldn't have surprised me, but it did.
14:44 spider-mario left
dalek kudo/nom: ddc85c1 | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | src/core/IO/Path.pm:
Make IO::Path.new(:directory) work (again)

It's all in which the candidates are listed.		 14:45
14:51 azawawi left
Ven
.oO( the king is dead, long live the king ) # want array
 14:52
moritz Ven: though Perl 6 would call it 'wantlist', because we try to learn from p5's mistakes :-) 14:53
Ven :P. it's actually for sink, here.
moritz speculates that Ven listens to some discussathon 14:54
timotimo i figured it out
Ven pm, larry and jonathan talking together :P
moritz Ven: that can be fascinating :-)
dalek c: 5a36ec6 | moritz++ | lib/Language/regexes.pod:
[regexes] elaborate a bit on whitespace parsing
 14:55
timotimo i was actually looking for .rotor(3, 2) and .rotor(4, 3)
pmichaud TimToady: rt.perl.org/Public/Bug/Display.html?id=113026
Ven moritz: yeah. I actually (almost) convinced larry to unspec something :-P
moritz ^^ sombody please look at the commit above, if it's somewhat understandable, and not total BS
timotimo Ven: that's unspectacular 14:56
Ven huehuehue.
masak nice. just found glyph.twistedmatrix.com/2008/06/da...e-out.html which makes very much the same point I made in strangelyconsistent.org/blog/its-ju...tree-silly -- but quite differently.
14:56 erkan left
FROGGS m: my num $x = "42e2"; say($x) 14:57
camelia rakudo-moar 5bb0d4: OUTPUT«This type cannot unbox to a native number␤ in block <unit> at /tmp/OwVuoLl3_a:1␤␤»
FROGGS m: my num $x = nqp::unbox_s("42e2"); say($x)
camelia rakudo-moar 5bb0d4: OUTPUT«4200␤»
jnthn m: class A { BEGIN {say A.^name } }
camelia rakudo-moar 5bb0d4: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤No such method 'dispatch:<.^>' for invocant of type 'A'␤»
Ven moritz: this is a hard issue 14:58
14:58 erkan joined
Ven moritz: actually, I feel very confident now :P 14:58
b2gills m: my num $x = "42e2".Num; say($x) 14:59
camelia rakudo-moar 5bb0d4: OUTPUT«4200␤»
b2gills m: (enum ( :a(1), <b> )).perl.say # Fixed by github.com/rakudo/rakudo/pull/321/
camelia rakudo-moar 5bb0d4: OUTPUT«EnumMap.new("a", 1, "b", 0, )␤»
FROGGS moritz: is that a typo? github.com/perl6/doc/commit/5a36ec...d54408R923 15:00
15:00 nbrown joined, anaeem1 joined
moritz FROGGS: looks like a vim-o :-) 15:00
FROGGS :o) 15:01
moritz FROGGS++
dalek c: 430aed8 | moritz++ | lib/Language/regexes.pod:
fix vim-o
Ven hehehe
isBEKaml moritz: "unwildly"? 15:03
mauke unwidely
15:03 anaeem1 left
masak pmichaud: +1 on irclog.perlgeek.de/perl6/2014-10-11#i_9490121 15:03
isBEKaml oh, FROGGS++ already pointed that out
masak pmichaud: in fact, there's a transcript from a SoTO 2000 somewhere which agrees quite spot-on with that view. 15:04
isBEKaml mauke: unwieldy - having to spell sucks.
masak unweirdee 15:05
15:06 xenoterracide_ joined
masak ooh, new jnthn++ talk slides in the backlog! 15:07
mephinet m: say $*TMPDIR 15:09
camelia rakudo-moar 5bb0d4: OUTPUT«"/tmp".IO␤»
mephinet $ perl6 -e 'say $*TMPDIR' 15:10
returns the current directory on my rakudobrew'ed perl6, instead of $TMPDIR...
Ven ^ confirming. And it seems weird. It doesn't work on his machine, but it does work on mine. Might be because I have a mac...
masak please rakudobug-submit it, with all pertinent info. 15:11
mephinet masak: ok, will do
FROGGS mephinet: it checks if /tmp is writeable and will fall back to CWD if not 15:12
isBEKaml FROGGS: that's weird, /tmp should be world-writable, right? 15:13
mephinet my /tmp is writable, though...
lizmat moritz: in the end I had a 180MB JSON file, with a lot of Inf% and NaN%
Ven ^ its tmp is writable
lizmat and the reify's and the gimme's had been eating it all
Ven his*
sorry :(
isBEKaml Ven: Get out of Austria, fast! Their German is messing with you. :P 15:14
Ven isBEKaml: it is. So I'm speaking in french :P
15:14 pepl1 joined
moritz lizmat: sad, but not too surprising 15:14
lizmat indeed...
15:15 chenryn left
moritz wonder whether to way for GLR 15:15
*wait
and whatever I do, I should wait until after sleep
FROGGS m: my $io; say first( { .defined && ($io = .IO).all: <d r w x> }, %*ENV<TMPDIR>, '/tmp') ?? $io !! IO::Path.new(".");
camelia rakudo-moar 5bb0d4: OUTPUT«"/tmp".IO␤»
FROGGS mephinet: what does that do on your box?
dalek line-Python: 48251a5 | nine++ | / (3 files):
Convert (Unicode) strings from Python to Perl 6
 15:16
Ven moritz: wait for what?
nine: should have embedded PyPy :PPP
pmurias we now have an Inline-Python?
Ven pmurias: looks like it!
.oO( Inline::PHP – so you can write perl6 instead! )
FROGGS >.<
Inline::PHP4 - just because! 15:17
japhb Inline-Haskell -- so you can reimplement Pugs from the outside-in.
nine Ven: go ahead ;)
Ven hahaha :P
15:18 chenryn joined
mephinet FROGGS: the CWD. I guess I have an idea why... 15:18
pmurias no no, that's all backwards we want a PHP backend not the ability to use PHP code
mephinet I'm using mod_tmpdir
Ven pmurias: huehuehue
mephinet which sets $TMPDIR to a directory with reduced permissions
$ ll -d $TMPDIR
drwxrwx--T 5 root philipp 4096 Oct 12 17:18 /tmp/.private/philipp
15:18 zakharyas left
FROGGS mephinet: all your fault :P 15:18
isBEKaml all with setuid bits? :-) 15:19
FROGGS though...
it should still take /tmp as I understand it
m: %*ENV<TMPDIR> = 'FOOOOO'; my $io; say first( { .defined && ($io = .IO).all: <d r w x> }, %*ENV<TMPDIR>, '/tmp') ?? $io !! IO::Path.new("."); 15:20
wait for it...
camelia rakudo-moar 5bb0d4: OUTPUT«(timeout)»
FROGGS :/
m: %*ENV<TMPDIR> = 'FOOOOO'; my $io; say first( { .defined && ($io = .IO).all: <d r w x> }, %*ENV<TMPDIR>, '/tmp') ?? $io !! IO::Path.new(".");
camelia rakudo-moar 5bb0d4: OUTPUT«Unknown test d␤ in method all at src/gen/m-CORE.setting:15641␤ in block <unit> at /tmp/4nNBiVINlK:1␤␤»
FROGGS ohh
ahh, it is not supposed to be a string perhaps? 15:21
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mephinet fun fact: 15:22
$ perl6 -e "say '/tmp'.IO.all(<d r w x>)"
True
so it ever seems to evaluate it on /tmp...
FROGGS yeah 15:23
15:23 go|dfish left, isBEKaml left
FROGGS m: say first( { .defined }, %*ENV<TMPDIR>, '/tmp') 15:23
camelia rakudo-moar 5bb0d4: OUTPUT«(timeout)» 15:24
15:25 rindolf joined
mephinet masak: another beginner's question, sorry: where do I find rakudobug-submit? neither find nor google gives me a link... 15:26
15:27 go|dfish joined
FROGGS mephinet: see rakudo.org/tickets/ 15:27
"New tickets can be created by sending email to [email@hidden.address]
it doesn't say it but please describe the bug in the email :P
15:28 Brian_ joined
mephinet :) 15:28
lizmat FROGGS mephinet : so what is the problem? 15:30
FROGGS TMPDIR=FOO perl6 -e 'say first( { .defined && ($io = .IO).all: <d r w x> }, %*ENV<TMPDIR>, "/tmp")'
Unknown test d
in method all at src/gen/m-CORE.setting:15641
that is one problem... testing a fix already
pmichaud mephinet: there's also information about submitting bug reports in the README file, under "Reporting Bugs". github.com/rakudo/rakudo 15:32
I'm going to take the text from the README and put it into the "how-to-help" page on rakudo.org 15:33
and maybe the tickets page
FROGGS "tickets" could perhaps be replaced with "report a bug"? 15:34
because, as a newbie I am not interested in other tickets, and as a pro I know that I find information about tickets on a "report a bug" page 15:35
pmichaud you mean in the url? the menu entry already says "Bug tracker"
updated page: rakudo.org/tickets/ 15:37
comments/fixes welcome 15:39
Now also referenced on rakudo.org/how-to-help/ . 15:41
15:42 JimmyZ left 15:44 kjs_ joined 15:46 wollmers joined
timbunce__ github.com/perl6/ye-olde now exists. Any comments on the description in the README? /cc pmichaud 15:50
nine Wow, I discovered a trivial endless loop in Rakudo: "Test".encode("utf-8") eq "Test"; # eats all my RAM
moritz probably even easier: Buf.new(1) eq 'Test'
nine moritz: true 15:51
15:51 mauke left 15:52 mauke joined
timotimo nine: yes, known ;( 15:53
Buf does not do Stringy, but .Stringy on it returns self
"it's not a stringy yet, i should call .Stringy on it and try again" 15:54
for ever.
FROGGS also: Buf.new(1) ~ Any
moritz if Buf isn't stringy. .Stringy shouldn't return itself 15:55
timotimo that's right 15:56
dalek kudo/nom: 1c89f21 | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | src/core/IO/ (4 files):
No longer use IO::Path.all internally

It is under investigation		 15:57
wollmers m:"o\x[307,323]".comb.elems 15:58
15:58 ghostlin_ joined, molaf joined
wollmers m: "o\x[307,323]".comb.elems.say 15:59
camelia rakudo-moar ddc85c: OUTPUT«3␤»
15:59 nbrown left
wollmers m: "o\x[307,323]".NFC.comb.elems.say 15:59
camelia rakudo-moar ddc85c: OUTPUT«No such method 'NFC' for invocant of type 'Str'␤ in block <unit> at /tmp/owatvKJQdN:1␤␤»
15:59 Akagi201 left 16:00 Akagi201 joined
jnthn Buf.Stringy should probably call Buf.Str 16:00
16:00 xenoterracide_ left
pmichaud timbunce__: perhaps a note in the README that it's primarily for tracking issues outside of the "perl6.org" domain (since things inside perl6.org already have their own trackers) 16:01
m: $fh = open("README.md"); say $fh.lines[1];
camelia rakudo-moar ddc85c: OUTPUT«===SORRY!=== Error while compiling /tmp/QueTa39BEB␤Variable '$fh' is not declared␤at /tmp/QueTa39BEB:1␤------> $fh⏏ = open("README.md"); say $fh.lines[1];␤ expecting any of:␤ postfix␤»
timbunce__ pmichaud: will do
pmichaud m: my $fh = open("README.md"); say $fh.lines[1];
camelia rakudo-moar ddc85c: OUTPUT«open is disallowed in restricted setting␤ in sub restricted at src/RESTRICTED.setting:1␤ in sub open at src/RESTRICTED.setting:5␤ in block <unit> at /tmp/XhLn4mt8cL:1␤␤»
16:02 Brian_ left
pmichaud m: my $fh = IO::Handle.new; $fh.open("README.md"); say $fh.lines[1]; 16:02
camelia rakudo-moar ddc85c: OUTPUT«IO::Handle is disallowed in restricted setting␤ in sub restricted at src/RESTRICTED.setting:1␤ in method new at src/RESTRICTED.setting:21␤ in block <unit> at /tmp/IeKbk6dBBN:1␤␤»
pmichaud lizmat: apparent bug in IO::Handle.lines -> gist.github.com/pmichaud/55a0a1543a4fd8a17d7c 16:05
16:06 xenoterracide_ joined
pmichaud now updated 16:06
16:06 laben left
pmichaud actually, I'll file an RT for it 16:08
16:10 Brian_ joined
Ven m: say (rand xx 5 xx 5).lol.perl # is xx a listop? 16:11
camelia rakudo-moar ddc85c: OUTPUT«(0.0642102317242874e0, 0.0495805551982834e0, 0.601856287867469e0, 0.144757372978787e0, 0.895204040012804e0, 0.125387435322411e0, 0.764568587119958e0, 0.516667731366473e0, 0.107924606073753e0, 0.0918279826121361e0, 0.680850739676986e0, 0.209667421292075e0, …»
16:12 denis_boyun joined
dalek rl6-bench/stress: 70fb97c | (Geoffrey Broadwell)++ | timeall:
Add diagnose_capture() to provide a unified way to diagnose failures in test runs
 16:14
rl6-bench/stress: aeb0b94 | (Geoffrey Broadwell)++ | timeall:
Add comments to make explicit why some callers of run_tests() or time_all_compilers() catch exceptions, and some don't
rl6-bench/stress: 6e83296 | (Geoffrey Broadwell)++ | timeall:
Allow tests to specify expected output, in string or code form, and accept it in time_command()
rl6-bench/stress: 5d533f5 | (Geoffrey Broadwell)++ | timeall:
Pass expected output down to time_command()
rl6-bench/stress: 3bfdc41 | (Geoffrey Broadwell)++ | timeall:
Switch over to new protocol between time_all_compilers() and time_command(), including saving much more data about output and failure modes in per-run info hashes. This protocol (using run_info->{failed} instead of returning undef on command failure) will need to be extended outwards from time_all_compilers(), but I expect that this will end up with a lot of fallout.
TimToady m: say (rand xx 5).WHAT
16:14 Brian_ left
camelia rakudo-moar ddc85c: OUTPUT«(List)␤» 16:14
TimToady m: say ((rand xx 5,) xx 5).lol.perl 16:15
camelia rakudo-moar ddc85c: OUTPUT«(0.250623387102813e0, 0.364574042722242e0, 0.183950671379639e0, 0.612407072111445e0, 0.224575850296392e0, 0.789507832757076e0, 0.266554080399324e0, 0.950510703068462e0, 0.243425708359133e0, 0.879783949838789e0, 0.295875280090971e0, 0.633518496207426e0, 0.0…»
TimToady hmm
m: say ($(rand xx 5) xx 5).lol.perl
camelia rakudo-moar ddc85c: OUTPUT«((0.687789098937428e0, 0.719752262978069e0, 0.361492053221057e0, 0.106446581925366e0, 0.463905165471245e0).list.item, (0.412227644493526e0, 0.465935163848347e0, 0.311609330704693e0, 0.755184648739908e0, 0.649097251200573e0).list.item, (0.390846034978007e0,…»
16:17 denis_boyun left
Ven you don't even need to .lol it with $ 16:18
16:18 carlin left
TimToady nodnod 16:19
pmichaud TimToady: that looks like rt.perl.org/Ticket/Display.html?id=111732
16:20 kjs_ left
dalek kudo/nom: 94240b4 | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | src/core/IO/Path.pm:
Fix scoping issue in IO::Path.all
 16:20
TimToady p6: say (<[ ]> xx 10).pick(*).join 16:21
timbunce__ Should perl6.org/documentation/ still link to "Perl 6 and Parrot Essentials, 2nd Edition" ? 16:22
camelia rakudo-{parrot,moar} ddc85c: OUTPUT«(timeout)»
moritz timbunce__: not at all
jnthn timbunce__: NO
pmichaud timbunce__: *NO*
16:22 Hor|zon joined
dalek line-Python: 166a22d | nine++ | / (3 files):
Implement py_call_function
 16:24
FROGGS TimToady: that timeout seems to be camelia's fault or its machine 16:25
16:26 azawawi joined
FROGGS moritz: camelia is pretty fast on my box 16:26
16:26 Hor|zon left 16:27 imposter joined
TimToady m: say ((rand xx 5) xx 5).perl 16:27
lizmat pmichaud: updated your gist: gist.github.com/pmichaud/55a0a1543a4fd8a17d7c
imposter rakudo-moar 2014.09: OUTPUT«(0.0310884127605645e0, 0.660766453018269e0, 0.222059717292611e0, 0.76852232757651e0, 0.916799572589194e0, 0.146701245041585e0, 0.426901957902756e0, 0.963070996038028e0, 0.379452569336337e0, 0.789460871364036e0, 0.925418507178525e0, 0.643406883121996e0, 0.…»
camelia rakudo-moar ddc85c: OUTPUT«(0.872175174192954e0, 0.923336869843819e0, 0.337603871343798e0, 0.471658131760216e0, 0.800031543606972e0, 0.986673184885854e0, 0.0945058406411434e0, 0.244543695323723e0, 0.456548935105693e0, 0.733398096115551e0, 0.437349330347718e0, 0.0344160607203751e0, 0…»
lizmat it seems that somehow $!ins is lagging
FROGGS *g*
TimToady m: say ((rand xx 5,) xx 5).perl
imposter rakudo-moar 2014.09: OUTPUT«(((0.806250669165479e0, 0.478034538430306e0, 0.261319162204952e0, 0.661066718161828e0, 0.461030326837538e0).list,), ((0.490496888137333e0, 0.910621916309711e0, 0.113735491344386e0, 0.133590354692456e0, 0.862641049113965e0).list,), ((0.887862349062371e0, 0…»
camelia rakudo-moar ddc85c: OUTPUT«(((0.503282017910519e0, 0.844880026717003e0, 0.384680062350277e0, 0.300549716379671e0, 0.276662202886109e0).list,), ((0.0791750576180236e0, 0.0814673635548483e0, 0.242698199200667e0, 0.460314611683186e0, 0.330456774253125e0).list,), ((0.101111935154391e0, …»
FROGGS see, my imposter is faster :o)
16:27 imposter left
lizmat but I have no idea how to make that better 16:27
16:28 denis_boyun_ joined, kjs_ joined
lizmat the increment is *immediately* after the "take" 16:28
16:28 xenoterracide_ left
TimToady m: say ((rand xx 5) xx 5).elems 16:29
camelia rakudo-moar ddc85c: OUTPUT«25␤»
lizmat I guess I could do it just before the take, but after we know we have a line
TimToady m: say (('a' xx 5) xx 5).elems
camelia rakudo-moar ddc85c: OUTPUT«5␤»
TimToady m: say (('a' xx 5) xx 5)[0].WHAT
camelia rakudo-moar ddc85c: OUTPUT«(Parcel)␤»
pmichaud m: (('a' xx 5) xx 5).perl 16:30
camelia ( no output )
pmichaud m: (('a' xx 5) xx 5).perl.say
camelia rakudo-moar ddc85c: OUTPUT«(("a", "a", "a", "a", "a"), ("a", "a", "a", "a", "a"), ("a", "a", "a", "a", "a"), ("a", "a", "a", "a", "a"), ("a", "a", "a", "a", "a")).list␤»
pmichaud m: (('a' xx 5).perl)
camelia ( no output )
pmichaud m: (('a' xx 5).perl.say)
camelia rakudo-moar ddc85c: OUTPUT«("a", "a", "a", "a", "a")␤»
pmichaud m: my $a = 'a'; (($a xx 5).perl.say) 16:31
camelia rakudo-moar ddc85c: OUTPUT«("a", "a", "a", "a", "a").list␤»
16:33 Akagi201_ joined
dalek kudo/nom: 7f8d176 | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | src/core/IO/Handle.pm:
Make sure $!ins is up to date, pmichaud++
 16:33
timbunce__ Is github.com/hinrik/grok/ worth linking to from perl6.org/documentation/ ? 16:35
pmichaud timbunce__: my initial impression is "no", since I followed the link and don't know what it is :) 16:36
timbunce__ :)
16:37 kjs_ left
timbunce__ Same question for metacpan.org/pod/Perl6::Doc 16:37
pmichaud I'd maybe feel differently if the github repo had a README and didn't start with a broken link :)
16:37 Akagi201 left 16:38 kjs_ joined, zakharyas joined
pmichaud m: my $a = 'a'; (($a xx 5) xx 5).perl.say 16:39
camelia rakudo-moar ddc85c: OUTPUT«("a", "a", "a", "a", "a", "a", "a", "a", "a", "a", "a", "a", "a", "a", "a", "a", "a", "a", "a", "a", "a", "a", "a", "a", "a").list␤»
dalek line-Python: fbcae47 | nine++ | / (3 files):
Support int parameters for Python functions
 16:40
japhb Go nine, Go nine ... 16:41
nine It is a hackathon after all...even on the way home ;) 16:43
pmichaud my $a = 'a'; (($a xx 3) xx 2).perl.say
m: my $a = 'a'; (($a xx 3) xx 2).perl.say
camelia rakudo-moar 1c89f2: OUTPUT«("a", "a", "a", "a", "a", "a").list␤»
pmichaud I believe the above should've produced (("a", "a", "a").list, ("a", "a", "a").list).list 16:44
I think that's the only consistent answer.
jnthn m: say (*.^name eq 'NC').WHAT 16:46
camelia rakudo-moar 1c89f2: OUTPUT«(WhateverCode)␤»
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dalek href="https://perl6.org:">perl6.org: c675cbc | timbo++ | source/compilers/index.html:
Remove mention of Blizkost
 16:47
href="https://perl6.org:">perl6.org: b2b65c2 | timbo++ | source/documentation/index.html:
/documentation: remove books section, curate the Miscellaneous section
pmichaud m: my $a = 'a'; (($a, $a++) xx 3) xx 2).perl.say
camelia rakudo-moar 1c89f2: OUTPUT«===SORRY!=== Error while compiling /tmp/UgjfO1uUQW␤Unexpected closing bracket␤at /tmp/UgjfO1uUQW:1␤------> my $a = 'a'; (($a, $a++) xx 3) xx 2⏏).perl.say␤»
pmichaud m: my $a = 'a'; ((($a, $a++) xx 3) xx 2).perl.say
camelia rakudo-moar 1c89f2: OUTPUT«(("g", "a"), ("g", "b"), ("g", "c"), ("g", "d"), ("g", "e"), ("g", "f")).list␤»
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dalek line-Python: 0cf56f3 | nine++ | / (3 files):
Support string parameters of Python functions
 16:48
moritz that is... creative 16:49
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moritz oh 16:49
pmichaud that should've been ((("g", "a"), ("g", "b"), ("g", "c")).list, (("g", "d"), ("g", "e"), ("g", "f")).list).list
moritz because $a returns the container
and $a++ a value
pmichaud TimToady: agree/disagree?
FROGGS does it make sense to write these things down as tests?
pmichaud FROGGS: yes, there's also an RT ticket about it 16:50
my interpretation is also consistent with what is currently written about infix:<xx> in S03 16:51
nine
timbunce__ perl6.org/specification/ links to www.dlugosz.com/Perl6/ and bills it as ``Incomplete "Perl 6 Rigorous Technical Specification'' - worth keeping?
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moritz timbunce__: IMHO not; work has stalled, and it's very incomplete 16:52
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dalek line-Python: 0149c6a | nine++ | / (2 files):
Support return values of Python functions
 16:52
tadzik Perl World Is Not Enough, starring nine++ 16:53
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pmichaud does that make nine++ into "009"? 16:54
moritz one Perl 6 to Rule Them All
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timbunce__ Any suggestions for this to add (or remove) from perl6.org/fun/ ? 16:56
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dalek href="https://perl6.org:">perl6.org: b465807 | moritz++ | includes/menu-nav:
fix duplicate menu item key
 17:01
kudo/nom: 5a0810e | jonathan++ | src/ (3 files):
Stop [does|but] Foo(arg) relying on punning.

Should be a bit more efficient, both out of not needing the pun and by a bit less fiddling in general.
kudo/nom: 0d1ab23 | jonathan++ | src/vm/ (3 files):
Add a way to register de-sugars cross-VM.
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timotimo AFK for noms 17:03
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moritz somehow jnthn++'s commit looks like there's some awesome follow-up planned :-) 17:06
gtodd for punning or for sugar :-) 17:10
pmurias jnthn: desugars++ # I have recently found myself copy & pasting desugar ops and thinking that we need to avoid duplication at some point
gtodd I thought puns were just ways to use "-pn" style oneliners
but I guess it has to do with roles classes 17:11
etc
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gtodd hmm was there ever a collection of/blog post about perl6 -pn oneliners that mimicked unix tools perl6 -pe '.=indent(4)' # perl6 -pe '.=flip' # ... etc 17:24
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itz www.parrot.org/content/what-nfg-why...ot-have-it 17:50
^^ is this still true
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itz docs.parrot.org/parrot/latest/html/...s.pod.html 18:09
this seems to have a good n00b NFG intro (unless I'm missing more recent stuff?) 18:10
nine itz: NFG is on the very short list of things really needed before a 6.0 18:23
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itz sure .. I was just looking for simple introductions 18:24
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itz in order to understand what it actually is 18:24
b2gills my $a = 'a'; $a = $a xx 1; # doesn't finish until there is no ram left 18:25
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dalek line-Python: f737340 | nine++ | / (3 files):
Support passing arrays from Python to Perl 6
 18:43
azawawi hi #perl6 18:47
azawawi is working profile file download in farabi6 after --profile is invoked 18:48
dalek line-Python: d3fa12b | nine++ | / (3 files):
Don't leak items of arrays converted from Python to Perl 6
 18:50
pmurias it would be awesome if Perl 6 managed to meld Python and Perl 5 cultures ;) 18:57
masak what, unreadable *and* haughty? :P 18:58
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masak instantly regrets propagating two myths 18:58
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pmurias is doing ruby koans for uni 19:16
we should have something like that for Perl 6 19:17
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pmurias a Perl 6 tutorial where you fill in placeholders like is ..., 'Hello '~'World'; 19:18
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azawawi pbrd.co/1o6Pgzt # farabi6 with simple profiling support :) 19:35
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masak jnthn++ # jnthn.net/papers/2014-apw-objects-c...rrency.pdf -- nice 19:38
azawawi reads it 19:39
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masak jnthn: kudos for not having the word "mailbox" in the explanation of actors ;) 19:40
or "inbox"
azawawi jnthn++
b2gills Playing with v5 it would be nice if `package ...; 19:44
azawawi masak: any idea how to test HTTP::Easy http methods? 19:47
b2gills Playing with v5 it would be nice if `package <ident>; use v? 5 [ \. | \b ]` would force v5 symantics 19:48
masak azawawi: I'm sorry, I'd need a bit more context. the general answer tends to be to mock things in some way, though.
b2gills Then I wouldn't have to edit Perl6::Form, and many other Perl5 modules designed to work with 5.008
azawawi masak: so basically Controller.new and test against it 19:49
masak wow, when I created LSM in github.com/rakudo/rakudo/blob/fbac...ore/Str.pm the consensus was that it would be replaced by a "real" solution (auto-generated grammars) in the fullness of time. but that code is still alive.
azawawi: don't know enough about the code base, but probably, yes. remember that you can subclass/replace things, as long as you fulfill the protocol. 19:51
azawawi masak: i see thanks
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masak gets to github.com/jnthn/oo-monitors/blob/...ors.pm#L91 and gets very happy :> 20:06
this language is so awesome!
I can just add whole declarative keywords, and have them tie into a metaclass! o.O 20:07
jnthn++ # that module
jnthn++ # EXPORTHOW::DECLARE
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moritz m: my $HOW := (grammar { }).HOW; my $g := $HOW.new_type(); $HOW.compose($g); $g.new 20:13
camelia rakudo-moar 0d1ab2: OUTPUT«P6opaque: must compose before allocating␤ in method bless at src/gen/m-CORE.setting:939␤ in method new at src/gen/m-CORE.setting:923␤ in block <unit> at /tmp/zrjKFtwvF7:1␤␤»
moritz what am I doing wrong here?
I mean, the compose call is right there 20:16
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masak moritz: it's thrown from github.com/MoarVM/MoarVM/blob/mast...aque.c#L95 , fwiw. 20:21
moritz oh, I see th eproblem
masak which means that st->size must be 0
moritz $HOW is not the same as $g.HOW
masak aha.
moritz oh, because it's an instance of the metaclass
not the metaclass itself 20:22
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masak it's the grammar's metaobject, not the class (type object) same 20:23
of same*
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masak still not completely backlogged :) 20:25
'night, #perl6
azawawi github.com/azawawi/farabi6/issues/33 # Panda module search next :)
masak: night
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moritz gist.github.com/moritz/730031f70a2e2df686df this doesn't work :( 20:27
it prints Any, not a Match.gist 20:28
is there anything missing for adding the candidates to the proto? 20:29
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timotimo good evening 21:06
azawawi timotimo: hi :) 21:07
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azawawi pbrd.co/1xHzMlv # Initial UI for panda-based module search 21:10
timotimo nwc10: youtu.be/VVhYT36s6D8 - this is the train that lays tracks 21:12
FROGGS masak: you should know by now that provisorilies live a very long time :o) (about your comment about LSM)
nwc10 timotimo: yes,I made it back (Thanks) 21:13
timotimo azawawi: that page hasn't been able to serve a picture to me yet
nwc10 (for the link)
timotimo you also made it back thanks to me! :P
nwc10 jnthn: there are at least *2* places where the trolleybuses have level crossings with the electrified railways
and also, I was confused about how many trolleybus routes are this way 21:14
timotimo: yes - knowing which was the correct stop helped a lot. Even if I chose to get off at the wrong one. I would nothave got that right without you
timotimo i wasn't actually serious :S
but i'm glad i could be of help :) 21:15
azawawi timotimo: what browser are you using btw?
timotimo that's chrome
let me try firefox
that works 21:16
good point
nwc10 goesto bed
timotimo i really dig the new look 21:17
timotimo ingests an aspirin
azawawi shutting down & :) 21:21
timotimo gnite azawawi 21:22
azawawi timotimo: if you have the time, please install it and let me know if you have any suggestions. Feedback is more than welcome
timotimo: panda update && panda install Farabi
timotimo does it have non-panda dependencies at all?
azawawi timotimo: panda update && panda install Farabi6 # :)
timotimo cool :) 21:23
i definitely will try it
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azawawi timotimo: thanks 21:25
azawawi sleep & 21:26
timotimo "fetching farabi, wait half an hour, please" :S
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timotimo ah, a full codemirror 21:28
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timotimo farabi.js is not found in /home/timo/perl6/install/bin/languages/perl6/site/lib/Farabi6/files/assets 21:31
this seems like it's looking in a very wrong place
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azawawi timotimo: hmmm what's your $*EXECUTABLE ? 21:37
timotimo "/home/timo/perl6/install/bin/perl6".IO
21:37 Alula left
timotimo (should that still be an .IO? after all liz did? 21:38
azawawi timotimo: and you may need the latest rakudo. It is faster than 2014.09 in JSON decoding/encoding
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azawawi timotimo: perl6 --version ? 21:38
timotimo This is perl6 version 2014.09-187-gddc85c1 built on MoarVM version 2014.09-32-gdb725c2 21:41
azawawi builds a new rakudo 21:43
strange github.com/azawawi/farabi6/blob/ma...i6.pm6#L32 should do it 21:45
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azawawi timotimo: where did you run farabi6 from? what's the working directory? 21:45
timotimo oh, so you chop off the last 3
just in ~ 21:46
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timotimo timo@schmetterling ~> perl6-m -e 'my @dirs = $*SPEC.splitdir($*EXECUTABLE); say @dirs[0..*-3]' 21:46
home timo perl6 install
azawawi timotimo: find . -name farabi.js 21:47
timotimo ./perl6/install/languages/perl6/site/lib/Farabi6/files/assets/farabi.js 21:49
so it *should* work like that
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azawawi timotimo: /home/timo/perl6/install/***bin***/language​s/perl6/site/lib/Farabi6/files/assets ... it is not backing one level 21:53
timotimo: try it the code in github.com/azawawi/farabi6/blob/ma...i6.pm6#L32 in perl6 repl 21:54
timotimo i have
and i gave you the result up there :)
azawawi yeah sleepy :) 21:55
what about $*SPEC.catdir( @dirs[0..*-3], 'languages', 'perl6', 'site', 'lib', 'Farabi6', 'files' ); ?
i smell a bug in catdir 21:56
timotimo a sec.
home/timo/perl6/install/languages/perl6/site/lib/Farabi6/files 21:57
it could be $*EXECUTABLE is the .pm file when it's run from there?
oh
or maybe it compile-time-evaluates it?
just to troll us?
azawawi lol 21:58
timotimo i'm very tired 22:00
i'm going to bed
azawawi very strange it didnt happen before lol
me 2
b2gills timotimo: correction that video is of a machine that replaces "sleepers" on a high speed track
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azawawi timotimo: thanks for trying it out... Maybe a faulty rakudo or a panda rebootstrap.... 22:00
timotimo: :) 22:01
timotimo: night
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azawawi sleep for real & :) 22:01
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timotimo b2gills: oh cool. can you tell me more about that? 22:03
b2gills timotimo: Placing rails is much more hands-on as it requires either welding high speed rails together, or bolting lower speed rails together. 22:06
timotimo: It's possible that they could use the machine to place rails, but it would need actual tires on the front. 22:09
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timotimo oh 22:11
OK
thanks for clearing that up
and now i'm going to bed
and tomorrow i will try to figure out how to get farabi to work
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b2gills timotimo: or tracks www.youtube.com/watch?v=huBiCqoBVPg#t=43 22:12
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b2gills timotimo: better view after about two minutes in: www.youtube.com/watch?v=huBiCqoBVPg#t=145 22:15
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virtualsue dear apple, sometimes you kinda suck. love me 22:29
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virtualsue i suppose i’ve always manually installed git before. got “Agreeing to the Xcode/iOS license requires admin privileges, please re-run as root via sudo.” message when i tried using git on this newish laptop just now when trying to install rakudobrew :-/ 22:31
virtualsue installs git locally and wanders to apple support forum to complain 22:32
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