»ö« Welcome to Perl 6! | perl6.org/ | evalbot usage: 'p6: say 3;' or rakudo:, or /msg camelia p6: ... | irclog: irc.perl6.org or colabti.org/irclogger/irclogger_logs/perl6 | UTF-8 is our friend!
Set by moritz on 22 December 2015.
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samcv AlexDaniel, :) 00:13
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AlexDaniel samcv: hello? :) 00:14
samcv <AlexDaniel> samcv: these are called hands :) 00:15
AlexDaniel ah… wow
samcv i see your neural implants are working
AlexDaniel ZofBot: do you have any neural implants? What about hands? 00:16
:| 00:17
ok, I won't bring this up again…
samcv sore topic for zofbot i'm sure 00:18
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TreyHarris What _is_ utf8-c8, anyway? I couldn't find a definition of it and the only places it seems to be used (by that exact name anyway) are in Perl 6-related contexts 02:39
geekosaur one of several hacks for round-tripping non-utf8 data (e.g. filenames on the filesystem, which are not guaranteed to be utf8 on posix) 02:40
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TreyHarris geekosaur: what does the "c8" refer to? 02:41
[Coke] 8bit c strings, mebbe 02:44
geekosaur doesn't recall the origin. probably need jnthn 02:45
or try to search the list archives 02:46
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TreyHarris geekosaur: tried but that was a rabbit hole, the first reference was after it was already in the code 02:47
doesn't matter, i was just curious 02:48
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TreyHarris m: HyperWhatever.new.^methods 03:03
camelia ( no output )
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TreyHarris m: say HyperWhatever.new.^methods 03:04
camelia (<anon> <anon> soft <anon> <anon> yada perl <anon> <anon> <anon> onlystar candidates unwrap wrap <anon> multi package leave <anon> <anon> <anon> <anon> <anon> <anon> <anon> <anon> cando fire_if_phasers add_phaser has-phaser phasers WHY set_why perl of po…
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Zoffix m: sub {}.^methods.say 03:47
camelia (<anon> <anon> soft <anon> <anon> yada perl <anon> <anon> <anon> onlystar candidates unwrap wrap <anon> multi package leave <anon> <anon> <anon> <anon> <anon> <anon> <anon> <anon> cando fire_if_phasers add_phaser has-phaser phasers WHY set_why perl of po…
Zoffix It's just this sub it returns: github.com/rakudo/rakudo/blob/c134...ver.pm#L15
m: say (** + 2)(1..10) 03:48
camelia (3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12)
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Zoffix There's a bit of a glitch where HyperWhatever.new gets interepreted as ** hyper whatever instead of throwing like it was meant to 03:49
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samcv TreyHarris, it is utf-8 clean 8 04:19
the c8 means clean 8
because it retains all data and does not discard invalid or improper sequences
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Geth ecosystem: d690e3a1da | (David Warring)++ (committed using GitHub Web editor) | META.list
Add Native::Packing

Structured reading and writing of numeric binary data
  github.com/p6-pdf/perl6-Native-Packing		 05:17
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RabidGravy Is there something in the ecosystem that binds errno/strerror that I am missing? 06:55
I mean it's not particularly onerous to have to declare it in the code but, y'know, re-use 06:58
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u-ou how do I get a REPL after running a script? 08:03
masak you... don't? 08:05
your idea is to somehow still be in the lexical environment of the script, yes?
u-ou yeah
there are other languages that let you do it 08:06
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masak aye 08:07
not saying it's a bad idea or anything
but I'm not aware that Rakudo allows it
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u-ou ok 08:07
masak (or the underlying nqp compiler toolkit)
RabidGravy Boom! Boom! 08:10
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masak .u boom 08:11
yoleaux U+101E1 PHAISTOS DISC SIGN BOOMERANG [So] (𐇡)
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u-ou is there a .WHAT for container type 08:12
RabidGravy VAR 08:13
?
u-ou why is every answer another question on IRC >:P 08:14
RabidGravy *shrug* 08:15
masak I dunno, why? :P 08:16
u-ou: we're a curious bunch, so we ask questions ;)
u-ou :P 08:21
jnthn In a pinch, you can always stick `loop { EVAL prompt "> " }` at the end of the script :P 08:32
u-ou :) 08:34
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samcv heh 08:35
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Ulti need BASIC break style support where you capture ctrl+c and get a REPL at the current point of execution :) such security 08:52
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tokomer /j #programming 08:55
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masak m: loop { EVAL prompt "> " } 08:58
camelia 5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling <tmp>
EVAL is a very dangerous function!!! (use the MONKEY-SEE-NO-EVAL pragma to override this error,
but only if you're VERY sure your data contains no injection attacks)
at <tmp>:1
------> 3loop { EVAL …
masak thought so
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dalek t-ZMQ: 978adfa | RabidGravy++ | lib/Net/ZMQ/Pollitem.pm:
fix typeconstraint 'as'
 09:14
Net-ZMQ: 11006ea | RabidGravy++ | .gitignore:
Net-ZMQ: add precomp to gitignore
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yoleaux 19 Mar 2017 14:59Z <AlexDaniel> dalek: ahoi, please update that repo to use geth instead: Change the webhook to geth.perl6.party/?chan=#perl6-dev (or #moarvm for moarvm), Content-type: application/json and "Send me everything." 09:14
RabidGravy yeah there were a lot of commits on that PR :-\ 09:16
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timotimo i'm not sure Net-ZMQ should keep reporting here 09:19
RabidGravy timotimo++ cheers for that, it was kind of blocking one of my plans for world domination 09:26
timotimo yeah, github notifications are pretty much 100% useless for me at the moment :< 09:27
18.5k unread mails in my github folder, too
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Geth doc: Gnouc++ created pull request #1281:
doc/Type: correct List definition		 10:23
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Geth doc: 60dbcb834f | (Cuong Manh Le)++ (committed by Zoffix Znet) | doc/Type/List.pod6
doc/Type: correct List definition (#1281)
 11:22
RabidGravy valgrind still really unhappy with Net::ZMQ 11:23
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Geth doc: 4c3d62b340 | dmaestro++ (committed by Zoffix Znet) | doc/Language/operators.pod6
Document the infix method call operators (#1273)

This documents the behavior implemented in:
   github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/cb...ceec2c74de
and
   github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/be...17b7309526		 11:30
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Swinebead Hello 11:35
Say 3
'p6: say 3;' 11:36
RabidGravy m: say 3
camelia 3
Swinebead p6: say 3;
camelia 3
Swinebead Nice 11:37
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Swinebead Is perl 6 released yet 11:37
moritz yes!
Swinebead I was looking at it today it looks awesome 11:38
masak it's released
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Swinebead I've not had to code for several years but learned perl 5 and now perl6 is out 11:38
It all looks straightforward except for the parallel stuff
masak (I always thought "released"/"not released" was a funny distinction to use for an open-source project, but there you go... people seem to think that way) 11:39
Swinebead Where's a good place to understand? The docs confused me a bit
masak there are books on the way
this channel is a pretty great place to learn
moritz I'm biased, but I like leanpub.com/perl6 :-)
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Swinebead Ok cheers 11:40
moritz (pro tip: buy it today, tomorrow you can't buy it anymore because a publisher takes over)
Swinebead I'll check out perl 6 tomorrow... (It's night time here now) 11:41
It looks like they changed cpan to zef or something ? 11:42
RabidGravy the module installer is different 11:44
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AlexDaniel m: my Int @a = 1, 2; say @a[0 | 1] 13:03
camelia any(1, 2)
AlexDaniel m: my int @a = 1, 2; say @a[0 | 1]
camelia any(1, 2)
AlexDaniel m: my int @a = 1, 2; say @a[-1 | 1]
camelia any(2, 2)
AlexDaniel m: my int @a = 45, 83, 29, 67; say @a[-1 | 1] 13:04
camelia any(67, 83)
AlexDaniel m: my int @a = 45, 83, 29, 67; say @a[-2 | 1]
camelia any(29, 83)
AlexDaniel
.oO( python mode? )
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AlexDaniel m: my int @a = 45, 83, 29, 67; say @a[3 | 1] 13:06
camelia any(67, 83)
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AlexDaniel m: my int @a = 45, 83, 29, 67; say @a[4 | 1] 13:06
camelia any(0, 83)
AlexDaniel m: my int @a = 45, 83, 29, 67; say @a[30]
camelia 0
AlexDaniel oh
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AlexDaniel m: my int @a = 45, 83, 29, 67; say @a[-1] 13:07
camelia 5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling <tmp>
Unsupported use of a negative -1 subscript to index from the end; in Perl 6 please use a function such as *-1
at <tmp>:1
------> 3my int @a = 45, 83, 29, 67; say @a[-1]7⏏5<EOL>
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w4and0er96 ping 13:35
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moritz peng! 13:44
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Geth ecosystem: 1188064bf0 | (Julien Simonet)++ | META.list
Add Log::Any (See github.com/jsimonet/log-any)
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bazzaar \o perl6 15:37
Ulti o/ 15:40
bazzaar brilliant blog series by Oracle using matplotlib from perl6, with Inline::Python, in Part7 last coloured butterfly plot, found I needed to add .cache to $x,$y sequences to get it to work, couldn't find a way to add comment or send email 15:43
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bazzaar possible I'm doing something wrong, but anyway, that's all I wanted to report 15:46
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timotimo hm, what version of perl6 are you running? 15:49
bazzaar timotimo: Rakudo version 2017.01 built on MoarVM version 2017.01 implementing Perl 6.c 15:51
timotimo okay, that's a little out of date, but it's probably the latest rakudo star you can get 15:52
Geth ecosystem: matiaslina++ created pull request #316:
Add Matrix::Client to ecosystem
timotimo perhaps it's not necessary in a newer version
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bazzaar timotimo: been having issues with datetime.date too :-) , looking forward to upgrading to next rakudo star 15:53
timotimo aye, this upcoming release will come with a rakudo-star 15:54
until then, we actually just started building AppImages for rakudo and rakudo-star
samcv.github.io/rakudo-appimage/ - feel free to try 'em out 15:55
isBEKaml timotimo: Sorry, what are appimages? Docker? Digital Ocean? 15:56
timotimo neither of those 15:57
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timotimo appimage is just chmod +x my.appimage; ./my.appimage 15:57
isBEKaml timotimo: Oh, okay. When are we doing the next Star release?
timotimo NeuralAnomaly: status 15:58
NeuralAnomaly timotimo, [✘] Next release will be in 1 day and 12 hours. Since last release, there are 24 new still-open tickets (0 unreviewed and 1 blockers) and 138 unreviewed commits. See perl6.fail/release/stats for details
isBEKaml \o/
timotimo i think zoffix wanted to delay it by a bit, i don't know if that is already in this date/time or not
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isBEKaml I'm just trying out a star release. Someone reminded me that I left my packages go stale 15:59
s/left/let/ 16:00
Geth ecosystem: 6618623dfa | (Matias Linares)++ (committed by Zoffix Znet) | META.list
Add Matrix::Client to ecosystem (#316)

  github.com/matiaslina/perl6-matrix-client/
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timotimo oh, cool 16:02
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bazzaar timotimo: I like those AppImages, and the instruction how to run 'em, it'll give folk a way of seeing if an issue in their code is due to running an oldish perl6 implementation 16:03
timotimo yeah, should be good
also, currently travis jobs for checking modules will pull down moar, nqp, and rakudo, compile all of them, then install zef, and then it'll test the module 16:04
using an appimage that gets updated daily or more often will clearly be much better
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RabidGravy yeah, it takes ten times as long to build rakudo than it does most of the tests for my modules 16:11
Zoffix The bot reports normal time, and there's still the posibility it'll be delayed by 2 days. And that's the time for *compiler* release only. Rakudo Star was planned to be done in 2017.04 and with the RC releases the final release of it is usually 1-2 weeks after the compiler's release. 16:12
So normal time is 3rd Saturday of the month, but this month it might be delayed by 2 days to be on Monday
timotimo thanks for the clarification 16:13
RabidGravy my tablet needed 36 apps updated
Zoffix And delay is due: squeezing all IO into the release. I'm gonna be done with all the functionality changes by normal release date, but the 2 day delay will let me squeeze in all the performance improvements as well; especially on Windows. If that stuff misses the release, regular users will only get it in July, when next-next Rakudo Star ships. So, I figured may as well delay this release by 2 days and ship it 16:15
all in it
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Zoffix NeuralAnomaly: status 16:16
NeuralAnomaly Zoffix, [✘] Next release will be in 1 day and 12 hours. Since last release, there are 24 new still-open tickets (0 unreviewed and 1 blockers) and 138 unreviewed commits. See perl6.fail/release/stats for details
Zoffix ^ and that's not a real blocker. It's just a reminder for me to throw out TAP.pm6 from core; the release bot won't proceed when there are blockers :)
Well, back to the salt mines! \o 16:17
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isBEKaml Zoffix: go ahead, release untested software :-) 16:17
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Zoffix isBEKaml: it's the opposite actually :) A lot of stuff was untested; this release got at least 500 more tests and more coming. I also usually TDD, so no untested stuff from me in rakudo :) 16:21
bazzaar timotimo: Thanks for your help. (Perl, and now Perl6 in one working lifetime, how lucky is that!) 16:22
Zoffix 117 new commits to test suite, with 1,631 new lines of tests added this month: github.com/perl6/roast/pulse/monthly 16:23
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robertle ri'; 16:50
sorry, daughter commandeered my keyboard... 16:52
it's a promising sign though that her otehrwise senseless input is properly terminated with a semicolon 16:53
perigrin she may be a C programmer!
huf eh, multibyte char values are implementation defined 16:54
bad bad juju
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masak today's mini-challenge: implement en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fox,_goose_a...ans_puzzle as a program that takes an initial state, a goal state, allowed transitions and illegal states, and produces a shortest solution 17:56
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TimToady
.oO(today's maxi-challenge: getting wikipedia to use Oxford comma...)
 18:09
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masak heh. 18:52
I happen to like the Oxford comma, but I don't see why people feel they need to get all prescriptive about it
TimToady I didn't, I only thunk it. 18:53
masak if you did, I wonder if Slashdot would frontpage with "Larry Wall iterates through all of Wikipedia, painstakingly adding Oxford commas" :P 18:55
masak .oO( originally known for rn, patch and Perl... ) :P 18:56
TimToady well, all we really need to do is fix is the texts that teach it wrong... 18:57
masak and then sit back and wait a generation or two
TimToady ss:2nd/is //
Geth ecosystem: 28ae3f00ad | (Sterling Hanenkamp)++ | META.list
Hash::MultiValue now uses a META6.json
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samcv NeuralAnomaly, status 21:25
NeuralAnomaly samcv, [✘] Next release will be in 1 day and 7 hours. Since last release, there are 25 new still-open tickets (1 unreviewed and 1 blockers) and 98 unreviewed commits. See perl6.fail/release/stats for details
timotimo + 2 days 21:29
samcv also is star coming out in a week
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timotimo at the very earliest, i believe? 21:30
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sammers hi all 21:52
AlexDaniel \o/ 21:54
sammers m: sub foo($i){$i+10 };sub bar($i){$i+10};5.&foo.&bar.say;
camelia 25
sammers whenever I do the . notation chaining on subs I can't put the .bar on a newline... 21:55
like we can with methods
timotimo yeah, only allowed when . is followed by alphanumeric
actually, alpha only
sammers thanks, that is mentioned here docs.perl6.org/routine/$FULL_STOP 21:56
is there a technical reason for that? or is this some rational decision to not allow this? 21:58
timotimo still wanna catch people trying to use . for concat
sammers ok, so with .& that would look something like: 'string ' . &foo(123) 22:00
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ugexe you can end the line with \ 22:20
"whatever"\ \n .&foo() 22:21
timotimo yeah 22:22
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sammers I wonder if it might make sense to have an exception for `.&`? I am most likely not considering all situations, but other than this, where else would .& or . & be attempted? sub bar($b){$b}; say "first" . &bar("second"); # which should fail with Unsupported use of . to concatenate strings; 23:32
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AlexDaniel sammers: why put whitespace around . at all in this case? 23:34
sammers right, I wouldn't. that is the case they are trying to capture 23:35
for p5 users when they use . for concat instead of ~
for method chaining .n has to be followed by an alpha. but what about subs that need to be called with & or unicode names? 23:36
AlexDaniel m: sub bar($a, $b){ $a ~ $b}; say ‘first’\ .\ &bar(‘second’)
camelia firstsecond
AlexDaniel m: sub bar($a, $b){ $a ~ $b}; say ‘first’\ .&bar(‘second’)
camelia firstsecond
timotimo i'd +1 a flag that prevents those "you're a naughty p5 programmer, aren't you?" errors
AlexDaniel just use unspace instead
timotimo: sometimes I feel like +1-ing a full removal of p5 errors
sammers ok, I know that we can use the unspace now, but, I am suggesting that there could be an exception for .& 23:37
for chaining
AlexDaniel sammers: or at least the error message can be more awesome by suggesting unspace
timotimo do we also want an exception for .""?
well, have to spell it .""()
sammers just sub names
so if there is a unicode sub name 23:38
it would be nice to just chain methods / subs regardless. as long as they had valid sub / method names. 23:40
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sammers without unspace 23:40
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timotimo it's a little dangerous that putting a .foo on the next line after something is highly sensitive to the presence or absence of a ; 23:43
if the user doesn't make it clear with indentation, it can be misleading
sammers "(1,2,3)\n.map(...)\\n.&bar(special => 'second')\n.grep(...)\\n&foo.say;" 23:45
like this example, perl6intro.com/#_chaining
if you use your own subs inbetween you have to unescape
of you put the routines on a new line
TimToady re .&foo, you can always put .self.&foo if you hate unspace 23:48
timotimo m: say &unique 23:49
camelia sub unique (| is raw) { #`(Sub|60835656) ... }
timotimo oh, didn't realize
so, here's something hilarious
sammers hmm
TimToady on the design decision to allow .foo on the next line, most of the time when you default to $_ it's in a very small context, a map or grep or small loop, which tends to work against the situation where you want a lot of newlines
so they don't overlap as much as you'd expect 23:50
timotimo trying to open a file with a really long name gives a funny result
aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa: name to
TimToady or to put it the other way, when you use a lot of newlines, you're unlikely to be defaulting methods to $_
timotimo dang, it didn't copy over
TimToady you're more likely to be using explicit vars in that case
timotimo 000003f0: 6161 6161 6161 3a20 6e61 6d65 2074 6f00 aaaaaa: name to. 23:51
00000400: 1300 0000 000a 2020 696e 2062 6c6f 636b ...... in block
it totally put a 00 byte there %)
sammers that makes sense, I like to use a lot of small subs and write them in a way that allows me to chain them. so it isn't that I am unable to chain them, it would just be "nice" to be able to chain them like any other method when I have to use .&. 23:52
timotimo char *c_message = MVM_malloc(1024); 23:55
OH NO YOU DIDN'T :D :D :D
samcv hmm? 23:59

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