»ö« Welcome to Perl 6! | perl6.org/ | evalbot usage: 'perl6: say 3;' or rakudo:, niecza:, std:, or /msg camelia perl6: ... | irclog: irc.perl6.org | UTF-8 is our friend!
Set by sorear on 25 June 2013.
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colomon Okay, so here's the thing which (right now) I don't get about pmichaud++'s blog post. 00:01
We don't have lazy for (except maybe in certain cases I don't understand?) right now. 00:02
unless we do? MapIterator is lazy, is for internally translated to MapIterator is some cases? 00:03
I guess if map can be lazy, any loop probably can too.
TimToady sink is eager, and most for loops are in sink context
the inside list is still lazy, however 00:04
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pmichaud (arithmetic grammars) Perl 6 already has a layer of awesome available, in that Perl 6 itself uses an expression parser. All we need to do is expose it or write a library to make it easier for P6 programmers to utilize. 00:04
TimToady because we want the opportunity to 'last' out of a loop before evaluating the entire list
colomon TimToady: you're talking about the input to for, which agreed, has to be lazy. 00:05
pmichaud colomon: the short answer to your question is that "for @list { block }" is internally translated to [email@hidden.address] block })"
(I'm talking about current implementation, not necessarily what will be after GLR)
At the moment I'm guessing map has become opportunistic, probably in the pursuit of increasing performance. 00:06
colomon pmichaud: nope, if I switch my previous script to use map, it's lazy. 00:07
(I mean, the output is 1 2 3 4 16 instead of the 1 2 3 4 5 … 20 16 that I got using for.)
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pmichaud colomon: then I'm guessing that 'for' is not detecting context properly, and is doing something eager/sinky in your example code. 00:08
colomon pmichaud: am I correct in thinking the basic idea here is if you can do lazy MapIter without gather / take, then you can also do lazy WhileIter, etc.? 00:10
pmichaud colomon: MapIter was designed to be lazy, yes.
TimToady is that the range optimization getting in the way somehow?
pmichaud TimToady: I don't know, since I don't know what all has been changed. I'm looking now. 00:11
TimToady I mean the one that turns it into loop()
not the one I did that batches ranges
pmichaud I don't know anything about "turns it into loop()". That's news to me. 00:12
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pmichaud It looks to me as though Rakudo has statement_control:sym<for> as either eager or sink. 00:12
colomon gist.github.com/colomon/836e41416febdf9e6a0a # no range, still not lazy 00:13
pmichaud Thus "for" is currently translating into @list.map({ block }).eager
colomon that would explain it.
TimToady well, it's not supposed to do that unless it's at statementlist level
pmichaud actually, it should never be "eager".
TimToady right
sink or direct to map 00:14
pmichaud Right now "for" is "sink" when at statementlist level, "eager" otherwise.
TimToady an "overeager" optimizization
pmichaud anyway, post-GLR it'll be either sink or pass through the laziness level wanted by source and target
TimToady hopefully GLR will speed up both lazy and non-lazy processing 00:15
pmichaud oh, I'm 95% certain it will. Perhaps even very dramatically. 00:16
TimToady one thing we didn't talk about much at the hackathon was the relationship with code purity
if you know you have no side effects (such as .say), you can optimize more batchily without concern 00:17
pmichaud We can certainly look at that as well.
It should be no problem.
colomon: anyway, MapIter goes away, to be replaced by LoopIter that has the smarts for all sorts of loop-level control.
TimToady so colomon++'s test code would perhaps behave differently without the .say 00:18
unless we have a way of saying "pretend this code is pure"
pmichaud TimToady: correct. But how would you know if the block calls a function that calls .say ?
Or do we automatically check for purity of all things being called?
TimToady has to be transitive, for sure
colomon would love it if there was a way to say "This block is pure" 00:19
explicitly, I mean.
pmichaud I'd be fine with an option to :map for that.
er, .map
TimToady and a pure gather/take can work ahead with impunity as well
pmichaud I already need a way to flag things for gather/take
adverbs would be okay.
I want to be able to signal infinite gather/take
TimToady a few hints to the negotiators would go a long way 00:20
pmichaud I'm at a DFW.pm meeting so need to focus on what they're saying :)
syntactically I'm still looking for marking a gather/take as infinit.
*infinite
I'm also okay with the once speculated: ( gather { ... }, * ) 00:34
I should probably open a specs issue ticket for that :) 00:47
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BenGoldberg GLR == Great List Revision? 01:00
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pmichaud Great List Refactor 01:01
perlcabal.org/syn/S99.html#GLR
BenGoldberg Well, for a WAG, I came pretty close :) 01:04
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JimmyZ pmichaud: Is it same as NQP? irclog.perlgeek.de/perl6/2014-10-16#i_9516313 01:39
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raydiak gist.github.com/raydiak/5f84ddc0c3255a1ae630 02:55
^ is there a more elegant way to say that?
thought I remembered there being some built-in way to match brackets, but can't remember or find it yet 02:57
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JimmyZ raydiak: github.com/moritz/json/blob/master...Grammar.pm 03:01
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raydiak that ~ thing is interesting 03:03
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ezra1 how do if find out the status of perl6 on the jvm (like interop) 03:36
JimmyZ run some test code and run it? 03:37
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ezra1 gonna try to convert a libgdx example and see how it goes 03:42
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tony-o m: for (1) -> \2 { 2.say; } 05:16
camelia rakudo-moar af95ac: OUTPUT«===SORRY!=== Error while compiling /tmp/LQ3xtz6om1␤Missing block␤at /tmp/LQ3xtz6om1:1␤------> for (1) -> \⏏2 { 2.say; }␤ expecting any of:␤ formal parameter␤ new term to be defined␤ …» 05:17
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dalek ast: 7192d95 | usev6++ | S04-declarations/implicit-parameter.t:
Add test for RT #114696, fix and unfudge 2 related tests
 06:45
synopsebot Link: rt.perl.org/rt3//Public/Bug/Displa...?id=114696
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dalek ast: 02a309e | usev6++ | S11-modules/import.t:
Add test for RT #118231
 06:59
synopsebot Link: rt.perl.org/rt3//Public/Bug/Displa...?id=118231
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moritz \o 07:11
bartolin good morning moritz 07:12
rurban I wrote branch and one week long code about \o 07:17
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FROGGS o/ 07:19
yoleaux 15 Oct 2014 20:25Z <jnthn> FROGGS: will be happy to review the patch
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masak good moarning, #perl6 07:34
FROGGS morning masak 07:37
tadzik goo moo maa 07:38
masak m: say (<c f g m> X~ <aa oo>).roll xx 3 07:41
camelia rakudo-moar af95ac: OUTPUT«gaa goo moo␤»
masak :)
tadzik: gaa goo moo!
dalek ast: ece6378 | usev6++ | S09-typed-arrays/arrays.t:
Add test for RT #119061
 07:42
synopsebot Link: rt.perl.org/rt3//Public/Bug/Displa...?id=119061
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dalek kudo/nom: 4a4f17f | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | src/core/Deprecations.pm:
Deprecate just *after* the indicated release
 07:55
FROGGS m: say v2014.10 08:03
camelia rakudo-moar af95ac: OUTPUT«v2014.10␤»
FROGGS I believe I should update the changelog about two or three things I did before I forget ... 08:04
masak +1
dalek kudo/nom: a573abf | moritz++ | docs/ChangeLog:
[ChangeLog] document Str.trans improvements
 08:08
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brrt \o 08:15
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masak m: say <z r>.map(* ~ *).map({"b{$_}t!"}).join(" good morning ") 08:20
camelia rakudo-moar af95ac: OUTPUT«(timeout)» 08:21
moritz m: say <z r>.map(* ~ *).map({"b{$_}t!"}).join(" good morning ")
maybe it works the second time, when the caches are warm
camelia rakudo-moar af95ac: OUTPUT«(timeout)»
masak m: say <z r>.map({"b{$_ ~ $_}t!"}).join(" good morning ")
camelia rakudo-moar af95ac: OUTPUT«bzzt! good morning brrt!␤» 08:22
masak fixed a bug on the way :)
moritz aye, * ~ * consumes two args
masak right.
moritz m: say <z r>.map(* x 2).map({"b{$_}t!"}).join(" good morning ")
brrt \o masak
camelia rakudo-moar af95ac: OUTPUT«(timeout)»
brrt good UGT :-) 08:23
moritz hates host08 with a passion
masak m: say <z r>.map({"b{$_ ~ $_}t!"}).join(" good UGT ")
moritz Juerd: ping
camelia rakudo-moar af95ac: OUTPUT«(timeout)»
masak ran the spectests just now. failing test file t/spec/S17-procasync/print.rakudo.moar 08:25
Non-zero exit status: 255 08:26
Parse errors: Bad plan. You planned 16 tests but ran 11.
trying again to check for flappitude.
dalek ast: e203199 | usev6++ | S02-types/hash.t:
Extend test for RT #116597
 08:29
synopsebot Link: rt.perl.org/rt3//Public/Bug/Displa...?id=116597
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moritz masak: looks flappy; I just got three TODO passed fromt he same file 08:48
masak aye.
rand it again.
ran*
TODO passed: 12-14
tadzik rand it again :P
jnthn rand indeed :P
masak so... quarantine the file?
moritz Ayn Rand it again? 08:49
masak do we have a quarantine/ directory where we put flappy test files?
FROGGS masak: not yet 08:51
masak: what about marking them flappy in *our* spectest.data?
because it is rakudo's fault, not a spec issue
and these flappy tests are only run for authors, determined by a certain env var 08:52
masak well, I was hunting for a solution that is visible in the final test report.
so that when I see failing tests I go "oh, they're failing, but they're flappy" 08:53
FROGGS hmmm
would be nice to be able to tag tests as FLAPPY like we can tag them TODO 08:54
masak yes.
so it's a fudging thing.
would be nice if we had a fudger that we understood well enough to extend/modify :) 08:55
FROGGS now we'd need someone that knows a little about TAP parser implementations... *cough* leont *cough*
jnthn I'd say a solution that goes outside of what TAP provides is probably a little over-engineered... :) 08:56
FROGGS jnthn: you are always spoiling the fun :P
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jnthn Of course... :P 08:57
azawawi hi perl6
azawawi started to read the Perl 6 book :) 08:58
jnthn also hopes that our flappy tests are a fairly temporary affliction that won't need a long-term solution...
masak are we anywhere near knowing the cause(s) of flappy tests? 08:59
FROGGS I have no idea, that is what I know 09:00
masak :)
moritz I think in the case the reason is "doing stuff in parallel is hard" 09:01
brrt that's not an excuse though :-)
brrt thinks that given enough time we would find it out 09:02
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pmurias are TODO tests passing a bad thing? 09:06
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moritz pmurias: depends on the context 09:07
during development, it's good; it means you've implemented or corrected stuff 09:08
in a release, it's a bad sign, because it means the developers haven't maintained their test cases well
and if it's sometimes passing and sometimes not, it's always bad 09:09
dalek ast: aeed867 | usev6++ | S06-other/misc.t:
Add test for RT #118875
 09:10
synopsebot Link: rt.perl.org/rt3//Public/Bug/Displa...?id=118875
arnsholt A passing TODO is often a smell of some kind 09:12
Unless, as moritz said, it's tests for the bug/feature you're working on right now
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timotimo o/ 09:37
masak \o 09:38
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timotimo i haz my powerball ♥ 10:51
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daxim this is so unelegant <stackoverflow.com/a/26402516> (dynamic dispatch/invocation) 11:02
yoleaux 28 Sep 2014 11:30Z <FROGGS_> daxim: Please make sure that patch get manually applied to the libtommath that get bundled by opensuse
daxim moritz, can you modify yoleaux to provide a permalink to irclog instead of that naked timestamp? 11:03
timotimo oooh
that's not a bad idea
.o( except yoleaux isn't ours )
daxim ah crap
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timotimo but i think the yoleaux developer is very open to plugins 11:04
actually
synopsebot could parse yoleaux' output, bunch a few lines together and give links to the irclog
or something like that
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leont Would GLR break 􏿽xAB(self, @also).map(...)􏿽xBB? 11:17
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jnthn Yes, think so. That's one that'd need s/map/for/ 11:18
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jnthn Or map { ... }, self, @also; 11:18
Depending on what looks nicest. 11:19
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leont I though so 11:20
jnthn is happy that there is at least now easy rules to answer these questions... 11:21
timotimo how about (self, |@also).map(...), will that even work at all?
i don't think it will
jnthn No 11:22
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nine_ Piece of advise: treat flapping tests as failing tests. Because that's what they are. The fact that they sometimes pass is of no use to anyone. You cannot build on that. A user cannot rely on that. 11:30
masak +1
they are worse than failing tests, though. 11:31
that's why we should quarantine them.
nine_ They are failing tests that are harder to diagnose.
I'd say TODO is just the right thing for them. It means "yes, we know this fails and we will fix it later". Exactly what you want to do with those flappies. 11:32
peteretep An alternative to TODO is making things TODO until a certain date 11:37
moritz that only helps if you have a time-based development methodology
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Juerd moritz: pong and afk 11:49
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moritz Juerd: when you're bak, do you know how much traffic the feather hosts use up? 11:51
Juerd: oh, just saw in the search that you've answered that question. Never mind then
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FROGGS ahh, moritz++ is on a mission :o) 12:11
PerlJam guten morgen #perl6 12:12
FROGGS PerlJam: moin :o) 12:13
moritz FROGGS: do you think 1U is enough? Or should I go for 2U?
FROGGS moritz: I have no idea what the diff in CPU/RAM/extras is 12:14
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moritz FROGGS: there's primary a difference in available space :-) 12:15
PerlJam moritz: Are you going to setup a replacement for feather?
moritz PerlJam: that's the plan, kind
PerlJam moritz++ 12:16
moritz PerlJam: I have good chances to convince my employer (who does, among other things, hosting and colocation) to give us some rack space for free
maybe for a logo at the bottom of perl6.org or doc.perl6.org
PerlJam: and FROGGS++ would donate a server to install there 12:17
FROGGS moritz: well, partially at least, depends on how much it is at the end
moritz FROGGS: I wasn't assuming that I buy whatever I want and you pay :-) 12:18
FROGGS :o)
PerlJam A 2U would be nice if you needed disks for some RAID configuration.
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dalek kudo-star-daily: db9d9ed | coke++ | log/MoarVM-version.log:
today (automated commit)
 12:19
rl6-roast-data: 9dff240 | coke++ | / (4 files):
today (automated commit)
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[Coke] (flapping) neither todo nor skip is quite right, but skip is preferable from an automated testing standpoint. 12:34
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[Coke] (at least if todo'd, be sure to include "FLAP" somewhere so we don't have arguing commits about passing vs. failing) 12:35
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masak +1 12:36
PerlJam When a test has been flapping, how do we decide that it's no longer flapping? 12:38
FROGGS we need to debounce it, clearly :o)
(over several systems)
[Coke] PerlJam: "when was the last time it failed on the daily runs" is a good first approximation 12:40
we had several tests that would fail every other day. 12:41
PerlJam If we marked tests as flappy we could get a more automatic "time since last flap" indicator. 12:42
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FROGGS +1 12:47
daxim rakudo: sub foo_bar { 42 }; say foo_bar
camelia rakudo-{parrot,moar} a573ab: OUTPUT«42␤» 12:48
FROGGS we could fudge it as #?rakudo.moar flap ..., and it would turn it into a TODO that includes the word "FLAP"
daxim rakudo: sub foo_bar { 42 }; my $fname = 'foo_bar'; say $fname.()
camelia rakudo-parrot a573ab: OUTPUT«No such method 'postcircumfix:<( )>' for invocant of type 'Str'␤ in any at gen/parrot/BOOTSTRAP.nqp:1712␤ in block <unit> at /tmp/tmpfile:1␤␤»
..rakudo-moar a573ab: OUTPUT«Cannot find method 'postcircumfix:<( )>'␤ in block <unit> at /tmp/tmpfile:1␤␤»
daxim what's the invocation syntax here?
PerlJam FROGGS: sounds good to me. 12:49
moritz daxim: &::($name)
FROGGS PerlJam: though, in the summary it would only show "TODO passed: 12, 14"
which does not help at all 12:50
moritz m: sub foo_bar { 42 }; my $fname = 'foo_bar'; say &::($fname)()
camelia rakudo-moar a573ab: OUTPUT«42␤»
moritz daxim: ^^
daxim rakudo: sub foo_bar { 42 }; say &::('foo_bar')() 12:51
camelia rakudo-{parrot,moar} a573ab: OUTPUT«42␤»
daxim good
moritz also
m: sub foo_bar { 42 }; my $fname = '&foo_bar'; say ::($fname)()
camelia rakudo-moar a573ab: OUTPUT«42␤»
moritz you're flexible about where the sigil is
daxim oh gosh, I don't like that at first glance 12:52
PerlJam FROGGS: then we make the harness smarter so that it calls out flapping tests explicitly separate from TODOs :)
FROGGS: something like : FLAP passed: 12, 14 (this time)
:)
FROGGS PerlJam: that is where jnthn started to spoil it :o) 12:53
but yes, I'd like to see that
daxim: well, then start do dislike calling subs indirectly :o)
brb
PerlJam daxim: yeah, why /do/ you want to call a sub in this manner? 12:54
daxim for porting perl5 code
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moritz there are genuine use cases, usually related to DSLs or something like that 12:55
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PerlJam aye, but the P5er in me starts off with "don't do that!" :) 12:56
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moritz ... except when you generate accessors, or what not 12:57
PerlJam: I think daxim has been helping p5ers long enough to know when to use a hash instead :-)
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PerlJam funnily enough, I have some P5 code that calls subs in this manner that I'm modifying right now 12:59
(not changing that aspect of the code though)
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pmichaud good morning, #perl6 13:07
PerlJam greetings pm
masak pmichaud! \o/ 13:08
TimToady morning! 13:09
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pmichaud TimToady: still on .eu time? ;-) 13:09
bbiab, kid to school 13:10
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TimToady about on EST now... 13:11
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azawawi hi 13:14
PerlJam hello azawawi
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azawawi how does one 'return' from an END block in Perl 6? 13:15
moritz m: END { say 42; return; say 23 }
camelia rakudo-moar a573ab: OUTPUT«42␤===SORRY!===␤Attempt to return outside of any Routine␤»
moritz azawawi: not, it seams
*seems
azawawi m: END { return; }
camelia rakudo-moar a573ab: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Attempt to return outside of any Routine␤»
azawawi std: END { return; } 13:16
moritz azawawi: in theory with 'leave', but that's NYI
camelia std bd22b5c: OUTPUT«ok 00:01 140m␤»
azawawi NYI?
moritz not yet implemented
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azawawi :) 13:16
moritz m: END { leave; say 42 }
camelia rakudo-moar a573ab: OUTPUT«===SORRY!=== Error while compiling /tmp/RnYVlxP60l␤Undeclared routine:␤ leave used at line 1␤␤»
PerlJam What would "return" mean in an END block, anyway?
TimToady um, END is not a sub
nor is main 13:17
moritz FROGGS: wouldn't implementing 'leave' be a nice project? :-)
masak m: foo: say "OH HAI"; END { goto foo }
camelia rakudo-moar a573ab: OUTPUT«===SORRY!=== Error while compiling /tmp/V8lyjq903z␤Undeclared routine:␤ goto used at line 1␤␤»
masak oh right. labels, but no goto.
n: foo: say "OH HAI"; END { goto foo }
camelia niecza : OUTPUT«Cannot open assembly './run/Niecza.exe': No such file or directory.␤»
moritz m: foo: END { last foo }
camelia rakudo-moar a573ab: OUTPUT«Unhandled exception: No exception handler located for last_label␤ at src/gen/m-CORE.setting:12274 (/home/p6eval/rakudo-inst-1/languages/perl6/runtime/CORE.setting.moarvm:<anon>:48)␤ from src/gen/m-main.nqp:50 (/home/p6eval/rakudo-inst-1/languages/p…»
azawawi but the question is, why isnt it a sub...? 13:18
for consistency that is
moritz azawawi: because there's no 'sub' keyword in front
m: sub END { return }
camelia ( no output )
moritz m: sub END { say 42; return }
camelia ( no output )
pmichaud back 13:19
END is a phaser, much like LAST NEXT REDO FIRST etc. 13:20
PerlJam azawawi: if you mean for "return" to stop executing the END block, you can always wrap the conditional part of the END block in an if statement.
azawawi I see. Thanks for the explanation :)
so END phases things out... :) 13:21
dalek kudo/nom: 329ed92 | moritz++ | docs/ROADMAP:
[ROADMAP] mention leave
 13:22
azawawi now the question is why rakudo did not catch that obvious error until it hit it 13:24
the thing is `panda install Farabi6` was failing 13:25
moritz azawawi: because returns are dynamically scoped
m: my $double = -> $x { return 2 * $x }; sub foo($x) { $double($x) }; say foo 42 13:26
camelia rakudo-moar a573ab: OUTPUT«84␤»
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moritz this is valid 13:26
JimmyZ pmichaud: I had a question : irclog.perlgeek.de/perl6/2014-10-16#i_9516580
moritz so it's kinda hard to come up with a general analysis that complains about return in blocks but doesn't make the above a false positive
azawawi i see 13:27
azawawi `panda install Farabi6` is working again :)
azawawi blames himself for not testing it
pmichaud JimmyZ: I'm not sure I understand the question. 13:28
JimmyZ: are you asking if 'for' in NQP does a .map?
azawawi timotimo: ping
JimmyZ pmichaud: yeah
TimToady moritz: return is defined to be lexotic
so that code is incorrect
pmichaud JimmyZ: no, NQP doesn't have a .map. It does the 'for' directly, and it's not lazy. 13:29
JimmyZ pmichaud: Thanks
pmichaud and I'm pretty sure that 'for' in NQP doesn't return a list.
moritz iirc nqp just has a sub map 13:30
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moritz not even that 13:30
dalek ast: 4295bfc | usev6++ | S32-list/ (2 files):
Add tests for RT #118755
 13:33
synopsebot Link: rt.perl.org/rt3//Public/Bug/Displa...?id=118755
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FROGGS moritz: probably, yes 13:49
moritz: though, open(:nl) first
PerlJam Why is the number of lines read called "ins"? It keeps making me think "insert" more than anything else 13:53
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moritz "in"s vs "out"s 13:54
PerlJam Do we have an outs method/sub for lines written to a IO handle? 13:55
moritz bartolin: do you have a list of test files for me that could be included in rakudo's t/spectest.data? 14:00
pmichaud well, although my sleep schedule is definitely back on US time, my eating schedule is not. I'm starving for lunch, and it's only 9:07. :-/ 14:07
jnthn pmichaud: I think that's called "breakfast" :P 14:08
PerlJam maybe "second breakfast" 14:09
pmichaud jnthn: I'd call it breakfast if I was craving breakfast-y items. Right now I'm wanting a corned beef sandwich.
jnthn Well, a sandwich would pass as breakfast in Sweden...hack, in UK too if you put bacon or sausage in it :) 14:10
*heck
dalek kudo/nom: a6f181e | moritz++ | t/spectest.data:
Run now-passing test files, bartolin++, hoelzro++
pmichaud either way, the restaurant(s) that sell what I'd like to eat aren't open yet. :-(
jnthn Aww :(
.oO( sudo open up and make me a sandwich )
 14:11
pmichaud have to be careful with those root powers... might actually turn a person into a sandwich.
JimmyZ I sometimes read breakfast as break it fast :/ 14:12
moritz well, breakfast is breaking the night's fast (fasting = not eating) 14:13
so it's pretty close :-)
JimmyZ :) 14:14
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JimmyZ break the cup fastly :P 14:15
[Coke] bartolin: note that in the test for RT#118231, you're actually importing Test 3 times. 14:19
synopsebot Link: rt.perl.org/rt3//Public/Bug/Displa...?id=118231
masak m: $*OUT.outs 14:20
m: say $*OUT.outs
PerlJam: yes.
camelia rakudo-moar a573ab: OUTPUT«(timeout)» 14:21
masak ergh.
[Coke] bartolin: rt.perl.org/Public/Bug/Display.html?id=118029 is closable. 14:22
PerlJam ack -w outs # tells me it's not yet specced if it does exist.
[Coke] .seen diakopter 14:23
yoleaux I saw diakopter 20 Sep 2014 13:03Z in #perl6: <diakopter> oh
[Coke] moritz: so, I'm ready to bail on host08. you?
moritz [Coke]: I'm slowly preparing a replacement for feather that should be beefy enough to also replace host08 :-) 14:24
and it seems host07 is still running; maybe we can simply switch back to it from camelia 14:25
[Coke] .tell japhb < moritz> [Coke]: I'm slowly preparing a replacement for feather that should be beefy enough to also replace host08 :-) 14:26
yoleaux [Coke]: I'll pass your message to japhb.
moritz [Coke]: irclog.perlgeek.de/perl6/2014-10-16#i_9518291
[Coke] must have scrolled right past that. 14:27
moritz but I need the ACK from our CEO, then the actual machine, and then set it up 14:28
so I'd guess it'll be 2 weeks to 2 months before we actually have it
[Coke] honestly, I'm tempted to run them on my work laptop. It'd be OS X instead of linux, but I wouldn't even notice they were running.
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PerlJam moritz: how "beefy" were you shooting for? 14:29
moritz PerlJam: www.ebay.de/itm/like/130942134087 if we get the housing option 14:31
pmichaud afk, lunchfast
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colomon moritz++ 14:41
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b2gills Where would I look for a test like `my $e = enum :alpha<a>, <beta charlie>` # fixed in Rakudo by PR:321 15:15
15:15 Hor|zon joined
FROGGS usually in roast, but I can't find it 15:16
15:16 kaleem left 15:17 SamuraiJack left
PerlJam b2gills: I'd expect it to live in t/spec/S12-enums/non-int.t 15:18
bartolin [Coke]: thanks for the two notes. I'll have a look at it later
moritz: was afk for a while. I'll have a look later whether I find another file to include in t/spectest.data 15:19
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abraxxa panicFq644T65R66g76 15:24
pmichaud back with noms
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dalek ast: 8e9ba37 | TimToady++ | S04-statements/return.t:
return should not fallback to dynamic
 15:33
TimToady moritz++ for providing the negative example :) 15:35
for some reason eval_dies_ok doesn't work there, had to use try EVAL
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b2gills PerlJam: The problem also exists with `my $a = enum :a(1), 'b';`. That is the problem is that $prev isn't set for named args in ANON_ENUM (PR:321) 15:51
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masak hopes abraxxa is OK... 15:59
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Mouq m: enum a => 1 # LTA 16:25
masak ...in more ways than one... :/ 16:26
camelia rakudo-moar a573ab: OUTPUT«(timeout)»
Mouq std: enum a => 1
camelia std bd22b5c: OUTPUT«(timeout)» 16:27
[Coke] bartolin: there is a script in the rakudo repo you can run to see if test files not in spectest.data are passing.
Mouq viv is even more LTA 16:28
./viv -e 'enum foo => 1'
===SORRY!===
Illegal redeclaration of symbol 'foo' (see line 1) at (eval) line 1:
------> enum foo⏏ => 1
Check failed
16:29 flaviusb left
hoelzro o/ #perl6 16:31
[Coke] bartolin: perl tools/update_passing_test_data.pl
gtodd synopsis 99 16:33
[Coke] parrot build froze on host08 today. 16:36
Stage start : 0.000
Stage parse :
^^ stuck here for hours
16:36 cognome joined
[Coke] looks like camelia's java build is eating all the memory, perhaps? 16:37
ok. I'm killing the daily runs on host08, this is not usuable.
*usable
switching to ad hoc runs on my laptop. 16:38
b2gills Mouq: ok maybe there is two problems with `my $a = enum :a(1), 'b';`. `my $a = enum( :a(1), 'b');` only exhibits one of them ( fixed by PR:321) 16:41
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dalek rlito: 42aded4 | (Flavio S. Glock)++ | / (17 files):
Perlito5 - create Perlito5X namespace
 16:45
[Coke] trying to rebuild rakudo-moar locally: getting: Configuration FAIL. You can try to salvage the generated Makefile.
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[Coke] ah, the old I HATE SUBMODULES!@(*&!@(*#$@ problem. 16:46
whenever we explicitly do a git clone, we try to respect --git-protocol. git submodules ignore that.
(needed more work to setup my env so git https still tries to use my http proxy, done. whew) 16:50
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Mouq b2gills: :) Does the PR pass the spectest? (make spectest) and also, it'd be super useful if you could add a test for it in S12-enums/anonymous.t ? 16:55
s:2nd/\?//
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b2gills I only have Rakudo with rakudobrew, but it does work properly if I put the fixed ANON_ENUM in the test file 16:57
[Coke] gist.github.com/coke/987dd4a31524fa207aca - failures on spectest on OS X moar 16:58
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Mouq m: sub foo { sub bar { -> { return 42 } }; my &ret = bar(); ret() }() 17:06
camelia rakudo-moar 329ed9: OUTPUT«Attempt to return outside of any Routine␤ in block at src/gen/m-CORE.setting:628␤ in sub foo at /tmp/laHDOHb7b6:1␤ in block <unit> at /tmp/laHDOHb7b6:1␤␤»
vendethiel daxim: sorry I havn't been more clear on my ruby answer :) 17:07
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pmichaud An interesting comment on my APW2014 post: pmthium.com/2014/10/apw2014/#comment-1007732 17:09
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psch hi #perl6 17:11
m: my $list = <a b c>; map(&say, $list) 17:12
camelia rakudo-moar 329ed9: OUTPUT«a b c␤»
psch pmichaud: so we are already "badly broken"?
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Mouq We're the.. opposite of badly broken? `my $list1 = <a b c>; my $list2 = <d e f> map &say, $list1, $list2` if that doesn't output a b c\nd e f\n I'd be fairly upset 17:17
`my $list1 = <a b c>; my $list2 = <d e f>; map &say, @$list1, @$list2` is a different story, IMO 17:18
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Mouq And if the person wants a special case for two-arg map, I don't think the person understands Perl 6 17:20
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lizmat is back from being away most of the day 17:22
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pmichaud well, in the commenter's defense, note that (@$list1, @$list2).map(&say) and map(&say, @$list1, @$list2) will now be different. 17:24
and I can see how that would be more than a little confusion.
*confusing
lizmat wrt to deprecations: the way I implemented it now, is that release 2014.10 would *not* complain 17:25
but any commit after that *would*
so: the new features / API would be in the next release, the old still there not complaining
but anybody on blead would get the deprecation warnings 17:26
and the next release would as well
this would allow the ecosystem 1 release to fix any deprecations
does that make sense ?
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lizmat and ~1 year before the deprecated code is actually removed 17:27
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masak I'm about to close rt.perl.org/Ticket/Display.html?id=118581 (because it no longer segfaults). 17:32
psch difference of flattening between method and function does not particularly appeal to me from a consistency perspective either, but i think i could deal with it, as it has clear semantics 17:33
masak just curious: what *should* this return?
m: say \(1) ~~ :(int $x as Str)
camelia rakudo-moar 329ed9: OUTPUT«False␤»
masak m: say \(1) ~~ :(1) 17:34
camelia rakudo-moar 329ed9: OUTPUT«True␤»
masak m: say \(1) ~~ :(Int)
camelia rakudo-moar 329ed9: OUTPUT«True␤»
masak m: say \(1) ~~ :(int)
camelia rakudo-moar 329ed9: OUTPUT«True␤»
masak m: say \(1) ~~ :(int $x)
camelia rakudo-moar 329ed9: OUTPUT«True␤»
Mouq m: say \(1) ~~ :($x as Str)
camelia rakudo-moar 329ed9: OUTPUT«True␤»
masak m: say \(1) ~~ :(int $x as Str)
camelia rakudo-moar 329ed9: OUTPUT«False␤»
masak yeah, that feels wrong. :)
so maybe I should just change the title of the ticket?
or open a new one?
17:35 jack_rabbit joined
psch it should autobox for the smartmatch, shouldn't it? 17:35
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masak psch: note that \(1) ~~ :(int) matches. 17:35
Mouq m: say \(1) ~~ :(Int $x as Str)
psch err, for the 'as Str'
camelia rakudo-moar 329ed9: OUTPUT«True␤»
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psch masak: right, i'm typing before finishing thinking again it seems :) 17:36
masak happens to me all the time ;)
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masak closes the old ticket and opens a new one 17:38
bartolin sounds good, masak++ 17:40
masak m: \(1) ~~ :(int as Str)
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masak m: say \(1) ~~ :(int as Str) 17:40
camelia ( no output )
rakudo-moar 329ed9: OUTPUT«False␤»
bartolin [Coke]: wrt importing Test 3 times: do you think it's a bad idea to test with Test.pm? but it certainly is enough to import it once more. 17:41
nine_ m: BEGIN { my $class := Metamodel::ClassHOW.new_type(name => "Test"); $class.HOW.compose($class); GLOBAL::<Test> = $class; }; say Test.new(); 17:43
camelia rakudo-moar 329ed9: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Object of type Test in QAST::WVal, but not in SC␤»
nine_ m: BEGIN { my $class := Metamodel::ClassHOW.new_type(name => "Test"); $class.HOW.compose($class); GLOBAL.WHO<Test> = $class; }; say Test.new(); 17:44
camelia rakudo-moar 329ed9: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Object of type Test in QAST::WVal, but not in SC␤»
nine_ m: BEGIN { my $class := Metamodel::ClassHOW.new_type(name => "Test"); $class.HOW.compose($class); GLOBAL.WHO<Test> := $class; }; say Test.new();
camelia rakudo-moar 329ed9: OUTPUT«Test.new()␤»
psch btw, gist.github.com/peschwa/4cd283a7c2d450f9825b is how my cliopts grammar prototype behaves right now
nine_ Seems like I really should finally read up on when to use = and when := :)
psch integration into rakudo is probably a few days away, especially regarding the delimited options
oh, there's cases missing that (should) work 17:45
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psch gist updated. negation of grouped short opts dies as does negation of opts that need a value 17:47
multiple -I, which recently came up, seems already supported and should still be supported when i get this into rakudo 17:48
i guess i'll put "write many more tests" onto my todo as well
bartolin moritz: thanks for updating t/spectest.data. I don't know about other newly created files which could be included 17:49
nine_ Is caller implemented?
vendethiel mmmh. 17:50
m: sub f{caller.return(5)}; sub g {f}; say g
Ihavenoideawhatimdoing.jpg
camelia rakudo-moar 329ed9: OUTPUT«(timeout)»
vendethiel m: sub f{caller.return(5)}; sub g {f}; say g #probably doesn't work
nine_ sub test { say caller.name; }; sub foo { test; }; foo(); 17:51
PerlJam nine_: There's callframe
nine_ m: sub test { say caller.name; }; sub foo { test; }; foo();
camelia rakudo-moar 329ed9: OUTPUT«(timeout)»
vendethiel right.
17:51 Sqirrel joined
lizmat $ 6 'say callframe' 17:52
CallFrame.new(level => 2, annotations => ("file" => "-e", "line" => "1").hash, my => EnumMap.new("\$!", Nil, "\$/", Nil, "\$_", Nil, "GLOBALish", GLOBAL, "EXPORT", EXPORT, "\$?PACKAGE", GLOBAL, "::?PACKAGE", GLOBAL, "\$=pod", Array.new(), "!UNIT_MARKER", !UNIT_MARKER, ))
vendethiel nice :)
nine_ PerlJam: thanks!
lizmat: thanks!
bartolin speaking about t/spectest.data: AFAIU it's best to put tests for tickets in existing files (in roast). but sometimes it's hard to find a good place for a test (at least for me). are "per ticket files" like rt98765.t okay in such cases or is better to create new "thematical" files -- as I did with S19-command-line/arguments.t? 17:56
FROGGS[mobile] +1 for the latter 17:57
vendethiel I'm glad we have all that power at hand. I'm still very impressed often :o)
maybe "leave" should make it to the features matrix. It's kinda big. 17:58
I guess I should not mention it in my tutorial until it Works(TM)
moritz bartolin: yes, new test files are fine
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moritz does anybody have a working niecza installation, and know whether it supports leave? 17:59
bartolin okay, thanks
[Coke] bartolin: nah, any issues will be limited to fallout in that test file. 18:00
so "nah, no issues"
moritz: niecza requires mono < 3 at this point.
can I ask why you need a owrkign niecza?
the project is dead at this point. 18:01
FROGGS[mobile] vendethiel: yes, leave qualifies for the features matrix
moritz [Coke]: sometimes it's still itneresting to see how it interprets stuff
masak now and then, niecza still proves a useful point of comparison against Rakudo, IMHO.
right. what moritz said.
gtodd .net is not so backward compatible as perl and java I guess 18:02
masak it's falling further and further behind, but some things (things like "goto") it still has on Rakudo.
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nine_ m: BEGIN { my $class := Metamodel::ClassHOW.new_type(name => "Test::More"); $class.HOW.compose($class); GLOBAL.WHO<Test::More> := $class; }; say Test::More.new(); 18:03
camelia rakudo-moar a6f181: OUTPUT«Could not find symbol '&More'␤ in method <anon> at src/gen/m-CORE.setting:13622␤ in any find_method_fallback at src/gen/m-Metamodel.nqp:2725␤ in any find_method at src/gen/m-Metamodel.nqp:988␤ in block <unit> at /tmp/I8R3kS6pUv:1␤␤»
gtodd did it have the same approach as rakudo was it a "backend"? (was there a "nqp-n") 18:04
nine_ m: BEGIN { my $class := Metamodel::ClassHOW.new_type(name => "Test::More"); $class.HOW.compose($class); GLOBAL<Test>.WHO<More> := $class; }; say Test::More.new();
camelia rakudo-moar a6f181: OUTPUT«Could not find symbol '&More'␤ in method <anon> at src/gen/m-CORE.setting:13622␤ in any find_method_fallback at src/gen/m-Metamodel.nqp:2725␤ in any find_method at src/gen/m-Metamodel.nqp:988␤ in block <unit> at /tmp/8KfDgLQ49n:1␤␤»
nine_ :(
moritz m: constant Test::More = Int; say Test::More 18:05
camelia rakudo-moar a6f181: OUTPUT«===SORRY!=== Error while compiling /tmp/D7koXr5WVS␤Missing initializer on constant declaration␤at /tmp/D7koXr5WVS:1␤------> constant Test⏏::More = Int; say Test::More␤ expecting any of:␤ statement …»
moritz m: BEGIN ::('Test::More') = Int; say Test::More # I don't expect this one to work 18:06
camelia rakudo-moar a6f181: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤No such symbol 'Test::More'␤»
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moritz perl6-m -e 'BEGIN GLOBAL::<Test> = Int; say Test' 18:08
===SORRY!===
Object of type Int in QAST::WVal, but not in SC
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moritz that kind looks like a bug to me 18:08
nine_ m: BEGIN GLOBAL::<Test> := Int; say Test
camelia rakudo-moar a6f181: OUTPUT«(Int)␤»
nine_ moritz: := seems to work while = failes
dalek ast: de19d97 | usev6++ | S11-modules/import.t:
Modify test for RT #118231
 18:09
synopsebot Link: rt.perl.org/rt3//Public/Bug/Displa...?id=118231
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gtodd masak: leaving aside the technical questions .... didn't Scala "officially" drop the .Net platform just before it became wildly popular ... :-) ? 18:11
i.e. just before Scala became wildly popular ... :P 18:12
vendethiel gtodd: kind of
masak no idea. is it relevant?
vendethiel the scala.net backend was part of a GSOC 2011 project, IIRC
masak wow, I hadn't realized how awesome << >> quoting is. it's like a better heredoc in some cases.
18:13 _slade_ left
vendethiel :D 18:13
masak works excellent for tabulating test cases, for example. especially since I can use "" strings inside!
gtodd masak: only for marketing ;-)
masak and then just loop over it with a for loop that picks out just the right number of elements at a time
<3
Perl 6: love in syntax form. 18:14
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masak language point: 4 : quadrant :: 6 : ??? 18:15
vendethiel wut? 18:16
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gtodd haha 18:16
vendethiel masak: it's interesting to see even you get surprised by how the language works :P
masak the plane divides into four quadrants. is there a name for the thing it divides into when there's six of them?
vendethiel: I keep discovering things.
vendethiel yay, adventures! 18:17
masak vendethiel: it's not that I didn't know about << >>, it's just that I hadn't ever used it for this.
vendethiel yes, I get it
gtodd sextant?
vendethiel a feature isn't useful without use cases :)
masak gtodd: gonna go with that until someone comes up with something better :)
18:27 chenryn left 18:34 prevost left
dalek ast: d55c943 | usev6++ | S (2 files):
Add tests for RT #118581 and RT #118067
 18:36
synopsebot Link: rt.perl.org/rt3//Public/Bug/Displa...?id=118581
18:36 anaeem1_ left
nine_ aaaaaaaaaaah 18:42
m: BEGIN { my $class := Metamodel::ClassHOW.new_type(name => "Test::More"); $class.HOW.compose($class); GLOBAL.WHO<Test> := package {}; GLOBAL::Test.WHO<More> := $class; }; say Test::More.new()
camelia rakudo-moar a6f181: OUTPUT«(timeout)»
nine_ m: BEGIN { my $class := Metamodel::ClassHOW.new_type(name => "Test::More"); $class.HOW.compose($class); GLOBAL.WHO<Test> := package {}; GLOBAL::Test.WHO<More> := $class; }; say Test::More.new() 18:43
camelia rakudo-moar a6f181: OUTPUT«(timeout)»
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masak here's my use of << >> in code I just wrote: gist.github.com/masak/7404ebdd2ee6f397cb93 18:47
gtodd m: my $国 = "日本" ; say $国 "; 18:48
camelia rakudo-moar a6f181: OUTPUT«(timeout)»
psch what exactly does Text::SmartLinks need in the L<> tags in roast? synopsis and (headline or some text that matches somewhere)? 18:49
vendethiel masak: you're of the "normalized returns" school :P? 18:50
masak oh, investment humor?
I had to look that one up :)
psch i did that too. and it actually answered my question...
so, nvm that. for the record it's syn/headline/start-of-paragraph, if i understand correctly 18:51
bartolin yesterday we spoke about a "ticket deal" (irclog.perlgeek.de/perl6/2014-10-15#i_9512823) 18:52
let's try it: for todays RT work (we are down to 740 tickets) it would be nice if
1) someone looks at RT #99658 and comments if my explanation goes in the right direction and
synopsebot Link: rt.perl.org/rt3//Public/Bug/Displa...l?id=99658
bartolin 2) someone looks at PR 319 for Rakudo (I wanted to add one or two typed exceptions)
*g*
masak bartolin: looking at (1) now
bartolin masak++
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gtodd masak: so the << >> makes the appropriate list/s out of that whole paragraph and you dont need , or => or anything? 18:53
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gtodd list/s items etc. etc. 18:53
wow
timotimo gtodd: well, it's really just a flat list there
but masak is iterating over it by taking out the right amount of items each time
so it's effectively a table 18:54
gtodd it's cool .... but it crashed my repl :)
neat
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gtodd actually it's the fact you can use a "tabular" flat list to work with ==> for @tests -> $x, $y, $ox, $oy, $description { ... } that is cool 18:56
timotimo that's cool, too.
i hadn't fully realized someone went ahead and fixed « »
m: say «Hello "How are you?" \"I am fine.\"».perl
camelia rakudo-moar a6f181: OUTPUT«("Hello", "How are you?", ("\"I", "am", "fine.\""))␤» 18:57
masak gtodd: combined with the fact that "" works well inside << >>
timotimo oh, huh?
psch m: say <<foo\ bar>>
camelia rakudo-moar a6f181: OUTPUT«foo bar␤»
timotimo that's strange
psch timotimo: yours does seem sensible to me. you're escaping the quotes which makes « » split on <ws> 18:58
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dalek p: 3ea8d5c | (Mikhail Khorkov)++ | / (2 files):
Add --git-depth option

The option adds --depth option to all git clone commands		 18:58
p: 7ec03cf | moritz++ | / (2 files):
Merge pull request #191 from atroxaper/master

Add --git-depth option
kudo/nom: dd6ce68 | (Mikhail Khorkov)++ | / (2 files):
Add --git-depth option

The option adds --depth option to all git clone commands
kudo/nom: d4271c7 | moritz++ | / (2 files):
Merge pull request #322 from atroxaper/nom

Add --git-depth option
timotimo psch: but where do the parens come from? 18:59
psch oh, right
m: say «Hello "How are you?" \"I am fine.\"».elems
camelia rakudo-moar a6f181: OUTPUT«3␤»
psch m: say «Hello "How are you?" \"I am fine.\"».flat.elems 19:00
camelia rakudo-moar a6f181: OUTPUT«5␤»
dalek kudo/nom: 42841ad | (Brad Gilbert)++ | src/core/Enumeration.pm:
Make anonymous enums follow Synopsis 2

Adding a pair to an enum is supposed to change the value the next key would get.
kudo/nom: 1de1488 | moritz++ | src/core/Enumeration.pm:
Merge pull request #321 from b2gills/patch-1

Make anonymous enums follow Synopsis 2
psch hm, is \" another obscure escape sequence? :)
masak bartolin: I just rejected #99658, accepting your reasoning.
synopsebot Link: rt.perl.org/rt3//Public/Bug/Displa...l?id=99658
psch like \qq in ' '...
dalek ast: cab366f | (Pepe Schwarz)++ | S19-command-line (4 files):
Add a few tests for S19.

I hope I did the smart-linking correctly. I've prototyped stuff to pass these tests but integration into Rakudo might take a few more days.
timotimo i don't know \qq actually 19:01
does that give you qq semantics for the rest of the literal?
bartolin thanks, masak!
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dalek kudo/nom: 32aa365 | usev6++ | src/core/Exception.pm:
Add X::Syntax::Regex::SolitaryQuantifier
 19:02
kudo/nom: c77c584 | usev6++ | src/ (2 files):
Add typed exception X::Syntax::Term::MissingInitializer
synopsebot Link: rt.perl.org/rt3//Public/Bug/Displa...?id=116607
dalek kudo/nom: 86dc3c6 | moritz++ | src/ (2 files):
Merge pull request #319 from usev6/nom

Add two typed exceptions (X::Syntax::Regex::SolitaryQuantifier and X::Syntax::Term::MissingInitializer)
psch m: say '\x0\qqx50'
bartolin wow, thanks moritz++
masak so, let me get this straight.
camelia rakudo-moar a6f181: OUTPUT«(timeout)»
masak bartolin++ asked us to live up to the deal we established yesterday.
psch timotimo: something like that. i think it's still delimited
masak and #perl6 did, within 10 minutes.
19:02 anaeem1 joined
masak wow, that's what I call service. 19:03
19:03 Mso150_x joined
bartolin #perl6++ 19:03
moritz m: token a { * }
camelia rakudo-moar a6f181: OUTPUT«(timeout)» 19:04
masak bartolin: let's do this again sometime! :D
19:04 Mso150 left 19:05 Hor|zon left
timotimo b2gills: i'm glad you fixed the enum thing :) 19:05
pmichaud masak: ping 19:09
masak pmichaud: pong
pmichaud I don't understand the response to rt #99658
synopsebot Link: rt.perl.org/rt3//Public/Bug/Displa...l?id=99658
pmichaud according to my tests, the sequence is already lazy.
masak oh!
pmichaud has been... like, forever. 19:10
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pmichaud r: my @a = 1, 3, 5 ... *; say @a[7]; 19:10
bleh
camelia rakudo-{parrot,moar} a6f181: OUTPUT«15␤»
masak so far, so good.
pmichaud there.
masak what about with s/\*/8/ ?
which was what the original requestor was asking about. 19:11
pmichaud in that case it's not lazy, because the system has no way to know it'll be infinite
masak that's what I was agreeing with bartolin about!
19:11 virtualsue left, virtualsue_ is now known as virtualsue
masak so I guess now you understand my response ;) 19:11
19:11 itz left
pmichaud okay, I get it. 19:12
bartolin maybe my second to last example was misleading?
pmichaud I thought you were referring to the ... * case not being detectable.
masak no, that one is fine.
the requestor was complaining about ... * differing from ... 8
pmichaud right.
at the time the ticket was written, I don't think we were detecting *-infinities 19:13
masak then I don't know why the requestor was complaining about the discrepancy
pmichaud and the synopsis isn't all that rigorous when it talks about "infinite lists"
well, Perl 6 knows that assignment of an infinite list has to be lazy
19:13 kurahaupo left
pmichaud but the synopsis also says (said) that 1,3,5 ... 8 will produce an "infinite list" 19:14
anyway, it can stand as-is for now, and I agree with your response. thanks.
masak \o/
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PerlJam Should there be tests so that the current behavior can confirmed the same with the GLR? 19:17
pmichaud I suspect the tests exist already. 19:21
19:21 FROGGS[mobile] left, FROGGS[mobile] joined, darutoko left
pmichaud well, looks like there's an advent test for it (2009 day 23) 19:22
I don't see a regular test. 19:23
dalek kudo/nom: 0a7de34 | grondilu++ | src/core/operators.pm:
use for loop instead of while in SEQUENCE

This avoids side effects:
   my @abc = ^10; my @ = @abc ... 4; say @abc;
See IRC log for this day.		 19:25
kudo/nom: d792a22 | grondilu++ | src/core/operators.pm:
using binding for better performance

There were concerns about loss of performance with for loop instead of while/shift. A binding instead of an affectation might help.
kudo/nom: 8d0294b | moritz++ | src/core/operators.pm:
Merge pull request #273 from grondilu/patch-2

use for loop instead of while in SEQUENCE
timotimo wait, for loops are more performant than while loops by now? :) 19:26
moritz timotimo: nope
timotimo: the 'for' loop was for correctness 19:27
timotimo oh
side effects vs binding, misread
pmichaud yeah, there was definitely a binding issue there. 19:29
dalek line-Perl5/create_used_packages: b290f89 | nine++ | / (2 files):
Create a Perl 6 package for use'd Perl 5 modules.

Allows: BEGIN $p5.use('Data::Dumper'); my $dumper = Data::Dumper.new(perl5 => $p5, [{a => 1}]); say $dumper.Dump;		 19:30
nine_ Any comments on this ^^^ greatly appreciated!
dalek ast: 11ec63a | usev6++ | S13-overloading/operators.t:
Add test for RT #119473
synopsebot Link: rt.perl.org/rt3//Public/Bug/Displa...?id=119473
gtodd masak: hmm << >> is cool and simple ... now I want to slurp files that are arranged in tables like that in @arrays... (and not bother splitting or using regex or grammar or tokens or using a module or ...) ... and then have at them and munge
psch STable conflict detected during deserialization. 19:31
(Probable attempt to load two modules that cannot be loaded together).
nine_ Does it look useful? Is the implementation somewhat sane? Can I somehow get rid of the perl5 parameter of new?
psch ...yep
i need to continue with this somewhen else
19:31 virtualsue left 19:32 ghostlines left, vendethiel joined
PerlJam nine_: you could get rid of the parameter by using a dynamic var perhaps? 19:33
moritz nine_: if such a module is precompiled, I don't see how $p5 could be serialized
dalek rlito: c96ce25 | (Flavio S. Glock)++ | / (2 files):
Perlito5 - js - bugfix in "goto" emitter
 19:34
19:34 noganex_ joined
moritz nine_: one thing I could imagine is doing only a stub at compile time, and the stub wouldn't need the $p5 19:35
nine_ moritz: but where would the real code get $p5 from?
moritz nine_: well, that has to come from somewhere; either pass it as an argument, or require it in a contextual or a global 19:36
nine_: none of those sound really satisfactory to me 19:37
19:38 noganex left
nine_ I also played around with a parametric role, but that wouldn't let me override new 19:38
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masak moritz: I just use `my @.entries` in actual code instead of `my @entries; method entries { @.entries }` 19:41
moritz: first time I had a use for `my` + accessor. but it felt really right to reach for it.
vendethiel- masak: it's not the saaaaame. or is it?
masak TimToady++
vendethiel-: it is.
m: class A { my @.foo; }; A.foo.push("OH"); A.new.foo.push("HAI"); say A.foo.perl
vendethiel- masak: ooh. I thought myes were class-shared :) mb 19:42
dalek ast: 3b36aad | moritz++ | S19-command-line/dash-e.t:
fix fudging syntax error
masak vendethiel-: they are.
19:42 Akagi201 joined
camelia rakudo-moar a6f181: OUTPUT«Array.new("OH", "HAI")␤» 19:42
masak vendethiel-: which is how I'm using it here.
vendethiel- ah. I misread.
I had no idea you could `my TWIGIL` :o)
masak AFAIR, moritz has gone on record not liking it. I've always been vaguely positive. 19:43
having just had a use case for it, I'm more than just vaguely positive.
moritz m: say ~&say
camelia rakudo-moar a6f181: OUTPUT«Code object coerced to string (please use .gist or .perl to do that) in block <unit> at /tmp/nhfmFwv2YM:1␤␤say␤»
moritz why is that?
I mean, stringify works fine, no? 19:44
before, when I tried to stringify something, I could check for .defined, and if it was true, I could just stringify
19:44 Akagi201_ left
moritz now I have to check for Callable too? 19:44
mauke m: say &say.perl
camelia rakudo-moar a6f181: OUTPUT«sub say (Any |) { #`(Sub|50185952) ... }␤»
masak moritz: see github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/af...aec1e26c93 19:45
maybe more hints can be found in the backlog of Aug 15...?
19:46 kurahaupo left
bartolin moritz: one question about the follow-up with a new typed exception in Rakudo: Is it correct to update all tests which now fail because of the changed exception type as soon as the typed exception has landed in rakudo? 19:46
moritz bartolin: yes
bartolin: but it's never right to check for X::AdHock in the first place
bartolin: if you want to write a test that works, but will continue to work when there's a specific exception type, use Exception to check against 19:47
bartolin that makes a lot of sense, thanks! 19:48
masak m: class A { my @.foo handles <push> }; A.push("OH", "HAI"); say A.foo 19:49
camelia rakudo-moar a6f181: OUTPUT«(timeout)»
bartolin (sounds like a new task "adjust tests in roast which check against X::AdHoc to check against Exception)
masak locally: "Cannot call 'trait_mod:<handles>'; none of these signatures match" (Attribute, Method) 19:50
moritz good Google Code-In task, unless somebody else does it first
19:50 zakharyas left
masak am I greedy for wanting `my` + twigil + `handles` to work? 19:51
is that even theoretically possible?
it would be so awesome.
19:52 kurahaupo joined
moritz TimToady: any reason why your new test in t/spec/S04-statements/return.t doesn't use eval_dies_ok or throws_like ? 19:52
19:52 ghostlines joined 19:53 ghostlines left
dalek ast: ba89213 | moritz++ | S04-statements/return.t:
fudge new test for rakudo
 19:54
ast: b99fd2d | moritz++ | S32-exceptions/misc.t:
Fix exception type
 19:55
bartolin moritz: oh, was not fast enough ;-)
moritz I just did a spectest and had failures in 5 files 19:58
and I thought "oh my god, I should have spectested each pull request individually"
19:58 colomon left
moritz turns out two were flappers, and two new tests 19:58
bartolin sorry for part of the trouble 19:59
raydiak moritz: "15:35:38* TimToady | for some reason eval_dies_ok doesn't work there, had to use try EVAL"
moritz oh 20:00
because it's a routine 20:01
masak shouldn't it be EVAL_dies_ok these days? :/
jnthn masak: my @.foo supporting handles is a cute idea at least. It's not entirely straightforward. 20:02
masak: But feasible with effort. 20:03
masak developer torment? sounds like... a job for Perl 6! :P
jnthn No objections to filing a TODO ticket for it.
tadzik developer, is that a new dnd setting? :P
masak what's the saying again: "tormenting developers just for the sake of it"
tadzik I only heard of Planescape: Torment before
masak submits TODO ticket
raydiak is there a way to interpolate an array into a regex as an alternation of subrules instead of literals? 20:04
jnthn Doesn't <@foo> do it?
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jnthn m: my @a = < .. .+ >; say 'abcd' ~~/ <@a> / 20:05
bartolin moritz: and one (hopefully) last question: should a new typed exception be added to S02-types/WHICH.t?
camelia rakudo-moar 86dc3c: OUTPUT«｢abcd｣␤␤»
20:06 virtualsue joined
raydiak thanks jnthn++ dunno how I missed that 20:06
moritz bartolin: dunno, I find that test file to be not very important 20:07
bartolin: perl6/specs and perl6/doc is much more important IMHO
masak TODO ticket filed: rt.perl.org/Ticket/Display.html?id=122991
bartolin moritz: ah perl6/doc as well. (at least I had perl6/specs on my list ;-)
20:11 Mouq joined
raydiak okay, maybe this one will be harder: how do I interpolate an array *element* as a subrule? or is it necessary to assign it to a scalar first? 20:11
m: my @a = token {.+}; ("foo" ~~ /<@a[0]>/).perl.say
camelia rakudo-moar 86dc3c: OUTPUT«===SORRY!=== Error while compiling /tmp/9RcI5wZhxQ␤Unable to parse expression in metachar:sym<assert>; couldn't find final '>' ␤at /tmp/9RcI5wZhxQ:1␤------> my @a = token {.+}; ("foo" ~~ /<@a⏏[0]>/).perl.say␤»
20:11 kaare_ left
moritz if it's already a rule, @a[0] should work 20:12
Mouq m: my @a = token {.+}; ("foo" ~~ /@a[0]/).perl.say
camelia rakudo-moar 86dc3c: OUTPUT«Potential difficulties:␤ Apparent subscript will be treated as regex␤ at /tmp/l4odDajQha:1␤ ------> my @a = token {.+}; ("foo" ~~ /@a⏏[0]/).perl.say␤Nil␤»
Mouq m: my @a = token {.+}; ("foo" ~~ /<{@a[0]}>/).perl.say
camelia rakudo-moar 86dc3c: OUTPUT«Match.new(orig => "foo", from => 0, to => 3, ast => Any, list => ().list, hash => EnumMap.new())␤»
mauke it's perl5 all over again 20:13
raydiak thanks Mouq++
moritz m: my @a = token {.+}; say "foo" ~~ / @a[0] /
camelia rakudo-moar 86dc3c: OUTPUT«Potential difficulties:␤ Apparent subscript will be treated as regex␤ at /tmp/wyLzzkJE9H:1␤ ------> my @a = token {.+}; say "foo" ~~ / @a⏏[0] /␤Nil␤»
20:14 moukeddar left
masak mauke: what is? 20:15
mauke <@a[0]> parsing differently from <$a>, subscripts being ambiguous in a regex, needing { } to disambiguate 20:17
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Mouq mauke: It's not ambiguous; it's parsed as @a [0] and outputs a warning :P 20:19
masak m: class A { my ::?CLASS @.foo }; A.foo.push(2)
camelia rakudo-moar 86dc3c: OUTPUT«(timeout)»
masak locally, "Type check failed in .push; expected 'A' but got 'Int'"
(wow)
lizmat++ jnthn++, no doubt 20:20
Mouq But maybe we should consider having quote-like variable interpretation in regexes?
timotimo masak: are they to blame for this? :)
20:20 Mso150_x left
masak timotimo: it's amazing! it recognizes `A` as the current class, *and* it typechecks against it on .push 20:21
timotimo: woot!
timotimo that *is* neat.
mauke Mouq: how is that not ambiguous?
jnthn masak: Note it's more useful use is in roles, where ::?CLASS is generic. 20:22
masak jnthn: I'm just about to factor my current code into a role :>
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masak aww. 20:23
===SORRY!=== 20:24
No such method 'instantiate_generic' for invocant of type 'Array[::?CLASS]'
jnthn Awww :(
Mouq mauke: Mm, okay, I'll concede. I was thinking amiguous in that the spec decided it's too amiguous to allow
masak this... might be rakudobuggable.
hold on.
20:24 itz_ left
vendethiel- masak: code :P ? 20:24
dalek kudo/nom: 1059957 | (Pepe Schwarz)++ | src/Perl6/Actions.nqp:
Make flipflop smartmatch against $_ instead of calling .Bool.
 20:25
kudo/nom: dfb3e7a | moritz++ | src/Perl6/Actions.nqp:
Merge branch 'smartmatch_flipflop' of github.com/peschwa/rakudo into nom
masak m: role R { my ::?CLASS @.x }; class C does R {}; say "alive"
locally: "No such method 'instantiate_generic' for invocant of type 'Array[::?CLASS]'"
camelia rakudo-moar 86dc3c: OUTPUT«(timeout)» 20:26
20:26 SamuraiJack left
masak jnthn: any non-torment reason that shouldn't be possible? 20:26
m: role R { my ::?CLASS $.x }; class C does R {}; say "alive"
locally: "alive" 20:27
camelia rakudo-moar 86dc3c: OUTPUT«(timeout)»
masak if I remove the ::?CLASS type constraint, using a role still works. 20:28
psch $ ./perl6 -/h 20:29
>
hah
moritz timotimo: what's the state of github.com/rakudo/rakudo/pull/171 ? do you want to resolve the conflict(s), and merge yourself?
psch unfortunately my branch doesn't run in the harness anymore it seems 20:30
it does nothing, no cpu load, no progress
timotimo didn't someone (mouq?) make lol stuff much better recently?
i mean in combination with postcircumfix:<[ ]> 20:31
masak m: role R { has ::?CLASS @.x }; class C does R {}; say "alive"
timotimo or was that just for actually putting in the lol directly with the lol keyword?
20:31 colomon joined
masak locally: "alive" 20:31
camelia rakudo-moar 86dc3c: OUTPUT«(timeout)»
masak so it's only in the very specific case of `my` + `::?CLASS` + `@` that it blows up... 20:32
oh, and `role`
jnthn masak: It's the "my" that does it
masak: I think it's fixable
masak nice.
masak submits rakuodbug
jnthn Well, I'd not say it'll be nice to fix, but... :P 20:33
m: sub foo(::T $x) { my T @a; }; foo(42)
camelia rakudo-moar 86dc3c: OUTPUT«No such method 'instantiate_generic' for invocant of type 'Array[T]'␤ in sub foo at /tmp/H_CQC3prDZ:1␤ in block <unit> at /tmp/H_CQC3prDZ:1␤␤»
jnthn Hah, gulf. :)
masak :) 20:34
but `my`, type parameter, and `@` sigil are still essential, yes?
20:34 muraiki joined
jnthn Yes, but it can be a type parameter of a role or the sub 20:34
colomon moritz++
masak right, so `role` wasn't essential like I thought. 20:35
psch moritz++ # PRs and fudge fix
masak m: sub foo(::T, T @a) {}; foo(42, [])
camelia rakudo-moar 86dc3c: OUTPUT«(timeout)» 20:36
psch good night, #perl6 o/ 20:37
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masak m: sub foo(::T $x) { my T %h; }; foo(42) 20:41
camelia rakudo-moar 86dc3c: OUTPUT«(timeout)»
masak locally, "No such method 'instantiate_generic' for invocant of type 'Hash[T]'" 20:42
20:43 kurahaupo joined
jnthn Right, it'll be same underlying thing 20:43
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masak somehow ended up filing three new rakudobugs today. 21:14
and two yesterday.
bartolin \o/
masak I blame bartolin++ ;) 21:15
bartolin but you closed a few as well!
masak balance++
'night, #perl6 21:16
bartolin gnight
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timotimo i still can't launch farabi6 :\ 21:19
gtodd m: my @A = ( [< 1 2 3 4 5 >], [< 12 34 45 56 78>] ) ; say @A[*;2] 21:20
camelia rakudo-moar 86dc3c: OUTPUT«3 45␤»
21:21 testserver41 left
gtodd is there a way to add those those numbers using that approach ? Z+ 21:23
21:23 FROGGS[mobile] left
timotimo sounds like [+] to me 21:23
gtodd oh right add all the columns ... 21:24
timotimo you want to add up all columns?
gtodd I coudln't see how to do it with anon arrays in the array
pmichaud m: my @a = ( [< 1 2 3 4 5 >], [< 12 34 56 78 90 >] ); say @A[*;2].perl
camelia rakudo-moar 8d0294: OUTPUT«===SORRY!=== Error while compiling /tmp/L39a8kTWvk␤Variable '@A' is not declared␤at /tmp/L39a8kTWvk:1␤------> < 12 34 56 78 90 >] ); say @A[*;2].perl⏏<EOL>␤ expecting any of:␤ method arguments␤»
pmichaud m: my @a = ( [< 1 2 3 4 5 >], [< 12 34 56 78 90 >] ); say @a[*;2].perl
camelia rakudo-moar 8d0294: OUTPUT«("3", "56")␤»
pmichaud hrm. 21:25
m: my @a = ( [< 1 2 3 4 5 >], [< 12 34 56 78 90 >] ); say @a[*;2,3].perl
camelia rakudo-moar 8d0294: OUTPUT«(("3", "4"), ("56", "78"))␤»
21:26 kst`` is now known as kst
gtodd it's cool but I thought I could make operators do things to it :-) 21:26
pmichaud m: my @a = ( [< 1 2 3 4 5 >], [< 12 34 56 78 90 >] ); say [Z] @a[*;2,3]
camelia rakudo-moar 8d0294: OUTPUT«3 4 56 78␤»
pmichaud m: my @a = ( [< 1 2 3 4 5 >], [< 12 34 56 78 90 >] ); say ([Z] @a[*;2,3]).perl
camelia rakudo-moar 8d0294: OUTPUT«(("3",), ("4",), ("56",), ("78",)).list␤»
pmichaud probably need some spec clarity there. 21:27
jnthn m: my @a = [< 1 2 3 4 5 >], [< 12 34 56 78 90 >]; say @a>>.reduce(&[+])
camelia rakudo-moar 8d0294: OUTPUT«15 270␤»
gtodd ok then :-)
jnthn That's the shortest I can immediately think of. 21:28
m: my @a = [< 1 2 3 4 5 >], [< 12 34 56 78 90 >]; say @a>>.reduce(*+*) # shorter I guess
camelia rakudo-moar 8d0294: OUTPUT«15 270␤»
gtodd :-D
jnthn Though I kinda prefix the first 21:29
uh, *prefer* the first...
gtodd I thought I could figure out how to add the "columns" (1+12) (2+34) etc
jnthn Oh... 21:30
Sorry, I misunderstood columns :)
timotimo it seems like you'll X+ |@a in that case?
gtodd AoA and the anon [ ] inside stumped me ... there's roundabout way to do it but ...
ah OK
trying that next :-D 21:31
jnthn m: my @a = [< 1 2 3 4 5 >], [< 12 34 56 78 90 >]; say [>>+<<] @a
camelia rakudo-moar 8d0294: OUTPUT«13 36 59 82 95␤»
dalek ast: 0c4dac7 | usev6++ | / (37 files):
Check for Exception instead for X::AdHoc
gtodd \o/
[>>+<<] that is what I wanted!!! 21:32
wheee
not [+]
timotimo ah
breinbaas hi. I'm struggling a bit with install of a perl6 and its database access module, DBIsh 21:33
gtodd no need to do columnish things that way ... can do the columnn stuff after the arithmetic
21:33 pat_js joined
breinbaas I installed perl6 and I seem to have panda now as well, but any panda install DBIsh complains "could not find Shell::Command ..." 21:34
21:35 aindilis left
breinbaas so tried: panda install Shell::Complain but with same error. I'm clearly missing something :) 21:36
oops: Shell::Command
timotimo panda needs Shell::Command to run at all :o 21:37
did you install a Rakudo Star?
breinbaas I downloaded from the git repo 21:38
gtodd jnthn: so add the "5th column" ( [>>+<<] @A )[4] ... I think I was mesmerized by the awesomeness of "@A[*;2]"
timotimo breinbaas: you got yourself "rakudo/rakudo" from github?
gtodd I find "@A[*;2]" so amazing that I think I have to use it but it is just another nice little "featurette" 21:39
timotimo maybe you have more than one rakudo on your system?
if you clone tadzik/panda and ./rebootstrap.pl you should get a working panda
breinbaas timotimo: git clone git://github.com/rakudo/rakudo.git
timotimo that shouldn't give you a panda 21:40
breinbaas timotimo: ah ok, I didn't do that yet, I'll try that, thanks
timotimo and if you built that rakudo and installed it to where your system looks for it, that should actually explode properly
which is why i think you have more than one rakudo
"make install" will install that rakudo to whatever --prefix= you supplied to Configure.pl - if you didn't supply any, it'll be in rakudo/install 21:41
breinbaas I build it every now and then but I now deleted everything before the rebuild, I think
timotimo hm, ok 21:42
breinbaas I did: perl Configure.pl --gen-parrot --gen-moar --gen-nqp --backends=parrot,jvm,moar
then make && make test && make install
timotimo hmm, haven't built a rakudo-parrot or jvm in a long-ish time 21:43
breinbaas what's the preferred backend?
moar then :)
timotimo yeah :) 21:44
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breinbaas I'll just experiment some more, thank you 21:46
timotimo have fun! :)
breinbaas I hear perl6 became faster so I'nm curious about the db access :) 21:47
dalek p: 736f36a | TimToady++ | src/QRegex/NFA.nqp:
calculate literal lengths

We don't install lit length in the fates yet because this apparently blows up earlier stages of nqp build for some reason, so we'll wait till we rebootstrap stage0 for other reasons and see if it works then.
p: f9c9461 | TimToady++ | src/QRegex/NFA.nqp:
tabs -> spaces fixup
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timotimo good old circularity saw ... 21:49
breinbaas: we've been getting pretty nice performance improvements in over the last months
breinbaas: you may have heard talk of the "Great List Refactor", which is going to make our lists (both lazy and eager) better and faster
breinbaas timotimo: nice, there surely will be some trickle-down of that in the db access too ;) 21:50
timotimo sounds possible 21:51
breinbaas does this look ok? perl Configure.pl --gen-parrot --gen-moar --gen-nqp --backends=moar # still need that --gen-parrot ?
timotimo don't need --gen-parrot
breinbaas ok
timotimo personally, i'm excited by the prospect of actually jitting a native call invocation into an actual regular native call
rather than going through the completely dynamic thingie that does it for regularly interpreted code 21:52
but also the jit is refusing some amount of frames because our parameter handling isn't awesome yet 21:53
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breinbaas ok, rebuilt everything, works now. Thanks! ( you were right, there was an old panda/ dir ) 22:21
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[Coke] anyway to tell rakudo's configure to build nqp and moar with -jX ? 22:53
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dalek kudo/nom: 7c0c1b6 | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | src/core/Deprecations.pm:
Make sure we can from/removed obsolete vars also
 23:30
kudo/nom: 90fbcd7 | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | src/core/ (13 files):
Put from/removed info on current Deprecations
kudo/nom: 0dcd0d6 | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | src/core/Label.pm:
Remove reference to obsolete $*OS

  $*DISTRO.is-win is what we really wanted
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dalek ast: 7f2ba11 | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | S02-types/deprecations.t:
Adapt deprecation messages to new format
 23:43
lizmat good night, #perl6! 23:44
gtodd night! 23:48
lizmat: will ask you a question about error messages after I figure out a bit more where they come from
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gtodd maybe tomorrow 23:49

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