Parrot 1.9.0 "Blue-fronted Amazon" released! | parrot.org | Priorities: Add deprecations for 2.0; test platforms; check with HLL implementors | Roadmap: icanhaz.com/parrotroadmap | Latest modified TT's: icanhaz.com/parrotbugs
Set by moderator on 5 January 2010.
chromatic Makes sense. 00:02
Whiteknight in make whats the difference between = and := 00:14
chromatic One has a colon and the other... needs a machine. 00:15
darbelo := is nonstandard, but expands the RHS before assigning. 00:16
Coke www.gnu.org/software/make/manual/ma...ml#Flavors
:= ? 00:17
purl rumour has it := is pascal or U+2254
Coke := is also www.gnu.org/software/make/manual/ma...ml#Flavors
purl okay, Coke.
Coke I just did a big ole cut'n'paste in one_make branch if anyone is looking to clean up some perl. 00:21
dukeleto the parrot github repo should be updating regularly again. My machine died while I was on vacation 00:29
dalek rrot: r43408 | coke++ | branches/one_make/tools/dev/checkdepend.pl:
Search through .pir files for .include's and try to match them to real files.
 00:31
rrot: r43409 | coke++ | branches/one_make/tools/dev/checkdepend.pl:
Actually report on missing .include dependencies.
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cotto_work chromatic, is that paper more about how to do it if we could re-do Parrot or are there practical implications that could be applied to Parrot as-is? 00:53
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chromatic I haven't read it, but it seemed interesting to read and steal. 00:56
cotto_work Yes. I definitely hope there's something that could be useful to Parrot in there. It sounds shiny. 00:57
Where do you find that stuff?
chromatic I don't recall. 00:58
cotto_work It's a different concept of vtables than I'm used to with Parrot. 01:00
chromatic Exactly. 01:04
cotto_work very amenable to a "yo dawg" 01:05
Whiteknight which paper? 01:17
cotto_work piumarta.com/software/id-objmodel/
dalek rrot: r43410 | coke++ | branches/one_make/tools/dev/checkdepend.pl:
report on missing deps from load_bytecode; look in runtime/parrot/library
 01:20
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kid51 Coke ping 01:30
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plobsing pmc_freeze_cleanup tests fine everywhere AFAICT, but merging into trunk reveals a threads+GC problem 04:48
I assume this prevents merge prior to 2.0 04:49
chromatic Unless it's easy to fix.
plobsing I can change 2 lines to fix it - un-comment the body of stopGC in src/pmc/parrotthread.pmc 04:50
seems a little like passing the buck though 04:51
chromatic I don't see it in there on trunk. 04:53
Oh, stop_GC. 04:54
It's #ifdef 0 on trunk.
sorry, #if 0.
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plobsing yeah, that commenting out was added when STM landed 04:58
chromatic If you remove the #if, does the branch work?
plobsing I have to regenerate some native_pbc test pbcs to run a couple of tests, but other than that, it appears fine 04:59
dukeleto is hacking on PL/Parrot at the pdx hackathon 05:02
dalek parrot: d4cb26f | dukeleto++ | ROADMAP:
Add a ROADMAP. Needs a lot of work
 05:04
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chromatic Sounds like we need to debug that thread problem then. 05:25
Maybe something used to be constant but now isn't. 05:26
plobsing Constants in packfiles haven't been created as constants wrt GC since before this branch. it's a workaround for non-constant subs or something like that. 05:27
running gdb, it appears that a PObj in compact_pool is pointing to an invalid memory location (freed last GC run) 05:30
chromatic Disable your system's stack randomization. 05:34
Put a breakpoint on whichever function returns a new PMC header. 05:35
Check that it returns that particular PMC.
Then run a backtrace and see what allocates it.
plobsing The PObj itself is very short lived - created as a copy in String.get_string and handed off for freezing. 05:59
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nopaste "plobsing" at 67.204.44.186 pasted "Allocation Backtrace" (47 lines) at nopaste.snit.ch/19236 06:01
dalek parrot: c138e6b | dukeleto++ | ROADMAP:
Add some notes from eggyknap
 06:12
plobsing I think I have a grasp on what's going on now 06:18
A PObj is being COWed across threads that don't seem to share memory pools, so when one compacts, the other gets hosed.
This doesn't show up in trunk because pmc_freeze_cleanup generates larger images, therefor creating more GC pressure 06:19
does that make sense?
dalek TT #1404 created by aardvark++: [PATCH] eliminate ambiguous term PIR book, chapter 3 06:34
chromatic That makes sense. 06:41
We should check ownership when COWing across threads. 06:42
Coke . 06:45
plobsing sleeps 06:49
dalek parrot: 0fb3bd3 | dukeleto++ | ROADMAP:
More ROADMAP updates
 06:52
parrot: e55bf0c | dukeleto++ | ROADMAP:
More maps of roads
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dalek parrot: 81dc5bc | (Joshua Tolley)++ | ROADMAP:
Add notes to roadmap
 07:09
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dalek parrot: 821e790 | dukeleto++ | src/handler/plparrot.c:
Add the beginnings of something that does SPI
 08:12
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dalek parrot: c9755c5 | dukeleto++ | src/handler/plparrot.c:
Add some error checking for SPI_connect
 09:38
parrot: 6a5a19c | dukeleto++ | src/handler/plparrot.c:
Improved error handling for SPI_connect
parrot: ae90d19 | dukeleto++ | src/handler/plparrot.c:
Add some more SPI boilerplate
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dalek TT #1404 closed by coke++: [PATCH] eliminate ambiguous term PIR book, chapter 3 14:12
ttbot Parrot trunk/ r43411 i386-linux-thread-multi make error tt.ro.vutbr.cz/file/cmdout/180795.txt ( tt.ro.vutbr.cz//buildstatus/pr-Parrot/rp-trunk/ ) 14:13
dalek rrot: r43411 | coke++ | trunk/docs/book/pir/ch03_basic_syntax.pod:
Documention cleanup courtesy aardvark++ (TT#1404)
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whiteknight Parrot builds with icc on Linux32, but fails a few random tests. Mostly math stuff 16:29
Parrot builds with clang on Linux32, passes all tests I think
also passes all tests with gcc and g++, at least as of the last time I ran those tests 16:30
I haven't tried any of these with --optimize 16:31
smolder is stupid slow today 16:33
most ICC failures I can see look like -0 problems, so those are minor (annoying, but minor) 16:34
It also has two failed GC assertions in t/compilers/pct/complete_workflow.t, which are troubling 16:35
Coke that test has been failing on and off for some time. 16:43
(in one_make)
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ash_ is there a target for parrot that only builds the libraries and not the parrot executable? 17:06
PerlJam ash_: make help # should tell you 17:07
darbelo ash_: Not as such, but it'd be pretty easy to add. 17:08
look in the makefile for LIBPARROT
ash_ i see there is a PARROT_LIBS 17:09
if you were going to embed parrot into another program, all you would need is the PARROT_LIBS right? (it builds static and dynamic librarys) 17:10
darbelo Yeah, but you'll want to look at the embedding docs too. 17:13
docs/embed.pod should be helpful.
Coke there is no single target for that, no.
if you happen to know the name of the library file you wish to generate, you can of course just make that one file. 17:14
ash_ kk, thanks, still trying to figure out if I can make parrot as a linkable library for an iphone app
Coke: so i shouldn't be doing make PARROT_LIBS, but rather make blib/lib/libparrot.a ? 17:18
Coke I do not see that target in root.in, building makefile... 17:19
oh, you can make a varname? 17:20
huh.
ash_ it worked, i don't know if its the right way or not
if i want to link to the library from an iphone app it has to be statically linked for whatever reason, so i only really need the LIBPARROT_STATIC target 17:24
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Coke so, does gnat write perl anymore or just send links to boingboing? =-) 17:51
Tene cognominal: Oh, you're here already! 18:04
theory Coke: He's a professional maven. 18:05
cognominal yea, but I think my question is more appropriate to #perl6 :) 18:06
cotto_w0rk ignore piper? 18:11
Coke our usage of .include makes reporting on dependencies annoying. :| 18:14
dukeleto 'ello 18:22
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dukeleto mj41: hola 18:40
purl privet, dukeleto.
mj41 dukeleto: ahoj 18:45
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whiteknight Coke: how do I check the output of the config step, --verbose? 19:28
Coke --verbose-step Comma-delimited string of configuration steps 19:31
where the step is prolly auto::neg_0
whiteknight okay, I'll have to try that later
OpenSolaris/gcc3.4.5 was failing the neg0 tests, and Ubuntu/icc11.1 was too this morning 19:32
and I seem to remember we were seeing some kind of similar issues on a windows configuration
Coke it's possible that the config step is not dealing with some aspect of -0 that you need. 19:33
I'm pretty sure it tries to generate a -0 and then just print it to see if it comes out 0 or -0
I'm not sure what aspect the test failures you're seeing is dealing with.
whiteknight yeah, probably need to expand that to checking for -0 results from operations 19:34
if you look through the smolder reports, mine are the ones that use either ICC or OpenSolaris/i386
I'll dig out some links if you need (or I'll just submit new reports in an hour or so)
op/arithmetics.t, op/trans.t and op/sprintf.t were all failing if I remember correctly 19:35
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dukeleto chromatic: good moroning 19:36
chromatic morning
dukeleto chromatic: thanks for the mentoring link. i need to get on that 19:37
chromatic We could find a few good students. 19:38
dukeleto chromatic: definitely. I was talking to a prospective gsoc student at the hackathon last night 19:39
ash_ i am a student, well, i graduate in spring, and then i am applying for grad school, but i think that still counts over the summer 19:41
PerlJam ash_: it does IIRC
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dukeleto ash_: sounds good! start thinking about projects 20:10
ash_ i already know of 1 i am interested in, lorito and compiler optimizations
PerlJam ash_++ 20:11
cotto_work Hmm. We'll have to get hacking on Lorito so you've got something to work on then. ;)
dukeleto ash_: sounds good. just make sure you have a well-defined plan that can be accomplished in 3-4 months
ash_ that, or building a stack frame builder that uses the llvm 20:13
i know someone made one that uses libjit at one point
i think it would be interesting to see a comparision of the two 20:14
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dukeleto ash_: we really need a frame builder 20:17
ash_: plobsing is working on that, I think
ash_ yeah, thats the libjit one, although the github repo i was watching hasn't been updated since november 20:18
thats weird. when building in xcode for the iPhone, the MACOSX_DEPLOYMENT_TARGET environmental variable is set to 10.5 even though I am on 10.6, wonder why that is... 20:20
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Coke ... because the iphone is only running 10.5? 20:24
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ash_ no, i found it, its a project preference 20:27
well, i have it building for the simulator now... but targeting the actual device is not working, i am going to have to figure out some way to fudge the makefile or something 20:40
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ash_ So... my plan's kind of this, build parrot for the host system (so you can make pbc files if needed) and then have a second build phase that builds for the target system and supplements any uses of parrot with the host system's parrot instead of the target system's parrot 21:08
darbelo ash_: You need to watch out for host information bleeding into the target files. 21:13
ash_ maybe, i could setup some way for it to build the pbc's on the iphone after its run? 21:14
dukeleto ash_: sounds cool. this could be a gsoc project 21:15
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ash_ dukeleto: thats no fun, i'm already working on it 21:16
:-d
darbelo Starting early is the key to success ;) 21:21
ash_ what exactly are the requirements for a gsoc anyway? i have been interested in them but i don't know the details 21:23
darbelo Be a student. 21:24
Write a proposal.
Get accepted.
Profit!
ash_ you forgot the ... step
darbelo I did. 21:25
socghop.appspot.com/ has more data.
The 'Elelgibility' section of the FAQ is probably what you want. 21:26
s/Elelgibility/Eligibility/
ash_ i don't see why i wouldn't meet the requirements for that then 21:29
darbelo ash_: Go for it! 21:30
Well, when they announce the '10 edition.
ash_ i made a profile on that site 21:34
but yeah, lots of that is still 2009 stuff
so i can't apply till march then? it says student applications don't start till then 21:35
are there any other student developer things if I wanted to participate in those? or should I just keep toying with things, like trying to run parrot on the iPhone, 21:38
darbelo back 21:41
ash_: Actaully there hasn't been any official word of a GSoC'10. 21:42
They could just not do it, but that's rather unlikely.
dukeleto ash_: this is the time to work on your project ideas 21:43
ash_: what do you mean by "student developer things" "?
ash_ things like the gsoc, i was just wondering if there are other things like that out there that i may not be aware of
darbelo If there are, I'm not aware of the either. 21:44
dukeleto ash_: there are some $season of code things from a few places, but they are more specialized
ash_ one of my professors asked if i wanted to write a proposal on eng.auburn.edu/admin/marketing/news...award.html last semester, so I should be finding out about that soon (end of january) i was going to do llvm stuff, but now I am kinda thinking of working with parrot more (or merging the two if i can every figure out how the stack frame builder works) 21:46
darbelo plobsing did a lot of work on the frame builder, he might be of help. 21:47
s/did a lot of work/rewrote/ 21:48
ash_ if I wanted to try working on the stack frame builder for that grant, do you think anyone would mind? 22:01
darbelo All of us would mind. We are all against the improvement of parrot. 22:02
;)
Rule of thimb: If it makes parrot better, we're all for it. 22:03
s/thimb/thumb/
ash_ well, looks like i am going to revise my original proposal for my professor and see what he says 22:06
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ash_ does nci world against objective c libraries? 22:29
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Tene ash_: it works against anything you can dlopen 22:30
ash_ okay, cool, just curious 22:31
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