Parrot 2.6.0 | parrot.org Log: irclog.perlgeek.de/parrot/today | Nopaste: nopaste.snit.ch:8001 | fix 'make html' (talk to Coke), update tutorial (talk to tcurtis)
Set by moderator on 21 July 2010.
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plobsing seen ash_ 00:52
purl ash_ was last seen on #parrot 6 days, 22 hours, 11 minutes and 4 seconds ago, saying: i'll start looking into building my own tool from scratch, i am going to look at winxed first, to see what kind of reading PBC's was done with that [Jul 22 02:41:48 2010]
ash_ heya 00:53
plobsing hi. Do you think we could push our meeting a little later this evening or reschedule? 00:54
ash_ sure
what time is good for you?
plobsing how is an hour after the usual time? 00:55
ash_ thats fine 00:56
plobsing thank you 01:01
chromatic Ah, plobsing just left. I had a message for him. 01:02
ash_ he's going to be back a bit later 01:03
chromatic email sent to the list anyhow 01:06
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kid51 msg darbelo See smolder.plusthree.com/app/projects/...ails/35147 for smolder of gsoc_nfg branch; make codetest also PASS 01:12
purl Message for darbelo stored.
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cotto ~~ 01:39
What's the best way to write a test for some pir code that needs some included files as part of the test? 01:48
nm. found some other tests that do what I need 01:50
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dalek rrot: r48211 | cotto++ | trunk (2 files):
store bytecode offsets in pf debug segments instead of instruction counts, plus a test
 02:15
cotto coke++ 02:21
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dalek TT #1127 closed by cotto++: profiling core shows incorrect filenames. 02:27
TT #1127: trac.parrot.org/parrot/ticket/1127
plobsing ping ash_ 02:30
ash_ plobsing: pong
plobsing so hows the thunk gen tool comming? 02:31
ash_ github.com/ashgti/parrot/blob/gsoc_...nk_gen.nqp i have it in my repo now
its coming along, just trying to figure out the best way to represent certain objects 02:32
i might be able to roll some of it into a library too, so if you wanted a more OO version of the nci tools you could use parts of that
since i am making object types, like C-Int to represent a C Int type, you can say set_size(8) or set_size(:int) 02:33
and it will set the size of the C-Int to the appropriate size
plobsing Cool.
ash_ i am just doing that so i can have a way of managing my types used in signatures
plobsing Also, when working on the frame builder, I wanted to use the thunk gen for testing signatures. Thunk gen and framebuilder must generate the same PCC sigs for NCI sigs. 02:34
That was the big problem with the jitting framebuilder we ditched last october (IIRC)
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ash_ yea, they should build the same signatures, otherwise i am doing something wrong 02:35
plobsing they usually do. but if someone changes PCC or NCI, they can become out of synch with each other. We had no good way of catching that (and still don't) 02:36
ash_ also, in a slightly un-related note, i have been working on the web interface for rakudo's try.rakudo.org (seen greaterthaninfinity.dyndns.info/ is a preview) 02:37
ya, that is true, currently they are 2 completely separate implementations of the same thing, one is a grammar the other is all C
sorear ash_: are you planning to hook try up to R*?
ash_ sorear: ya, it will use R* 02:38
plobsing that's locked down tight right? I imagine getting Parrot to do something nasty is probably pretty easy.
ash_ ya, no inline parrot allowed
a lot of the system calls are disabled too
i am planning on it running in a chroot
with mem limits, and it currently times out after 10 seconds 02:39
github.com/moritz/try.rakudo.org/bl...cgi/try.pl is the meat of the implementation (with a few extra javascript files, but all the perl is in that file currently)
plobsing cpu time and mem are probably the easiest to abuse 02:40
any more thoughts about the pbc_to_exe-llvm (or whatever you want to call it)? 02:42
ash_ i think its going to be its own tool now, separate from pbc_to_exe, but i have been thinking about it a bit, i haven't gotten to test anything new though, just been working on the nci_thunk_gen.nqp 02:43
maybe this week i can get something started with that again 02:45
plobsing a name by which to call it would be useful 02:46
ash_ pbc_to_native ? 02:47
plobsing wfm
ash_ wfm?
purl wfm is probably works for me (for lazy folks)
ash_ oh
got ya, i mean its similiar to pbc_to_exe, but different in that instead of just sticking the code into the exe, it would unroll things when possible, so... ya... 02:48
i am not good with names
or meaningful names
plobsing me neither. My best stab would probably be something like 'pbc_to_exe_for_reals'
ash_ lol, i like how pls is going to be the new name for rakudo's proto 02:49
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cotto That's ... brilliant. 02:52
ash_ pls install MiniDBI etc. 02:54
anything else you want me to work on this next week plobsing?
plobsing hmmm... I've been meaning to import your git branch into the main svn repo for a while. You have commit privs. You could try that. 02:56
sorry about not doing that sooner, real lifes been crazy
ash_ thats fine
plobsing ping the list, get people testing. 02:57
ash_ i can try, at the very least, i'll make a svn branch that mirrors mine
even if its made from diffs
plobsing sidenote - those test files you've checking in to your git repo won't fly in the parrot repo 02:58
s/checking/checked/
ash_ i'll remove them, and the /throw_away folder 03:00
i just waned those files revisioned, so i could keep track of them for a while
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ash_ last i checked i still passed all the style tests 03:02
i think one of my config files needs tests still
i can do that, all it does is figure out if you have libffi and copy either the old nci.pmc or the new nci.pmc to the right location 03:03
so, it doesn't have much functionality, shouldn't be hard to test
plobsing btw, testing the try rakudo - if possible, error messages would be really nice 03:05
ash_ ya, they should be, i am working on those
i had it setup to do them before, but i changed it so it would persist lines between calls, and now it broke that, i am going to fix it though
doing: my $a = 5; <enter> say $a; <enter> should work for you 03:06
its a start though, and i plan on having a sorta framework setup for writing tutorials for try.rakudo.org, so that way others can help out by adding/patching those 03:08
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dalek kudo: c196801 | pmichaud++ | VERSION:
Bump VERSION.
 03:38
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dalek kudo: 9fd5eaa | pmichaud++ | build/gen_version.pl:
Make sure --version always prefers the date form of tag (starting with '2').
 03:50
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dalek izkost: bf19b68 | sorear++ | nt/exit.t:
Add a failing test for exit in callbacks
 06:15
izkost: 953ef9f | sorear++ | build/Makefile.in:
build/Makefile.in ~~ s:g/MANDIR/MAN_DIR/ # pmichaud++
sorear how long have I had that unpushed patch? 06:16
yikes.
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cxreg sorear: the exit.t one? 07:57
3 months :)
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dalek parrot: 9739681 | (Jonathan "Duke" Leto)++ | plparrot.c:
Slightly better error messages for when we detect an invalid interpreter
 08:08
parrot: 05851a6 | (Jonathan "Duke" Leto)++ | html/pir.html:
Update PIR html
parrot: 7cb57e4 | (Jonathan "Duke" Leto)++ | html/ (3 files):
Explain a bit about how PL/Perl6 works
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dalek rrot: r48212 | gerd++ | trunk/examples/languages/squaak/PARROT_REVISION:
I think the generated file from the "mk_language_shell.pl" script which holds the revision number should be deleted from the example.
 08:35
rrot: r48213 | gerd++ | trunk/MANIFEST:
remove the deleted file from MANIFEST
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kthakore \\o/ 11:33
PERL CHRISTMAS DAY!!!!
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smash hello everyone 12:32
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Coke cotto: I can't keep up with #perl6; I have "parrot" highlighted and skip most of the rest a lot of the time. =-) 12:40
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whiteknight pmichaud++ # star 12:46
kthakore how do I install star on windows? 13:15
whiteknight 1) Install Linux ... 13:16
moritz kthakore: by following the instruction from the README, but s/make/nmake/
kthakore: jnthn++ will provide windows builds soon
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kthakore jnthn++ yay! 13:24
jnthn Will have a 13:25
Windows installer later today
I already did most of the work on it
kthakore jnthn: how can I halp
instead of an installer is there a simple portable zip file? 13:26
you extract and use?
jnthn kthakore: Thing is that it's not relocatable ('cus Parrot isn't) 13:27
kthakore pmichaud++
booo parrot
jnthn: oh well
jnthn So ZIP file will likely only end up with people unzipping somewhere they shouldn't and getting in trouble. 13:28
kthakore it would be nice to have this on a USB stick to use
jnthn: A script to update PATH for it would be nice ... but I am being greddy
greedy
pmichaud if you can get parrot running on a usb stick then rakudo can be not far behind :) 13:29
kthakore pmichaud: how can I accomplish this feat?
I mean what stops it right now?
jnthn kthakore: I tried to binary patch the exe last night 13:30
kthakore: but it's not so simple :-(
kthakore pmichaud: also congrats! Many internetz have been won by you kind sir! :D
jnthn What stops it is hardcoded paths in the EXE
kthakore jnthn: ah ok
jnthn: where is that ... in src?
pmichaud kthakore: thanks... I've had a lot of help 13:31
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kthakore hi azawawi 13:31
azawawi hi :)
kthakore pmichaud:
oops
pmichaud: I am trying real hard to get parrotSDL done for useage soon 13:32
grammars for games :D I am stoked
pmichaud kthakore: niiiiice!
kthakore pmichaud: I have some work done github.com/kthakore/parrotSDL
azawawi any idea why loadlib opcode fails on strawberry 5.12? (blizkost fails trying to load "blizkost_groups.dll")
kthakore pmichaud: but I need to learn parrot internals
azawawi feather.perl6.nl/~azawawi/blizkost_..._error.png 13:33
kthakore azawawi: what are your strawberry flags?
perl -V
azawawi kthakore: i need to install it again... please give me 5 min... :) 13:34
kthakore pmichaud: but I had a "Magic: The Gathering" game I made in C# a while back. For which I used ANTLR to do card grammar.
pmichaud: like <effect> on <criteria> <target> + <multiplier>
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kthakore pmichaud: Then I saw perl6's grammars built in! 13:35
pmichaud: :D that was awesome!
pmichaud++
azawawi: ok
pmichaud: I hope to make it again ... but SDL perl5 is taking my time right now too
pmichaud: sorry if I am rambling but I am super excited for Christmas today :D I slept maybe 3 hrs 13:36
kthakore stays quite now
pmichaud kthakore: I slept less than that :) 13:37
not because I had to do anything, but was too hyped up to sleep (plus have a bit of a cough that would keep me awake anyway)
but I think I'm going to try to take a nap now
kthakore pmichaud: well I hope to cough was nothing
pmichaud: have a nice nap!
atrodo naps++ 13:38
kthakore naps++ at work!!!!
:D
atrodo i could take one. Only been awake 2 hours too
kthakore so you slept 22 hrs?
I don't think you need a nap 13:39
Coke pmichaud++
azawawi "No day is so bad it can't be fixed with a nap. " :)
atrodo kthakore> i would rebut that, but it makes no sense
kthakore atrodo: hehe
azawawi kthakore: ccflags right? 13:40
NotFound kthakore: stay away of "Magic" trade marks, we don't want such kind of publicity right now ;)
azawawi kthakore: pastebin.ca/1910947
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kthakore NotFound: but ... this is personal project 13:42
NotFound: I haven't release this ... it is too ugly ... and sucks
azawawi: crap that is blocked 13:43
NotFound kthakore: just be careful
kthakore NotFound: but I can make a grammar engine for card games like that in perl6 no?
if not ... that is BS ... 13:44
NotFound kthakore: of course, you just need to take care with the trademarked name.
azawawi kthakore: gist.github.com/498155
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NotFound plays 'A star is born' 13:46
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azawawi kthakore: did it work? 13:47
kthakore azawawi: yeah 13:48
azawawi: reading the perlapi.h
azawawi: can you send me yours?
I wanna confirm the symbol is in there
I don't have strawberry 5.12.1
azawawi sure
kthakore I have 5.10.1
azawawi kthakore: gist.github is taking too long to paste it... any other pastebin you can access? 13:53
kthakore: one without any non-80 port that i can access :) 13:55
kthakore nopaste
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kthakore azawawi: just ctrl-f for that symbol in your perlapi.h 13:56
azawawi kthakore: nopaste.voric.com/paste.php?f=8o5zmv
kthakore azawawi: hmm it is there 13:57
check intrpvar.h
and I think #p5p is a better channel for this
azawawi kthakore: you mean search for Perl_Iorigalen right? 14:00
kthakore yeah 14:02
azawawi: it is being used in perlapi.h
but the header.h it must be defined in is intrpvar.h
see if a macro skips the definition 14:03
azawawi kthakore: i see
kthakore azawawi: if it does then set that macro and buil perl
azawawi: besides that talk to #p5p
azawawi kthakore: going there :) 14:04
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Casan team++ 14:08
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Coke cries again about the failing tests in 'make smolder' 14:37
red tests make sad coke sad. :(
bacek aloha, humans! 14:39
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bacek Happy Christmas! 14:39
moritz o/ 14:40
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Coke \\ö 14:42
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moritz >>ö<< 14:45
bacek Perl 6 gives wings 14:46
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Coke opbots, names? 16:07
moritz I guess that list is pretty long :-) 16:19
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dalek kudo: d65e73b | moritz++ | build/PARROT_REVISION:
bump PARROT_REVISION to get some nqp-rx fixes
 16:43
kudo: da16b58 | moritz++ | src/Perl6/Actions.pm:
use less code to check for allowed s/// adverbs
TT #1717 closed by NotFound++: Parrot compilation fails on './miniparrot config_lib.pir' when there are ... 16:45
TT #1717: trac.parrot.org/parrot/ticket/1717
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cotto_work ~~ 17:05
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kthakore \\o/\\o/\\o/\\o/ 17:11
still compiling
purl i heard compiling was overrated.
kthakore ...
NotFound - 5, /* minor_version */
+ 6, /* minor_version */
Problem...
purl problem is nobody ever writes test cases after breaking it
NotFound Looks like core_ops.c was not regenerated before the release 17:12
Coke it was modified and committed per the dirs.
but a bug there might explain some of the odd errors we've been seeing in the HLLs. 17:13
(or so I thought it was, anyway.)
NotFound That appears in a diff after make bootstrap-ops
Coke ok. "make bootstrap-ops" isn't in the release guide, so that's probably a bug, then? 17:14
cotto_work yes 17:15
NotFound Don't know if that value is used or checked anywhere.
Coke Looks like the core_ops stuff is mentioned around line 120 or so
if that whole big step can be released with a single make command, that's prolly a good thing. =-)
note that I'm defensive about breaking a release or anything (c.f. "Atlanta") 17:16
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NotFound There was two comments in TT #1720 that I haven't seen in the mail. 17:29
dalek rrot: r48214 | NotFound++ | trunk (3 files):
fix int fdiv and add some tests for it, TT #1720
 17:32
rrot: r48215 | darbelo++ | branches/gsoc_nfg/config/gen/makefiles/root.in:
Fix some deps.
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dalek TT #1720 closed by NotFound++: fdiv_i_i_i and fdiv_i_i ops don't work correctly. 17:35
TT #1720: trac.parrot.org/parrot/ticket/1720 17:36
NotFound trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/48214/ shows the problem with version number in core_ops.c 17:40
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Coke ah, because only changed op guts. yah. 17:44
cotto_work We need to figure out how to make that harder to forget. 17:45
Coke cotto_work: forget what? 17:46
purl Coke: I forgot what
Coke That is... not a joke.
see also my defensiveness about following the instructions. ;)
cotto_work running bootstrap-ops after changing ops guts
Coke that should just happen automatically. 17:47
if it's not, that's a bug in the build system, yes?
mikehh if it has thje version number in it it needs to be run aftewr the version number is bumpewd
cotto_work There'd be a circular dependency if it happened automatically.
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cotto_work opsc needed to build ops, ops needed to build parrot, parrot needed to build nqp, nqp needed to build opsc 17:48
mikehh so we would need to run some of the stuff at least twice? 17:50
NotFound mikehh: with luck
Make a mistake in an op and you need to redo all 17:51
mikehh hey this realease manager thing is begining to sacare me :-{
scare
cotto_work It's easy. It's everyone's job to make sure the release manager guide is accurate and complete. 17:52
mikehh cotto_work: easy for you to say - you are next on the list :-} 17:54
probably should have had a not in there
NotFound We can't put an issue in the guide before knowing it
cotto_work phew 17:55
NotFound I just discovered that problem right now by looking at the diff
cotto_work no, but ideally we'll only run into it once before it goes into the guide
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mike hi, why is parrot so slow right now? Is there room for optimization in the near future? 18:03
PerlJam mike++ 18:04
mike: parrot is slow for a variety of reasons. Certianly there is room for optimization.
dalek rrot: r48216 | mikehh++ | trunk/compilers/imcc/pbc.c:
fix codetest failure - trailing whitespace (indent next line)
 18:05
mike ok
cotto_work mike: trac.parrot.org/parrot/wiki/Perform...provements 18:06
mike it's just that I get asked that once in a while... and I just say "well... I think it still has the debug flags on" ;) 18:07
particle we don't know how to spell otpimumization yet
dukeleto mike: are you compiling with --optimize ?
mike @dukeleto nope... well.. dunno 18:08
just build rakudo star today... but I didn't look for an --optimize flag 18:09
don't know if it's there
cotto_work It's there by default for Rakudo 18:10
NotFound Someone has some idea about what the version numbers in the oplib are used or intended to use? ack don't give me any clue. 18:11
particle it's not only parrot that can use optimizations, rakudo has almost none itself
mike what's Lorito? Sounds cool 18:12
particle lorito?
purl lorito is, like, "little parrot" in spanish or examples/embed/lorito.c or xkcd.org/707/
NotFound That's outdated 18:13
cotto_work actually, none of those are helpful
atrodo the first one is
particle purl: lorito is also github.com/atrodo/lorito
purl okay, particle.
tcurtis purl: lorito is also trac.parrot.org/parrot/wiki/Lorito 18:14
purl okay, tcurtis.
NotFound xkcd is always helpful
lorito? 18:17
purl well, lorito is "little parrot" in spanish or examples/embed/lorito.c or xkcd.org/707/ or github.com/atrodo/lorito or trac.parrot.org/parrot/wiki/Lorito
NotFound There is a "is not" option? 18:18
darbelo I think "s///" works on purl's factoids. 18:20
cotto_work lorit =~ s/examples\\/embed\\/lorito.c or//
lorito =~ s/examples\\/embed\\/lorito.c or//
lorito?
purl i think lorito is "little parrot" in spanish or examples/embed/lorito.c or xkcd.org/707/ or github.com/atrodo/lorito or trac.parrot.org/parrot/wiki/Lorito
cotto_work something like that worked at some point
particle just do: purl: no, lorito is ... 18:22
NotFound purl: no, lorito is "little parrot" in spanish or xkcd.org/707/ or github.com/atrodo/lorito or trac.parrot.org/parrot/wiki/Lorito
purl okay, NotFound.
NotFound lorito?
purl i think lorito is "little parrot" in spanish or xkcd.org/707/ or github.com/atrodo/lorito or trac.parrot.org/parrot/wiki/Lorito
NotFound good bot 18:23
purl :)
darbelo lorito =~ s/http/placeholder/g 18:25
lorito?
purl well, lorito is "little parrot" in spanish or xkcd.org/707/ or github.com/atrodo/lorito or trac.parrot.org/parrot/wiki/Lorito
darbelo lorito =~ s/http/placeholder/ 18:26
lorito?
purl lorito is, like, "little parrot" in spanish or placeholder://xkcd.org/707/ or placeholder://github.com/atrodo/lorito or trac.parrot.org/parrot/wiki/Lorito
dalek TT #344 reopened by JadeNB++: Can't create working installed parrot for macports
TT #344: trac.parrot.org/parrot/ticket/344
tcurtis lorito =~ s/ or / and / 18:27
lorito?
purl lorito is "little parrot" in spanish or placeholder://xkcd.org/707/ or placeholder://github.com/atrodo/lorito or trac.parrot.org/parrot/wiki/Lorito
darbelo lorito =~ s/placeholder/http/
lorito?
purl i think lorito is "little parrot" in spanish or placeholder://xkcd.org/707/ or placeholder://github.com/atrodo/lorito or trac.parrot.org/parrot/wiki/Lorito
darbelo lorito?
purl it has been said that lorito is "little parrot" in spanish or xkcd.org/707/ or github.com/atrodo/lorito or trac.parrot.org/parrot/wiki/Lorito
darbelo Works on privmsg, not on the channel. Maybe it's a feature. 18:28
mikehh All tests PASS (pre/post-config, make corevm/make coretest, smoke (#35164), fulltest) at r48216 - Ubuntu 10.04 amd64 (g++ with --optimize) 18:35
dalek TT #1721 created by NotFound++: parrot version numbers in oplib 18:42
TT #1721: trac.parrot.org/parrot/ticket/1721
atrodo darbelo> interesting 18:43
I'm also wondering if it was a good idea to make lorito an attention grabbing word for me...
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cotto_work I've already got it that way. 19:09
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Coke darbelo: was that caught with tools/dev/checkdepend? 19:11
dalek rrot: r48217 | darbelo++ | trunk/config/gen/makefiles/root.in:
Remove redundant build deps from parrot_debugger.
 19:12
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dalek rrot: r48218 | NotFound++ | trunk/src/call/args.c:
consting err_check in fill_params for clarity and maybe nano-optimization
 19:29
darbelo Coke: Yep. 19:33
Coke darbelo: \\o/
darbelo I had some mis-deps in my gsoc branch and caught the trunk one by chance. 19:35
We're pretty much done with the c deps, too. It spits out some pir stuff, but I'm not sure I'm qualified for those. 19:36
Coke I'm not sure we're doing those right anyway. 19:38
darbelo Hm, there's a bit more I can do on the C front. 19:45
Coke to improve the checker or enforce its will? 19:46
darbelo Enforce it.
dalek rrot: r48219 | darbelo++ | trunk/src/dynoplibs/Rules.in:
Fixup dynoplibs deps.
 20:02
darbelo That's the one. 20:03
dalek ee-optimization: e39dc98 | tcurtis++ | (5 files):
Add a :exact option to Tree::Pattern.ACCEPTS to replace :p/:pos(although they
davidfetter tcurtis, around? 21:02
tcurtis davidfetter: yes.
davidfetter tcurtis, so i'm looking into making a PL/Squaak (embedded Squaak in PostgreSQL)
does it have native methods for opening filehandles and/or pipes? 21:03
!squaak 21:04
hrm
tcurtis Not yet. If you give me a list of subs you'd need, I can work on adding them to its runtime library.
davidfetter actually, it's perfect that it can't. PLs come in two flavors: one that can do dangerous things and must be created by the super-user, and one that's safe for ordinary users to create stuff in 21:08
PL/Squaak would be the latter :)
dalek rrot: r48220 | NotFound++ | trunk (2 files):
implement OpLib vtable elements and add tests for it and get_pmc_keyed_int
 21:09
tcurtis davidfetter: :) Yay for lack of features! It can print to stdout and I need to reimplement reading from stdin at some point, too, though. Will that be a problem? 21:10
davidfetter hrm. if it actually must have stdout, that could be an issue. if it could pretend it's something else, that'd be fine 21:12
tcurtis davidfetter: well, it just uses the say pirop. 21:13
Coke spots a chip. 21:14
sorear a chip?
tcurtis so, probably not, unless you redirect its stdout to something else.
Coke sorry, a Chip. 21:15
NotFound getstdsomethingelse ?
davidfetter i'll give it a whirl 21:17
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cotto_work RMS: "I would like to have a friendly parrot." - blog.reddit.com/2010/07/rms-ama.html 21:36
mikehh All tests PASS (pre/post-config, make corevm/make coretest, smoke (#35166), fulltest) at r48220 - Ubuntu 10.04 amd64 (gcc with --optimize) 21:53
dalek rrot: r48221 | tcurtis++ | trunk/examples/languages/squaak/doc/tutorial_episode_3.pod:
[squaak] Fix exercise 5 solution in episode 3. pheuter++
 21:58
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dalek rrot: r48222 | tcurtis++ | trunk/examples/languages/squaak/doc/tutorial_episode_3.pod:
[squaak] Fix another mistake discovered thanks to pheuter++. s/expression/EXPR/
 22:31
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