Parrot 3.9.0 "Archaeopteryx" | parrot.org | Log: irclog.perlgeek.de/parrot | #parrotsketch meeting Tuesday 19:30 UTC
Set by moderator on 19 October 2011.
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diakopter from nqp, I'm trying to print to stderr using a pir:: call; pir::printerr__vS isn't working; any tips? 00:56
bacek_at_work diakopter, try something like 'my $e := pir::getstderr__p(); pir::print__vPS($e, "message")' 01:01
diakopter, printerr is dynop and you have to load io_ops beforehand
diakopter ooo
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dukeleto ~~ 02:51
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alvis dukeleto: ping 03:35
dukeleto alvis: pong 04:11
alvis oh, hey! Just had a coupl'a questions.
dukeleto alvis: go for it 04:12
alvis Sorry ... give me just a sec please.
ok ... back. 04:13
my question is, should a create a separate branch for the docs? Or just keep it all in '/docs'? 04:14
I'm not sure I understand precisely what benabik meant with, keeping the docs with the code, so I'm gonna email 'im, if he's not on channel now. 04:15
make that, "i create a ..." 04:16
dukeleto alvis: there are a lot of docs. which are you talking about? 04:20
alvis: are you writing new docs? changing old docs?
alvis sorry to be unclear. primarily, something like the manuals. 04:21
dukeleto alvis: yes, make a branch :)
alvis: make a branch for everything
alvis: in your local repo: git checkout -b my_docs_branch
alvis ahh, ok. that makes sense to me as well.
dukeleto alvis: will create my_docs_branch
alvis right. i just wasn't sure about the "keep the docs close to the code" statement. 04:22
next, what is the policy on taking over an old, defunct project? Specifically, Kea-CL. 04:23
I've sent Bob Rogers a coupl'a emails to no avail, so ....
I'd really like to see it cleaned up and running on Parrot. It's a long-term kinda thing, but .... 04:24
Just to be clear: I'm NOT asking to make it a part of the parrot repository. I'm just asking as a general matter. 04:43
Don't want to violate any policies or rules of which I am unaware. 04:44
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dukeleto alvis: i would say, grab the kea-cl code and start hacking on it 05:45
alvis: nobody has touched it in a long time
alvis dukeleto: Ok, thanks. Just didn't want to break any policies or violate some unwritten rule of which I am unaware. 05:47
dukeleto: Besides, he did a lot of very, very good work. I hate to see it lost.
dukeleto: one last thing (then i'm done for the evening): I assigned myself to migrate docs.parrot.org to Github pages. 05:49
dukeleto alvis: awesome! good luck reviving kea-cl! document the process so others can learn from it :) 06:13
dukeleto .sleep()
cotto ~~ 06:27
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dalek kudo/nom: 11e836e | moritz++ | src/Perl6/SymbolTable.pm:
use more nqp:: ops in SymbolTable
11:17
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whiteknight good morning, #parrot 12:20
moritz good morning whiteknight 12:27
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Coke msg alvis "keep the docs near the code" is shorthand for "don't create separate documentation files in a different location from the code you're documenting." for tutorials this doesn't make sense. for APIs it makes some sense. (so, the .ops files might want to keep their docs inline, as now, and have a build step that extracts it (as now)) 12:32
aloha OK. I'll deliver the message.
moritz also I think it means "don't put it into a separate repository", so that the pained developer only needs to keep one repo up-to-date 12:37
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dalek Heuristic branch merge: pushed 20 commits to nqp/bigint by jnthn 12:48
p/bigint: 60d70e2 | jonathan++ | src/ops/nqp_bigint.ops:
Update bigint ops to work with new repr API.
p/bigint: e388430 | jonathan++ | src/ (3 files):
Split bigint repr struct into instance and body. Split instance_of into allocate and initialize to match new API.
13:03
p/bigint: f4f9287 | jonathan++ | src/6model/reprs/P6bigint.c:
Toss defined, which is gone from the repr API. Fix up attribute related repr methods.
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dalek p/bigint: b0f876a | jonathan++ | src/6model/reprs/P6bigint.c:
Implement copy_to, get rid of repr_clone.
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dalek p/bigint: 1eea4e5 | jonathan++ | src/6model/reprs/P6bigint.c:
Update get/set native repr functions to new API.
13:15
p/bigint: 324df8e | jonathan++ | src/6model/reprs/P6bigint.c:
Update GC related bit of the bigint repr. Builds again.
13:23
p/bigint: d387ce9 | moritz++ | src/6model/reprs/P6bigint.c:
initialize return value in P6bigint -> get_int
13:33
p/bigint: f9262fc | jonathan++ | t/nqp/60-bigint.t:
Avoid a curious, seemingly new issue by removing a needless .HOW (what get_knowhow gives is already a HOW).
13:52
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dalek rrot/mls/kill-events-in-ehqueue: 5e2019c | mls++ | / (4 files):
create Parrot_cx_delete_upto_handler_local() function for better abstraction
14:04
rrot/mls/kill-events-in-ehqueue: 25e580f | mls++ | / (3 files):
Define init_pmc for ExceptionHandlers that takes a key to initialize the handled types.

Currently not optimized, we still build the RPA. Also change PCT to create the exception handlers that way.
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dalek p/bigint: 2163a93 | jonathan++ | src/6model/reprs/P6bigint.c:
Fix get_int/set_int in P6bigint.
14:22
p/bigint: ebffd93 | jonathan++ | tools/build/Makefile.in:
Make the right thing depend on the bigint repr.
14:36
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dalek rrot/mls/kill-events-in-ehqueue: 1c313a0 | mls++ | src/ (2 files):
Directly use Key as handles_type when possible.
15:04
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NotFound mls: ping 15:21
mls you rang?
NotFound mls: in 25e580faf7 you are making changes in ExceptionHandler unrelated to the main issue. 15:22
mls what's the "main issue"? 15:23
NotFound "Define init_pmc for ExceptionHandlers ..."
mls oh, you're right, some optimization crept in 15:24
or do you mean the pct change?
NotFound The changes in can_handle
It will be better to have these in separated commits. Or even better, out of the branch. 15:25
mls yes, That should probably have gone to master instead
NotFound Not a big problem, but is better for testing and eventual regresions. 15:26
moritz fwiw yesterday all rakudo tests passed on top of mls/kill-events-in-ehqueue
mls (or a different commit "opimize some keyed_str lookups away if the base_type matches")
moritz: NotFound++ has a point: those changes shouldn't be one commit 15:27
NotFound likes micro-commits
mls I can split the commit and use 'push -f' 15:28
Coke I think on a branch that's probably acceptable.
but IANAGL. 15:29
mls ok, will do
(I hope poor dalek can cope)
Coke I'd get buyin from at least one other person before doing that. ;) 15:30
moritz mls: I know, the only connection was the branch name, which made me remember that I ran that test yesterday
NotFound People advocated the switch because is much easy to branch and merge and thus less need to make lots of unrelated changes in One Big Branch. We switched, so let's profit from that point. 15:36
(the switch to git) 15:37
Coke NotFound: I'm specifically asking about mls rewriting publicly pushed history.
I agree in general that more isolated commits are better for review, etc. 15:38
NotFound Rewriting history in public repos is bad, according the few docs I've read on that matter. 15:40
dalek rrot/mls/kill-events-in-ehqueue: a38bbec | mls++ | src/ (2 files):
Optimize some keyed_str lookups and a isa() call away when the base_type matches
rrot/mls/kill-events-in-ehqueue: da7c786 | mls++ | / (2 files):
Define init_pmc for ExceptionHandlers that takes a key to initialize the handled types.

Currently not optimized, we still build the RPA. Also change PCT to create the exception handlers the new way if possible.
mls oh oh, force -f does strange things
rrot/mls/kill-events-in-ehqueue: 0d94c86 | mls++ | src/ (2 files):
Directly use Key as handles_type when possible.
mls It also updated master ;(
Coke mls: what happened to "don't do that yet!?"
moritz there are several approaches: 1) start a new branch 2) simply revert the commit in the branch, and add it back again in pieces
moritz can't think of more approaches actually 15:42
Coke mls: I don't see any updates to master today on github. 15:45
dalek rrot: b1dbbad | nine++ | t/pmc/alarm.t:
Remove faulty tests from t/pmc/alarm.t

The removed tests tested for alarms firing in a certain order which cannot be guaranteed due to preemption introducing a random element into the mix.
rrot: e20b3be | nine++ | / (4 files):
Merge branch 'master' of github.com:parrot/parrot
mls more karma for nine ;)
good thing that git is so forgiving 15:50
(nothing happened, please move on ;) )
NotFound And one more nitpick: that new init_pmc wants a test. 15:51
mls yes, true. I'll add one.
whiteknight if it's good, we will get it a test for christmas
mls so, how do we specify "handle_types_except" 15:52
NotFound ok(tree_has_bells() && santa_had_come())
This is a good test for christmas?
mls we could use negative values, but imcc doesn't evaluate constant expressions 15:53
so we probably would need EXCEPT_EXCEPTION_... = -<some_value> macors 15:54
i.e. a "negative" one for every exception type
or we can define one EXCEPT_TYPES value 15:55
and put that in front of the exception types
Btw, what do you goys think of moving the CONTROL types to something like 0x1000 and defining an EXCEPTION_ALL and CONTROL_ALL type? 15:56
NotFound You said you aren't afraid of imcc hacking? Add constant evaluation to it, then ;)
mls that's a bigger task than the one we talked about yesterday ;) 15:57
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not_gerd hello, #parrot 15:57
whiteknight mls: +1 to the rearranging the exception type numbers. It's a relatively small change 15:58
mls what about the "ALL" types?
whiteknight mls: Eventually, I would like to stop using exception type numbers and use actual exception classes, but that's a different story
mls: +1 to the ALL types too
NotFound Note that the pir limitation does not make such feature unusable. Winxed can do constant evaluation with pir-included macro consts. 15:59
mls yes, and I can define one EXCEPT_CONTROL_ALL, that's actually all nqp/rakudo needs 16:01
you you prefer negative numbers as "except" values?
so you...
NotFound It was just a quick idea, not a particualar preference. 16:02
mls (hmm, imcc doesn't even understand a 0x prefix) 16:04
dalek kudo/nom: 79c1c9f | moritz++ | Configure.pl:
[Configure.pl] fix import list, not_gerd++
NotFound Sometimes I forget pir limitations because I usually check pir-level functionality from winxed. 16:07
not_gerd some fixes for msys: github.com/parrot/parrot/pull/192 16:12
whiteknight not_gerd: I saw those yesterday. I think they got pulled already 16:14
or, something happened. I don't remember
not_gerd whiteknight: the pull request yesterday only disabled select to make it build again
dukeleto closed the request, but didn't apply it (or mention why it was closed) 16:15
whiteknight oh, another pull request. Sorry. I'll take a look at it later, if nobody beats me to it 16:21
dalek rrot/mls/kill-events-in-ehqueue: 461e486 | mls++ | / (3 files):
move control exceptions to their own number block, add _ALL types that catch any exception of that type
16:29
rrot/mls/kill-events-in-ehqueue: cfab58d | mls++ | compilers/pct/src/PAST/Compiler.pir:
use a key instead of a string for the return exception handler, as the key is cheaper
16:36
mls lets see if nqp/rakudo still work
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dalek rrot/mls/kill-events-in-ehqueue: 4e91e6c | mls++ | src/pmc/exceptionhandler.pmc:
it has to be pmc/exception.h, otherwise the Configure script will generate a wrong Makefile dependency
17:00
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dalek rrot/mls/kill-events-in-ehqueue: 74ba753 | mls++ | compilers/pct/src/PAST/Compiler.pir:
Argh, 'CONTROL' should not include CONTROL_ERROR, used in die()!
17:29
mls aaah, it hurts! it hurts! 17:30
whiteknight ...wat? 17:31
mls I'm tempted to move CONTROL_ERROR to the exception block, despite the name
or maybe add an EXCEPTION_ERROR used by die() 17:32
whiteknight I like EXCEPTION_ERROR
or even something better like EXCEPTION_DIE
mls yes, that would make sense
the current situation is that nqp's and rakudos CONTROL {} catch every control exception but one, CONTROL_ERROR 17:33
oh, actually CONTROL_ERROR can be used by warn(), which is supposed to be caught by a CONTROL catch block 17:34
(I currently use CONTROL_OK for that purpose) 17:35
whiteknight bleh 17:38
our exceptions system needs to be taken out back and shot 17:39
tadzik listening to what #parrot talks about, is there anything that shouldn't? 17:40
gms is cool I suppose
mls actually I like pct
parrot's ops are pretty fast 17:41
hmm, what else... ;) 17:42
Coke rakudo's pretty cool. 17:49
whiteknight tadzik: I overemphasize some problems. Exceptions are a particularly bad system with clear performance repercussions for Rakudo and other users 17:52
it doesn't help that, for all the performance penalties, the interface is lousy, the capabilities are limited and non-intuitive, the usability is low, etc 17:53
Coke and that it was designed either not against perl 6 or another HLL, or against an old version of the perl6 spec 17:54
mls that "resume" functionality makes it so tricky 17:55
it's different from other VMs
Coke just be sure to get buyin from moritz on a redesign, is all. ; 17:58
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whiteknight Coke: No, you're right. It was clearly not designed with Perl6 in mind 18:06
dalek rrot/mls/kill-events-in-ehqueue: a3ec104 | mls++ | src/pmc/ (3 files):
do not use CONTROL_ERROR for internal exceptions, now only die() uses it
mls enough for this week, you guys have a nice weekend! 18:08
whiteknight you too, mls! 18:10
cotto ~~ 18:11
dukeleto ~~ 18:32
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dalek rdinal: 27f7162 | (Daehyub Kim)++ | setup.winxed:
issue #18

   * clean
   * test
   * smoke: need to modify
   * help
   * install: do not commit in this changes
18:34
rdinal: 602e40f | (Daehyub Kim)++ | setup.winxed:
Merge branch 'setup_winxed' of github.com:lateau/cardinal into setup_nqp
rdinal: 4841027 | (Daehyub Kim)++ | setup.winxed:
target install added
rdinal: e393cd3 | (Daehyub Kim)++ | setup.winxed:
remove useless codes
rdinal: 32929b6 | (Daehyub Kim)++ | setup.winxed:
setup.winxed

all targets of setup.pir are supported and works now:
   * build
   * test
   * install
   * uninstall
   * clean
   * update
   * plumage
   * sdist
   * bdist
   * smoke
   * help
changed:
   * clean: remove rpm directory and it's subdirectories also
   * build: build target will be runed before sdist and bdist
Thanks NotFound++
rdinal: e8116ba | (Daehyub Kim)++ | setup.winxed:
ignore pod with /* */
rdinal: 97588e0 | dukeleto++ | setup.winxed:
Merge pull request #19 from lateau/setup_winxed

Setup winxed
rrot: 543e698 | (Gerhard R)++ | / (2 files):
disable select dynpmc on MSYS
18:38
rrot: c0a28a9 | (Gerhard R)++ | / (2 files):
fix make install on MSYS
rrot: df69781 | (Gerhard R)++ | / (4 files):
cleanup compiler flags, file generation, ignored files
rrot: 8fde623 | dukeleto++ | / (5 files):
Merge pull request #192 from gerdr/gerdr/msys-install

fix make install on MSYS
alvis Coke, mortiz: Thank you for the clarification. 18:41
dukeleto if anybody on msys can test that the stuff that just got merged works, that would be awesome 18:42
whiteknight not_gerd is our only user/tester on that platform, as far as I know 18:43
not_gerd dukeleto: make install on MSYS was broken-- I'm the only one who uses it on that platform and I just used parrot directly from the build directory 18:50
the new patch makes rakudo's --gen-parrot work - I don't guarantee anything beyond that... 18:51
btw, t/pmc/alarm.t hangs here - does it work on other windows configurations? 18:59
whiteknight not_gerd: it doesn't hang on other systems, but alarms might be disabled there. We should probably disable that test file on msys for now 19:14
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dukeleto drools over www.genesi-usa.com/store/details/11 21:56
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