www.parrot.org | Parrot 1.6.0 "half-pie" released: The JIT is dead! | Testing priorities: Exception and MultiSub
Set by moderator on 20 September 2009.
dalek TT #1025 created by coke++: PASM Registers limited to 2 digits. 00:00
00:05 Whiteknight joined
Austin Hello, Andrew. 00:05
dalek rrot: r41384 | coke++ | trunk/t/compilers/imcc/syn/regressions.t:
Migrate ticket from RT -> TT
 00:06
TT #1026 created by coke++: Can't use } in TGE transform definitions. 00:12
tracwiki: v4 | coke++ | DebuggerTaskList
tracwiki: trac.parrot.org/parrot/wiki/Debugg...ction=diff
rrot: r41385 | coke++ | trunk/src (2 files):
Moved this issue into the debugger wishlist.
 00:15
rrot: r41386 | coke++ | trunk/src/debug.c:
Remove speculative comment.
 00:16
tracwiki: v5 | coke++ | DebuggerTaskList
tracwiki: trac.parrot.org/parrot/wiki/Debugg...ction=diff
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Whiteknight hello Austin 00:25
Austin How is your weekend so far? 00:26
Whiteknight lousy, and very busy 00:29
Austin Well, I'm sorry about the first.
dalek TT #1027 created by coke++: PIR-only segfault 00:32
Whiteknight how is your weekend? 00:34
dalek rrot: r41387 | coke++ | trunk/t/compilers/imcc/syn/regressions.t:
Add failing TODO test for TT #1027
 00:35
Coke Whiteknight: have a segfault. 00:36
that'll cheer ya up!
alrightee. down to 231 parrot tickets. 00:37
s/parrot/RT
if everyone with a CLA moved one ticket over to trac, we'd be under 200.
Whiteknight Once the pcc_arg_unify branch lands, there are about two dozen tickets that I think we can close as either fixed or obsolete 00:38
Coke ... right after christmas! =-)
00:41 TiMBuS joined
Austin And if everyone moved 5, you'd almost be done. 00:42
What's a cla?
purl it has been said that a cla is Contributor License Agreement or www.perlfoundation.org/contributor_..._agreement or www.parrot.org/foundation/legal or www.parrot.org/files/parrot_cla.pdf
Austin Yikes.
Whiteknight you have to sign your life away and mail in a few nude pictures of yourself that they can use to blackmail you into fixing Coke's segfaults later 00:44
standard operating procedure 00:45
or, at least that's what they told me
Coke: in TT #1027, are we supposed to be able to retrieve two arguments from an exception handler? 00:46
I've only ever seen .get_results() called with one argument 00:47
dalek TT #1028 created by coke++: can't iterate a dynlexpad 00:49
Whiteknight what do dynlexpads do that lexpads dont? 00:51
Coke Whiteknight: that's old school.
I wouldn't expect that code to work, I just expect it to not segf. 00:52
dynlexpads don't require you to predeclare with .lex
(they're dynamic. =-)
dynlexpads basically let you add variables later. (which is crucial for tcl, especially with things like [upvar]) 00:53
(when you are 3 sub calls down the chain from teh original lexpad)
ok. down to 230 RTs. 00:54
enough cleanup for today. later.
->
Whiteknight I guess I don't understand why we have LexInfo/LexPad then. 00:55
dalek rrot: r41388 | coke++ | trunk/t/dynpmc/dynlexpad.t:
Fix TODO test; Migrate ticket from RT to TT
Whiteknight goes to bed. Goodnight! 00:58
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nopaste "kid51" at 70.85.31.226 pasted "kill_jit branch: preconfig test needs more fixing" (28 lines) at nopaste.snit.ch/18011 01:02
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mikehh Coke - t/compilers/imcc/syn/regressions.t hangs on me 01:10
I'm too tired to look at it now - bbl 01:34
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Coke chromatic: hio 03:11
chromatic howdy 03:19
Coke hurm. does 'make -j' work with rakudo/ 03:20
chromatic Yes.
dalek TT #1029 created by coke++: taillcall into PIR compiler broken 03:28
TT #1030 created by coke++: long sub invocation with named parameters 03:38
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dalek rrot: r41389 | coke++ | trunk/t/compilers/imcc/syn/pcc.t:
Add TODO test for TT#1030
 03:44
TT #1031 created by coke++: Free()ing of SymReg variables 03:48
rrot: r41390 | coke++ | trunk/compilers/imcc (4 files):
Remove speculative comment.
 03:55
TT #1032 created by coke++: Document available HLL Mappings 04:00
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dalek rrot: r41391 | coke++ | trunk/t/op/calling.t:
Migrate ticket from RT to TT
 04:08
TT #1033 created by coke++: no args checking for a sub without params 04:10
Coke chuckles at search.cpan.org/dist/AnyEvent-Kanye...t/Kanye.pm 04:25
YARGIBTS: doing a bisect is all local, and you don't need to wait forever for the server to download. 04:28
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chromatic RGIBTS? 04:35
04:36 petdance joined
Tene chromatic: reason git is better than svn 04:37
Coke that update is STILL running. 04:40
it's been 7 minutes.
(plus. and I had to restart it after moving a file out of the way)
now, granted, the initial git clone would have taken a while, but (one time cost) 04:41
Tene and not actually a very significant cost if it was just git.
It's just the git-svn clone that's absurdly long. 04:42
Coke ah.
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bacek_at_work Coke: and you can download prepackaged git-svn repo for parrot. And just update it. 05:00
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Coke (9.944+8.913+8.688)/3 05:05
purl 9.18166666666667
Coke (9.944+8.913+8.688)/3/6
purl 1.53027777777778
Coke 220/8 05:06
purl 27.5
Coke closes one of bacek's old tickets. 05:07
Coke wonders how much time he has lost on the RT->TT conversion. 05:11
s/lost/spent/
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dalek TT #1034 created by coke++: attempt to access code outside of current code segment 05:20
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Coke Andy: ping. 05:29
Andy yessir
Coke Andy: is rt.perl.org/rt3/Ticket/Display.html?id=44041 covered sufficiently by 'make cover' ?
(I know it's not quite the same thing)
Andy Don't know
Coke 44041 is a ticket you opened.
Andy have never looked at macke cover
yes, I know
Coke ah
Andy but I don't know if make cover is sufficient 05:30
Coke are you familiar with the general premise?
Andy but if you think it is ,then go ahead
I'm sure I put that there just as a general "this is a good idea"
Coke I think it is, I'll explain in the ticket.
cover? 05:31
purl i guess cover is not at link?
Coke make cover?
purl hmmm... make cover is running for me, but it fails some tests.
Coke bah.
coverage?
purl hmmm... coverage is cv.perl6.cz
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dalek TT #1035 created by coke++: PIR should allow comments between .param lines 05:55
rrot: r41392 | coke++ | trunk/t/compilers/imcc/syn/regressions.t:
Migrate ticket from RT to TT.
 05:56
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Coke chromatic: ping. 06:05
dalek TT #1036 created by coke++: readonly should be shallow
chromatic pong
Coke is TT #50894 still an issue?
chromatic Yes. 06:06
dalek rrot: r41393 | coke++ | trunk/t/pmc/ro.t:
Migrate ticket from RT to TT
chromatic I can put it on my list to test NotFound's patch. 06:07
Coke feel free to steal it from me. 06:08
dalek TT #1037 created by coke++: throw useful exception on non-quoted non-word characters in PGE
bacek_at_work Coke: which my ticket you've closed? 06:11
Coke ... one of the last 50 or so. 06:13
(MMD slowdowns, as I recall.)
you complained of 27x slowdowns. it's now only 1.5x slower.
dalek tracwiki: v36 | cotto++ | ParrotQuotes
tracwiki: the CLA is serious business
tracwiki: trac.parrot.org/parrot/wiki/Parrot...ction=diff
Coke (funny story about nude pics preserved for posterity on the wiki)-- 06:14
cotto Coke, feel free to delete it. Now that I think about it, it may be best left off the wiki. 06:17
bacek_at_work Coke: it wasn't me. I just bisected it. (And "fixed" in TT#452 :) 06:21
Coke I am downvoting. do as you will.
but left the ticket open, so I'm still blaming you. =-)
bacek_at_work Hey! It's The Architect's ticket! 06:22
dalek TT #1038 created by coke++: Convert Digest::MD5 to object-based implementation 06:35
rrot: r41394 | chromatic++ | trunk/compilers/imcc/main.c:
[IMCC] Fixed runcore flag setting with IMCC optimization options (-t, in
 06:43
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dalek TT #1039 created by coke++: MMD bug in FixedPMCArray.sort 06:45
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dalek TT #1040 created by coke++: inplace math on subclasses failing (MMD/vtable) 06:48
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Coke if someone would like to push us under 200 RTs, you have not much work to do so. 06:49
chromatic There's a weekly goal.
Coke well, there's only 4 left.
so I'd aim a little higher than that. 06:50
chromatic Okay. 150.
Coke doable if everyone would simply resolve or transfer the tickets they already have assigned to them.
transfer to TT, not to another owner on RT.
66 of those tickets were opened by ptc. I bet 80% of those can be rejected after a quick comment deletion. 06:53
chromatic Agreed. 06:54
Coke 66*.8
purl 52.8
Coke 53/66
purl 0.803030303030303
dalek tracwiki: v37 | cotto++ | ParrotQuotes 06:56
tracwiki: delete previous quote: It seemed like a good idea at the time. Now it doesn't.
tracwiki: trac.parrot.org/parrot/wiki/Parrot...ction=diff
TT #1041 created by coke++: pmc2c silently ignores bad code 07:04
rrot: r41395 | coke++ | trunk/docs/pdds/pdd03_calling_conventions.pod:
This already throws a proper exception:
 07:09
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dalek TT #1042 created by coke++: PGE doesn't support angle quotes inside of regexes. 07:14
Coke bacek: is TT#46687 closable? 07:17
dalek TT #1043 created by coke++: create YAML::Emitter::Syck that does what Data::Dumper does. 07:18
bacek_at_work Coke: nope 07:20
Coke ok. you get to transfer it over to TT, then. =-) 07:21
RT now at 199 tickets. 07:22
msg cotto You own RT #36407, 48439; can you either resolve them or reject them and transfer them to TT? 07:23
purl Message for cotto stored.
mikehh i still get t/compilers/imcc/syn/regressions.t hanging on me
Coke mikehh: for me it was a segfault. if it hangs for you, go ahead and skip it for now.
mikehh make test TEST_JOBS=5 run through all the other tests - then just sits there 07:24
Coke msg whiteknight: You own RT #37578, 38432, 48278, and 59628. can you either resolve them or reject them and transfer them to TT?
purl Message for whiteknight stored.
Coke msg kid51 you own 8 RT's - can you either resolve them in place, or reject them and transfer them to TT? 07:25
purl Message for kid51 stored.
Coke msg rurban - I stole your RT's as I expect you're not going to close them out. just FYI. 07:26
purl Message for rurban stored.
mikehh if I run it as perl t/harness t/compilers/imcc/syn/regressions.t it PASSes
Coke mikehh: ok. I'm not going to be able to diagnose it at this hour. =-) 07:27
msg jonathan you own RT #41583 and 46687 - can you either resolve them , or reject them in place and transfer them over to TT? 07:28
purl Message for jonathan stored.
mikehh Coke: I will have a look after I take my grandsons to school
Coke msg pmichaud you own RT's #40002, 44979, 48445, 56186 - can you either resolve them, or reject them in RT and transfer them over to TT? 07:29
purl Message for pmichaud stored.
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bacek_at_work Coke: no way! 07:30
Coke is magical ticket robot
purl: Coke?
purl hmmm... Coke is Will Coleda <mailto:will@coleda.com> or perpetually annoyed.
bacek_at_work purl: Coke is also magical ticket robot 07:31
purl okay, bacek_at_work.
Coke msg allison you own abut 9 RT's: can you either resolve them, or reject them in RT and transfer them over to TT?
purl Message for allison stored.
Coke msg coke go to bed.
purl Message for coke stored.
Coke scooby snack
purl Rank roo, Coke!
Coke messages erase 07:32
bacek_at_work Coke: TT#1042 looks duplicate of TT#837 07:33
Coke If you think so, go ahead and merge them. Thanks. 07:34
(duplicates in TT are better than one in TT and one in RT)
bacek_at_work Actually no. They are related anyway. 07:36
chromatic TT #1025 is because IMCC thinks the long register name is a STRINGCONSTANT. 07:37
Fixing the lexer to allow arbitrary PASM registers... segfaults elsewhere. 07:39
Guess: direct addressing.
Coke chromatic: I thought I mentioned that.
P99 maps to ... P99.
so if you allow P9999999 ... boom.
chromatic Ah. 07:40
I see that in your message now, but I didn't read that into the ticket.
either way: sleep!
Coke chromatic: hokay. 07:44
... or, it's 4am, I could just stay up
(email about rts sent)
Austin Coke, I thought you were on the west coast 07:51
Tene Coke: great job on those tickets. :) 08:01
dalek kudo: adddb73 | moritz++ | build/PARROT_REVISION:
bump PARROT_REVISION to a post-1.6.0 revision to get some testing
 08:03
kudo: 836c8c8 | moritz++ | (2 files):
mention spectest_smolder in README and ChangeLog
moritz jdv79: regarding your recent patch to add spectest_smolder to rakudo... sometimes when I run it nothing seems to happen... what do you think about making the generation of the .tar.gz and the uploading a single step in the Makefile? 08:12
mikehh Coke: I left that make tst running when I went out - it is parrot is now using 3.1GB 08:15
test
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bacek o hai 08:34
dalek a: 16f2b05 | fperrad++ | (2 files):
add dump_paths which introspects the interpreter (dev only)
 08:40
a: 0fd29ff | fperrad++ | (2 files):
add ../languages/lua/library/?.pbc as first path.

   - load languages/lua/library/uuid.pbc which loads library/uuid.pbc
a: 84bc11c | fperrad++ | src/lib/luapackage.pir:
try .pbc before .lua

Now, with previous commit, require 'Test.More' loads
   languages/lua/library/Test/More.pbc
instead of
   library/Test/More.pbc
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Austin Hello again, whiteknight 09:14
Feeling rested and ready to rock the week?
Man, NQP would suck a lot less if it occasionally said "symbol not found" instead of "Null PMC access in invoke()" 09:16
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Whiteknight hello again, Austin 09:18
09:19 TiMBuS joined 09:24 mokurai left
dalek rrot: r41396 | bacek++ | trunk/t/compilers/imcc/syn/regressions.t:
[t] Mark regression with SKIP because it hangs on Linux/i386.
 09:42
rrot: r41397 | bacek++ | trunk (3 files):
[cage][core] Emit additional noop after C<exit> if it's last in sub.
bacek ==2728== ERROR SUMMARY: 10000000 errors from 120 contexts (suppressed: 41 from 1) 09:44
Yay! TEN MILLIONS DOLL^W ERRORS! 09:45
Patterner Always remember: Error - Bad. Dollars - Good. €€€ - Best.
dalek rrot: r41398 | mikehh++ | trunk/t/compilers/imcc/syn/regressions.t:
fix skip and add amd64
 10:08
bacek And here I declare: exception handling in parrot suck big time... 10:13
sigh...
mikehh it's all about stack frames and continuations
bacek Parrot_cx_find_handler_local is just... bad. 10:14
dalek rrot: r41399 | mikehh++ | trunk/compilers/imcc/pcc.c:
codetest faillure - at least one space between keyword and subsequent open parenthesis
 10:17
rrot: r41400 | fperrad++ | trunk/MANIFEST.generated:
[install] add libpaths.pasm
 10:34
TT #811 closed by bacek++: [RFC] Deprecate "new Iterator" form for creating Iterators. 10:37
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mikehh messages 10:45
10:51 MoC joined
MoC When I first opened my Email client today and saw that there were 48 messages being downloaded, my first thought was: "oh noes, the spambots got me again.". Then I realised it was Coke++'s moving of the RT tickets. 10:52
moritz Coke++ the ticketbot 10:54
bacek Coke? 10:57
purl i heard Coke was Will Coleda <mailto:will@coleda.com> or perpetually annoyed. or magical ticket robot or (if Diet), something that turns into formaldehyde in my blood.
bacek "magical ticket bot" :) 10:58
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mikehh All tests PASS (pre/post-config, smoke, nqp_test, fulltest) at r41400 - Ubuntu 9.04 amd64 12:16
partcl r742 builds on parrot r41400 - make test PASS - Ubuntu 9.04 amd64
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mikehh rakudo (836c8c8) builds on parrot r41400 - make test / make spectest (up to 28334) PASS - Ubuntu 9.04 amd64 12:25
jdv79 moritz: did you alter the patch at all? i just noticed it myself. i'll look into it. 12:35
moritz jdv79: no, I applied as-is
jdv79 its odd cause i had the changes just local and it was solid for something like 2 weeks 12:36
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Coke msg austin I am basically in Albany, NY 12:50
purl Message for austin stored.
dalek TT #1044 created by doughera++: Configure.pl relies too heavily on perl5 ccflags settings. 12:58
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Coke doughera++ 13:04
jdv79 moritz: :) 13:06
moritz: uh, the leading tabs are missing from those 2 targets. probably my fault. Could you push that change through:) 13:10
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moritz jdv79: yes, will 13:12
do
jdv79 thanks
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dalek kudo: 0eaf628 | moritz++ | build/Makefile.in:
unbreak the whitespaces in Makefile.in (spaces -> tabs)
 13:34
TT #1045 created by doughera++: #53494: [BUG] --parrot_is_shared=0 IS shared?
TT #1046 created by doughera++: Configure.pl allows sizeof(INTVAL) != sizeof(void *), but parrot requires ... 13:45
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Coke is the exec core gone? 14:00
14:05 Andy joined 14:14 jsut|work joined 14:16 PacoLinux joined
jrtaylor Coke, If you mean "has the code been removed?", no. If you mean "Is it working?", I don't know. 14:22
whiteknight the exec core really needs to be removed, I think 14:25
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jrtayloriv whiteknight, Why? (just out of curiousity) 14:37
whiteknight As I understand it, it is related to the JIT core
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JimmyZ refactor++ 14:53
karma refactor 14:54
purl refactor has karma of 1
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cotto_w0rk git++ 15:32
pmichaud good morning, #parrot
whiteknight good morning pmichaud 15:33
moritz good morning #pm
mikehh All tests PASS (pre/post-config, smoke, nqp_test, fulltest) at r41400, Ubuntu 9.04 i386 15:49
15:52 chromatic joined
Coke wonders if there is an svn-git. 15:55
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dukelet0 Coke: svn-git should be possible, but I don't think anybody has been insane enough to write it 16:11
Infinoid There's tailor, for the sufficiently motivated.
mikehh rakudo (0eaf628) builds on parrot r41400 - make test / make spectest (up to 28337) PASS - Ubuntu 9.04 i386 16:12
Infinoid dukelet0: Got your message. If you add it to trac.parrot.org/parrot/wiki/Languages, dalek will magically start tracking it 16:13
mikehh partcl r742 builds on parrot r41400 - make test PASS - Ubuntu 9.04 i386 16:14
Infinoid (just a link to the project page is all dalek needs)
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dalek tracwiki: v18 | coke++ | GitObjections 16:34
tracwiki: Feel free to format my comments to fit the style of the page.
tracwiki: trac.parrot.org/parrot/wiki/GitObj...ction=diff
pmichaud coke: if I understand correctly, HLL *development* is supposed to track parrot releases also 16:35
(I agree that this doesn't work for most of us, but that's the way I've been led to understand things, on multiple occasions) 16:36
in fact, as allison proposed to me for Rakudo Star: 16:37
"Rakudo releases after Parrot 2.0 are developed against Parrot 2.0
instead of Parrot trunk/release-of-the-month.
Coke pmichaud: that's the theory. it just doesn't work. 16:38
pmichaud Coke: I agree entirely that it doesn't work. 16:39
Coke so I'm just noting that it doesn't work, for the record. =-)
pmichaud fair enough.
however, it bugs me that we'll say "we can't switch to git because HLL's are doing something we don't support". It seems contradictory to so many of our other policies. 16:40
Coke I have no idea who said that.
this wiki page is probably full of strawmen on both sides.
pmichaud that's objection #7, essentially
Coke (which is why I signed my comments)
pmichaud also, I'm wondering why there are separate #6 and #7. TO me they're the same issue. 16:41
Coke slightly different. 16:42
pmichaud yes, I see the difference now.
one is the fact of switching the repository itself, the other is switching the linear nature of tracking trunk.
Coke for # 7, I'm willing to just say "meh"
pmichaud same here.
Coke for # 6, that's just a documentation update for my users.
(and maybe a small changes to a helper make target or config script.) 16:43
pmichaud I'll add my comments/updates after lunch.
Coke oh, I remember an oft-heard objection.
(windows) 16:44
dalek tracwiki: v19 | coke++ | GitObjections 16:45
tracwiki: add 'windows' objection.
tracwiki: trac.parrot.org/parrot/wiki/GitObj...ction=diff
Coke rebooting to test tortoisegit... 16:47
jsut|work search adamprime
bloops :o
szbalint en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Git_(software)
dukelet0 Infinoid: thanks! 16:48
szbalint someone added Parrot to the list of git using software
:)
(projects)
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dalek tracwiki: v99 | dukeleto++ | Languages 16:49
tracwiki: trac.parrot.org/parrot/wiki/Langua...ction=diff
dukelet0 coke: are you spreading FUD about windows+git ? ;) 16:50
Tene whiteknight: Is there already or can you make a ticket describing the IO refactors that need to happen? 16:58
whiteknight Tene: yes, I've been meaning to do that. Haven't had time 16:59
I'll try to get the wiki page updated today
Tene whiteknight: Thank you. Can you ping me when you've done it? 17:00
Coke dukelet0: ... I suppose technically, yes.
whiteknight Tene: sure thing
dalek tracwiki: v20 | dukeleto++ | GitObjections 17:01
tracwiki: trac.parrot.org/parrot/wiki/GitObj...ction=diff
Coke dukelet0: have you used tortoisegit? 17:02
dukelet0 Coke: no. I don't have any windows dev boxes.
Coke: is it decent? i never used tortoiseSVN either 17:03
Coke tortoisesvn has some nice qualities.
whiteknight I use tortoisesvn at work and I like it
it integrates very nicely with the windows shell, so you right-click on things and select commands ("commit", "update", etc) 17:04
Coke tortoisegit requires msysgit. 17:06
and I can't get to github directly. from this box. will try again from home later. 17:07
tortoisegit?
tortoisegit is code.google.com/p/tortoisegit/
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cotto_work The tricky thing about that page is that it'll be tricky to mark objections as suffuciently addressed without knowing who raised which point. 17:09
(referring to GitObjections)
dalek tracwiki: v21 | cotto++ | GitObjections 17:10
tracwiki: mark objection #6</a> as addressed
tracwiki: trac.parrot.org/parrot/wiki/GitObj...ction=diff
dukelet0 cotto_work: we can attempt to color code
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cotto_work But what colors will we use? 17:11
;)
Coke cotto, how are your RT tickets coming? =-) 17:12
dukelet0 cotto_work: we can bikeshed about which colors to paint the brushes that we use to paint the bikeshed 17:14
cotto_work Coke, thanks for the poke. I'll look at them later today. 17:15
Coke wow, leo is still on the "most opened tickets" list on RT.
rt.perl.org/rt3/NoAuth/parrot/Overview.html for various ways of getting lists of tickets that are 10 or less and therefore make good blocks to work on. =-) 17:16
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Coke 194 RT 17:24
dalek a: 3867b6a | fperrad++ | src/lib/luapackage.pir:
Revert "try .pbc before .lua"
 17:25
a: 9ac0782 | fperrad++ | (7 files):
remove some :init modifiers
a: 497ce1b | fperrad++ | (4 files):
try to load .pbc before an existing .lua
a: c22b9ed | fperrad++ | test_lex.pir:
remove languages/lua prefix in some paths
a: cf55054 | fperrad++ | src/ (2 files):
now generate load_language
a: 174bdc3 | fperrad++ | src/lib/luaaux.pir:
load_bytecode with an absolute path.

   Test/More.pbc (compiler from Lua)
and
   parrot/library/Test/More.pbc
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dalek TT #1047 created by doughera++: [CAGE] pf_items assumes sizeof(INTVAL) == sizeof(opcode_t) 17:28
17:34 zak_ joined
cotto_work #ps in 1494 17:36
17:37 mberends joined
cotto_work you're welcome 17:37
dalek a: eea640a | fperrad++ | config/makefiles/root.in:
fix target clean
TT #1048 created by doughera++: [TODO] Configure.pl needs a has_function() function. 17:39
whiteknight probably won't be at #ps tomorrow 17:52
I may have to post my report around 5am EST
dalek TT #1049 created by doughera++: [TODO] replace the value for $(MAKE) with the actual path ...
Coke doughera++ 17:56
dalek TT #1050 created by doughera++: [TODO] [C] Use strerror_r instead of strerror 18:00
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dalek TT #1051 created by pmichaud++: [TODO] NQP should report use of undeclared variable 18:51
pmichaud okay, that closes out all of the RT/parrot tickets I owned. :) 18:52
dukelet0 stands back and watches the RTpocalypse 19:02
dalek TT #1052 created by pmichaud++: [TODO] Add --target=pbc to HLLCompiler 19:03
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dalek kudo: 798ea1c | pmichaud++ | docs/spectest-progress.csv:
spectest-progress.csv update: 436 files, 15498 (71.4% of 21695) pass, 0 fail
 19:22
19:38 Zak joined
Coke RT: 184 19:42
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Tene So, can anyone tell me what the purpose/policy is for the examples/ directory? It seems like there's some useful stuff in there that doesn't get installed at all. Can I just move it to runtime/library/ ? 19:53
Coke if it's actually usable as a library, I don't see a problem with that, except: then we have to support it. =-) 19:54
Tene SQLite3 was the earlier example. 19:55
Mysql is the one I'm currently looking at.
I guess this should really go in the "extra libs" thing that japhb was working on, whatever we ended up naming it...
NotFound Tene: I asked at #ps months ago, rejected because it was not enough mature nor complete... and still isn't. 19:56
Coke tene (extra libs) +1 here 19:57
Tene NotFound: so what's the plan for libraries like this?
There was that big thread about aviary, and then japhb did some work, but didn't finish what he was working on yet, I think...
NotFound Tene: the plan is to use it, yes. 19:58
And move out of core some non core libs, like sqlite 19:59
Tene So if I want to make SQL libraries available, I should work on figuring out and helping to complete the aviary thing.
Coke last I heard on aviary, japhb got sucked into the #toolchain discussion. 20:00
darbelo You make it sound like he got hit by a bus. 20:01
NotFound For simple modules like MySql, maybe a short pir or nqp utility can be enough. Take the pir file, put it in the library directory and compile it to pbc.
20:02 geoff joined 20:03 geoff left
Tene purl: msg japhb Can I get an update on the aviary and toolchain stuff, and what I can help with? 20:07
purl Message for japhb stored.
mberends Tene for aviary do you mean gitorious.org/parrot-plumage ? 20:09
Tene mberends: Maybe. I havne't been paying as much attention as I should have. 20:10
That looks right, though. 20:11
... eww 20:13
I run 'make' in that directory, and it tries to run: /home/sweeks/git/rakudo/parrot_install/bin/parrot
NotFound Tene: is a prototype. looks like you need to edit the Makefile manually to configure it. 20:22
20:22 bacek joined, japhb joined
nopaste "tene" at 97.117.70.208 pasted "I'm not so good with make... I assume this is unacceptable for some reason?" (16 lines) at nopaste.snit.ch/18017 20:23
Tene hi japhb
japhb: I just pasted a patch for plumage's Makefile. Can you tell me why that won't work? 20:24
darbelo Tene: that doesn't work if parrot_config isn't reachable in $PATH 20:26
And i'm not sure `` works on windows.
Tene Ah.
darbelo The standard solution seems to be /tools/dev/gen_makefile.pl 20:27
NotFound darbelo: And that is supposed to be in PATH? 20:29
Tene hehe
bacek Good morning 20:31
purl And good moroning to you, bacek.
darbelo That let's you reference parrot config itms in your makefile automagically, without caring about paths.
Tene I guess make doesn't have a way of doing that, so we need a configure script. :P
japhb *rez*
reading back
darbelo Tene: Yes, that is what I was implying with gen_makefile.pl
Tene darbelo: but how can you use gen_makefile.pl without first locating the parrot directories? 20:32
japhb is now caught up ... I think
darbelo You ask nicely to be told where they are? 20:33
japhb Tene: I had planned to do a Plumage hack day yesterday, but a $day_job deadline intervened 20:34
General state of Plumage (higher level than in TODO):
20:35 kyle_l5l joined
japhb * Getting to the actual hacking. Trying to make it go through a fetch-through-install cycle for Blizkost. 20:35
* Lots of stuff is hackish right now, because I have been getting bogged down with problems, and don't want to delay the project any further to try to get "perfect" when instead I could get it "working". 20:36
* Help de-hackifying greatly appreciated.
dukelet0 japhb: what is the relation between plumage and blizkost ?
darbelo Tene: right now I'm rewriting the decnum-dynpmcs Configure in PIR, I get the various parrot paths with 'load_bytecode "config.pbc"' 20:37
Coke (getting info from parrot config) check out partcl or rakudo's Configure.pl's parrot-config options.
japhb dukelet0: Blizkost is: a) cool, b) potentially useful, c) requires non-trivial work to fetch, build, and install, d) has external dependencies, so I can think about that problem with a real task in front of me, rather than "in theory" 20:38
dalek TT #1053 created by bacek++: [TODO] Allow Parrot Hashes to have PMC keys
dukelet0 japhb: i hack on blizkost, so I know that it is cool ;) Let me know if I can be of service
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japhb dukelet0, will do, thank you. 20:38
Tene japhb: would it be feasible to get SQLite3.pir and Mysql.pir somewhere where plumage could download and install them to the right place? 20:39
shockwave At docs.parrot.org, some paragraphs refer the user to see "table x-y". Where are these tables?
For instance, this page: docs.parrot.org/parrot/latest/html/...s.pod.html
at the very bottom; the last line.
japhb Tene: yes, that would be an excellent idea. And trying to create the correct metadata JSON for those would help me think about places the metadata spec is lacking. 20:40
Tene japhb: Great. I'd love to help you with this.
japhb Tene, Also, my makefile skills are limited to "just slightly more than cargo culting". Brains applied there greatly appreciated.
Tene OK. :)
japhb Oh and ... writing a configure script for it, in NQP? Pretty much rockin' help right there. 20:41
;-)
NotFound Please don't put MySql.pir in a git repository
japhb NotFound, I was thinking RCS ... ;-P
NotFound, but seriously, no fear. Plumage *must* be able to deal with a lot of different ways to fetch the code. From tarball to git, and everything in between. 20:42
Tene NotFound: as it is, in examples/, it's not installed, can't be used, etc. Your'e objecting to me putting a copy somewhere where people can start using it?
NotFound: or are you saying something about git specifically?
Or objecting to it being out of parrot's repo at all?
NotFound Tene: I just like to have it in a place I can work easily. 20:43
japhb I think the "out of parrot's repo" ship has just about left port. Allison seems adamant about stripping the libs to the metal. Just enough to bootstrap plumage, actually.
pmichaud I agree with that, fwiw 20:44
NotFound japhb: And just in a local directory?
japhb NotFound, you mean, as a place to fetch the code from? Sure, why not? It's just another url scheme. 20:45
Tene NotFound: So you're just saying that wherever I put it, you don't really care, just please don't use git?
NotFound Tene: yeah
japhb chuckles
Tene NotFound: Okay. The main Parrot repo isn't really an option, afaict, so where would you like to host DB libraries for Parrot? 20:46
Do you expect to care to work on any db libs besides mysql?
mberends japhb: please remind me where you blog about Plumage
Tene There's a blog, too?
japhb u.p.o. Except the journals fracking bit it last week. 20:47
But there were a number of them, yes.
Tene japhb: is there a reason that your blog isn't on planet.parrotcode.org ?
Coke shockwave: in the raw PIR, I see:
Table 7-1 shows the introspection characteristics supported by
C<inspect>.
=begin table Class Introspection
Tene japhb: upo username?
japhb I asked for it to be added in here, but unfortunately I think whoever I talked to (I forget who) forgot about it. Ah, Irony. 20:48
Coke ... so I'm guessing that the pod2html translator has lost the tables.
japhb Tene: geoffrey
Coke if you could open a ticket at trac.parrot.org/ about that, I'd appreciate it.
NotFound Tene: I wrote the MySql because I have some familiarity with MySql API, and like to keep working on it just because I started. Other than that, no special interest in DB.
japhb
.oO( I think my afternoon just got hijacked for a good cause .... )
Coke japhb: you were added.
it just never worked, as i recall. 20:49
Tene NotFound: OK. Please tell me where I can put a repository such that you'll continue to work on it?
Coke please piggyback on dukeleto's trac ticket.
japhb wonders why one's own thoughts actually often start with "I think", as redundant as that is ...
Coke (or open a new one)
japhb Coke, Ah. Sigh.
Coke japhb: you need to self-actualize.
Tene japhb: disclaiming certainty.
Coke ->
japhb heh
mberends thinks it makes sense
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NotFound Tene: the quick solution may be svn.parrot.org/modules or something like that. 20:50
japhb Anyone know A) a way to get my post data out of u.p.o right now, and B) a Really Fine Place to put it?
I don't really have the spare cycles to write a blogging engine and set it up somewhere, which is what I would have done 10 years ago .... 20:51
Tene Isn't there some blogging thing associated with parrot.org? 20:52
japhb I know there's a planet (clearly), but I didn't know of an actual place to post.
Tene Do I have privileges to make svn.parrot.org/modules/ ? 20:53
NotFound Tene: I don't know 20:54
Tene :)
japhb Oh, Tene: A quick hybrid of our ideas for the makefile would be useful. I think I'll still define PARROT_BIN manually, but from there find parrot_config, and find the rest of the locations from that, if I can. That at least reduces the surface area of the config problem. 20:55
japhb goes to hack that in ....
oh wait, someone pointed out `` is not portable.
Damn. Doesn't make have something portable for this?
Some interpolation hell? (Why does every tool have to define it's own interpolation syntax?!) 20:56
Tene japhb: I don't think it does... hence the persistent need for configure scripts.
darbelo japhb: You need a configure script to take care of that for you. 20:57
japhb Sure, to find the PARROT_BIN. But really, there's no `` equivalent? That's ... well, dumb. 20:58
Tene Yeah.
japhb Not to put too fine a point on it.
darbelo Dumb like the tabs and spaces thing? Yeah, sounds like make. 20:59
japhb cringes
dukelet0 Tene: yes, if you have an account on parrot.org, you should be able make posts 21:03
Tene Looks like nqp doesn't have an 'open' function...
japhb Does parrot require a particular make (or a certain limited set) to build?
Tene dukelet0: japhb is looking for a place to host his blog posts.
japhb: looks like NQP doesn't have 'open' and friends... inline PIR!
japhb Tene, Any time I need a "builtin", I've just been copying the relevant code from Rakudo and editing to fit, or writing my own with raw PIR ... in either case, that's what Glue.pir is for. 21:04
Tene nodnod
japhb There are a couple places I tried to clean things up a bit since the original code was clearly hacked on a bit, and a couple other places where I drop the niceties. 21:05
Tene japhb: are we avoiding depending on Perl 5?
dukelet0 Tene: i am sure there are other options, but I can give japhb a login to post to leto.net/perl/ or make another blog if he wants a whole blog to himself
Tene dukelet0: perhaps you should direct that to japhb. ;) 21:06
dukelet0 Tene: indeed
japhb dukelet0: Nobody here should have to do any work for this. I had only asked if someone had a recommendation for a good, solid "actually stays up" blogging host. (And if anyone knew of a way to recover the u.p.o posts, or if they were just gone.) 21:07
Goodness knows all the people here have enough tasks to deal with, without me adding to the pile. :-)
dukelet0 japhb: i run my own instance of movable type that can host any number of blogs. It mostly stays out of my way.
japhb Well, if it's pretty reliably up all the time, then sure, make me a fresh new one, and I'll start there next time I do a Plumage post. 21:09
darbelo japhb: Parrot builds fine on most makes, but it uses makfile templates that the gen_makefile turns into full makfiles with data gathered in the configure steps. 21:12
japhb pmichaud, I vaguely recall you and Allison disagreeing about whether gen_makefile was kosher to rely on ... whatever happened with that discussion? 21:13
darbelo It's installed with install-dev, and parrot itself depends on it. 21:14
pmichaud I decided that Rakudo didn't want to rely on gen_makefile, so it doesn't.
we'll do our own makefile generation
in particular, I'm not sure that I'd trust that Parrot's gen_makefile api won't change :) 21:15
japhb ah
darbelo pmichaud: What do you use for makefile generation?
pmichaud darbelo: we do it in our Configure.pl.... but it's much simpler than Parrot's generation 21:16
darbelo So, perl 5?
purl rumour has it So, perl 5 is fucked
pmichaud yes, perl 5
it might be entirely possible for me to rewrite it in nqp, though :)
japhb pmichaud, I think I may end up effectively prototyping that for you. 21:17
japhb reading the GNU Make manual and just getting the heebie-jeebies. ("Seriously, you guys are looking *down* on other make systems?") 21:18
darbelo japhb: "nmake" and that's all I'm sayin' 21:20
japhb oooh! Oooh! There's a 'shell' function: contents := $(shell cat foo) 21:21
Anyone who speaks nmake, gmake, et al. -- is that function supported?
NotFound Oh, nice. mysql library gets confused by parrot list_delete function. 21:22
darbelo japhb: Portably, I seriously doubt it.
japhb decides that Google, may, in fact, be his friend today. 21:23
shockwave @Coke, thanks for the info about the table issue. I can't create a ticket because I don't have a trac login. 21:24
darbelo make was created to manage dependencies in the "Oh, you touched this, you'll need to rebuild that as well" way. Everything else is non-portable, a horrible hack or both. 21:25
japhb OK, BSD make has an equivalent concept, using the != assignment operator 21:26
pmichaud anyway, the issue I had with parrot's gen_makefile is that the code is _really_ hard to understand and modify
also, I can imagine that someone will someday need to do something in makefiles that parrot's gen_makefile doesn't quite support
japhb nodnod
pmichaud so I wanted a simpler version that can generate makefiles without having all of those parrot dependencies 21:27
Tene japhb: you could also have a generator that loaded config.pbc itself.
pmichaud (and that someone could understand relatively quickly that didn't require knowledge of parrot's entire makefile config subsystem, which is pretty complex) 21:28
japhb Tene: Plumage does exactly that. But then we have a bootstrapping issue.
pmichaud, makes sense
Tene japhb: make a .pir and assume that the user knows how to invoke parrot on it?
and the .pir spits out a makefile.
or we go back to the parrot --whatevermagic=nqp configure.nqp 21:29
which is NYI and NYS etc.
pmichaud I'm still planning ot make nqp into a fakecutable and installing it as parrot_nqp
then it would just be parrot_nqp configure.nqp 21:30
japhb pmichaud, yes. Please.
mberends japhb: found use.perl.org/~geoffrey/journal/39622 21:31
japhb mberends, Oooh. I CAN HAZ UPO NOW?
NotFound What must be the subsystem prefix for list.c functions? Parrot_lst ? 21:32
pmichaud anyway, Rakudo's makefile generation is Configure.pl lines 164-186
japhb pulls a current Rakudo 21:33
pmichaud oh, one can also look at the source directly on github :-) 21:34
github.com/rakudo/rakudo
github.com/rakudo/rakudo/tree/mast...nfigure.pl
japhb yes, but in a couple minutes I will have a current perl6 binary. This is *so* worth the wait. ;-)
dalek TT #1054 created by shockwave++: Some documents at docs.parrot.org are missing data. 21:35
shockwave @Coke, I didn't realize registration for trac was open.
japhb pmichaud, OK, I call shenanicgans on lines 174-175. What is going on there? 21:46
Or rather, why are you doing it (and doing it that way)? 21:47
Why would an http: URI contain any backslashes at all? 21:48
pmichaud because the previous line converted allof the slashes into backslashes
fwiw, this is the way that Parrot's gen_makefile handles the situation as well :)
i.e., we stole that logic from Parrot :)
japhb oh. duh. 21:49
OK, as soon as I add music to this office, I'll hack up an NQP of create_makefile() for Plumage, and mayhaps some of it will be worth using for Rakudo. 21:51
Anyone know offhand where to get the running parrot and/or fakecutable's path from PIR? 21:52
darbelo japhb: Put it somwhere I can steal it for decnum-dynpmcs. 21:53
Tene japhb: ask it to load config.pbc 21:54
darbelo load_bytecode "config.pbc"; conf = _config(); conf['bindir']; would be my guess.
japhb
.oO( Ah, headphones are *so* much better than the tinny speakers in the wife's laptop .... )
darbelo, no problem 21:55
darbelo japhb: another thing, you'll want to use @cp@, @mv@, @rm@, @rm_r@ and friends in your makefile, that way it will expand into whatever the current platform uses for copying, moving, deleting, etc without you having to think about it. 21:56
japhb nod, nod. 21:57
In fact, I'm just going to combine your advice with Tene's and directly use the Parrot config items, if those are listed therein.
pmichaud fwiw, Rakudo will probably stick with the Perl 5 version of its build tools 21:58
We don't carry the "get rid of Perl 5 at all costs" sentiment that Parrot sometimes seems to exhibit
darbelo japhb: Exactly. Under the current system @whatever@ get's replaced with conf['whatever'] 21:59
japhb pmichaud, Plumage is a prisoner of its purpose. :-) 22:00
Coke shockwave++ #more tickets. 22:01
darbelo FWIW, I don't mind that parrot needs perl 5 to bootstrap itself, but I would prefer that my parrot-based project only depend on parrot.
pmichaud I'll be very happy if nqp can fill that niche. Indeed, it's somewhat intended to do exactly that :) 22:02
(and I'm working to increase that intent )
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japhb pmichaud, excellent. 22:12
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dalek rrot: r41401 | NotFound++ | trunk/examples/nci/Mysql.pir:
[examples] minimal fix in MySql;Statement prepare - Still not working because of symbol name conflicts between parrot and mysql libs
 22:19
japhb pmichaud, it looks like I can modify Rakudo's regex subst implementation (line 723 and following in src/builtins/any-str.pir) for my purposes. Where is the canonical code for instantiating the regex in the first place? src/parser/quote_expression.pir seems a bit ... self-referential ... on this topic. 22:29
pmichaud regexes are just quoted strings 22:30
if you're planning to pull Rakudo's regex parsing into NQP, I should warn that all of it is about to be tossed aside in the next two weeks
japhb pmichaud, no, I just wanted to know how I could instantiate the *Regex PMC needed to do subst(string: sub, string) 22:32
pmichaud I don't understan *Regex PMC 22:33
japhb Figured there might be some special stuff I had to do to set it up. I was looking at the Rakudo guts for inspiration
pmichaud are you just asking how you copmile a regex?
japhb pmichaud, the thing you can do .'!invoke'(string) on.
Yes, I think os.
er so
pmichaud from PIR: 22:34
$P0 = compreg 'PGE::Perl6Regex'
$P1 = $P0.compile('regex'); # I think
then $P1 is a sub that you can invoke on a string to be matched 22:35
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japhb Ah! That's way less of a pain than I expected. 22:35
pmichaud I'm not sure if it's $P0.'compile'('regex') or just $P0('regex')
eventually it'll be the former, but I don't know if we've made that switch yet.
(given that PGE comes from before we had compiler objects)
japhb OK. 22:36
darbelo japhb: I think you might have some competition. github.com/flh/genfile/
japhb Yeah, that's why I expected craziness.
pmichaud well, the craziness is more "simplification"
i.e., PGE provides a less sophisticated interface
japhb nodnod. (I didn't mean that in a negative sense, actually. Just meant that I expected to have to do a few contortions to get the sub I wanted.) 22:37
pmichaud right, I didn't take it negative 22:38
japhb darbelo: from a day ago? *chuckle*
pmichaud, ah, good.
darbelo just saw it in the backlog. 22:39
japhb chuckles that github.com/flh/genfile/blob/master/Makefile does a bunch of $(shell $(PARROT_CONFIG) ...) calls. 22:40
I think I still have a purpose. :-)
darbelo The thing starts at irclog.perlgeek.de/parrot/2009-09-20#i_1518892
japhb I think what I'm writing is what he would use to bootstrap his code. 22:41
darbelo I haven't really looked at the code, I was just noticing the similarity of intent. 22:43
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darbelo NotFound: ping 22:59
Austin Speaking of configuration data... How do I access configuration stuff from withing an installed parrot?
darbelo Austin: in PIR?
Austin Darbelo, yes, pir or nqp
I want to get things like the installed directory, where my language files are, etc. 23:00
darbelo PIR: load_bytecode "config.pbc"; conf = _config(); conf['whatever'];
Austin Okay. Is that info the same as %PConfig in perl?
darbelo where conf is a string.
Yes, and the same that the parrot_config binary outputs. 23:01
Austin Perfect. And is there some mechanism for adding / installing to it?
In other words, the "load_language" opcode pretends that it knows about the special language-specific dirs. Is it just using config['lib_dir']/$language_name, or is there something more sinister at work? 23:02
darbelo 'tis all pretend. 23:03
Austin :(
darbelo I think. 23:04
Austin It's cruel to lie to children...
FWIW, japhb, it was kind of interesting to see what flh was willing to do, in terms of manhandling the innards of the compiler, to get his stuff set up. Sub-classing grammars, a new compiler phase, etc. 23:05
japhb What's the reason for the root_new opcode? Is it a semantic disambiguation, or a performance optimization, or ...?
Austin Root_new because otherwise crossing hll's is too hard.
japhb "too hard"? 23:06
darbelo A workarround for some bug people were relying on. IIRC
japhb darbelo, oh. ew.
I guess I'll use it then.
Austin Too many instructions, too much checking.
japhb Austin, that sounds like an optimization
Austin Sure. Just like the PPSU opcodes, and a host of others. 23:07
But more like "supporting a common case" than prematurely optimizing. A lot of HLLs will want to use Parrot stuff, which is an xhll operation - root_new. 23:08
dalek TT #1055 created by jkeenan++: t/pmc/complex.t: sinh_of_complex_numbers: some tests fail on Win32 23:09
japhb Oh, I didn't claim it was premature. Just trying to understand its *purpose*.
Austin I think it falls out of the problem where PMCs are globally visible - that is, {{{ $P0 = new 'Hash' }}} always creates a parrot::Hash 23:10
Which meant that PMC names weren't namespace-ified, so there could be only one 'Hash', etc. 23:11
(PerlHash, TclInteger, yech)
Tene but if I have a Hash class in the current non-parrot HLL...
exactly
Austin So now it's {{{ $P0 = root_new [ 'parrot' ; 'Hash' ] }}}
darbelo msg NotFound Tried your patch for TT#1009, it still segfaults. 23:12
purl Message for notfound stored.
japhb ah so
Austin pmichaud added it back around YAPC time-frame
Man, I wish I was smarter. 23:15
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bacek_at_work darbelo: (TT#1009) is it segfaulting in trunk? 23:18
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darbelo bacek_at_work: nope, works like a charm. 23:19
Just closed the ticket too. 23:20
dalek TT #1009 closed by darbelo++: examples/shootout/spectralnorm.pir shows a segfault in the continuation ... 23:21
darbelo There, see?
bacek_at_work darbelo: :) 23:22
darbelo bacek++
Thank to you I might just see what a succesful make fulltest looks like :) 23:23
bacek_at_work darbelo: Yay!
Austin Wow! I just discovered something new about NotePad++ - draggable separate windows. 23:24
bacek_at_work But NotFound's solution was better. I'll try to check why it doesn't work.
cotto_work karma notepad
purl notepad has karma of 32
cotto_work karma notepad++ 23:25
purl notepad++ has karma of 2
bacek_at_work Austin: there is only 2 editors :)
Austin Bacek: There is only one editor. All others are impostors, or maybe just notepad programs.
darbelo bacek_at_work: Segfault is the same with NotFound's patch. Which it shouldn't be, but it is. 23:26
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dalek TT #1056 created by jkeenan++: inter::progs ought to be smarter about finding linker 23:28
TT #1009 reopened by chromatic++: examples/shootout/spectralnorm.pir shows a segfault in the continuation ...
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