pugs.blogs.com | pugscode.org | pugs.kwiki.org | paste: sial.org/pbot/perl6 | <stevan> Moose... it's the new Camel ":P | .pmc == PPI source filters!
Set by Alias_ on 16 March 2006.
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rbysamppi Can you method-call a multisub? multi f (Int $x: Int $z) { ... }; f 2: 3 00:30
audreyt yes, but that's a fallback 00:33
if method dispatch fails
it pretends you did
f(2, 3)
i.e. if 2.f() can't be found
Arathorn hum 00:34
prelude compiling seems to be broken - on the range operator
in push @rv, (~ $start)..(~ $end);
(line 412 of src/perl6/Prelude.pm) 00:35
Arathorn investigates as best he can
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Arathorn whee, this is rather fun 00:49
losing the char '.' >> notFollowedBy (char '.') in #10167 is the kicker... 00:50
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Arathorn bah, i don't understand parsec well enough 01:17
(assuming this is parsec)
aufrank Arathorn++ just for chasing it down :) 01:38
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Arathorn Arathorn-- for not having a clue what he's doing, though 01:56
Arathorn defers in favour of playing with Judy, which has the advantage of being written in a language i speak :) 01:57
aufrank have you looked at the "Build a Scheme in 48 hours" tutorial?
it has a good parsec crash course
Arathorn will - although tomorrow, at this rate 01:58
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schneiker I'd like to help with Perl6, but don't have much spare time. 02:41
In the course of searching for scattered Perl6 info,
I thought about starting a "perl.perl6.using"
group on Google Groups, with the following focus:
"Information exchange for using Perl 6.
The most useful info and resource links are added to a
weekly-updated "Using Perl 6 FAQ" posting. Topics include:
getting started with Perl 6, incremental migration from Perl 5,
developing Perl 6 tools, what early adapters are doing, etc.
Apparently I cannot do this directly through Google Groups.
I get this error message: "This group name is not suitable.
You cannot start a group name to be similar to a Usenet group."
However my newserver doesn’t show "perl.perl6.*" as part of
the Usenet newsgroup hierarchy (versus just in nttp.perl.org)
My search efforts haven't turned up any helpful info.
Information, feedback welcome.
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FurnaceBoy_ 'similar' though 02:49
who knows what their actual rules are. Try not using a '.'
just "Perl6 Users"
should be okay?
sanxiyn Interesting to see Pugs relicensing. I use this license myself: 02:50
FurnaceBoy_ a.k.a. BSD
FurnaceBoy_ is only joking
you could just say public domain
sanxiyn FurnaceBoy_: It's more fun this way. 02:51
FurnaceBoy_ more swearing involved, if that's your thing
sanxiyn Official homepage of WTFPL is here: sam.zoy.org/wtfpl/
FurnaceBoy_ I came across this one recently:
* ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 02:52
* "THE BEER-WARE LICENSE" (Revision 42):
* [email@hidden.address] wrote this file. As long as you retain this notice you
* can do whatever you want with this stuff. If we meet some day, and you think
* this stuff is worth it, you can buy me a beer in return. Poul-Henning Kamp
* ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
schneiker "Perl6 Users" should be OK, but I'd like to see it grouped with other "perl.perl6.*"
FurnaceBoy_ impossible schneiker.
you could, however, propose an addition to Usenet.
that would be about 100x more difficult however.
Usenet is a tree owned by root and not world writable;-)
and I think the rules are there to prevent exactly what you propose 02:53
if you want to augment Usenet, go through that procedure, but it will take longer
sanxiyn FurnaceBoy_: alt.* hierarchy is easier to get in.
FurnaceBoy_ true.
but that wouldn't have the ring of officiality that schneiker seems to be pursuing. 02:54
sanxiyn FurnaceBoy_: Big 8 needs voting.
FurnaceBoy_ notes 'officiality' isn't a word. sorry.
yes, I know.
depends on whether he wants quick'n'easy, or Usenet :)
sanxiyn One can read www.eyrie.org/~eagle/faqs/big-eight.html and start the process. 02:55
schneiker I got Usenet to add comp.lang.ruby, years ago, but it took several months.
However perl.perl6.* does not appear to be part of actual Usenet hierarchy.
That's why I was puzzled.
FurnaceBoy_ whatever way you cut it, a random Google Group is easier. which is why there are a zillion of them.
sanxiyn File RFD to news.announce.newsgroups...
FurnaceBoy_ find its owners schneiker
but I warn you, this way will take work and commitment
compared to opening a random GG 02:56
the result may be worth it ...
are there no perl6 groups in perl.* ?
FurnaceBoy_ goes looking
sanxiyn I still prefer Yahoo! Groups to Google Groups actually.
FurnaceBoy_ only uses Usenet
sanxiyn FurnaceBoy_: I also use Gmane. 02:57
FurnaceBoy_ ck
worst web interface ever.
sanxiyn FurnaceBoy_: Well, it has NNTP too.
FurnaceBoy_ thanks Allah
I can;t believe nobody has called them on it
in all these years
maybe all the sane people just use NNTP
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sanxiyn FurnaceBoy_: I only use search.gmane.org from the web interface. 02:58
FurnaceBoy_ schneiker, yeah, there seems an opening for a 'general' group under perl.perl6.*
sanxiyn (Which I found to work better than Google for some cases.)
FurnaceBoy_ you could probably find a way to propose one.
aufrank I'm pretty sure Larry mentioned something about being to able to help in getting that process off the ground 02:59
FurnaceBoy_ perl.perl6.using doesn't seem to have any precedent though... I mean 'using'
there must be a better word
aufrank but I could be imagining things
FurnaceBoy_ yes, TimToady could surely help
if anyone can
schneiker, pounce on TimToady about this
but I suggest a better word than 'using'
general has precedents in Usenet
schneiker FurnaceBoy: OK. I like general better. 03:01
FurnaceBoy: Recommended means to "pounce on TimToady about this"? 03:05
(I'm brand new to IRC, although I have been skimming logs for a while.)
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FurnaceBoy_ schneiker, you can ping him now, if he's asleep, wait till he's around here. ? 03:09
schneiker Thanks. 03:16
aufrank ok, I'm off for the night now too 03:23
bye all
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spinclad Arathorn: i've been pondering looking under the hood of JudyHS, seeing as it's described as implemented through Judy1 and JudyL 04:34
it seems the author doesn't see a natural or useful (or stable?) order to the keys, so doesn't provide iterators 04:36
but if one needs to iterate, in an arbitrary order, a hash order should work 04:38
so perhaps we may have something to contribute back to him...
otoh, Judy1 + JudyHS may be all we need, i haven't seen through this to the other side yet 04:40
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svnbot6 r10170 | audreyt++ | * Massive parsing cleanup. 08:33
r10170 | audreyt++ | * Newly implemented parses:
r10170 | audreyt++ | @<foo> @123
r10170 | audreyt++ | %<foo> %123
r10170 | audreyt++ | map {...}, 1, 2, 3
r10170 | audreyt++ | map {...} 1, 2, 3 # is this form still kosher?
r10170 | audreyt++ | "$var\ .moose()"
r10170 | audreyt++ | * Fixed parsefails:
r10170 | audreyt++ | 1..2
r10170 | audreyt++ | "$var."
r10170 | audreyt++ | "$var.moose"
r10170 | audreyt++ | rule foo { ... \{ ... }
gaal what's @<foo> @123 ? 08:35
audreyt short for @($<foo>) @($123)
gaal what's that mean? 08:37
I got as far as @($<foo>)
audreyt @($<foo>) means @($/.{'foo'}) 08:38
@($123) means @($/.[123])
i.e. the 123rd capture
gaal okay, so what do the two mean juxtaposed? 08:39
audreyt they mean that I was too lazy to type \n 08:40
TimToady: is this form still kosher? 08:41
map {$_+3} 1,2,3,4
gaal thanks :)
audreyt np, sorry :)
TimToady: the only mention is in S03
@result = map { floor($^x / 2) }
grep { /^ \d+ $/ }
if it's not a typo, then it needs to be clearly documented that whitespace-follows-block-literal means comma 08:42
because you've specced that non-comma-follows-block-literal will no longer be arglist
(S12, "it will be considered to be the final argument")
map {moose}.blah # map({moose}).blah 08:43
map {moose} .blah # map({moose}, $_.blah)
map {moose}, .blah # map({moose}, $_.blah)
is the current pugs behaviour
and I wonder how correct it is
but I need to go take a nap. been in $hospital.bureaucracy for an entire day... 08:44
bbiab &
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dakkar is it possible that there are still problems re: Cabal and fps? 09:11
here (ghc 6.4.1, Cabal 1.1.3) I can't compile pugs (fresh checkout, svn head) 09:12
build_pugs.pl calls (I think) Setup, who then says «Setup: cannot satisfy dependency fps-any 09:13
Setup: error reading ./.setup-config; run "setup configure" command?»
«ghc-pkg list» shows the fps library...
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Juerd audreyt: I am glad we discussed the long dot on p6l, \. is much better than . . 10:05
theorbtwo It's even somewhat better then .:. 10:06
So it's now \\(<ws>|_)+\. ? 10:07
I'm not sure now if the _ idea was accepted or not.
dakkar am I the only one unable to compile pugs at the moment? (see above) 10:10
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Arathorn morning folks 10:20
dakkar Arathorn: what was the error you got while building pugs, yesterday? 10:21
just «can't find Data.ByteString», or «can't read .setup-config»?
Arathorn i had three - the .. parsefail which audreyt corrected in the night, FPS not being handled by Cabal correctly(?) (which audrey fixed at the time), and a "No instance for (Typeable1 Tree)" at src/Pugs/AST/Internals/Instances.hs:138, which i fixed by swiching to ghc 6.4.1 rather than ghc-cvs in debianland 10:24
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dakkar yesterday I got «can't find Data.ByteString», today I get «Setup: error reading ./.setup-config; run "setup configure" command?» 10:25
of course there is no .setup-config file...
fixed 10:27
./Setup configure --user
Arathorn you shouldn't need to do that, though... 10:30
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dakkar Arathorn: you tell it ;-) it's compiling now 10:33
Arathorn hehe 10:34
dakkar I just can't figure what I should change in the Makefile.PL to make it work without running Setup manually... 10:35
ok, now that it is compiled, I'll check the parsefails due to whitespace changes and fix the tests 10:38
?eval my $path="abc";$path ~~ s:perl5[^([a-z]:)][{uc$0}];$path; 11:15
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evalbot_10170 Error: unexpected end of input expecting block, "\\", "$/", "$!" or ":" 11:15
dakkar parsefail? 11:16
(the code is from File::Spec::Win32)
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dakkar ?eval my $path="abc";$path ~~ s:perl5[^a][A];$path; 11:20
evalbot_10170 Error: No such sub: "&a"
dakkar what?
?eval my $path="abc";$path ~~ s:perl5/^a/A/;$path;
evalbot_10170 \"Abc"
dakkar ?eval my $path="abc";$path ~~ s:perl5 [^a][A];$path; 11:21
evalbot_10170 \"Abc"
dakkar oh, now I get it
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dakkar ?eval my $path="abc";$path ~~ s:perl5 [^([a-z]:)][{uc$0}];$path; 11:27
evalbot_10170 Error: unexpected end of input expecting block, "\\", "$/", "$!" or ":"
dakkar ?eval my $path="abc";$path ~~ s:perl5 [^([a-z]:)][{uc $0}];$path;
evalbot_10170 Error: unexpected end of input expecting block, "\\", "$/", "$!" or ":"
dakkar what's going on?
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dakkar there's something very wrong in the pugs parser to parse regex... 11:37
clkao dakkar! 11:38
dakkar clkao! 11:39
I'm trying to fix the tests, but I found some strangeness in the rx parser (see above)
did the syntax of 'require' change recently? 11:40
'Junction of Something' does not parse («unexpected "o", expecting comment or variable name») 11:41
I should write down these problems... 11:42
clkao \. is ugly! 11:52
Arathorn just as ugly as .:, imo
especially as the : looked attached to the term it prefixed, rather than part of a longdot 11:53
dakkar this whole whitespace-sensitivity thing doesn't feel very DWIM to me...
audreyt dakkar: fixing
dakkar audreyt: which one?
audreyt s[][] 11:54
s!!! works
as does s////
but s[][] not
a sec
sorry for breaking it
dakkar oh, thanks
Arathorn the white-space sensitivity stuff feels amazingly unDWIM to me too :(
dakkar audreyt: s{}{} has the same problem, btw 11:55
audreyt sure
Arathorn we sacrifice compulsory brackets at the expense of our immortal souls...
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dakkar is there a more recent smoke table than the one audreyt linked to? 12:03
audreyt yes 12:07
see smoke.pugscode.org
m19s28.vlinux.de/iblech/stuff/pugs-...a4201.html 12:08
dakkar got it 12:09
audreyt s[][] fixed 12:11
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svnbot6 r10171 | audreyt++ | * Parser: Allow nested begin/end pairs in regex body again: 12:19
r10171 | audreyt++ | rx[ [a-z] ]
r10171 | audreyt++ | however, the parser cannot currently distinguish between:
r10171 | audreyt++ | rx[ \[a-z] # should be valid
r10171 | audreyt++ | rx[ \\[a-z] ] # should be valid as well
r10171 | audreyt++ | as the escape codes are passed thru to the rules engine
r10171 | audreyt++ | without further manipulation. Thinking about how to solve this...
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Juerd [mac mini]-- # sometimes refuses to eject, then requires reboot. 12:21
Sometimes being twice in 12 cd's alreday.
Arathorn hope you have enough paperclips handy 12:22
Juerd Arathorn: No such emergency eject thingy.
audreyt: Well, \w characters that are escaped are special to the engine, while \W characters are special to the engine when NOT escaped. 12:23
audreyt: Also, \w characters are no longer valid delimiters
audreyt ah. point.
Juerd But I think there's, ultimately, no other solution than to have the full rule grammar embedded 12:25
'cause there's also rx<"...]...">]
(That was a p5 regex ;))
dakkar pugs's build system is fragile... but I don't know enough to change it... 12:26
«Wasn't able to find 'Syck_stub.o', aborting»
audreyt oh no, not that again 12:27
which ghc version? is Syck_stub anywhere in dist/?
(it's really Cabal 1.0 that is very fragile.)
dakkar ghc 6.4.1, Cabal 1.1.3
audreyt yay, another different point version :/ 12:28
find dist |grep Syck_
dakkar and no, no stub anywhere in sight
audreyt ok. I think I can fix it.
dakkar it's still in src/
audreyt a sec
dakkar should I copy it? 12:29
audreyt well, to get it working, sure
I'll have a better (and saner) fix in a bit
cp the stub to dist/build/src/Data/Yaml/Syck_stub.o
dakkar oops
it's Syck_stub.c, no .o 12:30
audreyt I'm implementing the saner fix (move Data.Yaml.Syck to third-party)
which is good, as it allows D.Y.S. be used separately
dakkar ok, thanks again
audreyt np :) thanks for reporting 12:31
dakkar is great at finding obscure bugs
audreyt: while you are there, do you have any idea why I have to manually run «./Setup configure --user» to make it find fps? 12:32
audreyt I believe it's a Cabal 1.1.3-specific thing :/ 12:36
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audreyt try it again 12:37
dakkar ok, I'll do it by hand
nnunley audreyt: Could it be because the Pugs.cabal file doesn't refer to third-party?
audreyt nope, try 10172
nnunley: no... it's not that 12:38
dakkar: r10172 should fix that
(essentially by adding --user for you)
dakkar ok
I'm fixing a lot of whitespace-related parsefails, btw
svnbot6 r10172 | audreyt++ | * build_pugs: add --user. 12:39
audreyt yay
Juerd audreyt: I think the whitespace rules for . and .= should be the same, for consistency: no whitespace around .=, if it's also disallowed around .
audreyt dakkar++ dakkar++
Juerd Uglier, but easier to predict.
audreyt er, uhm, hm, I thought the other way around.
I see .= as infix
not postfix-method
Juerd Also, with .foo meaning $_.foo, I'd expect .=foo to mean $_.=foo; when it does not, it should probably not mean anything, and die with an appropriate error message.
audreyt: .= is based on . 12:40
Not on +=
The RHS of .= is not a normal expression
audreyt I think it is
Juerd It is, like .'s RHS, a method name.
i.e. bareword, or simple variable.
audreyt when the pugs parser sees
$_ .= ...... 12:41
it transforms it as
Juerd I don't reason from a parser's point of view...
audreyt $_ .= $_......
dakkar audreyt: r10172 fixed the '--user'. now I only have the Syck_stub problem
audreyt Juerd: I see your point
my Dog $fido.=new; 12:42
is what you mean
Juerd That, and other things.
audreyt I think it's a bit too draconian; we can easily fix the whitespace problem.
Juerd Mostly, I'm worried about confusion if they different whitespace rules exist.
I also think of it the other way around: if whitespace is allowed around .=, it should be allowed around .
audreyt it is a normal infix macro... I think
Juerd It's not a macro, I think.
audreyt whilst as . is strictly postfix
ok. we Think Differently 12:43
that's fine :)
Juerd It isn't just that $foo.=bar always translates to $foo = $foo.bar
svnbot6 r10173 | audreyt++ | * Beginning to implement HsSyck.
audreyt it'd make $foo.=bar in the same cate as $foo.+bar
instead of $foo += bar
dakkar in enum.t: enum <<:Alpha<A> Bravo Charlie Delta Echo>>
Juerd It could have to call the inline-optimized version of bar
Of which I forgot the syntax :) 12:44
dakkar gives a parsefail at the <A>
Juerd audreyt: I think that would be a good solution
dakkar changing it to enum <<:Alpha<<A>> Bravo Charlie Delta Echo>> works
audreyt dakkar: a bug. fixing
Juerd Gotta go; afk
dakkar ok, so I won't touch the test
audreyt fixed 12:45
svnbot6 r10174 | audreyt++ | * Lexer: In 12:46
r10174 | audreyt++ | << < x > >>
r10174 | audreyt++ | do not commit on '<<' when we see inner '<'.
r10174 | audreyt++ | Reported by dakkar.
dakkar is 1..* still valid syntax?
audreyt it becomes valid syntax last week 12:47
havn't implemented term * yet
dakkar so I won't change the lazy_list test 12:48
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audreyt k 12:48
dakkar I'm changing a lot of lives_ok{...} to lives_ok {...} 12:51
is that needed, or am I manking some other problem?
audreyt mm 12:52
I think it's always needed now
postfix {} is always hash deref
dakkar ok, so I fixed right 12:53
audreyt misses the old backtracking dwim days
svnbot6 r10175 | audreyt++ | * HsSyck.
audreyt dakkar++
dakkar is q:to/SOMETHING/ implemented?
clkao new commits keep coming while i am compiling
Arathorn that's a good thing, no? 12:55
dakkar there's something screwy in q:to... either the implementation, or the usage 12:56
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audreyt both. 13:00
dakkar what type is the parameter to the :to adverb? a regex? a string? 13:01
clkao is pugs startup slower again 13:02
dakkar clkao: seems so
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svnbot6 r10176 | dakkar++ | r7940@nautilus: dakkar | 2005-11-12 17:54:58 +0100 13:03
r10176 | dakkar++ | local branch
r10176 | dakkar++ | r10192@nautilus: dakkar | 2006-05-01 12:59:37 +0200
r10176 | dakkar++ | long dot & whitespace fixes in tests
r10176 | dakkar++ | r10193@nautilus: dakkar | 2006-05-01 13:18:05 +0200
r10176 | dakkar++ | long dot & whitespace fixes in tests
r10176 | dakkar++ | r10194@nautilus: dakkar | 2006-05-01 13:50:32 +0200
r10176 | dakkar++ | long dot & whitespace fixes in tests
r10176 | dakkar++ | r10195@nautilus: dakkar | 2006-05-01 14:04:11 +0200
r10176 | dakkar++ | long dot & whitespace fixes in tests
r10176 | dakkar++ | r10196@nautilus: dakkar | 2006-05-01 14:12:00 +0200
r10176 | dakkar++ | long dot & whitespace fixes in tests
r10176 | dakkar++ | r10197@nautilus: dakkar | 2006-05-01 14:20:29 +0200
r10176 | dakkar++ | long dot & whitespace fixes in tests
r10176 | dakkar++ | r10200@nautilus: dakkar | 2006-05-01 14:39:12 +0200
r10176 | dakkar++ | long dot & whitespace fixes in tests
r10176 | dakkar++ | r10203@nautilus: dakkar | 2006-05-01 14:43:18 +0200
r10176 | dakkar++ | long dot & whitespace fixes in tests
r10176 | dakkar++ | r10204@nautilus: dakkar | 2006-05-01 14:45:00 +0200