pugscode.org/ | nopaste: sial.org/pbot/perl6 | pugs: [~] <m oo se> (or rakudo:, kp6:, smop: etc.) || We do Haskell, too | > reverse . show $ foldl1 (*) [1..4] | irclog: irc.pugscode.org/
Set by TimToady on 25 January 2008.
mncharity (t n+1) yet another odd pod comment construct: =head1...=cut 00:08
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mncharity i think this was discussed recently... is 'map:{3}' valid, or must it be 'map :{3}' (with a space)? anyone know? 00:16
eternaleye mncharity: 00:22
[Thu May 8 2008] [15:01:15] <moritz_> we had the discussion what $obj.math:{block} means
[Thu May 8 2008] [15:01:35] <moritz_> and it turned out to be parsed as $obj.meth :{block}
I'll pastebin the relevant porion of my logs 00:23
*portion
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mncharity eternaleye: thanks :) re pastebin, knowing the date, I can just check the log, thanks 00:25
eternaleye Okay
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mncharity TimToady: (12) is the | in 'sub f(|$c) {}' parsed? hint? 00:28
spinclad mncharity: re (10), @%(...) should be parsed @(%(...)) ? -- (but then @@ is a single sigil? hmm) 00:34
(haven't looked at STD on this to see the issue...)
mncharity oh. hmm. that would be odd wouldn't it. re @%() being @(%()), yeah, that looks like what was intended. t/data_types/hash.t 00:41
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mncharity try{ @%(a => <b>)<a> }; ok( $!, "doesn't really make sense, but shouldn't segfault, either ($!)"); 00:42
but at least re STD, looks like a parsefail. 00:43
circumfix:sigil 00:44
TimToady: (4 addendum) also re fatarrow using <ident> for the key, t/spec/S29-str/split.t has a '1 =>'. 00:48
and STD_red non-choking on t/ passes 60% of files. yay! pause. back to slogging... 00:50
TimToady: (13) ... let me know if you ever get tired of these ... routine_def uses ident which is \w* so 'sub postfix:<!!!> ($x){3}' doesn't parse. 00:55
anything:whatever too. 00:57
not that I'm at all looking forward to trying to make such declarations actually affect parsing. :/ 00:58
nothing like trying to duplicate it to remind oneself what an accomplishment pugs was/is. 00:59
rakudo: sub postfix:<!!!>($x) { $x * 2 }; say 3!!!; 01:01
exp_evalbot OUTPUT[Statement not terminated properly at line 1, near ":<!!!>($x)"␤current instr.: 'parrot;PGE::Util;die' pc 120 (runtime/parrot/library/PGE/Util.pir:82)␤called from Sub 'parrot;Perl6::Grammar;statementlist' pc 17896 (src/gen_grammar.pir:2659)␤called from Sub
..'parrot;Perl6::Grammar;statement_block' pc 14962 (src/gen_grammar.pir:1609)␤called f...
mncharity pugs: sub postfix:<aa>($x){$x*2}; 3 aa; 01:02
exp_evalbot RESULT[6] 01:03
mncharity rakudo: sub postfix:<aa>($x){$x*2}; 3 aa;
exp_evalbot OUTPUT[Statement not terminated properly at line 1, near ":<aa>($x){"␤current instr.: 'parrot;PGE::Util;die' pc 120 (runtime/parrot/library/PGE/Util.pir:82)␤called from Sub 'parrot;Perl6::Grammar;statementlist' pc 17896 (src/gen_grammar.pir:2659)␤called from Sub
..'parrot;Perl6::Grammar;statement_block' pc 14962 (src/gen_grammar.pir:1609)␤called f...
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meppl good night 01:14
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mncharity good night meppl 01:24
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mncharity svnbot definitely seems to be sleeping. could someone wake it? :) thanks. 02:35
hopefully I'll have some time this weekend. plan is to knock off a few more causes of parsefails, so we at least seem to potentially have a good set of accessible tests, then fork the next elf, and then begin knocking off test failures, fleshing out the compiler and prelude. 02:41
good night all & 02:42
Auzon bye
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masak I'm reading Damian's post tinyurl.com/5hm4ze 11:52
lambdabot Title: perl.perl6.language | Google Groups
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masak and thinking "God help us if we don't do like that" 11:52
is his post the "latest opinion" in the matter, or has someone else's superceded it since? 11:53
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pmurias masak: if i remember correctly Manhattan distance is not used this days 14:38
instead an ambiguity error is raised if one variant is not stricly better then all the others 14:42
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rindolf Hi all. 15:10
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pbuetow sup rindolf 15:32
:-)
rindolf Hi pbuetow
pbuetow i hope i ll do more perl this summer, no time for perl atm :/ 15:33
rindolf pbuetow: I'm fine. More or less finished writing a new essay.
pbuetow: called "Elements of Perfect Info-Tech Workplace".
pbuetow: ah.
pbuetow rindolf: cool
rindolf pbuetow: what kind of Perl?
pbuetow rindolf: can i see it?
rindolf pbuetow: are you a student?
pbuetow: sure.
pbuetow: www.shlomifish.org/philosophy/compu...workplace/
lambdabot Title: Index of /philosophy/computers/software-management/perfect-workplace, tinyurl.com/6o4kxz 15:34
pbuetow rindolf: yes, and that's the reason why i dont have a lot time left for perl, i am wriiting my diploma thesis in java.
rindolf pbuetow: ah.
pbuetow: I hope Java is not causing you too many problems.
pbuetow rindolf: "Objectoriented and synchronous Simulation of Protocols of Distributed Systems with GUI" <- Well it's not the official title, the official title is in german :) 15:35
rindolf pbuetow: ah.
pbuetow rindolf: well i've no problems with Java, everything works well :)
wow 12 pages 15:36
rindolf pbuetow: I recall a commercial network simulator back at the Com-Net lab in the Technion.
pbuetow: the PDF?
pbuetow yes.
rindolf <pbuetow> rindolf: well i've no problems with Java, everything works well :) - ah, that's good.
pbuetow it's just a programming language. and i think, for this purpose (my thesis) java is better than perl. 15:37
rindolf: did you write it for fun or for $job? 15:38
rindolf pbuetow: for fun. 15:39
pbuetow nice :)
rindolf pbuetow: and for profit.
pbuetow: well, PageRank, publicity, AdSense, etc.
pbuetow rindolf: my simulator will be open source too. but i've to think about a license. maybe GPL.
so it's good for publicity etc :)
rindolf pbuetow: I also wrote www.shlomifish.org/philosophy/compu...-software/ and publicised it. 15:40
lambdabot Title: What Makes Software High-Quality?, tinyurl.com/5lxnq5
rindolf pbuetow: got a lot of publicity from it thanks to OSNews.com and other places.
pbuetow ah cewl
rindolf pbuetow: ah, do you know what the implications of the GPL are?
pbuetow i read OSNews.com too :)
rindolf: well, the main idea i know 15:41
rindolf pbuetow: well, I had a good experience in them accepting some of my submissions.
Not all, but enough.
pbuetow: you realise you can only link to GPLed code if the code is GPL-compatible, right?
pbuetow after my thesis is done, i ll translate it into the english language (at least the simulator itself and short howto's)
rindolf: yes, but i am not using any library, instead of Java's stuff itself 15:42
rindolf pbuetow: you mean, the Simulator is in German, now?
pbuetow rindolf: yes
rindolf pbuetow: yes, but other people may wish to use your code.
pbuetow: well, for standalone apps GPL is OK.
But for libraries it may be probelmatic. 15:43
pbuetow yes.
rindolf In any case, I'm using MIT X11 for almost all of my code.
Well, my original code.
pbuetow what is different from this lic?
tmp.buetow.org/vs6.png <- first preview screenshot (after 2 weeks of heavy programming) 15:45
rindolf pbuetow: use.perl.org/~Shlomi+Fish/journal/36050 15:46
lambdabot Title: Journal of Shlomi Fish (918)
pbuetow in summer, i plan to extend Xerl (which is my own little perl script for my websites) so it can be used as a blog!
rindolf pbuetow: MIT X11 is practically Public-Domain.
pbuetow: I see.
pbuetow: ah. 15:47
pbuetow: I'm looking for a Blog Engine now.
pbuetow: but something more serious.
pbuetow: I Also need comments.
pbuetow rindolf: Movable Type?
rindolf pbuetow: and categories.
moritz_ rindolf: livejournal? ;-)
rindolf pbuetow: I tried MT and didn't like it.
pbuetow hm!
rindolf moritz_: I'm already on LJ.
pbuetow rindolf: has it to be perl?
rindolf moritz_: but I want something I can put on my hosting.
pbuetow: no, PHP and Py and possibly also Ruby can be fine. 15:48
pbuetow rindolf: my blog will be only usable via ssh and vi ;P
rindolf pbuetow: it has a weirdo static HTML caching thing.
pbuetow: MT I mean.
pbuetow rindolf: i have Wordpress atm
rindolf pbuetow: and it created many world-writable files.
pbuetow: ah.
pbuetow: WordPress has a lot of bugs.
pbuetow every other week security update, sucks :/
rindolf pbuetow: yes. 15:49
pbuetow but i want to migrate to my Xerl Blog. if it's ready.
rindolf pbuetow: it it upgraded as part of the OS?
pbuetow: ah.
pbuetow: I'll try out some other engines.
pbuetow xerl.buetow.org
lambdabot Title: xerl.buetow.org - home
15:49 vixey left
pbuetow rindolf: if you do so, and like something, tell me :) 15:49
rindolf pbuetow: sure.
pbuetow: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MIT_License 15:50
pbuetow ah thx
may be one license which would fit too 15:51
rindolf pbuetow: the MIT X11 is the exact opposite in its FOSS philosophy than the GPL. 15:52
pbuetow i ll talk with my prof about the license. he just told me: public domain
rindolf pbuetow: it allows sub-licensing, which means you can make it proprietary.
pbuetow: do they have the PD where you're at?
pbuetow: MIT X11 is a pseudo-PD licence.
pbuetow PD?
what's PD? 15:53
rindolf pbuetow: see the thread - use.perl.org/~Shlomi+Fish/journal/36050
lambdabot Title: Journal of Shlomi Fish (918)
rindolf pbuetow: PD == Public Domain.
pbuetow ah, lol
ok
rindolf pbuetow: where are you located?
pbuetow <- stupid
rindolf What do you mean by WDYM?
pbuetow rindolf: Aachen, Germany (Most west City of Germany, Near Duesseldorf and Cologne). Right next to Belgium and Holland. 15:54
rindolf pbuetow: ah.
pbuetow: so I don't think .de has a Public-Domain equivalent.
pbuetow: you should use MIT X11 probably.
pbuetow: if you don't want to use the LGPL, GPL, SleepyCat Licence, etc.
pbuetow yes, and no beer license (i will get drunk every day, because all students are supposed to use my software in the distributed systems class) 15:55
rindolf pbuetow: ah yes, beerware. 15:57
people.freebsd.org/~phk/ 15:58
lambdabot Title: Poul-Henning Kamp
rindolf pbuetow: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WTFPL 15:59
pbuetow rindolf: lol. hehe. 16:00
rindolf: small 'throw away' programs of mine are mostly beerware :) but until now, nobody gave me a beer :/ 16:01
moritz_ I actually published one (small) piece of software under the WTFPL
rindolf pbuetow: ah.
moritz_: I see.
moritz_: nice.
moritz_: did you Freshmeat it?
moritz_ rindolf: no. It was about 30 lines of perl code 16:02
rindolf moritz_: ah.
moritz_ something that painted a fractal in an unusual fashion 16:03
rindolf moritz_: I once saw a really badly written Perl script on Freshmeat.
moritz_ rindolf: just one? ;-)
pbuetow lol 16:04
rindolf moritz_: well, the one I looked at.
moritz_ could have been mine
rindolf moritz_: perl.org.il/pipermail/perl/2007-Dec...09338.html - search for rpmdig. 16:05
lambdabot Title: [Israel.pm] Some Links Related to the Conference Today
rindolf moritz_: it's unlikely to be yours. 16:06
moritz_ rindolf: I've freshmeated only one perl project of mine, and that has a Devel::Cover coverage of > 75% ;-) 16:07
rindolf moritz_: ah, nice. 16:08
moritz_: HTML-Widgets-NavMenu used to have a D::C coverage of 100%. :-)
moritz_: it used to have 297 (300 - 3) individual assertions.
moritz_ rindolf: my assertions are just "... or confess(...)" which naturally decreases coverage 16:09
rindolf moritz_: ah.
moritz_ Math::Expression::Evaluator (my first cpan module) has 100% coverage if you don'T count assertions
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moritz_ but that's more of an academic exercise 16:10
rindolf moritz_: ah.
moritz_: I registered perl-speak.org/ yesterday. Hopefully tomorrow I'll start setting up a Drupal-based News+Blogs+Forums+Community site.
moritz_ anyway, I'm going offline now for some barbecue ;) 16:11
good luck rindolf ;)
rindolf moritz_: bon appetite.
moritz_: thanks.
moritz_ merci bien
pmurias rindolf: what's the benefit of employes playing computer games at work? 16:39
rindolf pmurias: not all the time. 17:07
pmurias: if they're responsible they'll still do a lot of work. 17:08
pmurias: if not - they're not a good hire.
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rindolf pmurias: plus, doing non-work activities inspire the employees and gives them better ideas for how to be more efficient. 17:18
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rindolf pmurias: at my previous workplace, I sometimes cleared my mind by playing Sokoban and PySol. 17:18
pmurias: they didn't like the fact that people went by and saw me playing.
pmurias: because it didn't look like I was working. 17:19
pmurias i'm not suprised by this 17:20
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rindolf pmurias: I didn't play a lot. 17:21
pmurias at least for me computer games just tire me more, and people tend to assume other people function similarly to them 17:23
and solitare is the archetypical type waster 17:24
rindolf pmurias: I sometimes felt at work that "I need to play a game" and then I played it for a while (< 30 minutes) and then I felt I could start working again. 17:26
pmurias: for the record, I should say that they allowed browsing the Internet indefinitely. 17:27
pmurias: and I could also talk on Freenode without a problem.
In my current workplaces all ports are blocked except HTTP, HTTPS and SSH.
So I use SSH port-forwarding to connect to Freenode. 17:28
pmurias if you were allowed to whatever you please at work, you should be also allowed to do all your task fast and go home early 17:32
rindolf pmurias: well, normally there are more tasks to be done. 17:37
pmurias: I never had a case where I didn't have enough work to do.
pmurias: not even when I was writing Perl.
pmurias yes, but a person who can work with the same efficiency as you withought making brakes should be allowed to have a shorter workday 17:43
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pmurias mncharity: re "was working on" sorry for using the wrong tense ;) 18:03
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mncharity pmurias: np :) 18:20
TimToady: If you would like to change the current "I find 'em, you fix'em" approach to STD.pm bugs, just let me know. :) 18:36
TimToady: (14) stdstopper has a $ check, but if there is horizontal whitespace and/or a comment, that won't fire. 18:37
re 14, hmm, or perhaps I'm supposed to be eating the ws elsewhere... :/ 18:41
"every bit of whitespace magic is purchased with blood"
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mncharity TimToady: (14) can be disregarded. I'm still puzzling over the problem. 'sub f {} #x\n...' is failing in STD_red, unclear why. 19:03
TimToady: (4 addendum 2) also re fatarrow using <ident> for the key, there's also a ($var => 2) in t/blocks/sub_named_params.t . valid? 19:04
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pmichaud mncharity: ($var => 2) is valid Perl 6, yes, but I think that it may get parsed by infix:=>, if there is such a beast. 19:14
don't see it in STD.pm, though. 19:17
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pmichaud (that should be infix:sym<< => >> of course, but I don't have the ability to type the french angles in my current system) 19:17
mncharity pmichaud: right, thanks. (4) may reduce to "there is no infix:[=>]" in STD.pm. just a p5=> .
pmichaud well, generalizing <key=ident> to be a full expression might be problematic, which is why I think it's likely to be a separate infix operator 19:18
and fatarrow handles the case of a bareword on the lhs
mncharity re type the french angles, I cut and paste them. :) hmm, I wonder what the "you have gnome+emacs, and wish to type X" real solution is supposed to be.
pmichaud in vim I just do ctrl-k+<+< and it works great. 19:19
I used to have X11 set up so that right-alt+,+, would do the same
mncharity that sounds like something for a "tips and tricks" page somewhere. 19:20
pmichaud in vim, ":digraph" gives a list of the various special keyboard constructs (all introduced with ctrl-k) 19:21
mncharity xahlee.org/emacs/emacs_n_unicode.html 19:26
lambdabot Title: A Emacs ELisp A Day: Emacs and Unicode Tips
mncharity ctrl-x 8 < is « . nifty! danke. :) 19:27
rindolf mncharity: CTRL+K < <
vim FTW!
Or «
Compose+<+< using the X11 compose key. 19:28
I like Ctrl+K better than the compose.
But I don't always type stuff in vim.
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mncharity rindolf: tnx 19:29
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pmichaud I used to have .xmodmap set up to assign my compose key to right-alt, but I can't find how I did that now :-( 19:31
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mncharity oh, I had to do something like that fairly recently... let's see... 19:33
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pmichaud I think "keycode Alt_R = Multi_key" 19:33
nope, that doesn't work. hrm. 19:34
aha 19:35
mncharity xmodmap -e 'keycode 77 = Multi_key'
pmichaud keysym Alt_R = Multi_key
works
mncharity 77 is numlock, which is a very poor choice, but that's the idea 19:36
ah, ok. win.
pmichaud now I can do Alt_R + < + < to get « and Alt_R + > + > to get »
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pmurias ruoso: why is the responder interface supplied to the Node seperatly instead of being taken from the invocant of the capture? 20:47
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pmichaud TimToady: S02 has: $args = \3; # same as "$args = \(3)" 23:36
I can't find where that's parsed in STD.pm
actually, S03 refers to prefix:<\>, but that appears to be missing. So I'll assume that's what is intended. 23:38
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