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pugscode.org/ | nopaste: sial.org/pbot/perl6 | pugs: [~] <m oo se> (or rakudo:, kp6:, elf: etc.) (or perl6: for all) | irclog: irc.pugscode.org/ Set by Tene on 29 July 2008. |
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| pugs_svn | r22331 | putter++ | [elf] elf_h forked from elf_g. | 01:29 | |
| r22331 | putter++ | elf_g remains the recommended stable version of elf. 2 months old today. | |||
| r22331 | putter++ | elf_h is the unstable development head. | |||
| r22331 | putter++ | Dusted TODO. elf_g now uses its own copy of STD_red. | |||
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| pugs_svn | r22332 | putter++ | [STD_red] First rough draft of a dump format for Common Lisp. | 01:56 | |
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| s1n | moritz_: ping | 02:15 | |
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| Ontolog | moritz_: what was that bug number affecting returning a list of Match objects? | 03:54 | |
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| s1n | moritz_++ good work on the test suite lately | 04:39 | |
| Tene | moritz++ I agree | 04:43 | |
| s1n | we're over 5000 passing with over 8000 planned in t/spec! | 04:44 | |
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| Ontolog | I'm going through the PCT tutorial. I have an error: PAST::Compiler can't compile node of type Monkey::Grammar | 06:46 | |
| Is there any way to tell parrot to be more verbose? I would like to know *why* can't it compile the node | |||
| and no, options w and v don't help | 06:47 | ||
| oops i'm on the wrong channel :p | |||
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| moritz_ | re | 07:34 | |
| s1n: pong | |||
| pmurias | moritz_: hi | 07:36 | |
| moritz_ | pmurias: good morning ;) | ||
| pmurias | good morning | 07:37 | |
| Ontolog | i don't understand why I am getting <integer_constant> => PMC 'Monkey::Grammar' => "Hash[0x83a4298]" @ 2 | ||
| when I should be getting <integer_constant> => PMC 'Monkey::Grammar' => 1 @ 2 | 07:38 | ||
| moritz_ | you have a capture more than you think? | ||
| Ontolog | can't be | 07:40 | |
| input is a=1 | |||
| moritz_ | what does your rule integer_constant look like | 07:41 | |
| pugs_svn | r22333 | pmurias++ | [smop] changed smop back to a static library so pugs linked with it doesn't need LD_LIBRARY_PATH | 07:42 | |
| Ontolog | rule integer_constant { \d+ {*} } | 07:43 | |
| pmurias | does making pugs accept both perl6 and m0ld seem sane? | 07:44 | |
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| moritz_ | pmurias: if the m0ld is somhow delimited... why not? | 07:53 | |
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| pmurias | moritz_: i could make m0ld delimited or use a -F option, what i' worried about if it's not making pugs too smopish | 08:12 | |
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| moritz_ | that's not a worry I can address | 08:14 | |
| pmurias | nobody else is (visibly) working on pugs so that's propably not a big worry | 08:16 | |
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| masak | moritz_: aye. I generally backlog. :) | 08:28 | |
| too much interesting going on here. | |||
| moritz_ | masak: so did you backlog parrotsketch? ;-) | 08:29 | |
| pugs_svn | r22334 | pmurias++ | [pugs] Pugs.Embed.M0ld imports a modulized M0ld.hs which now lives in src/ | 08:30 | |
| masak | moritz_: no, doing that now | ||
| moritz_ | masak: in short, green light for your commit bit | ||
| masak | \o/ | ||
| moritz_ | either pmichaud or I will be mentoring you | 08:31 | |
| masak | I look forward to that | ||
| wow, this feels much better than I thought it would :) | |||
| moritz_ | hehe ;) | 08:32 | |
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| masak | perl6: 1 ?? 2 : 3 # this makes Rakudo's parser freak out | 08:41 | |
| p6eval | rakudo 31377: OUTPUT[ResizablePMCArray: Can't pop from an empty array!ā¤current instr.: 'parrot;PGE::OPTable;parse' pc 1754 (compilers/pge/PGE/OPTable.pir:495)ā¤] | ||
| ..pugs: OUTPUT[*** ā¤ Unexpected ": 3"ā¤ expecting operator or "!!"ā¤ at /tmp/4OqfHgrmYE line 1, column 8ā¤] | |||
| ..elf 22334: OUTPUT[Parse error in: /tmp/4kmbr4ZrzDā¤panic at line 1 column 0 (pos 0): Can't understand next input--giving upā¤WHERE: 1 ?? 2 : 3 # this makes Rakudoā¤WHERE:/\<-- HEREā¤ STD_red/prelude.rb:99:in `panic'ā¤ STD_red/std.rb:76:in `scan_unitstopper'ā¤ STD_red/std.rb:224:in `comp_unit'ā¤ | |||
| ..STD_r... | |||
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| masak | did we create an RT ticket for that? I don't remember | 08:41 | |
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| moritz_ | masak: yes, you did | 08:43 | |
| perl6: 1 ?? 2 !! 3 | |||
| p6eval | pugs, rakudo 31377: RESULT[2] | ||
| ..elf 22334: OUTPUT[Unknown rule: infix:conditionalā¤It needs to be added to ast_handlers.ā¤ at ./elf_f line 1918ā¤] | |||
| masak | elf++ # awareness of its own limits | ||
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| masak | rakudo: say +("1" ~ "0" x $_) for 308, 309 | 09:03 | |
| p6eval | rakudo 31378: OUTPUT["load_bytecode" couldn't find file 'PGE.pbc'ā¤current instr.: 'parrot;PCT::Grammar;onload' pc 0 (src/PCT/Grammar.pir:41)ā¤] | ||
| masak | recompiling again? :) | 09:04 | |
| rakudo: say +("1" ~ "0" x $_) for 308, 309 | 09:07 | ||
| p6eval | rakudo 31378: OUTPUT[1e+308ā¤infā¤] | ||
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| pmurias | moritz_: pugs -Bm0ld will work soon how should it be added to the evalbot? or do you have time to add it yourself? | 09:46 | |
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| pugs_svn | r22335 | pmurias++ | [pugs] pugs -Bm0ld creates a simple mold frame | 11:50 | |
| pmurias | @tell ruoso it turned out rootnamespace was an undead objects (it got DESTROYALLED) just after creation and "lived" on with a counter near 999 | 11:52 | |
| lambdabot | Consider it noted. | ||
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| pugs_svn | r22336 | pmurias++ | [pugs] [smop] the haskell gc does the refcounting for the SMOP__Objects passed around in haskell code | 12:39 | |
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| rakudo_svn | r31379 | pmichaud++ | [rakudo]: spectest-progress.csv update: 177 files, 3779 passing tests | 13:17 | |
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| masak | progress++ | 13:48 | |
| ahmadz | hi | 13:51 | |
| masak | ahmadz: hello. | 13:52 | |
| pmurias_ | ahmadz: hi | ||
| ahmadz | masak: raduko is part of parrot svn right? | ||
| pmurias_: hello | |||
| masak | ahmadz: yes, it is. | ||
| but the rakudo part of svn commits is reported here too | 13:53 | ||
| ahmadz | i noticed | ||
| so raduko passes t/spec in pugs or parrot svn? | 13:55 | ||
| masak | t/spec resides in Pugs svn | ||
| when you run 'make spectest', it's imported/updated locally | |||
| qwr wonders whether you consistent mispelling or is raduko some weird thing I don't know... | 13:56 | ||
| s/you/you are/ | |||
| ahmadz | qwr: sorry for that | 13:57 | |
| masak | qwr: I didn't see it until now. :) | ||
| qwr | heh, ok ;) | ||
| masak | we could name a Perl 6 project raduko and see what happens. and perhaps rukado, rokadu, rodaku and radoku, too. | 13:58 | |
| we clearly haven't filled the space of names yet. | 13:59 | ||
| pmurias_ | naming a Python project raduko and seeing what happens would be even more fun | 14:03 | |
| masak | yes, that's even better | ||
| ahmadz | interesting | 14:04 | |
| masak | the name 'Radoku' sounds like it could involve numbers in a 9x9 grid somehow | ||
| ahmadz | radoku ~ sudoku | 14:06 | |
| pmurias_ | sudoku-- | ||
| masak | pmurias_: I think I've gotten over my distaste for Sudoku. it doesn't mean I'm any more interested, I just don't care much either way any more. the masses will always need some kind of opium, even if it consists of filling in numbers in predefined ways. | 14:09 | |
| who knows, such activities might even stave off dementia for some folks | 14:10 | ||
| moritz_ | pmurias_: is the interface simply 'pugs -Bm0ld filename'? | 14:12 | |
| masak | moritz_: I'd make 'mold' and 'm0ld' synonyms if I were you, to avoid awkward questions :) | 14:13 | |
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| moritz_ | masak: not my choice, tell pmurias_ ;) | 14:13 | |
| masak | pmurias_: I'd make 'mold' and 'm0ld' synonyms if I were you, to avoid awkward questions :) | ||
| pmurias_ | moritz_: yes | 14:14 | |
| moritz_: pugs needs compiling with ./Setup configure --user --flags=SMOP;./Setup build and smop needs to be build with make | 14:15 | ||
| pmurias hates the _ suffix ;) | 14:16 | ||
| masak: maybe a smop synonym? | 14:17 | ||
| moritz_ | pmurias: I'll probably get to it later | 14:18 | |
| pmurias | moritz_: i'm still fighting strange bugs | 14:19 | |
| masak | pmurias: aye | ||
| pmurias | maybe symbolic references in C with dlopen(NULL,RTLD_LAZY) are a bit too magical... | 14:26 | |
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| moritz_ | if you ask yourself where yesterday night's leap in rakudo's passed test count came from... | 14:51 | |
| I wrote a new tool that helps to better identify which tests mostly pass | |||
| Tene | How many passing tests are there now? | 14:52 | |
| moritz_ | 3779 | ||
| Tene | Nice. | ||
| moritz++ | |||
| moritz_ | as opposed to 3434 the day before | ||
| PerlJam | for some reason I am reminded of The Princess Bride and the hero being "mostly" dead. | 14:57 | |
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| moritz_ | anyway, I'll test that thing a bit more, and then commit as a replacement for tools/update_passing_test_data.pl | 14:58 | |
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| pasteling | "spinclad" at 209.6.140.232 pasted "masak: proper credit for 'every day christmas'" (25 lines, 2.2K) at sial.org/pbot/32323 | 15:16 | |
| moritz_ | spinclad++ # "(i asked purl if i could quote her, she had no objection)" | 15:18 | |
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| pmichaud | I think that the "every day christmas" quote actually comes from audreyt | 15:55 | |
| [particle] | yes, may need to search logs for "xmas" | 15:56 | |
| pmichaud | I think I first heard about it at yapc 2005 | 15:57 | |
| might've been yapc 2006 | |||
| [particle] | toronto? sounds familiar | 15:58 | |
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| pmurias | mncharity: hi | 16:19 | |
| moritz_ | pmurias: smop/m0ld seems to depend on autobox, but not probing for it | 16:23 | |
| or autobox::Core | 16:24 | ||
| pmurias | sm0p more likely m0ld is in haskell | ||
| moritz_ | ok, smop then ;) | ||
| what a colourful build process ;) | 16:25 | ||
| pasteling | "moritz_" at 89.13.226.127 pasted "smop build failure (for pmurias/ruoso)" (13 lines, 781B) at sial.org/pbot/32324 | 16:26 | |
| pmurias | moritz_: doesn't happen here everything is svn up'd and unmodified? | 16:29 | |
| moritz_ | pmurias: "yes" to both | 16:30 | |
| when I started the build pugs wasn't built with m0ld support | 16:31 | ||
| is that a problem? | |||
| pmurias | shouldn't be | ||
| could you nopaste the build/test/33_pugs_simple.m0ld | 16:32 | ||
| pasteling | "moritz_" at 89.13.226.127 pasted "build/test/33_pugs_simple.m0ld (for pmurias)" (1 line, 2.6K) at sial.org/pbot/32325 | ||
| pmurias | moritz_: looks like you have an old pugs | 16:33 | |
| moritz_ | pmurias: I did an 'svn up', and then the ./Setup incantation you gave me earlier | 16:34 | |
| should I try a 'make clean' first? | |||
| pmurias | cp dist/build/pugs/pugs pugs | 16:35 | |
| sorry, my fault | |||
| moritz_ | ok, arrived at 100% | 16:36 | |
| pugs_svn | r22337 | moritz++ | [evalbot] add m0ld support, remove yap6 | 16:39 | |
| moritz_ | evalbot control restart | ||
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| moritz_ | pugs: say "sanity check" | 16:39 | |
| p6eval | pugs: OUTPUT[sanity checkā¤] | ||
| moritz_ | m0ld: say "hi" | ||
| p6eval | m0ld: OUTPUT[pugs: user error (Cannot evaluate in M0ld)ā¤ā¤] | ||
| moritz_ | pmurias: should that work right now? | 16:41 | |
| pmurias | in a minute or too | ||
| [particle] | m0ld: 1.say | 16:42 | |
| p6eval | m0ld: OUTPUT[pugs: user error (Cannot evaluate in M0ld)ā¤ā¤] | ||
| [particle] | m0ld: 1 | 16:43 | |
| p6eval | m0ld: OUTPUT[pugs: user error (Cannot evaluate in M0ld)ā¤ā¤] | ||
| [particle] explores the limits of m0ld :( | |||
| pugs_svn | r22338 | pmurias++ | [pugs] evaling code in the embedded smop works | 16:50 | |
| pmurias | moritz_: could you rebuild pugs with ./Setup configure --user --flags=SMOP;./Setup build;cp dist/build/pugs/pugs pugs | ||
| moritz_ | pmurias: that's pretty much what my build script does... testing it now, and if it works, I'll make a cron job out of it | 16:52 | |
| m0ld: say "hi" | |||
| p6eval | m0ld: OUTPUT[pugs: user error (Cannot evaluate in M0ld)ā¤ā¤] | ||
| pmurias | that error indicates smop support is not build in | ||
| moritz_ tries a 'make clean' | 16:53 | ||
| pmurias | and m0ld: should be propably be called smop: as rakudo: is not called pir: | 16:56 | |
| moritz_ | now that's easy to do ;) | 16:57 | |
| pugs_svn | r22339 | moritz++ | [evalbot] s/m0ld/smop/ | ||
| moritz_ | evalbot control restart | ||
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| pugs_svn | r22340 | pmurias++ | [pugs] a better error message if smop embedding is not configured | 16:58 | |
| pmurias | smop: $*OUT.print("Hello\n") | ||
| p6eval | smop: OUTPUT[pugs: user error (Cannot evaluate in M0ld)ā¤ā¤] | ||
| pmurias | evalbot control restart | ||
| moritz_ | pmurias: rebuild is not yet completed | ||
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| pmurias | smop: $*OUT.print("Hello\n") | 16:58 | |
| p6eval | smop: OUTPUT[pugs: user error (Cannot evaluate in M0ld)ā¤ā¤] | ||
| moritz_ | and evalbot doesn't need to be restarted when the implementations change | 16:59 | |
| pmurias | good | ||
| moritz_ | smop: $*OUT.print("Hello\n") | 17:00 | |
| p6eval | smop: OUTPUT[pugs: user error (Cannot evaluate in M0ld)ā¤ā¤] | ||
| pmurias | you don't run perl Makefile.pl;make right? | 17:01 | |
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| pmurias | smop: $*OUT.print("Hello\n") | 17:01 | |
| p6eval | smop: OUTPUT[pugs: user error (Cannot evaluate in M0ld)ā¤ā¤] | ||
| moritz_ | no, I run ./Setup --user --flags=SMOP | ||
| and then ./Setup build | |||
| pmurias | it's ./Setup configure --user --flags=SMOP | ||
| moritz_ | erm, yes | 17:02 | |
| sorry, didn't copy and paste | |||
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| pasteling | "moritz_" at 89.13.226.127 pasted "pugs build script" (12 lines, 188B) at sial.org/pbot/32326 | 17:02 | |
| pmurias | you should make smop first | 17:04 | |
| smop: $*OUT.print("Hello\n") | |||
| p6eval | smop: OUTPUT[pugs: user error (Cannot evaluate in M0ld)ā¤ā¤] | ||
| moritz_ | ok, trying again | 17:05 | |
| pmurias | it shouldn't matter, the pugs in the evalbot isn't HEAD btw | ||
| moritz_ | pugs: say $?PUGS_VERSION | 17:06 | |
| p6eval | pugs: OUTPUT[Perl6 User's Golfing System, version 6.2.13.11, July 31, 2008 (r20996)ā¤] | ||
| moritz_ | uhm. | ||
| that explaiins a lot | |||
| it executes the wrong pugs | |||
| sorry for the mess | |||
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| moritz_ | but why? | 17:08 | |
| dist/build/pugs/pugs -e 'say $?PUGS_VERSION' also says r20996 | 17:09 | ||
| moritz_ doesn't understand what's going on | |||
| pmurias | & | 17:11 | |
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| moritz_ | computers-- | 17:12 | |
| [particle] | humans++ | 17:13 | |
| moritz_ | don't DWIM | ||
| humans-- # don't teach the computers how to DWIM, at least not good enough | |||
| [particle] | computers++ # do exactly what you tell them to | ||
| moritz_ | ..except when they don't ;-) | 17:14 | |
| masak | I don't believe that more DWIM is always better. and IRC bots have convinced me that narrow AI rocks. | 17:15 | |
| except for purl, a very obnoxious bot | |||
| moritz_ | ;) | ||
| [particle] | <purl>i know you are, but what am i?</purl> | 17:17 | |
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| mncharity | howdy pmurias, how goes? | 17:20 | |
| pmurias | fine, i'm putting the pugs smop backend into the evalbot | 17:21 | |
| moritz_ | I just tried on a different machine | 17:22 | |
| pugs_svn | r22341 | putter++ | [elf] Finished elf_h fork. Tweaked IR. Updated test results. | 17:23 | |
| moritz_ | the revision number didn't get updated on rebuild | ||
| mncharity | pmurias: neat. | ||
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| pmurias | smop: $*OUT.print("hello\n") | 17:24 | |
| p6eval | smop: OUTPUT[smop embedding is disabled use ./Setup configure --user --flags=SMOPā¤] | ||
| moritz_ | that's what I get on a different machine as well | 17:25 | |
| does smop need to be in $PATH? | |||
| pmurias | no, smop is staticly linked in | ||
| mncharity | re neat, pity it isn't elf. ;) any feedback? went with the more working parser? | 17:26 | |
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| pmurias | mncharity: went with the more working ast | 17:26 | |
| mncharity | more working in what way? the infix:<,> you mentioned? anything else? | 17:27 | |
| pmurias | ruoso: hi | ||
| ruoso | hi pmurias | ||
| lambdabot | ruoso: You have 2 new messages. '/msg lambdabot @messages' to read them. | ||
| pmurias | mncharity: looking... | ||
| mncharity | no hurry. but would definitely like to know at some point. | ||
| just to make absolutely sure you know, you realize you are not going to be getting oo declarations out of the old pugs parse, right? | 17:29 | ||
| pmurias | pugs: class Foo {has $.foo;};my $foo = Foo.new(foo=>1);say $foo.foo; | 17:30 | |
| p6eval | pugs: OUTPUT[1ā¤] | ||
| pmurias | mncharity: pugs seems to parse oo declarations | 17:31 | |
| mncharity | yes, but that's not what you are using pugs for (unless I've badly misunderstood). take a look at your pil output. | 17:32 | |
| ruoso | smop: $*OUT.print("Hello World!\n") | 17:33 | |
| p6eval | smop: OUTPUT[smop embedding is disabled use ./Setup configure --user --flags=SMOPā¤] | ||
| mncharity | there's a reason we've been stuck on exactly this for a couple of years. not just "no one got around to doing a backend". :) | ||
| ruoso | ahhh | ||
| pmurias | mncharity: pil didn't have my declarations which is much more serious, but i hacked them in | 17:34 | |
| ruoso . o O ( if pmurias has a declaration I want one on my own ;) ;) ;) ) | |||
| mncharity | lol | 17:35 | |
| pmurias | ruoso: you can have our declarations | ||
| ruoso | heh... | ||
| mncharity | hacked them in?!? do please elaborate. | ||
| oh, "my" decarations. ok. nm. but have you seen the pil for class declarations? | 17:36 | ||
| pmurias | the typical pugs run is "source code" -> AST | 17:37 | |
| when you add a custom backend it's "source code" -> AST -> PIL1 -> "something else" | |||
| everything pugs can run it has in the AST | 17:38 | ||
| mncharity | (I have to go. sorry. back laterish) | ||
| pmurias | and there's nothing special about PIL1 | 17:39 | |
| mncharity: i'll propably switch to elf if audreyt doesn't go back to hacking on pugs | 17:40 | ||
| ruoso | pmurias++ # pugs -BM0ld works here :) | 17:41 | |
| moritz_, for some reason it only started working after I rebuild SMOP after building pugs for the first time... (or something like that) | 17:42 | ||
| masak | will we steal qualified imports from Haskell into Perl 6? :) | ||
| ruoso | but it does work now :) | ||
| moritz_ | masak: I think we did already | ||
| masak | moritz_: oh, good. | ||
| moritz_ | S11 or S10, I alway forget which one covers what | 17:43 | |
| masak | oki | ||
| moritz_ | ruoso: it feels like rebuilt both pugs and smop 10 times already :( | ||
| ruoso | did you saw " Compiling M0ld.AST " at any of those times? | 17:44 | |
| moritz_ | dunno | ||
| ruoso | moritz_, change the build script to build SMOP before pugs | 17:46 | |
| moritz_ | there seemss to be no 'make clean' for smop - what do you use iinstead? | ||
| ruoso | rm -rf build | ||
| ruoso :) it's nice because it's already sanely looking for variables in the lexical scope, just as expected... Pugs+SMOP seems to be a very interesting pair... | 17:51 | ||
| moritz_ tries to remove ~/.cabal and ~/.ghc and then tries a last time | 17:52 | ||
| ruoso | moritz_, are you building smop before trying to build pugs? | ||
| moritz_ | ruoso: yes | 17:53 | |
| ruoso | pmurias, the reason for using static linking is just to avoid LD_LIBRARY_PATH needing to be set? | 17:56 | |
| moritz_ | no luck again | 18:02 | |
| ./pugs -V |grep -i smop | |||
| no output | |||
| ruoso | smop: hell0o | 18:04 | |
| p6eval | smop: OUTPUT[smop embedding is disabled use ./Setup configure --user --flags=SMOPā¤] | ||
| ruoso | :( | 18:05 | |
| moritz_, do you have the buildlog? | |||
| moritz_ | ruoso: no, but I can try again... | 18:06 | |
| ruoso: do you need pugs build log, or both? | |||
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| ruoso | are you using that script you pasted above? | 18:06 | |
| moritz_ | yes | 18:07 | |
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| moritz_ | but I changed it to build smop first | 18:07 | |
| ruoso | right... so the log is for that script... | ||
| which involves both pugs build and smop build | |||
| right? | |||
| moritz_ | right | ||
| pmurias_ | ruoso: re static linking yes, it's a one word change | ||
| ruoso | pmurias_, right... I think it'll probably be easier later to have it as dynamic... to avoid having to rebuild pugs every time | 18:08 | |
| moritz_ | ruoso: moritz.faui2k3.org/tmp/pugs-build-log | 18:09 | |
| pmurias_ | moritz_: cp Pugs.cabal.in Pugs.cabal | 18:10 | |
| moritz_ | pmurias_: and then? | ||
| pmurias_ | ./Setup configure --user --flags=SMOP and then ./Setup build | 18:11 | |
| moritz_ | [14 of 93] Compiling M0ld.AST | ||
| pmurias_: do I have to do that copy step on each build? | 18:12 | ||
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| moritz_ | smop: $*OUT.print: "foo" | 18:13 | |
| p6eval | smop: OUTPUT[foo] | ||
| ruoso | :) :) :): ): ): ):) | ||
| moritz_ | indeed | ||
| smop: say "foo" | |||
| p6eval | smop: OUTPUT[no variable &say in the current scopeā¤] | 18:14 | |
| pmurias_ | :( | ||
| moritz_: you don't have to but you propably should | |||
| ruoso | "no variable &say" is the expected error :) | 18:15 | |
| pmurias_ | as we don't use perl Makefile.PL;make we have to do what they do | ||
| moritz_ | or tweak Makefile.PL to enable smop embedding ;) | 18:16 | |
| pugs_svn | r22342 | pmurias++ | [pugs] -Bm0ld supports integers | ||
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| pmurias_ | moritz_: yes | 18:17 | |
| ruoso | that's probably better... since I can't make it work on my machine anymore... :) | 18:18 | |
| pmurias_ | ruoso: what's the error? | ||
| ruoso | pmurias_, it simply doesn't get smop | 18:19 | |
| it throws me the "no embedded smop" error | |||
| but when I change Makefile.PL it works.. | 18:20 | ||
| pugs_svn | r22343 | azawawi++ | [pugs] Added a solution to "Cannot install zlib: 256" after 'perl Makefile.PL' | ||
| r22343 | azawawi++ | [pugs] Separated problems with line separators | |||
| ruoso | pmurias_, we probably need to take the tests out of the default compile target | ||
| since pugs depends on smop, and the smop tests depend on pugs | |||
| and the cool thing is that pugs and smop are getting together really nice... | 18:22 | ||
| producing the expected errors where expected... | |||
| like... | |||
| smop: $*OUT("no postcircumfix:( ) at this variable") | 18:23 | ||
| p6eval | smop: OUTPUT[unknown method "postcircumfix:( )" at message line 55 file /home/evalenv/pugs/v6/smop/build/src/smop_s1p_io.cā¤] | ||
| ruoso | smop: $*FOO = 1; $*OUT.print($*FOO); | 18:24 | |
| p6eval | smop: OUTPUT[no variable $*FOO in the current scopeā¤] | ||
| ruoso | hmm... that was not expected... | ||
| pmurias_ | that's actually wrong | ||
| moritz_ | why? | ||
| ruoso | because $*FOO is global, not a lexical | ||
| moritz_ | are global variables not subject to strict? | ||
| pmurias_ | no | ||
| ruoso | that's what makes them global ;) | ||
| and undesirable ;) | |||
| it shouldn't even be looking in the lexical scope... | 18:25 | ||
| pmurias_ | globals are a low priority | ||
| could you commit your change to Makefile.PL (propably conditional with $ENV{PUGS_EMBED} =~ /\bsmop\b/) | 18:26 | ||
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| pmurias | smop: $*OUT.print(1,"\n") | 18:27 | |
| p6eval | smop: OUTPUT[1ā¤] | ||
| pugs_svn | r22344 | pmurias++ | [pugs/smop] changed $*OUT to $OUT as $*OUT is a global not a lexical | 18:30 | |
| r22345 | pmurias++ | [smop] removed test 33 from the default test target | 18:39 | ||
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| pugs_svn | r22346 | ruoso++ | [pugs] add --flags=SMOP if $ENV{PUGS_EMBED} =~ /\bsmop\b/i | 18:46 | |
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| ruoso | pmurias, for some reason, pugs is trying to lookup itself for global variables | 18:52 | |
| smop: $FOO | 18:53 | ||
| p6eval | smop: OUTPUT[*** ā¤ Unexpected end of inputā¤ expecting "::"ā¤ Variable "$FOO" requires predeclaration or explicit package nameā¤ at /tmp/wBNnIL4j9u line 1, column 5ā¤] | ||
| ruoso | smop: $*OUT.print("Hello") | ||
| p6eval | smop: OUTPUT[no variable $*OUT in the current scopeā¤] | ||
| ruoso | smop: $OUT.print("Hello") | ||
| p6eval | smop: OUTPUT[no variable $*OUT in the current scopeā¤] | ||
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| ruoso | it seems that pugs is trying to be too smart | 18:55 | |
| pmurias | smtms: $OUT.print("hello") | 18:56 | |
| sorry | |||
| smop: $OUT.print("Hello here\n") | 18:57 | ||
| p6eval | smop: OUTPUT[no variable $*OUT in the current scopeā¤] | ||
| pmurias | ruoso: pugs is running no strict | ||
| ruoso | pmurias, but it shouldn't be doing that anyway... | 18:58 | |
| should it? | |||
| pmurias | no strict is the default for one liners | 18:59 | |
| ruoso | sure... but does "no strict" means translating $OUT to $*OUT? | ||
| pmurias | why not? | 19:00 | |
| ruoso | I'd expect $OUT to create a new variable... | ||
| specially because you don't start in package * | |||
| you start in package Main | |||
| so at most it would create Main::$Out | |||
| but I don't see how it would get to $*OUT | 19:01 | ||
| pmurias | maybe no strict falls back to globals not to package variables | ||
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| ruoso | hmm... that would be strange... | 19:02 | |
| pmurias | no strict doesn't make much sense | ||
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| ruoso | the specs only talk about when strict *is* in effect... | 19:03 | |
| I can't find a reference to 'no strict' | |||
| pmurias | falling back to a global is the least strict option | 19:04 | |
| ruoso | pmurias, being global and being in the package * are two different things | 19:05 | |
| pmurias | don't think so | ||
| ruoso | global is about visibility, not about where it is | ||
| pmurias | S10:58 | 19:06 | |
| ruoso | but packages are, by default, our | 19:07 | |
| which means that they're global | |||
| even if they are not * | |||
| pmurias | no they aren't you can have versioned packages | ||
| ruoso | pmurias, when the parser starts, it's in the package *, so package Foo at the beggining of a file, means *Foo | 19:08 | |
| the same way, if there's no package declaration, the runtime puts you into *Main | |||
| the most logical thing would be for $FOO to be *Main::$FOO | 19:09 | ||
| not $*FOO | |||
| pugs_svn | r22347 | masak++ | [ord_and_chr.t] added tests for multi-arg variants of ord and chr | ||
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| pmurias | ruoso: imagine having version 0.1 and 0.2 of a versioned *global* package at once | 19:11 | |
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| ruoso | pmurias, being loaded at the same time? | 19:11 | |
| you have two alternatives... | 19:12 | ||
| the first would be that this is not possible... | |||
| the second would imply that each versioned package registers itself globally with fully-versioned-name *Foo::0.1 and *Foo::0.2 | |||
| and Foo is bound to each place that "use Foo" | 19:13 | ||
| but that means $*Foo::bar is undetermined | |||
| although $Foo::bar in a place that use'd Foo will point to the correct version... | 19:14 | ||
| pmurias | the third option is that the spec is inconsitent | ||
| * inconsistent | |||
| ruoso | pmurias, the spec tries very hard to make globals unpleasant :) | 19:15 | |
| but the fact is... | 19:16 | ||
| package Foo; at the start of a file means creating a global package that is stored as *Foo | 19:17 | ||
| and unless you 'use Foo' or 'require Foo', you can only access it as *Foo... | 19:18 | ||
| 'use Foo' or 'require Foo' will create a local bind of that package as "Foo" in the current lexical scope | |||
| which will allow you to use Foo.new() | |||
| perl -MFoo will probably add Foo to the prelude scope... | 19:19 | ||
| so that it becomes omnipresent... | |||
| pmurias | ruoso: i don't think it's the intention to make the globals more unpleasant then they already are by they very nature | ||
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| pmurias | TimToady: does package Foo at the top create a global *Foo package? if so why? wouldn't that screw up versioning? | 19:20 | |
| ruoso | pmurias, I'm not sure current versioning schema provides loading two different versions of a library at the same time... | 19:21 | |
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| pmurias | ruoso: if they are purly lexical you can have as many as you want provided they are used from seperate lexical scopes | 19:22 | |
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| pmurias | and i think that's more important then builting support for monkey patching | 19:23 | |
| ruoso | "A bare package declarator declares an our package within the current package" | ||
| All files start out being parsed in the * package, but switch to some other package scope depending on the first declaration | 19:24 | ||
| pmurias | ruoso: i am aware what the spec says i just thinks it's a bug | ||
| ruoso | pmurias, if you take a look at S11, you'll see that package Foo; is an incomplete name | 19:25 | |
| the actual name of the package should include the version | |||
| pmurias | it's not just that | 19:26 | |
| ruoso | so it looks like *Foo:ver<0.1>:auth<DRUOSO> | ||
| and 'use Foo' creates a local bind of "Foo" pointing to that package | |||
| pmurias | it's wrong to be able to access Foo::bar just because something somewhere loaded the Foo package | ||
| ruoso | not Foo::bar... | 19:27 | |
| but *Foo:ver<0.1>:auth<DRUOSO>::bar | |||
| and if two pieces of code "use Foo", they will point to the same package | 19:28 | ||
| and Foo::bar in both codes will point to the same var | |||
| pmurias | still wrong | 19:29 | |
| ruoso | well.. the package needs to be shared in the interpreter... | ||
| it's just a matter of having a explicit way or a hackish way of accessing the shared package | |||
| a package is "our" by default... | 19:30 | ||
| pmurias | if we want to design premature optimalisation in we can have a native ptr type | ||
| ruoso | hm? what does it have to do with that? | ||
| pmurias | what's the point of a use Foo in 2 places using the same Foo? | 19:31 | |
| ruoso | perhaps Foo points to a package variable that should be shared? | 19:32 | |
| like... subroutines? | |||
| pmurias | so it would be an explicit *Foo | ||
| subroutines shouldn't be shared | |||
| we are not the monkey patching people | |||
| ruoso | well... 'use Foo' creates a local bind to "*Foo" as "Foo" | ||
| actually... "use Foo" creates a local bind to "wherever_the_package_is_stored" as "Foo" | 19:33 | ||
| pmurias | according to the spec which i belive to be severily wrong here | 19:34 | |
| * severly | |||
| masak | pmurias: 'severely', but who cares? :) | 19:35 | |
| ruoso | pmurias, for "class Foo is also {...}" to work at a distance (as expected) it needs to be that way | 19:36 | |
| pmurias | ruoso: it add stuff to the lexical Foo | 19:37 | |
| ruoso | pmurias, as well as adding a subroutine to an existing package... | ||
| pmurias, and the lexical Foo points to the shared Foo | |||
| pmurias | that's monkey patching | ||
| use should use use Monkey::Patching to do that | 19:38 | ||
| ruoso | pmurias, that's something Perl has always supported, and Perl 6 doesn't mention not supporting it anymore... | ||
| pmurias searches for chromatics "why monkey patching is stupid: post | 19:39 | ||
| PerlJam | just because something is stupid doesn't mean that perl 6 is going to prohibit it. | ||
| ruoso | mostly because monkey patching is the most effective way of patching modules you don't maintain... | 19:40 | |
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| PerlJam | "goto considered harmful", but we still have it anyway | 19:40 | |
| moritz_ | not prohibiting is not the same as using it as an essential language feature | ||
| ruoso | it's not an essential language features... | ||
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| ruoso | if you use it without doing monkey patching... it won't be monkey patching... | 19:41 | |
| but the Packages do need to be shared... | |||
| pmurias | PerlJam: my point it that the monkey patching package sharing shouldn't be the default | 19:42 | |
| PerlJam | pmurias: you mean the ability to do so? | ||
| ruoso | pmurias, you mean cloning the Package at every 'use'? | ||
| pmurias | ruoso: yes | ||
| ruoso | ouch... | ||
| that hurts... | |||
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| moritz_ | doesn't sound too efficient | 19:43 | |
| pmurias | we are not C++ | ||
| ruoso | pmurias, you know that makes package variables to behave in a very unexpected way, don't you? | ||
| like... | 19:44 | ||
| consider a file with: module Foo { our $bar = 0; sub baz { return $bar++ } }; | 19:45 | ||
| now consider that you have a script... that use Bla; and use Ble; | |||
| both Bla and Ble use Foo | |||
| and they will then point to different packages... | |||
| and point to different values of $bar... | 19:46 | ||
| that's very unexpected... | |||
| PerlJam | ruoso: Hmm. I think pmurias' way could work if on clone the original package were the "proto-package" for all of the clones and it held the singleton instances of the package variables, but subroutines were all their own. (if you get my meaning) | 19:47 | |
| moritz_ | how is that different from aliasing then? | 19:48 | |
| PerlJam | It's more like the anoymous class you get when you compose traits into an object at runtime | ||
| pmurias | ruoso: imagine what happends when Bla uses Foo >= 0.1 and Ble uses Foo 0.1 | ||
| PerlJam | s/anoy/anony/ | ||
| pmurias | * happens | 19:49 | |
| ruoso | PerlJam, that's also unexpected... since subroutines are just variables... | ||
| pmurias | ruoso: you can always use module Foo { sub baz { return $*Foo::bar++ } } | ||
| moritz_ | pmurias: that's not very DWIMmy | 19:50 | |
| ruoso | pmurias, not DWIMmy at all... | ||
| pmurias | things should be correct not DWIMy | 19:51 | |
| moritz_ | things should be both corret and DWIMy | ||
| ruoso | I mean... we could abolish globals entirely... | ||
| but I don't think that's the idea | 19:52 | ||
| pmurias | globals should only be used when you explicitly use them | ||
| and if take efficiency in mind the way i'm proposing is faster | 19:55 | ||
| s/if/you/ | |||
| ruoso | well... it's up to TimToady now | 20:05 | |
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| ruoso | pmurias, btw... "our $bar" is kinda explicit use of globals... | 20:11 | |
| TimToady | but the current package is lexically scoped | 20:15 | |
| and I suspect a Foo::bar without an explicit "use Foo" would pick the same Foo that a bare "use Foo" would do | 20:16 | ||
| ruoso | TimToady, but the package is our by default... | 20:17 | |
| which ends up being the same... | |||
| TimToady | the meaning of package names is lexically scoped | ||
| ruoso | right... we agreed to this point... | ||
| the question is whether they point to the same thing on different places.. | 20:18 | ||
| i.e. the Bla and Ble example I gave above | |||
| TimToady | they point to different places. if two packages want to share a global variable, they need a third package that doesn't change version so often | 20:19 | |
| same for an exclusive resource | |||
| such as a database handle | |||
| pmurias | TimToady: what i'm proposing is that packages aren't global unless prefixed with a * | 20:20 | |
| TimToady | "Foo" is ever only a local alias to the long name | ||
| pmurias | TimToady: so does package Foo {...} create a GLOBAL::Foo? | 20:22 | |
| ruoso | right... but what does get shared? | ||
| TimToady | on phone... | ||
| ruoso . o O ( GLOBAL::Foo on phone... hmmm... ;) ) | 20:23 | ||
| pmurias | ; | ||
| ) | |||
| ruoso | more importantly... package Foo {...} as the first declaration on a file creates GLOBAL::Foo? | 20:25 | |
| TimToady | package Foo is short for "our package Foo" which creates it in the current package | 20:26 | |
| ruoso | which, as the first declaration, is * | ||
| TimToady | which might actually be Main at the start of the file | ||
| so it's possible we only have *Main | |||
| and that contains the others | 20:27 | ||
| ruoso | er... | ||
| the spec tells about both * and *Main | |||
| pmurias | er... | ||
| TimToady | well, the spec could always be wrong :) | ||
| pmurias hopes it is | |||
| ruoso | pmurias, that only change where it's stored... | ||
| pmurias, not the fact that they are stored as global and shared... | 20:28 | ||
| pmurias | TimToady: why doesn't the file start in a lexical package? | ||
| ruoso have run :( | |||
| TimToady | there are no lexical packages | ||
| pmurias | ? | ||
| ruoso have *to* run, actually... | 20:29 | ||
| TimToady | or they all are, in another sense | ||
| anyway, I have to go too... | |||
| ruoso later & | |||
| pmurias | S10:05 | ||
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| pmurias | TimToady: S10:55 | 20:30 | |
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| pugs_svn | r22348 | azawawi++ | [pugs] Fixed Use of uninitialized value $ENV{"PUGS_EMBED"} in pattern match (m//) | 20:39 | |
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| pmurias | moritz_: do you think "module *Foo { our $bar = 0; sub baz { return $bar++ } };" is not DWIMmy enough | 20:50 | |
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| moritz_ | pmurias: can you explain in two sentences to the average perl programmer why you need that * before the Foo? | 20:55 | |
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| pmurias | so all of you package variables are shared by everything that uses your module | 21:00 | |
| i don't consider the average programmer to understand less than i do | 21:01 | ||
| moritz_ | he does | ||
| pmurias | he shouldn't be changing the variables in the modules i'm using then ;) | 21:06 | |
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| pugs_svn | r22349 | azawawi++ | [pugs] Removed warning: defaultUserHooks in Setup script is deprecated. | 21:23 | |
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| rakudo_svn | r31390 | moritz++ | [rakudo] complete rewrite of tools/update_passing_test_data.pl, now the | 22:01 | |
| r31390 | moritz++ | output is much more informative (but less copy&paste frindly) | |||
| moritz_ | std: {:a<1>, :b(2)} <a b c> | 22:08 | |
| p6eval | std 22349: OUTPUT[parse failureā¤] | ||
| moritz_ | std: (1 | 3)<3 | 22:09 | |
| p6eval | std 22349: OUTPUT[parse failureā¤] | ||
| moritz_ | std: print < 3 | 22:11 | |
| p6eval | std 22349: OUTPUT[parsedā¤] | ||
| moritz_ | std: reverse<1 2 3> | 22:12 | |
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| p6eval | std 22349: OUTPUT[parsedā¤] | 22:12 | |
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| pugs_svn | r22350 | moritz++ | [t] moved listquote.t to spec/, deleted bogus tests, and rewrote many others | 22:16 | |
| r22350 | moritz++ | to use eval_dies_ok. | |||
| r22350 | moritz++ | Also updated TASKS. | |||
| r22351 | azawawi++ | [pugs] Reverted Setup.lhs from previous fix to clear warning | 22:17 | ||
| ahmadz_ | moritz: Cabal really complicates things | 22:18 | |
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| pugs_svn | r22352 | azawawi++ | [pugs] svn ignore on *.hi, Setup, config for third-party | 22:30 | |
| moritz_ | azawawi++ # pugs build system | ||
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| pugs_svn | r22353 | azawawi++ | set svn ignore on remaining ext/* temp files | 22:35 | |
| r22354 | azawawi++ | [pugs] Last of the svn ignores | 22:39 | ||
| r22355 | moritz++ | [t/spec] fixed syntax errors in listquote.t, moritz-- | 22:42 | ||
| r22356 | moritz++ | [t/spec] fudged listquote.t for rakudo, and remark on testing | 22:45 | ||
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| rakudo_svn | r31391 | moritz++ | [rakudo] added listquote.t to spectest_regression, and brought back into | 22:52 | |
| r31391 | moritz++ | alphabetical order | |||
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| pugs_svn | r22357 | moritz++ | [t/spec] fudged undef.t for rakudo | 23:07 | |
| r22358 | moritz++ | [t/TASKS] undef.t is now fudged, remove from the list | 23:08 | ||
| rakudo_svn | r31392 | moritz++ | [rakudo] added undef.t to spectest_regression.data | 23:13 | |
| r31392 | moritz++ | (funnily it has less undef warnings than int.t) | |||
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| ruoso | @tell pmurias, 'package *Foo' doesn't seem to make much sense, since 'package Foo' is already 'our package Foo' which means that it creates a lexical alias "Foo" for the package with the same name which is stored as a member of the package we're at. Considering the file starts to parse in package *, the package is seen as just 'Foo' inside this lexical scope and by anyone who "use" or "require" Foo... | 23:52 | |
| lambdabot | Consider it noted. | ||
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| ruoso | @tell pmurias, but is globally registered as *Foo. What you seem to be talking about is another type of scope visibility... something like... "my package Foo is export {...}" | 23:54 | |
| lambdabot | Consider it noted. | ||
| ruoso | @tell pmurias, but still, this only refers on which names are bound to the package, the package instance is still the same in all cases, the only difference is the way to access it. | 23:56 | |
| lambdabot | Consider it noted. | ||
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