»ö« Welcome to Perl 6! | perl6.org/ | evalbot usage: 'perl6: say 3;' or rakudo:, niecza:, std:, or /msg p6eval perl6: ... | irclog: irc.perl6.org/ | UTF-8 is our friend! | Rakudo Star Released!
Set by diakopter on 6 September 2010.
jnthn sorear: I think cotto_work++ is interested in what I'm working on becuase it is of interest for Parrot development. 00:00
cotto_work very much so
jnthn sorear: nqpclr is not meant to grow beyond what nqp-rx is; the aim is that it paves the way for Rakudo also running on the CLR. 00:01
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cotto_work Once the new object model is workable and Lorito is ready it'll be what our PMCs are implemented in terms of. 00:01
jnthn But it's also turning out to be very useful for rapid prototyping.
Since the runtime layer - unlike Parrot - is small enough to fit in my head, and I don't really have a user base to worry about just yet who care about the API of the runtime layer (whereas Parrot has to pay attention to API stability and deprecation issues). 00:02
It's kinda -Oprototyping at the moment. :) 00:03
Though admittedly becoming less so as more stuff gets built up. :)
cotto_work It's the kind of thing I'd read up on anyway though. I find it fascinating. 00:05
jnthn It's a fun area. :) 00:06
I'll have a bunch more time for it again after next week too.
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dalek ok/issue-39-pagedims: 51ea448 | (Jerome Eteve)++ | src/images/.gitignore:
Ignore make time generated src/image/ files
 00:18
ok/issue-39-pagedims: 4e8d751 | (Jerome Eteve)++ | / (3 files):
Allow any paper width and height to be specified in PAPER make variable
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lichtkind jnthn: o/ 00:51
the path quoting, is part of the reason we have it that fire tests get distinguishable from string ops?
karma Herbert Breunung 00:52
aloha Herbert Breunung has karma of 217.
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dalek ecza: 8d02fba | sorear++ | / (5 files):
Refactor and encapsulate stash handling
 00:54
: ba3aad7 | lue++ | misc/perl6advent-2010/schedule:
Added self to day 16 to teach Temporal to the masses.
 00:58
tpfwiki: (Herbert Breunung)++ | www.perlfoundation.org/perl6/index....ics_tablet 01:00
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lopnor hello everyone, 01:46
I started perl6 advent calendar in japanese 01:47
perl-users.jp/articles/advent-calen...010/perl6/
sorear wow! lopnor++ 01:48
dukeleto lopnor++
sorear welcome, if you're new here
lopnor i'm just a biginner for perl6 01:49
i don't know how to find/distribute user defined modules like CPAN 01:50
is there any good place for that?
sorear modules.perl6.org
lopnor thank you!
sorear the ecosystem is... new.
sorear tests his Japanese
lopnor articles are written in Japanese, but code is perl6. 01:53
please let me know if there are any bad codes 01:54
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sorear yeaahh this is way beyond my level :D 02:01
lopnor: is this an original calendar or is it translated from someone else's? 02:03
lopnor sorear: it's original. 02:04
japanese perl users make 6 tracks this year here. perl-users.jp/articles/advent-calendar/2010/ 02:05
including english track!
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sorear "tracks"? 02:05
lopnor it's analogy of some conferences. 02:06
6 advent calendars there :) 02:07
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lopnor which should i use proto or pls? 02:18
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rjbs In reference to today's Advent calendar entry, does one ever see both ==> and <== in one statement? 02:20
(apart from highly contrived examples) :)
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plobsing perl6: Bool::True ǁ Bool::False 02:24
p6eval pugs: OUTPUT«decodeUTF8': bad data: '\449'␤*** No compatible multi variant found: "&Bool::True"␤ at /tmp/1YJG2rK7xS line 1, column 1 - line 2, column 1␤»
..rakudo : OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Confused at line 22, near "Bool::True"␤»
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sorear .u ǁ 02:25
phenny U+01C1 LATIN LETTER LATERAL CLICK (ǁ)
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sorear .u ǁ 02:26
phenny U+01C1 LATIN LETTER LATERAL CLICK (ǁ)
sorear .u 2228
phenny U+2228 LOGICAL OR (∨)
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sorear I suspect you wanted that 02:27
rakudo: say (True ∨ False)
p6eval rakudo : OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Unable to parse postcircumfix:sym<( )>, couldn't find final ')' at line 22␤»
plobsing I figured it would be similar to french/texas quotes
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sorear lopnor: Why do your twigils use more than one color? 02:38
oh, it seems to be getting highlighted as Perl 6 02:39
the cheat sheert
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sorear lopnor: in day 4, say $_ better written as .say 02:41
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lopnor sorear: $data.[0].<text>.say; ? 02:44
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lopnor ah, 03:00
k
sorear no, .say for @*INC 03:02
I have no further comments to make on the code insets
lopnor yes, i found that. thank you
sorear hopes to someday be able to read the rest
lopnor fixed 03:04
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sorear sweet, 5.0kb exe for "use Test; plan 5" 06:36
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dalek ecza: d2e0804 | sorear++ | src/Metamodel.pm:
De-conflate packages and stashes in the compiler some more
 06:41
ecza: 09e2417 | sorear++ | / (2 files):
Use load-time commutative operators to build stash tree
ecza: 338a605 | sorear++ | / (2 files):
Use per-module BOOT functions
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dalek ecza: 04e2294 | sorear++ | src/ (2 files):
Fix augment declarations being ignored
 07:10
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dalek ecza: 42e73ab | sorear++ | lib/Kernel.cs:
Quick fix for multi-parameter roles
 07:27
sorear yay STD is running again and not (much) slower 07:28
up from 35.8 to 36.9 07:29
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dalek ecs: 995ad12 | TimToady++ | S29-functions.pod:
braino noticed by Eirik++

chrs just returns a Str, duh		 07:53
ecza: 54b8c18 | sorear++ | / (4 files):
Implement require (no importing yet)
 07:55
sorear also, I now know the true size of STD's compiled form 08:06
this 3.2MB file contains everything needed to run "require STD" 08:07
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sorear TimToady: STD.pm6 likes to pretend that compile-time subs and packages are fundamentally the same. How true is this? 08:08
TimToady I guess I'd need to see an example 08:15
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TimToady $.mode = Sleep; 08:25
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moritz_ phenny: ask masak re problem 1, what is meant by "Ayou also don't have to consider polygons with holes."? are only convex polygons considered? 11:40
phenny moritz_: I'll pass that on when masak is around.
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snarkyboojum moritz_: I'm guessing a polygon "with holes" refers to a polygon with other polygon(s) excluded from its interior 12:03
colomon that would certainly be my take. 12:06
isn't that problem 2? 12:07
snarkyboojum seems to be
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colomon rakudo: " this is \n\n \n \r a \t\t\n _ test".subst(/<-alpha>+/, " ").say 12:25
p6eval rakudo : OUTPUT« this is ␤␤ ␤
colomon dog! 12:26
doh! doh!
rakudo: " this is \n\n \n \r a \t\t\n _ test".subst(/<-alpha>+/, " ", :global).say
p6eval rakudo : OUTPUT« this is a _ test␤»
colomon rakudo: " this is \n\n \n \r a \t\t\n _ test".subst(/<:!Letter>/, " ", :global).say 12:28
p6eval rakudo : OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Unable to parse postcircumfix:sym<( )>, couldn't find final ')' at line 22␤»
colomon rakudo: " this is \n\n \n \r a \t\t\n _ test".subst(/<:!Letter>/, " ", :global).say
p6eval rakudo : OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Unable to parse postcircumfix:sym<( )>, couldn't find final ')' at line 22␤»
colomon rakudo: " this is \n\n \n \r a \t\t\n _ test".subst(/"_" | "'"/, "", :global)./subst(/<-alpha>/, " ", :global).say 12:30
p6eval rakudo : OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Confused at line 22, near "\" this "␤»
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moritz_ remove the / before subst 12:34
rakudo: say <a b c>.rotate 12:36
p6eval rakudo : OUTPUT«bca␤»
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colomon rakudo: " this is \n\n \n \r a \t\t\n _ test".subst(/"_" | "'"/, "", :global).subst(/<-alpha>/, " ", :global).say 12:48
p6eval rakudo : OUTPUT« this is a test␤» 12:49
colomon rakudo: " this is \n\n \n \r a \t\t\n _ test".subst(/"_" | "'"/, "", :global).subst(/<-alpha>+/, " ", :global).say
p6eval rakudo : OUTPUT« this is a test␤»
colomon moritz_++
moritz_ barely involved :-)
colomon Never-the-less, you solved the problem I'd forgotten I had. :)
moritz_ is now in the process of solving p2 from masak++ 12:50
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colomon has to finish his Advent post before starting those. 12:50
which in practice, means finishing fiddling with this code and getting on to the actual blogging part. 12:51
moritz_ you do know that s:g/// is partially implemented? (except for $/ interpolation) 12:52
colomon yeah, I just like .subst. 12:54
moritz_ good :-)
in fact I like it too, because it's non-destructive
colomon moritz_: mind if I distract you from masak++'s project to look over my Advent post code? 12:58
moritz_ colomon: is it in wp?
colomon nope, I'll make a gist
moritz_ ok
colomon gist.github.com/737355 12:59
It works fine atm (well, slow), I'm just looking for any style suggestions.
moritz_ what should it do? 13:00
colomon It uses a Markov chain to create a random sequence of almost sensible text.
moritz_ right now I don't see a reason why you need a separate class
colomon "a locke god till toastrumps th his yout up grour babys and there but of thearlik"
how would you do it? 13:01
moritz_ you can just use an array
an array has push and roll too
colomon true.
It really wants to be an actual KeyBag, but that's NYI
moritz_ if you want to add methods later on, you could also do
class QuickThing { has @.values handles <push roll> } 13:02
colomon does that work yet?
moritz_ yes
colomon hmmmm....
moritz_ rakudo: class A { has @.values handles <push roll> }; $_ = A.new(values => (1, 3, 4)); .push: <foo bar>; .roll.say 13:03
p6eval rakudo : OUTPUT«1␤»
colomon \o/
moritz_ rakudo: class A { has @.values handles <push roll> }; $_ = A.new(values => (1, 3, 4)); .push: <foo bar>; .roll(5).say
p6eval rakudo : OUTPUT«4143bar␤»
moritz_ but it really only makes sense to have a separate data type if you add more methods
anyway, regarding style: 13:04
lines are too long
make that first regex / <[_']> /
$model-text.comb(/<alpha> | \s/) 13:05
is there anything besides <alpha> and \s left in the string?
colomon ooo, probably not
moritz_ if not, you can just use .
which I think is the default
colomon this is why another pair of eyes is good
moritz_ so just $model-text.comb
line 19 can become %next-step{$last-two} //= QuickKeyBag.new 13:06
or if you use Array instead of QuickBag: 13:07
%next-step.push: $a ~ $b => $c
rakudo: say 5.roll
p6eval rakudo : OUTPUT«5␤»
colomon wait, that's too good to be true. 13:08
rakudo: my %a; %a.push: "10" => "blue"; %a.push: "20" => "green"; say %a.perl
p6eval rakudo : OUTPUT«{"10" => "blue", "20" => "green"}␤»
colomon rakudo: my %a; %a.push: "10" => "blue"; %a.push: "10" => "green"; say %a.perl
p6eval rakudo : OUTPUT«{"10" => ["blue", "green"]}␤»
colomon okay, that's enough to convince me to switch to Array 13:09
moritz_++ 13:10
moritz_ tests in a shorted version 13:11
$ perl6 chain.pl < ~/p6/rakudo/README
a perl is copyright virtual machine rakudo perl a perl machis rakudo parrot virt
colomon: nopaste.snit.ch/26959 13:12
rakudo: .say for { a => 1, b => 5 }.roll(10)
p6eval rakudo : OUTPUT«a␤b␤b␤b␤b␤a␤b␤a␤a␤b␤»
colomon rakudo: .say for { a => 1, b => 10 }.roll(20) 13:14
p6eval rakudo : OUTPUT«b␤a␤b␤b␤b␤b␤a␤b␤b␤b␤b␤b␤a␤a␤b␤b␤a␤b␤b␤b␤»
colomon I didn't realize that was already implemented.
moritz_ you can change to hash based .roll with %next-step{$a ~ $b}{$c}++
colomon: it was a weekly challenge, back in the days
colomon I like pushing to a Hash so much I almost don't want to change it! 13:15
moritz_ it's ok :-)
colomon I think maybe I'll present it both ways. 13:16
rokoteko is there any perl5+xs implementation of perl6? I mean like; did anyone ever even try it? 13:17
colomon so, I think the script should be Unicode-friendly as presented, but off the top of my head I don't have an easy way to test that.
rokoteko I mean it is probably very insane to go on extending perl5 code to perl6. but what about building perl6 with perl5 and making the difficult parts possible or fast with XS? 13:18
moritz_ rokoteko: I don't know of any such attempt 13:19
rokoteko Im not aware either.
are there any fundamental problems with it? 13:20
moritz_ colomon: one problem is that it can run into situations where it can't continue to generate output
rokoteko: two, actually. One is the impedance mismatch between p5 and p6, and the second is XS 13:21
colomon moritz_: I don't believe that's true, though I've worried about it several times.
rokoteko moritz_: not enough people how know XS?
moritz_ rokoteko: no. Those that know it don't want to use it
colomon: it can happen, for example if you hit the end of the training string
colomon ooooo, good point 13:22
rokoteko moritz_: do you happen to know XS?
moritz_ if you train it with 'abc', and start with 'ab', it will generate 'abcAny()Any()Any()...'
rokoteko: just a bi
t
rokoteko moritz_: nods. I think this is the "broken telephone" that Ive played as a kid. :) 13:23
ie. whisper something to the next in the queue and see how different the message is at the end.
Ive never met a person that can program XS and don't love it. :)
moritz_ rokoteko: the real problem is that p5 and p6 are too different to p6 calls to equivalent p5 primitives 13:24
rokoteko: and p5 is not a good assembler language, and not a good language to generate code for
rokoteko: so there's really no point in using p5 for the runtime
instead you ideally want something that has very cheap, primitive objects and allows you to build your own object system 13:25
and define your own dispatch
colomon moritz_: can you think of any other case where it would fail to have a next option?
rokoteko moritz_: ok. :) I was mainly curious. 13:26
moritz_ rokoteko: maybe I should blog about it
perl6 chain.pl < ~/p6/rakudo/README
a parrot virtual is is copyright c 2Any()Any()Any()Any()Any()
no idea what went wrong there
oh, I changed <-alpha> to \W. Maybe that was not so bright 13:27
colomon We don't have FIRST yet, do we?
moritz_ nope
colomon I'm trying to figure out how to gracefully restart. 13:28
and maybe have better starts, as well, it's kind of English-centric right now.
my $first = $model-text.substr(0, 1); 13:33
my $second = $model-text.substr(1, 1);
my @chain := $first, $second, -> $a, $b { %next-step{$a ~ $b}.roll // $first, $second } ... *;
that doesn't work correctly, which is making me scratch my head right now 13:34
ah, // ($first, $second) is a bit better
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colomon interesting weirdness in sequence op, actually. 13:36
rakudo: my @a = -> { rand, rand } ... *; say @a[0]
p6eval rakudo : OUTPUT«(timeout)»
colomon rakudo: my @a := -> { rand, rand } ... *; say @a[0] 13:37
p6eval rakudo : OUTPUT«0.594149672283919 0.956055957629484␤»
colomon surely you should only get the first element....
moritz_ rakudo: my @a := -> { rand, rand } ... *; say @a[0].WHAT 13:39
p6eval rakudo : OUTPUT«Seq()␤»
moritz_ it seems it doesn't flatten where it maybe should
colomon 1,1,{ $^a + 1, $^b * 2 }...* # 1,1,2,2,3,4,4,8,5,16,6,32... is an example in the spec 13:40
moritz_ so it really should flatten 13:41
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moritz_ maybe just use // $first or so 13:41
colomon but that's not guaranteed to have a valid follow up, either 13:42
moritz_ right
colomon essentially you have the risk of it just becoming $first, $first, $first, $first...
moritz_ maybe just go until *.defined instead of *
erm, !*.defined
colomon moritz_++
moritz_ then you get shorter, but not repeated sequences 13:43
$ perl6 chain.pl < ~/p6/rakudo/README
a bug moduall onfiguall ortall rakudo perl alwastal to do cuse tage pers aults p
moritz_ likes it
colomon but then [^80] pads with Anys
moritz_ then use ... what's the method called... 13:44
colomon munch
moritz_ right
colomon bingo
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colomon so, where can I get a handy Unicode file to test it with? 13:45
smash hello everyone
colomon rakudo: $*IN.slurp.say # would be nice to have locally
p6eval rakudo : OUTPUT«Land der Berge, Land am Strome,␤Land der Äcker, Land der Dome,␤Land der Hämmer, zukunftsreich!␤Heimat bist du großer Söhne,␤Volk, begnadet für das Schöne,␤vielgerühmtes Österreich,␤vielgerühmtes Österreich!␤␤Heiß umfehdet, wild umstritten␤liegst dem Erdteil du inmitten,␤einem stark…
colomon smash!
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moritz_ colomon: it's in the perl6/evalbot repo, file 'input' 13:50
colomon I don't see it there? 13:51
file is 'stdin'
moritz_++ 13:52
rindolf Hi all.
colomon perl6 markov2.pl <../evalbot/stdin 13:53
land dem er sch volk brüftes söhnentarkerreiß in get derreiten heich viebtes öst
\o/
(one of my early drafts could only handle 'a' .. 'z', this makes me happy!)
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moritz_ has a sign error in his solution to p2 14:53
rindolf moritz_: what is p2?
Pentium II? 14:54
moritz_ rindolf: problem 2 of strangelyconsistent.org/blog/masaks...ng-contest
moritz_ doesn't have solutions to pentiums
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tadzik o/ 15:41
kersplat I am on a Pentium IV 15:42
I think it may be a dual core
how do I tell?
dmidecode?
rindolf kersplat: dual core or hyperthreading?
flussence lscpu 15:44
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kersplat CPU(s): 1 16:02
Thread(s) per core: 1
Core(s) per socket: 1
CPU socket(s): 1
I guess it is single core
but it is running at 2.7 ghz!
that is something, isn't it?
tadzik is it? My old P4 is 3.0 too 16:03
and I prefer the core2 in my thinkpad which is "only" 2.1 :) 16:04
Intel like hitting more and more Gigaherzes in their CPUs those days
kersplat so 2 cores at lower speed better than one core at higher speed? 16:05
rindolf kersplat: actually, even a single core of the 2 cores is speedier. 16:10
kersplat oh well, serves me right for buying used computers
but that is all I can afford
I am not doing any serious number crunching or gaming
or graphics
so *shrug*
and to think six years ago the Pentium IV was the peak of technology 16:11
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colomon moritz_: huh, Hash.roll doesn't seem to actually be in the spec? 16:24
moritz_ colomon: maybe as Hash.pick ?
colomon not there either. 16:25
(at least, as far as I see.)
TimToady are pick and roll in .Any? 16:27
s/\.// 16:28
rakudo: say { a => 1, b => 2 }.pick.WHAT 16:29
p6eval rakudo : OUTPUT«Str()␤»
TimToady o_O
rakudo: say { a => 1, b => 2 }.pick
p6eval rakudo : OUTPUT«b␤»
moritz_ TimToady: what do you think it should return? Pair? 16:30
TimToady was expecting Pair
a normal hash is not a KeyHash
or a Set
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colomon oh noez, a complication for my Advent calendar post! 16:30
moritz_ colomon: just go with what is implemented 16:31
colomon you sure?
it would be easy enough to go back to the Array implementation. 16:32
It would require rewriting a paragraph or two, that's all.
TimToady I'm just not sure that a normal hash should be expected to behave that much like a set, but I could be wrong
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colomon ooo, or I could leave it as is and add a note 16:33
that would let me sneak the cool array version into the post, too.
TimToady we do have sets
colomon TimToady: but what I need is a KeyBag
TimToady ah 16:34
colomon which we do not have yet.
TimToady well, there's always Hash.keys.pick
that will always work
moritz_ or Hash.roll(80).key
colomon but it won't be right.
it wouldn't be weighted properly
TimToady moritz_: you mean ».key I think 16:35
moritz_ TimToady: was just about to correct it
TimToady realizes that » is a plural marker 16:36
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colomon rakudo: say +( 1, 2, 3, { Any } ... * ) 16:59
p6eval rakudo : OUTPUT«3␤»
colomon moritz_: ping 17:02
moritz_: I've scheduled the post to go in 3 hours. Would appreciate it if you could proofread it, my tuits and limited and fuzzy at the moment. 17:05
colomon feels like this isn't the greatest example of the brilliance of p6, but the post turned up a Rakudo bug, a spec hole, and taught him several new p6 constructs, so it was pretty useful on the balance. 17:06
moritz_ colomon: will proofread 17:12
colomon moritz_++
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moritz_ colomon: ENODRAFT 18:57
colomon ?
moritz_ colomon: ah, scheduled, not drafted
colomon oh, it's up on wordpress instead of in Mu
moritz_ colomon: btw the "standard input file of p6eval" might better be described as Austrias National Anthem 18:59
colomon: apart from that, it looks great 19:00
colomon oh, sure, be technical. ;) 19:01
If you feed it Austria's national anthem (the standard "Land der Berge" file that p6eval uses as stdin), you'll get strings like...
moritz_++
or should national anthem be capitalized? 19:02
moritz_ I think lower case is fine 19:03
colomon++ # nice post 19:04
colomon blush
thanks for all your help.
as I've said before, I really enjoy working with you. :)
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sorear good * #perl6 19:32
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sorear TimToady: ping 20:10
lue hello citizens of the interwebs o/ 20:16
dukeleto lue: greetings, meatbag. 20:34
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moritz_ any volunteers for tomorrow's advent post? 20:52
maybe dukeleto about perl 6 in postgres?
or sorear on * ? 20:53
or anybody else on anything? 20:55
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masak #perl6! \o/ 20:59
phenny masak: 11:40Z <moritz_> ask masak re problem 1, what is meant by "Ayou also don't have to consider polygons with holes."? are only convex polygons considered?
moritz_ s/Ay/Y/
masak why would "holes" have anything to do with convex polygons?
moritz_ thinks he just implemented the general case anyway
because something that's not convex can have holes 21:00
moritz_ doesn't know what else "holes" means in this context
masak the set difference between a large filled pentagon and a small filled pentagon is a polygon with a hole in it. 21:01
(to a first approximation) 21:02
moritz_ doesn't see how the algorithm for a non-convex polygon and for a polygon with holes can differ, but is fine with that explanation
masak it has two borders, and splits the plane into three parts, one of which is the "inside".
sorear hi masak 21:06
masak hi sorear 21:07
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moritz_ has solutions to p1 and p2, but hasn't tested with non-convex polygons yet 21:17
arnsholt masak: A question for p2: Is a point on the border inside or outside? 21:24
masak arnsholt: I chose not to spec that. 21:26
according to me, it's not. but I don't care much.
arnsholt 'k
moritz_ those are the fine points that make geometric algorithms so nasty to implement 21:27
masak indeed. that's part of why I expect lots of variation on that one.
moritz_ masak: how many people have signed up so far?
masak three \o/ 21:28
and that's about the only question about the internal state of the contest that I've prepared to answer ;) 21:29
not even the MOP will work for the rest.
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jnthn
.oO( What about the BRUSH? )
 21:32
masak for a brief moment, I thought "oh noes, another higher-level OO concept I have to learn about!" :P 21:33
jnthn I want to invent one just so I can call it that. :P 21:34
masak "the successor of the MOP" :)
jnthn nommed a lovely curry this evening o/ 21:35
moritz_ takes a certain masochistic delight in finding new test cases that make his polygon detection thing fail 21:36
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masak nommed a lovely dhal this evening o/ 21:40
moritz_ \o/ all tests passed 21:43
moritz_ still has no post for tomorrow's advent calendar entry, and no volunteer either 21:44
zb and tomorrow is only 15 minutes away over here :-P 21:45
masak zb: hi! new face? don't recognize your nick. 21:46
zb hi :)
masak welcome! we hug newbies here, rather than bite them :)
zb thanks!
masak how did you find Perl 6 and #perl6? 21:47
lue hai masak o/
arnsholt goes to check the list of taken topics for the advent calendar
masak lue: \o
++arnsholt
zb masak: found it somewhere on the internet..
masak :) 21:48
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lue arnsholt: I just snagged Day 16 for Temporal a while back 21:49
arnsholt Right, not that much
moritz_: I think I saw operator precedence parsing on the brainstorming list a while back 21:50
I might be able to write one about that from my experiences writing Parrotlog
(Which has been in NQP, admittedly) 21:51
moritz_ arnsholt: that would be great 21:57
arnsholt: for tomorrow? or a later day?
arnsholt Sounds like you really need something for tomorrow, so I could write up something 21:58
moritz_ \o/
arnsholt If I could use you guys for support a bit as well, it should turn out decent
moritz_ is available for support, except when sleeping 22:00
arnsholt Better get started then =)
Should I write it up as a gist or something? 22:01
moritz_ or put it in the mu repo 22:02
misc/perl6advent-2010/articles/ or so
arnsholt Someone might have to give me access to mu. I'm in the perl6 org. but I'm not sure if I have write privs to mu 22:04
moritz_ arnsholt: done 22:05
kersplat and to think six years ago the Pentium IV was the peak of technology
arnsholt Cheers
sorear moritz_: What about * did you want me to write about?
Unless you meant Rakudo Star...?
moritz_ sorear: about Whatever you want to write 22:06
masak sorear: I want you to know I'm excited about what niecza could mean for me in terms of speed. 22:11
sorear: I want to start with the Markdown parser, but if that turns out well, I'll probably rewrite the whole of psyde to work on niecza. 22:12
(partly because ~2 minutes is starting to feel like a long time just to update the blog)
moritz_ masak: from p4, base-test 22:13
is run("3\ncomputer\n"), "computer takes 0,1\ncomputer wins\n"
masak yes.
moritz_ that's not the only possible winning move
masak no.
moritz_ but by masakian decree, that's what the program must do to be considered correct? 22:14
masak if your algorithm happens to do one of the other two, you're free to ignore that test.
either change it or write me a note.
but it's not terribly hard to add an exception and a cheerful comment in your code, either.
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masak colomon++ # "laß in ber bist brüften las schören zeites öst froher land der äckerzeichöne lan" 22:17
sorear wonders if that means anything in German 22:19
jnthn phenny: "laß in ber bist brüften las schören zeites öst froher land der äckerzeichöne lan" 22:20
phenny: "laß in ber bist brüften las schören zeites öst froher land der äckerzeichöne lan"?
phenny jnthn: "let in over brüften read times are eastern Schoer happy land of the long äckerzeichöne" (de to en, translate.google.com)
moritz_ it does not 22:21
jnthn happy land of the long \o/
moritz_ but it sounds not too bad :-)
masak is a big believer in letting in over brüften
lue just like the funniest joke in the world 22:22
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lue straight from monty python: 22:27
phenny: "Wenn ist das Nunstück git und Slotermeyer? Ja! Beiherhund das Oder die Flipperwaldt gersput!"?
phenny lue: "If the Nunstück git and Slotermeyer? Yes! Or the Beiherhund the Flipperwaldt gersput!" (de to en, translate.google.com)
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moritz_ phenny: "mein Luftkissenboot ist voller Aale"? 22:34
phenny moritz_: "My hovercraft is full of eels" (de to en, translate.google.com)
jnthn
.oO( It's aalle full of 'em! )
 22:37
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lue which mailing list is recommended for the Perl6 deficient (aka newcomers)? 22:45
moritz_ lue: the mailing lists are separated by topic, not by proficiency level
in language design, user problems, compiler writer's topics, announcement 22:46
lue rephrase: which mailing list would you recommend to a newcomer with questions about P6?
moritz_ what kind of questions?
lue (seems like perl6-users)
moritz_ how to achieve $x? what does $y do?
then perl6-users
lue yes. the I-just-found-out-about-Perl6-through-the-advent-or-some-other-tutorial kind of stuff 22:47
moritz_ right
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lue drafting Day 13 post 23:04
moritz_ -> sleep 23:05
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lue Quick! Can anyone remember off the top of their heads a moment in the channel that perfectly demonstrates the nature of #perl6 !? (i'm looking too) 23:11
dalek ecza: d1ad2d3 | sorear++ | src/Sig.pm:
Kill old unused binder generator
 23:12
ecza: 406e042 | sorear++ | src/ (7 files):
Rename clr_string to str as it is not VM-specific
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sorear #perl6 has many natures 23:12
there's punfests with jnthn and masak, insane techno with jnthn and pmichaud, high level meta-mode with pmichaud and TimToady, ... 23:13
risou_ excuse me, I have 2 question. 23:16
what will the difference of = and := be? 23:17
sorear := is lower level and represents the linguistic concept of aliasing 23:18
taken in isolation, = and := are the same
but in interation, := creates aliases
niecza: my $x := 1; my $y := $x; say $y 23:19
p6eval niecza 54b8c18: OUTPUT«1␤»
sorear niecza: my $x = 1; my $y := $x; $x = 1 say $y
p6eval niecza 54b8c18: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Two terms in a row at /tmp/9PWaPW6lRO line 1:␤------> my $x = 1; my $y := $x; $x = 1 ⏏say $y␤ expecting any of:␤ bracketed infix␤ infix or meta-infix␤ statement modifier loop␤Parse failed␤»
sorear niecza: my $x = 1; my $y := $x; $x = 1; say $y
p6eval niecza 54b8c18: OUTPUT«1␤»
sorear niecza: my $x = 1; my $y := $x; $x = 3; say $y
p6eval niecza 54b8c18: OUTPUT«3␤»
sorear niecza: my $x = 1; my $y := $x; $y = 3; say $x
p6eval niecza 54b8c18: OUTPUT«3␤»
masak sorear: when ruoso and pmurias roamed the channel together not long ago, they had insane techno too.
sorear niecza: my $x = 1; my $y = $x; $y = 3; say $x 23:20
arnsholt moritz_/masak: I've committed an initial short draft in perl6advent/articles/opp.pod
Have a look?
p6eval niecza 54b8c18: OUTPUT«1␤»
masak has a look
sorear risou_: is it clearer now?
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masak arnsholt: pulled but see no perl6advent/articles/opp.pod 23:21
risou_ i see... 23:22
dalek : 4315acd | (Arne Skj􏿽xE6rholt)++ | misc/perl6advent-2010/articles/opp.pod:
First draft of OPP post.
arnsholt masak: I r idiot
Comitted, but forgot to push =)
risou_ if $y := $x, $y and $x indicate same address ?
sorear yes 23:25
risou_ thx, i understand 23:26
plz teach, another question.
what will the difference of .. and ... be?
masak arnsholt: "For extra credit, try writing a grammar that gets the precedence right in all cases without using operator precedence. It's not as easy as you think." 23:28
arnsholt: enlighten me. isn't it just a matter of recursing the subrules right?
arnsholt It's a bit fiddly actually 23:29
Getting the oeprators to bind correctly is kinda tricky
Or, I couldn't get it right right away at least
=)
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masak I thought the chief gains from OPP was speed. 23:30
s/gains/gain/
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arnsholt Yeah, it's more efficient as well 23:30
But it's a lot more practical for implementation as well 23:31
s/for implementation/to use/
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lue grr, I'm getting rejected adding a new file to the mu/ repo 23:40
masak lue: check that .git/confic has the right origin address? 23:41
the one that is read/write, not just read.
er, .git/config
arnsholt Ah, crap. <EXPR> isn't actually in "normal" Perl 6, only NQP
masak thought EXPR was in STD, even 23:42
and in Rakudo.
23:43 Bzek left
arnsholt So did I 23:43
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arnsholt I get ``Method 'EXPR' not found for invocant of class 'Math''' for my code though >.< 23:44
dalek : 70e49da | lue++ | misc/perl6advent-2010/articles/community.pod:
Added first draft of my Perl 6 Community post.
 23:45
: b8316a8 | lue++ | misc/perl6advent-2010/articles/opp.pod:
Merge branch 'master' of [email@hidden.address]
lue I just forgot to git pull beforehand
I invite you to take a look at community.pod, tell me what you think.
masak lue: next time, if you pull with --rebase, you won't make a merge commit.
masak looks
lue ok, thanks
arnsholt masak: Apparently it's an optional thing to do 23:47
masak 'Things like "I think there should be a beat-object-with-catfish operator in the language" go here.' # lue: :) 23:48
arnsholt S05:2485-6 "perhaps with a bottom-up "middle layer" to handle operator precedence"
masak arnsholt: that surprises me, given how central OPP parsers are in every Perl 6 implementation. 23:49
arnsholt Yeah. I'm not sure how to proceed now, though
masak lue: don't feel obligated to include Perl 6 code if you can't think of any. 23:50
lue Alright (I don't have *nearly* enough P6-fu to come up with a Christmas Tree oneliner, like the one last year) 23:52
masak I didn't make that one, someone on Twitter did. :)
'night, #perl6 23:54
lue rakudo: say 'a'.ord 23:55
p6eval rakudo : OUTPUT«97␤»
lue rakudo: "hello".split('') » .ord «+» 13 » .chr.join('').say # let's see if it works 23:57
p6eval rakudo : OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Confused at line 22, near "\"hello\".sp"␤»

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