»ö« Welcome to Perl 6! | perl6.org/ | evalbot usage: 'perl6: say 3;' or rakudo:, niecza:, std:, or /msg p6eval perl6: ... | irclog: irc.perl6.org/ | UTF-8 is our friend!
Set by sorear on 4 February 2011.
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On96 TE 01:18
YES! Just as inspector clausau said once "the case is solvet".
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On96 foreach my $name ( $query ->param ) {my @val = $query ->param( $name );foreach ( @val ) {$_ = Encode::decode_utf8( $_ );} $name = Encode::decode_utf8( $name ); :-) 01:20
simply decoding and encoding at the right places...
UTF-8 is working! 01:21
sorear I recommend not putting spaces before -> 01:24
Spaces before postfix operators break in Perl 6
according to perldoc CGI, you should just be able to use CGI '-utf8'; and have it all automatic 01:26
flussence_ the best way to handle utf8 is pretend it doesn't exist, unless you're the one doing IO 01:27
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lue hello! o/ 01:40
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sorear hi. 01:45
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dalek ecza: 5d5bdc7 | sorear++ | lib/Cursor.cs:
Add support routines for new dispatch-method model
 02:14
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mberends good morning 04:16
lue good morning o/ 04:18
mberends I ran Rakudo spectests overnight, and have observed a significant slowdown since a week ago 04:19
it could be the local computer, does anyone else notice the full spectest suite taking approximately twice as long? 04:22
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mberends
.oO( if only someone would develop a test result aggregation database. oh wait, what was that popolnik? )
 04:24
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dalek ecza: 2c07097 | sorear++ | lib/Kernel.cs:
Implement topologically ordered method cache invalidation
 05:53
mberends hi sorear 05:54
sorear hi mberends
how are things for you?
mberends busy at $work, after hours too 05:55
sorear is sneaking up on multiple dispatch
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mberends sorear: nice 05:56
sorear I have to sleep now, but I'll probably have protoregexes working /correctly/ tomorrow 05:57
mberends :)
sorear good chance of nominal MMD by #phasers, but no promises
tuit shortage. 05:58
sorear out
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mberends Rakudo slowdown confirmed on a second hardware/software combination, seems to have happened around 2011-03-12 :( 06:42
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mberends anyone: could someone (*tm) with git-bisect-fu search for which Rakudo commit slowed Rakudo tests/spectests down by a factor of 2? 07:12
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jdhore mberends, I'm betting you're not using a parrot built with the gms GC 07:17
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mberends jdhore: this is using whatever Rakudo's Configure.pl --gen-parrot chooses 07:18
jdhore what's the date of your build?
mberends today, latest checkouts 07:19
jdhore odd
mberends whenever PARROT_REVISION changes I do a make realclean and rm -rf parrot parrot_install
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dalek ecza: c58db17 | (Martin Berends)++ | Makefile:
[Makefile] add targets aot spectest clean realclean and help
 08:40
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On96 Is it great crime to decode utf8 before saving a file and then encode it utf8 when displaying it (the results is an html page)? 08:50
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masak morning, zebras. 09:02
On96: no, that doesn't sound like great crime at all.
sounds like what you'd want to do in general with the I/O barrier and strings. 09:03
on the "inside" of your application, you want to treat the strings are sequences of characters. on the "outside", you generally have to treat them as sequences of bytes.
which means what you generally do is decode, process, encode. 09:04
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tadzik hello zebras 09:14
masak \o 09:18
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moritz_ good morning 09:19
masak rakudo: .say for ("hi", "good morning" X~ " ") Z~ <tadzik moritz_> 09:28
p6eval rakudo 25e5bd: OUTPUT«hi tadzik␤good morning moritz_␤»
masak interesting question on the above: how would the thing be parsed without the parens? 09:29
masak sees if he can get viv working locally again
ah. S03 mentions just that: "Note that list associativity (X) only works between identical operators. If two different list-associative operators have the same precedence, they are assumed to be non-associative with respect to each other, and parentheses must be used to disambiguate." 09:30
std: .say for "hi", "good morning" X~ " " Z~ <tadzik moritz_>
p6eval std 4608239: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤"X~" and "Z~" are non-associative and require parens at /tmp/8SzyU2iLVZ line 1:␤------> .say for "hi", "good morning" X~ " " Z~ ⏏<tadzik moritz_>␤Check failed␤FAILED 00:01 121m␤» 09:31
masak right. case closed.
moritz_ wow, being greated with syntactically invalid code... #perl6 has seen better times :-)
masak hey! my original code was valid! :P 09:32
moritz_ fairy nuff
masak also, the tie between "good times" and "syntactic validity" is tenuous at best... 09:34
masak stops overanalyzing
On96 Thanks masak... then it looks like the dream I had last night was productive! :-) 09:36
masak :)
"#perl6: Dream Productively"
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moritz_ still no new MoR chapter :( 09:57
masak also, the last couple chapters have been, well. not worse in quality, but also not building on the main story. 10:03
moritz_ considering that it's a fan fiction of philospher's stone, there needs to be some motivation to go into that forbidden corridor 10:05
so the last chapter might be the builtup for that
but yes, so far it looks like a side story
masak oh, true. it's not that I mind the extra focus on Hermione; she already has a pretty large part in the story, so it makes sense. 10:07
and leading up to the forbidden corridor would indeed explain the detour.
tadzik who was working on the irc client? 10:09
moritz_ tadzik: TiMBuS I think
masak the place where I last laughed out loud was '"But that's *crazy*!" Susan blurted out. [...] The Headmaster leaned down until he was face-to-face with the young girl. [...] Dumbledore put a finger to his lips and twiddled them, making a *bweeble-bweeble-bweeble* sound.'
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masak moritz_: have you started reading the Sequences? 10:25
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moritz_ Sequences? 10:40
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patrickas wiki.lesswrong.com/wiki/Sequences 10:42
hello all!
tadzik hello!
patrickas o/ Master Zebra!
tadzik whoa, whoa :) 10:43
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donri finished MoR 10:45
donri craves new chapters 10:46
patrickas Dang I forgot moritz_ hides joins and leaves! lost the intended effect :-)
donri ... unfortunately you'll have to wait weeks to get your fix now
tadzik I hide them too :) 10:47
moritz_ reading it in the logs, in retrospec it's quite impressive :-)
donri aww!
tadzik (:
donri is patrickas the author?
patrickas donri HELLO NO!
donri is EY?
patrickas donri: Yes, Elizer is the author of MoR he used to blog frenquently on LessWrong , some of his posts have been assembled into "The Sequences" (url pasted above) 10:52
donri in deed 10:53
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donri rakudo: say ?" " 11:17
p6eval rakudo 25e5bd: OUTPUT«Bool::True␤»
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masak buubot: ?eval say !!"0" 11:23
ENOBUUBOT
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masak anyway, in Perl 5, "0" boolifies to False. 11:24
perl6: say ?"0"
p6eval rakudo 25e5bd, niecza v3-78-gc58db17: OUTPUT«Bool::False␤»
..pugs: OUTPUT«␤»
masak oh. in Perl 6 too :)
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tadzik . o O ( I should reuse the "Master Zebra" title ) 11:26
masak "Mastering Regular Expressions and Zebras"? 11:29
huf i have a little app called zbr that makes a zebra run to the middle of my terminal, poop and then jump on it 11:31
i managed to wean myself off of typoing bzr as zbr that way ;)
of course, now i type bzsr 11:32
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masak huf: did you write the zebra app yourself? 11:36
tadzik care to share?
huf yeah, it's just a very small curses thing
hmm, i wonder where i put the source 11:37
tadzik masak: as in whyhello.im/tadzik :)
masak tadzik: ah :) 11:39
tadzik: in a couple of years, you can advance to being "Senior Master Zebra" :)
patrickas tadzik is that a black unstriped zebra ?
tadzik oh, I'll have to find a padawan first :) 11:40
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tadzik you're quite close to it anyway, masak ;) 11:40
masak "padawan" as in "apprentice"? 11:42
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masak that's me :) 11:42
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huf masak: huf.parawag.net/zbr.tgz 11:43
or tadzik 11:44
it's more stupid and less useful tho :)
masak sure :)
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tadzik that's super cool :) 11:46
masak huf: make error: gist.github.com/877423
oh! it's because I don't have some curses lib installed?
huf looks like it
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masak now it works. huf: *lol* 11:58
huf :)
masak "why did you install the 'ncurses' package?" -- "I'd rather not say." 11:59
huf essential tools
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moritz_ "because of the zebras" 14:27
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moritz_ mberends: I can't confirm any significant rakudo slowdowns since Toulouse-47-g3680ac3 (2011-03-08) and now. All spectest runs took about 20 minutes on my dual core laptop 14:57
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sorear mberends++ 15:38
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colomon masak, moritz_: don't suppose one of you guys knows an easy way to generate a binary tree graph for a blog post? 17:10
masak colomon: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Graphviz ? 17:12
though given enough time, I might just skip the graphviz step and work out a Perl 5/6 script to generate the SVG directly. 17:13
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colomon Oooo, I remember using Graphviz to try to chart the entity relationships in a STEP file once. That was one hideously complicated graph. 17:14
masak++
masak or two scripts. one to generate the coordinates for the nodes and edges, and one to decorate those with SVG elements. 17:15
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masak pipe one to the other, and voilà! 17:16
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colomon I guess is the point where I should mention my other blog. :) 17:18
not p6 related, alas: exploringjt.wordpress.com/ 17:19
masak nice. hadn't heard about JT before. 17:21
colomon It's an annoying CAD format. 17:23
They made it simple and elegant, and then heaped on about four layers of compression stuff on top of everything.
poop, graphviz won't install on my OS X. :( 17:27
ascii tree, here we come.
masak colomon: might be you can use this nice tool: github.com/masak/tote/commit/033fc...3fd2923730 17:36
(note, ASCII graph above, rendered .png version below)
ah, here it is: ditaa.sourceforge.net/ 17:40
at some point, I'd like to make a Perl 6 port of that tool. it's seriously cool.
flussence_ I once tried to get graphviz to render the entire dependency graph of packages I have installed on my desktop. It doesn't like doing graphs with 1500+ nodes apparently... 17:41
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masak flussence_: I think I've seen graphviz graphs with far more nodes than that... 17:42
flussence_ It might've been running out of /tmp space, come to think of it...
sorear flussence_: once I tried to render the static call graph of a 1MB executable using graphviz
flussence_ (which is on a tmpfs, so it probably ran out of RAM) 17:43
sorear it generated a .svg with a nominal size of 10^6 by 10^3
that was about 30,000 edges iirc
flussence_ ouch
(hm, I tried again and it gave me a 32766x55 png...) 17:46
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moritz_ I've successfully rendered signing graphs of my GPG key ring 17:48
but it's hard to find a viewer that doesn't crash on it :-)
colomon masak: nifty! 17:49
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masak colomon: yeah. I should use it more myself. 17:53
tadzik o/ 17:56
masak \o 17:58
colomon o\
masak what's that... a leg? 17:59
colomon saluting hand, I reckon. :)
masak oh right.
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colomon masak: new ditaa-powered post: exploringjt.wordpress.com/2011/03/1...an-coding/ 18:24
masak \o/ 18:33
colomon: have you considered making the edges as T crossings rather than slashes? 18:34
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colomon T crossings? 18:38
slashes obviously came out wrong...
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masak T crossings, as in one vertical line from the parent node meeting a horizontal line joining the child nodes somehow. 18:45
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colomon ah 18:50
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lue hello world o/ 20:03
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colomon \o 20:15
masak hellue!
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mberends hi lue! how is your C++ experiment going? 20:23
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takadonet hey all 20:30
lue mberends: Forgotten about :) . Besides, I think I'm more interested in getting my Pod reader working first. 20:32
.oO[ It's the start of spring break (week-long break from school) and it's snowing outside :D ] 20:33
mberends lue: ok, and have a good week (spring in NL is for real now :-) 20:34
arnsholt It's spring in Norway too. The snow is melting! =D 20:35
I so look forward to snow-free Oslo 20:36
mberends remembers piles of snow in Oslo during NPW2009
(or was it heaps? not stacks, anyways) 20:37
arnsholt Hehe. When was that again? Late march or something?
mberends April 16-17 2009 www.perlworkshop.no/npw2009/ 20:39
arnsholt Impressive. The snow is usually gone by that time
lue The weather was good for a bit, but the snow and other wintery weather came back just in time for situational irony. 20:40
arnsholt Where in the US you at? 20:41
mberends winter often has a final snap during Easter in the UK as well 20:42
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lue Pacific Standard Time zone :) [only daylight savings is on, grrr.] 20:45
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arnsholt mberends: Yeah, although easter is a bit early for that here 20:48
mberends oh yeah US is already on DST, Europe does that only next weekend :/
arnsholt Easter is the traditional "go to the mountains for cross-country skiing"-holiday =)
lue Easter is when this year? 20:49
arnsholt Stupid late
Last week-end of march, IIRC
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mberends Easter Sunday will be April 24 20:52
arnsholt Heh. Shows how good my memory is 20:56
mberends coincidentally Orthodox Easter is also on the same date, unlike in most other years christianity.about.com/od/faqhelpde...change.htm 20:57
flussence_ std: sub MAIN(Str :$foo, Str :$bar);
p6eval std 4608239: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Malformed block at /tmp/AbynIkbxjt line 1:␤------> sub MAIN(Str :$foo, Str :$bar)⏏;␤ expecting any of:␤ constraint␤ param_sep␤ parameter␤ routine_def␤ trait␤Parse failed␤FAILED 00:01 120m␤»
lue That's a day after DW Season 32 begins! 20:58
flussence_ ooh, thanks for reminding me :)
lue (in both the UK *and* the US, btw \o/) 20:59
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colomon US is getting DW the same time this season? 21:06
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mberends feels his gloat-fu weaken ;) 21:09
lue colomon: indeed it is. Actually the Christmas Special last, er, christmas, aired on the same day as well. It's also the first season to have filmed footage on US soil! 21:12
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tadzik o/ 22:17
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