»ö« Welcome to Perl 6! | perl6.org/ | evalbot usage: 'perl6: say 3;' or rakudo:, niecza:, std:, or /msg p6eval perl6: ... | irclog: irc.perl6.org/ | UTF-8 is our friend!
Set by sorear on 4 February 2011.
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jnthn morning o/ 08:21
moritz \o morning
jnthn Wow. 'twas quiet overnight... 08:30
moritz received two emails regarding the IRC logs overnight 08:31
jnthn Oh. Not so quiet there then. :)
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dalek kudo: 7114f56 | moritz++ | build/PARROT_REVISION:
bump PARROT_REVISION to get some testing on recent birds
 09:10
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colomon is dangerously close to proposing that p6 needs an Fop meta operator... 11:38
jnthn Oh Feq... 11:39
moritz colomon: what should it do? 11:40
colomon convert both operands to FatRats. :)
moritz eeks. 11:41
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donri can has fap operator? 11:55
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tadzik no please, no unicode in this one. I know there's a character for everything... 11:57
moritz .u fap 11:58
phenny U+A0D4 YI SYLLABLE FAP (ꃔ)
jnthn
.oO( phew! )
 12:00
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takadonet morning all 12:09
moritz .u ♺ 12:14
phenny U+267A RECYCLING SYMBOL FOR GENERIC MATERIALS (♺)
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lola_91 holy_cow came.. holy_cow left.. and nobody is here :| 13:16
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Moukeddar_ layla again :) 13:17
moritz holy cow!
lola_91 moritz: did you see that username? :D
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lola_91 Moukeddar_: yup! :D 13:17
moritz lola_91: no, I ignore joins/leaves/quits/renames in here, there are far too many of them
Moukeddar_ hilarious
in xna there is waldo_xxx 13:18
lola_91 lool :D
Moukeddar_ i didn't know waldo was into porn
moritz, how to ignore them ? 13:19
moritz Moukeddar_: depends on the client
/IGNORE #perl6 ALL -PUBLIC -ACTIONS 13:20
in irssi
lola_91 moritz: sometimes it is funny to do something absolutely useless.. :) like just walking by sea side..
moritz: wait.. I find that useful.. I take my words back :p
moritz lola_91: your picture of me might not be quite accurate :-) 13:21
Moukeddar_ done ,thanks moritz
lola_91 moritz: I know, I just force you to stop hiding it ;) 13:22
jnthn grrrrr...Russian visas are a darn nuisance to get... :/
lola_91 jnthn: LOOOOOOOOOOOOOL
Moukeddar_ moritz, be careful
gurls are dangerous :)
lola_91 jnthn: when are you going?
jnthn lola_91: Flying on Thursday next week, all being well. 13:23
lola_91 eh... :(
moritz Moukeddar_: yes, and so are men :-)
lola_91 jnthn: have fun :)
jnthn lola_91: Provided I didn't screw up the visa papers...
lola_91 jnthn: everything is getting harder a bit.. even for my little brother who was not born in Russia, we hardly got him a passport.. 13:24
Moukeddar_ what ? 13:26
i'm not dangerous
jnthn lola_91: Not fun :(
moritz Moukeddar_: you are dangerous, if you have enough relative velocity to another human :-) 13:27
lola_91 jnthn: heeeeeeey! you can make it fun if you want! When I ws in Russian last time I had so much fun! :D walking, visiting famous places.. seeing people.. :) beer for u :P :D
jnthn lola_91: Oh, being in Russia is great fun! 13:28
lola_91: It's getting the visa that is annoying.
lola_91 jnthn: ah that is true.. :\
jnthn lola_91: Spent most of today so far just working that out...getting all the papers done and sent. :| 13:29
lola_91 sometimes we had to wait for 30-40 days for a simple paper! :\ but I hope for you it will be better :)
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lola_91 jnthn: ah! our choclate is not bad too ^_^ 13:30
jnthn If I have to wait that long I'll miss YAPC... :/
lola_91: You and chocolate! :P
lola_91 jnthn: and mmm.. there is that thing we call...mmm.. zefer... dunno in english :S 13:31
tadzik do we need a visa for YAPC?
jnthn tadzik: YAPC::Europe? No
tadzik whew
jnthn YAPC::Russia? Yes.
BinGOs In Soviet Russia, visa needs you!
jnthn :P
lola_91 jnthn: I live on chocolate.. :P
jnthn lola_91: Healthy living... :) 13:32
Moukeddar_ in soviet russia jokes , pretty funny
jnthn lives on more than beer. Beer is nice, but there's just too many other tasty things too :) 13:33
lola_91 jnthn: i was kidding about beer :P i also try to eat useful things since am kinda need to gain weight :s 13:34
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lola_91 time to go... have fun all! :D 13:36
jnthn bye, lola_91 o/ 13:37
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uvtc I see that jnthn++ has been putting lots of work into npq. Does Rakudo use this newer npq yet? 17:05
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masak o/ 17:05
colomon \o
uvtc: no
uvtc Is Rakudo written in nqp? 17:06
colomon I believe jnthn++ is hoping to get a little more done before he (or better yet, we) starts migrating Rakudo to it.
masak uvtc: and C. and PIR. and Perl 6.
jnthn uvtc: rakudo/nom branch is where that work will be done.
I'm REALLY close with the nqp changes now. 17:07
o/ masak
masak \o
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jnthn uvtc: The Rakudo grammar and actions are currently written in NQP, and some module loading bits are. 17:08
uvtc: In rakudo/nom, those will stay in NQP. Also the main compiler object will be in NQP, the meta-objects will be in NQP also.
The current set of PIR built-ins will largely go away. Any PIR that stays will get wrapped in a Perl 6 body. There won't be any pure PIR files that we compile in Rakudo. It'll be just NQP, Perl 6 (in the setting), C (dynops, dynpmcs) and the odd bit of PIR in method bodies. 17:09
masak wut? www.perldonate.com/ 17:10
"The fact of the matter is you have to be a really good programmer in Perl and C, and have knowledge of the way many other languages work, to be able to make a useful contribution to Perl development." -- emphatically not.
Moukeddar masak, that www.infow.com is a BOMB
thanks
any similar?
uvtc Could someone be so kind as to point me to "rakudo/nom"? I only see at github rakudo/rakudo and rakudo/star. 17:11
masak Moukeddar: yes, but not right now. just hand around here ;)
Moukeddar infoq.com
jnthn uvtc: It's a branch in rakudo/rakudo
Moukeddar masak, no problem
moritz uvtc: but there's not yet much to be seen
jnthn uvtc: Nothing to see yet.
uvtc: Check back in a week or two. :)
uvtc jnthn: Doh. Thanks.
masak re the above quote, the fact of the matter is that the most precious thing people can donate to us, good programmers or not, is their time, interest, and enthusiasm. there are many ways to apply those.
jnthn uvtc: All the work so far has been in NQP, leading up to this.
uvtc jnthn: Will definitely check back. :) 17:12
jnthn uvtc: But in reality much of that work directly applies to Rakudo also.
Su-Shee masak: now that is some nonsense..
colomon masak: I dunno, a few hundred thousand dollars wouldn't hurt either. ;)
Su-Shee masak: I ofcourse meant the matter of fact statement and not yours :) 17:13
masak Su-Shee: I was wondering :P
colomon: sure! no doubt. but our bottleneck isn't really money.
colomon well, it kind of is, but only in a "huge amounts of money" sense. 17:14
I mean, if there was enough money to hire ten of us to work full time on Rakudo, things would get done more quickly. 17:15
masak yes, but.
look at Star Wars.
colomon for people with sensible amounts of money, donating time and enthusiasm is probably more useful.
Su-Shee colomon: if you don't have the money, you'd need attraction to others. 17:16
masak the good trilogy was made on a limited budget with limited resources. the bad trilogy was made with a ton of money, a huge staff, and all the latest visual effects.
"art from adversity".
I believe that's not just sour grapes talking. I think in some sense, Perl 6 needs to be an underdog project. 17:17
uvtc Does Rakudo rely on STD.pm6 (the "standard Perl 6 grammar") to know what it's parsing? 17:18
Su-Shee well .. people like me would like to see it really be a commonly used language because that's the only way you'd get all tools and libs and modules you really need. 17:19
colomon uvtc: not yet
moritz uvtc: it imitates large parts of STD, but it doesn't use it in the form of calling it
colomon uvtc: Rakudo's grammar is a stripped-down and hacked-up version of STD
PerlJam uvtc: STD.pm6 is more of a guideline for Rakudo :)
Su-Shee colomon: sure it's not hacked down and stripped up? ;) 17:20
uvtc Wow. Interesting. What is the reason for Rakudo not using STD.pm6?
PerlJam uvtc: STD.pm6 is Too Advanced for one.
colomon uvtc: STD.pm6 is by far the most complicated thing ever written in Perl 6. Rakudo is not sophisticated enough to parse it yet.
... maybe more process than parse, I suppose. 17:21
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uvtc Hm. I think I'm asking questions, the answers to which I don't yet have the sophistication to understand. :) 17:21
PerlJam uvtc: also, STD.pm6 was/is in flux enough that it would have been a nightmare to keep up with the changes.
colomon PerlJam++ # very good point 17:22
masak that's better now, though.
moritz note that niecza uses a far less stripped-down version of STD.pm6
which is why you get all sorts of fancy error message from it *and* you can run code with it
niecza: if(3) { say 'oh yes' } 17:23
p6eval niecza v4-76-g7bf5ef9: OUTPUT«Unhandled exception: System.FormatException: Unknown char: A␤ at System.Double.Parse (System.String s, NumberStyles style, IFormatProvider provider) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 ␤ at System.Double.Parse (System.String s, IFormatProvider provider) [0x00000] in
..<filename unkno…
moritz ouch
this is not the error message you are looking for
jnthn fancy error message!
colomon std: if(3) { say 'oh yes' }
p6eval std 9f27365: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Word 'if' interpreted as 'if()' function call; please use whitespace instead of parens at /tmp/65fLwXTkMw line 1:␤------> if⏏(3) { say 'oh yes' }␤Unexpected block in infix position (two terms in a row) at /tmp/65fLwXTkMw line
..1:␤---…
PerlJam moritz: an excellent counter example! :)
moritz that error message means 'niecza is currently hosed up, clean and rebuild please' 17:24
uvtc Blogging request: Would love to see an introductory article describing how Rakudo, npq, STD.pm6, PCT, etc. all fit (or would fit, or should fit, or soon might fit) together.
moritz uvtc: like perlgeek.de/blog-en/perl-6/rakudo-overview.html but in updated? 17:25
uvtc moritz: {...reading...} 17:26
PerlJam moritz: updated to include the other implementations too would be very nice.
moritz: and other Rakudo backends
moritz PerlJam: I fear I don't know enough about other implementations to do that
PerlJam well, maybe just niecza. At least you can ask sorear lots of questions :) 17:27
moritz and I don't know anything about other rakudo backends, except that they are in planning
niecza: if(3) { say 'OH NOEZ' } 17:29
p6eval niecza v4-76-g7bf5ef9: OUTPUT«Unhandled exception: System.FormatException: Unknown char: A␤ at System.Double.Parse (System.String s, NumberStyles style, IFormatProvider provider) [0x00000] in <filename unknown>:0 ␤ at System.Double.Parse (System.String s, IFormatProvider provider) [0x00000] in
..<filename unkno…
moritz huh.
PerlJam What's needed is wiki-like editing and someone to prod others to add their respective parts.
moritz PerlJam: you have my permission to turn it into a wiki. I can supply the .svg source for that file 17:31
ah, it's even in rakudo
in doc/architecture.{svg,html}
uvtc moritz: re. "like {this} but updated?", no, I don't think so. I'm more interested in learning what pieces Rakudo is made of. Evidently, it's mostly made of nqp, but also some C, PIR, and Perl 6. It also makes use of a "grammar" 17:32
moritz: but I don't really understand what that means in a practical sense.
PerlJam uvtc: do you know what NQP is ?
uvtc PerlJam: fwict, it's a subset of Perl 6.
moritz uvtc: in what practical sense? for modifying it? for compiling it? for runtime speed? feature completeness? 17:33
PerlJam uvtc: aye. Just enough of a subset to parse the Perl 6 used to create Rakudo (the various modules, grammar and actions). The bits that NQP can't actually implement natively yet are farmed out to either C or PIR 17:34
uvtc moritz: In a practical sense -- that is, reading the wikipedia page on grammars does not really help me understand what a grammer is and how Rakudo would use it to run Perl 6 code. 17:37
moritz: Perhaps I skipped too many high school english classes. :) 17:38
colomon Rakudo uses it to parse Perl 6 code.
PerlJam uvtc: a grammar describes the structure and semantics of a language.
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PerlJam uvtc: so, for example, the rule moritz has been trying to diddle with niecza is "an identifier immediately followed by parens is a function call" i.e. "foo()" is a function call, but "foo ()" is not 17:40
uvtc PerlJam: Ok, the grammar is what specifies that. Gotcha. 17:41
PerlJam uvtc: in our case, the grammar is written in Perl 6. 17:42
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uvtc But in what way can Rakudo use STD.pm6 as its parser if it have a parser to parse it. (How much wood would a wood chuck chuck...) 17:44
s/if it/if it must/
PerlJam uvtc: through a process called bootstrapping. 17:45
uvtc: you build a mini-compiler that undertands enough of your language that you can then write your language in terms of itself. 17:46
moritz uvtc: nqp can also parse Perl 6 (though not quite as completely as STD.pm6 can)
it's just like most C compilers today are written in C
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jnthn uvtc: NQP keeps an "already compiled" version of itself 17:47
It uses that to compile itself again, so changes can be made
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jnthn At some points, that "already compiled" base version gets updated. 17:48
uvtc So, at some point in the future, Rakudo's own bootstrapping parser will be able to parse STD.pm6, and then it will be able to handle any Perl 6 you throw at it? 17:49
PerlJam uvtc: maybe
moritz at least on the syntax level, yes
colomon that's the ideal goal, for sure. 17:50
uvtc I think I need to sip some herbal tea and ponder the nature of bootstrapping compilers...
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uvtc Thanks very much for the info, all. :) 17:51
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fglock I've updated perlcabal.org/~fglock/perlito.html 18:09
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masak fglock++ 18:13
fglock :) 18:14
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colomon #phasers in 8 min? 18:52
Util colomon: yes 18:53
masak ooh, colomon++ for reminding. 18:54
jnthn ooh, me too!
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masak rakudo: $_ = \()[0] 19:01
p6eval rakudo 7114f5: OUTPUT«Null PMC access in isa_pmc()␤ in '&infix:<=>' at line 1␤ in main program body at line 22:/tmp/y4MJK0IMPA␤» 19:02
masak submits rakudobug
rakudo: say \()[0] # it's really evaluating the \()[0] that causes the error 19:03
p6eval rakudo 7114f5: OUTPUT«Null PMC access in type()␤ in main program body at line 22:/tmp/ys1onhIQWa␤»
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masak rakudo: say 1 if 10 % i 19:10
p6eval rakudo 7114f5: OUTPUT«maximum recursion depth exceeded␤ in 'Numeric' at line 3200:CORE.setting␤ in 'Numeric' at line 3200:CORE.setting␤ in 'infix:<%>' at line 7622:CORE.setting␤ in 'infix:<%>' at line 519:CORE.setting␤ in 'infix:<%>' at line 519:CORE.setting␤ in 'infix:<%>' at line
..519:CORE.settin…
masak rakudo: 10 % i
p6eval rakudo 7114f5: OUTPUT«maximum recursion depth exceeded␤ in 'Numeric' at line 3200:CORE.setting␤ in 'Numeric' at line 3200:CORE.setting␤ in 'infix:<%>' at line 7622:CORE.setting␤ in 'infix:<%>' at line 519:CORE.setting␤ in 'infix:<%>' at line 519:CORE.setting␤ in 'infix:<%>' at line
..519:CORE.settin…
masak submits rakudobug
this one is from hakank++. he meant to write this:
rakudo: my $i = 3; if 10 % $i { say 1 }
p6eval rakudo 7114f5: OUTPUT«1␤» 19:11
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uniejo_ rakudo: i.perl.say 19:13
p6eval rakudo 7114f5: OUTPUT«Complex.new(0, 1)␤»
masak rakudo: say i === i 19:14
p6eval rakudo 7114f5: OUTPUT«Bool::True␤»
arnsholt Hmm. What's the sensible extension of modulo to the complex domain, I wonder?
masak arnsholt: might be there ain't one. in which case NaN would be fine. 19:15
but it shouldn't cause a stack failure.
arnsholt Yeah, there's no immediately obvious generalisation that I can see
Yeah, it's definitely a bug. Probably because noone found a sensible generalisation and the fallback is to numify both arguments, or some such at a guess 19:16
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masak no, I don't see how the idea of a remainder generalizes to the complex plane. 19:18
dakkar en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Euclidean_alg...n_integers 19:23
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masak cool, dakkar++ 19:26
that's the first *use* of Gaussian integers that I've seen. :)
but still, that definition of a complex remainder seems a bit tangled with the iterations of Euclid's algorithm. 19:27
PerlJam is coding something right now that would love to have some concise syntax for lagging by N elements while processing a list 19:28
(processing time-series data in phase space)
colomon The 10 % i sounds like a bug to me. I'll try to sort out what I've done wrong later today. 19:29
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masak Moukeddar: \o/ 19:45
Moukeddar hello masak
how you doing ?
masak Moukeddar: I'm less happy than usual... having Russian visa trouble :/
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masak but there are worse things in life ;) 19:46
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tadzik mumbles something about snow in may 19:46
frettled masak: and I guess explaining to them that they're all just Swedish emigrants from a thousand years ago will _not_ improve on that.
masak frettled: strangely, no.
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Moukeddar masak, ooh , bureaucracy crap right ? 19:47
masak frettled: visa application form just says "If you had USSR or Russian nationality at some time please indicate when and why you lost it"
Moukeddar: something like that.
jnthn "I lost it because I was Russian!"
Oh, they didn't mean that...
:) 19:48
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masak :P 19:48
Moukeddar well , you know , in Soviet russia ...
tadzik In Soviet Russia you fall on the snow?
Moukeddar fill the empty with the apropriate words
masak ...your visa gets YOU? 19:49
Moukeddar kinda :)
tadzik The bus cathes you? :)
Moukeddar the bus rides you
that has a meaning
jnthn
.oO( ouch! )
 19:50
tadzik I think "catches" is more subtle
Moukeddar i hope things will get solved for you masak
Rides is more nasty
which is so russian :)
tadzik . o O ( the cold cathes you )
masak Moukeddar: thank you. we'll see. :/
jnthn Russia is really quite nice. Getting a visa to go there is teh horrible though. 19:51
Moukeddar if not, just tell me
and we'll clear them up :)
just for you
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Moukeddar_ damn weather 19:52
masak, that website is awesome 19:53
been there all the afternoon :)
masak Moukeddar_: glad you like it :)
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Moukeddar_ is there something more like this? 19:54
masak Moukeddar_: you might want to check out distributedpodcast.com/2011/episode...ding-block -- and generally stuff that Greg Young has done.
Moukeddar_ what's CQRS ? 19:55
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masak Moukeddar_: :) 19:56
Moukeddar_: you should read the logs at irclog.perlgeek.de/cqrs-perl6/2011-04-15
Moukeddar_: and if you want to talk more about CQRS, pop into that channel and we'll have a chat. ;)
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masak doesn't want to distract #perl6 too much when there's a dedicated channel #cqrs-perl6 19:57
Moukeddar_ wow , that's some engineering stuff :) 20:00
masak it's a fascinating concept. quite eye-opening. 20:01
Moukeddar_ or mindblowing :) 20:02
wait , you're not Ivan right ?
masak not to my knowledge. 20:03
Moukeddar_ ok ;) 20:04
i'll brink a cup of tea 20:05
this is HOT :)
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Moukeddar masak, you're a master :) 20:14
masak I wish :P 20:15
Moukeddar you're good 20:17
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masak you say this only on the basis of a few links I provide? that just puts your judgment in question :P 20:18
tadzik masak: have a baby bison: i.imgur.com/FwwuK.jpg
I wonder if Baby Żubrs look similar :)
masak tadzik: awww!
Moukeddar all i see is STEAKS 20:19
tadzik you can't spell slaughter without laughter, eh?
Moukeddar masak, i'm talking from the log i'm reading
tadzik, i can,in arabic :) 20:20
tadzik :P
masak Moukeddar: oh -- in that case, thank you very much ;)
Moukeddar: I had a good teacher :)
Moukeddar you guys are making my summer plans even cooler ,
esp. you masak
in the end of this summer i'll be the new regional Guru :) 20:21
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Moukeddar masak, you're such good teacher :) 20:27
the smooth Teacher
masak I came back from that course in Poland all filled with inspiration. 20:28
it was easy to pass a fraction of it on to my friends here ;)
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masak moritz++ # parrot-dev :) 20:31
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masak judging from those timings, I should be running Rakudo 2011.01... :) 20:35
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moritz these timings mostly reflect nqp runtime, I think 20:39
s/nqp/nqp-rx/
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moritz finds that he probably didn't measure what he think he measured, and starts anew 20:41
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dalek p/ctmo: 932f6da | jonathan++ | src/ (2 files):
Make sure derived dispatchers are fixed up. Fixes the last two test regressions in the ctmo branch after the full switch to using compile time meta-objects.
 20:54
jnthn Test runs on ctmo welcome; merge to master imminent.
moritz test runs 20:55
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jnthn Danke :) 20:55
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dalek p/ctmo: 61e5ea0 | jonathan++ | src/stage0/ (6 files):
Update bootstrap.
 20:58
moritz t/p6regex/01-regex.t (Wstat: 0 Tests: 742 Failed: 656) Failed tests: 1-55, 62-83, 85, 87, 89-96, 100, 105-108 20:59
... and many more
the non-regex tests pass 21:00
jnthn huh, I don't even have them run on make test...
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moritz make p6regex-test 21:01
the Makefile line says 21:02
test: all core-test setting-test p6regex-test
jnthn huh, how come nmake test doens't run the tohers for me... : 21:03
:S
oh...no wonder it won't work
Moukeddar where's masak ? 21:04
jnthn $P0 = get_hll_global ['Regex'], 'Cursor'
That ain't gonna work any more...
moritz Moukeddar: Sweden :-)
jnthn Anyway, I expect it's the test harness that's broken.
Well, I can tell it is.
Moukeddar hehe ,thanks for the intel moritz
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moritz jnthn: maybe I can get around to rewriting it in nqp in the following days 21:05
jnthn moritz: That would be for the best
moritz: The code is old enough to still mention PGE in it.
moritz has taken the next three days off of work
jnthn moritz: I don't think I want to block rakudo/nom on fixing that. 21:06
moritz jnthn: that's ok
jnthn If regexes were actually broken I think we'd be failing to bootstrap. :)
OK, if all of core-test is OK, I think it's merge time.
jnthn goes for it 21:08
dalek Heuristic branch merge: pushed 20 commits to nqp by jnthn
jnthn OK, that leaves...installation. 21:10
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jnthn HLL.pbc, P6Regex.pbc and Regex.pbc conflict. :( 21:15
pmichaud: ping
moritz nqp: 'abc' 21:16
p6eval nqp: OUTPUT«sh: ./nqp: not found␤»
jnthn What's the "sh" short for there? ;) 21:17
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moritz wtf is killing the nqp on p6eval? 21:19
jnthn Does it fail to re-build somehow?
moritz the logs don't show it 21:21
jnthn: does nqp still set $/ or $0 after a regex match? 21:23
jnthn moritz: I've not knowingly changed that. 21:25
e.g. if it already did, I guess it still should
$0 isn't set
I mean
If $/ is there, $0, $1 etc just work.
moritz nqp: 'abc' ~~ /(.+)/; say $/[0]
p6eval nqp: OUTPUT«Confused at line 1, near "say $/[0]"␤current instr.: 'nqp;HLL;Grammar;panic' pc 20767 (src/stage2/gen/HLL.pir:5644)␤»
jnthn parens 21:26
moritz nqp: 'abc' ~~ /(.+)/; say($/[0])
p6eval nqp: OUTPUT«Symbol '$/' not predeclared in <anonymous>␤current instr.: 'parrot;PCT;HLLCompiler;panic' pc 146 (compilers/pct/src/PCT/HLLCompiler.pir:107)␤»
jnthn nqp: 'abc' ~~ /(.+)/; say($/[0])
p6eval nqp: OUTPUT«Symbol '$/' not predeclared in <anonymous>␤current instr.: 'parrot;PCT;HLLCompiler;panic' pc 146 (compilers/pct/src/PCT/HLLCompiler.pir:107)␤»
moritz nqp: 'abc' ~~ /(.+)/; say($0)
p6eval nqp: OUTPUT«Confused at line 1, near "say($0)"␤current instr.: 'nqp;HLL;Grammar;panic' pc 20767 (src/stage2/gen/HLL.pir:5644)␤»
moritz jnthn: that's what I mean
jnthn nqp: say($0)
p6eval nqp: OUTPUT«Confused at line 1, near "say($0)"␤current instr.: 'nqp;HLL;Grammar;panic' pc 20767 (src/stage2/gen/HLL.pir:5644)␤»
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jnthn oh, doesn't recognize those forms at all. 21:26
Did nqp-rx do that? 21:27
nqp: my $m := 'abc' ~~ /(.+)/; say($m[0])
p6eval nqp: OUTPUT«abc␤»
jnthn That works, mind. 21:28
moritz nqp-rx: 'abc' ~~ /(.+)/; say($0)
jnthn For the conflicting PBCs, I'm wodnering about prefixing them somehow
NQPHLL.pbc or some such
Bit ugly but...can't install it as HLL.pbc or it upsets nqp-rx, and thus Parrot's oplib building and stuff. 21:29
moritz that was my first attempt too, but I failed at renaming stuff :-) 21:30
Tene jnthn: so what's coming next for your work here, now that you've merged ctmo into master? 21:31
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jnthn Tene: rakudo/nom 21:31
Tene Great. :) 21:32
jnthn Tene: Getting Rakudo using new nqp and 6model and so forth.
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jnthn moritz: Yeah it's, er, intricate :) 21:32
tadzik jnthn: fails in t/setting/01-resizablepmcarray.t and t/setting/02-hash.t are alright? 21:35
jnthn tadzik: Yeah, those tests are kinda bogus-ish now 21:37
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jnthn tadzik: We used to poke stuff into the Parrot namespace 21:38
But it's time to stop doing workarounds like that. It's kinda evil.
moritz nqp: todo("foo")
p6eval nqp: OUTPUT«Could not find sub todo␤current instr.: '_block11' pc 30 ((file unknown):20)␤»
jnthn nqp: ok("foo")
p6eval nqp: OUTPUT«ok 1␤»
jnthn moritz: Feel free to ass to src/core 21:39
*add
testing.pm iirc
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moritz nqp: my $re = "bc"; say('abc' ~~ /$re/); 21:42
p6eval nqp: OUTPUT«Assignment ("=") not supported in NQP, use ":=" instead at line 1, near " \"bc\"; say"␤current instr.: 'nqp;HLL;Grammar;panic' pc 20767 (src/stage2/gen/HLL.pir:5644)␤»
moritz nqp: my $re := "bc"; say('abc' ~~ /$re/);
p6eval nqp: OUTPUT«bc␤»
moritz how do I interpolate as a regex? 21:43
jnthn <$re>
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moritz nqp: my $re := ".*"; say('abc' ~~ /<$re>/); 21:43
p6eval nqp: OUTPUT«abc␤»
moritz thanks
jnthn moritz: Think I've got the rename done. 21:45
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jnthn Couple of surprises. ;) 21:46
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dalek p: 8bffb73 | jonathan++ | / (11 files):
Some PBC renaming so we can install without trampling on things already in Parrot's library directory.
 21:54
p: 53e7266 | jonathan++ | src/stage0/ (6 files):
Update bootstrap after renaming.
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jnthn ah, nom branch isn't know by dalek... 22:02
jnthn tries to remember where to fix that
dalek kudo/nom: d8e5dec | jdhore++ | docs/release_guide.pod:
Add myself as the release manager for the May release.
kudo/nom: 25e5bd0 | TiMBuS++ | src/core/IO/Socket/INET.pm:
Changed IO::Socket::INET to act more like perl5's. One connection per object, acts a little more like a filehandle, and most importantly, actually works (the old code no longer connects).

Signed-off-by: Moritz Lenz [email@hidden.address]
rakudo/nom: 76425ab | moritz++ | src/ (11 files):
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tadzik :) 22:03
jnthn oh, it is, just not on push notifications
So I have to be patient ;)
tadzik heuristic branch merge fail?
pmichaud jnthn: pong
phenny pmichaud: 01 May 20:44Z <jnthn> tell pmichaud I managed to resolve the prefixes method issue relatively easily in the end. :)
jnthn Yeah
pmichaud: ETOOLATE
pmichaud +1
I often am.
jnthn That wasn't what I was going to tell you.
Well, ask :) 22:04
That was old news ;)
pmichaud so, what's the new news?
jnthn I had to install e.g. HLL.pbc as NQPHLL.pbc. Just used that prefix for now.
Otherwise we scribble over the ones nqp-rx installs
Which Parrot relies on
pmichaud wfm
jnthn And Rakudo master... :)
OK, good. :)
pmichaud could also be HLL-2 or HLL-nqp or something like that 22:05
but any name is fine
jnthn yeah, I don't feel too strongly.
pmichaud better might even be nqp/HLL.pbc
jnthn ooh, yeah
It's tied into use statements too... :)
Anyway, can always twiddle later with that if we feel like it. It's not too set in stone.
pmichaud well, then it could go into languages/nqp at some point
since we know we're going to *have* a runtime library, might as well make it a real language :-) 22:06
anyway, those are just ideas
jnthn We already do have .HLL 'nqp'
pmichaud right
so that tells me perhaps it should be languages/nqp/...whatever
jnthn The problem is that load_bytecode doesn't (as far as I could tell) look in languages/[hll name]/ at the moment.
pmichaud (and could potentially be installed that way by Parrot if/when Parrot adopts the new nqp)
not by default, no. but you can add it to the path, or you can use load_bytecode 'nqp/hll.pbc' 22:07
jnthn load_language does, mind...
True
Well, thing is we never write load_bytecode 'HLL.pbc' now. We write use HLL; :)
Well, use NQPHLL now...
pmichaud seems like 'use' could be smarter, then.
i.e., figure out where to look.
jnthn Yeah, it easily could.
pmichaud and use nqp::HLL; looks nicer still :-) 22:08
jnthn *nod*
pmichaud anyway, those are ideas -- whatever you decide for now will be just fine
we can always clean it up a bit later
jnthn Sure, I mostly just wanted to unblock working on rakudo/nom. :)
And not being able to install it was my last blocker. :) 22:09
pmichaud I still feel pretty uneasy about the way we generate constants in rakudo; part of me was thinking we might want to fix that first before the branch
but if you're ready for the branch already; any sequence is fine with me
jnthn Generate constants?
masak .oO( constant unease )
pmichaud for example, 1.45 currently ends up in being several runtime calls to generate a Rat
jnthn Eww.
pmichaud *including* runtime calls to generate a constant 145 and 100 from strings
jnthn Worse is that 42 gets re-built everytime. 22:10
Well, also bad
pmichaud right
jnthn :)
Well, we can fix that
Just shove it into the SC.
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pmichaud anyway, it shouldn't be a blocker 22:10
again, either way is fine
....and I'm being called to the other room, so I'll bbl (or maybe tomorrow)
jnthn It's a trivial fix with the new stuff I've built.
So I'll probably take it on during nom. :)
pmichaud wfm 22:11
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jnthn Catch you later/tomorrow 22:11
pmichaud I'm going to continue fleshing out a benchmark suite of sorts
jnthn OK, excellent
tadzik . o O ( CATCH { you.later } )
pmichaud then I'll turn to nqp/raknom
afk
jnthn tadzik: Well, you can try :P
tadzik :D:D
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tadzik jnthn: mind me fixing those perl6multisub.c:955:55: warning: suggest braces around empty body in an 'if' statement ? 22:14
jnthn Which compiler is the style cop?
:P
tadzik gcc of course :) 22:15
jnthn meh
Feel free if it makes things quieter. :)
tadzik I'm on 4.5.2
jnthn perl6multisub.pmc's life is somewhat endangered.
But the code in it will for the most part stay, just elsewhere. :)
masak why does gcc call it an "empty body"? that's a silly name for dangling syntax. 22:16
tadzik now that I look at it I'm not sure I know what gcc actually means
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tadzik if (foo); bar; is where it should produce such a warning 22:19
masak right.
tadzik *shrug* 22:20
I'll pass
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tadzik well, gcc shuts up when you use { } around the if'ed statement. Stupid 22:21
jnthn gcc--
msvc++ 22:22
;)
masak gccbug!
tadzik for some reason panda can no longer build with make -j2 22:24
but it passes all tests on rakudo/nom :)
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masak 'night, #perl6 22:38
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dalek kudo: 42dcfd1 | masak++ | src/core/Int.pm:
[src/core/Int.pm] made gcd signature slurpy

This way, there's less need to invent a corresponding infix:<gcd> op just to be able to reduce over it. And it's not like &gcd is spec'd anyway. :-)		 22:39
dr_df0 hello all 22:42
is perl6 moving away from parrot vm?
i was reading some news ... 22:43
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jnthn dr_df0: Where'd you read that news? 22:45
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dr_df0 dont remember now ... so many rss'es :) 22:47
jnthn: i'll look for it 22:48
jnthn dr_df0: Perl 6 is language, so it's a meaningless question as you asked it. :) If you really meant, "is Rakudo moving away from Parrot vm", then no, but it is looking to support *additional* backends.
dr_df0 jnthn: right, I meant Rakudo ... after all specs reading such a mistake ... sorry :) 22:49
jnthn No worries :)
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tadzik the spectest passes on rakudo/nom 22:57
jnthn tadzik: I'll soon put a stop to that... :) 22:58
tadzik :) 23:00
fun!
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tadzik 'night #perl6 23:09
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jnthn sleep & 23:16
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