»ö« Welcome to Perl 6! | perl6.org/ | evalbot usage: 'perl6: say 3;' or rakudo:, niecza:, std:, or /msg p6eval perl6: ... | irclog: irc.perl6.org/ | UTF-8 is our friend!
Set by sorear on 4 February 2011.
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colomon rn: say 2 ** 78 01:15
p6eval rakudo 097361, niecza v21-15-gf226bf6: OUTPUT«302231454903657293676544␤»
colomon rn: say (2 ** 157).log10 01:19
p6eval rakudo 097361: OUTPUT«47.261709319245␤»
..niecza v21-15-gf226bf6: OUTPUT«47.261709319245043␤»
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bugger hi perl6 01:51
sorear hello bugger.
welcome to #perl6. 01:52
bugger a LWP::Simple install error. gist.github.com/3747164
good morning sorear! 01:53
sorear:can you help me? 01:54
sorear I cannot personally help you, I don't know anything about LWP::Simple 01:55
bugger sorear:that's too bad.
sorear cosimo: tadzik: ping 01:56
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bugger sorear: bye! anyway. thanks. 01:58
01:58 bugger left
sorear bah! 01:58
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colomon was going to try to build a copy locally, but wasn't fast enough. 02:02
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sorear hopefully ey'll be back. 02:03
ingy anyone know what channels fglock is on? 02:06
sorear I think fglock just doesn't like IRC in general 02:08
doy seen fglock
aloha fglock was last seen in #perl6 7 days 8 hours ago joining the channel.
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sorear he talked more in Perl than I've ever seen on irc 02:09
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Circlepuller__ r: printf "%c", <7 ''> 04:35
p6eval rakudo 097361: OUTPUT«»
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yarp r: say "good morning"; 04:47
p6eval rakudo 097361: OUTPUT«good morning␤»
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moritz \o 05:00
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GlitchMr Cannot locate native library 'libmysqlclient.so' 05:49
Interesting :-)
dalek p: 8d5e5ff | moritz++ | / (2 files):
bump parrot revision to release
 05:55
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GlitchMr Uhmmm... ? doesn't work in SQLite... 06:25
Interesting
method do(Str $statement, $attr?, *@bind is copy) {
my $sth = self.prepare($statement);
$sth.execute(@bind);
But... shouldn't it have prepared statements
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tadzik sorear: pong 06:26
sorear tadzik: you're too late, sorry
tadzik bah
sorear someone came in with panda/LWP-Simple trouble, but they already gave up and left 06:27
tadzik shame
GlitchMr www.php.net/manual/en/sqlite3stmt.execute.php
tadzik yeah, seems like it fails tests
GlitchMr Oh, there are no prepared statements
like that
also... 06:30
return ($rows == 0) ?? "0E0" !! $rows;
Shouldn't it be $rows but True?
std: /\0/ 06:41
p6eval std b842bb3: OUTPUT«ok 00:00 42m␤»
GlitchMr rakudo: /\0/
p6eval rakudo 097361: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Unrecognized backslash sequence at line 2, near "/"␤»
GlitchMr gist.github.com/3748052 06:46
I'm almost sure I'm bored
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sorear n: /\0/ 06:47
p6eval niecza v21-15-gf226bf6: ( no output )
sorear rn: say "\0".ord 06:48
p6eval rakudo 097361, niecza v21-15-gf226bf6: OUTPUT«0␤»
sorear rn: eval "/\\\0/"
p6eval rakudo 097361, niecza v21-15-gf226bf6: ( no output )
sorear GlitchMr: rakudobug
eval eval "/\\\0/" 06:50
buubot_backup sorear: No output.
sorear eval eval "/\0/" 06:51
buubot_backup sorear: No output.
sorear buubot_backup: eval "/\0/"
buubot_backup sorear: /\0/
sorear buubot_backup: eval "/\\\0/"
buubot_backup sorear: /\\0/
sorear buubot_backup: ref eval "/\\\0/"
buubot_backup sorear: Couldn't match input.
sorear buubot_backup: eval eval "/\\\0/"
buubot_backup sorear: No output.
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GlitchMr Type check failed in assignment to '$!orm'; expected 'ORM' but got 'MiniDBI::ORM' 06:55
has MiniDBI::ORM $.orm;
Hmmm... interesting
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GlitchMr > $db.table('a').insert(:cake<b>) 07:05
INSERT INTO `a` (`cake`) VALUES ('b')
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cosimo sorear: pong 07:13
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stephaaan hi :) 07:54
moritz hello 07:55
masak mornin'
stephaaan just a probably noobish question - pastie.org/4752245 - lets say, connector is a variable - how do I change {connector}? {$connector} wont work :/ 07:56
moritz stephaaan: that looks like Perl 5 code, but #perl6 is, as the name implies, about Perl 6 07:57
stephaaan uhm...well :D
07:57 stephaaan left
moritz too late to him somewhere else 07:58
*to point him 07:59
moritz still wonders why people simply ignore the 6 in #perl6
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fragginaut sorry, got kicked :) 08:00
< stephaaan
moritz fragginaut: you could try #perl-help on irc.perl.org 08:02
fragginaut: there's also a #perl channel here on freenode, but it used to have a bad reputation -- not sure if that's still the case
tadzik not really, I think 08:03
moritz that's good
tadzik I sit there these days and it's pretty newbie-friendly I guess
moritz or maybe I've confused it with #perl on irc.perl.org
tadzik the word "tutorial" tends to ignite negative emotions sometimes ;)
masak tadzik: why? 08:05
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tadzik masak: "I found this code in some Perl tutorial on the web" => "OH GODS NO" 08:07
;)
masak aha. yes, well. 08:13
sorear o/ masak
masak yo sorear.
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masak .oO( "it's fine to write baby Perl at first" -- later -- "OH GODS NO" ) 08:13
sorear and with that. sleep& 08:14
huf baby english is fine, babies do it. baby old english is a bit odd, and that's what happens when people follow perl4 tutorials ;)
moritz well, baby perl is a bit like baby english interpreted by automatic voice recognition on a phone hotline 08:17
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kresike good morning all you happy perl6 people 09:17
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flussence DBD::Pg:lang<perl5> is starting to annoy me, now that I want to do interesting stuff with it :( 10:45
hoelzro hi Perl6 folk 10:46
moritz use DBIish; # :-)
hello hoelzro 10:47
hoelzro I'm having an issue install Rakudo *
pastebin.com/raw.php?i=0DbsP9AZ
I get that error message when running 'make install' with Rakudo * 2012.08
timotimo why does it use /usr/bin/nqp and not the one in your rakudo star? 10:48
hoelzro because I told it to
I built my own NQP from 2012.08.1 10:53
(this is more agreeable with my package manager)
moritz that's while building the debugger, right? 10:54
hoelzro looks like 10:55
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hoelzro any ideas? 11:08
moritz I'd have to look closer at the star build system 11:09
but currently at $work
hoelzro ok
well, no rush =)
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moritz irclog.perlgeek.de/perl6/2012-09-18#i_5997793 11:23
timotimo: the reason that rand() isn't supported is that if rand were a subroutine and not a term, rand + 2 would be parsed as rand(+2) 11:24
I'm not sure that's a convincing argument, but at least there is a reason
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flussence plus, what would you expect rand(2) to return? an Int? Num? 0..2 or 0..^2? 11:42
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masak I've never been a fan of rand(2). as flussence++ points out, there isn't an obvious connection between the positional argument and the return value. 11:44
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pmurias jnthn: I have started writing a simple QAST dumper: pastie.org/4753127 12:00
mst masak: usually I'd rather have pick_one_at_random_of(0..2) or something 12:01
moritz nr: say (0..2).pick for ^5
p6eval niecza v21-15-gf226bf6: OUTPUT«0␤1␤2␤1␤1␤»
..rakudo 097361: OUTPUT«1␤1␤2␤1␤0␤»
colomon rakudo: say (0..2).rand for ^5 12:02
p6eval rakudo 097361: OUTPUT«0.254855078400407␤1.62576730786023␤0.0954455466693709␤2.57372621380713␤1.8109134963372␤»
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flussence r: (^5).pick xx 5 12:07
p6eval rakudo 097361: ( no output )
flussence r: say (^5).pick xx 5
p6eval rakudo 097361: OUTPUT«3 3 1 0 3␤»
flussence that ^/. precedence feels a bit weird 12:08
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masak mst: right. 12:13
Su-Shee masak: are you still hacking javascript stuff? 12:22
masak Su-Shee: yeah.
Su-Shee masak: in case you need more gui -> jquery ui just convinced me with _1_ (one) line of code (instead of 150 if I'd done it myself.. :) 12:23
masak: 1 line for a complex gui feature is .. less isn't possible. ;) 12:24
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masak Su-Shee: I like the idea of jQuery UI, but I've had mixed success with it so far. 12:41
Su-Shee: submitted my first bug report to it five minutes after picking it up ;)
Su-Shee masak: uh, ah :) well I just used "sortable" which gives me in one line of code "drag item elsewhere, push other items automatically aside, drop item there" to re-arrange items. it also snaps automatically back and such. _one_ line of code. 12:42
masak Su-Shee: the direction I'm persuing right now isn't "more GUI", but rather "more structure to build on". knockout.js seems a fine choice for that.
Su-Shee masak: I have to refactor a complex gui.. think excel/table/arrangements of items.. 12:43
masak Su-Shee: yeah. the impressive thing about jQuery UI is how much is already there.
Su-Shee masak: it's not even really "G" of "UI" but just behavior... 12:44
it's fascinating how creative js developers have gotten ever since it took off again and how much the language still allows to cleanup things and make nicer libs. 12:45
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mst masak: somewhat 12:47
masak: I was planning to look at angularjs
masak: it seemed to fit my brain and audrey seems to like it 12:48
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masak mst: I've looked at it briefly too. it's in the same problem space as knockout.js, for sure. 12:49
mst: currently I'm enamoured with knockout.js's dependency handling. it's not often nowadays that I feel I learn something both new and fundamental, but knockout's algo for dependency handling qualifies. 12:50
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mst got a URL for that? 12:50
masak yes, hold on.
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masak knockoutjs.com/documentation/comput...ables.html -- heading "How Dependency Tracking Works" 12:51
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Su-Shee ah, you mentioned that on twitter a couple of days ago, didn't you? 12:54
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masak I did. 12:59
I think the idea transcends knockout.js and is usable in a lot of places where observers are involved. 13:00
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Su-Shee I like observers anyways. :) 13:01
not just in Fringe. ;)
FROGGS can somebody please help me? Inline.pm and NativeCall.pm are exporting trait_mod <is>, and when I run for example: perl6 -MInline -MNativeCall -e '1' 13:03
I get: Cannot import symbol '&trait_mod:<is>' from package 'NativeCall', since it already exists in the lexpad
masak learns about en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fringe_(TV_series)
tadzik FROGGS: did you declare them as multi? 13:04
FROGGS right
tadzik dunno
FROGGS identically to traits.pm and NativeCall.pm
masak Su-Shee: have you read en.wikipedia.org/wiki/They're_Made_Out_of_Meat ?
seeing the Observers reminded me of that :)
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FROGGS I dont know if thats that diamond-inclusion-thingy or not, I just dont know what to do 13:05
masak FROGGS: feels like a bug to me.
FROGGS :/ 13:06
masak tries to reproduce it with non-trait_mod multis.
Su-Shee masak: no, I didn't.
masak Su-Shee: it's quite a short read (linked from the Wikipedia article). recommended.
Su-Shee masak: "uh" "entirely written in dialogue" .. That's a literature style I absolutely hate to read...:( 13:08
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masak sorry to hear that. I just re-read it, and it's as good as I remembered it. 13:12
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benabik There are a couple films of it on youtube. 13:14
Dialog is much easier to listen/watch.
masak oh, I forgot to mention that.
yeah. the ones I've seen are (1) a surreal version from the 80's involving, I think, a fez, and (2) a black-and-white newer one which had quite a bit of ambience to it. 13:15
I think I'm fond of literature that highlights our cultural chauvinism in various ways. 13:16
or perhaps "bias" is more accurate.
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benabik The one I'm watching is just lights in space. 13:17
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masak .oO( aren't we all ) 13:18
benabik o/~ We Are All Made of Stars o/~ 13:20
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[Coke] thanks for getting that auto tune stuck in my head! 13:24
[Coke] . o O (grumble)
PerlJam [Coke]: Here, this will get it unstuck www.youtube.com/watch?v=kfVsfOSbJY0 ;> 13:26
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[Coke] if you're having fencepost errors I feel bad for you son -- I got 99 problems but somehow solved 101. (found in today's xkcd) 13:43
pmurias mst: having used angularjs for 2 (not very big apps), I rather like it, but it seems to impose a lot of structure and requires more thought to use then hacking things together with jquery 13:46
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mst pmurias: I tend to like libraries that require structured thinking 14:25
sirrobert What's that good operator to turn two arrays into a hash (arr1 is keys, arr2 is values) ? 14:30
masak sirrobert: Z=>
sirrobert thanks =)
What does the Z mean?
flussence r: my @a1 = 'a'..'z'; my @a2 = 0..*; say %(@a1 Z=> @a2);
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p6eval rakudo 097361: OUTPUT«("a" => 0, "b" => 1, "c" => 2, "d" => 3, "e" => 4, "f" => 5, "g" => 6, "h" => 7, "i" => 8, "j" => 9, "k" => 10, "l" => 11, "m" => 12, "n" => 13, "o" => 14, "p" => 15, "q" => 16, "r" => 17, "s" => 18, "t" => 19, "u" => 20, "v" => 21, "w" => 22, "x" => 23, "y" => 24,… 14:30
masak sirrobert: "zipwith" 14:31
sirrobert oh, I'll remember that (I hope =)
thanks, both
masak r: .say for 100, 200, 300 Z+ 3, 2, 1
p6eval rakudo 097361: OUTPUT«103␤202␤301␤»
flussence
.oO( ...at $dayjob the structure used for libraries is usually a heap )
 14:32
pmichaud even plain 'Z' works:
sirrobert Z makes a new array?
pmichaud r: my @a1 = 'a'..'z'; my @a2 = 0..*; say %(@a1 Z @a2)
p6eval rakudo 097361: OUTPUT«("a" => 0, "b" => 1, "c" => 2, "d" => 3, "e" => 4, "f" => 5, "g" => 6, "h" => 7, "i" => 8, "j" => 9, "k" => 10, "l" => 11, "m" => 12, "n" => 13, "o" => 14, "p" => 15, "q" => 16, "r" => 17, "s" => 18, "t" => 19, "u" => 20, "v" => 21, "w" => 22, "x" => 23, "y" => 24,…
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sirrobert ohh 14:32
you hashed explicitly
pmichaud Z creates a list consisting of the elements from each list interleaved
sirrobert say (1, 2, 3) Z=> (<a b c>); 14:33
r: say (1, 2, 3) Z=> (<a b c>);
p6eval rakudo 097361: OUTPUT«1 a 2 b 3 c␤»
sirrobert r: say %((1, 2, 3) Z=> (<a b c>));
p6eval rakudo 097361: OUTPUT«("1" => "a", "2" => "b", "3" => "c").hash␤»
sirrobert ok, thanks
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sirrobert so Z=> pairs them 14:33
but it's a list of pairs, rather than a hash
pmichaud Z produces lists... one has to explicitly coerce to a hash for either Z=> or Z
GlitchMr (1, 2, 3, 4 Z~ 5, 6, 7, 8).perl.say
pmichaud sirrobert: exactly right.
GlitchMr perl6: (1, 2, 3, 4 Z~ 5, 6, 7, 8).perl.say
p6eval rakudo 097361, niecza v21-15-gf226bf6: OUTPUT«("15", "26", "37", "48").list␤»
sirrobert pmichaud, ok, great
GlitchMr perl6: (1, 2, 3, 4 »+« 5, 6, 7, 8).perl.say 14:34
p6eval niecza v21-15-gf226bf6: OUTPUT«(1, 2, 3, 9, 6, 7, 8)␤»
..rakudo 097361: OUTPUT«(1, 2, 3, (9,).list, 6, 7, 8)␤»
GlitchMr perl6: ((1, 2, 3, 4) »+« (5, 6, 7, 8)).perl.say
p6eval niecza v21-15-gf226bf6: OUTPUT«[6, 8, 10, 12].list␤»
..rakudo 097361: OUTPUT«(6, 8, 10, 12).list␤»
GlitchMr Precedence :-)
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masak GlitchMr: right. the X and Z operators are low-precedence. the »« operators aren't. 14:35
sirrobert So is Z a "metaoperator?" 14:37
masak aye. 14:38
sirrobert I guess it's both
Z by itself is an operator, but it can take an op to go meta.
colomon just like X
sirrobert What's X? =)
GlitchMr Many operators can take other operator in name
moritz cross
GlitchMr Well, even = in C did that
masak sirrobert: well, infix:<Z> is just sugar for infix:<Z,>
sirrobert hmmm
ok, I will have to play with that before my head asplode.
moritz doc.perl6.org/language/operators#infix+X 14:39
doc.perl6.org/language/operators#infix+Z
GlitchMr What is so difficult about that. Z+ is similar to += in being meta operator
masak indeed. 14:40
sirrobert added two pages to my p6 blog (6ing.org): "Wish List" (stuff that would be super helpful to have available) and "Butter" (personal favorite features already available).
adding "Butter" now, actually
masak all of the metaoperator stuff can be seen as a generalization of += et al.
sirrobert++
sirrobert GlitchMr: It's not difficult, it's powerful =) 14:41
pmichaud wow, five tweets from TimToady++ about the 47% . :-)
GlitchMr Almost every language which inherited from C has operators like += 14:42
That includes Python
(except in Python assignment is statement)
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sirrobert moritz: typo in doc.perl6.org/language/operators#infix+X (I think) 14:45
the infix definition says <Z> instead of <X> 14:46
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GlitchMr What happened to dalek? 14:50
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masak .oO( the Doctor ) 14:50
tadzik :D
GlitchMr Also, wow, I wanted to make identical commit to your, masak. But you were faster
So, ! [rejected] master -> master (non-fast-forward) happened 14:51
I've done git pull --rebase
FROGGS masak: about my issue, there is a "# XXX TODO: Merge handling." in World.pm#L260 :o)
GlitchMr And my commit mysteriously disappeared from logs
Probably GitHub has noticed it's identical
moritz not github
GlitchMr Git*
moritz git
GlitchMr lol
moritz the --rebase throws away identical commits 14:52
masak GlitchMr: I didn't make that commit now. I must've made it ages ago.
FROGGS: d'oh! 14:53
GlitchMr Date: Wed Sep 19 16:48:39 2012 +0200
fix typo, sirrobert++
But I don't see it on GitHub... I'm confused
(also, yes, I've posted it so sirrobert would get positive karma - dalek wasn't there so sirrobert would get karma) 14:54
"Page did not respond in a timely fashion."
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GlitchMr oh, ok 14:54
raiph GlitchMr++ # Perl 6 changes - 2012W37 14:58
phenny raiph: 18 Sep 12:42Z <[Coke]> ask raiph if I should add blogs.perl.org/users/perl_6_reports/ to planetsi
GlitchMr status.github.com/ - git is red 14:59
dalek c: 162131a | moritz++ | lib/operators.pod:
fix typo, sirrobert++
GlitchMr That sounds... oh wait
Next Perl 6 changes report will be on 23.09.2012 15:01
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kresike bye folks 15:04
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sirrobert r: my @arr; @arr.push(%(a => 1, b => 2)); say @arr.perl; 15:06
p6eval rakudo 097361: OUTPUT«Array.new("a" => 1, "b" => 2)␤»
sirrobert I expected that to give me an array with one element that was a hash
what did I do wrong?
or maybe: how should I think about that? 15:07
masak push expects a list of things. if it finds a hash, it listifies the hash.
sirrobert ok, how do I get it not to listify things? 15:08
if I want an array of hashes
masak r: my @a; @a.push({ a => 1, b => 2}); say @a.perl
p6eval rakudo 097361: OUTPUT«Array.new({"a" => 1, "b" => 2})␤»
sirrobert ok
so what I really have is:
r: my @a; @a.push(%((1,2,3) Z=> (<a b c>))); say @a.perl; 15:09
p6eval rakudo 097361: OUTPUT«Array.new("1" => "a", "2" => "b", "3" => "c")␤»
sirrobert is the "right" solution here to create the hash separately? but it still gets expanded...
I think
masak yeah.
r: my @a; my %h = (1,2,3) Z=> (<a b c>); @a.push(%h); say @a.perl
p6eval rakudo 097361: OUTPUT«Array.new("1" => "a", "2" => "b", "3" => "c")␤»
masak indeed.
r: my @a; my %h = (1,2,3) Z=> (<a b c>); @a.push({%h}); say @a.perl 15:10
p6eval rakudo 097361: OUTPUT«Array.new({"1" => "a", "2" => "b", "3" => "c"})␤»
sirrobert ohh.. weird
ok, I can live with that =)
GlitchMr I would like have report for that commit - github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/ec...e957ea5615 15:11
Why it was clobbering GLOBAL before?
pmichaud r: my @a; @a.push({ (1,2,3) Z <a b c> }); say @a.perl
p6eval rakudo 097361: OUTPUT«Array.new(Block.new())␤»
moritz sirrobert: what's weird about it?
GlitchMr (and when?)
sirrobert the {%} seems redundant
moritz well, the {} makes an hash-in-an-item
sirrobert moritz: a workaround for the listification magic of push
moritz you can also say %h.item
sirrobert ok, that's a good paradigm for me to adopt for it 15:12
I didn't previously have a concept of 'item'
yarp r: (<1 2 3> Z* <4 5 6>).say;
p6eval rakudo 097361: OUTPUT«4 10 18␤»
yarp r: [+](<1 2 3> Z* <4 5 6>).say; 15:13
p6eval rakudo 097361: OUTPUT«32␤»
sirrobert huh... push({%...}) interprets it as a hash but push: {%...} interprets it as a block
moritz that's weird 15:14
sirrobert verifying now ...
moritz r: my @h; @h.push: {%*ENV}; say @h[0].WHAT
p6eval rakudo 097361: OUTPUT«Block()␤»
GlitchMr Oh, I cannot read - it was 'require'
moritz r: my @h; @h.push({%*ENV}); say @h[0].WHAT 15:15
p6eval rakudo 097361: OUTPUT«Block()␤»
moritz sirrobert: seems to be a block either way :(
r: my %a; my @h; @h.push({%a}); say @h[0].WHAT
p6eval rakudo 097361: OUTPUT«Hash()␤»
moritz r: my %a; my @h; @h.push: {%a}; say @h[0].WHAT
p6eval rakudo 097361: OUTPUT«Hash()␤»
moritz erm, what?
sirrobert moritz: erm, indeed =)
moritz %*ENV makes it a block, %a a hash? 15:16
moritz smeells a rakudobug
15:16 fhelmberger left 15:17 marmay_ left
sirrobert r: my $h = {%(<a b>) Z=> (1,2)}; say $h.WHAT; 15:18
p6eval rakudo 097361: OUTPUT«Block()␤»
masak moritz: that feels buggish, yes. 15:19
moritz: care to report it?
sirrobert sure
yarp r: my Num @ar = <3 4 5>; push @ar, [+]@ar; @ar.say
p6eval rakudo 097361: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Confused␤at /tmp/Yok24T4aEW:1␤»
sirrobert if I copy/paste this discussion is that enough? I don't quite know how to describe it.
moritz yes, it's enough
sirrobert ok, one sec 15:20
raiph "if I copy/paste this discussion is that enough? I don't quite know how to describe it." lol (or is that loh?) 15:21
yarp nr: my Num @ar = <3 4 5>; @ar[3] = [+] @ar; @ar.say;
p6eval rakudo 097361: OUTPUT«Type check failed in assignment to '$v'; expected 'Num' but got 'Int'␤ in block at /tmp/UI1lugx09V:1␤␤» 15:22
..niecza v21-15-gf226bf6: OUTPUT«3 4 5 12␤»
moritz doesn't get the funny part -- we do that all the time in bug reports
sirrobert posted
moritz r: my Num @ar = <3 4 5>
p6eval rakudo 097361: ( no output )
masak sirrobert++
moritz masak: another bug report, it seems :-)
yarp So what is the Num used for?
diakopter I just submitted a new bug for nqp; it's kindof odd
moritz (the my Num @ar)
diakopter github.com/perl6/nqp/issues/55
moritz yarp: whatever you usually use floating-point numbers for 15:23
yarp nr: my Num @ar = <3 4 5>; @ar[3] = [+] @ar; @ar.say;
p6eval rakudo 097361: OUTPUT«Type check failed in assignment to '$v'; expected 'Num' but got 'Int'␤ in block at /tmp/oV1hsT_L7A:1␤␤»
..niecza v21-15-gf226bf6: OUTPUT«3 4 5 12␤»
moritz nqp: say('¢'~"\n");
p6eval nqp: OUTPUT«Invalid character in ASCII string␤»
yarp Look, It didn't work;
moritz yarp: yes, because you typed it Num, but didn't give it a Num 15:24
yarp [+] @ar is not a number ???
moritz it's a number, but not Num 15:25
diakopter moritz: it started happening in the last week
wasn't happening beofre
moritz yarp: doc.perl6.org/type/Num
yarp 3 4 5 is Num , But sum them is not Num, so the Num maybe useless. 15:26
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moritz Num isn't useless. It's very useful for things you're not thinking of right now 15:26
but it's a bug that rakudo doesn't complain about the list assignment already
15:27 raiph left
GlitchMr If you want numeric values, see Numeric 15:30
Also, <3 4 5> are strings
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GlitchMr I think that there is :val modifier for q, but it isn't yet implemented anywhere 15:31
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yarp Rakudo didn't complain. 15:31
GlitchMr std: qw:val<3 4 5>
p6eval std b842bb3: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Unrecognized quote modifier: val at /tmp/Kbu0SSvFHh line 1:␤------> qw⏏:val<3 4 5>␤Check failed␤FAILED 00:00 41m␤»
GlitchMr std: qw:v<3 4 5>
p6eval std b842bb3: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Unrecognized quote modifier: v at /tmp/5KcKblIyLU line 1:␤------> qw⏏:v<3 4 5>␤Check failed␤FAILED 00:00 41m␤»
GlitchMr perlcabal.org/syn/S02.html#The_%3Aval_modifier 15:32
Uhmmm...
masak n: say <3 4 5>.perl
p6eval niecza v21-15-gf226bf6: OUTPUT«(val("3"), val("4"), val("5"))␤»
masak GlitchMr: Niecza implements val()
yarp I see.
nr: my Num @ar = （3， 4， 5）; @ar[3] = [+] @ar; @ar.say; 15:33
p6eval niecza v21-15-gf226bf6: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤␤Malformed initializer at /tmp/jo4Jz0Rr2J line 1:␤------> my Num @ar ⏏= （3， 4， 5）; @ar[3] = [+] @ar; @ar.say;␤␤Parse failed␤␤»
..rakudo 097361: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Malformed initializer␤at /tmp/hEOiRhcfsQ:1␤»
yarp nr: my Num @ar = (3， 4， 5); @ar[3] = [+] @ar; @ar.say;
p6eval niecza v21-15-gf226bf6: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤␤Confused at /tmp/U3I78ztYpL line 1:␤------> my Num @ar = (3⏏， 4， 5); @ar[3] = [+] @ar; @ar.say;␤␤Parse failed␤␤»
..rakudo 097361: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Malformed initializer␤at /tmp/06dug8M__8:1␤»
GlitchMr masak: yes, but not :val modifier 15:34
moritz .u ，
phenny U+FF0C FULLWIDTH COMMA (，)
moritz yarp: it'd help to use normal commas
yarp nr: my Num @ar = (3, 4, 5); @ar[3] = [+] @ar; @ar.say;
p6eval rakudo 097361: OUTPUT«Type check failed in assignment to '$v'; expected 'Num' but got 'Int'␤ in block at /tmp/ObinFSoXTw:1␤␤»
..niecza v21-15-gf226bf6: OUTPUT«3 4 5 12␤»
moritz wonders how much longer yarp wants to beat a dead horse 15:35
dalek href="https://glitchmr.github.com/perl6-changes:">glitchmr.github.com/perl6-changes: d721657 | GlitchMr++ | _posts/2012-09-23-perl-6-changes-2012W38.md:
Placeholder Perl 6 changes for 2012W38 page

Currently, not much was mentioned on this page, but I've made this branch so you can read it and report any bugs with this list if you will find any (like spelling errors or factual errors).		 15:36
GlitchMr wow, that's long repository name
masak GlitchMr: right, but saying <3 4 5> are strings is only half the truth.
GlitchMr Possibly <3 4 5>».Int would work
(putting ugliness of that aside)
Or simply 3, 4, 5 15:37
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GlitchMr Previously, I have published page at end of week. This time I want to do that earlier, except without actually publishing it. 15:38
masak a "draft".
GlitchMr Yes
And because git is easy, merging it will be like 'git merge perl6-changes' 15:39
moritz r: my Int @a = 'ab', 'cd';
p6eval rakudo 097361: ( no output )
GlitchMr And I can reuse this branch after merging :-)
moritz submits rakudobug
GlitchMr Strings are new Integers
yarp I try in my box, Can't work also. 15:40
GlitchMr r: my Int = 'ab' # just testing, I don't expect success
p6eval rakudo 097361: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Malformed my␤at /tmp/ztPMW9ME7P:1␤»
GlitchMr r: my Int $a = 'ab' # just testing, I don't expect success
p6eval rakudo 097361: OUTPUT«Type check failed in assignment to '$a'; expected 'Int' but got 'Str'␤ in block at /tmp/UHxoe8iKrn:1␤␤»
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yarp No matter 3, 4, 5 or 3.0, 4.0, 5.0 15:41
moritz 3.0 isn't a Num either
masak yarp: 3.0 is a Rat.
GlitchMr 3, 3.0, 3e0 and 3 + 0i are all different
masak yarp: yes, this takes some time to get used to.
GlitchMr Just noting
masak yarp: but it's good for you.
moritz yarp: if you want to to constraint to numbers, use Real or Numeric 15:42
yarp: though typed containers aren't yet very well done, and IMHO not worth the trouble
yarp Real realy work
thanks 15:43
GlitchMr std: say say 15:44
p6eval std b842bb3: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Unsupported use of bare 'say'; in Perl 6 please use .say if you meant $_, or use an explicit invocant or argument at /tmp/znRAnmFya9 line 1:␤------> say say⏏<EOL>␤Check failed␤FAILED 00:00 41m␤»
felher Folks, I am confused. Nothing new about that, but this time I think I have a good reason! ;) If I do >>>perl6 =(echo 'say $*IN.get;')<<< with a rakudo-built from today it works as I expect it to. I can enter _one line_ and if I press enter the line gets printed and I return to my prompt. In any other piece of code I could think of $*IN.get reads until I give it a ^D and doesn't stop at the first newline. Even 15:46
>>>perl6 =(echo '#blar\nsay $*IN.get;')<<< or >>>perl6 =(echo 'say $*IN.get();')<<< read multiple lines until I hit ^D and print them all at once. Any ideas/comments?
I don't think this is a problem with the newest Rakudo. I run into that when trying to get Rakudo working on a new machine :)
masak felher: no, $*IN.get() reads one line. 15:48
that's what it does, by spec.
GlitchMr Perhaps slurp?
Without argument it works on STDIN
felher masak: well, it doesn't to that on this machine. >>>perl6 =(echo 'say $*IN.get();')<< reads multiple lines on this new machine.
GlitchMr Also, if you need to parse line by line, try lines()
felher i can press Enter all i want. It reads until i give it a ^D. 15:49
GlitchMr felher: on my machine it gets one line 15:50
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felher GlitchMr: yeah, on my old machine it also gets one line. Not on my new one, though. :) 15:50
GlitchMr And... it was doing that on Rakudo Star 2010.07 too 15:51
sirrobert r: class A { has $.a; has $.b; has $.c; submethod BUILD (:$a) { $!a = $a; } }; say A.new(a=>1,b=>2,c=>3);
p6eval rakudo 097361: OUTPUT«A.new(a => 1, b => Any, c => Any)␤»
felher I also tested rakudo/parrot/examples/pir/readline.pir, but this example works as expected.
GlitchMr Perhaps you're doing something incorrectly
sirrobert Do I have to explicitly account for all object properties in BUILD?
masak only if you want them set at object initialization. 15:52
sirrobert why did that not set .b and .c?
or rather: how do I get that to set .b and .c?
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sirrobert I want to create an object using the normal constructur, but override how one property is interpreted. 15:53
Is that possible, or do I need to write a handler for all ?
geekosaur just from looking at that I would assume a :$b and :$c etc. added to BUILD...
masak you need to include in the BUILD signature those attributes you want to initialize.
sirrobert masak: ok 15:54
GlitchMr github.com/rakudo/rakudo/tree/1b6c...b00fde04c0
The past!
sirrobert masak: that's a feature I'd be interested in seeing added
masak r: class A { has $.a; has $.b; has $.c; submethos BUILD (:$!a, :$!b, :$!c) {} }; say A.new( :a(1), :b(2), :c(3) )
p6eval rakudo 097361: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Variable $!a used where no 'self' is available␤at /tmp/nVOH28xw4_:1␤»
masak r: class A { has $.a; has $.b; has $.c; submethod BUILD (:$!a, :$!b, :$!c) {} }; say A.new( :a(1), :b(2), :c(3) ) 15:55
p6eval rakudo 097361: OUTPUT«A.new(a => 1, b => 2, c => 3)␤»
sirrobert if I have an object with 40 properties and just want to handle one of them specially, that could get onerous.
(though I can live with it for now =)
maybe I really want a submethod modifier that pre-processes the args list 15:56
like a moose "before"
masak you're not the first to request one.
I think TimToady isn't prepared to make that core. but it could easily be made a module.
felher GlitchMr: yeah, may very well be that i'm doing something incorrectly. But then probably while installing rakudo. >>>perl6 =(echo 'say $*IN.get();')<<< can not get any shorter :)
sirrobert masak: hmmm how would you make that a module?
masak: What's the gist of how that would be done? (I'd be interested in giving it a try) 15:57
masak sirrobert: you make the module expose some MOP trickery as a grammar modification.
15:57 JimmyZ left
sirrobert ok, grammar mods 15:57
mod to STD?
masak sirrobert: we have the MOP trickery already, but maybe not the grammar modification machinery.
sirrobert masak: cool. I don't really know how the grammar is set up now, but I can check it out. 15:58
masak 'course, if you're willing to accept slightly uglier syntax for a while, then it can still be done, I think.
GlitchMr felher: also, =?
Why not `perl6 -e`
sirrobert masak: I'm willing... but it will help adoption to have fewer of those
GlitchMr Somehow I wonder how = could work for you
masak sirrobert: you might want to discuss this with TimToady. he has some fairly specific opinions about it.
sirrobert sure 15:59
masak: sounds good to me (though the beauty of modules is the possibility of ugly ones =)
GlitchMr I'm waiting for any Perl 6 implementation having access to variables like $~Regex
felher GlitchMr: =() or <() in ZSH or bash make a new temporary file with where the content of this file is the standard output of the programs within the =() or <() .:) 16:00
GlitchMr: but i think bash only has <(...)
GlitchMr oh, ZSH, I see
16:01 yarp left, brrt left
masak felher: maybe you're seeing some weird interaction with zsh, then? 16:01
sirrobert lunch 16:02
felher >>>perl6 -e 'say $*IN.get;'<<< waits for only one line, too, while >>>perl6 -e 'say $*IN.get();'<<< doesn't :)
16:02 wamba left
felher @ masak and GlitchMr 16:02
To be precise: >>>perl6 -e 'say $*IN.get();'<<< waits for ^D 16:03
masak wut
masak tries
GlitchMr It doesn't happen on my machine
16:03 wooden left
felher Yeah, doesn't happen on my old machine. Only my new has this problem :( 16:03
GlitchMr Using ZSH, without ZSH, on my machine, on feather
masak can't reproduce it here.
GlitchMr It gets only one line 16:04
masak felher: time to find out what distinguishes your new machine. :)
GlitchMr Perhaps OS
felher Same OS: Both gentoo linux. The new machine (it doesn't substitute the old, it just is a new server :) ) is in am VM, though. Well. Im doing some further digging. Maybe i can find anything. :) 16:06
masak felher++
GlitchMr What happens on perl -e 'print scalar <>'? 16:07
Just wondering
felher GlitchMr: works as expected. Reads and prints just one line :) 16:08
mhasch felher: your terminal sessions on these machines might have different stty settings
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felher mhasch: that would affect other programs, such as perl or cat too, wouldn't it? I only found that problem using rakudo. Event parrot examples/pir/readline.pir works as expected. :) 16:10
*Even 16:11
GlitchMr Uhmmm... doesn't cat always read every line?
You have problem with single lines
felher GlitchMr: yes, it does, but it prints every lines as soon as i type it. 16:12
GlitchMr: if it is buffering of the terminal, then cat should read multiple lines and then print all of them at once, not one a at time.
Maybe cat sets some terminal stuff, though...
GlitchMr felher: cat doesn't buffer when reading from tty
Also, I doubt this would work, but could you try perl6 -e'say lines[0]' 16:13
felher GlitchMr: yeah, that doesn't work, too. 16:14
mhasch felher: readline will change settings temporarily, I guess
pmichaud note that RT #112716 is still open, too.
felher mhasch: hmm, good point :)
16:15 wooden left, wooden joined
felher pmichaud: yeah, i stumbled upon that earlier today, too :) 16:16
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FROGGS phenny: ask jnthn if I should be able to build my own rakudo star atm, because when all is done I cant use NativeCall: Missing or wrong version of dependency 'src/gen/BOOTSTRAP.pm' 16:21
phenny FROGGS: I'll pass that on when jnthn is around.
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GlitchMr FROGGS: glitchmr.github.com/how-i-learned-t...panda.html 16:39
Have you ran ./rebootstrap.pl?
FROGGS no, I haven't
GlitchMr So, run it
FROGGS should I do this before make install? 16:40
GlitchMr You should rebootstrap.pl after updating Rakudo Perl 6
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FROGGS GlitchMr: looks good, thanks 16:46
phenny: tell jnthn that GlitchMr++ told me about rebootstrap.pl
phenny FROGGS: I'll pass that on when jnthn is around.
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jnthn evening o/ 16:52
phenny jnthn: 16:21Z <FROGGS> ask jnthn if I should be able to build my own rakudo star atm, because when all is done I cant use NativeCall: Missing or wrong version of dependency 'src/gen/BOOTSTRAP.pm'
jnthn: 16:46Z <FROGGS> tell jnthn that GlitchMr++ told me about rebootstrap.pl
FROGGS hi jnthn
jnthn yes, you need to refresh any PIR files if you rebuild your Rakudo. 16:54
Which is what rebootstrap.pl does
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FROGGS I made a batch now that rebuilds rakudo(star) and runs that rebootstrap too 16:55
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jnthn nice 16:55
FROGGS I try to figure out what's happening when it "should" merge multi methods 16:56
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FROGGS home & 17:02
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moritz r: say {%*ENV}.WHAT 17:09
p6eval rakudo 097361: OUTPUT«Block()␤»
moritz r: my %a; say {%a}.WHAT
p6eval rakudo 097361: OUTPUT«Hash()␤»
moritz r: my %*a; say {%*a}.WHAT 17:10
p6eval rakudo 097361: OUTPUT«Block()␤»
jnthn Hmm
I...suspect that's 'cus of the way contextual lookups are compiled
moritz yes
it probably checks .isa(QAST::Var) or so when deciding if it's a hash or block 17:11
jnthn right
well, maybe the answer is to figure out how to make contextuals a QAST::Var :)
moritz or maybe we give QAST nodes a DBA attribute 17:12
and ask if $ast.dba eq 'var' or so
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jnthn I'd rather than make QAST nodes bigger ;) 17:14
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moritz malformed sentence, but I understand the sentiment 17:14
jnthn English hard is! 17:15
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masak they need to do way instain English, who kill theyr sentence. 17:18
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sorear good * #perl6 17:23
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masak sorear! \o/ 17:25
sorear masak: did you see the rakudobug GlitchMr found last night?
masak no.
sorear nr: /\0/ 17:28
p6eval rakudo 097361: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Unrecognized backslash sequence at line 2, near "/"␤»
..niecza v21-15-gf226bf6: ( no output )
sorear nr: eval: "/\\\0/" # curiously, this works
p6eval rakudo 097361: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Confused␤at /tmp/dEL6PxnNQG:1␤»
..niecza v21-15-gf226bf6: ( no output )
sorear er, it did last night
nr: eval "/\\\0/" # curiously, this works
p6eval rakudo 097361, niecza v21-15-gf226bf6: ( no output )
sorear oh, the colon
jnthn \0 NYI in regexes? 17:29
wait, what's it meant to do? 17:30
jnthn checks S05
hm, no mention of it in S05
moritz std: /\1/
p6eval std b842bb3: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Unsupported use of the 1-based special form '\1' as a backreference; in Perl 6 please use the 0-based variable '$0' instead at /tmp/Luxsw29wry line 1:␤------> /\1⏏/␤Check failed␤FAILED 00:00 42m␤»
jnthn std: /\0/ 17:31
p6eval std b842bb3: OUTPUT«ok 00:00 42m␤»
jnthn huh
oh...is it meant to be a way to write NULL?
moritz eval: !! chr(0) =~ /\0/ 17:32
buubot_backup moritz: No output.
pmichaud rakudo: say "\0" ~~ /\x00/; 17:33
p6eval rakudo 097361: OUTPUT«｢␀｣␤␤»
pmichaud rakudo: say "\0" ~~ /\0/;
p6eval rakudo 097361: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Unrecognized backslash sequence at line 2, near "/;"␤»
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jnthn It's easy to add but...S05 doesn't mention it. Unless we count it under "same as Perl 5 did it" 17:34
sorear STD mentions it, though.
jnthn Ah.
That's probably good enough :)
moritz it's weird to allow \0 but disallow \1 etc. 17:35
sorear line 5066 in my checkout
huh, what's this SIGOK thing 17:36
pmichaud std: /\01/
p6eval std b842bb3: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Unrecognized regex backslash sequence at /tmp/wSpTlYpS3i line 1:␤------> /\⏏01/␤Check failed␤FAILED 00:00 42m␤»
pmichaud std: /\1/
p6eval std b842bb3: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Unsupported use of the 1-based special form '\1' as a backreference; in Perl 6 please use the 0-based variable '$0' instead at /tmp/t5UEiPZwha line 1:␤------> /\1⏏/␤Check failed␤FAILED 00:00 42m␤»
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masak "So we need to get something out there for people to start playing with right away." -- linuxdevcenter.com/pub/a/linux/rt/0...cript.html 17:42
masak found that an interesting read
"We have to have the process that continues to support people with Perl 5, at the same time giving them a clear migration path to Perl 6, if they want to go that way."
felher masak++ #found something for me to read on the bus ride home :) 17:43
tadzik Heh, a Pirate Folk-ish band advertises itself on the pirate bay, with free download available
mst masak: mentioning the 07282000 is the date would've helped 17:45
felher: the 07-28-2000 is the date :) 17:46
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masak mst: ah, yes. I forgot to mention that. 17:46
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mst not that it isn't interesting, but the context is important 17:47
jnthn r: say words(' foo bar baz! ', 1).perl
p6eval rakudo 097361: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤CHECK FAILED:␤Undefined routine '&words' called (line 1)␤»
jnthn r: say ' foo bar baz! ', 1).words(1).perl 17:48
p6eval rakudo 097361: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Confused␤at /tmp/_58JsZZvrk:1␤»
felher mst: thnx :)
jnthn r: say ' foo bar baz! ', 1.words(1).perl
p6eval rakudo 097361: OUTPUT«No such method 'words' for invocant of type 'Int'␤ in block at /tmp/6CeHq9HgFP:1␤␤»
jnthn ffs
r: say ' foo bar baz! '.words(1).perl
p6eval rakudo 097361: OUTPUT«("foo",).list␤»
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jnthn huh, I rewrote words to be a load faster and it got twice as slow :/ 17:54
[Coke] moritz: IWBNI docs.perl6.org went to doc.perl.org instead of perl6.org 17:55
[Coke] slow claps for jnthn.
*clap*
*clap* 17:56
GlitchMr back
moritz | it's weird to allow \0 but disallow \1 etc.
Actually, this is what JavaScript does in normal strings in strict mods
mode*
jnthn bah, I'm going for dinner :)
bbl
sorear [Coke]: I can't resolve doc.perl.org
diakopter pmichaud: thx for finding the parrot concat thing
GlitchMr "\0" is valid in JS strict mode, "\1" isn't
It's probably only octal escape I can accept :-) 17:57
Also, why unknown domains of .perl6.org lead to perl6.org? 17:58
FROGGS sorear: can't either
GlitchMr If I use domain like 404pagenotfound.perl6.org, why it would redirect me to perl6.org
mst wildcard DNS plus a default vhost 17:59
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GlitchMr I should make completely pointless tutorial like "Perl 6 for Python programmers" 18:00
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[Coke] sorear: typo. I meant (obviously?) perl6.org everywhere there. 18:03
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sorear [Coke]: I missed the distinction between docs and doc 18:16
who runs the perl6.org DNS system? 18:18
is Daniel Wright one of our people? 18:19
moritz well, he's a Perl monger
but not an active 6er
I've asked him to set up a wildcard DNS so that we can get subdomains without bothering him
sorear hmm, I knew a Daniel Wright in high school, I wonder if they're the same one 18:20
moritz sorear: he's probably older (unless it's a teacher)
sorear no, was 1-2y younger than me
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raiph hi all. anyone around willing to discuss #perl6 summaries? 19:12
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moritz 19:15
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skids r: my $a = Buf.new(42); $a.gist.say; $a.perl.say; $a.WHAT.say; # minor annoyance 19:24
p6eval rakudo 097361: OUTPUT«Buf:0x<2a>␤Buf.new()␤Cannot look up attributes in a type object␤ in method list at src/gen/CORE.setting:6941␤ in method gist at src/gen/CORE.setting:6952␤ in sub say at src/gen/CORE.setting:7173␤ in method say at src/gen/CORE.setting:758␤ in block at /tmp/A1B…
masak r: say (Buf.new).WHAT 19:25
p6eval rakudo 097361: OUTPUT«Cannot look up attributes in a type object␤ in method list at src/gen/CORE.setting:6941␤ in method gist at src/gen/CORE.setting:6952␤ in sub say at src/gen/CORE.setting:7173␤ in block at /tmp/f0hRCMAS2i:1␤␤»
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diakopter today's xkcd zoomable t.co/yxv7snNM 19:34
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masak nice. 19:36
bbkr speaking of domains - are projects like perl6/doc and perl6/ecosystems restricted to perl6.org? I'd like to use them to generate content for perl6.com (no specific layout plans yet). 19:44
diakopter are you planning to buy perl6.com from Jason?
(Jason Duke) 19:45
bbkr yes 19:47
diakopter how much were you going to offer? 19:48
3 years ago he said $2k was much too low
GlitchMr I'm creating Makefile and editor seems to ignore my settings. For some reason it uses tabs when I've configured it to use spaces. 19:49
diakopter bbkr: "i am always open to offers and when and if a number pops up that piques my interest i'll let you know but at the moment 2k doesn't interest one jot!"
bbkr I cannot share such details. We worked together for some time and he is tough negotiator :) 19:50
diakopter oh! glad to know you have an in.
sounds like he should've taken my offer :P 19:51
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bbkr Currently it is hard to estimate perl6.com value. On one hand we're relatively small community and there is not much financial juice to squeeze from hypothetical traffic on this domain. On the other hand check where perl.com leads to and who I'm competing against here :) 19:55
arnsholt GlitchMr: That's because Makefiles won't work if you use spaces 20:01
The lines in a recipe have to be indented by a tab, nothing else will do 20:02
If you use spaces you'll get really weird errors
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masak the Makefile format -- broken by design(TM). 20:12
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leont There are a lot of things great about it, but the file format has more holes in it than swiss cheese 20:20
jnthn Swiss cheese tastes pretty OK, though, despite the holes :) 20:23
TimToady r: say (^5).roll(5); # instead of (^5).pick xx 5
p6eval rakudo 097361: OUTPUT«0 3 0 4 1␤»
masak jnthn: the holes are the tastiest part! 20:25
TimToady that's where all the vitimins are
*vitamins
FROGGS but these are actually bacterial farts^^ 20:26
jnthn Mmmm...tasty tasty farts.
TimToady some bacteria are more equal than others 20:27
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leont Pretty much the same bacteria that commonly live on your feet, though 20:29
FROGGS r: my Bacteria $a; my Bacteria $b; $a meq $b; # meq, our new "more equal" operator
p6eval rakudo 097361: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Malformed my␤at /tmp/zmWaX5bUuG:1␤»
FROGGS we could introduce a "jabeq" operator though # just a bit equal 20:30
masak FROGGS: re cheese and bacterial farts: just wait until I tell you about beer and wine ;) 20:34
jnthn Beer then wine, you'll feel fine. Wine the beer, oh dear. :P 20:35
*then
masak hm. hadn't heard that one before. why is that? 20:36
jnthn Good question, but experimental studies conducted during my time in university support it. :P 20:37
FROGGS there is the same idiom in german 20:38
leont I'm sure those studies were scientific :-p
masak heh. the Internet has lots of sayings like this, and some weird theories about what they mean and why :P 20:39
FROGGS "Wein auf Bier, das rate ich dir. Bier auf Wein, das lass sein."
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masak right. "on" seems more common than "then". 20:39
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masak phenny: "Wein auf Bier, das rate ich dir. Bier auf Wein, das lass sein."? 20:39
phenny masak: "Wine to beer , I advise you . Effect of alcohol on the be let ." (de to en, translate.google.com)
jnthn *lol*
skids r: proto sub a (:$b = 2) {...}; multi sub a (:$b where { $_ == 2 }) { "sub1".say }; a(:b(2)); a(); # should work? 20:40
p6eval rakudo 097361: ( no output )
masak phenny got a little lost there towards the end.
skids hrm.
jnthn Well, given you write ... instead of {*} you don't even make it to trying to multi-dispatch :)
But even if you had, no.
The {*} uses the arguments that were passed in 20:41
Anything done in the proto signature has no influence on those.
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skids Ah. So the named->positional mapping in S06 is only a special case, not a fallout of a more general principle. 20:44
jnthn Doesn't that end up re-writing callsites anyway... 20:45
skids ponders different multis with different default values.
jnthn Either way, Rakudo doesn't implement the bit of S06 you're talking about yet.
One of those "jnthn looked, said ARGH and will implement it when he comes to terms with it not going away" :)
skids cool. Don't actually need it ATM, just was curious.
dalek kudo/unfaster-words: f843f61 | jonathan++ | src/core/Str.pm:
Refactor words to not use comb/matches.

In theory this should be a load faster. Instead it's twice as slow on pick-words. Maybe repeated utf-8 scanning kills it.		 20:52
jnthn pmichaud: ^^ may be relatedish to the setting-with-high-codepoints issue you're looking at. 20:54
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masak heh. from one line to 14 lines... and twice as slow ;) 20:55
jnthn I know! I shouldn't be allowed to program when sober. :P 20:56
I think it must be the utf-8 scanning
masak aye.
jnthn hmm...maybe I can convert it to search it...
.oO( strings shouldn't have encodings...that's an I/O thing :/ )
 20:57
FROGGS shouldnt it be faster if you declare $start and $end before gather?
jnthn FROGGS: No 20:58
Then the optimizer has a harder job.
FROGGS k
jnthn And won't do as well on 'em.
Declaring in the narrowest scope you can is only only good for code understandability, but in Rakudo it tends to get you better performance too. 20:59
*not only
Grr... (4 hours sleep)--
FROGGS 􏿽xF3.􏿽xF2
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jnthn Hm, yeah, getting it to scan a fixed width string is an improvement. BUT it's still horribly slow. 21:05
I guess 'cus the substr is on the utf8 one
leont Perl 5 does some caching, it may help in Rakudo too 21:07
jnthn Yeah. Getting it to do the substr on the fixed length thing gets me 5 times faster than the original. 21:09
I guess any such cachign would need to go into Parrot 21:11
dalek kudo/unfaster-words: 11e00a9 | jonathan++ | src/core/Str.pm:
Work on a fixed width string.

Sadly, this can't actually be merged yet, for the same reason we can not substr strings in the grammar from fixed width.		 21:12
masak jnthn++ # multi-line commit messages 21:14
jnthn Yeah...filling everyone's IRC screens faster to keep Linus happy :P 21:15
masak even Github does it right nowadays \o/
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[Coke] . o O (I hate irc) 21:20
masak hugs [Coke] 21:21
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dalek rl6-roast-data: 03ae412 | coke++ | / (4 files):
today (automated commit)
 21:33
rl6-roast-data: 78f2b91 | coke++ | / (4 files):
today (automated commit)
rl6-roast-data: 04b6da2 | coke++ | / (4 files):
today (automated commit)
rl6-roast-data: 3695055 | coke++ | / (3 files):
today (automated commit)
[Coke] (still haven't fixed rakudo there.) 21:34
jnthn was gonna say :) 21:35
sleep & 21:36
[Coke] kicks off a run of just rakudo, and gets a massive amount of git updating going on.
wonder if/why cron had a problem.
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masak 'night, #perl6 22:06
felher o/ masak 22:08
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dalek d: 77327a4 | larry++ | STD.pm6:
parse q:val for GlitchMr++
 22:44
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