»ö« Welcome to Perl 6! | perl6.org/ | evalbot usage: 'perl6: say 3;' or rakudo:, niecza:, std:, or /msg camelia perl6: ... | irclog: irc.perl6.org | UTF-8 is our friend!
Set by sorear on 25 June 2013.
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hoelzro safe travels lizmat 00:43
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dalek ast/S26-WHY: c89e17c | (Rob Hoelz)++ | S26-documentation/why-leading.t:
Name WHEREFORE tests
01:43
ast/S26-WHY: 9194bd1 | (Rob Hoelz)++ | S26-TODO:
Notes?
ast/S26-WHY: dd2f54e | (Rob Hoelz)++ | S26-documentation/why-leading.t:
Fix up WHEREFORE tests
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dalek rl6-bench: 998e4b5 | (Geoffrey Broadwell)++ | analyze:
Tune and simplify noise avoidance in analyze

The previous formula was strangely complex (why use twice an arbitrary number as the threshold, instead of just doubling the arbitrary number and using that?) and also as jnthn++ discovered too conservative (still too much noise on some platforms). Drop the 2x multiplier and increase the min_time value by 10x for an effective 5x threshold increase overall.
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dalek ast: 5754fb2 | coke++ | S03-operators/bit.t:
parrot fudge recent failure RT #122310
02:39
synopsebot Link: rt.perl.org/rt3//Public/Bug/Displa...?id=122310
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[Coke] how can I fudge a throws_like? if one of the 2 sub tests fails, the test fails. if I todo the test, I get a todo passes. 02:59
(if you know the answer, please fudge the throws like for #114134 in S32-exceptions/misc.t for parrot only. :) 03:00
synopsebot Link: rt.perl.org/rt3//Public/Bug/Displa...?id=114134
dalek ast: 7b94f55 | coke++ | S04-phasers/init.t:
parrot fudge recent failure RT #122311
synopsebot Link: rt.perl.org/rt3//Public/Bug/Displa...?id=122311
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dalek ast: 8032fc0 | coke++ | S06-routine-modifiers/lvalue-subroutines.t:
parrot fudge recent failure RT #122313
03:06
synopsebot Link: rt.perl.org/rt3//Public/Bug/Displa...?id=122313
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[Coke] It would be great if someone with a copy of rakudo.jvm could fudge the remaining test failures for the release coming up. (I cannot build rakudo.jvm... until I get my new 16G laptop, muahahahah) 03:09
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hoelzro [Coke]: I'll give it a look 03:40
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hoelzro [Coke]: umm...how exactly does one fudge test failures? =D 03:42
hoelzro looks at [Coke]'s commits 03:46
dalek ast/S26-WHY: 3e4bba0 | (Rob Hoelz)++ | S26-documentation/why-trailing.t:
Add WHEREFORE tests for trailing comments
03:57
ast/S26-WHY: ac7bc2f | (Rob Hoelz)++ | S26-documentation/why-both.t:
Add WHEREFORE tests to why-both
ast/S26-WHY: 55b8914 | (Rob Hoelz)++ | S26-documentation/why-both.t:
Cover classes and methods for why-both
ast/S26-WHY: 8da43b1 | (Rob Hoelz)++ | S26-TODO:
Remove WHEREFORE from TODO list
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dalek ast/S26-WHY: 8a378a1 | (Rob Hoelz)++ | S26-documentation/why- (3 files):
Make sure trailing comments on parameters only affect that param
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hoelzro I see the test failures, but I don't know which I should fudge and which I should leave be 04:22
I'll ask again when the Europeans are up!
dalek rl6-bench: 36f0d5e | (Geoffrey Broadwell)++ | microbenchmarks.pl:
Add int -> str conversion + non-constant concat tests

This not only tests performance of int -> str conversion (a common operation), but allows the testing of concatenation with non-constant terms (because jnthn++ recently optimized the constant case, which is a valuable common case for users, but testing only the constant variant skews overall performance results).
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masak morning, #perl6 05:49
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sergot o/ 06:10
morning
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Timbus oh, shifting from an empty list is an exception in perl 6 06:17
oh. okay, its just a fail object that i was mishandling. eh 06:24
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dalek rl6-bench: 1766bbb | (Geoffrey Broadwell)++ | microbenchmarks.pl:
Add split_string_{constant,regex} tests

Add tests for splitting a long string using a constant string and a simple regex. Also fix trim_string's work estimate to match the O(n**2) estimates used for the split tests.
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liztormato has boarded and should see you all on the other side of the pond 07:52
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sergot m: say buf8.new("Ł".encode); 08:13
camelia rakudo-moar 9e15cc: OUTPUT«Buf:0x<c5 81>␤»
sergot m: say buf8.new("L".encode);
camelia rakudo-moar 9e15cc: OUTPUT«Buf:0x<4c>␤»
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moritz m: say "Ł".perl 08:36
camelia rakudo-moar 9e15cc: OUTPUT«"Ł"␤»
moritz m: say "Ł".encode.perl
camelia rakudo-moar 9e15cc: OUTPUT«utf8.new(197, 129)␤»
moritz m: say "Ł".encode 08:37
camelia rakudo-moar 9e15cc: OUTPUT«Buf:0x<c5 81>␤»
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dalek osystem: 752af38 | sergot++ | META.list:
Encode added
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ren1us apparently if you run qqx{perl6} from the interpreter, it hangs so hard that even ctrl+C does nothing. 10:04
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moritz well, it tries to read from STDIN 10:08
ren1us i can see why it's misbehaving, but i feel like then going on to disregard what's essentially a de-facto kill signal in the original stdin is a bit much, even though that particular scenario is dirty in its own right 10:10
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moritz ren1us: agreed 10:51
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eiro hello #perl6 11:24
moritz eiro/ 11:25
masak \eiro 11:29
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carlin if a MoarVM change will affect how perl6 code works, should that be mentioned in rakudo's changelog? 11:34
specifically file creation operations now give default permissions of 0666
whereas in the previous release they were given something bizzare like 4777
masak thinks it should
hoelzro morning #perl6
masak ahojelzro \o 11:43
carlin github.com/rakudo/rakudo/pull/290/files # pull req updating ChangeLog 11:46
dalek kudo/nom: b2e65d8 | Carlin++ | docs/ChangeLog:
Update ChangeLog with DateTime and file changes

DateTime.new was changed MoarVM change affects file creation permissions
11:47
kudo/nom: b62d3e9 | moritz++ | docs/ChangeLog:
Merge pull request #290 from carbin/patch-1

Update ChangeLog with DateTime and file changes
timotimo the changelog should say something about tr/// 11:49
masak well volunteered!
timotimo not sure how to spell the change, though 11:50
carlin moritz++ # thanks :)
hoelzro does fudging still need to be done for the JVM?
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dalek kudo/nom: 2cf53c7 | timo++ | docs/ChangeLog:
mention tr/// by psch++
11:51
eiro is there a way to write something like "match as many <attr> as possible, no matter the LTM rule" ? 11:52
github.com/eiro/p6-lab/blob/master/sexml.p6
timotimo please be more specific? 11:53
eiro i'm working on this and the pb is <content>* can match the same than <attr>*
(line 6)
betterworld maybe if you use "regex" instead of token and rule
eiro so my attributes are slurped in the <content> match 11:54
betterworld, worth :) because the :lang{fr} is slurped 11:55
timotimo token is like regex, except :ratchet, rule is like token except :sigspace
eiro: maybe you want to have data have <!before ':'>?
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eiro dive back in the doc. thanks for the clue, timotimo 11:56
betterworld timotimo: yeah, so without :ratchet there will be more backtracking, which seems to be what eiro asked for :) 11:57
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timotimo that could help, aye 11:57
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eiro really have to understand backtracking control 11:59
moritz more backtracking is rarely the right answer
the right answer is usually to factor out common prefixes into a single rule 12:00
eiro the problem here is that data can accept almost everything 12:01
(as prefix)
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timotimo except ':' :) 12:02
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moritz so, <-[:]>* ? 12:04
timotimo i think only the very first character mustn't be a : 12:05
moritz or possibly <-[:]>*?
or <-[:]>.*?
timotimo it seems like the data begins with [':' <ident>] % [\s+]
er, i mean 12:06
before the data, you want to match*
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moritz missing quantifier? 12:08
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moritz on the LHR of the % 12:08
eiro right! actually ':'\S | <-[:]>
ooh... i'm reading the timotimo's subrule 12:09
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masak .u > 12:18
yoleaux U+003E GREATER-THAN SIGN [Sm] (>)
hoelzro wow, spectests take a long time on the JVM 12:21
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sergot .u ½ 12:30
yoleaux U+00BD VULGAR FRACTION ONE HALF [No] (½)
sergot .u ¾
yoleaux U+00BE VULGAR FRACTION THREE QUARTERS [No] (¾)
jnthn Those numbers. They're so tasteless. 12:31
hoelzro is there any reason that GrammarHOW is not Documenting? I feel like a Grammar should also be able to have a WHY 12:32
jnthn hoelzro: It is, by inheriting from ClassHOW, iirc. 12:33
masak jnthn: you probably know this, but that sense of "vulgar" essentially means "common" ;)
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timotimo so "vulgar speech" is distasteful because it's used by the "common folk" who are, of course, plebian, uneducated and in general not to be spoken to except for by your underlings? 12:34
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jnthn No shit. 12:36
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jnthn Of course, by now I'm looking up the etymology of vulgar fraction... :) 12:36
arnsholt In Latin, "vulgus" is "the crowd" or "the masses" =)
jnthn Ah... "Vulgar turned up first in English in the fourteenth century and then referred to something that was in common or general use or something customary or done as a matter of everyday practice. There was nothing disapproving about it." 12:37
timotimo ah
masak enjoyed blog.plover.com/prog/perl/barewords-setup.html and its follow-up
jnthn And wasn't until the 17th century it started to take on the other meaning. 12:38
masak jnthn: similarly, a lot of plants have "vulgaris" in their name, not because they are bad, but because they are common.
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Urgoster perl6: say 3; 12:39
camelia rakudo-jvm 2cf53c: OUTPUT«(timeout)» 12:40
..rakudo-{parrot,moar} 2cf53c, niecza v24-109-g48a8de3: OUTPUT«3␤»
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Ven o/ 12:42
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hoelzro jnthn: oh, really? 12:52
hmm
oh, I think I understand why my documentating code doesn't work for it, then
does nqp::getattr respect inheritance?
timotimo you always have to supply the class that initially declared the attribute
thus, the answer is Mu :)
hoelzro ah ha 12:53
bummer
but that's why my thing doesn't work for grammars
timotimo huh?
jnthn Why are you doing getattr? 12:54
timotimo if you nqp::getattr($the_thing, ClassHOW, '$!why') should work even if $the_thing is a GrammarHOW
hoelzro hang on, I'll pull up the code
jnthn Don't violate encapsulation of meta-objects; add a method.
timotimo mhm
hoelzro github.com/hoelzro/rakudo/blob/S26....nqp#L2081 12:55
hmm
I'm sure this branch will undergo some rigorous criticism once I'm done with it =) 12:56
timotimo that'll just mean your next branch will be better :3
jnthn yeah, add a method, don't getattr it
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hoelzro ok 12:58
I'll do that
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Ven should [] only accept operators that are monoids ? 13:09
(in [+], [*]. to have the monoid's zero element) 13:10
m: say [//] 0, 1, 2; 13:11
camelia rakudo-moar 2cf53c: OUTPUT«0␤»
Ven m: say [//] ();
camelia rakudo-moar 2cf53c: OUTPUT«(Any)␤»
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Ven Now I'm wondering. Is perl 6 a racket dialect, or is racket a perl 6 slang ? 13:18
.oO( #lang perl6, and now watch the world burn ) (sorry, I'm doing some racket macros/templates, and they look really cool, and I wonder in what sense could we bring them on for p6)
13:19
[Coke] sits on a presentation about AWS and wonders if we could be taking advantage. 13:20
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timotimo amazon web services? 13:22
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moritz Awesome Web Shit? 13:28
masak Applications With Snowmen? 13:33
jnthn Asteroids With Snowmen? :) 13:35
moritz Altruists With Swords? :-) 13:36
jnthn still counts the comet/snowman thing as one of his favorite Rakudo parsing bugs :)
masak .oO( benefit humanity with your swords, altruists! ) 13:38
Ven kinda WATs, but doesn't mind the snowmen
ok, google was accurate
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arnsholt How did that parsing bug happen though? 13:45
Some kind of Unicode-bug, I suppose?
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jnthn I think so :) 13:48
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Ven
.oO( I've fixed so many bugs, I can't even remember what the snowmen did )
13:50
masak mostly the snowmen act as comic relief for the main plot with the two sisters. 13:52
srsly though, I don't think the snowman-comet parsing bug ever got an explanation. at least I never heard one. 13:57
it also didn't really get a specific fix -- an older parsing engine just got swapped for a newer one.
PerlJam masak: let it go, man. Let it go.
masak :P
carlin it's one of things where you're better off not knowing 13:58
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masak I dunno. at least it would have made for an interesting blog post :) 13:59
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muraiki Ven: yeah, racket macros are really nice 14:05
here's a neat article about creating a text adventure DSL using syntax-rule: cacm.acm.org/magazines/2012/1/14480...t/fulltext 14:07
Ven s#langs :P
PerlJam Hmm ... that feels very familiar. 14:08
almost masakish. :)
masak ok, that piqued my interest. 14:09
masak looks
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Ven muraiki++ # helping me to get masak++ to get a look ;) 14:16
muraiki :D 14:17
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hoelzro I think the reason I avoided methods for my S26 stuff is I didn't want to "contaminate" the meta object API 14:29
is there a way to remove methods on meta objects before handing control over to the script/repl? 14:30
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jnthn hoelzro: That's the wrong way to see it. 14:31
hoelzro: The point of having a meta-object API is that you can programatically construct the things the compiler constructs.
hoelzro oh 14:32
I see
that...makes a lot of sense, actually
I wonder, then
if instead of explicitly fixing the WHEREFORE for a WHY
I should fix it in the WHY accessor
because if a user were told, "oh yeah, you have to call obj.fix_wherefore", that would be kind of dumb. 14:33
Ven I can define a lazy function macro in racket in 7 lines. Let's try with p6 now .. 14:34
jnthn I'm not intimately familiar with the problem you're working on, but it sounds like a better design to have it that way :)
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hoelzro jnthn: I'm just fixing up Rakudo to comply with S26 14:36
Ven Well, I'm not sure macros in their current state can do what I'd like them to, hmm. 14:38
PerlJam Ven: careful ... you might accidentally volunteer to fix them ;) 14:39
Ven PerlJam: I'd probably do it, if I were in holidays, and had more free time on my hands.
well, I can write a `lazy` sub easily enough and `my &a =` it, but it's not really the same,. 14:40
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FROGGS everybody: please update the changelog if needed! today is release day 15:32
hoelzro \o/ 15:34
FROGGS: do the upcoming changes to #= merit mention?
FROGGS hmmmm
can we put it in when we know what happened to #=? :o) 15:35
hoelzro I'm hoping to have them ready for 2014.08
#= means "leading doc" at the moment
it's changing to mean "trailing doc"
"use #| if you want leading docs"
FROGGS let's do that when it is done, so ppl an play with it... okay? 15:36
PerlJam that seems backwards to me btw.
FROGGS we usually do not mention upcoming changes
PerlJam at least huffman-wise
(or maybe I just like #= more then #| :) 15:37
carlin japhb_ recommended a couple of days ago that it be mentioned in the changelogs as a deprecation warning 15:38
hoelzro ok 15:39
FROGGS is something already deprecated?
hoelzro someone recommended mentioning it a few days, so I thought I'd bring it up
PerlJam IF it generates a deprecation warning, that might deserve a mention. 15:40
FROGGS because I don't like to announce something that might change a little due to upcoming discussions
PerlJam If it doesn't, then I'd save it to the next release
(just MHO)
FROGGS PerlJam: mine too
hoelzro should we make it generate one for 2014.07? 15:41
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hoelzro speaking of discussions, should I mention this on perl6-compilers? 15:41
PerlJam hoelzro: first off ... how? The construct will still exist, just that its semantics will change. How do you "deprecate" semantics? 15:42
hoelzro I always assumed it would be ok, since it would be updating Rakudo to be in line with the spec
hmm
good point
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japhb_ Re: #= deprecation, my concern was mostly that we've been using it and producing sample code with the current usage for a while. Which means that I suspect a fair number of people may have USAGE info that points to the wrong multis after the change, and that will surprise people. 16:42
(I know I will.)
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wolfram_ Please hlep me -- what perl version was it that changed the meaning of 'print(two + two == five ? "true" : "false")' in the 17th century? (irclog.perlgeek.de/perl6/2014-07-17#i_9038417) 17:13
huf :D 17:14
wolfram_: wait, is that a serious question?
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wolfram_ Only if you can provide firsthand experience from that time :-) 17:15
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huf i've been alive for millions of years dude 17:16
wolfram_ (Couldn't resist to mogrify from useless lurker to useless contributor for that...) 17:17
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dalek ast: 32ca69c | (Tobias Leich)++ | S32-io/IO-Socket-Async.t:
mark flapping test as TODO
17:25
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timotimo dalek: that'll turn an OK/NOT OK test into an OK #TODO/NOT OK #TODO test 17:28
er... i meant FROGGS -^
is that an improvement?
FROGGS timotimo: the spectest does not fail now, so I'd say yes 17:29
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timotimo OK 17:29
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timotimo walk & 17:32
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[Coke] TODOing flapping tests is not helpful. 17:52
also: do not fudge tests without a ticket if possible.
masak +1
maybe flapping tests should be isolated/quarantined into their own directory instead? 17:53
[Coke] here's why it's not helpful. what happens when this test passes for someone - shoudl they untodo it?
How can they tell if it's fixed, or if it flapped?
FROGGS tadzik / moritz / colomon / xfix: github.com/tadzik/Bailador/pull/11 # please merge in case you have commit bit
[Coke]: at least on my box that test passes like four times out of five, so one can see that there is something going on... 17:55
what I don't like about skipping them (with a ticket), is that they just are ticketed and forgotten then
TAP has no proper way to mark something flapping, so I am not sure what is better than TODO-ing it 17:56
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dalek ecs: 635fb4c | coke++ | S99-glossary.pod:
Define "flap"
17:57
[Coke] FROGGS: you leave it open, and mark it with a ticket.
masak FROGGS: we don't need to mark it up with TAP. we can mark it up any way we want.
FROGGS [Coke]: what do you mean by 'leave it open', what is 'it' in this sentence? 17:58
[Coke] "ticketed and forgotten" - better to be ticketed and fudged and forgotten than just fudged and forgotten. (there are nearly 900 fudges for rakudo that are not ticketed, "unspecced", or "NYI" at the moment)
do not fudge the test.
either skip it, or leave it running. 17:59
FROGGS [Coke]: I will not release with failing spectests
[Coke] in either case, it needs a ticket.
FROGGS I am about to ticket it right now
[Coke] then skip it. I don't want a release with passing todos.
FROGGS k
[Coke] "all tests pass " >> "some todo'd tests pass" >> "any test failed" 18:00
Should continue to include "flap" somewhere in the fudge directive so it's not blindly auto-unfudged later. 18:01
FROGGS++
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masak consensus++ 18:03
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dalek kudo-star-daily: 0cb7ef5 | coke++ | log/ (14 files):
today (automated commit)
18:03
rl6-roast-data: 1e09f7d | coke++ | / (5 files):
today (automated commit)
[Coke] I see 21 JVM failures, 28 moar failures (you skipped bytes_suppy - echo server failed on the daily run today), and list/uniq aborted 26 tests. 18:04
there is one failure in parrot which is a leftover question I had from yesterday: how do you todo a -subtest- 18:05
2 subests, one failing: todo the test, you get a todo passed; leave it alone, you get a failure.
I hate to skip it, but it seems the cleanest answer. 18:06
dalek ast: 121df26 | (Tobias Leich)++ | S32-io/IO-Socket-Async.t:
skip flapping test, see RT #122318
18:08
synopsebot Link: rt.perl.org/rt3//Public/Bug/Displa...?id=122318
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FROGGS okay, star-m also passes here 18:10
star-p seems problematic
[Coke] S32-io/IO-Socket-Async.t 4 - Echo server 18:11
S32-io/IO-Socket-Async.t 6 - bytes_supply
S32-list/uniq.t aborted 26 test(s)
those are the failures in the daily run, fwiw.
FROGGS yeah
I've not seen these fails (except IO-Async #6) on my box 18:12
[Coke] (for moar)
timotimo i ended up not really walking much. instead i got to pet a kittehs tummeh
FROGGS timotimo: a what? 18:13
[Coke] FROGGS: cutearoo.com/wp-content/uploads/201...itten5.jpg 18:14
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FROGGS what is a tummeh? 18:14
[Coke] "tummy" 18:15
masak guesses "stomach"
nwc10 I think tummeh is to ketteh as tummy is to kitten
[Coke] yes, that
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FROGGS ahh :o) 18:18
well yes, that's certainly better than walking :o)
[Coke] needs to write a jabber bot, and wonders if he could finagle it to be in perl6. 18:19
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huf you mean welkehng? 18:19
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retupmoca [Coke]: I have a Net::XMPP module that should handle the basics (theoretically), although it doesn't handle roster/contacts for you at all 18:21
[Coke]: I'd be happy to develop it more if you open issues for features/bugs
it'll even support TLS as soon as I figure out how to upgrade a standard socket to a SSL/TLS connection 18:22
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[Coke] secure connection might be required; checking... 18:30
retupmoca secure connection can be done if the server supports the old-style ssl connection in addition to STARTTLS 18:31
I just don't know how to do STARTTLS with the current OpenSSL bindings
[Coke] config.setSASLAuthenticationEnabled(true); // all the info I have at the moment.
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retupmoca sasl is separate from SSL 18:41
I think Net::XMPP only supports one SASL method right now, though
don't know what methods your server supports 18:42
[Coke] me neither; I had a java bot that just connected and echo'd, that's dea now, need to figure out what happened. 18:49
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carlin there are some failing tests in S32-temporal/local.t but they won't automatically run on most systems 19:01
FROGGS m: say nqp::gethllsym('perl6', 'P6EX'); 19:03
camelia rakudo-moar 2cf53c: OUTPUT«("X::Assignment::RO" => sub (Any $typename = { ... }) { #`(Sub+{<anon>}|139948762856144) ... }, "X::ControlFlow::Return" => sub () { #`(Sub+{<anon>}|139948762855928) ... }, "X::Multi::Ambiguous" => sub (Any $dispatcher, @ambiguous) { #`(Sub+{<anon>}|139948…»
FROGGS p: say nqp::gethllsym('perl6', 'P6EX');
camelia rakudo-parrot 2cf53c: OUTPUT«("X::Assignment::RO" => sub (Any $typename = { ... }) { #`(Sub+{<anon>}|1956344805137267409) ... }, "X::ControlFlow::Return" => sub () { #`(Sub+{<anon>}|1956344805143578829) ... }, "X::Multi::Ambiguous" => sub (Any $dispatcher, @ambiguous) { #`(Sub+{<ano…»
FROGGS hmmm....
[Coke] carlin: thanks for the reminder. 19:07
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[Coke] ah, that's not an env var, that's an evil hardcoded linux only hack. 19:09
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[Coke] carlin - it would be nice if you could open a ticket reminding us to make those tests a little more amenable to actually getting run. 19:11
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[Coke] .seen donaldh 19:35
yoleaux I saw donaldh 4 Jul 2014 14:16Z in #perl6: * donaldh imagines some kind of temporal instability
[Coke] .ask donaldh - can you add some notes to the README for perl6-eclipse-plugin about how to install it in eclipse?
yoleaux [Coke]: I'll pass your message to donaldh.
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[Coke] retupmoca: do you support connecting via an http proxy? 19:46
retupmoca [Coke]: Not directly; but you can pass in an already connected socket and it'll use that 19:47
[Coke]: If you're using a SOCKS proxy, there's a Net::SOCKS module I've built that you can use to make a socket to pass in 19:48
vendethiel- .seen pmichaud 19:51
yoleaux I saw pmichaud 19 Jun 2014 22:06Z in #perl6: <pmichaud> moving there
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retupmoca just realized he hasn't written any tests or docs for Net::XMPP 20:03
I suppose that's the first thing I should improve
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dalek ast: 7ab6b34 | (David Warring [email@hidden.address] | integration/advent2011-day24.t:
adding advent 2011 day 24
20:12
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dalek ast: f271d8c | (David Warring [email@hidden.address] | integration/advent2011-day24.t:
fixed TAP
20:38
TimToady well, I am now allowed to read a little, so I can at least drop in and say "hi" 20:39
yoleaux 11 Jul 2014 20:07Z <pippo> TimToady: I hope all goes well with your eyes. Best wishes.
FROGGS TimToady: hi :o) 20:41
masak hi TimToady
FROGGS TimToady: did it went well?
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TimToady pretty well, I ended up with three different detachments, so they just riveted my retina all the way around, and it seems to be holding nicely 20:43
[Coke] TimToady: Eye can't believe you didn't pun that up.
TimToady I see...
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[Coke] hugme: hug TimToady 20:43
hugme hugs TimToady
FROGGS groans a little... but smiles
TimToady the only bad news is that I apparently have some nerve damage to part of my macula, which may or may not recover 20:44
FROGGS eww
that means your eyesight is LTA?
timotimo TimToady: o/ 20:45
hope you're getting better soon!
TimToady so I have a spot right below my fovea (as I view it) that's looks kind of like a leech, with its tail extending over to my optic disk where the nerve comes in
FROGGS or does that mean that it is exhausting to read/look?
ahh
TimToady They told me not to read for the first week
didn't want things sloshing around too much
[Coke] we can probably find an intern to ready you the backscroll... 20:46
jnap best of luck TimToady, my best friend has been losing his eyesight for the past 10 years in drips and drabs, and all I ca say is that its great we live in an era of affordable large and bright monitors
FROGGS yeah... understandable
TimToady inside is currently about 70% gas and 30% water
jnap: well, fortunately I still have a good eye too :)
I think I'd still be able to read with the bad eye if I look below the line 20:47
jnap that will help, just is a nice excuse to always make other people drive
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TimToady but can't tell anything refractive currently, since air and water are so different 20:47
[Coke] TimToady: OOOH, do you have an eye patch?
TimToady well, it's "air", with some percentage of perfluro propane
I did the first few nights :) 20:48
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TimToady so, Aye!!! 20:48
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TimToady jnap: well, actually, I like to dirve 20:48
er, drive
TimToady blames his bad eye :)
looks straight down is odd because it's sloshy 20:49
since that's where the puddle is
masak tonight's little group theory fun: gist.github.com/masak/0c4496b90e2aebf98062 20:50
TimToady oh, and also my iris seems to be stick open for now, probably just overdid on the atropine,
masak I have a very weird effect wherein the last block in that gist doesn't seem to run. the rest works fine, though.
TimToady but the cool thing about is that I don't have PERL :)
(Pupils Equal and Reactive to Light)
dalek kudo/nom: 2647500 | (Tobias Leich)++ | src/vm/parrot/guts/bind.c:
[parrot] throw typed exeption X::TypeCheck::Binding

Only JVM throws still an X::AdHoc.
20:52
FROGGS PERL doesn't sound as if it was a bad thing 20:53
TimToady it's a good thing, but I ain't got it at the moment 20:54
FROGGS ahh
TimToady I think I got an extra dose of atropine because a different doctor looked at my eye earlier in the day of the surgery 20:55
so it might stay that way another week
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TimToady is likely to get better though, unlike the other neuropathy, which I deem to be permanent probably, but then I'll be happily surprised if it isn't :) 20:56
maybe I can be a guinea pig for retinal regeneration someday, which would be cool 20:57
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segomos what do you have? 20:59
or why were they looking at your eye?
TimToady had two emergency eye surgeries last week 21:00
multiply detached retina
(no apparent cause, other than just my bad eye getting worse...)
segomos ouch
was it repaired aside from the atropine OD? 21:01
TimToady they saved most of my retina, but the side effect of surgery is the blind spot below my fovea, about 8° high and about 20° wide
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TimToady could have been from any number of reasons 21:02
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TimToady a yanked nerve either before or during reattachment, or a misfired laser shot, or blockage of a blood vessel, or just optical nerve damage from pressure variations 21:03
I'm sure the doctor can think of another ten or twenty possible reasons
segomos i had a guy that worked for me that had some kind of spindle problem and he sees a big floating "psychedelic spot" in the middle of his vision until that eye eventually goes blind. i hope your spot goes away, i know his causes him a lot of stress
TimToady mine is quite unlikely to get worse, since it's likely one-shot damage 21:04
they're actually more worried about my cornea now, since it greatly increases the chance of rejection of my transplant to have immune cells crawling all over the place, and my eye is obviously rather enflamed still 21:05
segomos sorry to hear, vision is the only good sensory item i have left :-(
TimToady er, inflamed
segomos how long did they say until it's gone? 21:06
or until they know
huf even if this all goes to shit and you end up a pirate, you'll still have one functioning eye, right?
TimToady until the inflammation is gone? it's already getting better
but my cornea Dr wants me to keep putting steroids in my eye for a month
segomos right or left
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TimToady my right is the unlucky one 21:07
the left on has only had a cataract
so now I've pretty much had something go wrong with every part of my right eye; I guess the rear of my eye was feeling left out, so it popped both the retina and optic nerve to catch up to the front of my eye 21:08
masak if anyone could confirm that the last block of gist.github.com/masak/0c4496b90e2aebf98062 indeed doesn't execute for them either, that'd help -- kthx 21:09
huf you could still develop a rocky horror picture show midnight screening in the middle...
that could be distracting
TimToady but the parts of my macula that didn't suffer nerve damage were also spared from the detachment, so I should have some fine vision on the upper side of my macula
masak I don't see why it wouldn't, but it doesn't here. or rather, it runs until the if statement, and then just disappears. 21:10
I think we have a runtime bug of some kind.
TimToady the detached parts still seem to have some vision too, though time will tell how much comes back
well, I've probably overdone already for a first session of reading, so I'll go rest more, and find another audio book (just finish Citizen of the Galaxy by RAH) 21:11
afk &
segomos masak: which p6? 21:13
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masak segomos: gist.github.com/masak/0c4496b90e2aebf98062 21:15
segomos i've update yours, i ran it with moar and jvm 21:16
i updated your gist* with the output of both -m and -j
masak huh. 21:17
mine doesn't hang, it exits.
segomos i'm building most recent moar/jvm right now, i'm about 2 weeks behind i think
masak I'm on 2014.06-62-gc55942f. 21:18
m: say "you?"
camelia rakudo-moar 2cf53c: OUTPUT«you?␤»
masak ok, so I'm not on latest either.
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segomos 014.06-17-gf2060ea 21:18
masak ok, by inserting print statements everywhere, I now conclude that the code just disappears somewhere in the innermost `for` loop in &isometric. it enters an iteration, but then just disappears into nothing. 21:20
I think I have a live bug here; I'll try to golf it.
masak rebuilds his Rakudo first 21:22
segomos i'm still 'make'ing 21:23
masak did we have a Rakudo release today? I haven't been following 100% -- maybe I missed when the release happened? 21:24
FROGGS? 21:25
FROGGS masak: it is today, aye
masak ah, but not released yet.
FROGGS I am trying to fix one last thing before cutting the release
masak ah; ok. 21:26
good news: the program runs much better on latest Rakudo :) 21:27
I don't think it hangs -- it just runs for very long.
segomos how did you build so quickly? 21:29
or did you just do rakudo?
masak brand new laptop. SSD. :)
no, all of it. I `git clean -xdf`'d first. 21:30
segomos ahh i have a macbook pro with ssd that is just slow i guess :)
your switches are faster than mine
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segomos masak: what run time are you looking at? 21:35
masak ooh, it finish'd.
segomos i've had one running for 4 or 5 minutes
masak yeah, it takes long.
segomos ok
masak there's an O(N!) in there.
segomos ah 21:36
masak runs again and times his
anyway, everything works. najs.
segomos must optimize!
masak yeah -- suggestions welcome :)
segomos (kidding)
masak probably something can be improved in my algorithms.
segomos not really sure what this thing is doing
masak it's checking whether groups are isomorphic to each other. 21:37
segomos i just didn't see any `rm` or `deltree` type stuff
masak it does so "the hard way".
segomos ahh ic
dalek kudo/nom: 1b01e7a | (Tobias Leich)++ | src/vm/jvm/runtime/org/perl6/rakudo/Binder.java:
[jvm] throw typed exception X::TypeCheck::Binding

That means we have this now on all backends.
21:44
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masak segomos: 8 minutes, 35 seconds. 21:44
segomos i'm timing mine now too 21:45
masak m: say [*] 2..8 21:55
camelia rakudo-moar 264750: OUTPUT«40320␤»
masak that's the number of iterations the second block runs.
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segomos 9:52 for me 21:56
masak oh, better than I feared.
segomos i'm just impatient 21:58
masak :) 21:59
segomos wonder how well http::server::async works now
dalek kudo/nom: 960f2a2 | (Tobias Leich)++ | docs/ChangeLog:
more changelogs entries for 2014.07
kudo/nom: 18a496b | (Tobias Leich)++ | docs/ChangeLog:
adjust wording of required parrot version
22:01
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dalek kudo/nom: df269df | (Tobias Leich)++ | docs/announce/2014.07.md:
add announcement for 2014.07
22:13
kudo/nom: 6a2ab39 | (Tobias Leich)++ | docs/release_guide.pod:
move current release downwards
masak \o/
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dalek p: d181feb | (Tobias Leich)++ | / (2 files):
bump VERSION to 2014.07
22:18
thou FROGGS++ # Thanks for the release! 22:23
FROGGS not yet done :o)
masak it ain't over until the fat Wikipedia article sings.
thou :)
Let's say I'm cheering, distractedly, from the sidelines. 22:24
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masak cheers, too 22:29
FROGGS: good luck with le release.
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masak 'night, #perl6 22:29
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lizmat arrived in Portland uneventfully, rather differently from another flight leaving from Amsterdam around the same time :-( 22:36
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timotimo oh, the NativeCall bugfix that makes callbacks to different closures over the same code work properly is still missing on jvm and parrot, isn't it? 22:43
FROGGS I know nothing about such a fix 22:45
timotimo c511cb7 22:46
github.com/MoarVM/MoarVM/commit/c511cb7 22:47
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FROGGS ahh, interesting 22:48
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dalek kudo/nom: fb07f82 | (Tobias Leich)++ | tools/build/NQP_REVISION:
[release] bump NQP revision
23:02
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dalek kudo/nom: f24e0eb | (Tobias Leich)++ | VERSION:
[release] bump VERSION
23:02
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dalek kudo/nom: 0aaba7e | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | t/spectest.data:
Add some more advent tests
23:11
FROGGS I am going to continue tomorrow with the release process, I do not want to make mistakes just because I almost fall asleep 23:13
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Guest20108 Reading the backlog. I note that the conversation between Mäsak and jhntn is not for the vulgum pecus 23:18
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