»ö« Welcome to Perl 6! | perl6.org/ | evalbot usage: 'p6: say 3;' or rakudo:, or /msg camelia p6: ... | irclog: irc.perl6.org or colabti.org/irclogger/irclogger_logs/perl6 | UTF-8 is our friend! 🦋
Set by Zoffix on 25 May 2018.
buggable 🎺🎺🎺 It's time for the monthly Accidental /win Lottery 😍😍😍 We have 2 ballots submitted by 1 users! DRUM ROLL PLEASE!... 00:00
And the winning number is 3! Congratulations to [Coke]! You win a roll of duck tape!
El_Che it's rigged, it's always [Coke] 00:01
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Geth doc/car-grant-midrat: 61 commits pushed by 10 authors
review: github.com/perl6/doc/compare/ac030...3da68e7375		 00:20
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Geth doc/car-grant-midrat: 904de9d3cc | (Zoffix Znet)++ | doc/Language/numerics.pod6
[CaR Grant] Toss MidRat and ZDR normalization

  - MidRat is ded[^1]
  - ZDR normalization is currently on back burner due to
   causing poorer error reporting and not solving all the
   mathemantical problems with ZDRs
  [1] blogs.perl.org/users/zoffix_znet/20...-2018.html		 00:29
doc: zoffixznet++ created pull request #2086:
Add `Numerics` Language page
doc/master: 33 commits pushed by (Zoffix Znet)++, (JJ Merelo)++
review: github.com/perl6/doc/compare/9e1b7...8c8911d5e0
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Geth doc: e8da29f414 | (Zoffix Znet)++ | 3 files
Remove leftover references to MidRat

It never existed outside of branches
  blogs.perl.org/users/zoffix_znet/20...-2018.html		 00:48
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b2gills Zoffix: Then you have a problem with Stack Overflow's CSS, not with me. If you note, the way it is now, you can change the `1.` to any number and it will correctly renumber it on presentation, because it is now a correctly formatted Markdown ordered list. Also I told you in case you didn't like the change. There is no reason to be a _____________ about it. (Note that I made it so it would be easier to change the urls in the future 01:12
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Zoffix b2gills: I had no problems until you started editing my shit. The seven prior edits to the answer should've suggested to you I didn't just type it all up with my eyes closed. It was perfect and you ruined it and there isn't even a reverse button for me to undo it. 01:22
But I no longer care. In 22 hours all those posts will be from "user342432". Edit them 'till you blue in the face. 01:24
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b2gills Zoffix: I assumed that you don't know all the syntax of Markdown, partially because you keep putting way too many dashes for a horizontal rule (you only need three), and that you keep using the worst way to add hyperlinks. You should always use named "variable" links at either the top or bottom of the page. 01:24
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b2gills There was no need for me to notify you of the change. I gave you the courtesy of telling you so that if you really didn't like it you could click on “rollback”. I even gave you the link where you would need to go to find it. If I didn't think of you as a rational adult, I wouldn't have changed it. 01:36
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TEttinger I'm not sure why people continue to think of Zoffix as a rational adult... he seems to have these weird angsty phases, where he just yells at people for confusing reasons, with regularity. I'm just an observer, I have no vested interest here, but the guy needs to grow up 02:19
perlawhirl sings "why can't we be friends" 02:28
talking _about_ people rarely helps. human's are allowed to get angry sometimes... but we also have the capacity to see beyond these moments 02:29
b2gills TEttinger: I think that what you wrote, wasn't written in the best spirit. Neither is what I wrote. The difference is I was having a disagreement with him and was emotional over it. (It was also far nicer than what I was originally going to write). 02:34
TEttinger it's just that he does this regularly... it seems like he needs to acknowledge it 02:35
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atweiden-air i'm almost certain i read in the docs somewhere it's possible to lookup a variable's name, e.g. `my $variable; $variable.HOW.^self_name eq 'variable'` 02:39
does anyone know how to do this?
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Zoffix atweiden-air: .VAR.name 02:40
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Zoffix atweiden-air: but keep in mind that only works with proper variables. If a thing has something bound to it, that will give the name of the bound thing, or even crash with "no such method" 02:41
m: my $foo; say $foo.VAR.name; my $bar := $foo; say $bar.VAR.name
camelia $foo
$foo
Zoffix m: my $foo := 42; say $foo.VAR.name; my $bar := $foo; say $bar.VAR.name
camelia No such method 'name' for invocant of type 'Int'. Did you mean any of these?
base
none
note
take

in block <unit> at <tmp> line 1
Zoffix m: my $foo = 42; say $foo.VAR.WHAT =:= Scalar ?? $foo.VAR.name !! 'unknown name' 02:42
camelia $foo
atweiden-air Zoffix: great
Zoffix m: my $foo := 42; say $foo.VAR.WHAT =:= Scalar ?? $foo.VAR.name !! 'unknown name'
camelia unknown name
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gegagome hi guys, I am new to perl so pardon my ignorance, but if an employer is looking for a perl developer, do they mean perl6? 05:02
and how do I know if a tutorial is perl5 or perl6?
raschipi No, they mean perl 5. 05:04
Everywhere you see just Perl, it's Perl 5. 05:05
If it's about Perl 6, it will be explicity about that.
gegagome I see
got it 05:07
thanks for the clarification
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jmerelo squashable6: status 06:09
squashable6 jmerelo, ⚠🍕 Next SQUASHathon in ≈3 hours (2018-06-02 UTC-12⌁UTC+14). See github.com/rakudo/rakudo/wiki/Mont...Squash-Day
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raschipi domidumont: Any plans to package roast and run it with autopkgtest? 06:33
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Geth doc: 1220c5ecea | (Luca Ferrari)++ | doc/Type/Mu.pod6
Improve documentation about bless.

See issue #2077		 07:04
synopsebot Link: doc.perl6.org/type/Mu
Geth doc: 2280294118 | (Luca Ferrari)++ | doc/Type/Mu.pod6
Try to explain why using new is bad idea.

See issue #2077
doc: cba5ade8c6 | (Luca Ferrari)++ | doc/Type/Mu.pod6
Link object construction documentation in method bless.

Close #2077
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AlexDaniel squashable6: next 07:20
squashable6 AlexDaniel, ⚠🍕 Next SQUASHathon in ≈2 hours (2018-06-02 UTC-12⌁UTC+14). See github.com/rakudo/rakudo/wiki/Mont...Squash-Day
AlexDaniel \o/
squashable6 Webhook for perl6/whateverable is now active! Half measures are as bad as nothing at all. 07:22
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AlexDaniel Zoffix: fwiw there's no problem for me, I'm fine with not editing your comments. The thing is that in many environments these kinds of microcontributions are encouraged (wikis, stackoverflow, even source code of projects) 07:29
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AlexDaniel and sometimes I even explicitly note that my comment can be edited, if it's a list of something 07:30
recently github introduced edit history for comments, so I guess there are not many reasons for not editing someone's stuff… 07:31
remarks from TEttinger are a bit worrying :( 07:32
Geth doc: 532a03908c | (JJ Merelo)++ | doc/Language/nativetypes.pod6
Links the Numerics page
 07:33
doc: 5c7ff9f51f | (JJ Merelo)++ | doc/Language/numerics.pod6
Fixes links and reflows
synopsebot Link: doc.perl6.org/language/nativetypes
synopsebot Link: doc.perl6.org/language/numerics
AlexDaniel IMO it's fine being passionate about what you do, and getting a bit emotional is totally ok for me… as long as we focus on the actual topic and not downgrade to personal insults 07:34
jmerelo AlexDaniel: I would like also good answers in StackOverflow to _not_ be removed. 07:36
AlexDaniel and whether someone is an adult or not really should not matter, I hope we won't be using age as a means for discrimination…
I mean, just the idea of saying that someone is an adult or not is just wrong in its root, regardless of an actual age 07:37
jmerelo: what do you mean? 07:38
I think if you delete your account then it turns your answers into community wiki, no?
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jmerelo AlexDaniel: I want Squashaton! And Pizza! 07:59
AlexDaniel jmerelo: you can actually try following the instructions on github.com/perl6/whateverable/blob...IBUTING.md
jmerelo: and specifically on github.com/perl6/whateverable/wiki/Installation
jmerelo AlexDaniel: that I will :-)
AlexDaniel there are probably some rough spots in these instructions, yesterday I tried to go through things and found a bunch of issues 08:00
that I now resolved
so it should be much better/easier now, but who knows
jmerelo AlexDaniel: I'll start with that 08:01
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AlexDaniel I have a feeling that HTTP::UserAgent is running out of handles, or something like that 08:03
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AlexDaniel because if you run perl6 t/bisectable.t it will fail halfway through on the first run, but then it will succeed if you run it again because then it doesn't have to pull anything from the server anymore 08:03
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jmerelo I'm getting errors with some modules. Don't know if it will be temporary. Right now Stats is failing. 09:13
I'll start there... 09:14
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jmerelo Created a pull request for Stats github.com/MattOates/Stats/pull/9 09:19
squashable6: status 09:20
squashable6 jmerelo, ⚠🍕 Next SQUASHathon is in 39 minutes (2018-06-02 UTC-12⌁UTC+14). See github.com/rakudo/rakudo/wiki/Mont...Squash-Day
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AlexDaniel jmerelo: oh, this is when installing deps for whateverable? 09:52
jmerelo AlexDaniel: right.
AlexDaniel jmerelo: I tweaked the instructions a bit: github.com/perl6/whateverable/wiki...pendencies 09:53
so that --force is mentioned… 09:54
let's create an issue maybe?
jmerelo AlexDaniel: OK
AlexDaniel can you file a ticket?
jmerelo AlexDaniel: done. 09:55
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squashable6 🍕 AlexDaniel++ wrote a comment on “Installation fails in 2018.04”: github.com/perl6/whateverable/issu...-393834953 10:02
🍕🍕🍕 First contribution by AlexDaniel++! ♥
jmerelo .tell AlexDaniel I'm running tests now. There seem to be some of them failing and then it gets stuck on... /tmp/whateverable/rakudo-moar/c80ea2f28939875586d326ca1c63db2cdf7b8c8d is locked. Waiting…
yoleaux jmerelo: I'll pass your message to AlexDaniel.
squashable6 🍕 JJ++ wrote a comment on “CI test?”: github.com/perl6/whateverable/issu...-393835102
🍕🍕🍕 First contribution by JJ++! ♥
🍕 JJ++ opened issue “Dockerize it?”: github.com/perl6/whateverable/issues/323 10:04
Geth doc: df52c6576f | (Claudio Ramirez)++ | doc/Type/IO/Spec/Unix.pod6
style
 10:07
synopsebot Link: doc.perl6.org/type/IO::Spec::Unix
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Geth doc: b004ef0c95 | (Claudio Ramirez)++ | doc/Language/containers.pod6
remove anecdotical language
 10:10
synopsebot Link: doc.perl6.org/language/containers
squashable6 🍕 AlexDaniel++ labeled issue “Dockerize it?”: github.com/perl6/whateverable/issues/323
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squashable6 🍕 AlexDaniel++ wrote a comment on “Dockerize it?”: github.com/perl6/whateverable/issu...-393837244 10:12
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moritz 10:19
sorry 10:20
Geth doc: c3d66e9829 | (Claudio Ramirez)++ | doc/Language/containers.pod6
Add introductory paragraph
 10:22
synopsebot Link: doc.perl6.org/language/containers
AlexDaniel jmerelo: heading home now so will be away for ≈1 hour :) 10:23
yoleaux 10:02Z <jmerelo> AlexDaniel: I'm running tests now. There seem to be some of them failing and then it gets stuck on... /tmp/whateverable/rakudo-moar/c80ea2f28939875586d326ca1c63db2cdf7b8c8d is locked. Waiting…
AlexDaniel oooooohhh 10:24
squashable6 🍕 AlexDaniel++ edited issue “Make it easier to run for contributors”: github.com/perl6/whateverable/issues/122
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AlexDaniel jmerelo: check out this issue: github.com/perl6/whateverable/issues/122 10:24
jmerelo: some test files are known to either not work locally, or not work at all… 10:25
feel free to unbust anything
jmerelo: as for the stuff being left behind, if that happens you probbably need to do ｢rm -rf /tmp/whateverable/rakudo-moar/*｣
El_Che wow 10:26
until it's cleaned up a containers would be handy :) 10:27
AlexDaniel we can probably eliminate the issue if we also save the PID of the process…
and it doesn't affect bots running on the server because they have each their own virtual /tmp
El_Che: you mean this? github.com/perl6/whateverable/issues/323 10:28
squashable6 🍕 AlexDaniel++ wrote a comment on “Make it easier to run for contributors”: github.com/perl6/whateverable/issu...-393840941 10:29
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squashable6 🍕 AlexDaniel++ wrote a comment on “Make it easier to run for contributors”: github.com/perl6/whateverable/issu...-393840976 10:29
🍕 AlexDaniel++ edited wiki page “Installation”: github.com/perl6/whateverable/wiki/Installation 10:31
buggable New CPAN upload: P5rand-0.0.4.tar.gz by ELIZABETH modules.perl6.org/dist/P5rand:cpan:ELIZABETH 10:32
El_Che oh crap, I didn't know github was killing anonymous gists 10:33
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AlexDaniel already killed in fact 10:38
alright, away for ≈1 hour o/ 10:39
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buggable New CPAN upload: P5rand-0.0.5.tar.gz by ELIZABETH modules.perl6.org/dist/P5rand:cpan:ELIZABETH 10:42
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Geth doc: 65e76ccb73 | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | doc/Language/5to6-perlfunc.pod6
Mention new functions supported by P5math
 10:57
synopsebot Link: doc.perl6.org/language/5to6-perlfunc
lizmat afk for a few hours& 11:04
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buggable New CPAN upload: P5built-ins-0.0.21.tar.gz by ELIZABETH cpan.metacpan.org/authors/id/E/EL/....21.tar.gz 11:12
jkramer m: say 5+²; say 5² 11:14
camelia 7
25
jkramer m: say (1,2,3)>>²
camelia (1 4 9)
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jkramer m: say ²; say ²²; say ²²² 11:28
camelia 2
4
4194304
jkramer What is happening here?
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jkramer m: say 2**2**2 11:29
camelia 16
jkramer m: say 22**2
camelia 484
jkramer m: say ((²)²)² 11:31
camelia 16
jkramer Ah 11:33
m: say 2**22 == ²²²
camelia True
El_Che magic 11:35
jkramer \o/ 11:37
El_Che is it a bug? 11:38
moritz imho yes 11:39
m: ²
camelia WARNINGS for <tmp>:
Useless use of constant integer ² in sink context (line 1)
moritz ² shouldn't mean either 2 or **2 depending on the context
El_Che ²²² is a weird one 11:41
first ² is 2, the rest exponent
jkramer: can you post an issue with your examples? Good catch
jkramer Sure 11:42
El_Che jkramer++ 11:43
lizmat: re your SO comment "FWIW, a P5gethostbyname module that exports gethostbyname with Perl 5 semantics, is in the works" 11:46
lizmat: in this case the functionality is missing on Perl6 altogether. Weird that the solution is p5-semantics only. Just a thought. 11:47
lizmat: is there something weird for perl 6 on this type of contained functions?
lizmat: that make them "perl5 semantic"
makes
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jkramer github.com/rakudo/rakudo/issues/1892 11:56
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El_Che jkramer++ 11:59
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AlexDaniel I already commented on that issue 12:06
AlexDaniel brings popcorn
jkramer Ah sorry, I didn't know this is old/known 12:08
El_Che no sorries, it's confusing as hell 12:12
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jkramer Yeah, but realistically I probably wouldn't ever write ²²² in real-life and expect it to do something useful, so for me it's no biggie :) 12:15
I only found that by accident trying to find out how ² is implemented so it turns into **2 and works in code like (1,2,3)>>² 12:16
El_Che I would expect it to panic there 12:17
jkramer In (1,2,3)>>² ?
El_Che no, ²²²²²
jkramer Ah 12:18
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jkramer Actually I still don't know how ² is implemented, that's why I tried ².^name in the first place. :) I expected it to be defined as something like -> $n { $n ** 2 } so it works in >>² 12:19
El_Che Zoffix: Re: editing of posts on SO, see stackoverflow.com/help/editing 12:37
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AlexDaniel squashable6: status 13:39
squashable6 AlexDaniel, 🍕🍕 SQUASHathon is in progress! The end of the event in 1 day and ≈22 hours. See github.com/rakudo/rakudo/wiki/Mont...Squash-Day
AlexDaniel, Log and stats: gist.github.com/11815e42da19a6b523...16a13c2aa7
atroxaper CommaIDE BETA is released!
jnthn Finally! What took them so long? :) 13:44
yoleaux 31 May 2018 17:20Z <samcv> jnthn: i think this seems proper github.com/MoarVM/MoarVM/commit/1b83cc54bf trying to fix this coverity scan warning scan4.coverity.com/reports.htm#v27...tId=287729 let me know if any issues with this
atroxaper jnthn: haha ^^ 13:49
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SmokeMachine does the vim plugin works on CommaIDE? 13:51
El_Che isn't commaide just a plugin?
I would expect it could be combined with other plugins
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jnthn El_Che: It's both standalone IDE *and* can be used as a plugin 13:52
El_Che yes, that's what I mean 13:53
also being a plugin it should work with other plugins
jnthn SmokeMachine: Just installed the Vim plugin in Comma. Wow. I shoulda done this earlier. :D 13:54
El_Che pretty much how most language specific plugins/standalone intellij ide works
SmokeMachine jnthn: I can't use IntelliJ without that! :)
jnthn El_Che: Right, it's plugins all the way down (or up), pretty much. :) 13:55
El_Che (as in: if you need more than 1 lang, you'll endup with regular intellij + plugins)
jnthn: I'll try it when less busy. Looking forward to it. Cheers 13:58
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jnthn :) 13:58
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atroxaper jnthn: are debugger works? 14:05
null 14:06
java.util.concurrent.TimeoutException
at java.util.concurrent.CompletableFuture.timedGet(CompletableFuture.java:1771)
at java.util.concurrent.CompletableFuture.get(CompletableFuture.java:1915)
at edument.perl6idea.debugger.Perl6De...d.java:52)
jnthn: Have setup SDK. Can just run. Try to debug, then see Fatal Error ^
jnthn I didn't see *that* happen before, now. Please use the built-in report thing to send us the full trace. As to how well it works...it certainly needs a pretty recent MoarVM to stand much chance. 14:08
atroxaper Just updated perl6 from master... And send report ofcource. 14:09
jnthn Thanks, we'll take a look 14:12
El_Che jnthn: if rakudo java was on par with the regular one it would make your life easier in Java land, I guess 14:13
jnthn Hmm...maybe, though I'm doubtful we could have re-used the Rakudo parsing impl. What the IDEA platform wants there is just a bit too different to adapt. And you need a grammar that accepts every input too. 14:16
El_Che I see 14:18
jnthn What we actually built is a compiler that turns a Perl 6 grammar subset into a lexer/parser
El_Che impressive
jnthn And then took the Perl 6 grammar and marked it up with what tokens/tree nodes should be produced 14:19
El_Che it pays off to have the rakudo guy on the team :)
jnthn So we follow the real grammar pretty faithfully
So if you write stuff like a regex with a code block in it with a string in it that interpolates another code block that does a regex, then we'll cope alright. :)
Whether the reader of such code will also cope alright is another matter :P 14:20
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El_Che hehe 14:22
Geth doc: a1e3a9ad10 | (Zoffix Znet)++ (committed using GitHub Web editor) | doc/Language/glossary.pod6
Link memoization to the wiki
 14:25
synopsebot Link: doc.perl6.org/language/glossary
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El_Che AlexDaniel: I see the pop corn part now 14:29
Zoffix El_Che: yeah "Edits are expected to be substantial and to leave the post better than you found it" and which hasn't happened after b2gills's edit. "The rollback action itself then appears as the most recent item in the edit history." I only had rollback buttons for my own edits, not b2gills's, presumably because they have more rep. And since the diff included the entire post, I couldn't even manually edit it 14:31
without reviewing the entire post
El_Che: "this may not be the site for you." Yeah, agreed, which is why I deleted my account. Writing expert content to line the pockets of some nerd who does nothing while a stranger messes up your work is certainly not for me. 14:32
AlexDaniel: I like to believe I started GitHub's move to implement edit history when I emailed them saying a hostile user was editing my Issues and was damaging my character by misrepresenting what content my Issues contained. Thus, I don't believe they added it just so a stranger could barge in and make three of my sentences bold just because they felt like it. The comment is listed as posted by me. Just 14:36
because there's a way to perform two clicks to view the parts that weren't added by me doesn't mean most readers will automatically see which parts aren't from me.
El_Che Yeah, it seems to be an "deal with it or leave" policy 14:37
Zoffix This is the equivalent of personal space IRL. Just because you can stand 2 inches away from my face doesn't mean you should do that.
El_Che Zoffix: someone was trolling you changing your issues in bad faith? 14:39
that sounds bad
geekosaur I have other issues with SO, unrelated to this, but it still comes down to "everything must be on SO!" translating to "you don't want me to contribute" 14:41
El_Che geekosaur: I don't see it like that 14:42
geekosaur I noticed
El_Che geekosaur: it's just a popular medium that it's a first stop for many programmers
geekosaur you do not control my opinion, so I don't care how you see it
and it's not you that's doing most of the pushing anyway
El_Che geekosaur: and ofter the first link after a google search
Zoffix El_Che: they weren't trolling. I left a negative review of their project on CPANRatings and then filed a few bugs. They edited the issues to remove the actual bug reports and then added their own comment saying "issue deleted because the user is agressive" or something along those lines
El_Che in my opinion, the "everything" part applies to the doc site 14:43
SO is marketing
Zoffix El_Che: cpanratings.perl.org/dist/JSON-Create#12286 14:44
They now include a mention of me in the Pod :P
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El_Che lol 14:46
Zoffix El_Che: ah, here. Edited it to say "harrasment non-issue": github.com/benkasminbullock/json-c...e/issues/3 The log shows the original title was "Death on subrefs" and the same edit on github.com/benkasminbullock/json-c...e/issues/2 which log shows was originally titled as "Inconsistent/Unwanted Handling of Objects"
And then locked the Issues so I can't edit them anymore
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Zoffix Oh man, Comma is here!!@! 14:53
El_Che buy some RAM :) 14:54
Zoffix No paypal, eh? 14:55
Damn, I don't wanna enter my credit card number on some random site.
Instead of just paying by paypal, I had to get up and get my wallet in the other room! #FirstWorldProblems 14:57
El_Che: why some RAM? Does it need a lot? 15:00
El_Che Zoffix: it's a Java based IDE. It's good for a Java app though
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timotimo atroxaper: can you help me help you with the debugging issue? 15:05
atroxaper timotimo: with pleasant!))
timotimo i'm not 100% sure how to go about this; let's start with what version of perl6 is in your SDK?
Zoffix "Windows Defender SmartScreen prevented an unrecognized app from starting. Running this app might put your PC at risk." 15:06
atroxaper timotimo: on CommaIDE or Plugin&
timotimo Zoffix: put it at risk .. of being AWESOME! :P
atroxaper: which ever you are using i guess? 15:07
locally i have only the plugin in a regular IntelliJ IDEA
atroxaper timotimo: I download full CommaIDE for sure. And could setup SDK perl6 only from rakudobrew.
perl6 2018.05.43 now 15:08
timotimo OK, that is new enough to have the debugserver in it, at the very least
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timotimo OK, here's something you can try: in the run configuration that you use to debug, open the environment variables window, add a new one called MDS_PROTOCOL, set its value to "yes" 15:11
and run the debug process 15:14
it should give a lot of output in the console, hopefully
another thing we could try is setting the Debug Port to something that's surely unused in the Debug part of the Run Configuration 15:15
atroxaper timotimo: added just "thread 1 reacting to suspend request"
timotimo hm, if the address were already in use, moar would panic at the start, so that can't be it 15:16
atroxaper Yes. If I run the second debug then I see MoarVM panic... 15:17
timotimo right. comma needs to learn to find a free port before starting
and after the output appears you get that timeout error again?
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atroxaper yes. Actually the process is not finished. Just stuck. 15:19
timotimo is there any kind of firewall in place that might prevent the IDE from connecting to localhost on that port?
hm, it's probably not an ipv4/ipv6 problem? 15:21
atroxaper I think no/
jnthn timotimo: Is the suspend request something that can only be sent from the outside, or is that just because of it starting the program suspended? 15:22
timotimo the timeout for that connection is 2 seconds; it doesn't take that long to launch the moar process, right? 15:23
by itself, moar reaches the point where the port is opened in under a milisecond
atroxaper Gonna try to completely reinstall IntellijIDEA
jnthn timotimo: No, given it doesn't even load anything at the point it's suspended
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timotimo indeed 15:24
atroxaper jnthn: I clone rakudo, did configure and make. If I select rakudo folder in SDK dialog then I get "currupt" message :( 15:29
jnthn: I can choice SDK only from rakudobrew folder. 15:30
timotimo what folder exactly are you using?
i think it has to be the one you put into --prefix= with Configure.pl
atroxaper ~/git/rakudo/
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timotimo actually, the bin folder from the install prefix 15:30
jnthn atroxaper: It needs to be a directory containing a perl6 binary (or perl6.bat on Windows)
timotimo we could surely point that out in the error message 15:31
jnthn Yeah, or just try looking under bin/
timotimo right, or install/bin :)
jnthn Though in most cases folks have a Perl 6 in their PATH and we just find that and don't make them select anything :)
atroxaper The root of rakudo repository has perl6 binary...
Zoffix jkramer: the superscript operators are implemented in the grammar that rewrites them to a call of &postfix:<ⁿ> : github.com/rakudo/rakudo/blob/mast....nqp#L4340 github.com/rakudo/rakudo/blob/mast...7679-L7691 github.com/rakudo/rakudo/blob/c80e...c.pm6#L280 15:32
timotimo that's not one that works outside of the repository
jnthn Yes, but that binary doesn't work outside of the Rakudo directory, I believe.
atroxaper I have perl6 in the PATH and have to setup SDK.
timotimo comma is supposed to find the perl6 in path and suggest it as an SDK i think?
jnthn timotimo: Yes 15:33
atroxaper Ok. Then I just choice the one from rakudobrew ^^
timotimo we can surely figure out the case when someone selects the perl6 from inside the source folder
jnthn timotimo: Probably yes, but we can't really make it work. :-)
Zoffix jkramer: and handling of ² as a term is implemented as simply unicode properties: github.com/rakudo/rakudo/blob/mast....nqp#L3607 github.com/rakudo/rakudo/blob/mast...7906-L7918
timotimo indeed. we can just make sure the user understands why it's wrong 15:34
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jnthn I would like us to some day have a way that you can point Comma at Rakudo sources and then you will be able to Go To Declaration into there and debug into it and so forth :) 15:34
timotimo agreed 15:35
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Zoffix The bug reporting in comma don't work for me 15:37
The bug being if you use `unit class Foo` it indents all the stuff as if I wrote `class Foo {` 15:38
jnthn Zoffix: How did you try to do it?
ah, then probably we're not thinking of the same thing, 'cus that wouldn't cause an exception, and the reporter I'm thinking of is for those cases
Zoffix jnthn: I went to "Help-> Submit feedback" and it crashed and said "Submit a bug report". So I typed stuff up, and clicked send and it greyed out all the buttons and just sat there doing apparently nothing. I waited a couple minutes and closed it and clicking "Help Submit feedback" did nothing afterwards 15:39
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Zoffix Ok, now looks like it worked (the sending after crash) 15:39
jnthn Hm, weird. Was gonna say, I already had some reports in the DB from before 15:40
ah
atroxaper timotimo: as I understand, moar opens 9999 port and wait "somebody" to connect to it. Right? 15:41
jnthn Zoffix: Aha, found what happened in the logs.
timotimo that's right. somebody == comma's debugger feature
Zoffix Cool
jnthn Zoffix: Backend failure
timotimo i'm glad most of our early users are on #perl6, too
Zoffix :)
jnthn Me too :)
btw, the site that'd used to sell and offer Comma downloads is built using Cro :) 15:42
ZeonPeon Is there a way of specifying the type of list items for a sub argument?
Zoffix Cool
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Zoffix ZeonPeon: yeah, use the where clause 15:42
m: -> @ where .all ~~ Int { say "all are Ints" }(<1 2 3>) 15:43
camelia all are Ints
ZeonPeon Like "List where Str :$item"?
Zoffix m: -> @ where .all ~~ Int { say "all are Ints" }(<1 2e0 3>)
camelia Constraint type check failed in binding to parameter '<anon>'; expected anonymous constraint to be met but got List ($(IntStr.new(1, "1"),...)
in block <unit> at <tmp> line 1
ZeonPeon Oh, so a subset type thingy
Zoffix Basically, yeah
ZeonPeon Thank you
Zoffix eco: WhereList 15:44
buggable Zoffix, WhereList 'Simpler `where` constraints for items of lists': modules.perl6.org/dist/WhereList:gi...fix%20Znet
Zoffix There's also that module if you have a bunch of complex constraints on lists
ZeonPeon Neat, mind if I ask another question? 15:45
Zoffix No, ask away.
ZeonPeon Is there anyway of importing using a namespace?
Like pythons "import <whatever> as what"?
Zoffix There's some binding-to-constant syntax 15:46
Zoffix tries locally 15:47
ZeonPeon Thanks
Zoffix constant IRC = (require IRC::Client); say IRC.new
ZeonPeon Ohh 15:48
Zoffix So the class is named IRC::Client, but that lets you instantiate it via `IRC` name
ZeonPeon That's handy
I'm guessing you can use that to dynamically load modules? 15:49
Zoffix yeah 15:51
$ perl6 -e 'print "Enter module name to load: "; my $name := get; my \Mod = (require ::($name)); say Mod.new'
Enter module name to load: IRC::Client
IRC::Client.new(filters =>
Tried sticking `get` directly inside ::() and it didn't wanna load it. Prolly a bug 15:52
ZeonPeon odd
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ZeonPeon Can you import by path? 15:52
Say I want to have a specific module for scraping a site, would I have to have them all in the same lib directory or can I have them in their own specific directories throughout the filesystem? 15:54
Zoffix dunno 15:56
ZeonPeon So I'm reading the modules wiki page and I'm guessing you could store the Module name & file as "Module::File" and dynamically import based on that 15:57
Thank you again for the help 15:58
timotimo i'll be AFK for a little bit. atroxaper if you want to try if debugging works in general, that'd be cool. you can try installing zef install --/test App::MoarVM::Debug and then "moar-remote 9999" with 9999 being the debug port used
atroxaper timotimo: will try 15:59
timotimo thank you. see you soon!
Zoffix bdfoy would love comma... It seems to indent with his style 16:00
atroxaper timotimo: "Connecting to MoarVM remote on localhost port 9999 success!" 16:03
Zoffix Or maybe it's a bug... don't see any indent settings
No #commaide? 16:04
jnthn Zoffix: No, though could make a ##commaide for now I guess 16:06
jnthn joined it 16:08
Zoffix I already kinda found the answer to my question, since indents behave fine if they're in scope. Gonna email a bug report to [email@hidden.address] (since "Submit feedback" crashes)
jnthn Zoffix: Yeah, though I already fixed the backend issue that you ran into when typing a bug into the crash report there 16:09
It's certainly not *meant* to indent bdf style ;)
Zoffix jnthn: there are two bugs tho: clicking "Submit feedback" causes a crash and sending that crash was freezing. 16:10
jnthn: or is that how submit feedback works? It just generates an exception you can submit? 16:11
jnthn Zoffix: Yes, sending the crash freezing was the thing I fixed. It was a failure in the thing that received the report.
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jnthn Zoffix: Yes, just creating an exception you could submit with details is the "hack" solution. 16:12
Zoffix Cool
jnthn I would say "not the long term one", but I doubt it'll survive to the next release even :)
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squashable6 🍕 sylints++ wrote a comment on “Resolve issue #297”: github.com/perl6/whateverable/pull...-393930878 16:17
🍕🍕🍕 First contribution by sylints++! ♥
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squashable6 🍕 zoffixznet++ closed issue “Greppable says “1 lines, 1 modules””: github.com/perl6/whateverable/issues/297 16:22
🍕🍕🍕 First contribution by zoffixznet++! ♥
Geth whateverable: zoffixznet self-assigned Support \U github.com/perl6/whateverable/issues/234
f579dbdbe6 | (Zoffix Znet)++ | .gitignore
 16:24
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jnthn goes for some rest :) 16:50
moritz just learned about :smile in vim 16:51
El_Che moritz: it was discovered by programmers typing random combinations in order to exit vim
Zoffix jnthn: looks like that backend problem is back again... Installed comma on Linux and it froze again when I tried to submit the issue 16:58
I wish it'd let you copy-paste what you typed :P
(I mean, after you clicked send)
Still works fine on Windows.. OK then 17:00
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El_Che news.perlfoundation.org/2018/06/cal...y-2-3.html 17:29
Zoffix El_Che: well you were right.... It exited with "java.lang.OutOfMemoryError: Java heap space" while I was having lunch :) 17:33
Though the Windows copy is still chuging along with ~300MB in use 17:34
timotimo jmerelo: "written in #perl6" is a *very* bold thing to say about CommaIDE
El_Che :)
Zoffix heh
timotimo m: say 84186 / (499 + 7210) 17:35
camelia 10.920483
timotimo there's about 11x more java in there than perl6
El_Che Zoffix: increase the java heapsize (maybe the windows and linux configs are not the same), eg with java -Xmx2g
timotimo: I thought you meant this channel 17:36
#perl6
Zoffix Yeah, it told me to bump the thingie
timotimo though actually 17:37
m: say (84186 - 60000) / (499 + 7210)
camelia 3.137372
timotimo if you subtract the parser that was generated from perl6 code, it's only 3x as much java 17:38
Zoffix squashable6: help
squashable6 Zoffix, Available commands: status, log, quiet, loud # See wiki for more examples: github.com/perl6/whateverable/wiki/Squashable
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Zoffix doesn't wanna start now... Seems to hang when I try to close tip of the day 17:39
El_Che Zoffix: I don't think I have ever seen intellij crash or hang 17:41
Zoffix I can't figure out how to make whateverable run its tests. It says bot couldn't connect.... Where is it connecting to? 17:46
Failed test 'bot joined the channel'
Geth whateverable/implement-U: 8e73aec11f | (Zoffix Znet)++ | 2 files
Implement \U00000 syntax handling for Unicodable

Fixes github.com/perl6/whateverable/issues/234		 17:49
Zoffix right screw it
squashable6 🍕 zoffixznet++ opened pull request “Implement \U00000 syntax handling for Unicodable”: github.com/perl6/whateverable/pull/324 17:50
Geth whateverable: zoffixznet++ created pull request #324:
Implement \U00000 syntax handling for Unicodable
17:50 Zoffix left 17:55 araraloren left
Geth doc: e72fc4c5b9 | (Will "Coke" Coleda)++ | 3 files
whitespace
 18:08
doc: d21fb368b3 | (Will "Coke" Coleda)++ | doc/Language/numerics.pod6
Fix POD errors
synopsebot Link: doc.perl6.org/language/numerics
doc: 52e8f714ee | (Will "Coke" Coleda)++ | doc/Language/numerics.pod6
Pass compilation tests
[Coke] first time I've won. 18:10
(re: rigged)
18:18 lizmat left
[Coke] gets a cert issue launching comma, presumably due to being on my work machine. 18:19
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[Coke] L&F is... java? 18:21
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jmerelo [Coke]: What is L&F? 18:23
[Coke] look and feel
jmerelo You're talking about CommaIDE?
timotimo well, CommaIDE is based on IntelliJ's IDEs, so ... :) 18:24
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[Coke] zoffix, jnthn; I just tried "submit feedback" on the mac, nothing happened. 18:25
timotimo m: say ("foo" ~~ /f/).gist.comb[0].&uniname 18:29
camelia HALFWIDTH LEFT CORNER BRACKET
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Zoffix [Coke]: there's an icon at the bottom right corner with exclamation mark. Click it. Does it pop up the form with the trace? 18:30
[Coke]: that's where you'd type out your feedback. Copy-paste what you type tho before you send it, in case it freezes up the first time :)
colomon oh geez. guess I had two exceptions I didn’t even notice
Zoffix On Windows, there's an additional info message pops up in the bottom right corner, but I don't get it on Linux, only the exclamation mark flashes 18:31
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colomon Comma things I’ve noticed so far: 18:36
18:36 ZeonPeon left
colomon 1) Seems like it’s selecting file type based on extension? With .pm a p5 file and no extension just plain text, maybe? 18:37
2) On Mac, the tool tip’s “control-B” command is actually “command-B”
3) I’ve not been able to figure out how to run my script (now that I have one recognized as p6) from within the IDE. Hitting run doesn’t do anything as far as I can tell. 18:38
Ulti jnthn: congrats on the release \o/ 18:39
timotimo colomon: aye, you'll need to create a "run configuration"
on the left of the run/debug/stop buttons there's a drop-down that'll let you do that
colomon “add configuration” ?
timotimo yup 18:40
jnthn colomon: commaide.com/docs/running :)
colomon Ah. I thought I’d done that, but apparently I actually modified the default templates instead of creating one that could be used 18:41
jnthn And yes, it goes by extension to decide what is Perl 6
colomon that’s got that working
jnthn (.p6, .pl6, .pm6)
You can associate a particular file with a file type also
timotimo ah, yes, that's a feature that also surprised me multiple times, colomon
BBL 18:42
Ulti "Windows Defender SmartScreen prevented an unrecognised app from starting. Running this app might put your PC at risk." why are you trying to hack me!!!! zomg
colomon jnthn: I think I see my fundamental problem here: from the “Comma Downloads” page, it has “For installation instructions, see the documentation”, and when you click on documentation, it takes you to the installation instructions. 18:43
That (plus the tool tips) successfully distracted me from seeing that there is full documentation under the documentation tab on the website. 18:44
Ulti wow that splash screen :D
jnthn Ah, and then it's not clear that there's actually more documentation :)
Yeah, should probably do something at the top of the page to indicate you're within the documentation :) 18:45
I've thought that about the Cro docs for a while too
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Ulti ok I've unearthed some nasty bugs 18:52
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AlexDaniel Zoffix: comment edit history is a thing that was requested like hundreds of times :) github.com/dear-github/dear-github/issues/129 19:23
I kind of like how it's done on SO because it lists both nicknames
the original author and the last editor, side by side
[Coke] jnthn++ 19:24
AlexDaniel Zoffix: re whateverable tests, did you clone the repo with recursive thingie to pull the submodules also? 19:27
atroxaper timotimo: yes, debugging works :)
AlexDaniel Zoffix: it runs miniircd to start a small irc server and then lets the bot connect to it
timotimo atroxaper: do you know what changed? 19:28
AlexDaniel Zoffix: fwiw this is sort of mentioned on github.com/perl6/whateverable/wiki/Installation
timotimo or do you mean just with App::MoarVM::Debug?
AlexDaniel well, just a little bit mentioned :)
atroxaper timotimo: nonono. I mean debugging works in general. Not in IDE.
[Coke] Zoffix: ah, nifty. I have 8 exceptions from opening a file and clicking around a bit. Will have to file them.
also: ACHOOOOOOO
atroxaper timotimo: yes. Just with App::MoarVM::Debug 19:31
AlexDaniel actually, it just starts a Proc::Async blindly, that's why there's no error message or anything…
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[Coke] zoffix, jnthn; found the "report to button" - that generates its own stack trace about certs. 19:31
will followup with emails at some point. Danke. 19:32
timotimo damn it :(
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Geth whateverable: 59b1e4c65f | (Aleks-Daniel Jakimenko-Aleksejev)++ | t/lib/Testable.pm6
Helpful message if miniircd can't start

This is an attempt to write a helpful message for a common issue when miniircd is not cloned.		 19:42
AlexDaniel Zoffix: just did this ↑ so that it is more clear if anybody else stumbles upon it :) 19:43
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AlexDaniel m: 0x10FFFF.uniname.say 19:48
camelia <noncharacter-10FFFF>
AlexDaniel c: 2018.04,2018.05,HEAD 0x10FFFF.uniname.say
committable6 AlexDaniel, ¦2018.04,2018.05,HEAD(c80ea2f): «<noncharacter-10FFFF>␤»
AlexDaniel 6c: 0x10FFFF.uniname.say
committable6 AlexDaniel, gist.github.com/b6d312cb369774379a...f5a1d7d080
squashable6 🍕 AlexDaniel++ wrote a comment on a review for “Implement \U00000 syntax handling for Unicodable”: github.com/perl6/whateverable/pull...r192498774 19:51
🍕 AlexDaniel++ submitted a review on pull request “Implement \U00000 syntax handling for Unicodable”: github.com/perl6/whateverable/pull...-125296087
🍕 AlexDaniel++ wrote a comment on a review for “Implement \U00000 syntax handling for Unicodable”: github.com/perl6/whateverable/pull...r192498484
🍕 AlexDaniel++ edited a review on pull request “Implement \U00000 syntax handling for Unicodable”: github.com/perl6/whateverable/pull...-125296087
🍕 AlexDaniel++ wrote a comment on “Implement \U00000 syntax handling for Unicodable”: github.com/perl6/whateverable/pull...-393991534 19:52
🍕 AlexDaniel++ closed issue “Support \U”: github.com/perl6/whateverable/issues/234 19:57
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Geth doc/coke/build: 18 commits pushed by (Will "Coke" Coleda)++
review: github.com/perl6/doc/compare/2f942...830c63c451		 20:24
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squashable6 🍕 zoffixznet++ closed pull request “Implement \U00000 syntax handling for Unicodable”: github.com/perl6/whateverable/pull/324 21:03
🍕 zoffixznet++ reopened issue “Support \U”: github.com/perl6/whateverable/issues/234
21:04 Zoffix left
Geth whateverable/implement-U: 8e73aec11f | (Zoffix Znet)++ | 2 files
Implement \U00000 syntax handling for Unicodable

Fixes github.com/perl6/whateverable/issues/234		 21:10
21:21 Kaiepi joined
Geth whateverable/implement-U: 8f405b1b9f | (Aleks-Daniel Jakimenko-Aleksejev)++ | bin/Unicodable.p6
Expect \U without a +

Most likely an oops.		 21:25
whateverable/implement-U: c7ce7fad27 | (Aleks-Daniel Jakimenko-Aleksejev)++ | t/unicodable.t
Make tests pass

By adapting the output for rakudo 2017.10 and up.
whateverable/implement-U: 11bbd08f7f | (Aleks-Daniel Jakimenko-Aleksejev)++ | t/unicodable.t
Move tests a bit
squashable6 🍕 AlexDaniel++ reopened pull request “Implement \U00000 syntax handling for Unicodable”: github.com/perl6/whateverable/pull/324
🍕 AlexDaniel++ synchronize pull request “Implement \U00000 syntax handling for Unicodable”: github.com/perl6/whateverable/pull/324
🍕 AlexDaniel++ closed issue “Support \U”: github.com/perl6/whateverable/issues/234 21:27
Geth whateverable/master: 5 commits pushed by (Zoffix Znet)++, (Aleks-Daniel Jakimenko-Aleksejev)++
squashable6 🍕 AlexDaniel++ merged pull request “Implement \U00000 syntax handling for Unicodable”: github.com/perl6/whateverable/pull/324
🍕 AlexDaniel++ wrote a comment on “Implement \U00000 syntax handling for Unicodable”: github.com/perl6/whateverable/pull...-394013599
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Geth ecosystem: 0e86f3bd58 | (Pawel Pabian)++ (committed using GitHub Web editor) | META.list
Add GeoIP2 to the ecosystem.

  github.com/bbkr/GeoIP2 - MaxMind GeoIP v2 databases reader.		 21:48
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El_Che I pretty much prefer github than RT like the next guy/gal, but this: www.businessinsider.com/2-billion-s...18-5/?IR=T 22:14
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timotimo OK, we'll start work on SixHub right away 22:16
El_Che powered by Cro
the upside is that it will support pod6 just fine
:)
timotimo Crothub
lizmat I think it need to be shorter: start with Perl6Hub, then P6Hub, then just Pub :-) 22:18
timotimo lizmat: welcome to the Pub*!
(* Portmanteau Club)
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squashable6 🍕 AlexDaniel++ synchronize pull request “Resolve issue #297”: github.com/perl6/whateverable/pull/318 22:24
Geth whateverable/master: 5 commits pushed by herby++, (Aleks-Daniel Jakimenko-Aleksejev)++ 22:25
squashable6 🍕 AlexDaniel++ merged pull request “Resolve issue #297”: github.com/perl6/whateverable/pull/318
squashable6 🍕 AlexDaniel++ wrote a comment on “Resolve issue #297”: github.com/perl6/whateverable/pull...-394025423
AlexDaniel squashable6: status 22:26
squashable6 AlexDaniel, 🍕🍕 SQUASHathon is in progress! The end of the event in 1 day and ≈13 hours. See github.com/rakudo/rakudo/wiki/Mont...Squash-Day
AlexDaniel, Log and stats: gist.github.com/9f591c4656118380a7...2bc60253dd
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Geth doc/rafaelschipiura-patch-1: 2ae5b1ef79 | (Rafael Schipiura)++ (committed using GitHub Web editor) | doc/Language/numerics.pod6
Update numerics.pod6
 23:57
doc: rafaelschipiura++ created pull request #2088:
Update numerics.pod6		 23:58

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