»ö« Welcome to Perl 6! | perl6.org/ | evalbot usage: 'p6: say 3;' or /msg camelia p6: ... | irclog: irc.perl6.org or colabti.org/irclogger/irclogger_log/perl6 | UTF-8 is our friend! 🦋
Set by Zoffix on 25 July 2018.
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vrurg timotimo: if you're here by occasion: my earlier question on StackOverflow is seemingly macOS/darwin dependant. Closure is not lost on my vboxed Linux Mint. 00:03
timotimo o_O 00:04
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jeek ugh 00:04
Tried Julia
Arrays starting at 1 ftl 00:05
timotimo but is it blazing fast?
jeek No idea, I got two Euler problems in before my gag reflex kicked in over the array thing, haven't gone back yet.
timotimo but is that any better than saying "i won't use perl because sigils are terrible"? :) 00:07
then again, i have an irrational desire not to use lua for the same reason 00:08
jeek I was also irked by UNICODE operators. ⊻ is the bitwise xor operator. :D 00:11
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Kaiepi can someone take a look at this and see if there's a better way for me to be handling blobs and bitwise stuff? hastebin.com/siyozihave.pl 01:29
i feel like i'm converting between arrays and bufs and blobs too much
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buggable New CPAN upload: AttrX-Mooish-v0.4.8.tar.gz by VRURG modules.perl6.org/dist/AttrX::Mooish:cpan:VRURG 01:33
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Herby_ \o 02:35
jeek o/ 02:39
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buggable New CPAN upload: AttrX-Mooish-v0.4.9.tar.gz by VRURG modules.perl6.org/dist/AttrX::Mooish:cpan:VRURG 05:13
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ChoHag How can I install modules with filenames instead of numbers? 08:55
moritz ChoHag: what do you actually want to achieve?
ChoHag site (and vendor) directories who's contents filenames are not a hash. 08:56
moritz well, that's how Perl 6 modules are installed. Why does that bother you? 08:58
ChoHag Because I have a folder containing 100s of files with no indication what they are. 08:59
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ChoHag Are you saying that it's essential and not just some sort of optimisation? 09:00
moritz yes; it has to do with the fact that not all Perl 6 module names can be accurately reflected in file names
ChoHag So because 100% readable wasn't possible they went with 0% readable? 09:01
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moritz "they" aka "us" went with something that works 09:01
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moritz and it's quite an engineering feat that the module system works, and works fairly fast, with all the constraints placed on it 09:02
ChoHag It doesn't work for browing the filesystem.
+s
moritz why do you feel you need to browse the filesystem?
ChoHag Sorry is that a real question? 09:04
That's what the filesystem is _for_.
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sena_kun I think the question is more of "why do you feel you need to browse modules directly instead of managing it with package manager tools". 09:18
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pmurias ChoHag: re using sha1 for file names it's both and optimaliation and it avoids problems with unicode names getting mangled by the filesystem 09:27
moritz ChoHag: the file system serves many purposes, but mostly to store files 09:33
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moritz ChoHag: and I see no problem with declaring one directory as under the control of one program, and saying that it manages it as it sees fit 09:34
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timotimo my /var/lib/pg/data/global has files 12832, 12834, 12835, 12966, ...; why can't i browse that? 10:46
(i think this maps pretty well to the situation with the compunit repo) 10:47
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ChoHag Postgres' data store isn't scripts I'm expecting to read, execute or find specific things in. 10:56
timotimo if you know what you're looking for, you can "zef locate" 11:02
but the compunit repo also contains all the precompiledbinaries
also, editing the sources in a CUR is a Big No No
and the filenames in the source archive don't necessarily correspond to their "actual names", which is what's in the "provides" section of the META6.info 11:03
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Zoffix ChoHag: the modules are installed as precompiled binary blobs. You aren't meant to "read, execute or find specific things in" the installed blobs. They don't even have to be files and there's a joke that you could have repo that reads data from /dev/random as a source of modules. I think source of the modules is in fact kept somewhere, but that's merely to provide more useful errors that include line numbers 11:37
to modules. Modifying those source files won't change the installed module.
ChoHag: you can use `zef look Some::Module` command to fetch the module's source and play with it and I think `zef locate Some::Module` will give the sha dir location that has the source in it as well, but as mentioned, modifying it won't change the installed module 11:38
(to clarify, by "play with it" I meant you'd include that source dir with `use lib` or `-I.`; making changes to it won't change the installed module) 11:41
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timotimo i'm so glad youtube live streams let you rewind 12:04
youtu.be/b33MDXyl3Mw?t=4h18m55s - jnthn's concurrency/parallelism talk starts here 12:05
AlexDaniel timotimo: IIRC only some, when explicitly allowed 12:06
timotimo OK
i hope we have a brilliant audio editor who can tone down the swish noises in the recording after the fact 12:07
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Ulti timotimo: jnthn presented the same/similar talk a month or so ago with much better audio www.youtube.com/watch?v=l2fSbOPeSQs 12:21
timotimo i know, i was present :) :) 12:22
Ulti ah ok
timotimo i'm watching anyway to see if jnthn changed anything much since the previous time
MasterDuke did he already give the Cro talk? 12:23
timotimo that was yesterday
Ulti MasterDuke: www.youtube.com/watch?v=CH6Hmc9liRs 12:24
again might be different since then
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timotimo it is, this one is the "one year later" talk 12:24
Ulti one year later since one month ago? :D
timotimo well, cro reached the 1 year mark between then and now
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MasterDuke guess i should watch them both, thanks 12:27
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timotimo it's a good prsntthn 13:08
Geth rakudo.org: zoffixznet self-assigned rakudo.org/files/ has all star options in light blue on android phone github.com/perl6/rakudo.org/issues/10
e60ec51ef9 | (Zoffix Znet)++ | assets/js/main.js

Fallback to "generic" `wanted` instead of highlighting all available items as wanted.
Fixes github.com/perl6/rakudo.org/issues/10		 13:24
tbrowder__ hi, #perl6
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tbrowder__ i’m working in rakudo nqp land and have a compiler hang on a “make” command. no noted errors, just still hanging after almost an hour. i can ping the make host from another host but, so far, i haven’t been able to get access to find out what is happening. eventually i will try the process on a host with much more memory (the hanging host only has 4 Gb). note i am buildng only for moar. 13:28
the hang is occurring in the mast stage. 13:29
i will give more details when i have them. 13:30
any good hints for debugging? 13:31
the hang came after i added a debug function in Pod.nqp to unbox an object i want to inspect. 13:32
diakopter tbrowder__: usually that means there's some leftover process locking a file; look at your process list and kill anything leftover from a prior run
MasterDuke strace the process?
tbrowder__ m
daikopter: thnx
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tbrowder__ MaserDuke: i’ve never used that. if the proc kill doesn’t work i’ll look into it. thnx 13:34
rakudo.org: a12b057df2 | (Zoffix Znet)++ | assets/js/main.js
Consistify coding style
 13:35
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diakopter heh 13:36
tbrowder__ ah, yes, many eons ago... 13:37
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Geth rakudo.org: 3d8a0f6855 | (Zoffix Znet)++ | 2 files
[REAPP] Don't wait for commit trigger to restart the app

We don't get that many non-app commits that it's a problem to hot-restart the app on ANY commit and the commit trigger is often forgotten, leading to extra commits being made just to update the app.
Since update script and start-on-boot script are now identicall, I'm tossing the start-on-boot script and will update cron to use the other script on boot as well		 13:41
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Geth rakudo.org: f533019a8b | (Zoffix Znet)++ | update-rakudo.org.sh
Don't update now-deleted script
 13:43
rakudo.org: 50f41228f4 | (Zoffix Znet)++ | README.md
Update dev docs

To reflect changes[^1] to update scripts.
  [1] github.com/perl6/rakudo.org/commit/3d8a0f6855		 13:46
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Geth infrastructure-doc: 80a21dad70 | (Zoffix Znet)++ (committed using GitHub Web editor) | hosts/www.p6c.org.pod
Update maintenance docs for rakudo.org

Reflecting changes to start scripts:
  github.com/perl6/rakudo.org/commit/3d8a0f6855		 13:47
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Geth doc: uzluisf++ created pull request #2300:
Remove period from headings and subheadings and other minor fixes		 14:13
tbrowder__ er, rakudo was not the problem: firefox hogged most everything on a page that went wonky. sorry to waste bandwidth (but good to remember strace!) 14:16
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lichtkind jnthn, i would like talk to you before i file a feature request 15:19
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AlexDaniel releasable6: status 15:43
releasable6 AlexDaniel, Next release in ≈7 days and ≈3 hours. 1 blocker. 0 out of 54 commits logged
AlexDaniel, Details: gist.github.com/65aa18b1b79605930f...f1fe411bed
AlexDaniel squashable6: status
squashable6 AlexDaniel, Next SQUASHathon in 26 days and ≈18 hours (2018-10-06 UTC-12⌁UTC+14). See github.com/rakudo/rakudo/wiki/Mont...Squash-Day
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Geth doc: cada485ad1 | (JJ Merelo)++ | doc/Language/traps.pod6
Some reflow in preparation for #1603
 17:09
doc: 1fb3758607 | (JJ Merelo)++ | doc/Language/traps.pod6
Adds a trap on combining WhateverCode and SmartMatch

At the same time inaugurates a section for Smartmatch. Closes #1603 by using the same examples and explanations used there.
synopsebot Link: doc.perl6.org/language/traps
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kensanata On rakudo.org/files/star/source the Debian/Ubuntu section has an apt-get line which doesn't cover libssl-dev which I needed. The build will proceed but in the end, I was unable to zef install --/test cro, for example. 18:56
(This is me using PureOS, which is a Debian derivative.)
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MasterDuke kensanata: could you file an issue here github.com/perl6/rakudo.org ? 18:59
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Geth rakudo.org: kensanata++ created pull request #19:
Debian derivatives require libssl-dev		 19:04
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Geth rakudo.org: 5a1256211d | (Alex Schroeder)++ (committed using GitHub Web editor) | templates/_from-source-prereqs.html.ep
Debian derivatives require libssl-dev
 19:21
rakudo.org: 0616554455 | (Zoffix Znet)++ (committed using GitHub Web editor) | templates/_from-source-prereqs.html.ep
Merge pull request #19 from kensanata/patch-1

Debian derivatives require libssl-dev
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kensanata Cool 19:22
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kensanata Now that I'm trying to understand the code generated by cro stub, how do I find and read the documentation on my system for a libary like Cro::HTTP::Router, for example? I'm so very used to man, I guess. 19:24
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MasterDuke kensanata: perl6doc Cro::HTTP::Router should just work if you installed star 19:32
kensanata MasterDuke: It doesn't. Do you know where I should be seeing the perl6doc program? It's not in ~/rakudo/install/bin where perl6 and moar and some other binaries are. 19:35
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MasterDuke hm, maybe it's p6doc? 19:38
geekosaur it's called p6doc, and it's aseparate install
MasterDuke huh, thought it was bundled with rakudo star 19:39
geekosaur hm, dunno about star, sorry 19:40
kensanata Hm. I used zef search p6doc and found 1 result. Tried zef install p6doc and it says All candidates are currently installed. So I guess it is *somewhere* on my system. :) 19:41
MasterDuke what does `zef locate p6doc` say? 19:43
kensanata OK, there's /home/alex/rakudo/install/share/perl6/site/bin/p6doc which isn't on my path.
MasterDuke: "===> From Distribution: p6doc:ver<1.002001>:auth<>:api<>"
OK, works now. Thanks for the push in the right direction! 19:44
Geth doc: 0d3bec5756 | Coke++ | doc/Language/js-nutshell.pod6
fix example bug
synopsebot Link: doc.perl6.org/language/js-nutshell
Kaiepi yeah, there are a few different paths perl 6 binaries can go fsr
MasterDuke i feel an issue needs to be filed about this somewhere, not sure what repo though
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[Coke] when you installed it originally, did zef perhaps warn you about your path? 19:50
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AlexDaniel .tell kensanata hello :) 21:09
yoleaux AlexDaniel: I'll pass your message to kensanata.
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AlexDaniel m: my $s = set<a b c d e>; for $s.keys { .say } 21:57
camelia 5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling <tmp>
Use of non-subscript brackets after "set" where postfix is expected; please use whitespace before any arguments
at <tmp>:1
------> 3my $s = set7⏏5<a b c d e>; for $s.keys { .say }
expect…
AlexDaniel m: my $s = set(<a b c d e>); for $s.keys { .say }
camelia a
d
e
b
c
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AlexDaniel hmm 23:23
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AlexDaniel so GlotIO module depends on URI::Escape 23:23
but there's no URI::Escape
how did we lose it?
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Juerd What do you mean, "there's no URI::Escape"? 23:35
timotimo it's no longer in the ecosystem?
Juerd github.com/perl6-community-modules/uri 23:36
AlexDaniel aaaah 23:38
OK I see, nevermind
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Zoffix .ask samcv I think I asked you this before but totally forgot what the answer was. Is it guaranteed that an unmodified hash would maintain order when iterated over? There's a 6.d spec that declares a bunch of methods (.pairs, .keys, etc.) called on a hash must produce the values in the same order: github.com/perl6/roast/blob/fc96f8....t#L18-L33 Would you 23:48
yoleaux Zoffix: I'll pass your message to samcv.
Zoffix check if that new spec make sense?
.tell samcv check if that new spec make sense?
yoleaux Zoffix: I'll pass your message to samcv.
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