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Set by Zoffix on 25 July 2018.
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discord6 <Bearhug> Is there a reason why postfix:<,=> doesn't seem to work for Arrays? Seems like my @a = <a b c>; @a ,= 'd'; would make sense? 00:18
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MasterDuke Bearhug: things don't automatically flatten in perl6 as much as they did in perl 5 00:25
p5: my @a = ("a", "b", "c"); @a = (@a, "d"); say for @a 00:26
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MasterDuke perlbot: plugins
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MasterDuke oh well, i thought one of the bots could do perl5 also. anyway, the perl5 example above does result in @a having "d" appended. but perl6 creates a new array with @a in the first slot and "d" in the second, because it doesn't flatten @a 00:29
discord6 <Bearhug> Yeah, probably more intuitive that way for anyone but Perl 5 programmers. Is there a better way to non-destructively append an item to the front/back of a List/Array than to do something like |@a, 'd'? 00:31
MasterDuke what do you mean by non-destructively? you want something other than .push or .append? 00:33
you could use flat instead of | 00:35
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discord6 <Bearhug> Non-destructively as in I want to return a new list rather than modify @a 01:05
MasterDuke m: my @a = <a b c>; my @b = @a.clone.push("d"); dd @a; dd @b # only thing i could think of other than using | or flat 01:15
evalable6 Array @a = ["a", "b", "c"]
Array @b = ["a", "b", "c", "d"]
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SmokeMachine m: my @a = 1,2,3; my @b = |@a, 4; say @b 01:25
evalable6 [1 2 3 4]
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discord6 <Bearhug> Yeah that seems to be the most elegant 01:27
MasterDuke if you can use clone, it seems to be much faster 01:31
benchable6: compare HEAD my @a = <a b c>; my @b; for ^100_000 { @b = @a.clone.push("d"); }; dd @b ||| my @a = <a b c>; my @b; for ^100_000 { @b = |@a, "d"; }; dd @b 01:33
benchable6 MasterDuke, starting to benchmark the 1 given commit
MasterDuke, gist.github.com/ff2e793f3ae398da1e...fd109b2dac
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hdee hello 02:58
AlexDaniel hi! 03:04
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Seance[m] I have a question, I'm getting 'Use of Nil in string context' when using .uc to test against .prematch 04:13
which has a .WHAT type of (str)
Here is my conditional:
if ($/.prematch ~~ /<upper>/) and ($/.prematch !~~ /<lower>/) and ($/.prematch == $/.prematch.uc)
I was previously using 'eq'
because comparing strings, so the == was me just trying random stuff to get this to quit throwing errors
hastebin.com/uceyojojor.rb 04:14
Seance[m] sent a long message: < matrix.org/_matrix/media/v1/downlo...CzQtAapPbB > 04:15
I've traditionally done 3 via comparison of $str and $str.uc
I must be missing something pretty basic 04:16
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hobbs you're resetting $/ every time you do a match, so I don't think your code does what you mean for it to do 04:25
grab $/.prematch into a variable first, and then do some tests against that variable 04:26
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Seance[m] Does it reset between conditional checks? 04:39
hobbs sure, if you're doing regex matches as part of them
squashable6 🍕 titsuki++ wrote a comment on “Most wanted, 2019 edition”: github.com/perl6/perl6-most-wanted...-480558790 04:41
🍕🍕🍕 First contribution by titsuki++! ♥
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Geth doc: ccb25adfd9 | (JJ Merelo)++ | 2 files
Revises Buf for #2709, minor changes

Also adds missing methods for Blob. Refs #2694.		 06:39
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[Sno] lizmat_: /wave 11:35
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jmerelo squashable6: status 11:56
squashable6 jmerelo, 🍕🍕 SQUASHathon is in progress! The end of the event in ≈2 hours. See github.com/rakudo/rakudo/wiki/Mont...Squash-Day
jmerelo, Log and stats: gist.github.com/1b135a89bec1938423...305c31bf61
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Geth evalbot: stigtsp++ created pull request #11:
run rakudo-moar in a firejail as restricted as possible 		13:03
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ben_m Is there a way to reload a module in the perl6 interpreter without restarting it? 14:07
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ugexe No. How would that work in a multi thread environment? 14:20
owild the compiler just say screw it and give two separate racing threads different versions (that claim they are the same) ?
Should reloading in one thread be able to blow up every other thread that already loaded the module? 14:21
ben_m Meant the interactive interpreter, just for a simple REPL workflow 14:22
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ugexe The compiler shouldnt change its behavior based on how simple the workflow is though 14:23
maybe someone else is using the repl for a multithreaded learning experience 14:24
ben_m Don't know how the compiler works, just used to from some other languages (mostly Lisp based that I remember) to be able to modify the code I'm working on, reload it in the REPL and test it right away without restarting
I was just wondering if that's possible in Perl6 as well 14:25
ugexe How does parallel module loading work in lisp? 14:27
like does it actually load them in parallel or is it serialized
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antoniogamiz \o/ 15:01
ben_m I don't really understand that question, when I recompile/evaluate a library in lisp it just replaces the symbol table in the VM, as far as I understand 15:03
So everytime a function gets called after that it uses the new one instead of the old one
araraloren You should consider multi thread environment , I don't know lisp very well. 15:12
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El_Che I hope new libraries don't break the ABI :) 15:13
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jmerelo squashable6: status 15:26
squashable6 jmerelo, Next SQUASHathon in 25 days and ≈20 hours (2019-05-04 UTC-14⌁UTC+12). See github.com/rakudo/rakudo/wiki/Mont...Squash-Day
jmerelo squashable6: log 2019-04-06
squashable6 jmerelo, Log and stats: gist.github.com/870337c722bd40ef6d...ad84cdb5db
jmerelo Results for latest squashathon... github.com/JJ/p6-app-squashathons/...r-2019.csv 15:30
... and since AlexDaniel and myself are not eligible... 15:31
... the winner is...
.tell bduggan you're the squashathon winner! Contact lizmat to get your Camelia!
yoleaux jmerelo: I'll pass your message to bduggan.
jmerelo .seen bduggan
yoleaux I haven't seen bduggan around.
jmerelo Apparently he's not using the same nick in IRC. Anyway, Brian Duggan is the winner. Congrats! 15:32
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tobs I was looking forward to this squashathon but ended up being sick in bed all weekend 15:38
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pmurias rakudo.js passed 806 test files in Chrome :) 15:50
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araraloren how many the test file totally :) 15:54
atroxaper Hi, #perl6! 15:56
AlexDaniel hello o/
araraloren atroxaper o/
atroxaper I've just released a big module - production ready full customizable logger library. Please have a look. github.com/atroxaper/p6-LogP6 15:57
AlexDaniel: \o
Kaiepi sweet
atroxaper araraloren: \o 15:58
Kaiepi atroxaper++
AlexDaniel weekly: colabti.org/irclogger/irclogger_lo...04-07#l275
notable6 AlexDaniel, Noted!
timotimo atroxaper: cool, could you give a few words what makes it different from Lumberjack? 15:59
atroxaper AlexDaniel: Thanks!
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atroxaper timotimo: First of all, you can add loggin calls in your code but configure io::handele, log levels and so on without touching the code. Even in runtime through change configuration file. 16:03
ugexe timotimo: it uses 8 space indentation instead of 4
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atroxaper timotimo: This provide you possibility to use a logging even in libraries - end user can simply furn off it or redirect in separate file. 16:04
jaldhar Hello. Is there some special processing for - arguments in MAIN()? The reason I ask is because while doing the perl weekly challenge, I tried to write a sub like this:
multi sub MAIN('-f', $number)
atroxaper timotimo: more information in feature list github.com/atroxaper/p6-LogP6#features
jaldhar and it didn't match.
multi sub MAIN('f', $number) 16:05
did work however.
pmurias araraloren: 1310 (1191 not counting integration tests)
araraloren pmurias++, great job!
ugexe because -f is considered a named argument 16:06
pmurias araraloren: a lot of the ones use something that won't work in the browser like file io or threads
atroxaper pmurias++
ugexe or rather: its considered a named argument when its being passed in
araraloren pmurias oh, I see
pmurias araraloren: and some are broken on moar during precompilation too
jaldhar ugexe: do you know where this is documented. I didn't find it on perl6.org docs and I would like to read more. 16:07
araraloren do you mean `sub MAIN(:$f, $number)` ? 16:08
jaldhar araraloren: possibly :-) let me try it... 16:09
ugexe it would have to be $number, :$f
jaldhar oh yeah. No that won't work
ugexe but the input would still be the way you wanted
m: multi sub MAIN($number, :$f) { say 42 }; BEGIN @*ARGS = "-f", "1"
evalable6 42
ugexe m: multi sub MAIN($number, :$f) { say 42 }; BEGIN @*ARGS = "1", "-f" 16:10
evalable6 (exit code 2) Usage:
/tmp/cSn2yXyK_1 [-f=<Any>] <number>
ugexe m: multi sub MAIN($number, Bool :$f! where *.so) { say 42 }; BEGIN @*ARGS = "-f", "1"
evalable6 42
ugexe thats a more precise signature
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AlexDaniel I wonder if you can drop * there 16:11
ugexe if you want to accept -/f
oh you mean just the * 16:12
m: multi sub MAIN($number, Bool :$f! where .so) { say 42 }; BEGIN @*ARGS = "-f", "1"
evalable6 42
jaldhar what I am trying to do is option processing like getopt(3) with multiple subs for each option. 16:13
And actually it looks like this does work. Thanks!
"multiple subs for each option" is a bit vague. I meant multiple subs; one for each option. 16:14
timotimo atroxaper: cool 16:17
atroxaper: my performance-oriented brain sees "/^LIBNAME .*/" and wishes for special syntax for begins-with and/or ends-with 16:24
ben_m Are classes open in Perl6 (e.g. like in Ruby), or is there something like C#/Kotlin extension methods? Can't find anything by googling
atroxaper timotimo: And `contains-that` :) Dunno. Probably. 16:26
hobbs open, unless closed :)
araraloren ben_m what is extension method :) 16:28
timotimo atroxaper: and maybe even support for junctions
atroxaper timotimo: I appreciate that you have a look. Btw I have a pure level of english. I'm sure I have a lot of mistakes and miss-meaning in README. If somebody can review the README it would be great.
timotimo: I like junctions. But I need to imagine how we can describe junction in configuration file... 16:30
timotimo atroxaper: i kind of like that journald has structured log messages, that's kind of cool. any idea for that?
ben_m Extension methods let you add methods to existing classes without creating a derived class, or modifying the existing class
timotimo ben_m: you can call a sub on an object if you want
araraloren ben_m oh, yes you can in Perl 6
timotimo m: sub not-a-method($obj) { say "being called on $obj" }; 99.&not-a-method 16:31
evalable6 being called on 99
ben_m Ah right
atroxaper timotimo: can you link me to journald?
timotimo 0pointer.de/blog/projects/journal-submit.html - maybe this gives you an idea? 16:32
ben_m That's more explicit than extension methods, which might actually be cleaner, thanks.
timotimo that has to be in scope lexically, which may or may not be what you want
araraloren ben_m Also you can using Mixin feature :)
timotimo araraloren: not without changing the object in question 16:33
araraloren hmm
ugexe ben_m: docs.perl6.org/syntax/augment 16:34
er, that modifies the existing class though
atroxaper timotimo: as I understand journald is something like syslog. Learning... 16:35
ugexe m: class Foo { }; my $foo = Foo.new; $foo does role :: { method new-method { 42 } }; say $foo.new-method
evalable6 42
araraloren Hmm, is augment will affect all the things ? 16:36
timotimo yes, it will
hobbs Affect ALL THE THINGS!
timotimo except not subclasses
not at the moment
you'll need to manually .^compose all subclasses that you want to affect
araraloren oh, anyway it's dangerous 16:37
ugexe if you want dangerous you should use supercede
timotimo much like in ruby :P
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araraloren oh, ugexe don't know there is a thing like this :D 16:38
have to go to bed, have a good day #perl6
ben_m good night 16:39
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araraloren good night, and if anyone want more powerful getopt feature, you can consider my module Getopt::Advance :) haha 16:40
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atroxaper timotimo: As I found we can write to journald through NativeCall. Then I can create a special IO::Handle for that and use Writer. Maybe it will require the new type Writer. I will put journald support into Roadmap. Thank you. 16:51
ugexe ah, so no windows? 16:54
that will alienate 0.1% of your userbase
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atroxaper How I can interpolate string from not interpolated one? For example, my $tab = '>\t<'; After that I want to make $tab be '> <'. 17:33
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ugexe if its just for escape sequences I would suggest doing it yourself 17:37
otherwise how could any answer but EVAL handle the various ways interpolation could be handled?
m: my $tab = q|>\t<|; say $tab.subst(q|\t|, "\t") 17:39
evalable6 >␉<
patrickb Why is rakudobrew considered deprecated?
lizmat weekly: blogs.perl.org/users/laurent_r/2019...eek-2.html 17:40
notable6 lizmat, Noted!
discord6 <פ ח ו ף> hello perl6 newbie here
ugexe i dunno. i think its just intended to steer the general public away from using it, but its not deprecaed
patrickb I've done quite some work on it recently and I'd like to know what's wrong with it to earn it the deprecated note...
ugexe i use it every day so... 17:41
discord6 <פ ח ו ף> pastebin.com/raw/2TDVKYVb <<< im trying to figure out why this dosent work
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ben_m rakudobrew was the only thing that let me install rakudo on Arch, I ran into different problems without it 17:41
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patrickb But why shouldn't the public use rakudobrew? Does it somehow encourage bad practices? 17:42
discord6 <פ ח ו ף> its saying it was expecting a symbol
ugexe again im not sure, likely because i understand what its doing so i dont see issues.
sena_kun maybe because using official packages is better than running some script from the internet. The second reason is, I guess, is that rakudobrew gets you latest commits by default, which may be very bad. I wasn't present that time, but I've heard there was some case where user files were accidentally damaged on master, so rakudobrew would be an awful thing to use that day.
ugexe i think one issue was `rakudobrew rehash`
patrickb Ah. 17:43
sena_kun so it is not encouraged for "normal" users. but if you I Know What I Am Doing person.
ugexe the other was modules being installed to a central location
patrickb Then things should be better soon. I've implemented a no-shims-needed mode for rakudobrew. :-) 17:44
sena_kun then its ok, like, if you just _must_ use latest commit where a critical (for you) bug was fixed, then rakudobrew is ok. but it is not encouraged as a tool for new users to pick up and use.
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ugexe regular user should just be doing `rakudobrew build moar $RELEASE-VERSION` 17:44
patrickb I think defaulting to the latest release is a good idea. That's what most non-dev users would want.
sena_kun yes
such a default would be nice, but it is not how it is right now, I think 17:45
ugexe i almost only use `rakudobrew switch moar-$VERSION` and `rakudobrew switch moar-blead`
sena_kun uses rakudobrew too
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discord6 <פ ח ו ף> why is the regex ^[\S+] not matching [hello] 17:50
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ugexe m: say so "[hello]" ~~ /^[\S+]/ 17:51
evalable6 True
discord6 <פ ח ו ף> that is malformed regex it says 17:52
<פ ח ו ף> ^[\S+] works 17:53
<פ ח ו ף> do i not need to put \ to signify its the literal character [
dasdasdasd who knows perl6 is all screwed up
jmerelo ^ is no longer beginning of string 17:54
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jmerelo But right, you need to do that 17:54
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jmerelo m: say so "[hello]" ~~ /^\[\S+\]/ 17:55
evalable6 True
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jmerelo m: say so "[hello]" ~~ /^^\[\S+\]/ 17:55
evalable6 True
jmerelo m: say "[hello]" ~~ /^^\[\S+\]/
evalable6 ｢[hello]｣
ugexe m: say "[hello]" ~~ /^ "[" \S+ "]"/; # you can do this which is easier to read 17:56
evalable6 ｢[hello]｣
discord6 <פ ח ו ף> im trying to make an ini parser and its getting to be really difficult using grammar
ugexe perlgeek.de/blog-en/perl-6/2017-00...ammar.html 17:57
"Perl 6 By Example: Improved INI Parsing with Grammars"
discord6 <פ ח ו ף> that looks unreadable lol
ugexe you think /^[\S+]/ plus is readable? 17:58
discord6 <פ ח ו ף> more readable than '[' <-[ [ ] \n ]>+ ']' \n+
AlexDaniel weekly: perlweeklychallenge.org/blog/recap...lenge-001/ and github.com/manwar/perlweeklychallenge-club
notable6 AlexDaniel, Noted!
ugexe it is also more correct than /^[\S+]/ 17:59
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ugexe see docs.perl6.org/language/regexes-be...t_to_match 18:02
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atroxaper ugexe: thank you for idea :) 18:13
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AlexDaniel “Write a script or one-liner to remove leading zeros from positive numbers.” what does it even mean 18:15
like… can I have a test suite for this vague description? :) 18:16
lucs ugexe: Turns out my hung zef process was caused by a hung test it was running, but I couldn't tell because the output was being buffered by a wrapper I had it running under (to log stdout and stderr to files as well as having screen output); was fixed by an appropriate invocation of 'unbuffer'. 18:24
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ugexe there is a --test-timeout=... to bail out if a test takes too long (although I dont think this will kill the hung process) 18:29
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syntaxfree I just asked this question on #perl and I'm also reading through what Google tosses at me. But, should I learn Perl 5 or 6? 18:29
discord6 <פ ח ו ף> 5 18:30
syntaxfree I'm in machine learning (for a paycheck) and use Python for everything. But I'm not looking for a replacement, I want to broaden my mind.
lucs ugexe: Well yes, that worked, but it took me a while to figure out what was going on.
discord6 <פ ח ו ף> perl5 is used alot more but perl6 is more similar to python
ugexe perl6 will give you more options for learning. perl5 will give you more options for money 18:31
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ugexe python is more similar to perl5 than perl6 18:31
discord6 <פ ח ו ף> are you sure? perl5 dosent even have conventional paramters in functions no?
ugexe is that what your entire argument is based on? 18:32
lucs ponders words like "similarer" and "familiarer", but not for long.
ugexe and perl 5 has experimental support for parameters 18:33
it just seems odd to completely ignore threads/concurrency/gc 18:35
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crypto_bird howdy! 18:40
I've got a list of 60 lists with 22 elements each, what's a good perl way of zipping them all together? 18:41
syntaxfree Python is changing fast.
hobbs syntaxfree: for mind-broadening, probably Perl 6 because it will throw a lot of things at you. But Perl 5 gives you decades of existing code, some of which bends the language in interesting ways. So really... whatever, you can't go wrong :) 18:42
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syntaxfree the newer REST API libraries assume you're writing async code by default. 18:42
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syntaxfree type hints are also starting to be a thing. 18:43
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crypto_bird as in, ((1,2,3),(1,2,3),(1,2,3)) -> ((1,1,1),(2,2,2),(3,3,3)) 18:44
ugexe m: my @lol = map { [$_ xx 22] }, (1..60); say [Z] @lol 18:45
evalable6 ((1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 3…
ugexe, Full output: gist.github.com/db742a63f6f2539146...1c53047b07
hobbs m: zip (1,2,3),(1,2,3),(1,2,3) 18:46
evalable6 WARNINGS for /tmp/nDh4rVujJv:
Useless use of "zip (1,2,3),(1,2,3),(1,2,3)" in expression "zip (1,2,3),(1,2,3),(1,2,3)" in sink context (line 1)
hobbs m: say zip (1,2,3),(1,2,3),(1,2,3) 18:47
evalable6 ((1 1 1) (2 2 2) (3 3 3))
hobbs crypto_bird: zip is pretty good for zipping :)
AlexDaniel uhhhhhh…
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crypto_bird m: my $stuff = (1,2,3;1,2,3;1,2,3;); zip $stuff 18:50
evalable6 WARNINGS for /tmp/b8QxW94H0i:
Useless use of "zip $stuff" in expression "zip $stuff" in sink context (line 1)
AlexDaniel m: dd ‘ALEX.DANIEL’.parse-base(35).Str.Rat.base(35) 18:52
evalable6 "ALEX.DANIEL29"
ugexe thats not a list o flists
AlexDaniel m: dd ‘ALEX.DANIEL’.parse-base(35).base(35)
evalable6 "ALEX.DANIEL"
AlexDaniel what's the difference?
ahhhh 18:53
I think I get it
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crypto_bird @ugexe (1,2,3; 1,2,3; 1,2,3;) isn't a list of lists? 18:56
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tobs m: say zip (1,2,3; 1,2,3; 1,2,3) 18:57
evalable6 ((1 1 1) (2 2 2) (3 3 3))
tobs crypto_bird: it is, but putting it in a scalar container makes zip stop zipping:
m: my $stuff = (1,2,3; 1,2,3; 1,2,3); say zip $stuff 18:58
evalable6 ((1 2 3) (1 2 3) (1 2 3))
crypto_bird m: my @list = (1,2,3; 1,2,3; 1,2,3;); zip @list
evalable6 WARNINGS for /tmp/E0gkoUbSHG:
Useless use of "zip @list" in expression "zip @list" in sink context (line 1)
tobs and the bot needs you to "say" something. Otherwise you get the useless use warning ^
crypto_bird m: my @list = (1,2,3; 1,2,3; 1,2,3;); say zip @list 18:59
evalable6 (((1 2 3) (1 2 3) (1 2 3)))
crypto_bird oh
haha
putting it in an @arr doesn't seem to help either 19:00
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tobs m: my @list = (1,2,3; 1,2,3; 1,2,3;); say @list.elems 19:00
evalable6 3
crypto_bird I've had problems manipulating lists in perl6 since I started messing with it
tobs huh
(me too)
m: my @list := (1,2,3; 1,2,3; 1,2,3;); say zip @list 19:01
evalable6 ((1 1 1) (2 2 2) (3 3 3))
moritz m: my @list = (1,2,3; 1,2,3; 1,2,3;); say [zip] list
evalable6 (exit code 1) 04===SORRY!04=== Error while compiling /tmp/jt39Jikli5
Two ter…
moritz, Full output: gist.github.com/c5cd35ff4f624c013b...fd1537e22c
moritz m: my @list = (1,2,3; 1,2,3; 1,2,3;); say [zip] @list
evalable6 (exit code 1) 04===SORRY!04=== Error while compiling /tmp/EnirU8Ro1k
Two ter…
moritz, Full output: gist.github.com/ff8093bc91adde9a78...dec3f4e0f7
ugexe [Z] 19:02
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moritz right, thankx ugexe 19:02
m: my @list = (1,2,3; 1,2,3; 1,2,3;); say [Z] @list
evalable6 ((1 1 1) (2 2 2) (3 3 3))
lucs r: my $a = <a b c>; my $n = <1 2 3>; say [Z] $a, $n
perlbot lucs: ((a 1) (b 2) (c 3))␤ 19:03
crypto_bird that does it
dang I be overthinkin
thanks y'all
ugexe i said that 20 minutes ago :P
moritz but now *I* said it (SCNR) :D 19:04
lucs r: my @A = (<a b c>, <1 2 3>); say [Z] @A
perlbot lucs: ((a 1) (b 2) (c 3))␤
lucs Oh, that's moritz's version.
ugexe no respect! 19:05
lucs :)
crypto_bird @ugexe you totally did 19:06
I just didn't understand cause I was in the midst of overthinking
tyty <3
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crypto_bird got confused by the `my @lol = map { [$_ xx 22] }, (1..60)` bit 19:06
ugexe yeah, that part isnt even right (should have been [$_ x 22]) 19:07
well its right, but it would have matched your input
crypto_bird I see now :D thanks y'all 19:10
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patrickb I finished the rework of rakudobrew. I'd be grateful for testers. 19:24
pmurias syntaxfree: if you want to broaden your mind Perl 6 is more interesting
patrickb This rework is incompatible with the old rakudobrew. To test it one has to remove the old installation and do a fresh clone.
This should do the trick: `mv ~/.rakudobrew ~/.rakudobrew_old && git clone github.com/patzim/rakudobrew.git ~/.rakudobrew` 19:25
AlexDaniel patrickb: IMO that's not a big problem
discord6 <פ ח ו ף> just to see if im not going crazy what should "b o b".trim output?
AlexDaniel m: say "b o b".trim 19:26
evalable6 b o b
AlexDaniel that :)
discord6 <פ ח ו ף> ok good
patrickb AlexDaniel: I'm currently pondering on how to best release this. Just pushing to tadziks repo kills rakudobrew for everyone that does `rakudobrew self-upgrade`.
AlexDaniel patrickb: if you find a way, great. If not, I don't care and IMO people who use rakudobrew can reinstall it 19:27
patrickb Idea: Push to a different branch or repo and add a note to the current repo about the new version and how to upgrade. 19:28
pmurias patrickb: if your rakudo is sane enough after the rework you might consider hooking it up to p6up.github.io/
AlexDaniel <פ ח ו ף> are you seeing it behaving differently? Maybe there's something about unicode and text direction?
pmurias patrickb: p6up.github.io is currently just a mockup site 19:29
patrickb pmurias: Also thought about promoting rakudobrew a bit more. But first is getting it released at all. :-) 19:30
AlexDaniel patrickb: if we don't fall into the “nom” trap again then it's fine
patrickb pmurias: How would you measure "sane enough"?
pmurias patrickb: not sure, the old rakudobrew was considered discouraged
patrickb pmurias: Do you know why? 19:31
AlexDaniel patrickb: yes, because most people use it to keep up with master
patrickb I asked that twice already and always only got answers like "Works for me." "Others shouldn't use, but I do."
AlexDaniel patrickb: which is a bad idea because master is not guaranteed to work properly 19:32
pmurias patrickb: also if I remember correctly mst had some issues with it
AlexDaniel patrickb: also github.com/perl6/user-experience/issues/29
patrickb AlexDaniel: I just changed it to default to the latest release earlier today. (ugexe and sena_kun gave respective feedback) 19:33
AlexDaniel oh
hm 19:34
patrickb The issues mst had were about a severe bug (rakudobrew deleted an entire home directory). That has been fixed by mst himself as a result.
pmurias mst: rakudobrew is being reworked so if you have any issues with it's design now there is a big chance they will be addressed ;) 19:36
mst I don't think the bug actually affected me, I think it happened to a newbie and I got annoyed and happened to it 19:38
pmurias patrickb: re sane enough well p6up doesn't do anything so if you want you could hook rakudobrew right now ;) 19:39
patrickb mst: That's also what I remember.
mst and I think it ate the user's /usr/bin
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b2gills rakudobrew's use case is to be able to build any triplet of Rakudo/NQP/MoarVM. So it is for developing/debugging the compiler and runtime. Most people just want the latest stable version, or the latest one in git. 20:10
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cpan-p6 New module released to CPAN! LogP6 (1.3.1) by 03ATROXAPER 20:31
AlexDaniel does anybody use the triplet feature? 20:32
I tried it once and it didn't work for me, maybe because of a user error
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pmurias b2gills: do you use it for that? 20:36
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pmurias b2gills: I don't see using mismatched triplets instead of just a checkout of the repo for all three being very usefull 20:39
b2gills I created my own build script 20:46
That's part of the reason it is discouraged, most people don't need half of its features. 20:47
crypto_bird what is '⏏U' mean in perl? 20:54
timotimo that's usually how rakudo shows you where a parse error happened
moritz crypto_bird: ⏏ is the marker where rakudo detects a syntax error
crypto_bird I keep getting this error "Cannot convert string to number: base-10 number must begin with valid digits or '.' in '⏏U' (indicated by ⏏)`" 20:55
so I suppose that makes sense
timotimo aye, it does that for integer/number parsing, too
crypto_bird it seems to fail randomly for no reason, frustratingly enough 20:56
there's no obviously unparseable strings in the file that I'm attempting to use as data 20:57
pmurias patrickb: what's the benefit of rakudobrew over plenv? 20:58
crypto_bird y'all have any idea how I can figure out what perl is looking at when it throws that error? 20:59
timotimo does it not show a backtrace?
pmurias patrickb: well p6env
crypto_bird it says a line
patrickb pmurias:p6env basically does the same thing rakudobrew does
crypto_bird that line shouldn't be doing any conversion of strings to integers
patrickb it uses shims
it's written in bash instead of perl 21:00
crypto_bird "$block : $minute-avg \n";
patrickb so p6env will not work on windows
crypto_bird where block is a timestamp and minute-average is a list of averages
patrickb also the shim approach has some drawbacks, as there is always a wrapper involved.
timotimo OK, in that case perhaps the line number isn't correct 21:01
patrickb the new rakudobrew does path manipulation in env mode
just like perlbrew does
and rakudobrew also works on windows (in shim mode)
the perl dependency doesn't really matter, since perl is required anyways to build perl6
crypto_bird I wouldn't know how to tell where else it could be erroring, or why it would think that it should error there :/
timotimo OK, let's try this: 21:02
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timotimo invoke perl6 with --ll-exception, that will give you many more frames to your backtrace 21:02
they show internals, but they may point us in the right direction
patrickb I guess rakudobrew has turned into a "feature creep" solution. 21:03
pmurias: Does that answer your question?
crypto_bird brilliant; running now. It'll take a minute or so haha this thing is tryna parse nearly 8 hundred thousand lines of data 21:04
patrickb pmurias: Out of interest, what benefits does p6env have over rakudobrew?
timotimo sounds like something you'll want to try .hyper with :)
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crypto_bird oh dang, that looks sick 21:07
timotimo it's pretty rad
crypto_bird yeah, I'll probably end up trying to parallelism it once I have it working and not throwing ludicrous errors where it shouldn't haha 21:08
@timotimo gist.github.com/cryptobird/5b369ee...6fe0af0001 21:10
timotimo OK, so it's trying to sum something for some reason 21:11
crypto_bird it should be doing that slightly earlier in the script, to generate the averages 21:12
timotimo you probably got a lazy list and it exploded when you actually requested the value
that could very well be it
crypto_bird that makes sense 21:13
how do I make it not be lazy
I need the greed 21:14
timotimo you can .eager on it, for more details i'd have to see the code
crypto_bird my $rows = $minute.map(-> $r { $r[2..$r.elems-1]}); my $minute-avg = ([Z] $rows).map(&sum).map({ ($_/60).round(.000001)}); 21:15
timotimo yeah, at the end of the .map you'd .eager
crypto_bird .map.eager{} or .map{}.eager? 21:16
timotimo the latter
crypto_bird cool
time to give it a try :D 21:17
timotimo that $r[2..$r.elems - 1] is just supposed to skip the first two elements? 21:18
crypto_bird yeah
timotimo .skip(2) may be more efficient
crypto_bird perl has so many tricks
and I know none of them
timotimo it's totally fine to write "baby perl" 21:19
that's an explicit part of the language design
crypto_bird I do quite enjoy that face 21:21
fact*
tobs m: my $rows := (1,2,3; 1,2,3; 1,2,3); say ([Z] $rows).map(&sum); #`(could also try a "zip-with":) say [Z+] $rows 21:22
evalable6 (3 6 9)
(3 6 9)
moritz m: my $rows := (1,2,3; 1,2,3; 1,2,3); say [Z+] $rows
evalable6 (3 6 9)
crypto_bird oh wow 21:25
that's actually dang cool
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crypto_bird still big error :/' 21:29
timotimo time for some printf debugging? :) :) 21:30
well, dd probably
crypto_bird too many values for that
frustratingly enough 21:31
it's somewhere on this line my $minute-avg = ([Z+] $rows).map({ ($_/60).round(.000001)}).eager;
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timotimo is there a row with comments in it or something? 21:37
crypto_bird not that I can find 21:38
I'm trying to dd before the line where it errors though to see
timotimo if one $rows comes from one line in the file, perhaps output line numbers to check which line it fails at
crypto_bird I tried removing the minute that it fails in (60 rows) out into it's own file 21:39
couldn't reproduce
timotimo now the problem happens already inside [Z+] $rows, right? 21:40
i don't think it'll very easily let you plop a debug or try/catch in there
crypto_bird yeah 21:41
timotimo how about: .say for ([Z+] $rows).kv;
crypto_bird so I have to manually look through the 60 lines and look for a reason that it would fail
timotimo that'll give you line numbers and should display the failure when it happens
crypto_bird worth a shot 21:42
lizmat weekly: bduggan.github.io/p6-practical-regexes
notable6 lizmat, Noted!
crypto_bird unless the error actually occurs in the rounding part
timotimo it's possible that suming them up gives you a failure, which is like a lazy/unthrown exception 21:43
and the rounding triggers the explosion
crypto_bird tru
timotimo m: my $input = [(1, 2, 3), (9, 8, 7), ("hi", 4, 3)]; .say for ([Z+] $input).kv 21:44
evalable6 0
9
timotimo m: my $input = [(1, 2, 3), (9, 8, 7), ("hi", 4, 3)]; dd([Z+] $input)
evalable6 (9,).Seq
timotimo ah, that's not what
m: my @input = [(1, 2, 3), (9, 8, 7), ("hi", 4, 3)]; dd([Z+] @input)
evalable6 (exit code 1) Cannot convert string to number: base-10 number must begin with valid digits or '.' in '03⏏04hi' (indicated by ⏏)
in block <unit> at /tmp/dt5DeJOe_I line 1
timotimo that's the one
m: my @input = [(1, 2, 3), (9, 8, 7), ("hi", 4, 3)]; .say for ([Z+] @input).kv 21:45
evalable6 (exit code 1) Cannot convert string to number: base-10 number must begin with valid digits or '.' in '03⏏04hi' (indicated by ⏏)
in block <unit> at /tmp/cz0IBgYXrW line 1
timotimo OK, it'll explode earlier, it seems like
another idea would be to just iterater through everything in $rows and try to .Num 21:46
crypto_bird yeah
timotimo m: [(1, 2, 3), (9, 8, 7), ("hi", 4, 3)].deepmap({ try +$_; CATCH { .say } }); 21:47
evalable6
timotimo m: [(1, 2, 3), (9, 8, 7), ("hi", 4, 3)].deepmap({ say try +$_; CATCH { .say } });
evalable6 1
2
3
9
8
7
Nil
4
3
timotimo m: [(1, 2, 3), (9, 8, 7), ("hi", 4, 3)].deepmap({ +$_; CATCH { .say } });
evalable6 (exit code 1) WARNINGS for /tmp/qk9ETiaMMd:
Cannot convert string to number: base-10 numbe…
timotimo, Full output: gist.github.com/0fc7db05e783dd1f0e...8e8a91d5a7
timotimo hah 21:48
m: [(1, 2, 3), (9, 8, 7), ("hi", 4, 3)].deepmap({ +$_ or .say });
evalable6 hi
timotimo this'll get you the values that aren't properly numifiable
crypto_bird oh that's dope
timotimo m: [(1, 2, 3), (9, 8, 7), ("hi", 4, 3)].deepmap({ (state $row)++; +$_ or "$row: $_".say }); 21:49
evalable6 7: hi
timotimo well, that's not really the row, that's the field
crypto_bird what's staye $row
(state $row) 21:50
hahah haha 21:52
dammit
there are fields that contain NaN
how dare they.
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timotimo that's mean 21:55
but NaN should parse, shouldn't it?
m: say +"NaN"
evalable6 NaN
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crypto_bird m: say 1 + "NaN" 21:56
evalable6 NaN
crypto_bird m: say (1 + "NaN")/2
evalable6 NaN
crypto_bird m: .say for [Z+] (1,2,3;1,"NaN",3;1,2,3;) 21:57
evalable6 3
NaN
9
crypto_bird whelp, it's working now! that I deleted all the NaN's, at least 22:08
I appreciate your help timotimo
<3
timotimo \o/ 22:09
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patrickb .tell tadzik I got some thumbs up to just put my changes to rakudobrew in the current repo (github.com/tadzik/rakudobrew) and not try to be clever about the upgrade. 22:44
yoleaux patrickb: I'll pass your message to tadzik.
patrickb .tell tadzik The new version will just show a message when it detected the incompatibility and shortly explains what to do to fix it.
yoleaux patrickb: I'll pass your message to tadzik.
patrickb .tell tadzik Would you be OK with this? If yes, I'll prepare a PR. 22:45
yoleaux patrickb: I'll pass your message to tadzik.
patrickb is off for today.
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guifa Is there a way to sneak several very small modules into a single file but still reference them separately? (I’m guessing the answer is no but … worth a shot 23:18
ugexe m: module Foo { our sub foo() { 1 } }; module Bar { our sub bar() { 2 } }; say Foo::foo(); say Bar::bar() 23:22
evalable6 1
2
ugexe in your META6.json have an entry for each (both pointing to the same file)
"Foo":"lib/SomeFile.pm6", "Bar":"lib/SomeFile.pm6" 23:23
note this still precompiles into 2 files
guifa ^^ I’ll try that. I was doing just “use lib ‘lib’ and it wasn’t connecting for some reason
ugexe well
dont use `lib "lib"`
nobody should be using that over `use lib "."` if they have a META6.json 23:24
because there is no way to map both names to a given file
without explicitly mapping them in a META6.json
and `use lib "lib"` does not point at a directory with META6.json
guifa Ah, I didn’t realize that the use will look for META6.json , I thought that was exclusively for zef installs. 23:25
ugexe and honestly using `use lib ...` is discouraged as far as im concerned
use (or explain) people need to use -I ... or PERL6LIB
guifa just didn’t want to have to wait for a full install for quick tests
ugexe if you do `use lib "."` and it points at a directory with a META6.json it will be used. this ensures installed modules act the same as non-installed modules 23:26
this cannot be said for `use lib "lib"`
guifa But re precompile, that’s no problem. There’s about 70 numbering systems that I need to cover for CLDR, and *most* are literally just replacing 0..9 with foo..bar, so I’d rather not have a directory with 70 different modules. But for other systems that have far more complex logic (roman, etc) a module in its own file makes more sense. 23:27
ugexe but most of the times it should not be the module author decision where it should look for libraries (including writing tests)
so anytime i see a test with `use lib "lib"` i die a little 23:28
guifa Don’t worry I had no intention of releasing using use lib ‘lib’ lol 23:29
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ugexe your life shall be spared then 23:36
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guifa tio.run/##nZHtTsIwGIX/7ypOFkw2lDpw.../bRq82rKoP 23:50
Interesting results for the different ways to do the substitution
Using a hash lookup was actually faster than an array, though not by a lot. Using trans was monumentally slow 23:52
Probably the array is going Int -> Str -> Int to slow it down by a teensy bit 23:53

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