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[00:00] <ToddAndMargo> If I think I am saving something and it is not actaully saving, then it would seem like I am in a haunted house.  Next time I edit this program I will use vi

[00:02] <ToddAndMargo> Thatr trans thing works real pretty!  Thank you!  I never would have figure ti out from the docs either.

[00:03] <timotimo> for some reason the docs don't have results for the first few trans examples

[00:06] <ToddAndMargo> I am waiting for you guys new beginner level docs.  Maybe you should consider getting in on it.  Your explainations to me are extrodinarily easy to understand.  And I can be thick as a stone!

[00:07] <timotimo> hm, i wasn't exactly confident in my ability to explain stuff. or maybe my problem is more with building a bunch of knowledge into a coherent "narrative"

[00:09] <ToddAndMargo> Dude!  As your long staning pupil, you are way undercutting yourself.  Your explainations are extrodinary

[00:14] <timotimo> maybe i'm just good at getting into your head :P

[00:14] <timotimo> but the only thing i'll be getting into right now is my bed, i'm afraid

[00:17] <ToddAndMargo> Sleep?  What is that???   By the way, if Todd understands it, anyone will.  Anyone feel free bounce explainations off me to see if I get it.

[00:17] <ToddAndMargo> Thank you again.

[00:17] <timotimo> YW

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[00:26] <vrurg> Any ideas how to delcare a 'my method' in a module to prevent it loosing closure after compilation?

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[00:38] <raschipi> vrurg: Do you have a snippet we can look at?

[00:39] <vrurg> raschipi: No, but it's about Red ORM: https://github.com/FCO/Red/issues/158

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[00:41] <vrurg> I know it's possible because I use similar approach of adding methods in AttrX::Mooish. But it's a kind of magic anyway.

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[02:44] <Kaiepi> i really need to get my linux vm working again so i'm not wasting my time fighting with travis

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[05:53] <jmerelo> releasable6: status

[05:53] <releasable6> jmerelo, Next release will happen when it's ready. 1 blocker. 132 out of 284 commits logged (⚠ 2 warnings)

[05:53] <releasable6> jmerelo, Details: https://gist.github.com/a5c42698e87f9d014afb55ad39d6fd55

[05:54] <jmerelo> :-(

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[06:05] <Geth> ¦ doc: JJ assigned to antoniogamiz Issue Cursor should probably be taken off the type graph https://github.com/perl6/doc/issues/2770

[06:16] <Geth> ¦ doc: a0a7388044 | (JJ Merelo)++ | doc/Language/subscripts.pod6

[06:16] <Geth> ¦ doc: Changes to headers, refs #2483

[06:16] <Geth> ¦ doc: review: https://github.com/perl6/doc/commit/a0a7388044

[06:16] <Geth> ¦ doc: 602dbaba18 | (JJ Merelo)++ | doc/Language/subscripts.pod6

[06:16] <Geth> ¦ doc: Reflows

[06:16] <Geth> ¦ doc: review: https://github.com/perl6/doc/commit/602dbaba18

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[06:28] <antoniogamiz> o/

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[06:52] <antoniogamiz> rebuilding docs to fix #2770... time for breakfast

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[07:07] <El_Che> antoniogamiz: lo

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[07:17] <Geth> ¦ doc: 955184317a | Antonio++ | type-graph.txt

[07:17] <Geth> ¦ doc: deletes Cursor line in type-graph.txt, closes #2770

[07:17] <Geth> ¦ doc: review: https://github.com/perl6/doc/commit/955184317a

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[08:10] <tyil> antoniogamiz: o/

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[09:03] <antoniogamiz> tyil: what email client do you use?

[09:03] <tyil> antoniogamiz: claws-mail

[09:04] <antoniogamiz> tyil: ty :)

[09:04] <tyil> no probs ^_^

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[09:34] <Kaiepi> i'm excited about the grant someone just received for linking perl 6 programs

[09:36] <Kaiepi> shame it only focuses on making it work on windows, mac, and linux though

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[09:40] <Geth> ¦ doc: d5f06e5c96 | (Ben Davies)++ | 2 files

[09:40] <Geth> ¦ doc: Temporarily remove mentions of Scheduler.cue edge case version reqs

[09:40] <Geth> ¦ doc: 

[09:40] <Geth> ¦ doc: It may be in 2019.05, but may have to wait until 2019.06, but either

[09:40] <Geth> ¦ doc: way, 2019.04 isn't a version.

[09:40] <Geth> ¦ doc: review: https://github.com/perl6/doc/commit/d5f06e5c96

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[09:46] <tyil> Kaiepi: you can't target everything, I guess

[09:46] <tyil> I think that with those 3 platforms you have most of humanity's computer platforms covered

[09:47] <Kaiepi> true

[09:47] <Kaiepi> maybe after the grant's done i could take a look at supporting bsd as well

[09:47] <timotimo> once that stuff is implemented, it's probably not too hard to expand it to also cover some BSDs

[09:47] <timotimo> yeah

[09:48] <Kaiepi> speaking of which, i'm planning on starting my own grant work soon

[09:48] <tyil> going from GNU+Linux to BSD should be easier than going from nothing to BSD, I hope :>

[09:48] <Kaiepi> it depends

[09:49] <Kaiepi> i still don't have a mentor yet, but i'm allowed to start work without one in the meantime

[09:49] <tyil> you're always allowed to make contributions, I think

[09:50] <Kaiepi> yeah

[09:52] <Kaiepi> ofc i chose to start with the hardest work to do: preparing 6.e.PREVIEW and refactoring IO::Socket and IO::Socket::Async for upcoming changes in that release

[09:53] <Kaiepi> i remember zoffix had trouble preparing 6.d

[10:00] <kawaii> timotimo: good morning sir! Are you the one controlling the current rakudo site hosting?

[10:00] <timotimo> i'm a part of the group who does

[10:01] <kawaii> so I only had access to the old server, and today I'm determined to do my first release

[10:01] <kawaii> it's going to be messy but hey, first time :D

[10:01] <kawaii> so I'll ping you later about uploading the new release files

[10:01] <timotimo> we'll support you as best we can! *goes away to take a nap*

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[10:22] <antoniogamiz> uoh githyb is not working? O.o

[10:22] <antoniogamiz> github*

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[10:24] <antoniogamiz> yep, github is down

[10:27] <timotimo> oh, huh

[10:27] <timotimo> not on my end

[10:27] <jast> works for me, too

[10:28] <jast> actually SSH is broken for me, too

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[10:28] <timotimo> i was just able to "git pull" in my rakudo clone without issue

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[10:48] <antoniogamiz> timotimo: it was only for a minute or so

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[10:51] <timotimo> OK

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[10:59] <Kaypie> m: my Junction $alph = any 'abcdefghijklmnopqrstuvwxyz'.comb; my @words = flat ('aaaa'..'zzzz'), ('AAAA'..'ZZZZ'); my Instant $begin = now; @words.grep(-> $word { $alph ~~ all $word.comb }); say now - $begin

[10:59] <camelia> rakudo-moar b0dd44b00: OUTPUT: «(timeout)»

[10:59] <Kaypie> m: my Junction $alph = any 'abcdefghijklmnopqrstuvwxyz'.comb; my @words = flat ('aaa'..'zzz'), ('AAA'..'ZZZ'); my Instant $begin = now; @words.grep(-> $word { $alph ~~ all $word.comb }); say now - $begin

[11:00] <camelia> rakudo-moar b0dd44b00: OUTPUT: «20.846608␤»

[11:01] <Kaypie> m: my @words = flat ('aaa'..'zzz'), ('AAA'..'ZZZ'); my Instant $begin = now; @words.grep(-> $word { $word ~~ / ^ <[a..z]> $ / }); now - $begin

[11:01] <camelia> rakudo-moar b0dd44b00: OUTPUT: «WARNINGS for <tmp>:␤Useless use of "-" in expression "now - $begin" in sink context (line 1)␤»

[11:01] <Kaypie> m: my @words = flat ('aaa'..'zzz'), ('AAA'..'ZZZ'); my Instant $begin = now; @words.grep(-> $word { $word ~~ / ^ <[a..z]> $ / }); say now - $begin

[11:01] <camelia> rakudo-moar b0dd44b00: OUTPUT: «0.1564643␤»

[11:01] <Kaypie> why is it so much faster to use regex than to use junctions?

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[11:05] <timotimo> m: my Junction $alph = any 'abcdefghijklmnopqrstuvwxyz'.comb; my @words = flat ('aaaa'..'zzzz'), ('AAAA'..'ZZZZ'); my Instant $begin = now; @words.grep(-> $word { $alph eq all $word.comb }); say now - $begin

[11:05] <camelia> rakudo-moar b0dd44b00: OUTPUT: «(timeout)»

[11:05] <timotimo> the alph junction is a list of strings that all have to be string-compared separately

[11:06] <timotimo> <[a..z]> is just a check if the codepoint is between two numbers

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[11:07] <timotimo> also, since the junction could have anything at all in it, resolving the result has to do full multi dispatch every time

[11:11] <Kaypie> ah

[11:11] <timotimo> oh, also your regex seems to only accept one-character words, i.e. it will reject everything in @words

[11:12] <timotimo> if our regex optimizer/engine were smarter it would immediately reject it based on string length

[11:12] <timotimo> but yeah, you're also turning all the three-letter "words" into arrays of strings again for checking

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[11:43] <tyil> looks like I've been getting timeouts for a while on www.nntp.perl.org

[11:44] <tyil> which is where I used to pull new CPAN uploads from

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[11:45] <tyil> to whom can I report this issue?

[11:46] <lizmat> tyil: nntp.perl.org is still down to Perl NOC maintenance

[11:46] <tyil> ah

[11:46] <tyil> I assume it will be fixed in time, then

[11:47] <tyil> in the meantime I guess I should set up multiple sources so I can always get module updates

[11:47] <tyil> maybe something for tonight at amsterdam.pm

[11:47] <lizmat> yes... looks like  :-)

[11:47] <lizmat> indeed

[11:52] <lizmat> https://log.perl.org/2019/04/maintenance-week.html

[11:53] <lizmat> also: “We're mostly done with the heavy listing, and now we're cleaning up the dust and sharp edges and things we missed.  Things should be stabilizing rapidly.  I'm working on cleaning up the monitoring which will help us identify what's still out”

[11:53] <lizmat>  “This whole thing happened in a hurry, due to things outside our control, but we're pretty happy with how it went”

[11:56] <tyil> lizmat: thanks :>

[11:56] <Geth> ¦ doc: 7175096e4e | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | doc/Language/setbagmix.pod6

[11:56] <Geth> ¦ doc: Further work on Set/Bag/Mix introduction

[11:56] <Geth> ¦ doc: 

[11:56] <Geth> ¦ doc: - reduce set operator lemma's to just intro

[11:56] <Geth> ¦ doc:   - add link to complete info in operators/terms

[11:56] <Geth> ¦ doc:   - add Wikipedia link to the mathematical explanation

[11:56] <Geth> ¦ doc: - note that they should be called QuantHash operators, but that's a mouthful

[11:56] <Geth> ¦ doc: 

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[11:56] <tyil> ok

[11:56] <lizmat> oops, how did I do that ?

[11:56] <lizmat> killing Geth I mean ?

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[11:56] <tyil> nobody will know

[11:57] <tyil> probably too many messages in too short time

[11:57] <tyil> I need to configure persistent logging on my containers

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[11:59] <tyil> logs dont show any particular error, though

[12:03] <sena_kun>  

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[12:14] <xinming> m: 1.5 div 1

[12:14] <camelia> rakudo-moar b0dd44b00: OUTPUT: «WARNINGS for <tmp>:␤Useless use of "div" in expression "1.5 div 1" in sink context (line 1)␤Cannot resolve caller infix:<div>(Rat:D, Int:D); none of these signatures match:␤    (Int:D \a, Int:D \b --> Int:D)␤    (int $a, int $b --> int)␤  in…»

[12:14] <xinming> m: (1.5 div 1).perl.say;  A bit curious, Why will (1.5 div 1) returns the 0.5?

[12:14] <camelia> rakudo-moar b0dd44b00: OUTPUT: «5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling <tmp>␤Two terms in a row␤at <tmp>:1␤------> 3ay;  A bit curious, Why will (1.5 div 1)7⏏5 returns the 0.5?␤    expecting any of:␤        infix␤        infix stopper␤        postfix␤        …»

[12:14] <xinming> (1.5 div 1).perl.say;  A bit curious, Why will (1.5 div 1) returns the 0.5?

[12:14] <xinming> m: (3 div 2).perl.say;

[12:14] <camelia> rakudo-moar b0dd44b00: OUTPUT: «1␤»

[12:15] <xinming> With integer, it worked, Why doesn't it work with floating numbers?

[12:15] <timotimo> i'll be running a fedora distro upgrade, which could take a little while. kawaii, you'll have to find someone to do the uploads; sena_kun can give away access and perhaps tell you who already has access to do the uploads

[12:16] <kawaii> no problem, I'll come and be annoying later when I'm ready to do all that! :D

[12:16] <moritz> xinming: div is an operator that explicitly coerces to integer

[12:16] * sena_kun agrees with timotimo 

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[12:16] <sena_kun> kawaii, just ping me anytime you are fancy

[12:17] <moritz> masak: I've just learned that you can implement lambda calculus in mediawiki templates

[12:18] <xinming> moritz: I know it coerces to integer, I'm just curious why we don't have the Num version for it.

[12:18] <xinming> the design purpose

[12:18] <timotimo> "total download size: 5.7G" - probably cutting it a bit close with only 6.02G free on the hard drive ...

[12:19] <xinming> What I do for now is      $x - Int($x / 2)  to get the remainder.

[12:19] <xinming> But we have div already, I'm just curious why don't we have that support the Number.

[12:19] <xinming> The decision behind it.

[12:20] <timotimo> why not use % for getting remainders?

[12:22] <raschipi> xinming: div is supposed to work like the native integer division that processors have

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[12:24] <moritz> if you put two floats into %, you get the closest equivalent to div

[12:24] <moritz> works in the type you want, does a modulo

[12:25] <xinming> timotimo: Not remainder, I need the Int($x / 2)  part

[12:25] <xinming> raschipi: Thanks, That clear my confusion.

[12:26] <xinming> m: (5 % 3)

[12:26] <camelia> rakudo-moar b0dd44b00: OUTPUT: «WARNINGS for <tmp>:␤Useless use of "%" in expression "5 % 3" in sink context (line 1)␤»

[12:26] <xinming> m: (5 % 3).perl.say;

[12:26] <camelia> rakudo-moar b0dd44b00: OUTPUT: «2␤»

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[12:30] <timotimo> m: for (1, 1.5, 2, 3.1, 3.2, 3.3) X (1, 2, 2.5, 3, 3.5, 0.1, 0.5) -> ($a, $b) { my $one = Int($a / $b); my $two = $a div $b; say "$a / $b: $one, $two" unless $one == $two }

[12:30] <camelia> rakudo-moar b0dd44b00: OUTPUT: «Cannot resolve caller infix:<div>(Int:D, Rat:D); none of these signatures match:␤    (Int:D \a, Int:D \b --> Int:D)␤    (int $a, int $b --> int)␤  in block <unit> at <tmp> line 1␤␤»

[12:30] <timotimo> oh?

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[12:35] <timotimo>    At least 3996MB more space needed on the / filesystem.

[12:35] <timotimo> bleeeehhhh

[12:37] <lizmat> that fits on a USB stick    :-)

[12:41] <timotimo> i just have to find some stuff that i can move over sensibly

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[12:47] <tyil> timotimo: time for zfs? :D

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[12:47] <tyil> or is your entire disk overflowing

[12:47] <timotimo> it's the entire disk

[12:48] <timotimo> it's an SSD

[12:48] <timotimo> not a big one

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[12:53] <timotimo> BBL

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[14:10] <Geth> ¦ doc: b117438b90 | Antonio++ | doc/Type/Range.pod6

[14:10] <Geth> ¦ doc: EXISTS-POS method added #2739

[14:10] <Geth> ¦ doc: review: https://github.com/perl6/doc/commit/b117438b90

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[15:31] * lizmat clickbaits https://p6weekly.wordpress.com/2019/05/06/2019-17-18-three-months-to-riga/

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[15:34] <tadzik> \o/

[15:38] <moritz> twooot

[15:41] <Geth> ¦ doc: uzluisf++ created pull request #2772: Remove spaces around operators and reflow

[15:41] <Geth> ¦ doc: review: https://github.com/perl6/doc/pull/2772

[15:43] <jmerelo> hey

[15:43] <moritz> ho

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[15:46] <jmerelo> moritz: let's go. A few riffs more, and we got a Ramones' song.

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[16:00] *** cpage_ is now known as cpage

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[18:12] <jmerelo> releasable6: status

[18:12] <releasable6> jmerelo, Next release will happen when it's ready. 1 blocker. 132 out of 284 commits logged (⚠ 2 warnings)

[18:12] <releasable6> jmerelo, Details: https://gist.github.com/32dd8143d266b08daa8cf2492c2957a4

[18:12] <jmerelo> That did not move a lot in the last few days.

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[18:19] <masak> moritz: that's the best thing I've heard about MediaWiki templates in quite a while.

[18:19] * masak is really looking forward to Riga, too

[18:20] <masak> will be my first YAPC::EU in a while, and my first PerlCon ever ;)

[18:21] <jmerelo> masak: that's got to do something how the people is going to receive your totally not disruptive change in the Perl 6 core?

[18:22] <moritz> what did I miss?

[18:27] <jmerelo> moritz: masak's plans for world domination https://twitter.com/carlmasak/status/1125460437125017600

[18:27] <tadzik> I can't wait for the GGE rewrite in 007 replacing Grammar.pm

[18:29] <masak> tadzik: shhhhh!

[18:30] <tadzik> oops

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[18:30] <masak> gee, am I really that transparent?

[18:30] <tadzik> don't worry, with my GDPR superpowers I'm going to delete this from the internet

[18:30] <tadzik> y'all are not allowed to read this anymore

[18:30] <masak> "I exercise my right to be forgotten. hello. hello?"

[18:30] <tobs> masak: the Yoneda lemma has one layer of stuff much, right?

[18:31] <tobs> (re: your twitter blurb)

[18:31] <masak> tobs: you can always fix things by adding another layer of stuff... except possibly the Yoneda lemma, which already has way too much stuff. or too little, I can't decide.

[18:32] <moritz> jmerelo: ah, those plans :D

[18:32] <masak> mwhahah... I mean, please disregard any fallacious rumors about plans

[18:32] <tobs> I think the fixing effect of more layers is when you put indirections in between, not stack more and more on top :)

[18:33] <masak> well. "in between" is undoubtedly the best place to put indirections :P

[18:34] * masak .oO( "where does that indirection go?" -- "nowhere. it was put in at the very end, after we had any referents left." )

[18:35] <masak> I only really know two things about the Yoneda lemma: that I don't understand it, and that it's a beautiful generalization of Cayley's theorem

[18:35] <masak> (and even that latter fact I had to look up, so I didn't actually write "Cauchy's theorem")

[18:36] <masak> accidentally*

[18:36] <masak> I know all the ingredients and constituent parts that go into the lemma, but I can only really make them all fit together in my head when I'm drunk

[18:38] <jmerelo> masak: I'll get you to explain it to me over beers in Riga

[18:38] <jmerelo> masak: they have beer in Riga, right?

[18:42] <lizmat> yes, belgian beer even

[18:42] * lizmat has fond memories of the Belgian bar in Riga

[18:43] <jmerelo> lizmat: good to know. They have proper glasses for every kind of beer. That's probably essential to prove the Yoneda lemma

[18:44] <lizmat> http://bon-vivant.lv/en/home/

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[18:49] <masak> jmerelo: I'm not drunk right now, but there's a Swahili word "ubuntu" that's been having an upswing for the past 14 years for some reason.

[18:50] <masak> jmerelo: it means (IIUC) that people are defined by who they know and spend time with.

[18:50] <masak> jmerelo: that's a good description of the Yoneda lemma, except with categorical objects instead of people :D

[18:54] <jmerelo> and functors

[18:55] <jmerelo> masak: people are defined by what they functor with

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[19:06] <masak> and who they cofunctor with

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[19:53] <ufobat> m: say grammar { rule TOP {  <.ws>* \w* }}.parse("foo")

[19:54] <ufobat> m: say "oi?"

[19:54] <ufobat> :-(

[19:54] <camelia> rakudo-moar b0dd44b00: OUTPUT: «(timeout)»

[19:54] <camelia> rakudo-moar b0dd44b00: OUTPUT: «oi?␤»

[19:54] <ufobat> uh!

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[20:34] <timotimo> ufobat_: did you find out why that was wrong?

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[20:34] <ufobat_> not yet

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[20:37] <tobs> m: say "    foo" ~~ / <.ws> \w* /

[20:37] <camelia> rakudo-moar b0dd44b00: OUTPUT: «｢    foo｣␤»

[20:38] <tobs> if I had to guess it's because <ws> is already a star-quantified whitespace, so it can match 0 times if it must and you star it again, so it keeps consuming nothing over and over.

[20:39] <tobs> m: say all("foo", "  foo")  ~~ / <.ws> \w* /

[20:39] <camelia> rakudo-moar b0dd44b00: OUTPUT: «all(｢foo｣, ｢  foo｣)␤»

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[20:40] <tobs> m: say "foo"  ~~ / [<[ ]>*]* \w* /  # <.ws>*, I assume, is then something like this but with more kinds of whitespace

[20:40] <tobs> ufobat_ ^

[20:40] <camelia> rakudo-moar b0dd44b00: OUTPUT: «(timeout)»

[20:42] <ufobat_> i see :D

[20:42] <ufobat_> thanks tobs 

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