pugscode.org/ | nopaste: sial.org/pbot/perl6 | pugs: [~] <m oo se> (or rakudo:, kp6:, smop: etc.) || We do Haskell, too | > reverse . show $ foldl1 (*) [1..4] | irclog: irc.pugscode.org/ Set by TimToady on 25 January 2008. |
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mncharity | (t n+1) yet another odd pod comment construct: =head1...=cut | 00:08 | |
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mncharity | i think this was discussed recently... is 'map:{3}' valid, or must it be 'map :{3}' (with a space)? anyone know? | 00:16 | |
eternaleye | mncharity: | 00:22 | |
[Thu May 8 2008] [15:01:15] <moritz_> we had the discussion what $obj.math:{block} means | |||
[Thu May 8 2008] [15:01:35] <moritz_> and it turned out to be parsed as $obj.meth :{block} | |||
I'll pastebin the relevant porion of my logs | 00:23 | ||
*portion | |||
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mncharity | eternaleye: thanks :) re pastebin, knowing the date, I can just check the log, thanks | 00:25 | |
eternaleye | Okay | ||
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mncharity | TimToady: (12) is the | in 'sub f(|$c) {}' parsed? hint? | 00:28 | |
spinclad | mncharity: re (10), @%(...) should be parsed @(%(...)) ? -- (but then @@ is a single sigil? hmm) | 00:34 | |
(haven't looked at STD on this to see the issue...) | |||
mncharity | oh. hmm. that would be odd wouldn't it. re @%() being @(%()), yeah, that looks like what was intended. t/data_types/hash.t | 00:41 | |
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mncharity | try{ @%(a => <b>)<a> }; ok( $!, "doesn't really make sense, but shouldn't segfault, either ($!)"); | 00:42 | |
but at least re STD, looks like a parsefail. | 00:43 | ||
circumfix:sigil | 00:44 | ||
TimToady: (4 addendum) also re fatarrow using <ident> for the key, t/spec/S29-str/split.t has a '1 =>'. | 00:48 | ||
and STD_red non-choking on t/ passes 60% of files. yay! pause. back to slogging... | 00:50 | ||
TimToady: (13) ... let me know if you ever get tired of these ... routine_def uses ident which is \w* so 'sub postfix:<!!!> ($x){3}' doesn't parse. | 00:55 | ||
anything:whatever too. | 00:57 | ||
not that I'm at all looking forward to trying to make such declarations actually affect parsing. :/ | 00:58 | ||
nothing like trying to duplicate it to remind oneself what an accomplishment pugs was/is. | 00:59 | ||
rakudo: sub postfix:<!!!>($x) { $x * 2 }; say 3!!!; | 01:01 | ||
exp_evalbot | OUTPUT[Statement not terminated properly at line 1, near ":<!!!>($x)"current instr.: 'parrot;PGE::Util;die' pc 120 (runtime/parrot/library/PGE/Util.pir:82)called from Sub 'parrot;Perl6::Grammar;statementlist' pc 17896 (src/gen_grammar.pir:2659)called from Sub | ||
..'parrot;Perl6::Grammar;statement_block' pc 14962 (src/gen_grammar.pir:1609)called f... | |||
mncharity | pugs: sub postfix:<aa>($x){$x*2}; 3 aa; | 01:02 | |
exp_evalbot | RESULT[6] | 01:03 | |
mncharity | rakudo: sub postfix:<aa>($x){$x*2}; 3 aa; | ||
exp_evalbot | OUTPUT[Statement not terminated properly at line 1, near ":<aa>($x){"current instr.: 'parrot;PGE::Util;die' pc 120 (runtime/parrot/library/PGE/Util.pir:82)called from Sub 'parrot;Perl6::Grammar;statementlist' pc 17896 (src/gen_grammar.pir:2659)called from Sub | ||
..'parrot;Perl6::Grammar;statement_block' pc 14962 (src/gen_grammar.pir:1609)called f... | |||
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meppl | good night | 01:14 | |
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mncharity | good night meppl | 01:24 | |
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mncharity | svnbot definitely seems to be sleeping. could someone wake it? :) thanks. | 02:35 | |
hopefully I'll have some time this weekend. plan is to knock off a few more causes of parsefails, so we at least seem to potentially have a good set of accessible tests, then fork the next elf, and then begin knocking off test failures, fleshing out the compiler and prelude. | 02:41 | ||
good night all & | 02:42 | ||
Auzon | bye | ||
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masak | I'm reading Damian's post tinyurl.com/5hm4ze | 11:52 | |
lambdabot | Title: perl.perl6.language | Google Groups | ||
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masak | and thinking "God help us if we don't do like that" | 11:52 | |
is his post the "latest opinion" in the matter, or has someone else's superceded it since? | 11:53 | ||
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pmurias | masak: if i remember correctly Manhattan distance is not used this days | 14:38 | |
instead an ambiguity error is raised if one variant is not stricly better then all the others | 14:42 | ||
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rindolf | Hi all. | 15:10 | |
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pbuetow | sup rindolf | 15:32 | |
:-) | |||
rindolf | Hi pbuetow | ||
pbuetow | i hope i ll do more perl this summer, no time for perl atm :/ | 15:33 | |
rindolf | pbuetow: I'm fine. More or less finished writing a new essay. | ||
pbuetow: called "Elements of Perfect Info-Tech Workplace". | |||
pbuetow: ah. | |||
pbuetow | rindolf: cool | ||
rindolf | pbuetow: what kind of Perl? | ||
pbuetow | rindolf: can i see it? | ||
rindolf | pbuetow: are you a student? | ||
pbuetow: sure. | |||
pbuetow: www.shlomifish.org/philosophy/compu...workplace/ | |||
lambdabot | Title: Index of /philosophy/computers/software-management/perfect-workplace, tinyurl.com/6o4kxz | 15:34 | |
pbuetow | rindolf: yes, and that's the reason why i dont have a lot time left for perl, i am wriiting my diploma thesis in java. | ||
rindolf | pbuetow: ah. | ||
pbuetow: I hope Java is not causing you too many problems. | |||
pbuetow | rindolf: "Objectoriented and synchronous Simulation of Protocols of Distributed Systems with GUI" <- Well it's not the official title, the official title is in german :) | 15:35 | |
rindolf | pbuetow: ah. | ||
pbuetow | rindolf: well i've no problems with Java, everything works well :) | ||
wow 12 pages | 15:36 | ||
rindolf | pbuetow: I recall a commercial network simulator back at the Com-Net lab in the Technion. | ||
pbuetow: the PDF? | |||
pbuetow | yes. | ||
rindolf | <pbuetow> rindolf: well i've no problems with Java, everything works well :) - ah, that's good. | ||
pbuetow | it's just a programming language. and i think, for this purpose (my thesis) java is better than perl. | 15:37 | |
rindolf: did you write it for fun or for $job? | 15:38 | ||
rindolf | pbuetow: for fun. | 15:39 | |
pbuetow | nice :) | ||
rindolf | pbuetow: and for profit. | ||
pbuetow: well, PageRank, publicity, AdSense, etc. | |||
pbuetow | rindolf: my simulator will be open source too. but i've to think about a license. maybe GPL. | ||
so it's good for publicity etc :) | |||
rindolf | pbuetow: I also wrote www.shlomifish.org/philosophy/compu...-software/ and publicised it. | 15:40 | |
lambdabot | Title: What Makes Software High-Quality?, tinyurl.com/5lxnq5 | ||
rindolf | pbuetow: got a lot of publicity from it thanks to OSNews.com and other places. | ||
pbuetow | ah cewl | ||
rindolf | pbuetow: ah, do you know what the implications of the GPL are? | ||
pbuetow | i read OSNews.com too :) | ||
rindolf: well, the main idea i know | 15:41 | ||
rindolf | pbuetow: well, I had a good experience in them accepting some of my submissions. | ||
Not all, but enough. | |||
pbuetow: you realise you can only link to GPLed code if the code is GPL-compatible, right? | |||
pbuetow | after my thesis is done, i ll translate it into the english language (at least the simulator itself and short howto's) | ||
rindolf: yes, but i am not using any library, instead of Java's stuff itself | 15:42 | ||
rindolf | pbuetow: you mean, the Simulator is in German, now? | ||
pbuetow | rindolf: yes | ||
rindolf | pbuetow: yes, but other people may wish to use your code. | ||
pbuetow: well, for standalone apps GPL is OK. | |||
But for libraries it may be probelmatic. | 15:43 | ||
pbuetow | yes. | ||
rindolf | In any case, I'm using MIT X11 for almost all of my code. | ||
Well, my original code. | |||
pbuetow | what is different from this lic? | ||
tmp.buetow.org/vs6.png <- first preview screenshot (after 2 weeks of heavy programming) | 15:45 | ||
rindolf | pbuetow: use.perl.org/~Shlomi+Fish/journal/36050 | 15:46 | |
lambdabot | Title: Journal of Shlomi Fish (918) | ||
pbuetow | in summer, i plan to extend Xerl (which is my own little perl script for my websites) so it can be used as a blog! | ||
rindolf | pbuetow: MIT X11 is practically Public-Domain. | ||
pbuetow: I see. | |||
pbuetow: ah. | 15:47 | ||
pbuetow: I'm looking for a Blog Engine now. | |||
pbuetow: but something more serious. | |||
pbuetow: I Also need comments. | |||
pbuetow | rindolf: Movable Type? | ||
rindolf | pbuetow: and categories. | ||
moritz_ | rindolf: livejournal? ;-) | ||
rindolf | pbuetow: I tried MT and didn't like it. | ||
pbuetow | hm! | ||
rindolf | moritz_: I'm already on LJ. | ||
pbuetow | rindolf: has it to be perl? | ||
rindolf | moritz_: but I want something I can put on my hosting. | ||
pbuetow: no, PHP and Py and possibly also Ruby can be fine. | 15:48 | ||
pbuetow | rindolf: my blog will be only usable via ssh and vi ;P | ||
rindolf | pbuetow: it has a weirdo static HTML caching thing. | ||
pbuetow: MT I mean. | |||
pbuetow | rindolf: i have Wordpress atm | ||
rindolf | pbuetow: and it created many world-writable files. | ||
pbuetow: ah. | |||
pbuetow: WordPress has a lot of bugs. | |||
pbuetow | every other week security update, sucks :/ | ||
rindolf | pbuetow: yes. | 15:49 | |
pbuetow | but i want to migrate to my Xerl Blog. if it's ready. | ||
rindolf | pbuetow: it it upgraded as part of the OS? | ||
pbuetow: ah. | |||
pbuetow: I'll try out some other engines. | |||
pbuetow | xerl.buetow.org | ||
lambdabot | Title: xerl.buetow.org - home | ||
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pbuetow | rindolf: if you do so, and like something, tell me :) | 15:49 | |
rindolf | pbuetow: sure. | ||
pbuetow: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MIT_License | 15:50 | ||
pbuetow | ah thx | ||
may be one license which would fit too | 15:51 | ||
rindolf | pbuetow: the MIT X11 is the exact opposite in its FOSS philosophy than the GPL. | 15:52 | |
pbuetow | i ll talk with my prof about the license. he just told me: public domain | ||
rindolf | pbuetow: it allows sub-licensing, which means you can make it proprietary. | ||
pbuetow: do they have the PD where you're at? | |||
pbuetow: MIT X11 is a pseudo-PD licence. | |||
pbuetow | PD? | ||
what's PD? | 15:53 | ||
rindolf | pbuetow: see the thread - use.perl.org/~Shlomi+Fish/journal/36050 | ||
lambdabot | Title: Journal of Shlomi Fish (918) | ||
rindolf | pbuetow: PD == Public Domain. | ||
pbuetow | ah, lol | ||
ok | |||
rindolf | pbuetow: where are you located? | ||
pbuetow | <- stupid | ||
rindolf | What do you mean by WDYM? | ||
pbuetow | rindolf: Aachen, Germany (Most west City of Germany, Near Duesseldorf and Cologne). Right next to Belgium and Holland. | 15:54 | |
rindolf | pbuetow: ah. | ||
pbuetow: so I don't think .de has a Public-Domain equivalent. | |||
pbuetow: you should use MIT X11 probably. | |||
pbuetow: if you don't want to use the LGPL, GPL, SleepyCat Licence, etc. | |||
pbuetow | yes, and no beer license (i will get drunk every day, because all students are supposed to use my software in the distributed systems class) | 15:55 | |
rindolf | pbuetow: ah yes, beerware. | 15:57 | |
people.freebsd.org/~phk/ | 15:58 | ||
lambdabot | Title: Poul-Henning Kamp | ||
rindolf | pbuetow: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WTFPL | 15:59 | |
pbuetow | rindolf: lol. hehe. | 16:00 | |
rindolf: small 'throw away' programs of mine are mostly beerware :) but until now, nobody gave me a beer :/ | 16:01 | ||
moritz_ | I actually published one (small) piece of software under the WTFPL | ||
rindolf | pbuetow: ah. | ||
moritz_: I see. | |||
moritz_: nice. | |||
moritz_: did you Freshmeat it? | |||
moritz_ | rindolf: no. It was about 30 lines of perl code | 16:02 | |
rindolf | moritz_: ah. | ||
moritz_ | something that painted a fractal in an unusual fashion | 16:03 | |
rindolf | moritz_: I once saw a really badly written Perl script on Freshmeat. | ||
moritz_ | rindolf: just one? ;-) | ||
pbuetow | lol | 16:04 | |
rindolf | moritz_: well, the one I looked at. | ||
moritz_ | could have been mine | ||
rindolf | moritz_: perl.org.il/pipermail/perl/2007-Dec...09338.html - search for rpmdig. | 16:05 | |
lambdabot | Title: [Israel.pm] Some Links Related to the Conference Today | ||
rindolf | moritz_: it's unlikely to be yours. | 16:06 | |
moritz_ | rindolf: I've freshmeated only one perl project of mine, and that has a Devel::Cover coverage of > 75% ;-) | 16:07 | |
rindolf | moritz_: ah, nice. | 16:08 | |
moritz_: HTML-Widgets-NavMenu used to have a D::C coverage of 100%. :-) | |||
moritz_: it used to have 297 (300 - 3) individual assertions. | |||
moritz_ | rindolf: my assertions are just "... or confess(...)" which naturally decreases coverage | 16:09 | |
rindolf | moritz_: ah. | ||
moritz_ | Math::Expression::Evaluator (my first cpan module) has 100% coverage if you don'T count assertions | ||
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moritz_ | but that's more of an academic exercise | 16:10 | |
rindolf | moritz_: ah. | ||
moritz_: I registered perl-speak.org/ yesterday. Hopefully tomorrow I'll start setting up a Drupal-based News+Blogs+Forums+Community site. | |||
moritz_ | anyway, I'm going offline now for some barbecue ;) | 16:11 | |
good luck rindolf ;) | |||
rindolf | moritz_: bon appetite. | ||
moritz_: thanks. | |||
moritz_ | merci bien | ||
pmurias | rindolf: what's the benefit of employes playing computer games at work? | 16:39 | |
rindolf | pmurias: not all the time. | 17:07 | |
pmurias: if they're responsible they'll still do a lot of work. | 17:08 | ||
pmurias: if not - they're not a good hire. | |||
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rindolf | pmurias: plus, doing non-work activities inspire the employees and gives them better ideas for how to be more efficient. | 17:18 | |
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rindolf | pmurias: at my previous workplace, I sometimes cleared my mind by playing Sokoban and PySol. | 17:18 | |
pmurias: they didn't like the fact that people went by and saw me playing. | |||
pmurias: because it didn't look like I was working. | 17:19 | ||
pmurias | i'm not suprised by this | 17:20 | |
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rindolf | pmurias: I didn't play a lot. | 17:21 | |
pmurias | at least for me computer games just tire me more, and people tend to assume other people function similarly to them | 17:23 | |
and solitare is the archetypical type waster | 17:24 | ||
rindolf | pmurias: I sometimes felt at work that "I need to play a game" and then I played it for a while (< 30 minutes) and then I felt I could start working again. | 17:26 | |
pmurias: for the record, I should say that they allowed browsing the Internet indefinitely. | 17:27 | ||
pmurias: and I could also talk on Freenode without a problem. | |||
In my current workplaces all ports are blocked except HTTP, HTTPS and SSH. | |||
So I use SSH port-forwarding to connect to Freenode. | 17:28 | ||
pmurias | if you were allowed to whatever you please at work, you should be also allowed to do all your task fast and go home early | 17:32 | |
rindolf | pmurias: well, normally there are more tasks to be done. | 17:37 | |
pmurias: I never had a case where I didn't have enough work to do. | |||
pmurias: not even when I was writing Perl. | |||
pmurias | yes, but a person who can work with the same efficiency as you withought making brakes should be allowed to have a shorter workday | 17:43 | |
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pmurias | mncharity: re "was working on" sorry for using the wrong tense ;) | 18:03 | |
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mncharity | pmurias: np :) | 18:20 | |
TimToady: If you would like to change the current "I find 'em, you fix'em" approach to STD.pm bugs, just let me know. :) | 18:36 | ||
TimToady: (14) stdstopper has a $ check, but if there is horizontal whitespace and/or a comment, that won't fire. | 18:37 | ||
re 14, hmm, or perhaps I'm supposed to be eating the ws elsewhere... :/ | 18:41 | ||
"every bit of whitespace magic is purchased with blood" | |||
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mncharity | TimToady: (14) can be disregarded. I'm still puzzling over the problem. 'sub f {} #x\n...' is failing in STD_red, unclear why. | 19:03 | |
TimToady: (4 addendum 2) also re fatarrow using <ident> for the key, there's also a ($var => 2) in t/blocks/sub_named_params.t . valid? | 19:04 | ||
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pmichaud | mncharity: ($var => 2) is valid Perl 6, yes, but I think that it may get parsed by infix:=>, if there is such a beast. | 19:14 | |
don't see it in STD.pm, though. | 19:17 | ||
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pmichaud | (that should be infix:sym<< => >> of course, but I don't have the ability to type the french angles in my current system) | 19:17 | |
mncharity | pmichaud: right, thanks. (4) may reduce to "there is no infix:[=>]" in STD.pm. just a p5=> . | ||
pmichaud | well, generalizing <key=ident> to be a full expression might be problematic, which is why I think it's likely to be a separate infix operator | 19:18 | |
and fatarrow handles the case of a bareword on the lhs | |||
mncharity | re type the french angles, I cut and paste them. :) hmm, I wonder what the "you have gnome+emacs, and wish to type X" real solution is supposed to be. | ||
pmichaud | in vim I just do ctrl-k+<+< and it works great. | 19:19 | |
I used to have X11 set up so that right-alt+,+, would do the same | |||
mncharity | that sounds like something for a "tips and tricks" page somewhere. | 19:20 | |
pmichaud | in vim, ":digraph" gives a list of the various special keyboard constructs (all introduced with ctrl-k) | 19:21 | |
mncharity | xahlee.org/emacs/emacs_n_unicode.html | 19:26 | |
lambdabot | Title: A Emacs ELisp A Day: Emacs and Unicode Tips | ||
mncharity | ctrl-x 8 < is « . nifty! danke. :) | 19:27 | |
rindolf | mncharity: CTRL+K < < | ||
vim FTW! | |||
Or « | |||
Compose+<+< using the X11 compose key. | 19:28 | ||
I like Ctrl+K better than the compose. | |||
But I don't always type stuff in vim. | |||
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mncharity | rindolf: tnx | 19:29 | |
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pmichaud | I used to have .xmodmap set up to assign my compose key to right-alt, but I can't find how I did that now :-( | 19:31 | |
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mncharity | oh, I had to do something like that fairly recently... let's see... | 19:33 | |
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pmichaud | I think "keycode Alt_R = Multi_key" | 19:33 | |
nope, that doesn't work. hrm. | 19:34 | ||
aha | 19:35 | ||
mncharity | xmodmap -e 'keycode 77 = Multi_key' | ||
pmichaud | keysym Alt_R = Multi_key | ||
works | |||
mncharity | 77 is numlock, which is a very poor choice, but that's the idea | 19:36 | |
ah, ok. win. | |||
pmichaud | now I can do Alt_R + < + < to get « and Alt_R + > + > to get » | ||
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pmurias | ruoso: why is the responder interface supplied to the Node seperatly instead of being taken from the invocant of the capture? | 20:47 | |
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pmichaud | TimToady: S02 has: $args = \3; # same as "$args = \(3)" | 23:36 | |
I can't find where that's parsed in STD.pm | |||
actually, S03 refers to prefix:<\>, but that appears to be missing. So I'll assume that's what is intended. | 23:38 | ||
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