»ö« Welcome to Perl 6! | perl6.org/ | evalbot usage: 'perl6: say 3;' or rakudo:, niecza:, std:, or /msg p6eval perl6: ... | irclog: irc.perl6.org/ | UTF-8 is our friend!
Set by sorear on 4 February 2011.
dalek kudo/nom: 6e78299 | tadzik++ | src/ (3 files):
Apply the doc trait only for the documented objects
 00:05
tadzik jnthn: there :) 00:06
jnthn yay :) 00:07
pmichaud \o/ 00:08
jnthn Grr. Getting a GC-ish segfault.
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jnthn oh...darn it. 00:22
Parrot hashes deep clone, don't they...
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pmichaud yes, they do. a shallow clone requires a manual binding 00:25
afk, dinner
jnthn Guess a bit of bloody consistency with RPA is too much to ask for :/ 00:27
But no, I have to waste more time on stupid decisions.
dalek kudo/nom: b1c1886 | jonathan++ | src/binder/bind.c:
Unlike arrays, Parrot Hashes deep clone, which does the very wrong thing if you just want shallow. Fixes nested signatures involving nameds.
 00:38
kudo/nom: 0d9382f | jonathan++ | src/core/Mu.pm:
Mu.Capture, which coerces to a Capture based on the public attributes.
kudo/nom: 65f9068 | jonathan++ | t/spectest.data:
Run S06-signature/tree-node-parameters.t
kudo/nom: 5972bb9 | jonathan++ | src/core/Any.pm:
Add eqv case for Capture. Oddly, if you try and eqv the same Capture with itself it comes back as False; I fear some list nommage is going on somewhere.
sorear jnthn: welcome to my experience with Parrot 00:39
TimToady: what's non-simple about try's catch?
jnthn sorear: Yeah. Well, I kinda don't have time to write a VM at the moment too. :) 00:40
Though I look forward to getting Rakudo running on more places :)
git st
oops
dalek kudo/nom: 3aafdc9 | jonathan++ | NOMMAP.markdown:
Update nommap.
 00:42
tadzik oh, pmichaud, I see you're assigned to Buf. You may want to check the nom-buf branch 00:44
[Coke] argh. I keep running a check out t/spectest.data, and before it finishes, more commits roll in. ;) 00:45
s/out/of/
jnthn I promise to sleep soon. But that still leaves night-owls and those in other timezones ;-) 00:47
dalek kudo/nom: e084f6a | jonathan++ | .gitignore:
Add Pod/To/Text.pir to .gitignore.
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dalek kudo/nom: 46c05e2 | jonathan++ | src/binder/bind.c:
Unbust hash part of |$c binding in signatures.
 00:55
kudo/nom: e606577 | jonathan++ | NOMMAP.markdown:
Another nommap update.
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jnthn sleep & 01:03
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sorear o/ colomon 01:14
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colomon \o 02:46
pmichaud 00:44 <tadzik> oh, pmichaud, I see you're assigned to Buf. You may want to check the nom-buf branch 02:51
I'm only the current listed responsible party... if you want to list yourself, that's fine.
basically I'm just committing to do it if nobody else does :) 02:53
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sorear o/ colomon 03:01
colomon \o sorear
sorear so I'm thinking about how to make general 'CATCH' work in niecza 03:02
and I'm a little bogged down in subtleties of SIMPLECATCH and co
implementing CATCH using the spec's rewrite seems quite insane 03:03
I'm thinking it needs to use a helper function, perhaps largely in C# land
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sorear What happens if a control exception is generated when there is an exception pending, or vice versa? 03:50
e.g. LEAVE { next; }
Where is everyone? 03:56
jasonmay boston
sorear :( 03:59
I can't get anything done like this :p 04:00
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TimToady you'd think it was a Friday night or somethin' 04:14
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TimToady LEAVE is not inside an exception 04:14
it's a stack unwind thing 04:15
sorear what happens if LEAVE { next } is reached while unwinding after a CATCH? 04:16
TimToady but in general, I think control exceptions probably trump pending exceptions
on the assumption that someone knows what they're doing
the point of unwinding the stack on an exception is to get to a stable state 04:17
and maybe they know which stable state they want better than we do
doubtless it can also be abused
that's just my gut reaction
open to arguments the other way
sorear if a control exception is reached during unwind, should that abort the unwind? 04:20
TimToady that's what I thought I just said 04:21
sorear there are a lot of confusing interactions here
TimToady: sorry, I didn't understand that
now I do
TimToady but the viewpoint of the current unwind state is more likely to know where the control target is than if we complete the unwind and then try to do the control
sorear what if the user has a control operator in a CATCH?
TimToady same deal, I think, except that the stack may be more deeply wound at that point 04:22
since the unwind hasn't happened yet
but a CATCH with a goto in it is no worse really than a try that throws away all exceptions 04:23
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TimToady that is, CATCH { goto Label } is no different from try {} goto Label if $! 04:24
assuming the label is lexotically known
it's possible, that there should be some controls on it to keep people from hurting themselves, but it's not clear what nature those controls would be 04:26
other than just saying, "You tried to do a control while unwinding, and now I'll unwind harder"
which seems...a bit stiff
sorear TimToady: what dynamic scope are LEAVE blocks executed from? 04:28
TimToady they are in the dynamic scope of their OUTER 04:29
that scope is not officially left until after LEAVE, and probably POST as well
just the flipside of what we were talking about with PRE and ENTER 04:30
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TimToady it would probably be very bad style to go back into that dynamic scope with a control exception though, without reentering from the top 04:36
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sorear TimToady: what if a regular or control exception is generated from a CONTROL block? 04:44
sorear ponders how to implement LEAVE blocks with re-entry capability.
pmichaud nom developers: Please don't push commits that leave new spectest regressions for others to have to find + deal with. Or, if you do, at least leave a note about it in the commit log. Otherwise the rest of us (i.e., me) spend hours trying to track down spectest failures that have nothing to do with the patch we just applied. kthxbye 04:47
sorear pmichaud: what about developers of other compilers who occasionally push changes to roast? 04:48
pmichaud changes to roast I can deal with.
I don't expect people making modifications to roast to have to test them against rakudo. 04:49
TimToady sorear: in that case the new exception takes precedence over the old one 05:00
dalek kudo/nom: 11d46b3 | pmichaud++ | src/Perl6/Actions.pm:
More hyper metaop code, still not complete.
 05:04
TimToady sorear: As my father used to say, "It's not what you do, it's what you do next." 05:14
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lue > use Numbers::Ordinal; 05:27
"load_bytecode" couldn't find file 'Numbers/Ordinal.pbc'
does anyone know of this? [Numbers::Ordinal is install in ./perl6/lib/Numbers/ as Ordinal.pm6 and Ordinal.pir] 05:28
*installed
*~/perl6/lib ... 05:30
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mberends lue: If you made the directories by hand, you may need ~/.perl6 instead of ~/perl6 05:40
lue: unsure, but try copying Ordinal.pir to ~/.perl6/lib/Numbers/Ordinal.pir
and some versions of Rakudo would not open the .pir file unless the .pm file was also present in the same dir 05:41
lue I'm sorry, I just realized I mean ~/.perl6 , but type ./perl6 instead :/ 05:56
[I'm using nom by the way]
.oO(why am I not typing the past tense today? *meant *typed)
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mberends
.oO( lue and time - always a risky proposition ;)
 06:47
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masak good morning, #perl6. 07:23
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sorear o/ masak 07:31
o/ moritz!!
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moritz \o 07:40
phenny moritz: 05 Aug 22:55Z <tadzik> tell moritz given github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/71df76fa1f and gist.github.com/1128691 do you see any better way to solve this but to sort the block according to their $/.from?
sorear moritz: it seems like I'm going to start playing with exceptions, X::Base, CATCH, and CONTROL in niecza Real Soon Now 07:42
moritz: I'm wondering if exceptions should be considered immutable, and when the backtrace is added. 07:43
for instance is the backtrace available at CATCH time?
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mberends o/ masak sorear moritz Su-Shee 08:00
masak Su-Shee moritz sorear mberends \o
sorear o/
masak it's the weekend, and I have no excuse for not being very active with YAPC::EU talk preparations. 08:01
mberends masak: \o/ 08:02
masak need to implement an airport.
mberends how hard can it be? ;)
masak it's not exactly rocket science. 08:03
mberends heh. spaceports, now that's more of a challenge 08:04
masak I wanted something that people are a bit familiar with, while also avoiding the almost-clichéd example of an E-commerce site. 08:05
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moritz sorear: sure it is available at CATCH time ... when else would it make sense? 08:13
dalek ecza: 7e257a0 | sorear++ | / (3 files):
Refactor unwinding through nested runloops; allows "last" in defaults, etc to work.
 08:14
moritz sorear: and while it makes sense to make some of the built-in exceptions immutable, I don't think you should prevent the user from throwing mutable exceptions
sorear moritz: what I'm really asking is whether die() does $exn.backtrace = ... or $exn .= clone(backtrace => ...) 08:15
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dalek ast: 9b9d276 | sorear++ | S04-exceptions/control_across_runloop.t:
Here is a test for last in an inferior runloop. May not be general enough.
 08:16
moritz sorear: I guess it does $exn.add-backtrace($bt)
sorear: so that the exception can decide what do with multiple BTs
replace the old one, or add to a stack
sorear that last commit will break a couple of spectests, since it fixes a bug that my eval_dies_ok relies on 08:17
tomorrow I'll redo it correctly, using CONTROL and CATCH, which I'll add 08:18
sorear -> sleep
kanishka I am trying to build a module .. how to test it with out installing it 08:20
mberends kanishka: saving the module file in the same directory as the test script should work 08:22
moritz make test 08:28
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kanishka got it 08:31
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masak 'make test' works, but only if you have made yourself a Makefile for your project. 08:54
yay, IRC logs are back! 08:58
moritz++
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tadzik hello #perl6 09:29
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jnthn morning, #perl6 09:36
sorear o/ jnthn
sorear cannot sleep
tadzik oh, I had this today too
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dalek kudo/nom: 3853e1b | jonathan++ | t/spectest.data:
Disabling S02-builtin_data_types/instants-and-durations.t - it reliably hangs for me during the spectest run.
 09:48
masak morning, jnthn. hello, tadzik.
masak wishes the sun were less prominent
jnthn huh, what, they forecast rain todya 09:49
masak hopes that comes true 09:51
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tadzik oh, here too 10:04
masak .WHEREFORE, I think, represents the pinnacle of trying to strain question words to fit on top of behind-the-scenes relations in the language. 10:07
mberends hello tadzik, jnthn
mberends is unhappy that in Win32, int is 32 bits and long is 32 bits also :(
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tadzik masak: can you translate that to me to some Slavik language? :) 10:08
sorear masak: you noticed that too?
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mux most unices are the same on x86 10:08
masak reasons it's bad, in no particular order: (1) "wherefore" means the same as "why".
(2) no-one uses the word, except for Juliette.
(3) it's exactly the kind of thing that Damian thinks is cute today.
(4) there's no *reason* for it to be named that. 10:09
I think I could almost make a better case for .WHOSE
it's that bad :P
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mux .HENCEFORTH 10:09
masak .HITHERTO 10:10
tadzik .BECAUSE
masak o.O
tadzik it's the opposite of .WHY, if viewed right :)
masak .WHYNOT
tadzik (or viewed wrong)
mberends .SOTHERE 10:11
tadzik .DOCUMENTEE
mux .INSOFAR
masak .NONWITHSTANDING 10:12
tadzik .THUS
mberends .DONTARGUE 10:13
masak .FURTHERMORE
tadzik .ILIKECHOCOLATEMILK
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masak is reminded of bash.org/?23396 10:13
TimToady: I like your thoughts about the PLAN phaser, but I'd like to bikeshed the name to EMPTY or DEPLETE or FINISH, to rhyme better with gather/take. 10:19
sjn .WTF # lists error messages related to the object 10:20
:-P 10:21
masak "What's The Failure" :) 10:23
tadzik makes sense
masak <sorear> Where is everyone? 10:24
<jasonmay> boston
*lol*
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dalek kudo/nom: 614236f | jonathan++ | src/core/Capture.pm:
Avoid usage of $capture.list eating the $!list in Capture by shallow cloning (pmichaud, please review).
 10:39
odel: ed14a43 | (Martin Berends)++ | c/t (5 files):
odel/c] get current time to microsecond resolution on unix and win32
 10:46
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moritz Ronja just ate her first grapes -- she complained when the supply wasn't fast enough :-) 11:29
jnthn :-) 11:30
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gfldex that aint no suprise: de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ronja_R%C3%A4ubertochter 11:31
or better: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ronia_the_Rob...s_Daughter 11:32
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masak gfldex: not sure I see the connection between that book and grapes :) 11:40
moritz the connection is ronja :-) 11:45
gfldex well, one could argue that being a robber is a complain against lacking supply 11:46
moritz :-)
gfldex and ronja knows no fear, not even of grapes
moritz it does sounds a bit far fetched though :-) 11:47
gfldex quite frankly, it is
dalek ast: b869db3 | moritz++ | S32-hash/pairs.t:
rakudo unfudges in pairs.t
 11:48
mberends afaik the only thing moritz steals is code ;) 11:53
moritz and ideas :-)
sometimes karma, too
masak it's true. 11:54
no-one has de-karma'd me as much as moritz has ;)
moritz masak: actually you have de-karma'd yourself much more often than I have :-) 11:56
masak oh, that's true. didn't consider that.
masak-- # too de-karma-y 11:57
oh wait :)
moritz gist.github.com/1129286
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masak oh, and jonalv :) 11:58
and egonw.
people from a different universe.
wow, there will now forever be a gist of "people who have taken karma from masak, and how much" :P 11:59
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pmichaud good morning, #perl6 12:36
jnthn morning, pmichaud
pmichaud is proud to not be on the list of people who have de-karma'd masak++.
tadzik good morning pmichaud
pmichaud jnthn: 614236f looks fine -- you're correct, the $!list needs cloning there. 12:37
jnthn pmichaud: Yeah, sorry about that.
pmichaud: I noted the problem in the commit message, though didn't really draw much attention to it...I'd planned to deal with it last night, then got sucked into the hash clone mess. :/
(The eqv commit message, that is.) 12:38
Turns out the Parcel.Capture hack was being relied on quite heavily.
pmichaud I'm surprised, actually.
jnthn So was I 12:39
pmichaud I suspect there were a lot of bogus Capture tests.
jnthn There were
Also, we didn't run most of autoref.t on master
At least, not the bits that were unfudged for nom.
pmichaud I've long felt they were likely bogus, but couldn't find any specs to prove it.
jnthn No, I ended up asking TimToady++
pmichaud Yes, I saw. 12:40
jnthn After an unsuccessful spec trawl.
I'm working on installable nom and modules.
pmichaud +1
jnthn Need to fix up nqp's own install and module search first.
(It pokes a bunch of stuff into the Parrot library directory, rather than the nqp language directory.) 12:41
Nested sigs are pretty much done now. We fail two tests in array-unpack.t but it's not nested signature's fault. 12:42
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dalek ast: fc2707f | kboga++ | S (7 files):
(un)fudge tests
 12:49
kboga does tree-node-parameters.t fail for anyone else? 12:50
pmichaud kboga: yes, it fails for me.
jnthn Works here 12:51
(the .rakudo)
pmichaud .rakudo fails here.
jnthn (the .t fails, but it works when fudged)
oh.
pmichaud Not enough positional parameters passed; got 0 but expected 2 in sub-signature of parameter %top
jnthn hm
aha!
kboga without that test running spectest now passes (here) 12:52
jnthn forgot to push
dalek ast: 83243d7 | jonathan++ | S06-signature/tree-node-parameters.t:
Fix signatures now positional named fallback stuff changed.
kboga yep it now passes, jnthn++ 12:54
jnthn sorry 'bout that
kboga no need :) 12:58
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JimmyZ wonders how many tests nom passed. 13:02
tadzik I think it's close to 9000 13:03
flussence github.com/flussence/specgraphs/ra...-tests.png 13:05
that answer your question? :)
tadzik oh, the graph is better and better! flussence++ 13:07
JimmyZ a little old
flussence (does anyone know why those numbers are lower than the ones on smolder.parrot.org/app/projects/smoke_reports/5 ?) 13:08
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tadzik the birth of nom looks really nice in gource :) 13:26
flussence I was looking at that the other day, it seems like rakudo gets a huge increase in activity around November each year 13:28
tadzik . o O ( No one's hacking on November )
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moritz flussence: the smoke reports includes skipped tests ass PASS, iirc 13:35
flussence ah
dalek ast: 9d302d9 | kboga++ | S09-subscript_slice/slice.t:
rakudo fudge in slice.t
 13:37
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moritz masak: fwiw those de-karma numbers are slightly bogus 13:51
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moritz masak: mysql's "like" search also counted lines with a whitespace between your nick and the '--' 13:52
masak moritz: oh! 13:53
I didn't know that about mysql's "like" operator. wonder what the use case is for that? 13:54
jnthn masak -- he didn't get de-karma'd so much after all!
flussence (people who don't use unicode em-dashes)-- # :)
moritz masak: pseudo-but-not-quite fulltext search
for example I searched for when pmichaud++ down-karamd me, and I found 13:55
<pmichaud> great job this week, moritz -- see you Sunday!
(that's from 2009-08-27)
:-)
masak .oO( passive-aggressive downvoting ) 13:56
moritz oh, and flussence++ for the nom spectest graph
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masak nom: role A { method foo { say "A" } }; role B { method foo { say "B" } }; role C does A does B {}; say "alive" 14:09
p6eval nom: OUTPUT«alive␤»
masak nom: role A { method foo { say "A" } }; role B { method foo { say "B" } }; role C does A does B {}; class D does C {}; say "alive"
p6eval nom: OUTPUT«Method 'foo' must be resolved by class D because it exists in multiple roles (A, B)␤current instr.: '_block3066' pc 48729 (src/gen/perl6-metamodel.pir:15135) (src/gen/Metamodel.pm:1432)␤»
masak nom: role A { method foo { say "A" } }; role B { method foo { say "B" } }; role C does A does B { method foo { say "resolving collision" } }; class D does C {}; say "alive" 14:10
p6eval nom: OUTPUT«alive␤»
masak and now in the master branch... :)
rakudo: role A { method foo { say "A" } }; role B { method foo { say "B" } }; role C does A does B { method foo { say "resolving collision" } }; class D does C {}; say "alive"
p6eval rakudo 922500: OUTPUT«alive␤»
masak huh!
rakudo: role A { method foo { say "A" } }; role B { method foo { say "B" } }; role C does A does B { method foo { say "resolving collision" } }; class D does C {}; D.new.foo 14:11
jnthn Not *everything* was broken in master :P
p6eval rakudo 922500: OUTPUT«resolving collision␤»
masak jnthn: I got the impression that the difference was between master and nom.
perhaps I misunderstood. :)
no matter. it's great. jnthn++
jnthn masak: tbh, I couldn't remember what master did. :) 14:12
masak hah!
spent too much time in perfect nommy-nom land. :P
nom really is already here, just unevenly distributed...
jnthn hopes he can beat NQP module loading into submission soon so that nom can distribute itself into install directories. 14:16
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tadzik yay 14:26
jnthn Well, I didn't manage it yet. :P 14:27
tadzik END { yay }
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masak KEEP { yay } # masak shows his innate pessimism :) 14:33
people, what is your favorite phaser? 14:39
tadzik #phasers :)
masak mine is either LEAVE or POST, I think.
tadzik oh
DOC INIT of course :) 14:40
moritz before I BEGIN, let me CHECK if my INITial KEEPers have arrived by POST
masak tadzik: :P
moritz answers with a junction of some sort.
jnthn BEGIN, because it means I can screw with the compiler internals. :) 14:41
tadzik nom: BEGIN { /\d/ } #hi hi
p6eval nom: OUTPUT«error:imcc:syntax error, unexpected DOT ('.')␤ in file '(file unknown)' line 68149218␤error:imcc:syntax error ... somewhere␤ in file '(file unknown)' line 68149254␤syntax error ... somewhere␤»
jnthn tadzik: you screwed it :P
nom: BEGIN { /./ } #hi hi
p6eval nom: ( no output )
[Coke] drinks koohii. 14:42
jnthn hm
It's char classes that bust it, huh.
tadzik not really 14:43
nom: BEGIN { <[0..9]> }
p6eval nom: ( no output )
moritz nom: BEGIN { /\s/ }
p6eval nom: OUTPUT«error:imcc:syntax error, unexpected DOT ('.')␤ in file '(file unknown)' line 450␤error:imcc:syntax error ... somewhere␤ in file '(file unknown)' line 486␤syntax error ... somewhere␤»
jnthn achievement! I broke NQP make install too 14:44
masak [Coke]: it took me a while to catch on to the fact that that's just "coffee" in Japanese. 14:45
tadzik yay, now both nom and nqp work the same way
now we just need to change the state of workingness :)
masak phenny: jp en "kohii"?
phenny masak: The jp to en translation failed, sorry!
masak phenny: jp en "koohii"?
phenny masak: The jp to en translation failed, sorry!
moritz phenny: "kohii"? 14:46
phenny moritz: Language guessing failed, so try suggesting one!
masak phenny: jp en "コーヒー"?
phenny masak: The jp to en translation failed, sorry!
moritz phenny: one "kohii"?
masak :P
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[Coke] phenny: en jp "coffee" 15:08
moritz [Coke]: need a trailing '?'
[Coke] phenny: en jp "coffee"?
phenny [Coke]: The en to jp translation failed, sorry!
[Coke] but, yes, those kana look right. 15:09
masak rakudo: say [+] 1..10
p6eval rakudo 922500: OUTPUT«55␤»
masak .oO( that kana be right ) 15:10
jnthn :P
jnthn drinks a kana ビール :P 15:11
[Coke] you'll rune the day you made that pun.
masak rakudo: say sum 1..10
p6eval rakudo 922500: OUTPUT«Could not find sub &sum␤ in main program body at line 22:/tmp/SbtEzz7O61␤»
masak maybe we should provide 'sum' and 'product' in the setting? :) 15:12
jnthn [+] and [*] are provided :)
[Coke] only knows one biiru. (sapporo)
masak jnthn: yes, I know. but it costs nothing to have the words there, too. 15:13
jnthn: Haskell has both foldr (+) and sum.
jnthn masak: It doesn't cost much, no. But what does it pay? :) 15:19
masak that's a motivated question.
jnthn: fac n = foldr (*) 1 [1..n] 15:20
jnthn: fac n = product [1..n]
jnthn: which one do you find easier to read?
JimmyZ I guess [*] 1..n ? 15:21
masak JimmyZ: right, that would correspond to the foldr one. 15:22
JimmyZ: Perl 6 provides the 1 as a default for *
jnthn masak: I don't find them all that different. The first means that if I know what foldr does then it's immediately clear what's going to happen. With product I could probably guess correctly if I didn't know.
masak jnthn: right.
jnthn: it's not a strong point but that's my point.
jnthn I suspect after a bit you memorize [*] as a word rather than as its pieces, though. :) 15:24
masak right. but with [*], the reader always has to do the chunking/unchunking herself, even when it's rote. 15:25
with 'product', you've abstracted away the chunking.
jnthn aye, it's just where to end 15:26
masak aye.
jnthn [==] could be all-numerically-equally 15:27
[<=] could be sorted
etc
:)
masak Perl 6 wishes to provide a "very big sweet spot". 'sum' and 'product' are very natural words from maths.
jnthn Yeah, they feel quite natural.
There's not much room to guess wrong.
masak rakudo: say [1..10].sum
p6eval rakudo 922500: OUTPUT«Method 'sum' not found for invocant of class 'Array'␤ in main program body at line 22:/tmp/CiqLyP3udv␤»
masak that could be useful, too. 15:28
as could .product
jnthn Well, yeah, if we're going to have a sub form we should have a method one too.
masak though my case for them is weaker, as they clutter the List class.
things in the Setting don't really clutter.
JimmyZ rakudo: say [1..10].[*]
p6eval rakudo 922500: OUTPUT«12345678910␤»
JimmyZ rakudo: say [1..10].[+]
p6eval rakudo 922500: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Unable to parse postcircumfix:sym<[ ]>, couldn't find final ']' at line 22␤»
masak JimmyZ: that's a slice, good fellow :)
rakudo: say [1..10].reduce(infix:<*>) 15:29
p6eval rakudo 922500: OUTPUT«No candidates found to invoke for method 'reduce' on object of type 'Array'; available candidates have signatures:␤:(Mu : Code $expression;; *%_)␤␤ in main program body at line 22:/tmp/aE7gZuaB9Q␤»
jnthn rakudo: say [1..10].&prefix:<[*]>()
p6eval rakudo 922500: OUTPUT«Could not find sub &prefix:<[*]>␤ in main program body at line 22:/tmp/Sa3BVitzS_␤»
masak rakudo: say (1..10).reduce(infix:<*>)
p6eval rakudo 922500: OUTPUT«No candidates found to invoke for method 'reduce' on object of type 'Range'; available candidates have signatures:␤:(Mu : Code $expression;; *%_)␤␤ in main program body at line 22:/tmp/m9f2wHXW32␤»
masak grr
rakudo: say (1..10).list.reduce(infix:<*>)
p6eval rakudo 922500: OUTPUT«No applicable candidates found to dispatch to for 'reduce'. Available candidates are:␤:(Mu : Code $expression;; *%_)␤␤ in main program body at line 22:/tmp/oxHd2suJq4␤»
jnthn rakudo: say (1..10).reduce(&infix:<*>)
p6eval rakudo 922500: OUTPUT«3628800␤»
jnthn You missed the nounizer :)
masak oh, 'course
jnthn++ 15:30
rakudo++
JimmyZ well, I'd like to say since we have a sub [*], we shoulde a [*] method ;)
jnthn OK, I now have installation to the point where it starts up.
:)
JimmyZ yes, we have, but different result
jnthn Only thing it doesn't do yet is locate its setting, but I didn't get to that bit yet.
The bad news is...that nqp builds are broken if you installed nqp. :/ 15:31
Darn bootstrap staging fun.
jnthn is once again happy that Rakudo is not a bootstrapping compiler, and builds on a smaller bootstrapped one instead. 15:32
[Coke] ooh, more tests passing. 15:33
JimmyZ but the goal is a bootstrapping compiler?
masak JimmyZ: method names have to be identifiers, and [*] isn't an identifier.
JimmyZ well, that's joke 15:34
jnthn JimmyZ: No, Rakudo being a bootstrapping compiler is not a goal.
Or at least, it's not a goal for me.
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JimmyZ that's the Perl6 project goal , iirc 15:34
jnthn No. 15:35
JimmyZ maybe I missunderstand
jnthn Perl 6 project goal is to create an awesome language. ;-)
[Coke] someone is working on a perl6 in perl6, but that's their goal. (ETOOMANYPERLS)
jnthn Right. :)
Of course I'm fine with people working on it. I just don't think it's the direction Rakudo should go in. NQP being bootstrapped, otoh, is a good thing. 15:36
masak [Coke]: I'm working on a Perl 6 in Perl 6.
[Coke]: for some value of "working"... :/
TimToady it's not awesome unless it's *possible* to write a bootstrapping compiler
that doesn't mean it has to be done that way 15:37
jnthn TimToady: I wasn't commenting on whether it's possible, just on whether I'd consider it desirable. :)
Yes, it absolutely should be possible. :)
And niecza++ seems to be demonstrating that it is. :)
TimToady where "possible" is defined as "easy" :) 15:38
not just Turing-possible
JimmyZ read some articles that said Perl 6 want to compile itself so Perl 6 can adapt to the theory of evolution :)
TimToady that's primarily talking about the parser 15:39
masak JimmyZ: yes, that's basically it. you can extend Perl 5, but not in all ways we'd like. Perl 6 is the "second try", in a sense, making things more extensible. 15:41
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dalek ast: 7672eb3 | Coke++ | S06-signature/unpack-array.t:
fudge for nom
 15:45
JimmyZ well, I am not that ambitious, I just hope some java project like solr/Lucene/mahout will be rewritten in Perl6, and in the future most people will use Perl 6 instead of PHP :)
JimmyZ washes
masak just saying the word "PHP" made you need to go wash? :P 15:46
[Coke] Does anyone require tools/test_summary to show work in progress, or would a dump at the end work?
dalek kudo/nom: b3a247b | Coke++ | t/spectest.data:
passed some tests, update failure modes
 15:47
JimmyZ well, it's 23:50 here :)
[Coke] (it would be nice if that test file ran tests in ||)
flussence [Coke]: I'm only using it for the last few lines of output, don't care what it does in the middle 15:48
[Coke] hurm. it does a LOT, though. ah well.
flussence: ah, so something like that that just gave you the summary would work?
that would be easier than redoing all of test_summary.pl
flussence more specifically, I'm using it for the $ENV{REV} thing 15:49
[Coke] can you gist the part of the output you care about?
masak [Coke]: I looked at '||' and was confused. '|' is more parallel than '||' nowadays :)
[Coke] is old school. 15:50
[Coke] thinks, geometrically, that you need at least 2 | to show parallel. 15:51
flussence it'll take a while to get that output, but it's just the thing starting at line 250 which outputs a line for docs/spectest-progress.csv
15:52 PacoLinux left
[Coke] oh, I don't think I'm running that by default. never saw it. :) 15:53
15:54 PacoLinux joined 15:56 Mowah joined 15:57 woosley joined 15:59 dual left 16:00 donri joined
JimmyZ is back 16:05
16:05 dual joined 16:07 whiteknight joined
[Coke] just ran a spec test (not with test_summary): 16:07
Files=369, Tests=10387, 908 wallclock secs ( 5.74 usr 2.69 sys + 1315.37 cusr 117.04 csys = 1440.84 CPU)
JimmyZ :D 16:08
kboga does this look sane? gist.github.com/1129444
masak kboga: yes. 16:09
kboga so that +$0 et al work
masak that's how I think of Match numification, at least.
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flussence huh, "Bad file descriptor at tools/test_summary.pl line 401." 16:13
JimmyZ thinks $!to >= $!from; in the Bool method should be $!to > $!from;
dalek p: 1f94461 | jonathan++ | src/ModuleLoader.pm:
Start to re-work module loading a bit in preparation for changing install approach.
 16:17
p: 7392f50 | jonathan++ | tools/build/Makefile.in:
Sketch out how make install should probably look once he changes all work.
p: c82c723 | jonathan++ | tools/build/Makefile.in:
Need NQP_LANG_DIR defined, of course.
masak JimmyZ: nope.
dalek p: 2ae55b1 | jonathan++ | tools/build/Makefile.in:
PAST library still needs to go in Parrot library directory.
p: 314b2df | jonathan++ | src/ModuleLoader.pm:
Remove debugging output.
p: 2bd6964 | jonathan++ | src/ModuleLoader.pm:
Unbust build after make install has been run. Essentially, the updated module loader dropped any --library far too eagerly - we use it for the bootstrapping rounds, so it needs careful attention.
p: 06b6cfc | jonathan++ | src/stage0/ (7 files):
Update bootstrap with updated module laoder; all seems well.
masak JimmyZ: think of /^$/
JimmyZ masak, then Match.Str.Numeric.Bool will not equal Match.Boll 16:18
masak, then Match.Str.Bool will not equal Match.Boll 16:19
s/Boll/Bool/
masak correct.
jnthn I don't think I'd expect them to
masak also, Match.elems.Num will not equal Match.Num
it's all fine.
jnthn Match.Bool is really "did the match successful"
dalek kudo/nom: 9bec8df | jonathan++ | tools/build/Makefile.in:
Start getting the install target more in shape - certainly not finished yet, and relies on NQP updates.
 16:20
kudo/nom: b4c471b | jonathan++ | tools/build/NQP_REVISION:
Get NQP installation and module loading improvements. With this, we now have a 'make install' that installs a Rakudo that will start up, though the setting and module installation is still to do. Nuking your install directory is recommended.
masak jnthn: in English, it's "WAS the match successful" :P
or "did the match SUCCEED"
jnthn oh my :)
masak is such a tease
jnthn Told you your English is better than mine :P
masak stick to lolspeak! :P
jnthn Match.Bool is like "CAN HAZ MATCHED!" 16:21
masak nods approvingly
JimmyZ don't like sometimes they are equal, sometime they are not 16:22
masak JimmyZ: I don't have a problem with it.
JimmyZ: that's what having several different aspects of a complex enough object will give you.
and Match objects are nothing if not complex.
they're Bools, they're Strs, they're Nums, they're Lists, they're Hashes...
or at least they have aspects of all of these. 16:23
flussence you can't expect type conversion to perfectly preserve all semantics, that's why we have types at all
JimmyZ well, maybe I just need time to like it :)
masak one could say that it's because they don't exactly *are* all these objects that there can be differences when you convert.
that sentence feels odd, but I believe it's correct.
jnthn masak: I...wtf. :) 16:24
masak ...maybe not :)
jnthn don't exactly are? :)
aren't exactly :)
masak oh!
right.
that doesn't put the emphasis on the copula, though. 16:25
jnthn No, true
masak I guess my sentence can't be expressed in contemporary English.
this happens to me a lot :P
jnthn Wherefore?
:)
JimmyZ well, you guys read my poor english too much, so you are following my poor english out of your control 16:27
masak JimmyZ: I admire your grasp at English. I know how much work it is for a 中国人 to learn to write that well. 16:28
JimmyZ well, the max english level is eight, I am only in the three level :( 16:29
most times I use dictionary
masak heh, who doesn't these days? :) 16:30
I need a dictionary for English too, it's so tricky.
JimmyZ well, actually, I can't speak in english and listen in english 16:31
masak at the same time, you mean?
or you mean as opposed to reading/writing?
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JimmyZ as opposed to reading/writing :) 16:32
16:32 SHODAN left
masak well, my spoken Mandarin really sucks. but give me a few days and even I can write an email in it. :) 16:32
JimmyZ didn't use any chinese-to-chinese dictionay ;) 16:35
for many years
pmichaud re-good morning, #perl6 16:36
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jnthn re-o/, pmichaud 16:37
woosley good morning #perl6 #english&chinese:)
masak good re-morning, pmichaud 16:38
JimmyZ sleeps
night 'all
jnthn o/ JimmyZ
16:38 JimmyZ left
kboga there: github.com/rakudo/rakudo/pull/34 16:42
masak kboga: merged. 16:43
kboga thx masak :)
pmichaud I think that method needs a "multi"
masak thank *you*.
pmichaud: oh, good point.
I can add it.
kboga well 16:44
it didn't compile with a multi
dalek kudo/nom: 66e0e4e | kboga++ | src/core/Match.pm:
add Numeric method for Match objects
kudo/nom: 6d7af58 | (Carl Mäsak)++ | src/core/Match.pm:
Merge pull request #34 from kboga/match-numeric

Match numeric
kboga Capture's Numeric doesn't have one either
pmichaud then there's a bug somewhere.
masak kboga: it didn't *compile* with a multi?
kboga uhu
masak kboga: did you write 'multi method'?
kboga yes
masak is surprised and confused at this 16:45
jnthn There's something up with proto auto-gen.
masak ah.
pmichaud there shouldn't be an autogen'd proto.
jnthn If there's an only somewhere in the hierarchy it gets upset.
pmichaud oh, then the problem is that Capture is missing its multi also.
kboga "Could not find a proto for multi 'Numeric' in package 'Match' (it may exist, but an only is hiding it if so)"
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jnthn Yeah, that's the one 16:45
pmichaud oh, then the problem is that Capture is missing its multi also.
kboga yes
pmichaud also, in general I prefer for methods of the same 'category' (like Bool/Numeric/Str) be alphabetized within that grouping 16:46
kboga grep 'method Numeric' -r *
looks like there are other non multi Numeric's 16:47
intentionally? 16:48
pmichaud I only see the one for Capture and Numeric
do you see more?
kboga Ennumeration also 16:49
and Numeric? 16:50
pmichaud I tried putting a multi there but ran into problems because Enumeration is a role.
(or something). So Enumeration is "intentional", at least for now.
kboga ah
ic
pmichaud Numeric.Numeric should probably be multi.
(and yes, I didn't see Enumeration in my list... thanks for catching that.) 16:51
kboga np, I was wondering if this was intentional, so thanks for the clarification =)
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kboga Should all "Enumeration:D:" be "::?CLASS:D:" in the Enumeration role? And if not, why not? 17:14
pmichaud the CLASS version seems like it would be lots better. 17:15
jnthn Should be the lcass version 17:17
Or it'll multi-sort weirdly.
kboga ok, thx, spectesting now 17:18
dalek ast: bb1b10f | kboga++ | S03-operators/range.t:
(un)fudge range.t
 17:20
kudo/nom: 033e420 | pmichaud++ | src/core/metaops.pm:
Initial version of hyper metaop. Mostly works -- doesn't support hyperop on hashes yet.
 17:23
jnthn \o/ 17:24
Down to (I think) one last issue before I have working installable nom.
dalek ast: 90755e2 | pmichaud++ | S02-names_and_variables/list_array_perl.t:
Unfudge test relying on hyperops.
 17:28
ast: 8ee25b9 | pmichaud++ | S03-operators/range.t:
Merge branch 'master' of github.com:perl6/roast
pmichaud do we really want to just be fudging tests (e.g., range.t) that used to work in master? 17:29
seems to me that we'd rather get nom to pass those tests than to fudge them out entirely 17:31
jnthn Yeah, these days as we work towards master we want to be doing that less, imo. 17:32
kboga oh, feel free to revert that commit
pmichaud as long as the fudge message contains "nom" I might be okay with it.
jnthn wonders if we'll somehow be able to get a diff of "tests nom fudges that ng runs and does not"
pmichaud then we could quickly ack for "nom"
jnthn: that diff is likely going to be difficult to get. 17:33
kboga if it was not the right thing to do
jnthn pmichaud: OK
pmichaud niecza: say RangeIter 17:34
p6eval niecza v8-38-g7e257a0: OUTPUT«RangeIter()␤»
jnthn Then we shouldn't rely on doing so :)
pmichaud hmmm
jnthn std: RangeIter
p6eval std 516268a: OUTPUT«ok 00:01 117m␤»
pmichaud nom: say RangeIter
p6eval nom: OUTPUT«Could not find sub &RangeIter␤current instr.: '_block1002' pc 74 ((file unknown):108) (/tmp/ytLX8YEXof:1)␤»
pmichaud nom doesn't have (or need) a RangeIter class.
jnthn There's only one mention in S02: 17:35
RangeIter Iterator over a Range
pmichaud right, and a couple of mentions in S03
ok '1 3' ~~ /(\d) . (\d)/, 'regex sanity'; 17:37
is ($0..$1).join('|'), '1|2|3', 'range from $0..$1';
I think this last test is bogus. Anyone want to disagree?
jnthn That'd be a string range, no?
If anything at all.
pmichaud I'm thinking it's a range of Match objects.
and Match doesn't define a .succ 17:38
jnthn *nod*
ah
Yeah
We could have an .. that's Any $a as Numeric, Any $b as Numeric I guess.
But maybe better to make people be clear about what they want.
pmichaud the spec is pretty clear about it already 17:39
sorear good * #perl6
pmichaud there's not a default conversion to Numeric -- it all depends on .succ
jnthn aha
OK, then the test is bogus.
o/ sorear
pmichaud o/ sorear
sorear niecza has RangeIter because I copied the Range implementation from master
pmichaud I started nom with a RangeIter, then realized that it made a lot more sense as Range. 17:40
sorear masak: the language code for Japanese is "ja"
masak d'oh
thanks.
phenny: ja en "koohii"?
phenny masak: "koohii" (ja to en, translate.google.com)
masak phenny: ja en "コーヒー"? 17:41
phenny masak: "Coffee" (ja to en, translate.google.com)
masak \o/
pmichaud \o/ masak++ sorear++
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pmichaud nom: my @one = 1; say ~(@one..3); 17:43
p6eval nom: OUTPUT«Method 'succ' not found for invocant of class 'Array'␤current instr.: 'postfix:<++>' pc 634027 (src/gen/CORE.setting.pir:149648) (src/gen/CORE.setting:847)␤»
pmichaud also looks correct to me, per the spec.
masak I'm guessing @one should numify through .elems in that case. 17:44
pmichaud the spec only talks about numifying if the lhs is numeric.
actually, I suppose it should die with a multidispatch error (mismatched types) 17:45
oh, wait, I missed a section. 17:46
"Smart matching against a Range object does comparisons (by coercion, if necessary) in the Real domain if either endpoint does Real.
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masak \o/ 17:47
pmichaud although there it's only talking about smartmatching, not about iterating. 17:48
so, reading the spec strictly, @a .. 4 would smartmatch as if it's @a.Real .. 4, but would fail to iterate. 17:49
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pmichaud TimToady: my $range = @a .. 4; say $range.min.WHAT; # what gets output here? 17:51
masak my vote is on Int.
pmichaud masak: in other words, the Range coerces when it's created? 17:52
(and we also coerce based on "either endpoint does Real"?)
I'm fine with that... just stating the outcome of your vote :) 17:53
tadzik masak: any ideas on the .WHEREFORE and misordering?
pmichaud tadzik: .WHAT is this ".WHEREFORE misordering" of .WHICH you continually speak? 17:54
pmichaud hasn't been following the .WHEREFORE issue closely.
tadzik pmichaud: take a look at github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/71df76fa1f346
and gist.github.com/1128691 17:55
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jnthn tadzik: It's just that you apply the doc trait in package_def, whihc runs after all ofthe things inside of the package. 17:56
tadzik: But you have $*PACKAGE and the doc string to hand way earlier than that :) 17:57
tadzik yes
jnthn So you just need to trigger something to attach the docs earlier.
tadzik yes, but I don't have a constructed object to put into WHEREFORE
jnthn Oh?
I thought that'd just have the package?
tadzik hmm
jnthn e.g. .WHEREFORE is jsut the module in this case?
tadzik mebbe
jnthn What have you got it as now? 17:58
tadzik yes, it's what you say, of course
jnthn OK
So that's what is in $*PACKAGE :)
See package_def in the grammar for when you have it. :)
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tadzik hmm 18:00
pmichaud ouch, there's a lot of code in package_def
tadzik subs can have a sub-subs, right?
jnthn tadzik: yes, that'll be a bigger problem.
pmichaud I would think that documentation would tend to get applied right around the same time the traits are applied.
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jnthn pmichaud: Yeah, but debatably we apply them too late at the moment. 18:00
(In some cases.)
tadzik that's what makes me wonder if your fix is worthwhile, if we'll have to fix it again anyway 18:01
pmichaud as long as the documentation is applied before any blockoid, we should be pretty safe.
jnthn Well, putting it in the package_def action method is always going to be too late.
tadzik pmichaud: due to how parser and action methods work, docs for methods get there before docs for the class
pmichaud tadzik: it's the same issue there as well.
you want the docs for the class to take place before its blockoid.
and not in its action method. 18:02
tadzik the only thing that comes to my mind is sorting declarator blocks by their $/.from
pmichaud tadzik: you're not following what jnthn++ and I are saying, then. :)
tadzik hmm 18:03
tadzik rereads
jnthn A <.attach_docs> in package_def an appropraite point could be all that's needed
pmichaud correct.
tadzik okay, I see the point. But is it always possible?
dalek ecza: 1ce800e | sorear++ | / (2 files):
Properly handle exceptions generated from LEAVE, including those that re-enter the associated block.
jnthn Not in routine_def and method_def yet.
Because we don't create the code object until the action method.
I'm pondering changing that though. 18:04
pmichaud I wonder if it could/should be attached to <.newpad> somehow.
sorear note that in niecza currently, foo: say "hi"; die pi; LEAVE { goto foo } prints hi twice
pmichaud that always seems to be a fairly appropriate point.
jnthn pads are all about PAST::Block though
sorear because a given LEAVE block is never invoked more than once for a given frame
jnthn We don't have an object yet.
sorear wonders if this is sane
pmichaud yes, but when we create the object, we could look at its PAD
jnthn True. 18:05
There may not always be a pad though.
#= thingy
has $!thing;
pmichaud actually, I suspect that the $*POD_BLOCKS.push should be separated from its attachment
i.e., we always push a $*POD_BLOCK when it's created (in its action method), but attach it later. 18:06
a dynvar could be used to keep track of the current pod block to be attached.
tadzik possibly
jnthn oh, so things declare a :my $*POD_BLOCK; if they themselves may get one?
pmichaud yeah, something like that.
jnthn And then take care of doing stuff to the "outer" one in the right order?
pmichaud the problem isn't in the attaching, it's in the order of the push. and the order of push should always be the order of declaration, iiuc. 18:07
jnthn It either should just be that, or needs to have the equivalent result. And of course, finding a way to Just Do It is generally better.
pmichaud yeah, sorting on $/.from is too much like "fix it up later" 18:08
tadzik abit
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pmichaud what creates/sets $*DOC, ooc? 18:10
dalek ecs: f0be5f1 | larry++ | S03-operators.pod:
prohibit only Range as endpoint of a Range

Used to prohibit Iterable, with the sad result that we couldn't't use an array for its size.
tadzik pmichaud: package_def for example 18:11
pmichaud it's just a string? 18:12
tadzik yes
(so far)
let me check if formatting codes may appear there
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tadzik declarator Pod blocks are syntactically like ordinary Perl 6 18:13
pmichaud what is $*POD_BLOCKS an array of?
tadzik single-line comments and embedded comments
that's a no I think
pmichaud: Pod::Blocks serialized
pmichaud can the Pod::Block be created by the action method for comment:sym<#=> ? 18:14
jnthn tadzik: I presume the actual objects, not the serialization code?
pmichaud instead of doing it in the document() sub?
tadzik pmichaud: possibly, but then the Pod::Block::Declarator needs a method to fill in the .WHEREFORE later 18:15
pmichaud if so, then that action method can also push it into $*POD_BLOCKS
tadzik yes
pmichaud and they'll be pretty much guaranteed to appear in $*POD_BLOCKS in the order parsed
tadzik jnthn: <compile_time_value> 18:16
bbkr1 is anyone working on BSON converter? if not I will try it (it will make MongoDB library implementation possible)
tadzik yes
sorear let's bikeshed. What should be the type and API of $_ in a CONTROL block?
pmichaud anyway, that's the approach I'd aim for.
it would also mean that unattached #='s still end up in $*POD_BLOCKS 18:17
(if such a thing is possible)
jnthn tadzik: That later attachment shouldn't be a problem.
So pmichaud++'s idea seems a good one.
pmichaud is .WHEREFORE the reverse mapping of .WHY?
tadzik yes 18:18
pmichaud ah.
jnthn ffs, Parrot's NameSpace PMC is a real POS.
tadzik pmichaud: my idea to rename that to .BECAUSE didn't find any understanding, suprisingly :)
pmichaud tadzik: .WHYNOT? ;-) 18:19
tadzik probably because it didn't start with .W :)
sorear .say for rx/Delete a file/.WHEREFORE;
tadzik Any() 18:20
pmichaud I think it should be called .JEOPARDY :)
(possibly obscure?)
although easiest would simply to say that a Pod::Block .documents something 18:21
i.e., given a Pod::Block in $_, .documents returns whatever it's documenting
tadzik so, to summarize: the document() sub finds the $*IMSOLONELY Pod::Block and sets its .WHEREFORE?
jnthn tadzik: Sounds sane. 18:22
pmichaud and also applies it to the declaration
18:22 woosley left
pmichaud (the thing being declared) 18:22
jnthn Aye
tadzik does the dynamic-variableness guarantee us that it'd be the right one?
yes, of course
pmichaud it should be at least as guaranteed as what you have now :)
I'm simply saying to keep track of the Pod::Block instead of its content string :)
jnthn tadzik: Tip: set the .WHEREFORE in the trait_mod handler that applies the doc. 18:23
pmichaud ooooh, even better!
tadzik yes, that's what I want
pmichaud jnthn++
jnthn tadzik: That is, it already makes the association in one direction, so just make it wire the other one too :)
tadzik oh, but wait
nono
.WHEREFORE is the Pod::Block::Declarator object
the class' .WHY is not a Pod::Block::Declarator, it's a string 18:24
jnthn oh
Why? :)
pmichaud classes have a block
tadzik my $chainsaw; #= This text stored in C<$chainsaw.WHY> 18:25
jnthn I'd kinda expect that for a docuemtned thing, $thing.WHY.WHEREFORE =:= $thing or so
well, maybe ===
pmichaud yeah, same here.
tadzik we can change that
then Pod::Block::Declarator can have an .Str or even be Cool
pmichaud I think I've pushed this a little better direction, hopefully. tadzik++ jnthn++ 18:26
now to reward myself with lunch
tadzik pmichaud++ # evenly distributed karma
pmichaud TimToady: (S03 Range change) ... should we also update the text to say that if any endpoint is Real, the Range is Real? 18:27
(the Range is a range of Reals?)
currently it's tied to the left endpoint. 18:28
TimToady yes, in fact this policy is already stated under smartmatching, so it'd be consistent
pmichaud right
just confirming that we're consistifying there :)
okay, lunch, then hacking 18:29
bbiaw
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sorear TimToady: what would you like to see in $_ in a CONTROL block? 18:32
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dalek ecza: 83bb53b | sorear++ | src/niecza:
Fix CATCH/CONTROL action methods; they are actually statement_control, not _prefix, oops.
 18:36
18:43 PacoLinux left
dalek ecza: 3421bd8 | sorear++ | src/niecza:
Fix duplicate CATCH detection
 18:45
diakopter sorear: btw, niecza built without a hitch on Windows under cygwin; I did have to do simple things like make sure git and mono were in $PATH 19:05
mberends diakopter++ 19:15
sorear yay 19:16
diakopter sorear: mono run/Niecza.exe -e 'say "Makefile".IO ~~ :z' # returns Bool::False... shouldn't it complain z method not found 19:19
sorear: actually IO ~~ :e seems to always return false 19:24
say "Makefile".IO.e # works though 19:26
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diakopter ah well, I won't explicitly target the spec tests which all use the ~~ form; I'll test with the . form 19:29
niecza: say "Makefile".IO.e 19:31
p6eval niecza v8-41-g3421bd8: OUTPUT«Unhandled exception: CORE IO.e may not be used in safe mode␤ at /home/p6eval/niecza/lib/CORE.setting line 0 (CORE IO.e @ 0) ␤ at /tmp/XU9eY3XiXM line 1 (MAIN mainline @ 2) ␤ at /home/p6eval/niecza/lib/CORE.setting line 1983 (CORE C930_ANON @ 2) ␤ at /ho…
diakopter oh; heh
sorear diakopter: I guess ~~ :e is being treated as ~~ Pair 19:36
diakopter was stuck at DFW airport for 8 hours yesterday; had to be deplaned from two different planes because of mechanical problems. all for a 40 minute flight. 19:38
sorear: how to fix the ~~ :e thing
sorear check if Pair defines ACCEPT 19:42
if not, add it
19:42 envi left
sorear look at what Rakudo does to see what it should do 19:42
probably something like method ACCEPTS(\$what) { defined(self) ?? ($what."$.key"() ~~ $.value) !! nextsame } 19:43
except that's not quite right, since it would make :e always true
19:43 kaare_ left
kboga github.com/rakudo/rakudo/pull/35 19:52
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dalek kudo/nom: f1de2a8 | jonathan++ | src/Perl6/ModuleLoader.pm:
Start to flesh out module loading a bit; make it pay attention to @*INC at least, and even failing that (due to no setting loaded yet) at least check installed locations.
 20:00
kudo/nom: e37f879 | jonathan++ | tools/build/Makefile.in:
Install CORE.setting.pbc, so we now at least find this when running from an installed version. Not quite there yet - we struggle with loading the module loader.
kudo/nom: 1119188 | jonathan++ | src/Perl6/SymbolTable.pm:
Make sure we can locate the Perl 6 module loader from the installation.
kudo/nom: e48d487 | jonathan++ | src/Perl6/ModuleLoader.pm:
Quick cheat for loading NQP::Metamodel in the setting; will un-cheat it in forthcoming modules work.
kudo/nom: d70d16a | jonathan++ | NOMMAP.markdown:
nom is now installable; update nommap. Again, nuking your current install directory is recommended if you didn't already do so with the NQP upgrade.
20:09 dorlamm left
masak pmichaud: yes, I'd vote for the array coercing going in rather than going out. 20:10
20:13 soupified2011 left
TimToady sorear: I'd think a control exception shouldn't be much heavier than a small integer; they don't have to be easily extensible by the user, and they want to be fast. So that's what I'd expect in $_. 20:18
just enough to run a switch
(assuming the control exception doesn't have to carry the return value) 20:19
nap & 20:20
20:20 im2ee left
[Coke] nom from earlier this morning: "total", 9385, 0, 392, 1090, 10867, 36394 20:20
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[Coke] (nom fudging) I have been using the string "nom regression" on those. 20:21
(to make them easier to find and fix later. in the meantime, better to /run/ the tests than to skip them entirely.) 20:22
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bbkr1 how 2 Buf objects can be joined? 20:23
moritz suspects there could or should be an infix:<~> for that
jnthn++ # making rakudo installable 20:24
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jnthn moritz: plz test :) 20:24
moritz jnthn: a say "foo" worked from outside the build dir 20:25
jnthn nom: say "I survived what jnthn did so far!"
p6eval nom: OUTPUT«I survived what jnthn did so far!␤»
bbkr1 rakudo: my $x = Buf.new([:16<02>]) ~ Buf.new([:16<00>]); $x.WHAT.say # does not work.
p6eval rakudo 922500: OUTPUT«Str()␤»
jnthn moritz: yay :)
moritz bbkr1: that's worth a bug report
bbkr1 can I append some values then to already created buf? I will report the bug of course but lack of workaround will stop my BSON project. 20:27
tadzik wow, what did I miss! 20:28
tadzik starts porting modules and panda
masak \o/
jnthn tadzik: er
Installable
Didn't do the non-pre-compiled case yet :)
sorear bbkr1: Buf in Rakudo is a thin wrapper around my Int @x 20:29
jnthn tadzik: Feel free to start porting modules. I'd hold off a little on Panda (more)
tadzik that's a good excuse to do the proper order of compiling stuff in panda ;)
masak diakopter: I just got my Sudoku solver to do a bit of solving: gist.github.com/1129521
(not committed yet. coming right up.)
jnthn tadzik: I'm still working out exactly how it will look, but I'm thinking the installer will just install the .pm files
tadzik: And we'll leave Rakudo itself to take care of the PIR cache. 20:30
20:30 molaf left
diakopter masak: cool! 20:30
[Coke] jnthn++
pmichaud++
jnthn tadzik: Otherwise people end up with pre-compiled files all over that are out of date with their current Rakudo install. 20:31
tadzik jnthn++ # this jonathan guy stealing all the karma 20:33
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moritz $ ls blib/lib/XML/Writer.pir 20:33
blib/lib/XML/Writer.pir
$ PERL6LIB=blib/lib perl6 -e 'use XML::Writer'
"load_bytecode" couldn't find file 'XML/Writer.pbc'
shouldn't that work?
jnthn moritz: In nom? 20:34
moritz jnthn: yes 20:35
jnthn moritz: May do if you turn it into a PBC
moritz the PERL6LIB is correctly added to @*INC
jnthn moritz: It goes through @*INC looking for .pbc
moritz: In theory at least.
moritz: I'm still heavily working on the whole module loading thing. 20:36
moritz: It's quite feasible we don't detect .pir stuff now
moritz doesn't work with .pbc either
ah well, will try tomorrow 20:37
20:37 kboga left
jnthn ok 20:37
jnthn takes a little break...bbs 20:38
sorear phenny: tell TimToady an unreified control exception in niecza contains an int, an optional Frame (for lexotic throws), and an optional string (label). Pass a tuple to CONTROL?
phenny sorear: I'll pass that on when TimToady is around.
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moritz jnthn: strace shows that nom never looks into directories that I add to @*INC or PERL6LIB 20:41
moritz -> sleep 20:53
20:53 moritz left
masak 'night, moritz. 20:55
dream of visits to the @*INC and PERL6LIB directories.
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bbkr1 what is the most proper way in P6 to express "defined $foo" from P5? 21:01
masak rakudo: my $foo; say defined $foo 21:02
p6eval rakudo 922500: OUTPUT«Bool::False␤»
masak dunno about 'most proper', but it gets you a Bool :)
bbkr1: by the way, welcome back. :)
21:03 huf left
bbkr1 indeed, defined works like in old school ... 21:03
masak we kept the parts that work well. 21:04
bbkr1 i'm also glad to get back to P6
masak P6 holds you in a soft embrace. 21:05
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bbkr1 oh, defined also works properly as a topic variable attribute now. given $x { when .defined { say "OK" } } works \o/ 21:15
tadzik jnthn: shouldn't we maybe install Test.pir in addition to Test.pm?
jnthn no
tadzik mhm
I just patched the Makefile to install Pod/To/Text.pm too, but shame it won't work :)
jnthn tadzik: Yeah, I'm working on modules thing 21:16
Though probably won't really land it until tomorrow.
tadzik no hurry
masak is glad tadzik went with a capital 'T' in 'To' 21:17
bbkr1: it's a method, yes. 21:18
rakudo: my $foo; say $foo.defined 21:19
p6eval rakudo 922500: OUTPUT«Bool::False␤»
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masak lue! \o/ 21:19
lue hello world! o/
masak turns on the groovy music
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lue I just saw the git log, nom is installable! \o/ 21:20
tadzik jnthn: compiling the setting seems to segfault randomly to me :/
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jnthn tadzik: huh? :/ 21:22
tadzik: Got local patches?
tadzik jnthn: no that I know of
21:23 molaf joined
lue I noticed MAIN doesn't work yet (at least I did last night), the error complains about a nonexistent MAIN_HELPER routine. 21:24
tadzik yeah, I almost brought that to work
21:26 soupified2011 joined
tadzik make: *** [CORE.setting.pbc] Bus error 21:26
wtf
jnthn :/
tadzik maybe I should stop recompiling Parrot
bleh, it failed for like 4th time in a row. I'll try in a gdb 21:34
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tadzik jnthn: gist.github.com/1129777 21:38
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jnthn Holy shit! 21:39
*sigh* 21:40
tadzik: Is it random? 21:41
tadzik jnthn: I'll rerun
dunno what caused that, the nom changes, the nqp changes or the parrot changes :/ 21:42
bbkr1 does anyone need Mac OS X environment? I just set up shiny Lion 10.7 server so if you need free shell to test your modules compatibility leave me message on GitHub (user bbkr). 21:43
jnthn tadzik: It bothers me that we're hitting that clone case.
21:44 im2ee left, Psyche^ joined
mberends bbkr: I'd like to use an OS X shell account for compatibility testing 21:47
jnthn tadzik: Do you have the gdb foo to work out what _pmc is in thaw?
*fu
21:47 Patterner left, Psyche^ is now known as Patterner
tadzik no, I don't think so 21:48
[Inferior 1 (process 29404) exited normally] 21:49
lucky :)
dalek ast: e0a9375 | Coke++ | S03-operators/range.t:
unfudge a bit for nom
 21:51
[Coke] pmichaud++ hyper meta op bought us back some tests. 21:52
dalek kudo/nom: 0c336ba | Coke++ | t/spectest.data:
run more spectests, track failure modes
 21:53
jnthn tadzik: Got something here. 21:56
tadzik oh?
bbkr1 mberends: sure, I'l post you login details on GitHub. 10 minutes.
jnthn tadzik: Yeah, the trace gave me a good lead. Thanks. 21:58
tadzik you're welcome :) 21:59
22:00 MayDaniel left
dalek kudo/nom: 397cf71 | tadzik++ | tools/build/Makefile.in:
Install Pod/To/Text.pm along with Test.pm
 22:00
22:03 soupified2011 left 22:04 soupified2011 joined 22:05 soupified2011 left
bbkr1 mberends: details sent via GitHub, please confirm if login works. 22:06
22:06 soupified2011 joined
jnthn tadzik: Think it's led me to a performance bug. 22:06
tadzik good :)
nom: sub foo(Bool :$alpha) { my $binary = $alpha ?? 'alpha' !! 'perl6'; }; foo() 22:07
p6eval nom: OUTPUT«"load_bytecode" couldn't find file 'CORE.setting.pbc'␤current instr.: 'nqp;Perl6;ModuleLoader;_block1137' pc 3132 (src/gen/perl6-moduleloader.pir:1248) (src/Perl6/ModuleLoader.pm:136)␤»
tadzik meh
jnthn Maybe multiple. SixModelObject's clone v-table should never have really been called. Turns out in some places hashes get deep-cloned when shallow woulda done.
evalbot rebuild nom
p6eval OK (started asynchronously)
tadzik > sub foo(Bool :$alpha) { my $binary = $alpha ?? 'alpha' !! 'perl6'; }; foo()
Cannot unbox type object to a native integer
works fine when omitting Bool 22:08
how do I fix this? :)
jnthn Bool.Bool maybe wants :D
tadzik Boo!
> my $a = True; $a.Bool 22:09
True
oh, :D
I thought you were laughing...
jnthn no, I meant, like, Bool:D as invocant :P
tadzik multi method Bool(Bool:D:) { self }
looks fine, what is the trailing :?
mberends bbkr1: thanks, logged in, password changed :-)
jnthn Means it's the invocant
Oh, that already looks fine. Hm 22:10
tadzik ok
jnthn tadzik: Way does say ?Bool do?
or if Bool { say 42 }
*What
22:10 dorlamm left
tadzik > say ?Bool 22:11
Bool::False
> if Bool { say 1}
Cannot unbox type object to a native integer
gotcha
jnthn aha
oh
lue blog post! rdstar.wordpress.com/2011/08/06/id...ve-perl-6/
jnthn BOOTSTRAP.pm, look for get_bool v-table override in Bool
tadzik unbox_i 22:12
rong?
should be nqp::p6bool maybe?
jnthn It's fine, just not when the thing isn't defined :)
tadzik oh :)
jnthn No, this is the low-level thingy that breaks the booleanization circularity. :) 22:13
tadzik (:
black magic
jnthn Yeah
tadzik how do I fix this?
$self.defined ?? ... !! ...
or so?
jnthn no
repr::defined__IP($self) ?? unboxi ... !! 0 22:14
gah
tadzik I get it
jnthn pir::repr_defined__IP I meant
masak lue: nice to see you back to blogging. 22:18
tadzik lue: nice post :) In addition to the graph, how about documenting the standard methods in a nice way?
[Coke] if I want to try adding a glob sub, but not put it in the setting to start... where to put it? 22:19
lue It's been forever since I've done anything P6, that's likely part of the reason why I'm scared of nom. Just trying to ease into it.
tadzik [Coke]: File::Glob or so? 22:20
lue: nom is very friendly :)
lue tadzik: That's another good idea. I've actually thought of adding a fourth group of documents to the synopses, in addition to the Synopses, Apcolypses, and Exegeses, that explains the S's in easy to understand language 22:21
(like Exegesis does for Apcolypse)
tadzik one day it should be possible to do this in the setting :)
and be able to do &sort.WHY and so 22:22
[Coke] er... /global/
tadzik oh
jnthn [Coke]: What do you mean by "global"?
[Coke] I want to prototype, e.g. "cosh"
tadzik put it in any module and make it 'is export'? Not sure if I understand correctly
jnthn
.oO( dang, I thought we were getting an implementation of &glob :P )
 22:23
[Coke] maybe later. :P
tadzik nom: module Foo { sub cosh is export { 1 } }; cosh()
p6eval nom: OUTPUT«"load_bytecode" couldn't find file 'CORE.setting.pbc'␤current instr.: 'nqp;Perl6;ModuleLoader;_block1137' pc 3132 (src/gen/perl6-moduleloader.pir:1248) (src/Perl6/ModuleLoader.pm:136)␤»
jnthn [Coke]: Why not just write a sub cosh() { ... }?
lue I've already figured the type hierarchy isn't documented in one nice little section of a spec, is it?
tadzik bleh
jnthn [Coke]: Are you wanting to implement it in order to get some tests passing?
[Coke] jnthn: yes, where? (I'm trying to avoid having the setting recompile on me)
jnthn: yes.
jnthn [Coke]: Take a copy of the test file and just write a sub cosh at the top of it? :) 22:24
[Coke] the trig tests look like LHF at the moment.
jnthn: ... I'll just put it where I think it goes. :P
jnthn Or put them in a module, mark them is export, pre-compile the module to PIR 22:25
And then use ThatModule
tadzik: Think I have a patch towards helping the segfault. 22:27
tadzik yay
jnthn tadzik: Bad news is that it's to something in the Parrot repo so it'll be version bumps all the way down.
tadzik no problem :) 22:28
jnthn Also adding a sanity check to make sure we don't accidentally run into this kinda thing again.
[Coke] jnthn++ #fixing parrot b00gs. I appreciate it. 22:29
jnthn [Coke]: PAST::Compiler one 22:30
tadzik oh, benabik is gonna be happy :P
jnthn l(
er
;)
[Coke] kboga: I think I manually applied some of your pull requests without seeing your pull requests.
kboga++
jnthn kboga++
kboga np, those were just test enable's anyway :) 22:31
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kboga credit goes out to pmichaud++ all the way for his work on the metaops 22:32
[Coke] aye.
[Coke] wonders if his newish work laptop (win7) compiles perl6 faster than his older mac osx desktop. 22:33
tadzik heh, I tried to continue my gsoc work when my laptop was broken. My PC needed 30 minutes to compile nom :) 22:34
[Coke] yah, that's why I was trying to avoid putting anything in the setting until I was ready. ;) 22:36
tadzik nom: say 1
p6eval nom: OUTPUT«"load_bytecode" couldn't find file 'CORE.setting.pbc'␤current instr.: 'nqp;Perl6;ModuleLoader;_block1137' pc 3132 (src/gen/perl6-moduleloader.pir:1248) (src/Perl6/ModuleLoader.pm:136)␤»
tadzik aroo
kboga S03-metaops/cross.t passes all but one test that was marked todo for master (but now segfaults), skip with 'nom regression' message? 22:37
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kboga nom: my @result = [~]«( <a b> X, <1 2> ); 22:37
p6eval nom: OUTPUT«"load_bytecode" couldn't find file 'CORE.setting.pbc'␤current instr.: 'nqp;Perl6;ModuleLoader;_block1137' pc 3132 (src/gen/perl6-moduleloader.pir:1248) (src/Perl6/ModuleLoader.pm:136)␤»
jnthn kboga: It'd be nice to know the segfaulting code
tadzik 'bababa $binary foo'.subst('$binary', 'fasada') hangs on nom, it seems 22:39
rakudo: say 'bababa $binary foo'.subst('$binary', 'fasada')
p6eval rakudo 922500: OUTPUT«bababa fasada foo␤»
kboga oh no, my bad no segfault, mixed it up with something else 22:40
jnthn ah, OK :)
tadzik is there augment in nom? 22:41
jnthn no
kboga anyways the test is currently todo with this message: "Not at all clear if this test is correct or not"
tadzik I wonder which part of Str.subst hangs 22:42
rakudo: 'asd $binary foo'.match('$binary'); say 1
p6eval rakudo 922500: OUTPUT«1␤»
tadzik ok, that was easy :)
that one hangs on nom 22:43
kboga nom: ( <a b> X, <1 2> ).perl 22:45
p6eval nom: OUTPUT«"load_bytecode" couldn't find file 'CORE.setting.pbc'␤current instr.: 'nqp;Perl6;ModuleLoader;_block1137' pc 3132 (src/gen/perl6-moduleloader.pir:1248) (src/Perl6/ModuleLoader.pm:136)␤»
lue afk
22:46 PacoLinux__ joined, PacoLinux left, PacoLinux__ is now known as PacoLinux
[Coke] jnthn: do you find that nmake on windows is rebuilding things it shouldn't? 22:47
(I just built rakudo, fine. I then immediately ran "nmake spectest" and it started rebuilding again, including the setting. 22:48
tadzik oh the pain
jnthn [Coke]: Yes :(
[Coke]: I tracked it down to $(DYNOPS) 22:49
But no further
:(
Spent a while on it but no joy.
dalek kudo/nom: 6d7cf62 | tadzik++ | src/Perl6/Metamodel/BOOTSTRAP.pm:
Fix Bool.get_bool vtable mapping, jnthn++
jnthn hmm. Why does git describe --match RELEASE* fail in Parrot repo? 22:52
tadzik dunno
jnthn: any performance wins in the last commit?
jnthn tadzik: Probably not really
tadzik: It saves enabling/disbling GC a load
May help a bit
Should save some allocations at least
Most importantly, we don't take the segfaulty code path any more :) 22:57
tadzik yay :) 22:58
jnthn Seems the issue has been there ages and we just got the memory alignment and bad luck to hit it today
[Coke] jnthn: think found the problem.
(with namke)
jnthn [Coke]: Ooh!
++[Coke] 22:59
I'd *love* a patch for that :)
[Coke] working on it. 23:00
jnthn huh what... 23:02
When I configure NQP with latest build Parrot I get "Unrecognized revision specifier 'show'"
[Coke] testing... dinner time, though 23:05
masak jnthn: sounds like bad parsing of git output somewhere. 23:06
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jnthn masak: seems so, I nuked the repo and cloned afresh and things are better. 23:14
oh, no
23:15 PacoLinux left
jnthn hmm, and even when Parrot builds and installs and nqp builds, the build fails and the produced nqp executable won't run :/ 23:15
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jnthn :/ 23:31
Could somebody else try building nqp on latest Parrot?
Here it does with "Null PMC access in set_integer_native()" towards the end of the build.
tadzik ooh, spectest all clean 23:32
jnthn: trying
jnthn Curiously, running the PBC works, just not the executable. 23:33
tadzik jnthn: seems to work fine 23:35
just did make clean; make
jnthn tadzik: ah, something musta been dirty here 23:37
Just finished a successful build.
tadzik: Thanks
tadzik no problem
my eyes autoclose, sleepytime is near
jnthn :) 23:38
same here
Can get the nqp version bump in though first :)
23:40 molaf joined
dalek p: ed093d3 | jonathan++ | tools/build/PARROT_REVISION:
Bump PARROT_REVISION to get PAST::Compiler tweak.
 23:47
p: 265a34e | jonathan++ | src/pmc/sixmodelobject.pmc:
Throw an exception if the clone vtable is called on a 6model object - it doesn't support it in any sane way (yet) and the default does insane things.
[Coke] jnthn: back from dinner. initial attempt buggy, retrying. 23:48
23:48 bbkr1 left, bbkr1 joined
[Coke] the nqp version got bumped, but rakudo's nqp version didn't. 23:57
perl6lexpad.c: In function ‘Parrot_Perl6LexPad_set_pointer_orig’:
perl6lexpad.c:618: warning: request for implicit conversion from ‘void *’ to ‘const struct PMC *’ not permitted in C++
jnthn [Coke]: Not pushed yet, just making sure Rakudo builds :)
[Coke]: Ah, one of those errors... 23:58
[Coke] k. I have a fix for the makefile. testing on os x before pushing.
jnthn [Coke]: I've little idea what to do about those - I trust a C++ hacker can supply a patch some day. :)
23:58 PacoLinux__ joined 23:59 PacoLinux left, PacoLinux__ is now known as PacoLinux, Moukeddar left, sftp left, sftp joined

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