»ö« Welcome to Perl 6! | perl6.org/ | evalbot usage: 'perl6: say 3;' or rakudo:, niecza:, std:, or /msg camelia perl6: ... | irclog: irc.perl6.org | UTF-8 is our friend!
Set by sorear on 25 June 2013.
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TimToady .pong 00:24
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[Coke] updated gist.github.com/coke/5879701 01:27
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[Coke] .tell lizmat S02-names/is_default.rakudo.jvm aborted 114 test(s) 02:46
yoleaux [Coke]: I'll pass your message to lizmat.
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[Coke] here's a rakudo-jvm bug: IO::Spec::Win32.abs2rel('/a'); - throws an error about not finding 'match' 03:09
rakudo: IO::Spec::Win32.abs2rel('/a');
camelia rakudo afe36d: ( no output )
[Coke] rakudo: IO::Spec::Win32.abs2rel('/a')
camelia rakudo afe36d: ( no output )
[Coke] (whoops)
benabik r: IO::Spec::Win32.abs2rel('/a').say
camelia rakudo afe36d: OUTPUT«..\..\a␤»
[Coke] r: say "that's about {33+19} tests more..." 03:17
camelia rakudo afe36d: OUTPUT«that's about 52 tests more...␤»
[Coke] zzz 03:20
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lue rn: sub infix:<IFSO OTHERWISE>($a, $b, $c) { $a ?? $b !! $c }; say 1 IFSO 2 OTHERWISE 3 03:33
camelia niecza v24-90-gd827fa8: OUTPUT«Unhandled exception: No value for parameter '$c' in 'infix:<IFSO OTHERWISE>'␤ at /tmp/XXgQDasMgd line 0 (infix:<IFSO OTHERWISE> @ 1) ␤ at /tmp/XXgQDasMgd line 1 (mainline @ 4) ␤ at /home/p6eval/niecza/lib/CORE.setting line 4579 (ANON @ 3) ␤ at /home/p6…
..rakudo afe36d: OUTPUT«===SORRY!=== Error while compiling /tmp/PJVGEK_bWq␤Two terms in a row␤at /tmp/PJVGEK_bWq:1␤------> >($a, $b, $c) { $a ?? $b !! $c }; say 1 ⏏IFSO 2 OTHERWISE 3␤ expecting any of:␤ postfix␤ infix stopper␤ i…
lue :/
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benabik Trinary isn't supported that wawy. 03:35
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benabik ?? !! has a custom parse in the grammar 03:35
lue S02:3250 suggests differently. 03:36
synopsebot Link: perlcabal.org/syn/S02.html#line_3250
lue (although I'd instead vouch for an incircumfix category, as opposed to overloading infix with that ternary notion) 03:37
benabik Erm. That is how the _name_ is parsed. 03:38
But Perl6::Grammar doesn't translate that name to a trinary op. 03:39
lue Not that I expected it to work, but that S02 line feels incredibly misleading. 03:40
benabik Eventually you might be able to do something weird like infix:<<A B>> is parsed(/'A' <expr> 'B'/)
It might be better to use a (post)circumfix:<< >> as an example instead. 03:41
lue circumfix would be the easiest example. I think I'll change it. 03:42
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dalek ecs: ccc6176 | lue++ | S02-bits.pod:
[S02] Replace misleading example

Specifically, infix:<?? !!> wrongly implies that you can implement ternary operators in this fashion, when it reality it's much more complex a task. This example was thus replaced with a situation where multi-element operator names makes sense (circumfix:«<< >>»).		 03:46
benabik Hm. I hadn't actually expected you to use circumflex:«<< >>», but it works. :-D
lue++ # finding and removing confusion 03:47
lue I was going to do circumfix:<( )> or similar but I think part of the point of that example was to demonstrate the possibility of multi-char multi-element names (thus emphasize the need for the separating space in <> form). 03:48
benabik fair
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TimToady umm, << >> is not a circumfix 04:57
benabik Details. 04:58
TimToady it's a quoter
it's not a circumfix unless it takes an EXPR in the middle
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dalek : 61eb362 | (Tobias Leich)++ | / (2 files):
return subcaptures if applicable
 06:32
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FROGGS jnthn / masak: I'd like to create a (perl5-ish) nqp::pack and nqp::unpack like we did for sprintf, would that be okay? 07:43
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moritz_ \o 08:08
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FROGGS moin moritz 08:08
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lizmat morning all 08:55
yoleaux 02:46Z <[Coke]> lizmat: S02-names/is_default.rakudo.jvm aborted 114 test(s)
lizmat .tell [Coke]: I have no idea: 114 is *all* tests. on parakudo it says: Files=1, Tests=114, 3 wallclock secs ( 0.03 usr 0.00 sys + 2.75 cusr 0.17 csys = 2.95 CPU) 08:56
yoleaux lizmat: What kind of a name is "[Coke]:"?!
lizmat .tell [Coke] I have no idea: 114 is *all* tests. on parakudo it says: Files=1, Tests=114, 3 wallclock secs ( 0.03 usr 0.00 sys + 2.75 cusr 0.17 csys = 2.95 CPU)
yoleaux lizmat: I'll pass your message to [Coke].
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lizmat FROGGS: fwiw, that seems like an excellent ide 09:14
a
FROGGS yeah, because v5 contains an improved pack/unpack, and it should be faster when it was in nqp 09:15
lizmat would v5 be able to use that as well then? 09:16
FROGGS it would... btw, nqp::sprintf gave v5 about 1000 passing tests 09:17
masak good antenoon, #perl6 09:25
lizmat masak /o
masak /o\ 09:27
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jnthn morning, #perl6 09:27
masak .oO( at least I'm here before jnthn... ) :P 09:28
lizmat hopes jnthn got some serialize_tc inspiration...
jnthn took advantage of being able to sleep in, given he has to get up and teach all 5 days next week... 09:29
lizmat oooh wow 09:30
masak has it easy, only has to teach 4 days next week ;) 09:34
jnthn It's almost like it's autumn :P
masak .oO( and boy do we "fall" for that, ever time ) :P 09:35
jnthn *groan*
jnthn springs to the coffee machine
masak ...and we're fresh out of season-related puns. 09:36
lizmat nuts, we'll soon have nuts!
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masak no, that's a squirrel-related pun at best :P 09:37
arnsholt Definitely seasonal, I'd say =p 09:39
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masak .oO( fair enough. let's pick nuts, not pick nits ) 09:40
arnsholt We could also go nuts 09:42
But maybe not bananas
arnsholt ponders when bananas are actually in season 09:43
jnthn
.oO( bananaphobe... )
arnsholt Gee, thanks. There goes that day's worth of music listening ^_^ 09:44
jnthn bwahaha
lizmat
.oO( what would a movie called "Bananarama 3D" be like )
arnsholt And from that song, I remembered spotify:track:0PCyUmv2yn4h82GOZ6SKNT. Yet another hit from the early days of my internet career 09:46
masak arnsholt: I have no idea how to visit that resource specifier. 09:48
arnsholt Put it into your spotify client's search field (less the period, which is sentence final) 09:49
Although to be fair, the proper proper link is www.albinoblacksheep.com/flash/french 09:50
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jnthn
.oO( Let it be Rick Astley, let it be Rick ... )
 09:50
masak arnsholt: oh, that one :)
arnsholt Oh no, way before Rick =)
And much more hilarious (although possibly not to lizmat)
jnthn :) 09:52
Yes, seen that one some time ago :)
masak no, listening to deformed lyrics of a song in your own language is hopeless. 09:53
arnsholt Also, relistening to Bananaphone, there are some truly #perl6-worthy puns in there
masak the whole thing is ruined by your brain helpfully telling you what the song is all about.
arnsholt "It's no baloney, it ain't a phoney!"
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masak .oO( I sausage that one coming miles away ) 09:54
lizmat :-)
masak it has a nice rhythm to it. 09:56
(Bananaphone, not French)
*lol* "it's a phone with appeal!"
that one snuck up on me. and it feels like a really "pure" pun, for some reason. 09:57
like, you'd create the entire song around it, just to get that pun in at the end.
lizmat some books start with the final line being written first :-) 09:58
arnsholt It's even in there twice. At the beginning there's "I've got a feeling, so appealing" as well =D
masak that one doesn't trigger it for me, even though I see the connection. 09:59
the nice thing about the second use is that you can hear the sentence two ways.
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lizmat wonders whether she should wait for jnthn to fix the serialize_tc issue, or start on something else 10:04
jnthn lizmat: Probably the latter, it will need quite some golfing... 10:05
lizmat okidoki 10:06
let me know if I can help you with the glof
golf
wave
stream
subconcious
should
stop
jnthn lizmat: Well, most helpful would be to have an example of it just in terms of a role and a BEGIN-time mixin of it to some class. 10:07
(If it can be done that way.)
lizmat maybe strip the CORE_SOURCES list and get a smaller sample?
jnthn Well, no, I think it can be reproduced just in a single file 10:08
lizmat but still during building of setting, right ?
jnthn Without mentioning Hash at all, just creating something with a similar structure and using a BEGIN method that does a mixin
No
Because we managed to reproduce it last night separately.
lizmat did we?
jnthn Yes, you had a short file that used a typed hash that wouldn't pre-compile... 10:09
Which suggests any usage of one triggers it
lizmat I just added that class to Bag.pm (which was otherwise clean)
jnthn Oh...I thought you'd done it as a separate file? 10:10
Outside of setting...
Hmm.
lizmat no, sorry
jnthn Ah
May still be worth checking if that explodes though...
OK, then it's harder.
lizmat r: class A { my Int %h{Any} } 10:11
camelia rakudo afe36d: ( no output )
lizmat doesn't bomb
I'm not sure what you're getting at?
jnthn Yes, but that's not serializing.
Would need to be in a module, then pre-compile the module 10:12
lizmat perl6 --target=pir --stagestats --output=test.pir -e 'class A { my Int %h{Any} }' test # works 10:13
jnthn ah
So the usage has to be within the setting...
Grr 10:14
lizmat the generated .pir files clearly states: 10:17
push $P5004, "!UNIT_MARKER"
push $P5004, "Hash[Int,Any]"
push $P5004, "TValue"
push $P5004, "TKey"
$ perl6 -Mtest -e 1 # also works 10:18
even with -I. :-) 10:19
Teratogen pirrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr 10:21
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masak Teratogen: :) 10:27
Teratogen masak what is up!?
masak Teratogen: clouds. feather.perl6.nl. the positive y axis. 10:29
Teratogen actually Buckminster Fuller made the observation that really there is no up or down, there is just in and out
masak the study of the Zermelo-Fraenkel axioms has made me draw the same conclusion. 10:30
jnthn But...but...I go in the elevator which goes up or down, then I got out...
lizmat haw can you be sure the building didn't move down and up ? 10:31
jnthn Well, some of the tallest buildings I've been in were in earthquake zones... 10:32
.oO( or is that "been up" :P )
masak r: say sgn(4) 10:36
camelia rakudo afe36d: OUTPUT«===SORRY!=== Error while compiling /tmp/2oZ5kXrBH4␤Undeclared routine:␤ sgn used at line 1. Did you mean '&sign', '&sin'?␤␤»
masak r: say sign(4)
camelia rakudo afe36d: OUTPUT«1␤»
Teratogen jnthn, when you get into an elevator and go "up" you are actually going "out" from the earth. 10:40
masak also, if you look at "up" upside-down, it says "dn"
jnthn :P 10:41
Teratogen well in upside down is ni, like the Knights who say Ni 10:42
masak no "in" upside-down is "uı" 10:44
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jnthn masak: fail, you want a COMBINING DOT BELOW on that ı :P 10:44
Teratogen we want... a SHRUBBERY! 10:45
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masak jnthn: aye :) 10:48
lizmat r: say ~Mu 10:58
camelia rakudo afe36d: OUTPUT«Nominal type check failed for parameter ''; expected Any but got Mu instead␤ in sub prefix:<~> at src/gen/CORE.setting:1368␤ in block at /tmp/9zUTGWsOVJ:1␤␤»
lizmat since Mu has .Stringy, and prefix ~ calls .Stringy, any objections against making prefix ~ take Mu ? 10:59
masak no objections.
lizmat spectesting 11:00
masak though the obvious question is how it interacts with Junction
lizmat maybe an extra candidate then ?
jnthn -1. This feels like a slipperly slope. If we do this to ~, how many more operators will we do it to? 11:01
lizmat it's just that there is a failing spectest for ~Mu
so maybe the spectest should go ?
masak maybe. 11:02
why is it we have a Mu type again?
lizmat to allow for more cow puns
but only if you change them :-)
masak .oO( bullshit puns ) 11:03
lizmat hmmm… actually, slightly above in the test file it says: 11:04
# jnthn and pmichaud believe the next test is incorrect
# is +Mu, 0, "+ context forcer works (8)";
masak heh.
jnthn Mu is outside of Any to allow dispatch fail-over to trigger stuff like auto-threading.
masak right, also known as "we put junction semantics in the type system".
jnthn Right.
Or rather, use the type system to flag up the case.
That's a general Perl 6 thing, though. 11:05
masak troo
jnthn (Pushing decision making into the type system)
lizmat so: ~Mu should never work, ergo we need a spectest that it fails ?
otoh, what are .Str and .Stringy doing in src/core/Mu then? 11:06
shouldn;t they be in Any then ?
jnthn Yes, should have a test that it fails...
masak there's been a bit of back and forth about this in the backlog over the years, I recall... 11:07
lizmat and what to think about methods in Mu.pm that don't have a Mu signature ?
masak I think it was differences like this that led to something like .gist 11:08
lizmat r: say Mu.Str
camelia rakudo afe36d: OUTPUT«use of uninitialized value of type Mu in string context in block at /tmp/a6ez5MmVGq:1␤␤␤»
lizmat r: say Mu.Stringy
camelia rakudo afe36d: OUTPUT«use of uninitialized value of type Mu in string context in block at /tmp/f6CZNG45VI:1␤␤␤»
jnthn I don't think "~ should auto-thread" automatically means "Mu shouldn't know how to .Str". 11:09
lizmat ok
jnthn They're at lesat somewhat orthogonal.
lizmat I'll just add tests for +Mu and ~Mu failing 11:10
r: say +Mu
camelia rakudo afe36d: OUTPUT«Nominal type check failed for parameter ''; expected Any but got Mu instead␤ in sub prefix:<+> at src/gen/CORE.setting:3500␤ in block at /tmp/AgVUdmylxX:1␤␤»
lizmat r: say +Any
camelia rakudo afe36d: OUTPUT«use of uninitialized value of type Any in numeric context in block at /tmp/uBKOARA6P4:1␤␤0␤»
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Faxmachinen Hi folks 11:11
Is first always eager?
jnthn I guess it has to reify up until it finds the first thing that matches. 11:12
lizmat first is lazy
there are spectests for that
jnthn r: (gather { for 1..20 { .say; take $_ } }).first(3) 11:13
camelia rakudo afe36d: OUTPUT«1␤2␤3␤»
jnthn Looks like it's behaving as I described. :)
Faxmachinen r: (Date.new(1900, 1, 1) ... Date.new(10000, 1, 1)).first({ .day-of-week == 7 }) 11:16
camelia rakudo afe36d: ( no output )
Faxmachinen Is this a recent change maybe? On my local Rakudo Whatever that line takes like ten thousand years to evaluate 11:18
This is perl6 version 2013.05 built on parrot 5.3.0 revision 0 11:19
jnthn Faxmachinen: I seem to recall fixes to first in the not too distant past
FROGGS maybe it is doing in in real-time?
jnthn ah 11:20
New in 2013.07
+ List.first is now lazy
Faxmachinen Thanks :)
jnthn (from docs/ChangeLog)
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dalek ast: 4ea3b29 | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | S03- (8 files):
Some skip/todo fudges and some new tests
 11:37
lizmat running some errands&
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arnsholt Weeeeirdness 11:48
To the gdb-mobile! 11:49
Parrot Y U return 0x1???? 11:52
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flussence r: say (Date.new(1900, 1, 1) ... Date.new(10000, 1, 1)).first({ .day-of-week == 7 }) 12:52
camelia rakudo afe36d: OUTPUT«1900-01-07␤»
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lizmat just realizes today is the 5th palindrome date of the year: 31-8-13 12:55
masak r: say (Date.new(1900, 1, 1) ... *).first({ .day-of-week == 7 })
camelia rakudo afe36d: OUTPUT«1900-01-07␤»
masak r: sub palindrome { $^s eq $s.flip }; .say when &palindrome for (Date.new(2013, 1, 1) ... Date.new(2013, 12, 31)).map({ "{.day}-{.month}-{.year.substr(2)}" }) 12:58
camelia rakudo afe36d: OUTPUT«31-1-13␤31-3-13␤31-5-13␤31-7-13␤31-8-13␤»
masak \o/
masak ♥ Perl 6 12:59
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masak of course, that .substr(2) isn't Y10K-compatible. my bad. 13:00
r: sub palindrome { $^s eq $s.flip }; .say when &palindrome for (Date.new(2013, 1, 1) ... Date.new(2013, 12, 31)).map({ "{.day}-{.month}-{.year % 100}" })
camelia rakudo afe36d: OUTPUT«31-1-13␤31-3-13␤31-5-13␤31-7-13␤31-8-13␤»
masak r: say "{.day}-{.month}-{.year % 100}" if .month.chars == 1 && .day == 31 for Date.new(2013, 1, 1) ... Date.new(2013, 12, 31) 13:02
camelia rakudo afe36d: OUTPUT«31-1-13␤31-3-13␤31-5-13␤31-7-13␤31-8-13␤»
masak also, we won't have a palindrome date of that kind until 2021. 13:03
so today is indeed very special.
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lizmat woolfy came up with 4-11-14 13:32
colomon woolfy++
just have to ignore the dashes
woolfy I can come up with more: 5-11-15, 6-11-16, 7-11-17, 8-11-18, 9-11-19 13:33
masak yes, ignoring the dashes produces more solutions, indeed.
woolfy :-)
I am happy to ignore dashes.
timotimo masak++ #t3 reviews and t4 reviews in a little bit :D
woolfy 02-11-20 13:34
masak I've been spending parts of the day implementing t3 myself.
to find out things about optimal solutions.
woolfy: now you're adding zeros :)
lizmat there were rulez?
.oO( Miep Cijfer )
 13:35
woolfy To make palindromes look pretty, dashes are not necessary and zeroes can be.
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lizmat r: my @one=1,2; say @one .. 3 13:44
camelia rakudo afe36d: OUTPUT«[1, 2]..3␤»
lizmat r: my @one=1,2; say ~(@one .. 3)
camelia rakudo afe36d: OUTPUT«No such method 'succ' for invocant of type 'Array'␤ in sub postfix:<++> at src/gen/CORE.setting:2217␤ in sub postfix:<++> at src/gen/CORE.setting:2216␤ in method reify at src/gen/CORE.setting:6649␤ in method reify at src/gen/CORE.setting:6779␤ in method reify …
lizmat r: my @one=1,2; .say for @one .. 3 13:45
camelia rakudo afe36d: OUTPUT«No such method 'succ' for invocant of type 'Array'␤ in sub postfix:<++> at src/gen/CORE.setting:2217␤ in sub postfix:<++> at src/gen/CORE.setting:2216␤ in method reify at src/gen/CORE.setting:6649␤ in method reify at src/gen/CORE.setting:6779␤ in method reify …
lizmat hmmmm...
# Test that the operands are forced to scalar context 13:46
## From pmichaud 2006-06-30: These tests may be incorrect.
## C<@one> in ## item context returns an Array, not a number
## -- use C< +@one > to get the number of elements. So, we
## need to either declare that there's a version of infix:<..>
## that coerces its arguments to numeric context, or we can
## remove these tests from the suite.
# RT #58018
# RT #76950
Time to remove these tests ?
r: my @a=1,2; say for 0 .. @a 13:47
camelia rakudo afe36d: OUTPUT«␤␤␤»
lizmat r: my @a=1,2; .say for 0 .. @a 13:48
camelia rakudo afe36d: OUTPUT«0␤1␤2␤»
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masak lizmat: +1 on removing. 13:51
lizmat finding out that 0 .. @a works
made me change perspective: if that works, @a .. 100 should also work 13:52
masak I think infix:<..> favors the rhs in determining the type. 13:54
I may misremember on that one, though.
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Faxmachinen r: sub foo(Int @a) { return [+] @a }; say foo([1,2,3]); 13:58
camelia rakudo afe36d: OUTPUT«Nominal type check failed for parameter '@a'; expected Positional but got Array instead␤ in sub foo at /tmp/7qXCh4ORUS:1␤ in block at /tmp/7qXCh4ORUS:1␤␤»
lizmat RT #58018 13:59
jnthn Crappy error reporting, but it's correct to reject it..
lizmat was hoping for an RT bot to provide a link :-)
jnthn r: sub foo(Int @a) { return [+] @a }; say foo(Array[Int].new(1,2,3));
camelia rakudo afe36d: OUTPUT«6␤»
Faxmachinen Huh, forgot about the Class[Whatever] syntax 14:00
The error message is perhaps not ideal though
jnthn Yes, agree 14:01
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dalek kudo/nom: 2d5abca | moritz++ | tools/build/NQP_REVISION:
bump NQP revision
 14:10
lizmat running spectest with this while cycling& 14:17
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FROGGS perl6 -e 'use v5; $x = "" =~ /./; { use 6.0.0; say $x.WHAT }' 14:45
(List)
I love that way to debug things :o)
JimmyZ :P
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arnsholt O(n!) > O(2^n), isn't it? (If you'll forgive the flagrant abuse of notation) 14:58
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masak arnsholt: yeah. 15:00
arnsholt: because the left side keeps multiplying bigger factors, as the right side keeps adding the same factor. 15:01
arnsholt Right, right
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moritz n! is more like N^N 15:25
erm, n^n
timotimo nân? 15:26
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masak cf en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stirling%27s...roximation 15:27
moritz tadzik: fwiw the '==> Fetching panda' step in bootstrapping panda seems awefully slow 15:28
timotimo on jvm already? ;) 15:30
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moritz no 15:33
masak: I've used that a lot in statistical physics 15:34
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dalek Iish: 99608bb | moritz++ | t/10-mysql.t:
[mysql] use the documented test crendetials
 15:36
timotimo did arnsholt fix all the stuff needed for you to do your dbi stuff? and stuff? 15:37
moritz timotimo: dbiish mostly seemed to work even with zavolaj broken-ish 15:38
timotimo: I'm now testing it more thoroughly though
timotimo cool :)
moritz postgres also works \o/ 15:39
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dalek Iish: 51cfd5a | moritz++ | lib/DBDish/ (2 files):
avoid deprecation warnings in bless
 15:42
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timotimo i wish i knew enough about plack and websockets and such so that i can build a tiny web framework on rakudo-jvm 15:43
wait, not plack, PSGI 15:44
moritz read up on it :-) 15:45
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timotimo hm, http::easy already has something for psgi, maybe it can be adpted to handle async, too? 15:56
lizmat is back and saw that the spectest is green after moritz++ upgrade of Parrot version 16:01
colomon as of last night, we're back to NativeCall failing and all dependent modules failing with it. 16:03
timotimo so it seems like there's a listen socket that speaks the psgi protocol and it accepts one connection per incoming request to the "outer" web server and speaks a specific protocol over that connection 16:05
lizmat colomon: could this be Bag/Set related ???
timotimo that means it should be rather simple to plop an async in there and have it work
colomon lizmat: doubt that very greatly
timotimo i hope :)
sadly supernovus isn't idling around here 16:06
colomon I'd be dumbfounded if NativeCall is using Bag or Set.
timotimo intermittent failure brought to light by some environment change?
colomon " 16:09
Cannot unbox argument to '' as a native str
t/02-simple-args.t 16:10
timotimo i thought that was aded? 16:11
bbl
colomon wrong computer, bother 16:14
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colomon no, that's still the error I get with an *almost* up-to-date Rakudo. (Doesn't have moritz++'s NQP bump.) 16:16
next step is to try with that, I guess 16:17
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timotimo i read a commit today or yesterday about something unboxing to native str 16:37
FROGGS I think there was a patch about Mu and Stringy 16:39
nwc10 colomon: are you able to use git bisect to work out which commit? 16:40
colomon don't have time right now 16:41
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colomon is cooking lunch to take to the library, then making a bassoon check stop, then heading out to pick up two months' worth of meat from a farm, and needs to get back before the football game starts. :) 16:42
nwc10 mmm, meat.
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masak another round of horse jokes? :/ 16:49
:P
nwc10 I think that we've managed to reign them in
TimToady it's the long tail 16:50
nwc10 we're no longer saddled with bad puns
masak I see we're back on track
TimToady still jockeying for top punster?
jnthn I thought my position at the top was stable... :P 16:51
TimToady you're just stalling
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masak whaddya take me for, a foal? 17:12
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geekosaur calf-baked ideas? 17:13
masak the cow puns were earlier today. 17:15
masak .oO( a mare cow pun will not do )
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Moukeddar evenin' #perl6 o/ 18:05
GlitchMr rn: say Rat(1, 7) # Seriously, number of elems in array? 18:06
camelia niecza v24-90-gd827fa8: OUTPUT«Unhandled exception: Unable to resolve method postcircumfix:<( )> in type Rat␤ at /tmp/UHq2VYtnDN line 1 (mainline @ 3) ␤ at /home/p6eval/niecza/lib/CORE.setting line 4579 (ANON @ 3) ␤ at /home/p6eval/niecza/lib/CORE.setting line 4580 (module-CORE @ 576…
..rakudo 2d5abc: OUTPUT«2␤»
GlitchMr Yep
I'm not sure whatever this is intentional. 18:07
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masak Moukeddar: \o 18:17
GlitchMr: the Rat type object should not be callable, IMHO. 18:18
GlitchMr rn: say tc 'finish' 18:24
camelia rakudo 2d5abc, niecza v24-90-gd827fa8: OUTPUT«Finish␤»
GlitchMr :-)
18:26 risou is now known as risou_awy
GlitchMr rn: say tc 'finish floats' 18:27
camelia rakudo 2d5abc, niecza v24-90-gd827fa8: OUTPUT«Finish floats␤»
GlitchMr rn: my $scalar = 42; $scalar.delete(42); say $scalar; 18:28
camelia niecza v24-90-gd827fa8: OUTPUT«Unhandled exception: Unable to resolve method delete in type Int␤ at /tmp/4MHTr5P0QW line 1 (mainline @ 4) ␤ at /home/p6eval/niecza/lib/CORE.setting line 4579 (ANON @ 3) ␤ at /home/p6eval/niecza/lib/CORE.setting line 4580 (module-CORE @ 576) ␤ at /home…
..rakudo 2d5abc: OUTPUT«42␤»
GlitchMr I've my doubt about hack at github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/78...0035bf6896
It hides real mistakes. $scalar.delete(42) just doesn't make sense. 18:29
JavaScript already did that mistake (and doesn't do it anymore in strict mode).
FROGGS this should fail unless it does Positional or Associative
(IMO) 18:30
GlitchMr > delete 42
true
JavaScript
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GlitchMr I'm seriously wondering how adding such ambiguous methods to Any wasn't reverted. 18:32
jnthn GlitchMr: It has been discussed here. 18:33
GlitchMr: It's to make %h<a><b>:delete work out, but I feel we should do it a different way
GlitchMr It feels too much of the hax for me. 18:34
Hax that causes different hax. 18:40
github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/90...ec3039e7cf
I mean, implementing a method that doesn't exist?
r: Bag.new.delete('cat')
camelia rakudo 2d5abc: OUTPUT«Cannot call 'delete' on an immutable 'Bag'␤ in method delete at src/gen/CORE.setting:14740␤ in block at /tmp/tQaRt7h8Yl:1␤␤»
GlitchMr r: Bag.new.delete
camelia rakudo 2d5abc: OUTPUT«Not enough positional parameters passed; got 1 but expected 2␤ in method delete at src/gen/CORE.setting:14739␤ in block at /tmp/qdtWU9dB9N:1␤␤»
GlitchMr oh, I see, it's fixed. 18:41
jnthn GlitchMr: That's later updated to throw a different exception
GlitchMr: But yes, I agree with you
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GlitchMr r: 42<42>:delete 18:43
camelia rakudo 2d5abc: ( no output )
GlitchMr This should be an error.
Int is not Positional.
n: 42<42>:delete 18:44
camelia niecza v24-90-gd827fa8: OUTPUT«Unhandled exception: Cannot use hash access on an object of type Int␤ at <unknown> line 0 (ExitRunloop @ 0) ␤ at /home/p6eval/niecza/lib/CORE.setting line 349 (Any.delete_key @ 9) ␤ at <unknown> line 0 (ExitRunloop @ 0) ␤ at /tmp/8_SWUs9dLN line 1 (mai…
jnthn At the very least, the delete method in Any should only work on :U
(so it only has any effect in an auto-viv scenario, like the at_key in Any)
18:44 btyler joined
jnthn afk for a bit 18:45
GlitchMr Autovivication is a good argument, but 42 is defined.
Magically changing it into dictionary sounds wrong. 18:46
r: my $number = 42; $number<cat> = 82; say $number
camelia rakudo 2d5abc: OUTPUT«postcircumfix:<{ }> not defined for type Int␤ in method <anon> at src/gen/CORE.setting:11565␤ in any at src/gen/Metamodel.nqp:2671␤ in any find_method_fallback at src/gen/Metamodel.nqp:2659␤ in any find_method at src/gen/Metamodel.nqp:946␤ in block at /tmp/n…
GlitchMr r: my %hash; %hash{42}{84} = 82; say %hash
camelia rakudo 2d5abc: OUTPUT«("42" => {"84" => 82}).hash␤»
GlitchMr (but then well, in Perl 5, you can actually do 'delete 42->{42}', so perhaps that's a Perl 5 compatibility code) 18:51
Even in strict mode, somehow. 18:52
FROGGS I dont think we have this kind of compatibility
GlitchMr But I think it's actually Perl 5 bug. 42->{42} should make an error in strict mode, but doesn't. 18:53
FROGGS that would be like being backcompat to Perl 5's Switch.pm
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tadzik moritz: yes, copying is awfully slow on rakudo 19:05
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GlitchMr github.com/sorear/niecza/commits/master 19:35
Just when I expected a change in Niecza, it was reverted.
Great.
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GlitchMr std: / 2 ** 03 / 19:37
camelia std 27326bc: OUTPUT«ok 00:00 42m␤»
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GlitchMr std: / 2 ** 09 / 19:37
camelia std 27326bc: OUTPUT«ok 00:00 42m␤»
GlitchMr No warnings?
std: / 2 ** 09 .. 010 /
camelia std 27326bc: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Spaces not allowed in bare range at /tmp/T9NASSg74X line 1:␤------> / 2 ** 09 ..⏏ 010 /␤Parse failed␤FAILED 00:00 42m␤»
TimToady no, it calls <decint>, not <integer>
GlitchMr oh, ok
TimToady last week it was just \d+ after all 19:38
but if I call <integer>, it'd allow 2 ** :16<43> and such
and I don't think we want that
I don't think the 010 failure mode is likely to occur with any great frequency there 19:39
people are used to using decimal numbers in ranges
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GlitchMr :16<43> 19:42
I don't see issue with that.
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GlitchMr What's wrong with repeating something 0x43 times? 19:42
masak I think I agree it should be <decint> there. 19:43
TimToady there's no point in adding functionality that people will (almost) never use
all it does is make the parsing of regexen more ambiguous
since : already means something
GlitchMr Oh, right.
masak oh, that's an excellent point. 19:44
*especially* since **: means something.
GlitchMr Oh, I understand. This commit is about 1_000.
It took me a while to understand that.
TimToady it might seem like a good generalization to parse with a more general rule, but consider the degenerate case of allowing <EXPR> after ** 19:45
GlitchMr / 'something' ** (2 + 2) / 19:46
That would be too crazy.
TimToady nevertheless, that's exactly why we have the ** { 2+2 } escape hatch
GlitchMr std: / 'something' ** $var /
camelia std 27326bc: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Variable $var is not predeclared at /tmp/c8lOVpDRwh line 1:␤------> / 'something' ** ⏏$var /␤Potential difficulties:␤ Unsupported use of atom ** $var as separator; nowadays please use atom +% $var at /tmp/c8lOVpDRw…
GlitchMr std: my $var = 42; / 'something' ** $var /
camelia std 27326bc: OUTPUT«Potential difficulties:␤ Unsupported use of atom ** $var as separator; nowadays please use atom +% $var at /tmp/7lkySjv50T line 1:␤------> my $var = 42; / 'something' ** $var ⏏/␤ok 00:00 44m␤»
TimToady std: / 'something' ** { 2 + 2 } /
camelia std 27326bc: OUTPUT«ok 00:00 43m␤»
TimToady std: / 'something' ** { $_ } / 19:47
camelia std 27326bc: OUTPUT«ok 00:00 43m␤»
TimToady std assumes the bare form of $var is trying to specify the delimiter in the old form, not a repeat count
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TimToady std: my $var = 42; / 'something' ** {$var} /; # is fine 19:48
camelia std 27326bc: OUTPUT«ok 00:00 44m␤»
TimToady someday we might relax that
when all the people who remember the ** $sep form die off :) 19:50
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ajr_ which program in the latest rakudo star (2013.08) is the perl 6 executable? The paths seem to have changed. 20:04
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timotimo should be bin/perl6 or something like that 20:04
may depend on how you configured it before compiling 20:05
ajr_ I just untarred it
timotimo ah. yes, i think you have to compile it, don't you? 20:06
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ajr_ Not * 20:06
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timotimo find . -name 'perl6' 20:07
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moritz ajr_: yes, you have to compile first 20:07
R* is still a source distribution
(except the occasional .msi for windows)
ajr_ That's new, isn't it? 20:08
agre Hi all. How to correctly run PIR code produced by perl6 --target=PIR on parrot?
Just doing "perl6 --target=pir -e 'say 1' | parrot -" does not work. 20:11
moritz ajr_: it's not new; it has never been different
ajr_: you can't. The only thing that works is precompiling modules with --target=pir, and then use that module with 'use ModuleName' in Perl 6 code 20:12
erm sorry, that last line was meant for agre
agre Ok.
ajr_ Duh! The heat of summer must have done something to my brain. 20:13
colomon for people curious about the smoke test, updating to the Rakudo with moritz's NQP version bump fixed the issue with NativeCall. 20:14
moritz ... which was the reason for the bump :-) 20:15
jnthn ajr_: I guess it's possible you downloaded the Windows installer, which would give you a binary...not sure if that's available yet for 2013.08... 20:20
agre Maybe one can write a wrapper in PIR to run PIR generated by perl6? 20:22
ajr_ No, just for some reason I forgot to configure & make
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sorear wanders in 20:22
yoleaux 29 Aug 2013 01:05Z <diakopter> sorear: find this spot in the backlog.. jvm bytecode parsing error from rakudo
moritz agre: maybe. "Just" needs doing.
jnthn o/ sorear
agre :) 20:23
sorear o/ jnthn 20:24
masak sorear! \o/
moritz: I've now started a script to pit your t3 solution against veky's, for 1_000 randomized inputs, to see if either one has an edge on the other. 20:25
this is perfectly the first time in human history that a Perl 5 one-liner instruments both a Perl 6 script and a Python 3 script at the same time.
ooh, I see differences.
yeah, sorry. moritz lost out to veky. :(
(and thereby the unique claim to the elegance criterion.) :/ 20:26
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dalek ast: 763e849 | (David Warring)++ | S05-capture/caps.t:
a couple more tests + raukdo.jvm fudging
 20:40
BenGoldberg Hmm... 20:43
r: (^Inf but role { method BUILD { say 'bar' } })[0]
camelia rakudo 2d5abc: OUTPUT«bar␤Too many positional parameters passed; got 5 but expected 1␤ in method BUILD at /tmp/nLFEFA_MBM:1␤ in method reify at src/gen/CORE.setting:6655␤ in method reify at src/gen/CORE.setting:6779␤ in method gimme at src/gen/CORE.setting:7212␤ in method exists at…
BenGoldberg r: (^Inf but role { method BUILD(@) { say 'bar' } })[0]
camelia rakudo 2d5abc: OUTPUT«Not enough positional parameters passed; got 1 but expected 2␤ in method BUILD at /tmp/TAsTrtgM3a:1␤ in method BUILD_LEAST_DERIVED at src/gen/CORE.setting:912␤ in sub infix:<but> at src/gen/CORE.setting:15391␤ in sub infix:<but> at src/gen/CORE.setting:15386␤ …
20:43 btyler left
BenGoldberg How many args does BUILD take? 20:44
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masak r: sub postfix:<!>($N) { [*] 2..$N }; say 10! 20:47
camelia rakudo 2d5abc: OUTPUT«3628800␤»
masak that's... not an awfully large space.
r: sub postfix:<!>($N) { [*] 2..$N }; sub thousands($n) { $n.flip.comb(/..?.?/).join("_").flip }; say thousands 10! 20:48
camelia rakudo 2d5abc: OUTPUT«3_628_800␤»
lue r: sub thousands($n) { $n.flip.comb(/..?.?/).join("_").flip }; say thousands([*] 2..16)
camelia rakudo 2d5abc: OUTPUT«20_922_789_888_000␤»
lue hexadecimal comes with more than enough :) 20:49
masak well, I'm talking about the t3 space.
lue I know. Who's to say those programs can't be modified to handle A, B, C, D, E, and F? 20:50
masak the t3 task description.
lue I was merely suggesting hex if you *really* needed more than 3.6mn configurations to test. 20:51
BenGoldberg What's the t3 task?
masak BenGoldberg: github.com/masak/p6cc2012#readme 20:53
strangelyconsistent.org/blog/the-20...ng-contest 20:54
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masak 10! is still a pretty challenging space :) 21:11
I'm *hoping* it's within the bounds of what my RAM can take.
jnthn
.oO( masak sheepishly looks at this ram ewesage )
 21:13
masak it stayed within bounds. 21:17
using single transpositions starting from the identity permutation, it takes 45 generations to get all possible permutations.
but I realize it's not single transpositions I'm after. it's all non-adjacent combinations of them. 21:18
should be possible to code. tomorrow. :)
timotimo are you also checking all the results are actually correct? 21:19
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masak I'm not sure I understand the question. 21:24
there's a graph of all possible permutations. it's 3_628_800 nodes large.
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timotimo maybe one of the permutation exposes a bug in the implementations? 21:25
and since "a different solution" is interpretable sa "one implementation does it more elegantly", do you trace all lines to see if they end up in the actually correct spot on the other side?
masak well, in some sense, this graph encodes "the most elegant solution" for all possible permutations. 21:26
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masak which is why I found it interesting to generate it, as it's possible to compare it against veky's solution, say. 21:26
timotimo ah, ok
i thought the python 3 solution looked like just a wall of text :( 21:27
jnthn timotimo: I thought that but thought it may be just 'cus I ain't used to looking at Python code
masak no, it's a wall of text. 21:29
FROGGS *lol*
*g*
masak FROGGS: NO LOL
21:29 btyler joined
timotimo add "NO NO LOL" to the topic? 21:32
masak .oO( -O LOL ) 21:33
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FROGGS "NO NO" describes #perl6 better 21:37
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masak we're so permissive, we forbid restrictions! 21:42
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diakopter give me liberty or give me permission 21:43
21:45 agre left
masak "Give me liberty, *for*give me permission" -- Grace Hopper 21:46
diakopter orly
masak not really. 21:47
but I think she originated the "f > p" meme.
BenGoldberg preflex: ordinal 2 21:51
preflex 2rd
masak how do you pronounce "2rd"? :) 21:59
TimToady surd, as in ab 22:00
timotimo twird 22:01
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lue where's this py3 script, masak? 22:07
masak lue: gist.github.com/masak/1e9d78d8deaa789880e3 22:09
lue
.oO(Python's forced indentation ironically didn't translate to other similar concepts, like blank lines, or spaces around operators.)
 22:11
jnthn nqp: nqp::substr("abc", 0, -5) 22:12
camelia nqp: ( no output )
jnthn nqp: say(nqp::substr("abc", 0, -5)) 22:13
camelia nqp: OUTPUT«␤»
diakopter nqp: say(substr("hhhhhh", 5, -5)) 22:14
camelia nqp: OUTPUT«Could not find sub &substr␤current instr.: '' pc 48 ((file unknown):39) (/tmp/QcaNyAcgRa:1)␤»
diakopter nqp: say(nqp::substr("hhhhhh", 5, -5))
camelia nqp: OUTPUT«␤»
diakopter meh
nqp: say(nqp::substr("hhhhhhhhhhhh", 5, -5))
camelia nqp: OUTPUT«␤»
diakopter nqp: say(nqp::substr("hhhhhhhhhhhh", 5, -5).WHAT) 22:15
camelia nqp: OUTPUT«Can only use get_what on a SixModelObject␤current instr.: '' pc 48 ((file unknown):144969501) (/tmp/Brj7f_a6vl:1)␤»
diakopter ha
jnthn: ^
TimToady wrong nqp?
diakopter nqp-jvm: say(nqp::substr("hhhhhhhhhhhh", 5, -5).WHAT) 22:16
camelia nqp-jvm: OUTPUT«java.lang.StringIndexOutOfBoundsException: String index out of range: -5␤ at java.lang.String.substring(String.java:1911)␤ at org.perl6.nqp.runtime.Ops.substr3(Ops.java:2096)␤ at 1C1C561F7D2C1605E7AAF79F7E1C1D1159D81559.qb_10(<generated>)␤ at
..org.perl6.nqp.runtime.Ops.in…
diakopter no clue what parrot's (or nqp's) trying to do there 22:17
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masak 'night, #perl6 23:01
TimToady o/
sorear o/
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dalek kudo/nom: 5d09997 | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | src/core/Range.pm:
Ranges starting with @a.. and (1,2,3).. work (right hand side already worked)
 23:18
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dalek kudo/nom: 1fca644 | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | src/core/Range.pm:
Also allow Match objects as endpoints of a Range
 23:40
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dalek ast: 6bae94e | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | S03-operators/range.t:
Test arrays/lists/matches as endpoints for ranges
 23:46
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