»ö« Welcome to Perl 6! | perl6.org/ | evalbot usage: 'p6: say 3;' or rakudo:, or /msg camelia p6: ... | irclog: irc.perl6.org or colabti.org/irclogger/irclogger_logs/perl6 | UTF-8 is our friend!
Set by moritz on 22 December 2015.
timotimo m: my @strings = <a ab abc abcd abcde abcdef abcdefg>; for @strings { my $s = $_; $s .= chop while $s.chars % 3; say "$_ => $s" } 00:03
camelia a =>
ab =>
abc => abc
abcd => abc
abcde => abc
abcdef => abcdef
abcdefg => abcdef
timotimo m: my @strings = <a ab abc abcd abcde abcdef abcdefg>; for @strings { my $s = $_; $s .= substr(0, *.ceiling(3)) say "$_ => $s" } 00:04
camelia 5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling <tmp>
Two terms in a row
at <tmp>:1
------> 3y $s = $_; $s .= substr(0, *.ceiling(3))7⏏5 say "$_ => $s" }
expecting any of:
infix
infix stopper
statement end
…
timotimo m: my @strings = <a ab abc abcd abcde abcdef abcdefg>; for @strings { my $s = $_; $s .= substr(0, *.ceiling(3)); say "$_ => $s" }
camelia Too many positionals passed; expected 1 argument but got 2
in block at <tmp> line 1
in block <unit> at <tmp> line 1
timotimo hm, i wonder if floor and ceiling should have an argument that works just like round
m: my @strings = <a ab abc abcd abcde abcdef abcdefg>; for @strings { my $s = $_; $s .= substr(0, *.round(3)); say "$_ => $s" } 00:05
camelia a =>
ab => ab
abc => abc
abcd => abc
abcde => abcde
abcdef => abcdef
abcdefg => abcdef
timotimo m: my @strings = <a ab abc abcd abcde abcdef abcdefg>; for @strings { my $s = $_; $s .= substr(0, * - * % 3); say "$_ => $s" }
camelia Too few positionals passed; expected 2 arguments but got 1
in block at <tmp> line 1
in block <unit> at <tmp> line 1
timotimo m: my @strings = <a ab abc abcd abcde abcdef abcdefg>; for @strings { my $s = $_; $s .= substr(0, {$_ - $_ % 3}); say "$_ => $s" }
camelia a =>
ab =>
abc => abc
abcd => abc
abcde => abc
abcdef => abcdef
abcdefg => abcdef
timotimo that's probably not worth much at all 00:07
timotimo sorry for cameliaspamming 00:11
ktown doing my daughter's python homework in perl6
comborico1611 ktown: Are you cheating for her? 00:29
Or just having fun?
timotimo cheating at programming homework assignments should not be encouraged. in the real workplace, there's noone and especially no popular web site that can give you most of the answers you'll need 00:44
geekosaur I would not expect a Python course to accept perl 6 answers 00:52
Juerd geekosaur: Hey, I once wrote a 3-line PHP script that essentially started Perl 5 and fed it the rest of the file. Made my life a lot easier :) 01:01
Juerd geekosaur: If it's executable Python code, that just happens to let Perl 6 do the heavy lifting, it's still a python program? :D 01:02
geekosaur only if you can convince the teacher/prof of that
(then again I once handed a math prof who underspecified a Riemannian integration program written in RM/COBOL. I should talk)
timotimo if you're using "print" to output some text, isn't it the rest of the whole operating system doing the actual heavy lifting? :P 01:03
geekosaur (mind, I knew I could get away with it; we had a bit of a running joke going on all semester)
Juerd timotimo: I use the same example when asking people why they think writing their own solution is better than reusing an existing one. They typically fail to see that most of what they're doing still does reuse existing code, but this argument often helps them understand that using libraries isn't bad at all :) 01:04
timotimo pay the designers of the font in your terminal and code editor ffs :P 01:05
Juerd I'm afraid that one day someone will take it the other way and go NIH all the way down to the hardware 01:06
timotimo well, not everybody uses fonts to read text, of course
Juerd Audio fonts, aka voices. 01:07
timotimo well, there's also braille devices 01:08
Juerd I could see that as a font 01:12
(no pun intended)
timotimo fair enough. there's only really one braille font you can "choose" from, right? 01:13
Juerd Well, it does come in several sizes, and weights
Juerd And, er, thickness I guess? 01:13
timotimo i do believe braille devices are usually very heavy ;) 01:15
at least they're pretty big
i'm told they use piezos for each individual nub and since piezos hardly move at all, they've got looooong levers in there
geekosaur there's at least one gps that calls them "fonts" 01:21
timotimo what's a gps?
Herby_ o/ 01:21
timotimo \o 01:22
Herby_ timotimo: how goes it?
geekosaur (that was re "audio fonts", not Braille devices)
timotimo oh, ok
i'm okay, not finding a good way out of a specific bug i'm seeing 01:23
regarding the profiler
Herby_ I wish I could provide a useful contribution to your bug hunting endeavors 01:24
but since I lack the chops, I'll provide moral support instead :)
you can do it
timotimo at this point i'm getting a whole lot of suggestions and examples of broken code that moral support feels more useful :) 01:25
so thanks for that!
Geth doc: 63e089070e | skids++ | 2 files
Angle quotes imply Q:v even in an adverb, so mention val()

Also, teach aspell "retronym"		 03:02
Herby_ rookie question here: in the latest p6 weekly, there was a mention of a 6% speedup in certain areas. If I wanted to see how those speedups were achieved, where do I look? 03:07
I'm a github novice too
MasterDuke Herby_: github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commits/master 03:11
Herby_ MasterDuke: thanks 03:14
github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/79...43a9a7d3a7
MasterDuke: that's a nice speedup :)
MasterDuke yeah, pleasantly surprising 03:15
Herby_ releasable6: status 03:19
releasable6 Herby_, Next release in ≈5 days and ≈15 hours. 2 blockers. 0 out of 76 commits logged
Herby_, Details: gist.github.com/ac0ecc649dacc2da63...95d3f6c18d
AlexDaniel Herby_: changes like this are usually also referred to in the changelog 03:23
Herby_ AlexDaniel: dumb question, but where can I see that?
AlexDaniel Herby_: github.com/rakudo/rakudo/blob/mast.../ChangeLog
Herby_ awesome, thanks 03:24
AlexDaniel Herby_: changelog for this release is not there yet, but it will be this week
Herby_ AlexDaniel: I might get started on the monthly squashathon early. I think I might be able to resolve some of the LFH in whateverable 03:25
AlexDaniel Herby_: oh! That's pretty cool
Herby_: let me know if you're able to run things locally, because I was planning to double check that things work before the squashathon
AlexDaniel Herby_: I do know that bisectable's tests fail because it is constantly attempting to download binaries that don't exist 03:26
but everything else works I think
Herby_ another beginner question that I was going to ask: with these being IRC bots, any guidance on how I go about testing changes?
I'm not too familiar with irc bots in general 03:27
AlexDaniel Herby_: oh, this should be documented
Herby_: in case of whateverable there are tests: github.com/perl6/whateverable/tree/master/t
Herby_: and if you simply run it like this: t/evalable.t 03:28
oops
perl6 t/evalable.t
it should work
Herby_: it will actually spawn a mini irc server, and the bot will connect to it
Herby_ ok. so I should be able to clone the whateverable github repo to my local computer, make changes, then run the test
AlexDaniel yes, and add your tests for the newly added feature (or tweak tests if you're changing existing functionality) 03:29
Herby_: second option is this: sake debug:evalable
Herby_: it will actually start the bot, and it will connect to freenode and join #whateverable channel
Herby_ great. i'll give it a go and hopefully can solve some of the low low lhf 03:30
do I need to be on a specific release to do the changes and testing? right now I'm on the latest release on rakudo-pkg
AlexDaniel any recent-ish rakudo will do 03:31
Herby_: there was this page: github.com/perl6/whateverable/wiki...w-Features
Herby_: but it is really out of date, feel free to change it
“It is really hard to work on these bots if you do not have a couple of thousands of rakudo builds” – totally not true anymore
Herby_: what's your OS by the way? 03:32
Herby_ My main is Windows 10 but I have a virtualbox with ubuntu 16.04 and 18.04
but i'm a linux rookie
so still figuring things out there
AlexDaniel most bots will work much better on linux 64-bit 03:34
Herby_: fwiw what happens there is that bisectable needs a bunch of rakudo versions to work properly, and there are thousands of these on whateverable server 03:35
Herby_: one option is to build these yourself, which will take a lot of time of course
Herby_: but by default if you're on linux amd64 it'll pull existing builds from whateverable server
so you don't need to build anything
and 15k builds are ready for use :) 03:36
Herby_: and actually most bots will need to run rakudo in one way or another, not just bisectable 03:37
Herby_ Ok. I'll start trying my luck with some of the simple issues and see what I can get done. I'll probably be asking lots of questions :) 03:38
thanks for the guidance
AlexDaniel Herby_: there's a high chance that you'll stumble upon issues that are my fault, so feel free to complain :) 03:40
Herby_ there will be no complaints. you do great work for p6 :) 03:41
AlexDaniel I still expect bug reports though, no matter how good our work is :)
AlexDaniel runs away to get some healthy… 1 hour of sleep… 03:42
Herby_ o/ 03:43
modules.perl6.org down?
AlexDaniel undersightable6: status 03:45
undersightable6 AlexDaniel, OK! Working on it…
Todd By chance is perl6.org down? 03:46
Herby_ I just posed that same question. it looks to be
Todd Would you mind if I mooched the syntax on how to create a directlry? mkdir $path ? 03:47
Herby_ books.google.com/books?id=uJlGDwAA...mp;f=false 03:49
Todd Thank you!
Herby_ i havent used mkdir with p6 but that would be my best guess :)
AlexDaniel Herby_: heh… I guess it is timing out, and there are lots of domains, so it will take a lot of time for undersightable6 to finish 03:52
Herby_ i guess now is as good as time as any to get some sleep
o/
Tison \o 04:29
I wonder if you guys can access perl6.org/ 04:30
It times out accessing from China. 04:31
donpdonp * Connected to perl6.org (213.95.82.53) port 80 (#0)
donpdonp > GET / HTTP/1.1 04:31
(waiting... waiting...)
donpdonp yeah it connected but no response. (from thailand) 04:31
Herby_ Tison: I can't access it from the US either. some sort of problem going on 04:32
Tison well
donpdonp that means i can read docs.perl6.org/type/Buf oh noes :) 04:33
can/cant
Todd I need match help. How do I specify a want to see certain characters ohly? perl6 -e 'my $A="44.rc0"; if $A ~~ m/( \d**1..4 "." <["a" . "b" . "rc" ]> +$ ) / {say "$0";} else {say "no match";}' 04:59
Todd I want to match "a" or "b" or "rc" 05:01
donpdonp wow first time ive seen the new regex syntax 05:03
m: "44.rc" ~~ m/( \d**1..4 "." ("rc" | "a" | "b") $ ) /
camelia ( no output )
donpdonp so um, on my terminal it says it matches with 0 => ｢44.rc｣ 05:04
jmerelo m: say "44.rc" ~~ m/( \d**1..4 "." ("rc" | "a" | "b") $ ) /
camelia ｢44.rc｣
0 => ｢44.rc｣
0 => ｢rc｣
Todd testing 05:05
jmerelo donpdonp: m evaluates but you have to print the output explicitly
donpdonp jmerelo: nod. thx.
Todd Thank you! 05:07
perl6 -e 'my $A="44.rc20"; if $A ~~ m/( \d**1..4 "." ( "a" | "b" | "rc" ) .*$ ) / {say "$0";} else {say "no match";}' 44.rc20
jmerelo m6: my $A="44.rc20"; if $A ~~ m/( \d**1..4 "." ( "a" | "b" | "rc" ) .*$ ) / {say "$0";} else {say "no match";} 05:08
m: my $A="44.rc20"; if $A ~~ m/( \d**1..4 "." ( "a" | "b" | "rc" ) .*$ ) / {say "$0";} else {say "no match";}
camelia 44.rc20
Todd jmerelo: I am not finding your correction. What am I missing? 05:12
jmerelo Todd: just running it through the Camelia bot 05:16
.tell moritz docs.perl6.org seems to be down. 05:17
yoleaux jmerelo: I'll pass your message to moritz.
ufobat jmerelo, my edit of issue 2015 was by accident :(
jmerelo .tell moritz correction: every *.perl6.org seems to be down
yoleaux jmerelo: I'll pass your message to moritz.
jmerelo ufobat: no problem :-) 05:18
Geth doc: c9f0961172 | (JJ Merelo)++ | doc/Language/subscripts.pod6
Less accidental MD, refs #2022
 05:35
synopsebot Link: doc.perl6.org/language/subscripts
doc: 5884013447 | (JJ Merelo)++ | doc/Language/subscripts.pod6
Eliminates Iterable

Which at least makes the example compile. Iterable is not used in the other examples, so I don't really get what it's doing there. It's not really relevant to the main topic, which is subscripts. The example should probably be improved, but that's a different thing altogether. Closes #1438.
Geth doc: b89f453072 | (JJ Merelo)++ | doc/Language/unicode.pod6
Review and finish normalization subsection

It was pretty much completed by @samcv. I have added explicit reference to graphemes and little more. Closes #1517
Also deletes accidental markdown refs #2022.		 05:47
synopsebot Link: doc.perl6.org/language/unicode
moritz perl6.org is up again 05:49
yoleaux 05:17Z <jmerelo> moritz: docs.perl6.org seems to be down.
05:17Z <jmerelo> moritz: correction: every *.perl6.org seems to be down
jmerelo moritz: great. Thanks! 05:50
donpdonp mmmm... sweet sweet documentation is back up.
Geth doc: JJ self-assigned Proc::Async Example needs to be modified to run on Windows 10 github.com/perl6/doc/issues/1453
JJ self-unassigned Only highlight perl 6 snippets as perl 6 github.com/perl6/doc/issues/1430

Checks that $?RESOURCES is effectively documented
Which closes #1422.
Also deletes some accidental MD, refs #2022		 06:09
synopsebot Link: doc.perl6.org/language/modules
moritz ... and down again 07:07
donpdonp and back. 07:09
donpdonp say "hash {$hash.perl}"; => hash Buf.new(...Transaction.new(:typecode, :hash); => Type check failed in assignment to $!hash; expected Buf but got Bool (Bool::True) 07:48
donpdonp sorry if thats hard to read. $hash is clearly a Buf, but the error is expected Buf but got Bool 07:48
maybe im using named params wrong 07:49
m; class T { has Buf $.hash }; my $hash = Buf.new; T.new(:hash) 07:51
m: class T { has Buf $.hash }; my $hash = Buf.new; T.new(:hash)
camelia Type check failed in assignment to $!hash; expected Buf but got Bool (Bool::True)
in submethod BUILDALL at <tmp> line 1
in block <unit> at <tmp> line 1
donpdonp has Buf $!hash; :) 07:54
jmerelo donpdonp: :hash is equivalent to hash => True. That's why it says stuff about Bool... 07:55
m; class T { has Buf $.hash }; my $hash = Buf.new; T.new($:hash)
That's the correct syntax, I guess. It's equivalent to hash => $hash 07:56
(If I'm not wrong, that is. Let he check)
donpdonp m: class T { has Buf $!hash }; my $hash = Buf.new; say T.new(:hash).perl 07:57
camelia T.new
jmerelo m: class T { has Buf $.hash }; my $hash = Buf.new; T.new($:hash) 07:58
camelia 5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling <tmp>
Cannot use placeholder parameter $:hash outside of a sub or block
at <tmp>:1
------> 3hash }; my $hash = Buf.new; T.new($:hash7⏏5)
jmerelo No, it's not...
m: class T { has Buf $.hash }; my $hash = Buf.new; T.new(hash => $hash)
camelia ( no output )
jmerelo m: class T { has Buf $.hash }; my $hash = Buf.new; T.new(:$hash) 07:59
camelia ( no output )
jmerelo donpdonp: OK, that was it...
m: class T { has Buf $.hash }; my $hash = Buf.new; say T.new(:$hash) ~~ T.new( hash => $hash ) 08:00
camelia False
jmerelo m: class T { has Buf $.hash }; my $hash = Buf.new; say T.new(:$hash) eqv T.new( hash => $hash )
camelia True
donpdonp jmerelo: ah ok, thx!
jmerelo donpdonp: if that gratefulness is accompanied by a post in StackOverflow with the question you had, I'd be inmensely grateful :-) 08:01
donpdonp id rather not document my ignorance :)
jmerelo donpdonp: c'mon. Just check out the people that ask the most questions in StackOverflow... Questions there will help everyone in the community. 08:02
donpdonp: you can also post the question, wait a reasonable amount of time, and answer it yourself (pointing to this IRC conversation if you want). 08:03
donpdonp here's another goodie 08:14
m: my $t = -> $tuple { my ($a, $b, $c) = $tuple; }; say $t((1,2,3))
camelia (1 2 3)
donpdonp thats good.
m: my $t = -> $tuple { my ($a, %b, $c) = $tuple; }; say $t((1,%(a => "b"),3)) 08:15
camelia Odd number of elements found where hash initializer expected:
Found 3 (implicit) elements:
Last element seen: 3
in block <unit> at <tmp> line 1
donpdonp that seems like a p6 bug.
jmerelo m: my $t = -> $tuple { my ($a, %b, $c) = $tuple; }; say $t((1,$(%(a => "b")),3)) 08:15
camelia (1 {a b => 3} (Any))
jmerelo hum 08:16
jmerelo m: my $t = -> $tuple { my ($a, %b, $c) »=« $tuple; }; say $t((1,$(%(a => "b")),3)) 08:16
camelia (1 {a => b} 3)
jmerelo right
donpdonp o^O 08:17
jmerelo donpdonp: just documented that yesterday in the docs docs.perl6.org/language/operators#...B%3D%C2%AB
jmerelo or this weekend, anyway 08:17
donpdonp »=« 08:18
wow
grin. ok thx.
jmerelo donpdonp: cool, right :-)
donpdonp: not simply thanks. You know the spiel :-)
donpdonp Hyper :O
I do. it has been noted :-)
jmerelo donpdonp++
donpdonp i mean mentally noted, not noted in SO. but anything's possible 08:19
jmerelo donpdonp: :-)
donpdonp i dont even know how to make a »=« with the keyboard
feels like learning klingon :)
copy/paste from irc is working fine 08:20
jmerelo donpdonp: you can just use <<=>> or >>=<<
I have compose keys defined in my keyboard. And you can, too docs.perl6.org/language/unicode_entry+
docs.perl6.org/language/unicode_entry 08:21
donpdonp thats a nice page to have 08:22
El_Che if I wanted to build a simple irc bot for simple stuff like flood protection and autovoice with delay, wich of the both here is the easiest to use as an example? Geth? 11:54
Zoffix and AlexDaniel have lots of bots :) 11:55
AlexDaniel El_Che: I think following a tutorial from IRC::Client is the easiest 12:20
El_Che: github.com/zoffixznet/perl6-IRC-Cl...-basics.md
El_Che thx 12:24
will do that
tyil rakudo.org died? 12:29
getting a 503 12:30
jkramer paste.pound-python.org/raw/kVFW06M...WmLB0ouJm/
El_Che moritz : the same as the doc.perl6.org downtime?
jkramer Is this as it's supposed to be or a bug? 12:31
moritz El_Che: no, for the doc.perl6.org downtime, the whole system hung 12:33
ZofBot: is there anything that needs to be started on www.p6c.org for rakudo.org to come up again? 12:34
ZofBot: never mind, found it 12:35
jkramer The same error is thrown with .&say on a new line instead of .say
moritz we should really have an init script for that :( 12:35
tyil yes
jkramer I see no reason why this shouldn't be working
jkramer This is weird too: paste.pound-python.org/show/6Ey4Xt...Rr4ofw21I/ 12:42
El_Che moritz: thx 12:43
Zoffix moritz: there is a start-on-reboot script, but it just got a bug in it (only starts if there were new commits) 13:29
moritz Zoffix: ah, ok 13:30
Zoffix: I've opened an issue on perl6/rakudo.org for this, ftr
ktown comborico1611: just for fun. I would have to learn python todo her work for her. Interesting to compare the code. 13:31
Geth rakudo.org: 77f07199d6 | (Zoffix Znet)++ | 2 files
Add separate script for booting up on box reboot

Closes #11		 13:33
ktown and I discovering the awsesomeness of markdown, here are the exercised so far : acmebot.com/py/ 13:34
tyil ktown: personally, for technical texts, I prefer asciidoc
I've used md for ages before being introduced to adoc 13:35
Geth rakudo.org: a632006262 | (Zoffix Znet)++ (committed using GitHub Web editor) | README.md
Document start-rakudo.org.sh script
 13:36
Geth infrastructure-doc: 594c63ad14 | (Zoffix Znet)++ (committed using GitHub Web editor) | hosts/www.p6c.org.pod
Document start-rakudo.org.sh script
 13:38
jmerelo O/ 15:04
timotimo \o 15:05
lucasb There's some little details that I want to ask if they were conscious decisions and if they are documented/tested somewhere. 15:08
<1/2> is a Rat, but <1.2> is a RatStr. Is it ok?
timotimo m: say < 1/2 >.^name 15:09
camelia RatStr
timotimo if you want that
lucasb the other way around :) 15:09
why <1.2> isn't a Rat/
?
lizmat m: dd <42>.^name 15:10
camelia "IntStr"
lizmat same reason ^^^
lucasb: the xxxStr types are the dualvar types of Perl 6
lucasb hm, ok. Int and Num's are different than Rat and Complex then
with regard allomorphism 15:11
lizmat not sure I follow
no, they should be the same ?
timotimo <x/y> is syntax for a numerator/denominator literal
Tison m: say (+<1.2>).^name
camelia Rat
lizmat m: say (~<1.2>).^name
camelia Str
Tison If you know <...> provides a list of stringy
lucasb yes, understood. <1/2> and <1+1i> and not quoted lists, but literals. 15:12
*are not
ok, next question :) 15:13
<0+0i> is Complex, but <0i> is ComplexStr
can't <0i> be a literal for a complex number?
also, <0+i> is a Str. Can't it be a complex literal? 15:14
Tison m: say <1+1i>.^name
camelia Complex
Tison somewhat inconsistent 15:15
Zoffix lucasb: because there's no point in writing 1.2 with brakets. Without brakets it's still a Rat literal, so the obvious implication is you wanted a RatStr. `1/2` on the other hand is not a literal. It's an expression and you can't use it to mean a Rat literal in certain places that don't accept expressions (like signature literals). So <1/2> is the syntax for literals and if you actually want a RatStr, use 16:02
space.
Zoffix lucasb: same applies to complex, as `1+i` is an expression. And it's a bug that <1+i> is a plain Str. 16:03
lucasb Zoffix: do you have any opinion on <1i> to mean a complex literal? 16:04
Zoffix lucasb: and this stuff is documented here: docs.perl6.org/language/glossary#i...-Allomorph and on the upcoming Numerics language page: github.com/perl6/doc/blob/car-gran...#L382-L394 16:05
lucasb makes sense now, thanks Zoffix & others for clarification
Zoffix lucasb: yeah, it probably should be a complex literal, since `i` is a postfix operator, so it's an expression 16:05
m: -> 1i {say "in"}(1i)
camelia 5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling <tmp>
Missing block
at <tmp>:1
------> 3-> 17⏏5i {say "in"}(1i)
expecting any of:
whitespace
Zoffix m: -> <1i> {say "in"}(1i) 16:06
camelia 5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling <tmp>
Missing block
at <tmp>:1
------> 3-> <7⏏051i> {say "in"}(1i)
Zoffix huh
Ah, right. If it were a complex literal it'd get accepted. 16:07
Kinda makes me think we should accept allmorphic numeric literals too
Filed R#1827 and R#1828 16:12
synopsebot R#1827 [open]: github.com/rakudo/rakudo/issues/1827 <1i> should be a Complex literal, not ComplexStr
R#1828 [open]: github.com/rakudo/rakudo/issues/1828 Allomorphic numerics should probably be accepted as literals in signatures
Zoffix lucasb: reminder that you wanted to fix R#1824 :) 16:17
synopsebot R#1824 [open]: github.com/rakudo/rakudo/issues/1824 [IO][easy to resolve][good first issue] non-interactive REPL mode breaks STDIN
Zoffix With Z-Script: *make nqp changes*; *write test*; run `z n; z s`; submit a PR 16:22
huggable: zscript 16:23
huggable Zoffix, Helper script for Rakudo Perl 6 core development: github.com/zoffixznet/z
Zoffix Well, I guess you'll need to `cd` into ~/R/nqp and ~/R/rakudo/t/spec dirs and change remotes to forks
Zoffix &
uzl Other than calling a method on an invocant, can the term 'self' access an attribute? 16:26
I wonder if the reason this example (pastebin.com/Nq6xd3wx) is not working is
because I'm trying to call a method on the invocant and using the wrong syntax. 16:27
timotimo ah, self!foo is syntax only for method calls 16:29
you really need $!color there
uzl: ^
[Coke] Zoffix: irc is not the best way to reach me for TPF related issues. Email is best. You don't have a GM yet, I'm working on it. Worst case, it'll be me again. 16:30
uzl timotimo, I guess %!color would also work too? 16:32
timotimo yup 16:36
sorry, i didn't look closely enough 16:37
uzl BTW do those method calls only apply to methods created by the user? What about methods created by Perl for public attributes? 16:39
timotimo there is no difference between a user-created method and the public method created for you, but there will not be a public method created for you if you already have a method of the same name 16:41
Zoffix [Coke]: is it tpf-grants-secretary(at)perlfoundation.org ? 16:43
[Coke]: GM or no GM, I plan to have my first report ready on 26th (a month after grant approval). 16:44
Zoffix [Coke]: also, what's up with TPF's website? Almost every page I visit is either horribly outdated or has Unicode issues. Is TPF willing to give the keys to the code/server to people willing to fix that stuff? 16:46
Like this page still lists Karen as chair: www.perlfoundation.org/steering_committee
Tax returns page hasn't been updated in half a decade: donate.perlfoundation.org/irs.html
Zoffix This page doesn't display Unicode right news.perlfoundation.org/ 16:47
uzl_ timotimo, thanks! 16:48
Zoffix The YAPC stuff is still called YAPC 16:49
Zoffix [Coke]: k, found the address you emailed from during the last grant. I'll send the grant report to that on 26th or earlier, unless I hear back about the GM. 16:50
uzl_ So just to be sure, %!color = %hue; would mean I'm accessing the attribute directly? 16:52
Zoffix uzl_: yes
uzl_ And self.color = %hue; means I'm calling the method on the invocant? 16:53
Zoffix uzl_: yes
uzl_ Thank you!
uzl_ Probably not related, but how do you tag a particular user like you did with username? 16:54
timotimo you mean on irc? literally just put their nickname somewhere in the line; usually irc clients will tab-complete nicknames for you 16:55
[Coke] zoffix: the secretary address is fine, but so is coke at cpan.org or will at coleda.com 16:59
uzl_ timotimo, For some Hexchat doesn't add the colon but a comma after the username. 17:00
[Coke] Zoffix: for the website, feel free to send me a list of defects, I'll see if I can find someone who can fix them or provide access.
timotimo that's not important :) 17:01
uzl_ oh, great! Thanks! 17:02
geekosaur hexchat is configurable
preferences > interface > input box > nick completion > nick completion suffix 17:03
uzl_ geekosaur: Just did that! 17:07
El_Che hexchat, is that the successor of xchat? 17:08
timotimo i think it's just "windows builds of xchat"? 17:09
geekosaur it's successor
xchat still exists after a fashion but seems to be pretty much dead
hexchat cam einto existence when the xchat devs went commercial for windows
El_Che I run xchat in the day, bit it didn't offer much to get me off irssi 17:10
ran
it felt more like a mirc->linux-alternative transition
geekosaur yes and no. it's somewhere between the two; I find mirc highly annoying 17:11
but most of that is how they use screen real estate
timotimo when i was little, mirc was a lot of fun
El_Che yeah, it was my first irc client tough :)
timotimo what with the custom scripts that could drastically change the interface
geekosaur xchat/hexchat style works better for large screens. mirc always feels to me like multiple tui windows 17:12
El_Che mirc -> epic II -> epic II with bitchX -> irssi
last time I saw mirc it still felt likt a windows 3.11 app
geekosaur which can work but is little better than irssi with cheap sprinkles
[Coke] Zoffix: upcoming site migration to a new system. Probably wait until that drops.
El_Che geekosaur: oh, I also used Microsoft Comic Chat 17:16
geekosaur of course a lot of this is personal preference. I find that a mix of GUI and TUI works well, and hexchat does a decent job of giving me that mix 17:16
El_Che you need a bouncer or something similar though 17:17
timotimo i like weechat and glowing-bear 17:18
ttkp6 mmm sirc 17:58
stmuk I moved from irssi to weechat 17:59
ttkp6 using xterm(-cum-mrxvt) for everything == high information density, same font everywhere, same cut+paste behavior everywhere, low memory overhead, higher reliability 18:00
Herby_ \o 18:07
AlexDaniel ktown: hey! I did revise some 5to6 messages 18:17
e: $,=" ";say 1,2
evalable6 (exit code 1) 04===SORRY!04=== Error while compiling /tmp/24FeMCO2QF
Unsupported use of $, variable; in Perl 6 please use .join() method
at /tmp/24FeMCO2QF:1
------> 03$,08⏏04=" ";say 1,2
AlexDaniel ktown: ↑ this one is probably better now
at least doesn't suggest to use some non-existent thing 18:18
jmerelo AlexDaniel++
AlexDaniel more info here: github.com/rakudo/rakudo/issues/13...-388599174 18:18
hm it doesn't have to be a *method* obviously, so the text can be improved 18:19
ah, I wrote it that way to be consistent with $" message I think 18:20
so please feel free to change both :)
AlexDaniel runs away 18:21
jmerelo AlexDaniel: you can say "thingie" instead :-)
AlexDaniel: or "whatnot"
AlexDaniel jmerelo: “perl 6 equivalent” :) 18:25
jmerelo AlexDaniel: :-) 18:26
timotimo Perl 6 or 100% compatible
geekosaur class Perl6 does Whatever {...} 18:34
probably should be a role :) 18:35
timotimo "does whatever" lets a class just typecheck "true" for any type or role or subset 18:36
moritz why does this discussion remind me of "compatible with Windows NT 4.0 or better" statements? :-)
Herby_ question: is there an easy way to see what p6 dependencies a repo has? 18:38
geekosaur ideally it has a meta file with that information
Herby_ ahhhh. found it. thanks!
one follow up question: given a meta file with a list of dependencies, is there an easy way to install all of them? or just one-off "zef install" each one? 18:39
sd_ hi 18:39
timotimo if you have the repo cloned, you can just zef install --depsonly . 18:40
hi sd_
Herby_ sd: o/ 18:40
moritz timotimo, Herby_ it's --deps-only
timotimo OK
Herby_ timotimo, moritz: I'll give that a try. thanks 18:40
Herby_ hmm. I'm thinking I'm failing to "point" it at something because if I use: zef install --deps-only , nothing happens 18:43
timotimo did you put a . at the end?
or the name of the folder if you're not in the folder itself
Herby_ thats why they pay you the big bucks :)
that worked, thanks
timotimo hah, i wish 18:44
timotimo "Cannot write to a closed socket" - i wonder how i got that 18:56
(in a cro application)
[Coke] did you close a socket and then try to write to it? *duck*
ktown AlexDaniel++ 19:02
ktown timotimo: the other end closed the socket 19:10
timotimo yeah, that's likely
i'm not sure how it figures that
ktown if you read or write to the closed socket it will error, made cro checks if the socket exists frist 19:21
kurahaupo_ A shutdown socket and a closed IO::Socket aren't the same thing; I wonder which is really means when it says "closed" 19:24
ktown with async sockets a few things can happen, connection reset by peer, buffer is not flushed, client closes connection 19:35
server needs LAST (to close connection), QUIT (await errors) and CATCH (reset by peer) 19:37
timotimo ?!?!? i see the websocket frame being reacted to from console.log output in the console, but the "network" tab in the chrome debugger shows 0 frames have ever gone through that socket >_> 19:40
that just kept me spinning my wheels for about half an hour
oh no 19:41
there was a split thingie in that view that was all the way at the top
so i saw the table's headers, but none of the content 19:42
just "select a frame to browse its contents" which looked like a placeholder where the data would show up
FML
Herby_ Geth: help
Geth Herby_, Source at github.com/perl6/geth To add repo, add an 'application/json' webhook on GitHub pointing it to hack.p6c.org:8888/?chan=#perl6 and choose 'Send me everything' for events to send | use `ver URL to commit` to fetch version bump changes
Geth whateverable: sylints++ created pull request #311:
Add "usage" alias		 19:53
Herby_ novice git question: I believe i made a pull request that addresses a whateverable issue. I'm assuming someone will review my PR, and if its good, they'll approve it. 19:55
do they close the issue or do I, when the change is approved?
jjmerelo Herby_: I checked it out and it looks good 19:55
timotimo when merging the pullrequest from the github website, it'll automatically be closed 19:56
AlexDaniel Herby_: comment added :)
jjmerelo Herby_: you can include the words "closes #xx" if it addresses some issue outside the PR. It will be closed automatically.
AlexDaniel ↑ help.github.com/articles/closing-i...-keywords/
Herby_ I'll give that a look. thanks 19:57
AlexDaniel: saw your comment, I'll try my hand at creating a test for it
Geth whateverable: sylints++ created pull request #312:
add test for "usage" alias		 20:09
whateverable: adff3c10dd | sylints++ (committed using GitHub Web editor) | lib/Whateverable.pm6
Add "usage" alias

Addressing issue #303. github.com/perl6/whateverable/issues/303		 20:11
whateverable: 0466ebfcd1 | (Aleks-Daniel Jakimenko-Aleksejev)++ (committed using GitHub Web editor) | lib/Whateverable.pm6
Merge pull request #311 from sylints/patch-1

Add "usage" alias
whateverable: 5e1c927745 | sylints++ (committed using GitHub Web editor) | t/lib/Testable.pm6
add test for "usage" alias
whateverable: 1dd3ad5b7b | (Aleks-Daniel Jakimenko-Aleksejev)++ (committed using GitHub Web editor) | t/lib/Testable.pm6
Merge pull request #312 from sylints/patch-2

add test for "usage" alias
AlexDaniel committable6: usage 20:15
committable6 AlexDaniel, Like this: committable6: f583f22,HEAD say ‘hello’; say ‘world’ # See wiki for more examples: github.com/perl6/whateverable/wiki/Committable
AlexDaniel Herby_: \o/ thank you
AlexDaniel Herby_: I won't restart *all* of the bots just yet, but they'll all get this change next time they're restarted 20:16
Herby_ awesome. I'm bumbling my way through contributing to open source projects, github, p6 etc..
so if i'm not doing something the best way, let me know :)
AlexDaniel Herby_: what you can also do is add commits to the existing pull request 20:17
Herby_: for example, you could've added tests and just pushed it 20:18
Herby_: and the extra commit will appear in the pull request too
Herby_ gotcha. i figured there was a way to add on to an existing PR
AlexDaniel afk 20:19
buggable New CPAN upload: Algorithm-Heap-Binary-0.0.1.tar.gz by CONO cpan.metacpan.org/authors/id/C/CO/...0.1.tar.gz 20:32
Herby_ hmm. i'm trying to run any of the tests in whateverable, and i'm failing on test 1: Failed test 'bot joined the channel' 20:44
i'm running the test with: perl6 t/evalable.t
AlexDaniel ah-haa 20:45
geekosaur make sure it's not doing something silly like trying to log in with a nick that's taken already?
AlexDaniel no-no it's starting its own miniircd 20:46
geekosaur might check if firewall rules or something prevent it then 20:46
AlexDaniel Herby_: is 3rdparty/miniircd empty?
Herby_ AlexDaniel: it is 20:47
geekosaur: I hope it isnt firewall issues, because my networking knowledge is about 0 20:48
AlexDaniel no it's just that the submodule is not cloned
AlexDaniel I'm trying to find the right command… 20:50
Herby_: git submodule update --init --recursive
Herby_ AlexDaniel: what folder do I perform that in? 20:51
in 3rdparty/miniircd ?
AlexDaniel Herby_: in whateverable root
Herby_ k
AlexDaniel .tell Herby_ I tweaked the docs a bit: github.com/perl6/whateverable/wiki/Installation 20:53
yoleaux AlexDaniel: I'll pass your message to Herby_.
Herby_ AlexDaniel: that command worked :) 21:00
yoleaux 20:53Z <AlexDaniel> Herby_: I tweaked the docs a bit: github.com/perl6/whateverable/wiki/Installation
Herby_ perl6 t/evalable.t hard reboots my system for some reason
AlexDaniel oh wow 21:01
Herby_: how much RAM do you have? 21:02
Herby_ hmm. i'll have to double check. its a virtualbox, and i'm still figuring it out
El_Che (depending on how experienced you are with Linux) docker is a lightweight alternative for virtualbox 21:05
with 'docker commit $id' you can save your progress
geekosaur there I'd want to make sure it's not using a port that is quietly being used by vbox for something else (like, say, host to guest communication)
AlexDaniel El_Che: I think Windows is the main OS in that case, so docker probably not an option 21:06
geekosaur although it can also mean you found yet another bug in vbox >.>
El_Che AlexDaniel: docker works well on recent Windows
AlexDaniel oh?
El_Che AlexDaniel: it uses a lightweight hypervisor
AlexDaniel how in the world…
El_Che AlexDaniel: like it does on mac
Herby_ El_Che: i have very little in the way of Linux chops. I installed VB in an attempt to learn a little linux
geekosaur docker has been both a hypervisor manager and an interface to cgroups for quite some time now 21:07
El_Che Herby_: in that's case it's a good choice
geekosaur it transpaently uses cgroups where they;re available and sufficient, and a hypervisor when they;re not
AlexDaniel well, wow
that's awesome
El_Che before I automated rakudo-pkg on travis, I built a few releases on a mac just because I could :) 21:08
AlexDaniel El_Che: speaking of which… :)
quite some time without a prerelease
El_Che (I have a mac test machine from work, but my main os is Linux (work and home) )
als in no new files? or no builds? 21:09
it should build every 24h
(or when triggered)
AlexDaniel El_Che: ye-ye, it's simply that I didn't upload anything new 21:10
El_Che AlexDaniel: travis-ci.org/perl6/rakudo-pkg-canary -> "Ran for 30 min 12 sec. about 3 hours ago"
that's why it's green :) 21:11
AlexDaniel well, I actually tried more than twice :)
once there was a broken test, another time Inline::Perl5 was failing
El_Che good to catch it 21:11
I also have a few rakudo containers waiting to be integrated, so that dev can try stuff on the fly, even on i386 21:12
and as I said, it works on Windows, Mac and Linux
AlexDaniel El_Che: meh! :) github.com/niner/Inline-Perl5/issues/113 21:37
El_Che :) 21:39
El_Che .tell jmerelo I would propose a "obsolete" tag. There are question tagged with perl6 on SO that are no longer relevant or do not even work anymore (e.g. perl6 on parrot) 22:16
yoleaux El_Che: I'll pass your message to jmerelo.
El_Che .tell jmerelo the tag and a comment on the question 22:17
yoleaux El_Che: I'll pass your message to jmerelo.
lizmat And another Perl 6 Weekly hits The Net: p6weekly.wordpress.com/2018/05/14/...ough-time/ 22:23
Herby_ lizmat++! 22:27
Herby_ grep but 22:28
greppable6: but
hmm
Herby_ i killed it :( 22:30
lizmat perhaps AlexDaniel can revive it :-) 22:31
lizmat goes afk to get some R&R
timotimo i do think systemd restarts them when they go down
greppable6 Herby_, 40782 lines, 959 modules: gist.github.com/52176b1942dc62cd10...3e9584aa75 22:33
Herby_ thats probably why it had a heart attack
timotimo haha
something makes them unable to respond to pings while doing their task
Herby_ looking in some of the whateverable bots, i'm seeing the "but" operator for the first time
timotimo but they do properly reconnect when they're done and then output it
Herby_ timotimo: i saw in the p6 weekly that you worked on some things in the MoarVM. How'd you get started hacking on that? 22:39
timotimo hm, good question 22:40
at the time moarvm came out, i had just been working on rakudo-jvm for a little bit. seeing the cool bits that moarvm had got me interested i suppose?
there was lots of low-hanging fruit at the beginning, i think 22:41
timotimo github.com/moarvm/moarvm/commit/b2da0b7cf - this was my first commit; adding nqp::replace 22:41
Herby_ nice! what rakudo-jvm your first exposure to vm's? 22:42
what/was
timotimo i wouldn't say that; i contributed tiny bits to PyPy before, which you could consider experience with VMs in the widest sense 22:43
cool, sqlite has a "total" function that you can use instead of "sum" that will never throw an integer overflow error 22:46
AlexDaniel Herby_: arguably using `but` is not the right way to do things 23:08
but it works so well for whateverable 23:09
AlexDaniel when all you need is to just throw some messages around 23:09
.tell Herby_ irclog.perlgeek.de/perl6/2018-05-14#i_16165471
yoleaux AlexDaniel: I'll pass your message to Herby_.
AlexDaniel [Coke]: the link to “his blog for April” is broken here: news.perlfoundation.org/2018/05/gra...rl-6-.html 23:12
well, it points to stackoverflow, that's the wrong link

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