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Set by Zoffix on 25 July 2018.
Geth doc: be63e6b751 | Coke++ | doc/Language/grammars.pod6
whitespace
 00:08
doc: 4cbf1cbf34 | Coke++ | doc/Language/grammars.pod6
fix example
synopsebot Link: doc.perl6.org/language/grammars
Xliff geekosaur: Naw. The whole $/ is copy thing when using Action classes. 00:54
geekosaur might be a trap 00:55
Xliff LOL
If you do further ad-hoc matching on $/, it won't work because that match wants to set $/, which is now read only.
And throws an exception and BEWM!
You're wondering WTF the assignment to a readonly object is where there is no "=" involved. 00:56
geekosaur docs.perl6.org/language/traps#Usin...'s_actions
Xliff Well, feh! 00:57
That's in the traps page, should be linked to here: 00:58
docs.perl6.org/language/grammars#C...g_grammars
Mainly because who searches for traps when looking for Grammars? 00:59
buggable New CPAN upload: AI-Agent-0.1.17.tar.gz by HOLYGHOST modules.perl6.org/dist/AI::Agent:cpan:HOLYGHOST 04:21
holyghost ^-- I have a NESMusicAgent with a message such as "rip roms", which method searches for sound enable in a NES ROM file 04:23
Now I have to search for sound loops later on 04:24
There's also M68000 processor hashmap of opcodes which you can use to let your agent assemble something
I still have to put in the NES (6502 processor) opcodes 04:25
holyghost Now I'll stop with the rom ripping code as further work on it is illegal. I am going to invent something like a parser for several agent types (e.g. youtube links, FB poster, the methods are legion 04:40
You can test if a NES ROM includes music and that's all I'm going to say about that 04:41
buggable New CPAN upload: AI-Agent-0.1.18.tar.gz by HOLYGHOST modules.perl6.org/dist/AI::Agent:cpan:HOLYGHOST 05:11
holyghost I am going to make a system inside an agent which recognizes your (headerless) binary, I can use machine learning or hidden markov models for it 05:13
So you know what you can do with a binary, some sort of linux "file" command but with searches of opcodes on a binary 05:14
then classify etc
It's also a method to salvage binaries if you like 05:15
holyghost with headerless binaries I mean pieces of machine code without what's in /usr/include/elf.h 05:16
Geth doc: 4c715da8aa | (Christian Sánchez)++ | doc/Type/SetHash.pod6
Fix #2412 Document SetHash --

Add examples for removing SetHash elements		 05:24
synopsebot Link: doc.perl6.org/type/SetHash
Geth doc: acc80fbf25 | (Christian Sánchez)++ | doc/Type/SetHash.pod6
Fix typo in example
doc: 70ac793167 | (Juan Julián Merelo Guervós)++ (committed using GitHub Web editor) | doc/Type/SetHash.pod6
Merge pull request #2417 from chsanch/fix-2412

Fix #2412 Add examples for removing SetHash items
Xliff How can I force a shared resource through only one thread? 05:39
jmerelo Xliff: what do you mean by force? 05:41
Xliff I just want to make sure that when I erase a shared resource, I can do it where no other thread can add to it. 05:42
Kinda like a blocking call.
holyghost a virtual pointer ? 05:43
Xliff No
holyghost reference-counted pointer I mean
Xliff NO
synchronized { %empty-this-hash = {}; # No other thread can access %empty-this-hash until the block ends. } 05:44
holyghost you can then use a mutex to lock everything since it's only one thread
Xliff OK. I will look that up.
Xliff Mutexes. Looks like Lock and its ilk are working. Thanks, guys! 06:24
Geth doc: 4857a9c380 | (JJ Merelo)++ | doc/Language/operators.pod6
Fixes said link (and others) closes #2414
 06:36
synopsebot Link: doc.perl6.org/language/operators
buggable New CPAN upload: AI-Agent-0.1.19.tar.gz by HOLYGHOST modules.perl6.org/dist/AI::Agent:cpan:HOLYGHOST 07:02
Geth doc: 416431e49e | (JJ Merelo)++ | type-graph.txt
utf8 added to type graph

Which was all that was needed to close #2416. New lesson learned about htmlify.p6, which never ceases to amaze. Also addresses partially #2418.
moritz <spam> Perl 6 Fundamentals is USD 9.99 as en ebook today: www.apress.com/us/book/9781484228982 </spam> 10:26
tadzik mm tasty spam 10:27
"Authors: Lenz, Moritz" -- that's cool, I didn't know you wrote this together with that Lenz guy :P 10:28
(gal?)
atroxaper Hello, #perl6 ! 11:00
jmerelo atroxaper: hi!
atroxaper Please help me to understand why wrapped sub has strange signature behaviour? :)
p6: sub wr(:$a) {say $a}; say %(:a(3)) ~~ &wr.signature; &wr.wrap(-> |c {callsame(c)}); say %(:a(3)) ~~ &wr.signature;
camelia True
False
atroxaper As I see, the signature is the same after wrapping the sub. But ACCEPTS works differently. Why? Moreover, signatures has the same WHICH... 11:01
p6: sub wr(:$a) {say $a}; say &wr.signature.WHICH; &wr.wrap(-> |c {callsame(c)}); say &wr.signature.WHICH;
camelia Signature|64243048
Signature|64243048
atroxaper jmerelo: Hi :)
jmerelo m: (-> |c {callsame(c)}).signature 11:02
camelia ( no output )
jmerelo m: say (-> |c {callsame(c)}).signature
camelia (|c is raw)
jmerelo atroxaper: signature is not the same.
p6: sub wr(:$a) {say $a}; say %(:a(3)) ~~ &wr.signature; &wr.wrap(-> |c {callsame(c)}); say wr.signature 11:03
camelia True
Too many positionals passed; expected 0 arguments but got 1
in block <unit> at <tmp> line 1
jmerelo p6: sub wr(:$a) {say $a}; say %(:a(3)) ~~ &wr.signature; &wr.wrap(-> |c {callsame(c)}); say &wr.signature
camelia True
(:$a)
jmerelo Hum
atroxaper jmerelo: Yes, 'Hum' )
jmerelo atroxaper: well. Thing is, one thing is the signature of the container, other the signature of the thing contained 11:05
atroxaper jmerelo: Can I decont it in pure Perl 6? 11:06
jmerelo p6: sub wr(:$a) {say $a}; say &wr.perl; &wr.wrap(-> |c {callsame(c)}); say &wr.perl
camelia sub wr (:$a) { #`(Sub|62421744) ... }
sub wr (:$a) { #`(Sub+{Routine::Wrapped}|62421744) ... }
jmerelo atroxaper: I'm looking at the way of doing that... As you see, the wrapped thing contains a Routine::Wrapped role, that's the one that's giving out the (new) signature 11:07
atroxaper jmerelo: I use ACCEPTS method of the Signature object. Why result is different? 11:08
jmerelo p6: sub wr(:$a) {say $a}; say &wr.perl; &wr.wrap(-> |c {callsame(c)}); say &wr<>.perl
camelia sub wr (:$a) { #`(Sub|48481296) ... }
sub wr (:$a) { #`(Sub+{Routine::Wrapped}|48481296) ... }
jmerelo p6: sub wr(:$a) {say $a}; &wr.wrap(-> |c {callsame(c)}); say &wr<>.signature 11:09
camelia (:$a)
jmerelo p6: sub wr(:$a) {say $a}; &wr.wrap(-> |c {callsame(c)}); say &(&wr).signature
camelia (:$a)
jmerelo p6: my $wr = -> :$a {say $a}; say $wr.signature; $wr.wrap(-> |c {callsame(c)}); say &($wr).signature 11:10
camelia (:$a)
No such method 'wrap' for invocant of type 'Block'. Did you mean any of these?
Map
grep
map

in block <unit> at <tmp> line 1
jmerelo p6: my $wr = -> :$a {say $a}; say $wr.signature; &($wr).wrap(-> |c {callsame(c)}); say &($wr).signature
camelia (:$a)
No such method 'wrap' for invocant of type 'Block'. Did you mean any of these?
Map
grep
map

in block <unit> at <tmp> line 1
jmerelo OK, right...
atroxaper: right, what is returned by .signature is not the same as is returned by ACCEPTS... 11:11
atroxaper p6 sub wr(:$a) {say $a}; my $sig = &wr.signature; &wr.wrap(-> |c {callsame(c)}); say $sig; say %(:a(3)) ~~ $sig; 11:12
p6: sub wr(:$a) {say $a}; my $sig = &wr.signature; &wr.wrap(-> |c {callsame(c)}); say $sig; say %(:a(3)) ~~ $sig;
camelia (:$a)
False
jmerelo sub wr(:$a) {say $a}; say :(:a(3)) ~~ &wr.signature; &wr.wrap(-> |c {callsame(c)}); say :(:a(3)) ~~ &wr.signature; 11:14
Geth ¦ doc: tbrowder self-assigned expand last example to allow comments and blank lines github.com/perl6/doc/issues/1759
jmerelo m: sub wr(:$a) {say $a}; say :(:a(3)) ~~ &wr.signature; &wr.wrap(-> |c {callsame(c)}); say :(:a(3)) ~~ &wr.signature;
camelia ===SORRY!===
QAST::Block with cuid 2 has not appeared
jmerelo Now that's weird
p6: sub wr(:$a) {say $a}; say &wr.ACCEPTS.gist; &wr.wrap(-> |c {callsame(c)}); say &wr.accepts.gist 11:15
camelia Cannot resolve caller ACCEPTS(Sub: ); none of these signatures match:
(Mu:U: \topic, *%_)
(Mu:U: Mu:U \topic, *%_)
(Any:D: Mu:D \a, *%_)
(Any:D: Mu:U, *%_ --> Bool::False)
(Any:U: \topic, *%_)
(Code:D $self: Mu $top…
jmerelo p6: sub wr(:$a) {say $a}; say &wr.ACCEPTS.gist; &wr.wrap(-> |c {callsame(c)}); say &wr.ACCEPTS.gist
camelia Cannot resolve caller ACCEPTS(Sub: ); none of these signatures match:
(Mu:U: \topic, *%_)
(Mu:U: Mu:U \topic, *%_)
(Any:D: Mu:D \a, *%_)
(Any:D: Mu:U, *%_ --> Bool::False)
(Any:U: \topic, *%_)
(Code:D $self: Mu $top…
jmerelo p6: sub wr(:$a) {say $a}; say wr.ACCEPTS.gist; &wr.wrap(-> |c {callsame(c)}); say wr.ACCEPTS.gist
camelia (Any)
Cannot resolve caller ACCEPTS(Bool: ); none of these signatures match:
(Bool:D: Mu \topic, *%_)
(Bool:U: \topic, *%_)
in block <unit> at <tmp> line 1
jmerelo p6: sub wr(:$a) {say $a}; say &wr.signature.ACCEPTS.gist; &wr.wrap(-> |c {callsame(c)}); say &wr.signature.ACCEPTS.gist 11:16
camelia Cannot resolve caller ACCEPTS(Signature: ); none of these signatures match:
(Mu:U: \topic, *%_)
(Mu:U: Mu:U \topic, *%_)
(Any:D: Mu:D \a, *%_)
(Any:D: Mu:U, *%_ --> Bool::False)
(Any:U: \topic, *%_)
(Signature:D: Mu…
jmerelo Not sure it's actually using the ACCEPTS method...
p6: sub wr(:$a) {say $a}; say &wr.signature.gist; &wr.wrap(-> |c {callsame(c)}); say &wr.signature.gist 11:17
camelia (:$a)
(:$a)
jmerelo p6: sub wr(:$a) {say $a}; say &wr.signature.gist; say &wr.wrap(-> |c {callsame(c)}).signature;
camelia (:$a)
No such method 'signature' for invocant of type 'Routine::WrapHandle'
in block <unit> at <tmp> line 1
atroxaper This strange - "Cannot invoke object with invocation handler in this context": 11:18
p6: sub wr(:$a) {}; my $sig = &wr.signature; &wr.wrap(-> |c {callsame(c)}); say $sig; say $sig.ACCEPTS(%(:a(3))); say %(:a(3)).Capture; say $sig.ACCEPTS(%(:a(3)).Capture);
camelia (:$a)
Cannot invoke object with invocation handler in this context
in block <unit> at <tmp> line 1

False
\(:a(3))
atroxaper jmerelo: It was about .Capture on a Hash inside ACCEPTS. Without ACCEPTS it is works. 11:19
jmerelo atroxaper: the problem is that by wrapping you are blending in a role which acts like a block. You are not actually modifying the signature. I don't know what's the deal with ~~ and/or ACCEPTS 11:20
atroxaper: really, beats me. You can try and ask in StackOverflow, where there are people much more knowledgeable than me; question and answer will help the rest of the community 11:21
atroxaper jmerelo: Thank you, really. I'm going to do so :) 11:22
jmerelo atroxaper: good luck!
atroxaper Will post a link here.
Zoffix weekly: looking for 3-5 volunteers to form the Media Group who will be responsible for our Media to have consistency (e.g. in look and messaging): github.com/perl6/perl6.org/issues/...-433017146 11:37
notable6 Zoffix, Noted!
Zoffix .botsnack 11:38
yoleaux :D
SmokeMachine m: say :($a) ~~ :($a) 12:32
camelia True
atroxaper I created a question about my ask above. stackoverflow.com/questions/529898...r-wrap-sup 12:57
Zoffix .tell moritz would you retweet this on P6 Twitter Feed ( twitter.com/zoffix/status/1055424052632936448 ) or post an original with a link to the Issue? github.com/perl6/perl6.org/issues/...-433010412 15:12
yoleaux Zoffix: I'll pass your message to moritz.
moritz ZofBot: done 15:15
yoleaux 15:12Z <Zoffix> moritz: would you retweet this on P6 Twitter Feed ( twitter.com/zoffix/status/1055424052632936448 ) or post an original with a link to the Issue? github.com/perl6/perl6.org/issues/...-433010412
jkramer Can anyone successfully install Log::Minimal using zef? 15:24
Here it's stuck at: ===> Testing: Log::Minimal:ver<0.0.1>
...using 100% of CPU and almost 90% of RAM just before I killed it 15:25
(Of 48G RAM in total)
sena_kun let me try it...
though I Have only 16 on board. :D 15:26
sena_kun jkramer, confirmed. 15:27
it starts to eat ram _very_ fast.
sena_kun killed it after 2 gb were eaten in mere seconds. 15:27
moritz try with --notest 15:28
jkramer Worked with --/test and the module itself seems to work too once it's installed 15:34
dpaste.com/0233CS8 15:39
Any idea why this doesn't work?
moritz maybe it's not smart enough to autobox the named param into an array? 15:40
jkramer Hmm I thought I had read somewhere that using an array there would allow the option to be given multipe times 15:41
But I can't find it now, probably my imagination ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ 15:42
tyil jkramer: tio.run/##K0gtyjH7/7@4NEnB19HTT8PK...XnQ1lJiUUA 15:46
yoleaux 24 Oct 2018 14:57Z <uzl> tyil: Great Hackerrank (part 2) write-up! BTW, in What's your name? - "... it's .Str value..." -> "... its .Str value..."
24 Oct 2018 14:58Z <uzl> tyil: in Designer Door Mat - "A thing I learned is that the .. operator that generates a sequence...". I think the ... operator could've done the job but I'm not sure if it'd have some downside.
tyil it should be possible, but I'm not sure why your example doesnt 15:47
like this it also works tio.run/##K0gtyjH7/7@4NEnB19HTT8Oq...z4eykhKLAA 15:51
but adding a -s variant still breaks it
tyil .tell uzl thanks, I fixed the "it's" to "its" in my local repo, I'll push it when I get home. On the .. vs ... operator, I am aware, but when I asked the question on SO I was advised to use .. and .reverse it 15:59
yoleaux tyil: I'll pass your message to uzl.
xinming m: my %h = :a<x y x>; for %h<a> { .perl.say }; 16:47
camelia $("x", "y", "x")
xinming Is this desired behavior?
in for %h<a> returns the whole "array"
Just for the clarification. 16:48
m: my %h = :a<x y x>; for %h<a>[] { .perl.say };
camelia "x"
"y"
"x"
xinming This one does work. Just wanted to clarify the for %h<a> thing in this case
Zoffix xinming: that's normal behaviour. Hashes and Arrays auto-place their values into Scalar containers: perl6advent.wordpress.com/2017/12/02/ 17:02
m: my %h := :a<x y x>; for %h<a> { .perl.say }; 17:03
camelia "x"
"y"
"x"
Zoffix (binding the Pair directly to the %h var above)
jkramer m: (\('lol', :foo(123))).map(*.gist).join(' ').say
camelia lol
jkramer How can I map over everything in the capture? 17:04
Zoffix jkramer: .list gives you positionals; .hash gives you nameds
xinming Zoffix: Thanks. 17:04
jkramer Yeah but what if I want to iterate over all of them in the order they were given? :) 17:05
Zoffix I don't think any order is offered for named args.
Zoffix m: (\("lol", :foo(123))) andthen flat(.list, .hash).map(*.gist).join(" ").say 17:06
camelia lol foo => 123
jkramer (\("lol", :foo(123), 'test')) andthen flat(.list, .hash).map(*.gist).join(" ").say 17:06
evalable6 lol test foo => 123
jkramer :( 17:06
Zoffix m: dd \("lol", :foo(123), 'test') 17:07
camelia \("lol", "test", :foo(123))
jkramer Hmm. How else would I pass on arguments from one sub to another as they are? 17:08
Zoffix A Capture.
jkramer: what difference is there between ("lol", "test", :foo(123)) and ("lol", :foo(123), "test") ? 17:09
jkramer Zoffix: I want to print them in the order the user gave em to the sub :)
I'm making a log module with the obvious methods debug, warn, info etc and want to pass the args on to a generic log method which then formats and prints them 17:10
Would be weird if $log.debug("Here's a pair:", :foo(123), " and here's a number:", 123) would print the stuff in random order :) 17:11
I guess I could use a slurpy array and pass it around but I thought this is exactly what captures are made for 17:13
Zoffix But slurpy array wouldn't capture any positionals... 17:14
Captures were made for capturing the arguments, but named arguments aren't ordered.
leont Yeah, been bitten by that before, solved that by reordering them in a way that made sense in my case, that approach may not be workable for all situations 17:15
jkramer Hmpf 17:15
jkramer So it's generally not possible to pass a pair as a positional argument? 17:18
m: sub x(Pair $x) { say $x }; x(:lol(123)) 17:19
camelia Too few positionals passed; expected 1 argument but got 0
in sub x at <tmp> line 1
in block <unit> at <tmp> line 1
Zoffix There's a billion ways to pass a Pair as positional
m: sub x(Pair $x) { say $x }; x (:lol(123))
camelia lol => 123
Zoffix m: sub x(Pair $x) { say $x }; x :lol(123).Pair
camelia lol => 123
Zoffix m: sub x(Pair $x) { say $x }; x 123 R=> 'lol'
camelia lol => 123
jkramer Huh 17:20
m: sub x(Pair $x) { say $x }; x (:lol(123))
camelia lol => 123
jkramer Ah, the space
Zoffix (parens around the Pair make it get passed as positional) 17:21
jkramer I'll just assume no one every wants to log a pair :) 17:22
Zoffix m: use nqp; sub meow (|) { dd nqp::atpos(nqp::savecapture(), 0) }(42, 100, :54foo) 17:33
camelia This representation (MVMCallCapture) does not support positional access (for type CallCapture)
in sub meow at <tmp> line 1
in block <unit> at <tmp> line 1
Zoffix Is CallCapture a proper class defined in nqp/Perl6? 17:34
moritz m: CallCapture
camelia 5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling <tmp>
Undeclared name:
CallCapture used at line 1
moritz no 17:36
seems to be a java class in the java backend
Zoffix I'm not using Java tho :)
Wanted to see what methods it got, but I guess it's entirely created in C code 17:37
Zoffix gives up 17:41
Zoffix jkramer: don't see any lowlevel ops that got all the args ordered as they were at the call. I notice they are still ordered in QASTs, so the only thing I can think of is writing a Slang to hook into signature creation and create an array of named+pos args by walking the QAST and… doing something with them, I guess 17:42
Zoffix Tho even with QAST, stuff like `:foo, "bar", :!foo` already removes the first arg 17:44
Zoffix m: gist.github.com/zoffixznet/40a07ff...f3e799bbde 18:11
camelia Got args: foo => 42, bar, ber => 10
Got args: meow, z => 1, bar, ber => 10
Zoffix ehehehe 18:12
Zoffix jkramer: ^ :) obviously extremely hackish, pokes at internals, uses unsupported features (NQP), and experimental features (Slangs) 18:12
TimToady well, that's basically macro territory anyway 18:15
Garland_g[m] My perl6 linter for ALE (vim plugin for asynchronous linting) was merged today. It uses perl6 -c. github.com/w0rp/ale#supported-languages 18:17
Zoffix neat 18:20
weekly: <Garland_g[m]> My perl6 linter for ALE (vim plugin for asynchronous linting) was merged today. It uses perl6 -c. github.com/w0rp/ale#supported-languages 18:21
notable6 Zoffix, Noted!
El_Che Kudos, Garland_g[m] 18:22
the only thing with the -c is that most of the time ot's delivered disabled, because it does run code, maybe external 18:23
that's the case with syntastic 18:24
TimToady Zoffix: just a heads up wrt the alias, which I'm thinking of as "It's the stage name (but Perl 6 still cashes the checks)"; at the moment I'm liking Raku the best for a short name (it's 4 letters like Enya or Pink or Gaga), with long names of either Raku-go or Go-raku (where "go" is Japanese 語 for "language") because I'm not terribly fond of the "-lang" neologism 18:26
Ofun is a close second, but unfortunately "fun" is Japanese for excrement :) 18:27
also Raku pottery is "imperfect but sophisticated", so that's a fit :) 18:29
most of the existing uses of "raku" in trademarks appears to be for medical supplies or food processing 18:30
and there doesn't seem to be an existing "raku" command, at least that Linux Mint knows about 18:31
haukex Hi all! +1 Raku :-) btw, will the version numbering continue to be 6.letters?
TimToady
.oO(raku roku)
 18:32
Zoffix TimToady: sounds good :) +1 for Raku :) 18:33
haukex: pretty much.
"Raku 6.d". I like it. 18:34
TimToady currently in Japanese "goraku" is an amusement center, while "rakugo" is comic storytelling
haukex I had an shower thought the other day (literally): 2018 -> '18; Perl 5.28 -> Perl '28 ?? (feel free to shoot me down, I have no say or stake in it :-) l
TimToady though, unfortunately, that could also be read as "Raku 5" :)
jmerelo TimToady: go-raku++ 18:36
Zoffix haukex: you're in good company then. Because we don't call shots on Perl 5.28 either :P 18:36
TimToady oh, also, it can be read as "rock you" :)
Zoffix :D
TimToady as in we-will-we-will
haukex heh 18:37
jmerelo TimToady: rok-u!!! rok-u!!
TimToady though, to be honest, rakkyuu in Japanese means to fumble the ball :) 18:38
haukex Zoffix: I meant in general, for any 5.x where x>6 (btw, I'm perfectly happy with Perl 5 staying Perl 5, it's just I've read others complaints) 18:39
Zoffix haukex: that's what they should do, but that'd hurt Perl 6, so I hope they won't :P 18:40
TimToady I don't think it'll much matter really 18:40
haukex Zoffix: hm, I see your point... my idea was of the "*try* to make everyone happy" sort :-) Raku 6.d = Perl 6.d, Perl '30 = Perl 5.30 18:42
Zoffix haukex: where does that place perl11 then? :) 18:43
TimToady
.oO(Her long name is "Raku Roku Rock-U" so the 6 is permanent...)
 18:44
haukex Emojis I guess? ;-) the next Unicode version is adding an onion
Zoffix u: butterfly 18:45
unicodable6 Zoffix, U+1F98B BUTTERFLY [So] (🦋)
Zoffix It's even listed on Unicode sponsored chars page as dedicated to Perl 6 :)
TimToady if it's invoked as "raku" I'm pretty sure we can assume we're dealing with p6 numbering
TimToady anyway, "it's the stage name for Perl 6" seems like about the right level of cultural hack to me 18:47
haukex Zoffix: nice, in your name too :-) 18:50
haukex TimToady: +1 18:51
TimToady We invented the dual licensing, so why not dual naming too? 18:52
ss/the // 18:53
haukex I think some people will still want to interpret it as a "rename", but I liked your statement at last year's YAPC about Perl being a culture
TimToady if people need to think of it that way, they may, but there's to be no stigmatizing of people who feel differently 18:55
it's an 'any' junction, not a 'one' junction 18:56
haukex I agree... if someone wants to think of it as a "rename" to feel better about it, that's probably a good thing :-) 18:59
TimToady that being said, sometimes in context "Enya" communicates better than "Eithne Pádraigín Ní Bhraonáin" :)
haukex I stayed out of the whole 5 "versus" 6 thing, which is probably why I can't wrap my head around why some people have such strong feelings about it, but I've been reading a bit more about it recently. 19:00
anyway, I'm just happy that both 5 and 6 are great langauges :-) 19:01
IIRC Enya (the artist's) music was used in a Beck's (beer) commercial... that's the first association that comes to me ;-) 19:02
El_Che TimToady: you don't cease to amaze me :) 19:05
raku is the best, adding Go as a pre- or postfix may cause other confusions :)
Garland_g[m] El_Che:To clarify, the linter is disabled by default because of code execution. 19:07
TimToady El_Che: if we really wanted to confuse people we'd call it raku-golang :) 19:08
El_Che Garland_g[m]: yes, exactly. It's choosing between an anoyence and a security risk when you randomely open perl6 code from the internet :) 19:09
ryn1x Raku and Raku-go both sound real nice. Go-Raku does not flow as well IMHO. Raku 6.d looks nice too, but in this case is the 6 part of the name or version number...
SmokeMachine I like Ofun...
TimToady SmokeMachine: so do I, in fact that's the one I was considering a couple weeks ago when one of my friends mentioned I'd asked about it 19:10
TimToady but in the end Raku is a better stage name 19:11
El_Che ofun is more a inside-crowd reference which is nice, but it lack the strong pronunciation of raku
on the other hand how do you pronounce the u in this case 19:12
/uː/ or /ʊ/ 19:13
SmokeMachine Is the r of raku with the Japanese sound of r?
TimToady well, Japanese doesn't have an "uh"
El_Che translate.google.com/#ja/en/raku 19:14
TimToady if you want to pronounce it "laku" in Japan, I doubt anyone will bat an eyelash
SmokeMachine Easy?!
El_Che the japanese r sounds like a h
TimToady yes, it means "easy" or "comfort"
El_Che 楽
TimToady and yes, I made sure it wasn't the character used in "comfort women" 19:15
El_Che it's a *very* nice character for posters
TimToady well, it's essentially the same as the traditional Han character for music
El_Che and it looks like a butterfly look at it funy
SmokeMachine I’m asking that because in portugues there’s a difference between the sound of rr and r... 19:16
TimToady 樂
El_Che that a butterfly doing the rock and roll hand sign
SmokeMachine The r sound does not exists in the beginning of the word in Portuguese... so every time I say Rakudo to some one the feels strange... 19:17
TimToady らく also looks a bit like a butterfly 19:18
SmokeMachine But I like raku too
El_Che 楽: music; comfort, enjoyment; ease, simplicity; final day of a performance
I like all the translations
El_Che SmokeMachine: just say Haku 19:18
like Hio de Janeirho 19:19
TimToady well, it can also mean things like "drop", hence "fumble" or "fail"
El_Che :)
TimToady there is much space for punning the name in Japanese :)
SmokeMachine El_Che: r in the beginning of the word sounds like rr...
El_Che TimToady: it's applicable to you as a Japanese student
SmokeMachine: it sounded more like a strong H to me when I was in Brazil 19:20
TimToady of course, the fact that it's a back-formation from rakudo helps too
El_Che haven't been to portugal though
TimToady: I am looking at translation in other languages just to be sure 19:21
TimToady it might also justify a better backronym for Moar
SmokeMachine El_Che: the sound of r on rio is different of the r in janeiro
TimToady El_Che: it's mostly just place names 19:22
El_Che in Estonian is means "the cell" according to google, maybe AlexDaniel` can tell us more
SmokeMachine: true
omg
SmokeMachine El_Che: I’m Brazilian
TimToady it's also an odd verb form for some not-positive things in certain slavic languages, I think
El_Che SmokeMachine: yes, I suspected so :) 19:23
SmokeMachine El_Che: I’m Brazilian
haukex Armenian: raku = raccoon
El_Che in Vietnamese I get cancer
TimToady that too
but all those were taken into consideration :)
El_Che in Uzbek: I get raccoon
haukex Bosnian: cancer
El_Che I like that one
Urdu: hold on 19:24
haukex same for Croatian
El_Che in Telugo it's a raghu :)
TimToady I guess we'll have to rename the Tropic of Cancer now... 19:25
haukex Hawaiian: rash
El_Che also applicabl
e
haukex Indonesian: confess
timotimo Krita (art program) also doesn't have the best name when you look at some language ...
El_Che it difficult to find a short 4-letter name without some weird translation somewhere 19:27
ofun in Yoruba means "one of them"
in Urdu "faithful" 19:28
haukex ok, that was most of the Google Translate languages
El_Che (although without native speakers weighting in we don't know if the nice translation have conotations)
haukex true, Google Translate can often be quite inaccurate 19:29
TimToady well, it's not like we're trying to sell a car named "nova" :) 19:30
haukex I like how when you click the audio button in google once, it says the word normally, and when you click it a second time it says it much slower ;-)
TimToady
.oO(moar = Meta Objects Amuse Raku)
 19:42
El_Che haukex: google translate have a sarcastic mode :) 19:44
"Meta Objects Arouse Raku" could be an option as well 19:45
haukex "what, you didn't hear me the first time? okay, I'll say it reeeal slow" ;-) (but seriously, a useful feature)
lizmat ,oO( Moar Objects Around Raku ) 19:46
El_Che that could work
lizmat for that necessary bit of recursiveness 19:47
El_Che Don't ask TimToady to pick an alias, he'll alias the lot :)
TimToady Above, Adorn, I looked at most of the A words already :)
Arm, Allow, etc 19:48
I just thought "Amuse" fit better with the stagename vibe :)
El_Che Amerce 19:49
TimToady Arouse is perhaps NSFW
El_Che yeah :) 19:50
TimToady: on the other hand, wearing a "Roku" t-shirt at YAPC-JP may be a little tricky :) 19:51
TimToady there is that 19:52
El_Che (on the other hand, I may be the wrong person to bounce off ideas. Too much Monty Python) 19:53
(Oh, I did it again :) ) 19:54
TimToady of course the middle two letters of "ofun" also had various possibilites...
El_Che lol 19:54
TimToady yes, I thought about a lot of things over the last few weeks :)
El_Che Gloria had trouble understanding why you started laughing in the middle of the night :) 19:55
nige TimToady .... thanks for "raku" ... that ticks all the boxes 20:03
nige :-) 20:03
El_Che also
if get fed up with the butterflu, raku-n means raccoon 20:04
also a cool mascot :)
SmokeMachine so, is rakudo the way of raku? 20:07
El_Che Wow 20:08
good none
good one
AlexDaniel well, I'll take it, but to be honest I'm not sure why everyone is so happy about that particular one. Though I'm indeed happy that there's at least something coming 20:10
right off the bat couldn't figure out how to pronounce that R there, but maybe I'm the only one 20:11
El_Che AlexDaniel: you can alias the pronounciation
being an international buch, we'll always have that problem 20:12
AlexDaniel and then there's also “long name” coming? Like if this name is not confusing by itself already
El_Che (I propose the french pronounciation)
AlexDaniel there's also… I don't know… something about it just doesn't ring to me as a name 20:15
but again, I'll take it if that is it
El_Che AlexDaniel: what was your favorite
SmokeMachine could someone who speak Japanese confirm if rakudo could be translated of "the way of raku", please? (im curious about that) 20:16
AlexDaniel El_Che: I liked 6lang and ofun 20:17
there's just some catchiness about them that I like, that raku lacks IMO 20:18
El_Che funy, It's the other way around for me 20:19
Zoffix SmokeMachine: well, Rakudo is "Way of the Camel" 20:38
SmokeMachine Zoffix: yes, I know... but once "raku" is a thing... I think it can be "way of raku" too, no? 20:39
Zoffix SmokeMachine: no idea
El_Che rakudo is translated as "comic" and "paradise" by google 20:40
Zoffix AlexDaniel: it's fine. Don't look a gifted horse in the teeth. It works well when combined with Perl 6 ("Raku Perl 6"). It fits with the compiler name and the already established Raku* name due to that compiler.
AlexDaniel 🤷 20:41
tobs TimTowny
Zoffix I'm slightly disappointed raku.org / raku.party were taken, but I guess that's probaly the case for all 4-letter names now adays 20:42
nige yes - domain name squatters are all over less than 5 letters 20:43
El_Che raku-lang.org? 20:44
nige like the Google's pronunciation "rarkoo"
AlexDaniel El_Che: awesome
Zoffix El_Che: well, I followed TimToady's comments about disliking the -lang trend and instead using "goraku.org" with "go" for "language" or something. And it works in pure english as in "Go [with] Raku" 20:45
El_Che Zoffix: luckily there isn't a popular language called Go 20:46
oh wait
Zoffix: It's just for the domain, not for the alias itself
Zoffix Quick! Eradicate all uses of "Go" from everywhere for **od! 20:46
El_Che You got to give it to them, it was a good find 20:47
timotimo when is Inline::Go?
El_Che ungoogable but they had a way around that :) 20:47
Zoffix "good find" for what? Naming a language "go"? C'mon 20:48
El_Che 2 letter command that those everything?
Genious
go fmt
go build
go get
Zoffix "Genious" indeed :P
El_Che go run
lol
Zoffix Hm, I registered goraku.org among a couple of others, and all the others show up in my control panel, except for goraku.org, yet trying to re-register goraku.org says me it's taken -_- 20:49
Zoffix oh well. It's not even the final decision to go with raku 20:50
nige "do raku" oh ... hang on ...
rakudo 20:51
:-)
timotimo let's do raku 20:57
nige ramen & raku
[Coke] yawns. 21:11
El_Che [Coke]: Curb your enthousiasm 21:25
:)
[Coke] That was just me being cold and tired, sorry. :) 21:44
El_Che [Coke]: no prob 22:22

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