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weekly Rakudo status meetings with phase transitions: Tue 19:00 UTC | IR clogs at irclog.perlgeek.de/phasers/today Set by moderator on 5 December 2010. |
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| diakopter | mberends: hi :) | 18:28 | |
| mberends | ahoy! | ||
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| diakopter | my report: took a break from the -rx portion of clrnqp-rx .. but when I pick it up again, I'll be blocked on questions for pmichaud | 18:59 | |
| mberends | testing 6model/dotnet atm on Mono 2.4.4, no failures yet :) | 19:02 | |
| diakopter | cool | ||
| colomon | o/ | 19:03 | |
| diakopter | 05-comments.t fails sporadically on .Net, we have no idea why | ||
| sorear | hi | ||
| TimToady | .oO(if it's random, it must be the GC :) |
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| sorear | no #phasers today? | ||
| TimToady | sezhoo? | ||
| mberends | this is it! | ||
| pmichaud | \\o/ #phasers | 19:04 | |
| sorear | the lack of o/ spam at 11:01 local time | ||
| mberends | \\o/ greetings pmichaud! | ||
| sorear | o/ anyway | 19:05 | |
| diakopter | TimToady: :P actually it fails in the parrot portion (parsing), so YES. :D | ||
| so I guess I meant, parrot-on-windows and not .Net | 19:06 | ||
| PerlJam | greetings! | 19:07 | |
| PerlJam phases in | |||
| diakopter | sorear: your update? | 19:10 | |
| sorear | done: | 19:11 | |
| @foo[*-1] and @foo[1,2,3] | |||
| INIT | |||
| require | 19:12 | ||
| diakopter | \\0/ | ||
| sorear | starting to play with the new codegen | ||
| end | |||
| earlier, I had Perl code generating C# | 19:13 | ||
| I'm trying to replace this with C# code using SRE | |||
| which should be quite a bit faster, also, a bit more flexible | 19:14 | ||
| colomon | replace the perl with C#, or the C# with C# using SRE? | 19:16 | |
| sorear | the former | 19:17 | |
| moritz_ did some work on the advent calendar. Solved some of masak's coding contest problems. No further Perl 6 hacking. | |||
| diakopter | pmichaud: did you see my mention of you above | 19:22 | |
| pmichaud | diakopter: yes, I did. Let me know when you pick it up again, I'll try to squeeze out some time. | ||
| diakopter | it's probably a quick q&a | ||
| pmichaud | my status report: I continue to be distracted from p6-hacking by other things going on around here. | ||
| Util made no progress on anything but masak's 5-problem contest. | 19:26 | ||
| TimToady | 'tis the season to be crawly... | 19:28 | |
| colomon is frustrated by his progress on masak's contest. | |||
| I did work around .ord and add .ords and .chrs at TimToady++'s behest over the weekend. | 19:29 | ||
| And an Advent post. | |||
| TimToady | colomon++ | ||
| Util | colomon++ | 19:30 | |
| colomon | Planning on one and maybe two more Advent posts, and a lot more hacking on the contest in the next week. | 19:32 | |
| .eor | |||
| PerlJam | TimToady: any chance you'll submit a post to the advent calendar? | 19:35 | |
| pmichaud: what about you? | 19:36 | ||
| there are still several days open | |||
| TimToady | mebbe, it's a little hard for me to type at the moment, because my spacebar thumb is sore | 19:37 | |
| pmichaud | PerlJam: I'll look at the calendar and see if it meshes with mine at all | 19:38 | |
| TimToady | getting old sucks, sometimes | ||
| PerlJam | TimToady: You /were/ blessed with two thumbs :-) | ||
| TimToady | yes, the other thumb is how I'm typing at all :) | 19:40 | |
| diakopter | probably it hurts just to keep it lifted off the touchpad/spacebar | 19:41 | |
| diakopter guesses | |||
| pmichaud | maybe.you.should.find.some.other.key.that.you.can.use.instead.of.space.to.type.:-) | 19:46 | |
| then.you.don't.need.to.use.spacebar.thumb.at.all. | |||
| if.only.there.was.some.tool.that.could.then.be.used.to.translate.this.other.character.into.spaces... | 19:47 | ||
| what's.the.opposite.of.Acme::Bleach? :-P | |||
| diakopter | Acme::Sharpie | 19:48 | |
| pmichaud | I suppose we'd want Acme::Etch -- which bleaches the unmasked portions of the template leaving only the desirable traces | ||
| Acme::EtchingSolution | |||
| PerlJam | but then you'd need an ultraviolet light or some other catalyst. | 19:49 | |
| pmichaud | TimToady++ is bright enough to be his own catalyst :-) | ||
| I like Acme::Sharpie, though. | 19:53 | ||
| TimToady has this habit of derailing productive conversation... | 19:54 | ||
| mberends | :) | ||
| diakopter | as long as it's onto another set of productive rails... | ||
| PerlJam | though the talk of etching made me wonder if there were already a "line-drawing" version of Camelia. | 19:55 | |
| mberends | regarding 6model/java, it's now clear to me that the generated-goto compiler requirement rules out Java as a target language. The Java subproject will have to become bytecode based, say 6model/jvm. If anyone feels like working on that with me, please volunteer. I must first recuperate from my $work induced tuit deprivation though, expected to be better in January. | 20:01 | |
| sorear | Alternatively, you could just design and implement a tiny JVM language with gotos | 20:03 | |
| diakopter | heh | 20:04 | |
| 'just'ified by works | |||
| mberends++ # having lots of $work | 20:06 | ||
| mberends | I'll try whatever works soonest. | ||
| diakopter | sorear: i'm sure there are other structural/imperative languages for the JVM with labels/goto | 20:07 | |
| ok, I'm not sure | |||
| I highly suspect | |||
| sorear | Is 6model/dotnet bytecode based yet? | 20:13 | |
| mberends | no, it generates C# afaik | 20:16 | |
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| mberends | yes, verified, the Linux oriented try.sh script writes to the fixed name RakudoOutput.cs to pass on to Mono. | 20:19 | |
| sorear | tylercurtis! | 20:22 | |
| diakopter | ... at this stage it wouldn't be too difficult *for me* to write a CIL backend (interfacing with/wrapping runsharp), but it probably wouldn't correspond to how jnthn's imagining it... so I was going to discuss it thoroughly with jnthn beforehand. | 20:24 | |
| sorear | diakopter: How is runsharp better than System.Linq.Expression? | 20:25 | |
| diakopter | sorear: I don't know whether System.Linq.Expressions.GotoExpression is implemented in mono (maybe it is) | 20:27 | |
| sorear | it has to be, the DLR critically relies on it | ||
| diakopter | it may have relied on System.Linq.Expression in .Net 3.5 | 20:28 | |
| but not System.Linq.Expressions.GotoExpression b/c that doesn't exist in .Net 3.5 | |||
| b/c the DLR definitely works on just 3.5 | |||
| oh.. but in different namespaces | 20:29 | ||
| (not System.Linq) | |||
| (now I remember) | |||
| sorear | the DLR uses "expression trees 2.0", which were cored in 4.0 | ||
| diakopter | yeah; afai remember a namespace change was involved. | 20:30 | |
| so, to answer your question, runsharp *could be* better than the Linq.Expressions b/c it's a much smaller dependency, and I have no idea how good its generated code is... maybe it's decent. | 20:32 | ||
| sorear | well, afaik 6model already depends on C# 4.0 | 20:33 | |
| for "var" declarations | |||
| diakopter | no :P | ||
| var was in 3.0 | |||
| sorear | so System.Linq.Expressions is a null dependency | ||
| diakopter | I was speaking of load-time dependency, not just on-disk | 20:34 | |
| sorear: I'm gun-shy of the DLR (and its Linq.Expressions) mostly b/c of the severe perf problems msft had with it | 20:49 | ||
| (when implementing ironruby & ironpython) | |||
| sorear: of course, such things don't matter once we're working in an App::Persistent-like setting | 20:50 | ||
| (similar to what .Net does on Windows with its ".Net Runtime Optimization" windows service) | 20:51 | ||
| sorear | "severe perf problems", hehehe | 20:52 | |
| diakopter | yeah, I think it's fair to call them that | ||
| sorear | all the docs like to gloat about how "fast" it is | ||
| diakopter | bah | ||
| in some benchmarks, yeah.. but startup time always kills them | |||
| when compared to all the other pythons and rubys | 20:53 | ||
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| spinclad | .oO( meeting done? or just phased out? ) |
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| sorear | it never really got started. | 21:55 | |
| diakopter | I don't see how my report at -1 minute wasn't a real start | 21:56 | |
| spinclad | a few other reports sprinkled in, and some relevent talk derailed to other relevent talk... | 22:00 | |
| sounds like an ordinary meeting, just quieter than usual | 22:02 | ||
| sorear | *much* quieter | 22:05 | |
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