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weekly Perl 6 status meetings with phase transitions: Wed 17:30 UTC | IR clogs at irclog.perlgeek.de/phasers/today Set by moderator on 10 November 2011. |
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| jnthn | I'll miss #phasers due to an evening $dayjob task | 14:34 | |
| Quick preport... | |||
| * Much of the week was sucked up by $dayjob, travel, attending London Perl Workshop and visiting | |||
| * LPW went well - gave two talks | 14:35 | ||
| * Since I got back, worked with moritz++ got get the last things blocking bigint dealt with, and it got merged | |||
| * Started to dig into the NFA branch of NQP | |||
| In the next week... | |||
| * Tuit supply way better than the last couple of weeks | |||
| * (hopefully) :) | |||
| * Plan to focus on NFA branch and getting us some protoregex support in nom | 14:36 | ||
| * Will also fix that bigint boolification bug before the release | |||
| * Probably other bits | |||
| Planning | |||
| * We're missing a Rakudo release person this month - sign up! ;) | 14:37 | ||
| * I'm aiming that we are in shape for a Rakudo * relesae in December. This means I plan to focus on protoregexes, NCI and other bits that unblock the ecosystem. | |||
| EOR | |||
| Util | Pre-report: | 16:37 | |
| (I may be in-and-out of #phasers due to $WORK.) | |||
| # Done: | |||
| * Fixed typos in Perl 6 specs. | |||
| * Found conflict in [S03] w.r.t. left-hand-side of xx operator. | |||
| * Unravelled and committed about half of my 5-year "Perl 5 to Perl 6 translator" code slush: | |||
| = github.com/Util/Blue_Tiger#readme | |||
| Feedback/review welcome from all perspectives | |||
| # Plan to do: | |||
| * Finish committing the Blue Tiger code slush: | |||
| = is_structure_like() | |||
| = for my $i (@a) {...} to for @a -> $i {...} | |||
| = other control structure changes. | |||
| * Brush off Mac binary creator for upcoming Rakudo Star | |||
| # Blockers: | 16:38 | ||
| * $WORK | |||
| EOR | |||
| tadzik | pre-report (classes during #phasers): closed a bunch of tickets, we're under 450. Abandoned the idea of a META.info dedicated parser due to regex mess. Plans: more ticket closing, maybe. EOR | 16:40 | |
| colomon | pre-report: | 16:57 | |
| * Did nothing p6ish except worry that the state of the module tools is sadly lacking in both nom and niecza. | |||
| plan: | |||
| * Hope to get the mandelbrot script working in Gtk (note: potential Advent calendar topic) | |||
| * Continue advocating for the modules | |||
| EOR | |||
| diakopter | pre-report ($work during #phasers): rolled back most of the optimization attempts in nqplua. Stalled on porting QRegex due to the lack of labels/goto in Lua 5.1. They exist in lua 5.2, and the author of luajit mentioned to me they're on his TODO but with no known time horizon. Started digging into QRegex NFA branch to increase its bus number. Tried to debug protoregexes. EOR | 17:05 | |
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| Util | Hello | 17:32 | |
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| TimToady | o/ | 17:33 | |
| mikemol | o/ | ||
| Just a fly on the wall. :) | |||
| TimToady too :) | |||
| colomon | \\o | ||
| Util | \\o | 17:34 | |
| TimToady | actually, in my case, the Walls have ears | ||
| mikemol | I *really* want to get around to implenting NQP in C++, but that's not going to happen any time soon. But it's something I actively ponder a lot. :) | ||
| TimToady | porting Perl 6 to C++ could make it a super gaming engine, so you maybe you need to find some young gamer to do it in his basement when he should be studying :) | 17:39 | |
| mikemol | I said NQP, not Perl 6. You've still got NOM to worry about, there. :) | 17:40 | |
| TimToady | 6model should be able to handle C++ style objects pretty well, eventually | ||
| TimToady suspects that most of the poeple who are serious about #phasers can't attend today | 17:42 | ||
| is there anything serious that anyone wants to discuss? | |||
| mikemol | Perl6 to C++ has at least a couple snags. First is eval(). Second is that C++ classes aren't mutable at runtime. You can modify instance data, but you lost the ability to modify the classes the moment you compiled. | ||
| PerlJam is belatedly here | |||
| mikemol lets the real discussion continue. :) | |||
| Util | As pre-reported, looking for feedback on Perl 5 to Perl 6 translator: github.com/Util/Blue_Tiger | 17:43 | |
| PerlJam | all of the pre-reports look like "I won't be at #phasers because of $work or $school" | ||
| colomon | Util: I'll try to take a proper look at it sometime soon. Util++ | 17:45 | |
| sorear | aaagh | ||
| hi, I'm here, I thought #phasers was in 45, accursed DST | |||
| TimToady | for a moment, thought someone had stabbed you | 17:46 | |
| sorear | did: discussed unicode stuff a bit with TimToady (who wants to see case, space, and hyphen sensitive <:General_Category<Other_Letter>> (or is that <:Gc<Lo>> ?)) and khw | 17:47 | |
| started work on a C# Unicode Character Database library | |||
| TimToady | \\o/ | 17:48 | |
| Util | colomon: thanks! | ||
| TimToady wonders if it shouldn't be in Perl 6 someday | |||
| sorear | will do: more unicode stuff, planning to talk to the TR18 folks about their interpretation of grapheme mode | ||
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| sorear | very few tuits this month. | 17:48 | |
| EOR | |||
| PerlJam: I didn't make it because I overslept | 17:49 | ||
| TimToady | or in the C# subset of Perl 6... | ||
| sorear: btw, I'm okay with simple short/long aliases, or at least okayer than with casefolding | 17:51 | ||
| the long ones could require declaration, if there's overhead | 17:52 | ||
| diakopter | oh; I didn't realize #phasers was now | 17:57 | |
| it's supposed to be 9:30 PST 10:30 PDT? | |||
| PerlJam | 1730 UTC | 17:58 | |
| mberends | o/ | 18:00 | |
| sorry for late arrival | |||
| report: gave a great talk about Niecza, Gtk and Tetris at London Perl Workshop. .EOR :) | 18:01 | ||
| colomon | mberends++ | 18:03 | |
| Util | mberends++ | 18:06 | |
| mberends | I'll commit the slides into niecza/docs :) | ||
| Util | I will certainly read them! | 18:09 | |
| sorear | me too! | 18:10 | |
| colomon | So, I promised to push this: anyone have a feel for what needs to be done to get module tools working in nom and niecza? | 18:11 | |
| Right now it feels like there's a lot of cool stuff going on, but the core state of Perl 6 has regressed eighteen months or so.... | |||
| PerlJam | colomon: could you define "module tools" for me? | 18:12 | |
| colomon | pies / panda / ufo / whatever | ||
| PerlJam | thanks | 18:13 | |
| TimToady | colomon: the core state of rakudo has regressed, but I don't see much regression in other implementations... | ||
| colomon | PS we also need to figure out how to allow people to install both niecza modules and rakudo modules at the same time. | ||
| TimToady: niecza never had those tools working at all. That's not a regression for niecza, but it's not helpful, either. | |||
| sorear | \\o/ mberends | 18:18 | |
| Util | A roadmap of all the current pieces of the puzzle would be helpful. pies / panda / ufo, what is deprecated, which does what part of the job, and which fails on what implementations. | 18:19 | |
| sorear | +1 | ||
| and _what the job is_ | |||
| colomon | +1 | ||
| PerlJam | something like perl6.org/compilers/features.html but for modules and applications would be nice | 18:20 | |
| colomon | sorear: at the big picture level, I'd say the job is to be able to A) easily install modules and B) easily run their test suite. Also would be good to be able to C) easily create new modules for the ecosystem. | 18:22 | |
| mberends | _what the job is_ almost deserves to be specced, as an addition to github.com/rakudo/rakudo/blob/nom/...oposal.pod and maybe moved to another location. | 18:23 | |
| [Coke] | can we add the "works with" <impl> <latest version> info to modules.perl6.org/ ? That seems like a useful place for it. | 18:24 | |
| PerlJam | [Coke]++ | ||
| colomon | [Coke]: that's a great idea, but right now we don't have any way to generate that information other than running each module by hand. | 18:25 | |
| Util | Tornado warning here. Signing off; will backscroll later. | ||
| [Coke] | colomon: Have to start somewhere, yes. | ||
| TimToady | Util++ gives new meaning to the term "duck typing" | 18:26 | |
| diakopter | Alabama/Georgia border? | 18:28 | |
| colomon | diakopter: yes | ||
| TimToady++ # had to read that one three times before I got it, but then I laughed very, very loudly. :) | |||
| I wish tadzik++ were here, as he has a clear idea what panda (pies?) needs done to run on nom. That would be a good start, I guess. | 18:33 | ||
| oh, hey, one other issue for the p6 community: are we going to try to get some p6 tasks into the TPF part of the Google Code-In? | 18:51 | ||
| PerlJam | that would be cool | 18:54 | |
| I can't think of many "high school level" problems though. | 18:55 | ||
| colomon | here's a list of the p5 ones: wiki.enlightenedperl.org/gci2011/gci2011/ideas | 19:01 | |
| I'd say there are probably lots of open p6 issues easier than the medium difficulty / high difficulty tasks there | |||
| diakopter | what is perl5i | 19:06 | |
| PerlJam | It's something that tries to be perl6-like but keep everything in a perl 5 frame (if that makes enough sense) | 19:07 | |
| sorear | search.cpan.org/~mschwern/perl5i-v2.../perl5i.pm | ||
| colomon | github.com/schwern/perl5i | ||
| sorear | TimToady: how doy ou feel about <:gEnErAlCaTeGoRy<Lo>>? not strictly a perversion of smartmatching to fuzzily match the _keys_ | 19:15 | |
| (slight reminder: property names and values (except Uppercase_Mapping and suchlike, which you shouldn't be using directly in regexes anyway) are restricted to printable ASCII characters, whereupon case-folding is simple and linguistically well defined | 19:17 | ||
| TimToady | I'm okay with canonicalizing those | 19:22 | |
| but I still don't think that casefolding has much place in programming, being steeped in Unix culture | 19:24 | ||
| sorear out | 19:28 | ||
| jnthn back | 19:29 | ||
| tadzik is here | 20:23 | ||
| jnthn | o/ tadzik | 20:24 | |
| tadzik | ohai | 20:25 | |
| jnthn | tadzik: I'm working on protoregexes atm. | ||
| tadzik | \\o/ | ||
| supercool | |||
| jnthn | tadzik: Hopefully once that's back, we can get close to having JSON::Tiny back. | ||
| colomon | tadzik: lots for you to comment on in the backlog here. ;) | ||
| tadzik | are there any unanswered questions about the ecosystem zoo? | ||
| jnthn | tadzik: Mostly, I want to know what - other than protoregexes - we need. | 20:26 | |
| tadzik | to be perfectly honest, I never tried pies/panda on niecza | ||
| jnthn: nothing from the things I could catch at compile time | |||
| jnthn: I'll grab something to eat, fake some ecosystem data and see how the whole thing works | |||
| jnthn | tadzik: OK, great | ||
| tadzik: Getting that, then NCI back up are my main goals for the week or two ahead. | 20:27 | ||
| tadzik | I'm thinking sometimes about my 6model-ish parrot object wrapper | 20:28 | |
| s/my/my idea of/ | |||
| but that's another story | |||
| jnthn | :) | ||
| colomon | tadzik++ | ||
| tadzik | for now it's nom time | 20:30 | |
| jnthn | enjoy | ||