The topic for #perl6 is: pugscode.org/ planetsix.perl.org/ | nopaste: sial.org/pbot/perl6 | pugs: [~] <m oo se> (or rakudo:, kp6:, elf: etc.) (or perl6: for all) | irclog: irc.pugscode.org/
Set by TimToady on 25 November 2008.
pugs_svn r24534 | azawawi++ | [Syntax::Highlight::Perl6] added use strict; use warnings; to tests 00:05
lichtkind_ masak have resolved the issue with the private accessor? 00:13
masak lichtkind_: which issue exactly?
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lichtkind masak: inheritance of $!accessors 00:14
masak well, TimToady and I talked about it. I don't really remember what we said, but it's in the logs somewhere. 00:15
when I think about it, it seems to me that $!accessors shouldn't be visible at all to inheriting classes. 00:16
but I'm no OO expert, so don't take my word for it.
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masak lichtkind: ah, re-found the ticket. #61500. 00:21
lichtkind renormalist: moin
renormalist lichtkind: moin
masak lichtkind: it would seem to me that the error is that Rakudo can see a $!foo from the B class. it should be a compile error, methinks. 00:22
adding this as a comment to the ticket.
lichtkind masak: this is just another privat method, and these usually do inherit
masak oh. 00:23
I'm mostly from the Java world, where private things don't inherit.
well, either it should or it shouldn't inherit. if it should, then the error is that we don't see a 7 in the second one-liner, right? 00:24
lichtkind masak: in which code? 00:25
masak oh, sorry. I thought you were looking at the ticket, too. 00:26
rakudo: class A { has $foo = 7; method x { say $!foo } }; A.new.x
p6eval rakudo 34162: OUTPUT[7␤]
masak rakudo: class A { has $foo = 7 }; class B is A { method x { say $!foo } }; B.new.x
p6eval rakudo 34162: OUTPUT[␤]
masak to me, it's worrisome enough that B can see a $!foo. 00:27
but that might be correct, depending on how Perl 6 OO works.
lichtkind masak: yes it should not but i check again
masak lichtkind++
lichtkind masak: point one: every private method is called with ! so my first suggestion was right, but: has $foo creates no accessor at all 00:33
maybe there is another bug
masak maybe.
but `has $foo` still allows access through $!foo, I'm pretty sure of that. 00:34
it's just that $!foo isn't an accessor per se, but the actual storage location.
all IIUC
lichtkind renormalist: IIUC? 00:37
masak "If I Understand [it] Correctly".
lichtkind thanks 00:38
masak my current understanding stems not from reading S12 very carefully, but from beating my head against Perl 6 OO in a real-world app.
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lichtkind :) 00:40
masak I generally find out the real way to do things by submitting Perl 6 OO rakudobugs and being told that I have the wrong expectations. :)
which is quite a luxurious way to learn, I might add. I'm enough of an early adopter that the smart people who designed Perl 6 haven't tired of answering FAQs yet. 00:41
so I usually get very high-quality answers.
lichtkind masak: i know without it i could not write my tutorial 00:43
masak lichtkind: I'm going to browse S12 and see if I can find an answer to the specific question "are private accessors visible from inheriting classes?". if I find no clue, I'll feel entitled to disturb People Who Know. 00:45
lichtkind masak: i really beginning to read s12 but logic tells me
masak: things like submethods would be useless if privates don't inherit 00:46
masak ooh, interesting. I haven't tried to use logic to figure it out.
lichtkind: please elaborate.
pugs_svn r24535 | azawawi++ | [Syntax::Highlight::Perl6] updated 00-syntax.t messages 00:47
r24535 | azawawi++ | [Syntax::Highlight::Perl6] added tests to test bin/hilitep6
lichtkind no thats all, im currently writing part 6 of my perl 6tut :)
masak: submethod are normal methos but they dont inherit
masak lichtkind: I know. what does that have to do with private attributes?
masak likes submethods 00:48
lichtkind lichtkind: mompl :)
masak: for what?
masak: p6 rule number ine everything is possible
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masak lichtkind: sorry, what did your question "for what?" refer to? 00:48
lichtkind why you like submethods i hevent found any real use for that yet 00:49
masak ah.
well, BUILD is a submethod. 00:50
it gets called in object initialization.
pugs_svn r24536 | azawawi++ | [Syntax::Highlight::Perl6] Updated Changes... Not going to release to CPAN until
r24536 | azawawi++ | [Syntax::Highlight::Perl6] the STD.pm second instance parsing bug is solved.
masak we want it to act like a method, but we don't want it to be inherited.
lichtkind so you have the 4 possibilities: inhertitable, visible: yy(method), yn(my method), ny(submethod), nn(my submethod), perfect orthogonal
i mean symmetric 00:51
does it makes sense to you?
masak yes. another way of saying the same thing is that 'method'/'submethod' controls inheritability, and ''/'my' controls visibility.
lichtkind yes
masak and they are orthogonal, too. 00:52
azawawi TimToady: ping
masak that's the word I'd use, at least.
azawawi masak: i like the @ infront of my nickname ;-)
masak azawawi: yes, it suits you :) 00:53
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masak goes well with that tuxedo you're wearing. 00:53
azawawi thinks about his next step: world domination ;-)
masak azawawi: then you need to get a white angora cat, as well.
and a couple of fat gold rings.
azawawi lol
masak after that, you're set. 00:54
lichtkind hihi: at the end the truth always wins, but were staying at the begin
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masak lichtkind: aye. that's what makes #perl6 a fun place. by the end of the day one might have 150 new spectests, three new features in Rakudo, and a new operator in the synopses. :) 00:57
azawawi: for your consideration: www.eviloverlord.com/lists/overlord.html 00:58
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azawawi taking a look 01:01
lichtkind masak: i aleady have a project that consumes all the time it can, thats why i set to mysel a strict do not code rule for perl 6, doc writing only 01:02
masak lichtkind: probably a wise choice.
azawawi: make sure you skip over the introduction and go for the list itself.
lichtkind: found it! 01:03
lichtkind: "the exclamation form may be used only in the actual class, not in derived classes."
S12:567
this needs spectests, to be sure 01:04
that also means that Rakudo is too permissive in this case
masak adds this to the ticket
lichtkind masak: maybe larry changes that or my understanding of privat methods is broken 01:05
masak lichtkind: I don't know.
I'm just following the spec.
usually, when the spec is outdated, people tend to point that out when I submit rakudobug tickets. 01:06
lichtkind at least spec will be updated :) 01:15
masak: in case my plans will work out and i release this tutorials alteret on major it mag i want also some input from you because november is the first major app or isn't it? 01:17
masak lichtkind: depends on what you mean.
I hear Elf is a pretty big app too. 01:18
lichtkind app = program for end users
i heard from elf
but kepp from these things :)
masak November is the first big Perl 6 app for end users that I know of.
pugs_svn r24537 | azawawi++ | [Syntax::Highlight::Perl6] More tests for --help and no arguments for t/02-hilitep6.t 01:19
r24537 | azawawi++ | [Syntax::Highlight::Perl6] --help test discovered that --help was not working ;-)
r24537 | azawawi++ | [Syntax::Highlight::Perl6] Updated messages and as a side note: Testing rulez... ;-)
masak lichtkind: what kind of input are you interested in? 01:20
azawawi masak: the funny thing is that croak does not work always as expected, hence --help was broken 01:21
lichtkind masak: some sentences to give a real world feel what its like to code with perl 6
masak azawawi: I feel a sudden lack of context. which 'croak' and '--help' are we talking about? 01:22
lichtkind: it's wonderful and monstruous.
lichtkind masak: the article is mainly about syntax just in part one a bit of history and project status
masak ok.
lichtkind masak: please elaborate
azawawi masak: i replaced all 'die's with Carp's 'croak's per perlcritic comments and didnt test 01:23
masak azawawi: ah.
azawawi masak: until today, i started writing tests for bin/hilitep6 (previously STD_syntax_highlight)
masak lichtkind: this summer, when viklund++ and I were developing November in secret, we ran into errors all the time.
azawawi masak: and discovered that --help was not working because croak was not working...
masak lichtkind: Rakudo and Parrot have become a _lot_ more stable since then. 01:24
azawawi: :)
lichtkind: I would say that the issue known to me as '#58392' ended an era, of sorts 01:25
after that, Rakudo has been much much stabler.
azawawi masak: i think perlcritic makes ur program more bug-prone... 2 bugs until now because of it ;-)
lichtkind what was that?
masak lichtkind: lexicals handling.
lichtkind: in effect, it meant that you couldn't do recursion correctly.
lichtkind: and some other annoyances, like the second time you called a method you got strange results due to old values sitting around in variables when they shouldn't. 01:26
lichtkind hihi
masak azawawi: everything in moderation, buddy :) even percritic.
lichtkind so you have now a safe basic set of features that always get you at least done 01:27
masak lichtkind: I think so, yes.
it's a much more pleasant experience to work with Rakudo nowadays.
not all the features are there yet, but we have a good sense of which things we can use. 01:28
azawawi masak: did u write tests to test 'November'?
masak azawawi: yes. we're building coverage all the time.
if you read through the November source, you'll find places where we write '# RAKUDO', to indicate that we're waiting for a bug to get fixed in Rakudo, or for a feature to get implemented 01:29
often we put an RT ticket number in the comment as well
it creates a nice feedback cycle between November and Rakudo.
azawawi masak: and how pending rakudo issues for Nov are there so far? 01:30
masak: s/how/how many/
masak azawawi: how many? I don't know, haven't looked recently.
but nothing critical right now, actually.
which means that we're not blocking on Rakudo. 01:31
azawawi thinks of his next project 'Syntax::Highlight::Perl6VIM'
masak azawawi++
literal what would be the purpose of that?
just to split the vim stuff out of Syntax::High?light::Perl6 01:32
goddamn it
azawawi literal: hi there ;-)
masak perl6: say [3, 2, 1, "four", "five", 4 => 6, 7 => 5].sort
p6eval rakudo 34163: OUTPUT[Multiple Dispatch: No suitable candidate found for 'cmp', with signature 'PP->I'␤current instr.: 'infix:cmp' pc 13989 (src/builtins/cmp.pir:146)␤]
..pugs: OUTPUT[1234 67 5fivefour␤]
..elf 24537: OUTPUT[123Pair=HASH(0x88254e0)Pair=HASH(0x8826898)fivefour␤]
azawawi literal: the package structure is not clear; but im going to work on the command line tool first 01:33
literal ok
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azawawi literal: convert perl6.vim to perl regexp 01:33
literal eh
why? :)
if I could use Perl regexes I would have done it a lot more differently... 01:34
azawawi literal: compile perl6.vim to make a highlighter
literal or, well, hm
actually, it's not really the regexes that are the problem
more the fact that there's not state
no*
which makes it especially hard to guess whether '<' is less-than or quote-words 01:35
azawawi literal: It is like building on something that works but without the dependency on Text::VimColor; VIM is not available on all platforms and Text::VimColor has also too many FAILs. 01:37
literal I see
azawawi literal: and it is gonna be 'fun' to see if it will be faster ;-) 01:38
lichtkind syntax highlighting for perl 6 nqp pir and so on is also issue for me
literal isnt the STD highlighter much more accurate?
lichtkind because i do write a editor :)
azawawi sure
literal lichtkind: there are some vim syntax files for those in the parrot repository
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lichtkind thats the project im talked about 01:38
literal and those are much more simple than Perl 6, so they are easier to write
lichtkind literal: thanks that might help 01:39
azawawi btw, Padre::Plugin::Perl6 is already out
masak everything is more simple to parse than Perl 6. :)
azawawi but depends on Padre 0.22 which is not released
literal azawawi: how long does it take for the STD highlighter to highlight STD.pm? 01:40
lichtkind azawawi: they release everything frm pre alpa state on ,wo i dont think its usable
azawawi lichtkind: Padre folks?
lichtkind btw from my approach would be benefit padre and kommodo
masak btw, the Python people have an excellent porting-to-Python-3.0 strategy: docs.python.org/3.0/whatsnew/3.0.ht...python-3-0
lichtkind azawawi: whats the question? 01:41
azawawi literal: first time 1.70 secs if lex directory is made; subsequent calls 0.4 secs on my laptop
literal that's not bad 01:42
probably faster than vim on my laptop
azawawi lichtkind: who are u talking about that are releasing pre-alpha stuff? Padre?
literal and perl6.vim is still incompl and much less accurate :P
+ete
azawawi literal: yeah but it is gonna be great to see both projects evolve 01:43
literal I suppose
azawawi deja-vu ;-)
lichtkind azawawi: it was just an observation from other plugins
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azawawi lichtkind: Padre::Plugin::Perl6 is my work ;-) 01:44
lichtkind azawawi: i thonk i saw your picture on cpan :)
today :)
azawawi cool
literal: im also working on extracting error information from STD while typing/highlighting 01:46
literal nice
lichtkind azawawi: is Padre::Plugin::Perl6 written inperl 5?
azawawi lichtkind: yeah and depends on Syntax::Highlight::Perl6 01:47
lichtkind: you can try it on Padre 0.21 but you need to modify the startup script to 'use STD;' 01:48
lichtkind azawawi: i look at sources but like i said i write my own editor :)
literal what editor is that?
lichtkind Kephra 01:49
literal ah
I meant to try that one
azawawi link?
lichtkind but?
literal either couldn't get it installed or it wouldn't run
lichtkind kephra on cpan or
literal don't remember which
lichtkind kephra.sf.net
literal from cpan
lichtkind its the same
i just use svn and websapce from sf
masak good night, people. 01:50
lichtkind good nicht
azawawi scintilla-based right?
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lichtkind of cource 01:50
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azawawi browsing the screenshots 01:51
lichtkind most of them are not current
azawawi lichtkind: release cycle? 01:52
lichtkind azawawi: what you axectly mean?
exactly 01:53
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azawawi lichtkind: how often do u release Kephra? 01:53
lichtkind nigtly almost eevery day, testings in a moth or longer stable half a year or longer 01:54
azawawi lichtkind: what about translations? which are currently supported?
lichtkind english, german norwegian and i currently make a czech 01:55
azawawi lichtkind: what about RTL languages support such Arabic?
lichtkind what is RTL? 01:56
avar right-to-left
lichtkind is it unt-8?
utf is suppose no
maybe scintilla can do it but never felt the need myself :)
azawawi lichtkind: Arabic and Hebrew are written right to left 01:57
lichtkind i know
i know a little bit hebrew
azawawi lichtkind: plz move your dev website to code.google.com; i hate sf's slowness lol 01:58
lichtkind and i hate google :)
yes that sucks 01:59
azawawi lichtkind: do u need help with Arabic translation for Kephra?
lichtkind azawawi: i would love to egt help
get
you just to have to translate one file
its conf so you see all strings in his kontext
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azawawi cool 02:00
where is the file?
lichtkind but i cant promise hoe fast to get this left to right to work
in the configs
look in the svn under mom i give you link
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lichtkind kephra.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/k...iew=markup 02:01
what you need for arabic 02:02
utf-16 or utf-8?
azawawi utf-8
lichtkind great
because my config parser supports that
with my i mean config::General
if you need any help just mail me or i mostly lurk at #perlde 02:03
at magnet
thats the german perl channel
azawawi cool 02:04
lichtkind azawawi: im nazi why thats cool ? :)
wait im only 40% german 02:05
literal you're a Nazi? awesome
azawawi lichtkind: so why should i care? ;-)
lichtkind azawawi: thats the right attitude, but an ugly topic often , here more that anywhere else 02:06
azawawi: please i just wanted know what you ment with cool?
azawawi lichtkind: since you gave me all the information i needed, i said 'cool' ;-) 02:07
azawawi is playing with Kephra 02:08
lichtkind all right, i would love to see more developer helping with kephra, you know im doing that since some years and was bit disapointed that padre came along and got all the buzz
you run it cool which version? 02:09
azawawi stable 0.4
stable 0.4pl3
lichtkind these days i finished the autopluggablelocalisation system so it detects the existing files and creates menus drom the header data of locals 02:10
yes im very happy with 0.4 pl 3
azawawi lichtkind: how do i switch languages in Kephra? 02:11
lichtkind the config menu, but i will switch soon into the soon to be config dialog
0.4 has just english and german 02:12
since the other 2 are not complete
it has a lot of small usefull stuff 02:13
azawawi: any comments, feedback is always welcome? 02:15
azawawi lichtkind: the win32 key bindings like CTRL-W, CTRL-F4 are not working 02:16
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lichtkind azawawi: are you using windows? 02:17
azawawi licktkind: search bar is cool, but you can add more results like in chrome
lichtkind: yes, winxp
lichtkind what you mean by adding?
azawawi lichtkind: when i type something, it should highlight all of my matches and then CTRL-G should cycle between them (like in FF3, chrome) 02:18
lichtkind azawawi: CTRL-F4 works fine here (have that version here) and means replace which also works perfect
yes i tried but thats was harder i expected, its on todo
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azawawi lichtkind: CTRL-F4 is toggling Notepad icon its right window 02:19
lichtkind azawawi: it shoult closing window is alt+f4 02:20
azawawi lichtkind: ctrl+f4 should close the current edited files, alt-f4 works fine. 02:21
lichtkind azawawi: i never heard that 02:22
any reference?
azawawi lichtkind: i use it all the time on winxp (see notepad++)
lichtkind: and CTRL-W = CTRL-F4 02:23
lichtkind the keymap is easy changable just edit the line in the text file and save, it reloads automatically 02:24
but i have to think about that thanks for bringing it up 02:25
... i should open channel kephra :)
azawawi lichtkind: nice work, lichtkind++
lichtkind thanks
azawawi im going to sleep now 02:26
lichtkind gut nacht
sleep well
azawawi good night
sleep &
lichtkind i will too
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rakudo_svn r34167 | pmichaud++ | [rakudo]: Add radix support for string-to-number conversions (RT #59222, s1n++) 02:40
r34167 | pmichaud++ | * Based on a patch courtesy s1n [email@hidden.address]
pugs_svn r24538 | pmichaud++ | [t/spec]: Unfudge some radix.t tests for rakudo. 02:42
cspencer rakudo: my (@a, @b); @a.push(2) 02:44
p6eval rakudo 34165: OUTPUT[Method 'push' not found for invocant of class 'Undef'␤current instr.: '_block14' pc 85 (EVAL_16:47)␤]
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cspencer pmichaud: i've attached a patch that (maybe) fixes the above issue to ticket #61300 02:49
pmichaud looks like it might work. 02:51
(I'd prefer that it not do viviself at all... but that'll come with the refactor.) 02:52
Do all of the spectests pass?
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rakudo_svn r34171 | infinoid++ | [cage] Fix up some t/codingstd/check_toxxx() failures. 03:20
r34172 | infinoid++ | [cage] Fix up some t/codingstd/check_isxxx.t failures.
r34172 | infinoid++ | Reformat some if/else chains to make it a little more readable.
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pugs_svn r24539 | pmichaud++ | [t/spec]: Fix #?rakudo skip line in radix.t . 04:29
rakudo_svn r34179 | chromatic++ | [Rakudo] Turned a C++-style comment into a C-style comment so as not to confuse 04:30
r34179 | chromatic++ | old, broken, vendor-supplied compilers stuck in the twentieth century.
pugs_svn r24540 | pmichaud++ | [t/spec]: Unfudge a rakudo test in S03-operators/misc.t . 04:34
r24541 | pmichaud++ | [t/spec]: Unfudge some tests for hyperoperators. 04:42
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meppl good night 04:57
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rakudo_svn r34184 | pmichaud++ | [rakudo]: Fix initialization of variables in signatures (RT #61300, cspencer++) 05:20
r34184 | pmichaud++ | * Patch courtesy cspencer [email@hidden.address]
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pugs_svn r24542 | pmichaud++ | [t/spec]: Unfudge more tests for rakudo in my.t . 05:27
r24543 | pmichaud++ | [t/spec]: unfudge more tests for rakudo (assign.t) 05:49
r24544 | pmichaud++ | [t/spec]: Some rakudo fudge updates, not yet ready for spectest regression. 05:51
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eric256 rakudo: class A {has $x = 1; sub test { $.x++} }; my $a = A.new; $a.test; 06:20
p6eval rakudo 34185: OUTPUT[Method 'test' not found for invocant of class 'A'␤current instr.: '_block14' pc 99 (EVAL_12:50)␤]
eric256 rakudo: class A {has $x = 1; method test { $.x++} }; my $a = A.new; $a.test;
p6eval rakudo 34185: OUTPUT[Method 'x' not found for invocant of class 'A'␤current instr.: 'parrot;A;test' pc 259 (EVAL_12:110)␤]
eric256 rakudo: class A {has $.x = 1; method test { $.x++} }; my $a = A.new; $a.test;
p6eval rakudo 34185: RESULT[2]
eric256 rakudo: class A {has $.x = 1; method test { $.x += 1} }; my $a = A.new; $a.test;
p6eval rakudo 34185: OUTPUT[Cannot assign to readonly variable.␤current instr.: 'die' pc 14469 (src/builtins/control.pir:188)␤]
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eric256 somethings wrong there ;) 06:21
bed time for me now though
rakudo: class A {has $.x is rw; method test { $.x += 1} }; my $a = A.new; $a.test;
p6eval rakudo 34185: RESULT[1]
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rakudo_svn r34186 | pmichaud++ | [rakudo]: spectest-progress.csv update: 261 files, 5645 passing, 0 failing 06:30
r34186 | pmichaud++ | Yes. Over 420 new passing tests in one day.
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cspencer pmichaud: sorry, stepped out for a bit there, wasn't ignoring your earlier question re: the patch i'd sent it :) 07:00
s/sent it/sent in/
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pmurias ruoso: hi 10:43
ruoso: do you think we could get away with having the hash in perl6? 10:45
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lichtkind class Heart::Gold { class Velocity { }}, namespace of inner class is Velocity or Heart::Gold::Velocity? 15:24
smg get a good book :] 15:25
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lichtkind smg: dont wory i dont read douglas adams anymore 15:26
smg: or you mean book about oop? 15:29
masak is &flunk a standard Perl 6 function. ack turns up nothing about it in the specs. 15:31
lichtkind: Velocity, at least by the current implementations.
lichtkind masak: thanks 15:32
masak np.
lichtkind: ...which makes inner classes very non-special, in a way. they just happen to be defined inside another class.
I think this is an area which simply hasn't been explored/specced very much.
smg lichtkind: sorry i thought i would have been in c++ 15:34
lichtkind smg: never been
masak: thanks
pmurias @tell ruoso i'm switching the build system from cmake-- to scons 15:37
lambdabot Consider it noted.
15:41 Whiteknight is now known as wknight-away
cspencer rakudo: my (@a, @b); @a.push(2); @a.say 15:41
p6eval rakudo 34202: OUTPUT[2␤]
15:41 wknight-away is now known as wknight8111
masak perl6: my $a = "foo"; given $a { when "foo" { say "foo!" }; when /foo/ { say "kinda foo" }; when * { say "what-EVER!" } } 15:49
p6eval elf 24544: OUTPUT[Can't locate object method "cb__Given" via package "EmitSimpleP5" at ./elf_f line 1561.␤]
..pugs, rakudo 34202: OUTPUT[foo!␤]
TimToady it's supposed to be Heart::Gold::Velocity
masak TimToady: spec?
TimToady because it defaults to "our", and that means in the current package
masak aah.
I sit corrected. 15:50
TimToady and that's how STD interprets it
and it's the only sane approach if you don't want package collisions
well, or we could default to 'my', but that's another story 15:51
masak rakudo: say A.WHAT
p6eval rakudo 34202: OUTPUT[Failure␤]
TimToady bbl & 15:52
masak rakudo: class Outer { class Inner {} }; say Inner.WHAT
p6eval rakudo 34202: OUTPUT[Inner␤]
masak submits rakudobug
:)
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pmurias wonders when will he start hating scons 16:04
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pmichaud rakudo: class Outer { class Inner{} }; say Inner.PARROT; 16:12
p6eval rakudo 34202: OUTPUT[␤]
16:14 ejs left, ejs joined
cspencer should: [ ].max return "-Inf"? 16:15
i'm assuming it's the opposite of [ ].min which returns "+Inf"
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pmichaud yes, it should return -Inf 16:20
cspencer alright 16:21
have infinite Range's been implemented yet?
pmichaud no -- we haven't done any lazy things yet. 16:22
cspencer ok
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cspencer just submitted a patch for the above min/max issues in #60868 16:35
pmichaud oh, they're supposed to be the numeric +/- Inf, not the strings "+Inf" and "-Inf" 16:39
cspencer oh!
whoops
does assigning "+Inf" to a num variable in PIR not do a conversion? 16:40
pmichaud not as far as I know.
cspencer ah ok, let me rework that one then, sorry about that
pmichaud even so, we don't want the case of my $a = [].max; if $a < 3 { say 'yes'; } 16:41
er, backwards
even so, we don't want the case of my $a = [].min; if $a < 3 { say 'yes'; }
because right now "+Inf" is probably treated as < 3
rakudo: say "+Inf" < 3;
p6eval rakudo 34203: OUTPUT[1␤]
masak but that's an orthogonal problem, no?
pmichaud it's a different problem. 16:42
I suspect that [].min.WHAT should not return "Str"
masak submits rakudobug
cspencer ok.
pmichaud there's already a bug for +/- Inf in max/min
masak I know. I submitted it.
rakudo: say Inf.WHAT 16:43
p6eval rakudo 34203: OUTPUT[Failure␤]
masak hm.
pmichaud right, we haven't defined Inf yet, either.
that's yet-another-bug.
masak aye
pmichaud I was actually going to work on those this morning :-)
cspencer heh, alright, i retract that patch then :) 16:44
sorry, i was somehow under the impression that assigning "+Inf" to a num var did the conversion
not sure why :)
pmichaud oh! 16:45
it's a num var
I didn't see that.
I take back my objection, then -- it might work.
checking...
rakudo: eval(qq< q:PIR { $N0 = "-Inf"\n say $N0 } >); 16:46
p6eval rakudo 34203: OUTPUT[Statement not terminated properly at line 1, near "\\n say $N0"␤␤current instr.: 'parrot;PGE;Util;die' pc 129 (runtime/parrot/library/PGE/Util.pir:83)␤]
pmichaud rakudo: eval(qq< q:PIR { \$N0 = "-Inf"\n say \$N0 } >); 16:47
p6eval rakudo 34203: OUTPUT[Statement not terminated properly at line 1, near "\\n say \\$N"␤␤current instr.: 'parrot;PGE;Util;die' pc 129 (runtime/parrot/library/PGE/Util.pir:83)␤]
pmichaud bah.
just a secd
16:49 <nopaste> "pmichaud" at 72.181.176.220 pasted "+/-Inf works (for cspencer)" (12 lines) at nopaste.snit.ch/15055 16:49
so, your patch is fine.
I still need to define Inf as a symbol, though. 16:50
cspencer oh good, thanks :)
bbl, breakfast time
16:51 cspencer left
masak ah, implementing NaN and Inf is #58014 16:52
jesse++
16:53 azawawi joined
azawawi hi 16:53
pmichaud rakudo: say +"Inf"; 16:54
p6eval rakudo 34203: OUTPUT[0␤]
pmichaud right, okay.
masak guess that's a manifestation of the same problem as "+Inf" < 3 16:55
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masak yay! Mr Board Game Maker has given the go-ahead to release my Perl 6 board game under a FOSS license! \o/ 17:10
now I have to decide whether to put it in the Pugs repo or on github. 17:11
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eric256 pugs repo ;) 17:16
or we could start a new repo with rakudo ready examples ;) i feel kinda bad chaning pugs examples to fit rakudo, but then i don't want tons of perl6 examples that just don't work either 17:17
rakudo_svn r34214 | pmichaud++ | [rakudo]: Add +Inf and -Inf to min and max (RT #60868, cspencer++) 17:20
r34214 | pmichaud++ | * Patch courtesy Cory Spencer.
pmichaud I wouldn't be in favor of "rakudo ready examples" 17:21
I'd like to see "Perl 6 examples"
masak aye.
pmichaud i.e., that aren't tied to an implementation.
masak but fixing things that only ever worked on Pugs is a Good Thing.
pmichaud granted specific implementations may need workarounds, in which case we have a (e.g.) ".rakudo" version that says how it works in rakudo.
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pmichaud so, we could have "hanoi.p6", and then if Rakudo needs a workaround version it's "hanoi.rakudo" 17:22
if Pugs needs a workaround it's "hanoi.pugs"
when an implementation no longer needs the workaround, we drop the ".rakudo" version in favor of the generic .p6 one.
masak eric256: we have November in a separate repo, and there are certain advantages to that.
pmichaud for building a complete application, I agree with separate repo very strongly.
masak question is, is a little board game a separate application? 17:23
right now it's one file.
pmichaud one file? I could see it going either way.
masak if I make separate frontends, it might grow to be several.
eric256 pmichaud: i think that all makes perfect since
pmichaud If you're planning to package it up with readme and the like, then it might make sense to have a repo.
eric256 masak what about a new perl6 examples repo seperate from pugs?
the tie in to pugs is....odd.... at this point ;) 17:24
masak eric256: I'm not against such a repo.
eric256: but I'm also not the one who will create it. I have enough to do as it is. :)
eric256: please go ahead, though.
masak ponders a quip along the lines of 'with great repos comes great responsibility' 17:25
eric256 lol
i was playing with the euler examples and they don't work simply because we can't pull in benchmark ;) fudge 17:28
masak eric256: I say go for it. it's a good idea.
eric256 feels underqualified ;)
masak eric256: make a repo on github or something. add a great README file explaining its purpose. build it, and they will come.
eric256: if it's any consolation, I know the feeling. it'll pass. :) 17:29
eric256 lol
is there someone to get a blessing from to move these things out of pugs?
masak eric256: you don't need to remove them from the Pugs repo, do you? 17:30
eric256 would put a readme in the pugs examples pointing off to the new repo, my understanding is that pugs is pretty dead though ;)
wouldn't want dups
masak eric256: not dead, it's resting!
eric256 lol
masak it's pinin' for the fjords.
eric256: I'd advise you to at least make a significant number of them run under Rakudo before you remove them in the Pugs repo. 17:31
pmichaud actually, I'd leave "remove them from the Pugs repo" as someone else's decision. 17:32
masak perhaps even better, yes.
pmichaud start a new repo. If it becomes more popular/used, then the Pugs repo will naturally dtrt. 17:33
eric256 masak ohh i would only move them as athey worked
not wholesale
masak eric256: what pmichaud said.
eric256 lol
eric256 goes to look at github
masak eric256++
pmichaud it's okay for examples to live in both repos.
masak eric256: also, remember that those scripts in the Pugs repo are Artistic2.0-licensed. 17:34
eric256: you'd probably have to license the copies under the same terms.
eric256 enlists masak as Director of Licensing issues
masak done.
eric256: I'm 'masak' on github. I have no issues with being given commit rights to the repo. :) 17:35
eric256 okay i'm installing git and siging up ;) 17:36
masak \o/ 17:37
I have to go in a couple of minutes.
eric256 and blaming all of you ;) but we do need some more organization round here ;)
masak eric256: we need people like you, who are willing to transform free time into organization around here.
rakudo: when Undef {} 17:40
p6eval rakudo 34215: OUTPUT[Method 'ACCEPTS' not found for invocant of class 'Undef'␤current instr.: 'infix:~~' pc 16545 (src/builtins/match.pir:18)␤]
masak submits rakudobug
pmichaud there is no Undef
masak oh.
then... then that's a bug, instead! :P
pmichaud so I'll be happy to say "this bug will be fixed when we have type checking." :-)
er, when we have the type registry working.
masak ok.
masak doesn't submit rakudobug 17:41
rakudo: when .undef {}
p6eval rakudo 34215: OUTPUT[Method 'undef' not found for invocant of class 'Failure'␤current instr.: '_block14' pc 81 (EVAL_13:45)␤]
pmichaud ... ".undef"?
shouldn't it just be: 17:42
masak erm.
pmichaud rakudo: when undef { say "not defined"; }
p6eval rakudo 34215: OUTPUT[not defined␤]
masak ok, ok!
have it your way :)
pmichaud granted: when !.defined { ... } ought to work also, and probably doesn't.
masak rakudo: when !.defined { say "defined. NOT!" } 17:43
p6eval rakudo 34215: OUTPUT[defined. NOT!␤]
masak works fine.
eric256 rakudo: when not .defined { say "Yea!" }
p6eval rakudo 34215: OUTPUT[Yea!␤]
masak time to do laundry around here. 17:44
pmichaud oh, I'm thinking $x ~~ !.defined might not dtrt
that one may be tricky.
masak pmichaud: aye.
eric256: let me know how that repo goes. I'm willing to help it along if needed.
masak waves
17:45 masak left, dukeleto joined
lichtkind eric256: are you eric wilhelm? 17:47
17:47 cspencer joined
eric256 github.com/eric256/perl6-examples/tree 17:49
i think i'm done ;) err ready
no not wilhelm
oh sure masak left ! ;)
thats okay family time aroud here anyway...but the baby steps are done
pmichaud eric256: later today I'm planning to make my "try some scripting problems" announcement
where I invite people to post Perl 6 solutions to common scripting problems 17:50
I think this repo may be a good place to put those solutions, but I'm actually going to suggest that solutions be posted in many places instead of centralized in one place. 17:51
eric256 ehhh that would be a good start ;) i was going to put the euler problems in there
well even if they put answers many places...one place could be there 17:52
you going to do like weekly problems or something? blog with weekly problems and solutions all over the net would be fun ;) with comments pointing to solutions and discussing it 17:53
i would like that
gotta go play guitar hero with the wife for now though
later
17:56 pmurias left
cspencer pmichaud: were you working on defining +Inf/-Inf, or do you mind if i take a crack at it? 18:01
pmichaud I'm doing "make spectest" on it now. Also NaN
cspencer ok :)
pmichaud I already had Inf tested, but then realized I should go ahead and do NaN while I'm at it. :-) 18:02
cspencer heh 18:06
is the request tracker just extremely slow, or is that a problem just for me? 18:07
lichtkind when i do multiple inheritance, the als class that called with is has "overwritten" its methods?
pmichaud it's extremely slow. 18:09
I'm starting to find it unusable for issue tracking. 18:10
rakudo_svn r34218 | pmichaud++ | [rakudo]: Add support for Inf and NaN (RT #58014)
cspencer yeah, i've got 2 timeouts or internal server errors in the last 30 minutes
pmichaud I've gotten a lot more than that.
cspencer heh
pmichaud and even when I do get a response, it's taking 45+ seconds or more to get it.
cspencer yeah, that's my average too. is it a hardware issue? 18:11
pmichaud I don't know.
cspencer hmm.
pmichaud we probably need to ask the rt.perl.org maintainers
cspencer do you want me to change that min/max patch to use the Inf() subroutines? 18:12
pmichaud that might be a good idea. But what you have now works as well.
Inf() may disappear as a sub at some point also.
cspencer ok
pmichaud it may become a class/object of its own.
cspencer i'll leave it as is for the moment
ah ok
pmichaud afk, lunch is ready 18:13
cspencer k, ttyl :) 18:15
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lichtkind if i declare a class is rw, how to make an acessor readonly then? 18:18
or in other words can i write in a class: has $speed if r; ? 18:28
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pugs_svn r24545 | azawawi++ | [Syntax::Highlight::Perl6] 02-hilitep6.t now uses $Config to get the current Perl 18:58
pmichaud lichtkind: "is readonly", I think.
lichtkind ah thanks
yes r would be to ambiguous
pmichaud: and with multiple inhertance always the last overwrites? 18:59
pmichaud I don't know -- I'd have to read the spec for that. 19:00
lichtkind pmichaud: im currently reading buts its well hidden 19:01
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cspencer should hashes should be mappable? or are they already? 19:06
ie) %hash.map: { ... } 19:07
rakudo: my %hash = (a => 1, b => 2); %hash.map: { .say }; 19:08
p6eval rakudo 34218: OUTPUT[Method 'iterator' not found for invocant of class 'Perl6Hash'␤current instr.: 'parrot;Any;map' pc 9549 (src/builtins/any-list.pir:177)␤]
cspencer rakudo: my %hash = (a => 1, b => 2); %hash.keys.map: { .say }; 19:09
p6eval rakudo 34218: OUTPUT[a␤b␤]
cspencer hmmm 19:10
should %hash.map work by iterating over a list of key/value Pairs?
lichtkind cspencer: its no question about map but what is a hsh in list context 19:12
its a list of pairs
and yes you can map over that
cspencer ok
so the above error needs fixing then?
lichtkind seems so 19:13
pugs once could do this trick 19:14
cspencer i imagine it's because the Hash class isn't deriving from Any, which is where map currently resides then 19:15
and also because there's no iterator method 19:17
pmichaud S09 talks about hash iterator methods 19:18
cspencer ok, i'll take a look
pmichaud basically it's a list of pairs
and all of keys, kv, values, pairs, etc. are supposed to be defined in terms of the iterator 19:19
cspencer that's what i figured. i'll put that in then.
ok
pmichaud I do have some questions about it, though.
cspencer which questions?
pmichaud for example: keys %hash versus keys %a, %b
rakudo: my %a = <a 1 b 2 c 3>; my %b = <d 4 e 5>; say keys(%a, %b); 19:21
p6eval rakudo 34218: OUTPUT[01234␤]
pmichaud rakudo: my %a = <a 1 b 2 c 3>; my %b = <d 4 e 5>; say keys(%a, %b).perl;
p6eval rakudo 34218: OUTPUT[[0, 1, 2, 3, 4]␤]
pmichaud that example is probably confusing -- I'll do a different one 19:22
rakudo: my %a = <a A b B c C>; my %b = <d D e E>; say keys(%a, %b).perl;
p6eval rakudo 34218: OUTPUT[[0, 1, 2, 3, 4]␤]
pmichaud rakudo: my %a = <a A b B c C>; my %b = <d D e E>; say keys(%a).perl;
p6eval rakudo 34218: OUTPUT[["a", "b", "c"]␤]
cspencer hmmm
pmichaud rakudo is following what the spec says... I'm just wondering if that's really the spec we want. 19:23
cspencer why's the output from the 2nd last one a list of ints?
that's in the spec?
pmichaud it's easier to see if I use pairs instead
watch
cspencer ok
pmichaud rakudo: my %a = <a A b B c C>; my %b = <d D e E>; say pairs(%a).perl;
p6eval rakudo 34218: OUTPUT[[(0 => ("a" => "A")), (1 => ("b" => "B")), (2 => ("c" => "C"))]␤]
cspencer ah ok 19:24
pmichaud because .pairs on a List produces keys of 0, 1, 2, ...
cspencer right
pmichaud so keys() on a List produces keys of 0, 1, 2, ...
cspencer right, gotcha
pmichaud anyway, yes, the methods in Mapping.pir need refactoring -- if you want to work on those it'd be great. 19:26
.iterator should be the base method, with .keys, .values, .kv, etc defined in terms of that. 19:27
.iterator should probably return a list of pairs
cspencer sure, i'll do that
azawawi lambdabot: bye bye ;-) 19:30
pmichaud oh 19:31
(nm)
19:40 lambdabot joined
azawawi @tell lambdabot welcome back 19:41
lambdabot Nice try ;)
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cspencer i've having some issues creating the Perl6Pair class in the pir 19:58
pmichaud use 'infix:=>'
cspencer how does one pass in values to initialize the attributes?
ah
pmichaud (code reuse is a good thing)
cspencer ok, that'd work :)
heh, i was looking for that, but didn't think of the '=>' option 19:59
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cspencer ok, got that working, thanks 20:06
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cspencer actually, i suppose i could have reworked the .pairs method for the iterator 20:09
pmichaud yes, perhaps. 20:10
cspencer so you'd like the other methods written in terms of .iterator? 20:11
pmichaud please.
cspencer in terms of method organization in the various files, are they supposed to be in alphabetical order? or is that not really a big issue 20:12
pmichaud 1. Methods
2. Operators
3. Coercions
4. Private methods
5. Vtable functions
alphabetical within each section
cspencer ok, will do
pmichaud lots of the files are incorrect about this, so feel free to refactor as needed. I think that List, Object, and Array are correct, if you want something to use as a model 20:13
eric256 /me needs to make a bot that just records all of pmichaud's chatting and puts it in a document
lol
cspencer sure, ok :)
pmichaud eric256: irclog.perlgeek.de/search.pl?channe...k=pmichaud 20:14
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pugs_svn r24546 | pmichaud++ | [t/spec]: unfudge some tests relating to Inf/NaN . 20:18
rakudo_svn r34219 | pmichaud++ | [rakudo]: Recognize numification of "Inf" and "NaN" strings. 20:20
r34219 | pmichaud++ | * Also fix strlen() bug introduced in r34167 patch.
eric256 @tell masaks now i need a git tutorial!! ;) 20:24
lambdabot Consider it noted.
azawawi @tell TimToady after thorough investigation, i found out that calling STD->parse() inside Foo.pm for two different strings can cause the second one to fail (as if the state is preserved from the first parse). 20:42
lambdabot Consider it noted.
eric256 www.perlfoundation.org/perl6/index....do_hacking starting a compilation of the way things should be done in PIR 20:43
azawawi @tell for a testcase try 'perl t/00-syntax.t' in $PUGS_HOME/misc/Syntax* 20:44
lambdabot Consider it noted.
azawawi @tell TimToady for a testcase try 'perl t/00-syntax.t' in $PUGS_HOME/misc/Syntax*
lambdabot Consider it noted.
azawawi sleep & 20:45
cspencer what's the .hash method for in the Mapping class? Hash appears to be the only class using Mapping as a parent
or will other classes eventually inherit .hash?
pmichaud .hash on any Object says "return the hash form of this object"
cspencer ok 20:46
pmichaud it corresponds to .list and .item
cspencer ah, ok
eric256 pmichaud (or anyone else) please add to the above wiki ;) or i can make a file in the repo...dunno 20:47
20:48 justatheory left
pmichaud wiki better than repo for this. 20:48
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cspencer keys in hashs can be objects other than strings, correct? Mapping.pir assumes (or converts) them to be strings 21:05
should they be changed to a pmc var as opposed to string?
avar IIRC yes, the hash key as string restriction in parrot was supposed to be temporary 21:10
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cspencer and i was going to be changed at a later date to support pmc's? 21:11
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pmichaud Parrot's Hash PMC doesn't support non-string keys. And it throws segfaults if you try to use non-string keys. 21:21
So we're sticking with string keys for now.
cspencer ok
rakudo: my %hash = (a => 1, b => 2); %hash.fmt.say 21:22
p6eval rakudo 34219: OUTPUT[too few arguments passed (1) - 4 params expected␤current instr.: 'parrot;Mapping;fmt' pc 5341 (src/classes/Mapping.pir:177)␤]
cspencer rakudo: my %hash = (a => 1, b => 2); %hash.fmt("%s").say 21:23
p6eval rakudo 34219: OUTPUT[a␤b␤]
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cspencer what's the best way to confirm that the changes i've made haven't broken a bunch of features? (ie. what output from "make spectest" should i be looking for?) 21:32
pmichaud test failures 21:35
they're normally summarized at the bottom of the "make spectest" output 21:36
so if you see "All tests successful" then everything that needed to pass did so. :-)
cspencer ok. so in a normal "make spectest", there shouldn't be any failures being reported, correct?
ok, gotcha ;)
21:41 dukeleto left 21:45 Eevee joined
cspencer is there a way of just asking "make spectest" to run on a subsection of the tests? (ie. S03-operators) 21:45
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mberends seen eric256 21:58
21:59 justatheory joined
cspencer rakudo: my %hash = (a => 1, b => 2); %hash.map: { .say } 22:08
p6eval rakudo 34219: OUTPUT[Method 'iterator' not found for invocant of class 'Perl6Hash'␤current instr.: 'parrot;Any;map' pc 9549 (src/builtins/any-list.pir:177)␤]
meppl gute Nacht 22:10
good night
22:10 apeiron joined 22:12 meppl left
pmichaud cspencer: make t/spec/S03-*/*.t 22:16
cspencer oh, that's easy :)
i was getting failures, but they were related to Inf. a subsequent "make spectest" fixed that though
22:23 hercynium left
eric256 @seen mberends 22:23
lambdabot mberends is in #perl6. I last heard mberends speak 25m 17s ago.
mberends eric256, I like the idea of a Perl 6 repository. CPAN looks very limited on that side, only containing Perl5 code that does some Perl 6 like behaviour. 22:26
Do you think github will be able to grow into a temporary CPAN for Perl 6 code? 22:27
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eric256 i would guess so yes. i'm not sure if thats the right long term solution though ;) plus the opensource free one only has 100mb of space ;) 22:28
pmichaud I think it's a good idea to start that way, and deal with space issues when we get there. :-) 22:29
mberends we might get 100MB per contributor... 22:30
eric256 mberends: feel free to add to github.com/eric256/perl6-examples/tree/master 22:31
mberends looks in to signing up on github 22:32
pmichaud perl 6 examples are relatively short, at least to begin with. :-)
eric256 yea mberends i still have to figure this thing out ;) 22:33
22:33 justatheory left
eric256 hmm any idea what would cause "get_iter() not implemented in class 'Integer'" 22:34
pmichaud probably an array not being bound correctly.
eric256 this damn git thing is smarter than me 22:36
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cspencer pm: i've reworked Mapping.pir in terms of .iterator, seems to be passing all tests 22:39
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cspencer eric256: that repo looks like a great idea! will others be able to commit to it as well? 22:40
eric256 thats the goal 22:41
at the moment i can't even figure out how to connect to it
pmichaud cspencer: submit as a patch when you think it's ready. I'll review it a bit later. 22:42
(working on fixing Complex right now.)
cspencer pm: will do, it's #61582
pmichaud excellent.
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cspencer pm: is there any merit in going through and writing some of the methods (ie. grep, first, map, etc) in perl 6? is the idea to replace some of the PIR methods later with p6 ones? 22:44
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eric256 arg github is mad about my public key, but i added my id_rsa.pub to it! ;( 22:48
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mberends eric256, were you affected by github.com "planned maintenance" an hour ago? 22:49
22:50 alech joined
pmichaud cspencer: yes, the idea is to do so. I think it's a week or so early to do that. 22:54
I'm still working out how I want all of this to be structured.
and we still have issues with parameter passing that really need solution first.
cspencer alright, i'll check back in a week
right
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lichtkind hello ruoso 23:05
ruoso hello lichtkind 23:07
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lichtkind ruoso: was surprised how much effort you lay in smop 23:10
eric256 mberends: dunno, watching football ;) i think i'm having trouble cause i'm A->ssh->B->ssh->C and then working on C, but for some reason SSH on C isn't pully information from the local files for SSH key authentication
ruoso lichtkind, thanks... I had some help tho 23:12
lichtkind thats nice 23:14
ruoso lichtkind, but it's paying the effort already, SMOP is showing itself as the probable way of integrating SMOP and P5
if everything goes well, we might have perl 5.12 supporting Perl 6 through SMOP 23:15
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lichtkind_ ruoso: so we will have a pony the other way arount, ynoP 23:17
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ruoso heh... kind of 23:18
lichtkind_ Perl 6 on old interpreter PooI
doesn't look better :) 23:19
mberends eric256, maybe the OS X Problems section of github.com/guides/providing-your-ssh-key warns what to look out for. Trying some of that myself (on Linux). Good luck there...
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eric256 mberends: straight cut and paste of that worked perfectly 23:25
odd
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pugs_svn r24547 | pmichaud++ | [rakudo]: Unfudge some Complex tests. 23:32
rakudo_svn r34221 | pmichaud++ | [rakudo]: Clean up .Complex method; eliminate unnecessary Complex objects. 23:40
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pmurias ruoso: hi 23:41
lambdabot pmurias: You have 2 new messages. '/msg lambdabot @messages' to read them.
pmurias why do i get the same two messages every time (suspect the lambdabot restarts and reads and old file) 23:43
ruoso: i'll hack on embedding the perl5 interpreter in smop tommorow 23:44
cspencer what is the perl 6 equivalent of the perl 5 ".=" operator? 23:46
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eric256 rakudo: ("hello " ~= "world").say 23:46
p6eval rakudo 34221: OUTPUT[Unable to set lvalue on PAST::Val node␤current instr.: 'parrot;PAST;Val;lvalue' pc 556 (src/PAST/Node.pir:161)␤] 23:47
eric256 or not ;)
cspencer heh :) yeah, i'd tried that without much success myself :)
pmichaud you're trying to concatenate to a constant?!?
rakudo: my $a = 'hello'; $a ~= 'world'; say $a;
p6eval rakudo 34221: OUTPUT[helloworld␤]
eric256 rakudo: my $x = "hello "; $x ~= "world"; $x.say
cspencer oh, hey, that's what i was looking for!
p6eval rakudo 34221: OUTPUT[hello world␤]
cspencer i wonder why that didn't work... 23:48
eric256 rakudo: my $x; $x ~= "world"; $x.say
p6eval rakudo 34221: OUTPUT[world␤]
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eric256 rakudo: my $x = 5; $x ~= "world"; $x.say 23:52
p6eval rakudo 34221: OUTPUT[5world␤]
eric256 seems to work pretty good ;)
cspencer yeah, sorry, my bad. i was mixing up my error messages :) 23:53
eric256 there added wizard and problem 1 from project euler ;)
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