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🦋 Welcome to the MAIN() IRC channel of the Raku Programming Language (raku.org). This channel is logged for the purpose of keeping a history about its development | evalbot usage: 'm: say 3;' or /msg camelia m: ... | Logs can be inspected at colabti.org/irclogger/irclogger_log/raku Set by lizmat on 1 May 2021. |
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| oddp | calling foo('12') for this recurses endlessly: multi sub foo($x) { foo($x) }; multi sub foo(Int $x) { $x }; | 00:00 | |
| back to 'where /\d+/' it is i guess | |||
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| moon-child | I wonder if multi sub foo(Int() $x) would work | 00:04 | |
| m: multi sub foo($x) { say 1 }; multi sub foo(Int() $x) { say 2 }; say foo '5'; | 00:05 | ||
| camelia | Ambiguous call to 'foo(Str)'; these signatures all match: ($x) (Int(Any) $x) in block <unit> at <tmp> line 1 |
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| moon-child | nope | ||
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| ugexe | multi sub foo($x) { foo($x) }; | 00:16 | |
| where could this dispatch to with foo("12")? | |||
| you could use `multi sub foo($x) { nextwith($x) };` but again... what would it dispatch to when the only other candidate requires Int (12) not Str ("12")? | 00:18 | ||
| oddp | man, just realized that your example from above works with <1 0> because that produces a IntStr list where as i am using regular str lists | 00:50 | |
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| oddp | well, well, sorry for wasting everyone's time, but i guess i better stick to ruby for now. my brain simply hasn't enough folds for raku | 00:52 | |
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| moon-child | eh ruby doesn't even have multiple dispatch, does it? :P | 00:55 | |
| could just avoid multis | |||
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| Geth | doc: 4cb25dbd56 | (Suman Khanal)++ (committed using GitHub Web editor) | doc/Language/py-nutshell.pod6 Example in raku not working as expected The last example ``` my $list1 = (1, "two", 3, "hat"); my $list2 = (5, 6, "seven"); ... (22 more lines) |
11:31 | |
| linkable6 | Link: docs.raku.org/language/py-nutshell | ||
| Altreus | Was there any further discussion on my ancient question about why we have "multi" when its omission unnecessarily restricts extension? | 11:42 | |
| Can it not be inferred/ | 11:43 | ||
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| moritz | requiring "multi" allows to catch accidental re-definition of only subs | 11:46 | |
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| Altreus | then why not require only instead? | 12:19 | |
| it also prevents you from intentionally re-defining subs that were not set up to do so | 12:20 | ||
| Which is a problem when you don't own the original | |||
| Adding another option for a procedure is good design, in my opinion, and should be encouraged | 12:21 | ||
| Therefore, preventing it by default is bad | |||
| multi should be the default | |||
| codesections | Altreus: IMO, there's a bit of a library/application distinction. When writing _library_ code, I agree that it's best to default to multi for the reasons you say. But in end-user code (esp. scripts) it seems like "only" is a good default (it simplifies the mental model and restricting extension is less of an issue) | 12:25 | |
| and since library authors tend to be more experienced, I'm ok with having the literal default be the one that fits application code, and asking library authors to opt in | 12:26 | ||
| moritz | also, only subs are easier to learn for the beginner | 12:27 | |
| codesections | (esp. since `multi f` is only slightly longer than `sub f` -- though that doesn't apply to methods) | ||
| moritz: yeah, that's a more direct way of putting what I meant by "it simplifies the mental model" :D | 12:28 | ||
| Altreus | So can you add a multi method to a subclass of a class that doesn't define the original as multi? | 12:42 | |
| Maybe you can override the multi-ness of the existing one? | |||
| m: class A { sub a ($x) {} }; class B isa A { multi sub a ($x, $y) {} }; | 12:43 | ||
| camelia | 5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling <tmp> Unable to parse class definition at <tmp>:1 ------> 3class A { sub a ($x) {} }; class B is7⏏5a A { multi sub a ($x, $y) {} }; expecting any of: whitespace |
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| Altreus | er | ||
| m: class A { sub a ($x) {} }; class B is A { multi sub a ($x, $y) {} }; | |||
| camelia | ( no output ) | ||
| Altreus | m: class A { sub a ($x) { say $x } }; class B is A { multi sub a ($x, $y) { say "$x ... $y"} }; my $b = B.new; $b.a("A"); $b.a("A", "B") | 12:44 | |
| camelia | No such method 'a' for invocant of type 'B' in block <unit> at <tmp> line 1 |
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| Altreus | m: class A { method a ($x) { say $x } }; class B is A { multi method a ($x, $y) { say "$x ... $y"} }; my $b = B.new; $b.a("A"); $b.a("A", "B") | ||
| camelia | Cannot resolve caller a(B:D: Str:D); none of these signatures match: (B: $x, $y, *%_) in block <unit> at <tmp> line 1 |
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| Altreus | you what | ||
| codesections | you'd need to add a bit of code to re-dispatch to parent when it doesn't match | ||
| Altreus | OK then I object to that :) | 12:45 | |
| this is anti-DWIM | |||
| codesections | fair | ||
| Altreus | I'm happy it let me redefine it - I expected an error there | 12:52 | |
| Although the actual error is worse :D | |||
| lizmat | m: class A { method foo() { dd } }; class B is A { proto method foo(|) {*}; multi method foo() { dd; nextsame } }; B.foo | 13:02 | |
| camelia | method foo(B: *%_) | ||
| lizmat | you can use a proto | ||
| however, the proto will prevent you from doing nextsame and friends | 13:03 | ||
| Altreus: is that a problem ? | |||
| if so, you could do something like; | |||
| class A { method foo() { dd } }; class B is A { my constant &a = B.^find_method("foo"); proto method foo(|) {*}; multi method foo() { dd; a(self) } }; B.foo | 13:05 | ||
| evalable6 | method foo(B: *%_) method foo(A: *%_) |
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| lizmat | aka, save the previous dispatch chain in a constant (at compile time) *before* the new proto is added | 13:06 | |
| and refer to that to go up the dispatch chain again | |||
| hmmm...self.&a() instead of a(self) probably | |||
| codesections | and that foo method could be `multi method foo(|)` to come after all your own foos, right? | 13:07 | |
| lizmat | if I understand your question correctly, yes :-) | 13:08 | |
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| Altreus | I dunno if that's a problem because I'm yak shaving | 13:21 | |
| But it does seem like a problem if someone provides a class and I have to jump through hoops to extend it | |||
| Raku has enough gotchas | |||
| lizmat | well, most of them in the core have been fixed I think for the publicly accessible methods | 13:22 | |
| but please correct me if I'm wrong :-) | |||
| Altreus | I was more thinking about community modules | 13:23 | |
| Everyone would have to make everything multi just in case | |||
| lizmat | in any case, I think this was a deliberate decision at one point by @Larry | ||
| yeah, that's the consequence of this | |||
| Altreus | I wonder what the rationale is | ||
| lizmat | I wonder if newdisp / RakuAST would make changes to this more easy | ||
| Altreus | Because the outcome is heckin' inconvenient | ||
| codesections | yeah. But my argument is that it's easier to have best practices for modules than user code | 13:24 | |
| lizmat | moritz was around then, maybe he can shed some light | ||
| codesections | it feels like it's in the spirit of "torture the implementer", in that it puts a little extra burden on module authors to simplify things for end users | 13:25 | |
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| Altreus | Seems like a pull request engine to me | 13:26 | |
| Although with a workaround at least it's not showstopping | |||
| lizmat | also: with B.can("foo").head it's less meta-oppy | 13:27 | |
| instead of .^find_method | |||
| afk for a few hours& | 13:30 | ||
| Geth | doc: sumanstats++ created pull request #3882: Fix tuple-like structure in Raku |
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| Geth | doc: 1fe9282577 | (Suman Khanal)++ (committed by Juan Julián Merelo Guervós) | doc/Language/py-nutshell.pod6 Fix tuple-like structure in Raku Do a minimal change as suggested in github.com/Raku/doc/commit/4cb25db...36b73da106 |
13:52 | |
| linkable6 | Link: docs.raku.org/language/py-nutshell | ||
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| antononcube | HI! I asked this question yesterday, but got disconnected, so I do not know about any responses... I wonder should I use Math::Matrix or Math::Libgsl::LinearAlgebra. Has anyone used Math::Matrix for non-trivial matrix computation workflows? | 14:45 | |
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| codesections | I haven't, sorry (I know that's not helpful, but I wanted to make sure you know that we're not ignoring the question!) | 15:37 | |
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| lizmat | antononcube: I think I would investigate using Math::Libgsl::LinearAlgebra girst | 15:56 | |
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| lizmat | *first | 15:56 | |
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| lizmat | . | 18:11 | |
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| Geth | doc: 294096359d | Coke++ | doc/Language/py-nutshell.pod6 whitespace |
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| linkable6 | Link: docs.raku.org/language/py-nutshell | ||
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| lizmat | and yet another Rakudo Weekly News hits the Net: rakudoweekly.blog/2021/05/10/2021-...-beta-pod/ | 19:03 | |
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| eseyman | No!!!! Not another one! | 19:12 | |
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| patrickb | lizmat++ | 19:39 | |
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| Geth | doc: da1f28ba08 | (Stoned Elipot)++ | doc/Type/Num.pod6 Use code formatting |
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| linkable6 | Link: docs.raku.org/type/Num | ||
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