2009 -- the year of November. <november-wiki.org> <github.com/viklund/november> <irclog.perlgeek.de/november-wiki> <nopaste.snit.ch>
Set by moderator on 27 May 2009.
01:39 ihrd joined 01:40 ihrd left 02:52 ihrd1 joined 03:40 ihrd1 left 04:00 ihrd joined 05:26 ihrd left 06:16 viklund_ joined 07:46 masak joined 07:57 lichtkind_ joined 07:59 zarah joined
Tene masak: ping 08:02
masak Tene: pong. 08:03
Tene masak: I have vague memories of you talking with someone about working on dealing with the auth string on module loading in rakudo? 08:04
Or did I misunderstand or make that up?
masak Tene: I created a Rakudo branch for such work. haven't actually committed anything yet, though. 08:05
Tene masak: I'm currently using that in rakudo trunk for foreign hll loading... auth colonpairs are being parsed and passed to use.
So... what are you trying to do?
masak I'm trying to build something concrete that actually handles several same-named modules of different versions and authors. 08:06
I know the colonpairs already parse in Rakudo. 08:07
but it's another thing to actually handle the ver/auth information.
Tene So you're working on actually responding to that information.
Okay.
Just wanted to avoid conflicting or duplicate effort. 08:08
masak aye. good.
I'm currently trying to orient myself in the Genshi codebase, to get some hints on Hitomi design. 08:10
my most recent find is that Genshi has tests! originally I thought it didn't. 08:11
Tene I'm still winding down after being very busy for the past weeks... 08:12
working on some HLL stuff and some blog posts about it.
masak nod.
Tene I should be getting back to Web stuff soon.
I'm starting to get a little disappointed at the lack of work on most other languages on Parrot. 08:13
I guess it makes sense that there won't be much interest from most people until Parrot is proven a bit better.
Would be nice, though.
Found out yesterday that Pynie doesn't do classes at all.
masak Pynie is the Python implementation? 08:14
Tene yes
I'm thinking of trying to improve it enough to get basic classes and namespaces working, and loading foreign libraries.
masak would be nice. 08:15
Tene I got a very basic app running on cardinal (ruby) using rakudo's HTTP::Daemon
But... cardinal's parser is really really bad. 08:16
I never did figure out exactly why it was so absurdly slow... I should return to it someday.
(like... in some cases it would take several *minutes* to parse a several-line program. Mostly depends on how deeply nested anything is.) 08:17
masak maybe it does backtracking wrong.
Tene Probably.
masak it's usually something like that.
Tene I mean, I get the general idea, but I don't know the specific cases that were failing the worst. 08:18
anyway, that's work for another day. 08:19
It was pretty cool. 08:20
Hmm... I bet scheme would be friendlier...
oh, no, blocks in scheme are a pain. Unless I introduce some friendlier lambda syntax, Tags.pm would suck in scheme.
Eh, http;;daemon could still be nice. 08:23
masak :) 08:25
I'm pursuing two tracks with Web.pm right now.
one is building a simple Druid web app. the other is porting Genshi->Hitomi. 08:26
both are going a bit slower than I'd like. I should take an evening and do just those two.
Tene oh man, no way to call methods from steme... ><
masak that sounds problematic. 08:27
Tene r6rs doesn't talk about classes...
'night 08:29
masak 'night. 08:37
viklund masak: November crashes when unicode characters are submitted ;( 09:09
masak viklund: aye. 09:10
viklund: do we have a ticket about that?
viklund no
or maybe I did it
masak feel free to create one.
viklund no, no ticket
masak no tickee? 09:11
viklund I can fix one though
masak please.
viklund it seems that it's not sent as utf-8, which is strange
masak yes.
we've discussed this before. it's a mystery.
viklund I looked at the post using live http headers, and there it was 3 characters instead of — 09:12
masak aye.
viklund maybe ask the catalyst folk, they should know smth.
masak I'm on catalyst right now. I could ask them.
viklund please do
masak what exactly should I ask?
viklund zarah: welcome back 09:15
zarah viklund: you've just exceeded my capabilities :/
viklund it's filed now at least 09:17
masak viklund++
viklund maybe we can detect utf8 somehow and stop it
masak yes, but why doesn't it work? 09:18
09:18 viklund_ joined
viklund I think it has something to do with how it is sent.. 09:18
masak from tonight's backlog, I got the impression that it's a Rakudo problem...
09:19 viklund_ joined
viklund masak: no, I think that that was a problem with interactive mode in Rakudo... 09:19
but I'm not sure
masak ok.
viklund since it worked if we had it in a perlscript 09:20
masak ah, right.
so, what should I ask the #catalyst people?
viklund ehm, how to recieve utf8 from a post? 09:21
I'm going to test it with p5w I think and see what happens...
masak goodie. 09:22
viklund this is interesting for Web.pm as well I guess 09:23
masak very much so. 09:24
viklund lichtkind thought it was a stopper for putting stuff up, oh well
it
it's frustrating anyhow
masak it's not a blocker, but it's certainly embarassing. 09:25
encodings are hard! :/
viklund if we only could stop november from choking on it we would be far better of
off?
no
I guess that when a character is several bytes the first byte tells how long it is somehow... 09:26
maybe we can check that
masak it's possible, but guessing encodings is somewhat of a last resort. 09:28
it will lead to other, possibly worse, problems.
viklund my point isn
isn't guessing encodings, it's saying, "oops, we can't handle this, remove those squiggles"
until we have a real fix 09:29
masak yes, sure.
we can do that.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/UTF-8#Description describes how the bytes of UTF-8 encoding look. 09:30
zarah masak's link is also tinyurl.com/5ha63
viklund ty 09:32
p5w is using a lot of modules I don't have... thank god for the cpan shell 09:33
would be nice with a program that scanned perl files and installed all deps...
masak doesn't sound too hard to do. 09:34
viklund no
and yes
since i p5 you can do 'use "Stuff"' 09:35
masak sure, but if the program finds and installs 99 out of 100 modules for you, it's still of some use. 09:39
viklund hmm, in p5w the � gets removed
hmm
masak that character you just posted comes up as '\\227' here. 09:40
viklund hmm
I'm on a different computer with a different irc client now 09:41
can you paste the dash from november-wiki.org?
masak sure, hold on. 09:42
—
viklund that worked at least 09:43
�
masak I got \\227 again. 09:44
09:45 p6eval joined
viklund ;( 09:45
p5w doesn
doesn't work either... 09:46
masak viklund: that's sad. :/ 09:50
viklund: ok, step 1: disallow the utf-8 in November.
viklund masak: but it doesn't die...
masak step 2: isolate the error as a test case and show it to the Rakudo devs. 09:51
viklund dang
masak: ugly hack plan: if ord($chr) > 127 { die somehow } 10:06
masak viklund: aye.
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lichtkind does november work now :) ? 18:13
18:53 ruoso_ joined 18:57 masak joined
viklund heh 19:16
masak viklund++ 19:17
viklund lichtkind: we don't know how to fix that utf thingy yet, I'm working on implementing a fix, I've just come home from beeing out all day
so instead of an ERROR you will get a "sorry try again, and please make sure it's only ascii this time"
masak ascii-- # :( 19:18
where's our promised land of UTF-8?
lichtkind viklund: so i have time to finish the tutorial in the tpf wiki :) 19:19
viklund "Welcome home, to my broken promised land, where the skys are grey, there's no stars to lead my way" 19:20
masak viklund: well, aren't you the cheery one. 19:21
viklund mmm, cherries!
I'm working on the utf8 fix now 19:35
in the mean time, check this out:
github.com/viklund/november/commit/...cb84afe413 19:36
closing issues via commit messages! Nice
github++
masak :) 19:43
viklund masak: How do I slurp all arguments into an array? 19:53
masak viklund: either | or * depending on whether we're talking argument or parameter. 19:54
viklund method call?
method stuff( *@all ) { ... } 19:55
??
masak aye.
but that's not a call, that's a declaration...
hence, parameters.
viklund ah
ty
masak np 19:56
viklund now I need to test, *sigh*, time to reinstall apache... 20:26
masak viklund: we should really make a prepackaged november/apache pseudoproject on proto. 20:28
viklund: maybe a good project for Tuesday.
viklund that 20:29
maybe, might be good...
21:02 zarah joined
viklund oops, I curl'd a png... 21:08
masak :)
viklund I've got it running, but for some reason it doesn't get styled... 21:19
masak that's odd. 21:20
can you get at the style file directly?
viklund yes
then I curl'd the png... 21:21
masak ok. 21:22
viklund luckily, I run screen, so I just closed the vt 21:23
masak: grammar checkup, this is my error message: 21:24
Sorry, november can't currently handle UTF8
"currently can't"?
no, we should say that we only handle ascii... 21:27
masak aye. 21:28
fwiw, I'd say "currently can't" 21:29
viklund "We're sorry, but for the moment November can only eat ASCII" 21:30
masak s/eat/consume/
viklund masak: now, keep your fingers crossed ;) 21:58
masak crosses 'em
viklund wait for it... 22:02
masak ...
... 22:03
viklund_ yes...
it's some other error too.
masak :/
viklund_ ahh
I haven't cleaned the server ;) 22:04
huzzah! 22:05
it works, that is, we get an error message ;)
masak viklund_++ 22:06
viklund but what about me?
masak viklund: are you kidding? viklund_ did all the work! 22:08
the insolence...
viklund_ viklund: there you go
viklund masak: there is one more alley to check for this issue 22:10
apache configuration
masak oh. indeed.
viklund other than that I don't know
but, now, I want to sleep
masak viklund: thanks for the good work tonight.
we should do this more often. :)
viklund_ masak: Yes
and look at my comment on the bug: 22:11
github.com/viklund/november/issues#issue/6
zarah viklund_'s link is also tinyurl.com/q77dpu
masak looks
viklund_: .split takes '' as a default argument nowadays. 22:12
viklund_ github++ again
masak I know, since I blitz-changed that after TimToady changed his mind. 22:13
viklund_ masak: oh, good, I was wondering that when I wrote that code...
masak oh, wait. might even be more appropriate to use .comb nowadays.
viklund_ comb?
masak it also takes '' as default. :)
viklund_: yes. :) TimToady usually mumbles about 'figure vs ground' with these two.
that is, split removes and comb keeps. 22:14
viklund_ my comb doesn't work: 22:16
./perl6 -e 'my $a="bacadae"; for $a.comb("a") -> $c { say $c }'
masak rakudo: my $a="bacadae"; for $a.comb("a") -> $c { say $c }
p6eval rakudo fb2fd4: OUTPUT«No applicable candidates found to dispatch to for 'comb'␤in Main (/tmp/pfAiDBPxNb:2)␤»
masak hm.
viklund_ what should the answer for that be. Or rather, where does the a's go? 22:17
do*
masak .comb should return a List.
very strange. I'm looking at the source code right now. 22:18
let's run this by #perl6.
in #perl6, it works :)
viklund_: oh! 22:19
viklund_ rakudo: say 'abcdefghi'.comb(/<[aei]>/).perl
p6eval rakudo fb2fd4: OUTPUT«["a", "e", "i"]␤»
viklund_ ah!
masak you use a string, but only a Code variant is defined.
checking spec...
viklund_ rakudo: my $a="bacadae"; for $a.comb(/a/) -> $c { say $c } 22:20
p6eval rakudo fb2fd4: OUTPUT«a␤a»
masak nope, it's only defined for regexes.
viklund_ rakudo: my $a="bacadae"; for $a.comb(//) -> $c { say $c }
p6eval rakudo fb2fd4: OUTPUT«Statement not terminated properly at line 2, near "(//) -> $c"␤in Main (src/gen_setting.pm:0)␤»
viklund_ rakudo: my $a="bacadae"; for $a.comb(//m) -> $c { say $c }
p6eval rakudo fb2fd4: OUTPUT«Statement not terminated properly at line 2, near "(//m) -> $"␤in Main (src/gen_setting.pm:0)␤»
masak viklund_: I guess taking Str as a first parameter is less useful for .comb than it is for .split :) 22:21
viklund_: the // pattern is forbidden in Perl 6.
viklund_ ;)
masak viklund_: and there are no longer any trailing flags. 22:22
viklund_ anyway, good night 22:23
masak viklund_: 'night. 22:24

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