svn switch --relocate svn.openfoundry.org/pugs svn.pugscode.org/pugs/ | run.pugscode.org | spec.pugscode.org | paste: sial.org/pbot/perl6 | pugs.blogs.com
Set by avar on 16 November 2006.
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audreyt !wiki AboutPugs 01:25
devbot6 audreyt: TracBot does not have a tracBase defined for this channel
audreyt !wiki AboutPugs 01:26
devbot6 audreyt: dev.pugscode.org/wiki/AboutPugs
lambdabot Title: AboutPugs - Pugs - Trac
audreyt !maketicket "Set up buildbot" We need automated nightly builds for (at least) Win32, OSX and Linux -- Also copy over instructions from eg cvs.haskell.org/trac/ghc/wiki/BuildBot 01:28
devbot6 audreyt: Posting a new ticket failed.
lambdabot Title: BuildBot - GHC - Trac
TimToady that page says that Perl 6 development happens on p6compiler, but that list has had three messages in the last month... 01:30
audreyt please login and edit it away...
and we can test devbot's RSS announcement that way too 01:32
TimToady trouble is I'm not sure what to change it *to* 01:35
audreyt delete it then? :) 01:36
allbery_b #perl6 of course :)
TimToady should it send something here? 01:37
01:38 devbot6 is now known as audreyt
TimToady run away!!! it's the devil bot!!! 01:38
whew!
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devbot6 Announcement from my owner (audreyt): #perl6 tracfeed 01:47
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devbot6 dev.pugscode.org/timeline?milestone...ormat=rss: AboutPugs edited by audreyt <dev.pugscode.org/wiki/AboutPugs> || AboutPugs edited by lwall <dev.pugscode.org/wiki/AboutPugs> || WikiStart edited by audreyt <dev.pugscode.org/wiki/WikiStart> || ProjectDependencyGraph edited by gaal <dev.pugscode.org/wiki/ProjectDependencyGraph> || WikiStart edited by audreyt < 01:50
lambdabot Title: Timeline - Pugs - Trac, tinyurl.com/2zaxzo
audreyt !rss announce dev 01:51
devbot6 audreyt: The operation succeeded.
TimToady but did the patient survive?
devbot6 dev: AboutPugs edited by audreyt <dev.pugscode.org/wiki/AboutPugs> || AboutPugs edited by lwall <dev.pugscode.org/wiki/AboutPugs> || WikiStart edited by audreyt <dev.pugscode.org/wiki/WikiStart> || ProjectDependencyGraph edited by gaal <dev.pugscode.org/wiki/ProjectDependencyGraph> || WikiStart edited by audreyt <dev.pugscode.org/wiki/WikiStart>
TimToady should the channel topic be pointing there somewhere? 01:52
audreyt sure
sec
ashelyb_ audreyt: I checked out the rss feed -- it doesn't show authors of commits, which is slightly annoying.
TimToady the spew here does 01:53
devbot6 dev: AboutPugs edited by audreyt <dev.pugscode.org/wiki/AboutPugs> || AboutPugs edited by lwall <dev.pugscode.org/wiki/AboutPugs> || WikiStart edited by audreyt <dev.pugscode.org/wiki/WikiStart> || ProjectDependencyGraph edited by gaal <dev.pugscode.org/wiki/ProjectDependencyGraph> || WikiStart edited by audreyt <dev.pugscode.org/wiki/WikiStart> || AboutPugs edited by audreyt <dev.pugscode.org/wiki/Ab
ashelyb_ TimToady: true, though I wish the spew here showed files changed.
TimToady it seems cumulative
audreyt tweaking 01:54
devbot6 dev: AboutPugs edited by audreyt <dev.pugscode.org/wiki/AboutPugs>
audreyt ok, better.
ashelyb_ nice!
audreyt++
TimToady .++.++
devbot6 dev: Ticket #1 (task created): Set up BuildBot for nightly builds <dev.pugscode.org/ticket/1> 01:56
audreyt that looks... useful 01:57
rss add planet6 planetsix.perl-foundation.org/rss20.xml 01:59
!rss add planet6 planetsix.perl-foundation.org/rss20.xml
devbot6 audreyt: The operation succeeded.
audreyt !rss announce planet6 02:00
devbot6 audreyt: The operation succeeded.
planet6: perl6.announce: Weekly Perl 6 mailing list summary for 14-20 January, 2007 <www.nntp.perl.org/group/perl.perl6....ce/549> || Audrey Tang: Weekly Perl 6 mailing list summary for 14-20 January, 2007 <pugs.blogs.com/pugs/2007/01/weekly_...2.html> || Luke Palmer: Perl 6 Rules: Elementary Compositionality + More Vocabulary <use.perl.org/~luqui/journal/32200?from=rss> || perl6.announce: Weekly Perl 6 mailing list
audreyt !changeset 15213 02:02
devbot6 audreyt: dev.pugscode.org/changeset/15213
lambdabot Title: Changeset 15213 - Pugs - Trac
audreyt !addticket "Move pugscode.org pages from svn to dev and make pugscode.org redirect to AboutPugs" 02:03
devbot6 audreyt: Error: "addticket" is not a valid command.
audreyt !newticket "Move pugscode.org pages from svn to dev and make pugscode.org redirect to AboutPugs"
devbot6 audreyt: (newticket ) -- Gives the link to the trac ticket submission page.
audreyt !maketicket "Move pugscode.org pages from svn to dev and make pugscode.org redirect to AboutPugs" 02:04
devbot6 audreyt: (maketicket [--type=<type>] [--reporter=<reporter>] [--component=<component>] [--owner=<owner>] [--milestone=<milestone>] [--version=<version>] "<summary>" <description> ) -- Submit a new ticket with summary <summary> and description <description> with the supplied options.
audreyt !maketicket "Move pugscode.org pages from svn to dev" Also, make pugscode.org redirect to AboutPugs
devbot6 audreyt: Posting a new ticket failed.
audreyt hm.
!maketicket "Move pugscode.org pages from svn to dev" Also, make pugscode.org redirect to AboutPugs 02:09
devbot6 audreyt: Posting a new ticket failed.
tene !maketicket "Making tickets through devbot6 doesn't work" Someone should fix devbot6 so that you can use it to make tickets 02:10
devbot6 tene: Posting a new ticket failed.
audreyt lol 02:12
!maketicket "Move pugscode.org pages from svn to dev" Also, make pugscode.org redirect to AboutPugs 02:13
devbot6 audreyt: Posting a new ticket failed: dev.pugscode.org/newticket ().
lambdabot Title: New Ticket - Pugs - Trac
audreyt !maketicket "Move pugscode.org pages from svn to dev" Also, make pugscode.org redirect to AboutPugs 02:14
devbot6 audreyt: An error has occurred and has been logged. Please contact this bot's administrator for more information.
audreyt hm, 400 bad request
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audreyt !maketicket "Move pugscode.org pages from svn to dev" Also, make pugscode.org redirect to AboutPugs 02:19
devbot6 audreyt: 'Posting a new ticket failed: dev.pugscode.org/newticket (<!DOCTYPE html\n PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD XHTML 1.0 Strict//EN"\n "www.w3.org/TR/xhtml1/DTD/xhtml1-str...\n<html xmlns="www.w3.org/1999/xhtml" lang="en" xml:lang="en">\n<head>\n <title>New Ticket - Pugs - Trac</title><link rel="start" href="/wiki" /><link rel="search" href="/search" /><link rel="help" (17 more messages)
lambdabot Title: New Ticket - Pugs - Trac
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audreyt !maketicket "Move pugscode.org pages from svn to dev" Also, make pugscode.org redirect to AboutPugs 02:21
devbot6 audreyt: 'Posting a new ticket failed: dev.pugscode.org/newticket (<!DOCTYPE html\n PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD XHTML 1.0 Strict//EN"\n "www.w3.org/TR/xhtml1/DTD/xhtml1-str...\n<html xmlns="www.w3.org/1999/xhtml" lang="en" xml:lang="en">\n<head>\n <title>New Ticket - Pugs - Trac</title><link rel="start" href="/wiki" /><link rel="search" href="/search" /><link rel="help" (17 more messages)
lambdabot Title: New Ticket - Pugs - Trac
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audreyt !maketicket "Move pugscode.org pages from svn to dev" Also, make pugscode.org redirect to AboutPugs. 03:05
devbot6 audreyt: An error has occurred and has been logged. Please contact this bot's administrator for more information.
tene ?eval my $j = any(1..100); say "omgwtf" if 20 == $j
03:05 evalbot_r15237 is now known as evalbot_r15241
evalbot_r15241 OUTPUT[omgwtfā¤omgwtfā¤] (Bool::True) 03:05
audreyt !maketicket "Move pugscode.org pages from svn to dev" Also, make pugscode.org redirect to AboutPugs. 03:06
devbot6 audreyt: An error has occurred and has been logged. Please contact this bot's administrator for more information.
audreyt !maketicket "Move pugscode.org pages from svn to dev" Also, make pugscode.org redirect to AboutPugs. 03:08
devbot6 audreyt: 'Posting a new ticket failed: dev.pugscode.org/newticket (<!DOCTYPE html\n PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD XHTML 1.0 Strict//EN"\n "www.w3.org/TR/xhtml1/DTD/xhtml1-str...\n<html xmlns="www.w3.org/1999/xhtml" lang="en" xml:lang="en">\n<head>\n <title>New Ticket - Pugs - Trac</title><link rel="start" href="/wiki" /><link rel="search" href="/search" /><link rel="help" (17 more messages)
lambdabot Title: New Ticket - Pugs - Trac
audreyt !maketicket "Move pugscode.org pages from svn to dev" Also, make pugscode.org redirect to AboutPugs. 03:09
devbot6 audreyt: An error has occurred and has been logged. Please contact this bot's administrator for more information.
audreyt !maketicket "Move pugscode.org pages from svn to dev" Also, make pugscode.org redirect to AboutPugs.
devbot6 audreyt: 'Posting a new ticket failed: dev.pugscode.org/newticket (<!DOCTYPE html\n PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD XHTML 1.0 Strict//EN"\n "www.w3.org/TR/xhtml1/DTD/xhtml1-str...\n<html xmlns="www.w3.org/1999/xhtml" lang="en" xml:lang="en">\n<head>\n <title>New Ticket - Pugs - Trac</title><link rel="start" href="/wiki" /><link rel="search" href="/search" /><link rel="help" (17 more messages)
lambdabot Title: New Ticket - Pugs - Trac
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tene ?eval my $j = any(1..100); my $k = 1; $k++ if 20 == $j; $k 03:11
evalbot_r15241 \3
tene That's... wrong.
I think.
lidden ?eval my $j = any(1..100); my $k = 1; $k++ if 200 == $j; $k 03:12
evalbot_r15241 \1
audreyt !maketicket "Move pugscode.org pages from svn to dev" Also, make pugscode.org redirect to AboutPugs. 03:16
devbot6 audreyt: 'Posting a new ticket failed: dev.pugscode.org/newticket (<!DOCTYPE html\n PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD XHTML 1.0 Strict//EN"\n "www.w3.org/TR/xhtml1/DTD/xhtml1-str...\n<html xmlns="www.w3.org/1999/xhtml" lang="en" xml:lang="en">\n<head>\n <title>New Ticket - Pugs - Trac</title><link rel="start" href="/wiki" /><link rel="search" href="/search" /><link rel="help" (17 more messages)
lambdabot Title: New Ticket - Pugs - Trac
audreyt gives up for now ;) 03:17
tene So, audreyt, you able to confirm or deny that that's a bug?
audreyt (supposedly it'd need to move form urllib2 to mechanize or cookielib to properly handle cookies.)
TimToady why don't you put in "constant" as a declarator instead. :)
I tried earlier and failed... :)
audreyt tene: yes, postfix-if seems to be wrong. write a test please 03:19
t/junction/ somewhere
?eval my $j = any(1..100); my $k = 1; if 20 == $j { $k++ } $k
evalbot_r15241 \2
mugwump heh, love that dependency graph 03:23
what does the blue represent? 03:24
audreyt heya mugwump
the blueline is PugsRoadMap numbering
TimToady: does "constant sub foo {...}" simply mean "sub foo is inlined {...}"? 03:26
TimToady inlineable, anyway
and run at compile time, probably
maybe BEGIN is "constant sub BEGIN {...}"
mugwump is this the same: "sub foo() is pure { ... }" ? 03:27
TimToady dunno, I didn't write that trait 03:28
mugwump oh, I thought pure was the trait for functions without side-effects
audreyt TimToady: run at compile time?
I thought that's what macro is for
my sub foo {...} === my &foo ::= sub { ... } 03:29
constant sub foo {...} === constant &foo ::= sub { ... }
TimToady macro body isn't "real" code
it's metacode
at this point, I don't care if it's really constant
audreyt ok.
so it's like "my" 03:30
TimToady I just tried aliasing it to "my" and it didn't work
audreyt still cisible in MY::() ?
*visible
TimToady presumably
aliasing to my and throwing a readonly on it would work for now 03:31
audreyt done. 03:32
testing before commit...
TimToady I wonder if the dup junction could be related to multithreading the junction 03:34
audreyt sure is 03:38
svnbot6 r15242 | audreyt++ | * New "constant" scope as alis for "my" (not really constant yet)
audreyt $_ is passed (True|False)
to the implicit block around if
?eval $_ if 3
evalbot_r15241 \3
audreyt problem is it really should not be an implicit $_
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audreyt fixed. testing 03:40
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avar audreyt: sial.org/pbot/22906 # more progress on re::engine::Plugin, I basically have everything working, what's left is just moving more stuff to the $re object (named matches et al), supporting captures (easy from now on) and making sure all my SV ref keeping is correct:) 03:57
lambdabot Title: Paste #22906 from Someone at 85.197.228.236
avar and oops, those flags should be 40961 :) 03:58
avar sleep & 04:00
TimToady karma TimToady 04:04
jabbot TimToady: TimToady has karma of 40
audreyt avar: nice! 04:05
avar: upload upload upload
avar It's still very brokenish, but I'll be able to make a CPAN release soonish 04:06
ish++
svnbot6 r15243 | audreyt++ | * tene++ reported that:
r15243 | audreyt++ | warn if 1|2|3;
r15243 | audreyt++ | errorneously warned thrice because it was rewritten as:
r15243 | audreyt++ | if 1|2|3 -> $_ { warn }
r15243 | audreyt++ | instead of the clearly saner:
r15243 | audreyt++ | if 1|2|3 { warn }
r15243 | audreyt++ | This commit fixes it by defaulting syntactic prim/bare blocks
r15243 | audreyt++ | to take () instead of ($_=$+_).
audreyt chsh ish
<- really should start making slides instead of procrastinating online 04:15
beppu__ audreyt, what are you making slides for? 04:34
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audreyt beppu: Monday's talk @ google.tw 04:37
beppu__ good luck on that. I haven't been able to contribute much, but I appreciate all the work you're doing for Perl 6. 04:38
beppu__ going home....
audreyt thank-you for your kind words :)
lidden \wii 04:52
Khisanth those seem to be sold out 04:59
amnesiac Khisanth, ssshhh.... 05:01
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nothingmuch Ciao all! off to the airport 06:33
kanru =quin 06:41
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gaal there are lambdawii? 07:30
audreyt TimToady: say I'd like to request timely destruction of a variable, in the style of 07:38
given DBI.connect(...) -> $dbh { LEAVE { $dbh.DESTROY } ... normal code ... }
is that the idiomatic way to do this? should there by some way to somehow tell the Codethat its param is to be timely destructed upon LEAVE? 07:39
(assuming this RAII pattern is desirable to keep)
(given nondeterministic GC)
I guess this can also be implemented as ENTER/LEAVE methods defined on the $dbh object, and have "given" always call them. 07:42
(that's the C#/Python way.) 07:46
the way D solves it is by introducing yet another declarator
which translates to p6: 07:47
given DBI.connect(...) -> $dbh is scoped { ... }
the trait would cause its immediate DESTROY upon LEAVE. 07:48
maybe "scoped" is the wrong word. but a trait feels useful.
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nothingmuch yo yo yo homies sup 08:24
werd to yo lambdas
nothingmuch is studying... stevan is planning on deserting him in New Haven so he can learn how to be an OG
audreyt OG? 08:29
Ocaml Guru?
08:30 GeJ joined
rgs that sure sounds like some sort of initiation 08:39
wolverian t-a-w.blogspot.com/2007/02/right-to...mming.html -- nice flame ;) 08:40
lambdabot Title: taw's blog: The right to criticize programming languages, tinyurl.com/2cavc5
rgs so. while I'm here. I hope to put up somewhere a summary of all improvements in 5.10 regexps. just to check that P6 isn't left behind :) 08:41
GeJ: hello.
audreyt rgs: woot :) 08:45
rgs wolverian: oh come on. this guy says java is portable :) 08:46
wolverian I wish everyone was as lucid as taw in their flames.
rgs, compared to many things, it is... (sadly)
'course we know better.
rgs right.
I had once to port a Java application (with threads) from Windows to Solaris. That was teh pain. Perl 5 is much nicer. But most languages would have made the thing almost impossible... 08:47
araujo somebody talking so good about java, it's just too suspicious :-) 08:49
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shay|p6 good morning (IST) 10:24
audreyt greetings. 10:27
shay|p6 hello audreyt, how are you doing? 10:31
araujo: hermano :)
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audreyt shay|p6: doing just fine, trying to find out how to describe Perl 6 as a language optimized to create languages 10:43
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audreyt such that library authors can use another library to shape perl 6 into a language they like, and use that language to shape the language for the library's user (recursively) 10:46
merlyn (and in the distance, 10000 managers run screaming) 10:47
audreyt a general-purpose domain-specific programming language if you will. 10:48
well, the Rails dialect of Ruby (which is not at all like Ruby) seems to work just fine...
merlyn as I said... screaming. :)
sorry, I wear at least two hats
audreyt aye aye. which is why perl6 _also_ has to focus on sane defaults 10:49
unlike perl5 which has this "use strict" dialect
merlyn as a perl6 user, I'm looking forward to this. as a guy who has to sell this to corps around teh world, I'm a bit confused at the complexity :)
audreyt the manager would like people to immediately reshape their perl5 to perl5-strict-dialect, I hope :) 10:50
the point here is, "shape" very often means not "drastically change syntax" but "enforce certain policy and get the compiler reject all other styles" 10:51
the ability to do that should make managers happy, I hope :)
for example, the ability to completely pretend three-part loops did not exist.
merlyn it's good ultimately, it just looks scary until it's properly sdescribed
audreyt nod, which is I'm agonizing over the words/examples to use... 10:52
s/I'm/why I'm/ 10:53
svnbot6 r15244 | moritz++ | Added test cases for say with explicit filehandle 11:11
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ludan ola 12:10
moritz tach ;)
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avar yawns 13:53
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vladd hi Ziggy6! 14:48
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pmurias hi 14:58
are the sematic used by multimethods in specifing the best match speced somewhere? 14:59
i read the Multisubs and Multimethods section of S12 15:00
15:01 cmarcelo joined
nwc10 A good question. I assume so, but it doesn't seem that anyone who knows the answer is awake 15:01
devbot6 dev: Ticket #2 (task created): Update pugs t/regex/p6regex/ to use the new rx_* files. <dev.pugscode.org/ticket/2>
pmurias the synopsis just uses the word "best" 15:02
audreyt pmurias: docs/notes/multi_method_dispatch/mmd-draft.txt 15:03
it's the closest we have with @Larry for consensus
but it needs to be ported to Spec English and littered with more examples 15:04
maybe maketicket for that? :)
TimToady I don't like the voting metaphor 15:05
audreyt neither do I :/ we had the racing metaphor first 15:06
devbot6 dev: Ticket #3 (task created): Capture fglock/putter interview info to kp6 faq. <dev.pugscode.org/ticket/3>
audreyt but racing snipers that doubles as suicide bombers are... a bit too violent for me
(I think undeads were there for a while too) 15:07
nwc10 "branes" and zombies? richardc infiltrated perl 6 for a while? :-)
cmarcelo moose! is there a way to create a default/easy link for showing the all open tickets in trac? now there isn't a 1-click way to view them :P 15:08
lambdabot cmarcelo: You have 1 new message. '/msg lambdabot @messages' to read it.
audreyt add one to the homepage then? :)
wait, dev.pugscode.org/query is it no?
lambdabot Title: Custom Query - Pugs - Trac
cmarcelo not for me.. I mean, the /query link gets me to a form, not to a list of tickets.. i'll finish TASKS -> tickets then see how to make a 1-click link.. 15:10
audreyt cmarcelo++ 15:11
dev.pugscode.org/query shows 3 tickets for me
lambdabot Title: Custom Query - Pugs - Trac
cmarcelo hmm.. are you logged in? 15:12
devbot6 dev: Ticket #4 (task created): Fix PIL2JS. <dev.pugscode.org/ticket/4>
audreyt tried with both yes and no
if you are logged in, try remove the first filter
that says owner=you?
I think it's a sticky operation
devbot6 dev: Ticket #5 (task created): Refactor util/run-smoke.pl. <dev.pugscode.org/ticket/5> 15:14
cmarcelo every time I leave /query and come back, the first filter is back :( 15:15
audreyt try making a link on the homepage: 15:17
[query:status=new|assigned|reopened Open tickets] 15:18
devbot6 dev: Ticket #6 (task created): Keep STATUS file updated. <dev.pugscode.org/ticket/6>
audreyt !wiki TracQuery
devbot6 audreyt: dev.pugscode.org/wiki/TracQuery
audreyt see that for more details
lambdabot Title: TracQuery - Pugs - Trac
cmarcelo oka
devbot6 dev: Ticket #7 (task created): Tests directory organization. <dev.pugscode.org/ticket/7> 15:20
TimToady audreyt: we've already got "is leave { .close }" 15:21
er, "will leave { .close } 15:22
I wonder if explicit reference counting should be built into open/close generally 15:23
and you make an explicit ref-counted link with some kind of reopen
cmarcelo (putter?) the files docs/Perl6/Overview/* looks like PODified, so looks like a task done, or the entry in TASKS means something else?
audreyt TimToady: what I don't quite like is the explicit {.close} 15:25
Limbic_Region babel: german english Auf Wiedersehen
TimToady will close
Limbic_Region not here either apparently
TimToady except then it'd chew up the normal body
audreyt yeah.
devbot6 dev: Ticket #8 (task created): Fix old repository (svn.openfoundry.org) references. <dev.pugscode.org/ticket/8> 15:26
TimToady is closed
is autoclose
hmm
merlyn is clothes
audreyt the problem with {.close} is it's auotinvoking a userlevel method
or rather, force programming to spell out the autoinvoking
TimToady anyway, if we culturally generalized open/close to refcount semantics, we could have a consistent way to pass out a refcounted object
or clean it up if nobody took an explicit refcount 15:27
merlyn: didn't get a chance to congratulate you!!!
audreyt nod. that would be nice
merlyn well, it's more about what I haven't done for ten years, than what I have done. :)
but I didn't do anything successfully, so here I am!
TimToady well, don't start now. :)
cmarcelo brb &
merlyn definitely not! 15:28
devbot6 dev: Ticket #9 (enhancement created): Make evalbot report the build failure when it happens. <dev.pugscode.org/ticket/9>
merlyn it's the biggest non-news in my life. :)
TimToady where in the world are you at the moment?
merlyn the anti-press-release
just getting off of geekcruise#36
physically on the waterfront in ft lauderdale florida
TimToady I know the place... 15:29
merlyn I'm flying home tomorrow for two days, then down to burbank for two weeks, then up to palo alto for 10 days.
and this is the tail end of a 3 week trip already
so two days home out of seven weeks
TimToady so maybe role Handle is our official way to do explicit refcounting 15:31
maybe we're trying to get rid of the wrong thing here, and it's the "leave" that's the usual case 15:34
which would give us "will { .close }"
audreyt hm. 15:36
TimToady or throw out "will" and replace it with "leave", "keep", "undo" etc.
"leave {.close}"
audreyt still feels rather nonidiomatic compared to other languages with nondeterministic GC... 15:37
TimToady but I'm not sure this will be used often enough to warrant any default over "will leave {.close}"
audreyt filehandles surely?
TimToady yes, but most of most programs is processing lines, not opening files.
15:38 trym joined
audreyt fair enough... 15:38
TimToady I do realize that P5 programmers will balk at writing even that much...
maybe its -> Handle $h that is magically scoping 15:39
audreyt been thinking that, yes. 15:40
my Handle $h # too
TimToady FileHandle is also rather bulky
audreyt and all its subtypes 15:41
TimToady well, I guess IO is our shorthand
audreyt so thing that derives Handle is magically scoped when annotated as a constraint
TimToady it's almost turning into a monad...
audreyt for it to be a proper monad we still need this RealWorld type...
TimToady nah, that's just the prototypical monad 15:42
anything that doesn't behave programmatically can be a monad. :)
audreyt that's very Leibnizian of you...
TimToady I often speak hyperbolically 15:43
no wait, that was the other L guy...
audreyt this L guy speaks in binary... 15:44
given sufficient reason, that is
allbery_b monads are just perl<6's magic :)
TimToady use perl5:Foo == thread the Foo module with the perl5 monad... 15:45
audreyt yay I finished slides sketch
TimToady audreyt++
speaking of which, why doesn't audreyt++.++ work? 15:46
audreyt I guess "Extensible Compilation" is a good enough description
better than "Malleable Compilation"
TimToady oh way, that's the value
nevermind
audreyt (for the metaprogramming support)
audreyt ponders "Maimable Compilation"
TimToady Derivable languages 15:47
I keep picturing Perl 6 as the root of a big naming scheme for all languages. :)
audreyt it's both the root and the top...
Root|Roof
TimToady use perl6://now/I/am/Python 15:48
Juerd use chameleon;
TimToady but I understand you are trying not to scare the audience too much :) 15:49
audreyt TimToady: so, if I'm to schedule a Mountain View hackathon, does July work for you? something like early Jul .. oscon 15:50
May or June is also possible, but that means two US trips for me (already submitted oscon)
TimToady I think so, have to check with my executive secretary to be sure
audreyt ok. I plan to stay longer this time 15:51
TimToady she sez it should be fine
audreyt will check with google folks to see if they have spare rooms in the 'plex
failing that, would need to find localhost
TimToady you would be most welcome at our humble adobe
it's probably closer to the googleplex than their accomodations 15:52
quite walkable, in fact
moritz btw is anybody coming to debconf7?
TimToady name it debcon7 and you'll get crackers coming by accident 15:53
audreyt TimToady: oh nice. 'plex may work better as hackathon space if we get more people joinging
moritz TimToady: I have no influence on the name ;(
audreyt but I've love staying at ::Larry -- hopefully I won't bore you to death :) 15:54
*I'd
TimToady look, our kids ranged from ADD to Asperger's...we're ready for anything 15:55
well, almost anything...
audreyt :) will keep you posted then 15:56
TimToady kewl
Juerd From ADD to PDD is more symmetrical ;)
audreyt tries to get some sleep... bbl &
TimToady ah yes, my favorite diagnosis PDD-NOS 15:57
Juerd As opposed to the very tiny group of PDD-OS :P
TimToady "not otherwise specified"
Juerd Including PDD-Asperger.
Do they include "PDD" where you live?
Or is Asperger's seen as a thing by itself?
TimToady they didn't have Asperger in the Dmumble IV 15:58
PDD-NOS was the closest they had
Juerd DSM-IV
TimToady the DSM IV, sez my executive secretary 15:59
oh, that's that new one, which has it
Glo says III was just PDD-NOS
Juerd Yea. I was about to mention that the DSM IV *does* have both
TimToady well, nice that half of silicon valley is no longer "miscellaneous" 16:00
Juerd Hee :)
Juerd got his share of the DSM spectrum too
TimToady can't say I haven't noticed. :) 16:01
Juerd I'm sure you could ;)
(qed? :P)
TimToady laziness=PDD impatience=ADD ... hubris=profit!!! 16:02
Juerd PDD, ADD, HIQ. Common set. 16:03
TimToady actually, hubris is some form of narcissism, I expect 16:04
Juerd Intellectual narcissism, then.
I like the thought.
TimToady obviously we need to find some place where the normal psychotics can fit in. 16:05
Juerd I found out that my site is on the first google page if you search for "psycho test"
Because of a entirely non serious page inspired by Wolverian's image hacking in Pelr. 16:06
Perl
TimToady accumulating useless facts is one of the symptoms
Juerd Things that are useless to some, may be of great value to others :) 16:07
TimToady I've accumulated quite a wide variety of useless facts
Juerd Doesn't everyone do that?
TimToady yes, but they accumulate normal useless facts, not abnormal ones. 16:08
Juerd They just haven't discovered Wikipedia yet ;)
I all(hate, love) that site. 16:09
TimToady when I was young I read the entire World Book encyclopedia 16:10
Juerd Browsing through the huge three-shelves-occupying encyclopaedia at Grandpa's was why I liked visiting him so much. 16:11
Now that I have Wikipedia at my disposal, I like going there, for the old guy himself :) 16:12
devbot6 dev: WikiStart edited by cmarcelo <dev.pugscode.org/wiki/WikiStart> 16:15
svnbot6 r15245 | moritz++ | moved tests to the appropriate location 16:16
Juerd afk 16:18
devbot6 dev: Ticket #10 (task created): Rearrange t/ for reuse with multiple Perl 6 implementations. <dev.pugscode.org/ticket/10> 16:23
dev: Ticket #9 (enhancement closed): Make evalbot report the build failure when it happens. <dev.pugscode.org/ticket/9#comment:1> 16:25
merlyn ... rename t/{xx-uncategorized/pi_internals.t => builtins/math/pi_internals.t} (100%)
so says git-svn
devbot6 dev: Ticket #11 (task created): Remove all unconditional SKIP/TODO flags from t/. <dev.pugscode.org/ticket/11> 16:27
moritz merlyn: dev.pugscode.org/changeset/14904 is a change of svnbot
lambdabot Title: Changeset 14904 - Pugs - Trac
moritz s/svnbot/evalbot/ 16:28
merlyn why are you poiting that out to me
moritz merlyn: I understood something wrong ;) 16:29
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devbot6 dev: Ticket #10 (task updated): Rearrange t/ for reuse with multiple Perl 6 implementations. <dev.pugscode.org/ticket/10#comment:1> 16:31
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devbot6 dev: Ticket #12 (task created): Tests directory scaling problem. <dev.pugscode.org/ticket/12> 16:33
dev: Ticket #13 (task created): Synchronize docs/ with current lang spec. <dev.pugscode.org/ticket/13> 16:37
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devbot6 dev: Ticket #14 (enhancement created): More information in pugs -V output. <dev.pugscode.org/ticket/14> 16:40
dev: Ticket #15 (task created): Function aliases for math number rounding. <dev.pugscode.org/ticket/15> 16:43
dev: Ticket #16 (task created): Shortcut/script for easy Prelude regeneration. <dev.pugscode.org/ticket/16> 16:47
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devbot6 dev: Ticket #17 (task created): Introspection interface. <dev.pugscode.org/ticket/17> 16:49
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svnbot6 r15246 | cmarcelo++ | * Add messages on important project_planning/ files pointing to the 16:56
r15246 | cmarcelo++ | Pugs Trac at dev.pugscode.org/
lambdabot Title: Pugs - Trac
devbot6 dev: Ticket #18 (task created): The Pugs Commentary. <dev.pugscode.org/ticket/18> 17:03
masak_ audreyt: the logo on dev.pugscode.org/query doesn't scale very well. please use this scaled 72x72 version instead: masak.org/carl/pugscode-small.png 17:05
lambdabot Title: Custom Query - Pugs - Trac
cmarcelo pp/TASKS is ported to new ticket system. I skipped that CruiseControl task since #1 looks like a replacement.. 17:06
moritz cmarcelo++ ;)
17:07 masak_ is now known as masak
cmarcelo @tell putter See new ticket #18, maybe is an alternative to your idea to have an TALK page for each .hs file. Or maybe is complementary :) 17:07
lambdabot Consider it noted.
cmarcelo It would be nice to have a post on blog.pugscode.org telling the world about the new Trac, the Christmas Graph, and what happened in #perl6 / pugsland since November... 17:12
cmarcelo wonders if putter has a blog bit... ;-) 17:13
audreyt masak: I'll fix the logo soon... maketicket for it? or even do one based on (say) aburlison's Perl6Mascot logo? 17:15
merlyn is "stevan working on MetalModel 2.0, based on MiniMetaModel"
is Metal there correct?
a cute joke?
a cross between Mental and Meta, perhaps? 17:16
or more forged?
audreyt it's typo.
moritz somtimes life is simple ;) 17:17
audreyt occam and all :)
merlyn ok 17:18
devbot6 dev: WikiStart edited by cmarcelo <dev.pugscode.org/wiki/WikiStart>
merlyn just wondering how many names I have to still learn. :)
I just looked at a_dependency_graph.dot 17:19
yeow
cmarcelo devbot6: you should be karma friendly... :P
devbot6 cmarcelo: Error: "you" is not a valid command.
merlyn "You is" is not proper english. :)
you ain't no proper command!
cmarcelo hehe
merlyn my momma done told me 'bout creepy bots like you! 17:20
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masak audreyt: ticket submitted 17:43
devbot6 dev: Ticket #19 (task created): Replace current logo with a correctly scaled version <dev.pugscode.org/ticket/19> 17:45
svnbot6 r15247 | lwall++ | contextualizers, subcalls, listops including post-declared, 1st <suppose...> 18:20
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araujo shay|p6, :-) 18:44
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shay araujo, bro, cōæ½xF3mo estōæ½xE1s? 19:18
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akesson hey 21:50
TimToady hey, hey
21:51 avar joined
akesson about perlembed, is the the linking dynamic or static against the perl interpreter? 21:52
TimToady usually dynamic, can be static
akesson we are trying to do some cool stuff here :)
TimToady where is "here"? 21:53
akesson sweden ;)
TimToady that would have been my guess, considering your address ends .se
akesson clever
:)
and yea, what is DynaLoader.a ? 21:54
TimToady basically, the difference between miniperl and perl
akesson so, how to make it dynamic?
TimToady just need to make sure it builds a .so on most Unixy systems 21:55
I believe it's a Configure option
akesson hmm
ok
TimToady I note that fedora comes with /usr/lib/perl5/5.8.5/i386-linux-thread-multi/CORE/libperl.so 21:56
which perl
and that's what /usr/bin/perl links against 21:57
akesson so, dynamic is the default?
TimToady /usr/bin/perl itself being a 14k program. :)
akesson thats great! 21:58
moritz du `which perl`
1.1M /usr/bin/perl
so it's different on debian ;)
TimToady basically look in perlmain.c to see how perl embeds itself to make the ordinary perl executable. 21:59
akesson we are gonna do code in Perl as some kind of plugin for a C program. 22:00
so, C program runs the Perl code
pretty nifty 22:01
TimToady is certainly doable
akesson is __Ace__ btw :) 22:02
TimToady ah
akesson not at home atm so.. :)
TimToady thought it looked a little familiar
akesson hehe
ok, gonna eat now... laters
my buddy says hello
TimToady hello, buddy! 22:03
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akesson anyone here that has ideas on how to solve nameconflicts when it comes to filesystems? 23:15
besides numbering
moritz timestamps, hashes 23:17
akesson: or what are you aiming at?
akesson: and what's bad about numbers?
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akesson we are not against numbers.. just wanna see other alternatives 23:18
hashes doesnt solve it btw
moritz rand() ;) 23:19
akesson :D
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