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🦋 Welcome to the MAIN() IRC channel of the Raku Programming Language (raku.org). This channel is logged for the purpose of keeping a history about its development | evalbot usage: 'm: say 3;' or /msg camelia m: ... | Log available at irclogs.raku.org/raku/live.html . If you're a beginner, you can also check out the #raku-beginner channel! Set by lizmat on 8 June 2022. |
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| japhb | Quibono: Sure, the more the merrier. Do note that it's a LOT of work to go from "the basics" to "can compete with Rakudo on MoarVM". But this is why the language is defined by its test suite -- if your compiler can pass the test suite, it compiles Raku. | 00:01 | |
| Quibono | Yeah that makes sense, like 1000 tests in the roasts? | ||
| Voldenet | more backends is doable | 00:02 | |
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| Nemokosch | . | 07:01 | |
| tellable6 | 2022-07-22T23:16:22Z #raku <SmokeMachine> Nemokosch: I have done something that looks like that: github.com/FCO/MemoizedDOM/blob/ma...o/Todo.pm6 | ||
| 2022-07-23T11:11:01Z #raku <lizmat> Nemokosch: github.com/lizmat/HTML-Entities-Fast on its way to the ecosystem | |||
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| Nemokosch | Okay okay, thank you. I'm gonna check it out soon. First I want to profile HTML::Tag without the entity encoding because yes... that's still too slow | 07:03 | |
| Nemokosch | öööh | 07:11 | |
| is join meant to be slow? | |||
| I rendered a 4 column, 3 row table, the whole program ran for 180 milliseconds with the profiling | 07:15 | ||
| 90 of which belongs to one single join call, apparently | |||
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| yeah no, this is bullshit; hypering has a high initial cost that kills the benchmark | 07:24 | ||
| actually you might have even pointed this out in a way, now that I think of it | 07:25 | ||
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| I don't know who to reach out to with the MoarVM profiler HTML but it would be really-really desirable to properly handle the history with JS | 08:06 | ||
| it's quite tough to return | |||
| Kaiepi | the profiler js has a habit of printing massive numbers for no obvious reason and grinding my browser to a halt at times | 08:14 | |
| Nemokosch | true | 08:17 | |
| but the biggest problem is that I'm yet to find out how to get anything useful from it | |||
| Kaiepi | i'm on this whole MOP tangent from my networking work out of readings i got from the profiler when benchmarking a prototype of some packet abstractions | 08:18 | |
| it was spending a weirdly long amount of time in routines originating from there | 08:19 | ||
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| Nemokosch | I don't know... could it be that the sheer cost of running methods is this big? I wouldn't know | 08:29 | |
| and this profiler seems barely useful at all | |||
| I click on something that seems big and the parts that show up don't nearly add up to the value | |||
| Kaiepi | metamethods are small and run as such, the problem is they carry a lot of weight and inefficiencies get blown out of proportion that way | 08:30 | |
| the changes from github.com/rakudo/rakudo/pull/4936 etc. influence build times, for instance | 08:32 | ||
| Nemokosch | there were 174361 sink calls... | 08:35 | |
| I think the "exclusive time" row doesn't contain valid percentages, by the way | 08:36 | ||
| inclusive time: | |||
| 9.48% (20.98ms) | |||
| exclusive time: | |||
| 0.6% (12.99ms) | |||
| BRUH | |||
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| habere-et-disper | Adverbs appear to not be checked for syntax/typos. Is this meant to be the case? | 09:06 | |
| For example the plural form tripped me up: | 09:07 | ||
| m: say '123abc456'.substr-eq: 'abç', 3, :ignoremarks | |||
| camelia | False | ||
| habere-et-disper | Compare with: | 09:09 | |
| m: say '123abc456'.substr-eq: 'abç', 3, :ignoremark | |||
| camelia | True | ||
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| ab5tract | o/ | 09:35 | |
| Nemokosch | I think adverbs are just pairs | 09:42 | |
| I don't know if there was some deliberate design choice with this, I mean that they don't check the keys | 09:43 | ||
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| ab5tract | any idea why two datetimes that for all intents and purposes look the same don't smartmatch each other? | 12:24 | |
| m: my $dt = DateTime.now; say $dt ~~ $dt.clone | |||
| camelia | False | ||
| ab5tract | Seems... strange | 12:25 | |
| Nemokosch | I don't see any ACCEPTS method for them... | 12:27 | |
| If this really is the case, I suppose Any.ACCEPTS would be used, which checks for object identity | 12:30 | ||
| I don't know if there is any specific reason for this, though. Maybe it just went unnoticed | |||
| gfldex | ab5tract: please file a rakudobug | ||
| ab5tract | gfldex: will do | 12:32 | |
| gfldex: just to clarify, that just means adding a bug to the rakudo repo on github, correct? | 12:38 | ||
| gfldex | aye | ||
| Nemokosch | if we can trust the documentation, it seems like it's rather a "design bug" than an "environment bug" 😅 | 12:40 | |
| probably not intentional though | 12:41 | ||
| ab5tract | It could do string comparison or even an instant comparison | 12:42 | |
| hmm, it even provides == | 12:43 | ||
| good to know, but makes ACCEPTS an even stranger omition, as I wouldn't expect the numeric op to be provided for DateTime | 12:44 | ||
| Nemokosch | == does Int coercion, as you might know | 12:45 | |
| ab5tract | in this case that involves a cast to Instant | ||
| Just going by the docs here. Maybe == isn't specifically defined, it's behavior is just documented... | 12:46 | ||
| Nemokosch | sorry, not Int, Numeric | 12:48 | |
| I tend to forget there are other numbers as well 😅 | |||
| and yes, apparently Instant "is Cool does Real", so for some, to me unknown reason, it can be used for Numeric coercion | 12:50 | ||
| guifa | an Instant is at its core just a number, and it logically makes sense to use > < = ≤ ≥ ≠with that value | 12:51 | |
| Nemokosch | how does this coercion happen, though? | 12:53 | |
| gfldex | Comparing DateTime is quite wonky in general. If you compare 2 timestamps, what precision do you want? | 12:54 | |
| ab5tract | I would say you want the precision that is defined | ||
| as precise as the datetime's themselves, that is | |||
| Nemokosch | there is no .Numeric on DateTime or Dateish, yet I can call .Numeric on an instance | ||
| ab5tract | so if you don't want seconds, you make sure you are comparing datetimes that don't have seconds | ||
| gfldex | That may mean that some ppl will miss appointments. Humans tend to think about equalness down to the minute, maybe second. | 12:55 | |
| guifa | Nemokosch: an Instant turns into (at the moment) a POSIX-like time stamp (unix epoch, but iirc POSIX doesn't do fractional time, but Instant.Numeric preserves sub-second precision) | ||
| tellable6 | guifa, I'll pass your message to Nemokosch | ||
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| Nemokosch | . | 12:57 | |
| tellable6 | 2022-07-24T12:55:52Z #raku <guifa> Nemokosch: an Instant turns into (at the moment) a POSIX-like time stamp (unix epoch, but iirc POSIX doesn't do fractional time, but Instant.Numeric preserves sub-second precision) | ||
| Nemokosch | negative: | 12:58 | |
| m: DateTime.now andthen .Instant eqv .Numeric andthen .say | |||
| camelia | True | ||
| Nemokosch | They do the same - but how does DateTime get a .Numeric method in the first place? | 13:00 | |
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| lizmat | re DateTime.ACCEPTS: github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/31...00b6e74797 | 13:12 | |
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| Nemokosch | In master already? 😂 | 13:14 | |
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| ab5tract | Thanks lizmat! I had a feeling you would be on top of this :) | 13:32 | |
| Gotta go for now. Have a great afternoon everyone! | 13:33 | ||
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| Nemokosch | 👋 | 13:40 | |
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| Quibono | Hello everyone | 14:07 | |
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| lizmat | Quibono /o | 14:21 | |
| Quibono | How are you doing lizmat? | 14:46 | |
| lizmat | pretty well :-) and you? | 14:47 | |
| Quibono | Good. Hoping to start making a VM tonight and maybe learn some raku. | 14:52 | |
| lizmat | good for you! | ||
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| nine | Nemokosh: the parts that show up when you click on something big in the profiler cannot add up to the total, since there's also the exclusive time spent in that big thing itself. | 17:42 | |
| tellable6 | 2022-07-22T15:48:42Z #raku <ab5tract> nine I'd be interested in perusing a list of low-hanging fruit for new-disp, if you have the tuits to put one together | ||
| nine | new-disp? Isn't it a little late for that considering it's been merged for almost a year now? | 17:43 | |
| Nemokosch | 🤣 | 17:48 | |
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| \s/new-disp/RakuAST, then 🧠| 17:52 | ||
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| by the way | 17:58 | ||
| you must come to discord, s// is built in | |||
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| nine | ab5tract: sorry, I'm quite under the weather right now. I'd just run a spectest with RAKUDO_RAKUAST=1 and look at a few of the failing ones. Compilation failures due to unrecognized syntax are often the easier ones as you often just have to copy&paste from the old grammar and adjust a little. Actions are much easier to write now. Hardest part is finding the relevant bits of the old actions. | 18:28 | |
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| SmokeMachine | I don't know how useful it is (if useful at all), but I've been playing on adding Cro web components using pro template and web socket. Would someone like to take a look at it and tell me if it could be useful for anything, please? github.com/FCO/Cro-WebSocket-WebCo...Routes.pm6 | 19:49 | |
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| SmokeMachine | Does anyone have any opinion about that? | 20:16 | |
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| Nemokosch | I'm not competent at this, sorry | 20:44 | |
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| melezhik | .tell lizmat for some reasons rak does not search on my SparkyCI alpine test box - sparrowhub.io:2222/report/914 - but maybe this Rakudo version thing? | 23:26 | |
| tellable6 | melezhik, I'll pass your message to lizmat | ||
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