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Set by lizmat on 8 June 2022.
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tonyo do a quick search to read hundreds of pages on monads and still not understand what they are or how to use them 00:14
watch a few hours of bartosz to still not understand what they are 00:15
just use ruby
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Nemokosch Monads are glorified decorator pattern, change my mind 06:26
.oO( does Go have monads? :-)
Nemokosch Ruby is like the Smalltalk of Python 06:36
Those who use it swear that it's the best programming language ever
But they very apparently fail to convince most people about it
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Voldenet monads are just monoids in the category of endofunctors 09:14
Nemokosch okay okay, flaunt with category theory -.- 09:15
Voldenet it's an old haskell joke ;D
Nemokosch the overthinker's math 09:16
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Anton Antonov First, of all I agree with that statement. It is a little oversimplifying, but it is “to the point”, especially for people with OOP background. 12:25
<@297037173541175296> Now, trying to “change your mind”. For me the main benefit of using monads is that they make the code written with them to have algebraic properties. I use monadic designs as “developer-user interfaces”, not necessarily to implement or design functionalities. That said, my DSLs that generate programming code are heavily based on “monadic” properties observed in the computatio 12:30
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Nemokosch this sounded quite cryptic 😅 14:27
MitarashiDango[m Does anyone have any feedback on these < 100 character descriptions of Raku? I sourced and adapted them from various places such as the homepage, marketing repo, etc github.com/exercism/raku/pull/533/files 15:09
There's up to 6 total, using icons from github.com/exercism/docs/blob/6f87...ture-icons 15:13
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Voldenet MitarashiDango[m: icon for `concise` should be `small` imo 16:21
MitarashiDango[m Voldenet: Good choice, I might reuse powerful for regexes and grammars. 16:24
Voldenet + worth mentioning how the language can be type-checked during compilation 16:25
MitarashiDango[m Maybe, but I'd likely have to take something else out to replace it, there's no more space 😅 16:26
Voldenet I'm not sure about expressiveness, reality is that anything but OOP will be tough
it's a statement that's hard to evaluate and easy to invalidate 16:30
Nemokosch > anything but OOP will be tough 16:35
wait what
also I don't think anyone is interested in hunting down subjective-ish statements 16:36
if you have used Raku for more than 2 weeks, it's pretty easy to get a feeling for this proclaimed "expressiveness" 16:37
and it has nothing to do with OOP that's for sure
Voldenet it's all subjective 16:38
MitarashiDango[m The statement is an extract from the intro in marketing.raku.org/id/1516098660/any
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Nemokosch if there is anything not subjective, it's that it has nothing to do with OOP, lol 16:39
also, whether you consider it a useful measure or not, the length of the code is a measure, moreover an objective measure 16:41
Voldenet I see that I misunderstood this point
Nemokosch and if I understand it right, these are like catch phrases for someone who has never heard of Raku, and would like to get to know it for example 16:43
Voldenet 'you can use it for one-liners and full stack dev' describes not the expressiveness but adaptability to various styles
'you can use it for one-liners and full stack dev' describes not the expressiveness but adaptability to various styles 16:44
Nemokosch indeed but who was talking about that?
Voldenet the pdf linked
Nemokosch the message doesn't say that, though 16:45
rightfully, I think
"Raku is a supremely flexible and mutable language, adaptable to your own style of programming." 16:46
this absolutely makes sense and it's not about "from one-liners to full stack dev"
Voldenet >is a supremely flexible language, adapting to your style of programming, whether that be quick oneliners for sysadmins, scripts to manage a database import, or the full stack of modules necessary to realise an entire website.
that's why I said I misunderstood that 16:47
Nemokosch okay, perhaps I cannot keep up with the topic
Voldenet I totally agree with that point, just I'm not sure if I'd describe that as expressive 16:48
but maybe I'm wrong
but maybe I'm wrong 16:49
Nemokosch the "from oneliners to full stack" point? 16:52
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if I were to guess, the idea was to somehow register that Raku offers a lot, syntax-wise and structure-wise 16:54
which I do think is worth noting
if there was no other reason, at least as a tribute to the insane amount of work put into the language
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MitarashiDango[m For context Go has its own on this page (under key features) exercism.org/tracks/go/about 17:08
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MitarashiDango[m Raku currently doesn't have any so I might merge this later today and then potentially tweak if further adjustments are desired. 17:09
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Nemokosch If Go can be labeled expressive then 17:23
You know, Raku is like Bertrand Russell tier 17:25
stevied that's a good marketing document. someone should update it for Raku 17:31
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lizmat stevied: want a commit bit? :-) 18:05
tellable6 lizmat, I'll pass your message to stevied
Xliff \o 18:06
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stevied lizmat, commit to what? 19:12
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Voldenet >good marketing document. someone should update 21:34
probably this ;) 21:35
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stevied `s/Perl 6/Raku/g` 22:19
there, donde
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there, done 🙂 22:19
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is there a raku marketing team, btw? 23:08
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