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patrickb o/ Hi there! How do I introspect the nativecall types from Rakudo? e.g. I have some variable that might have a uint16 or so, how do I find out that it's a native unit with a width of 16? 05:58
Ugh! It might actually be simpler than I thought and I'm just hitting a compiler bug. Investigating. 06:08
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patrickb ... or it's more probably my own stupidity. 06:22
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disbot <simon_sibl> for this, all I found is that I can duplicate the \r\n in the Blob, anyone have another solution ? or an easy way (one liner ?) to duplicate the \r\n ? 08:02
<simon_sibl> my $patched-data = $data.subst(:g, "\r\n", "\r\n\r\n"); 08:11
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disbot <simon_sibl> Somehow even with that, the Debian net install torrent returns Nil while other torrent file works đź«  09:23
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[Coke] "This is due to the fact that Natives don't know their types because they're just values, without any metadata" 12:26
(from docs.raku.org/language/nativetypes) 12:28
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disbot <simon_sibl> Is there any Raku backend that allows compiling to standalone binary ? Trying to find a replacement language for Nim (I dislike python syntax and crystal is much less mature and if I choose crystal, why not also restart ruby instead of Perl to merge knowledge) 12:41
lizmat there was a GSoC project once, but it was never completed :-( 12:43
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Voldenet if you want standalone binaries then nothing beats golang 14:01
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disbot <.landyacht.> SmokeMachine: just wanted to say I love what you did with your Cro router utils :) being able to build a URI string with all the type checking is great 14:51
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disbot <.landyacht.> I’ll definitely grab that module the next time I build a website/service 14:52
SmokeMachine .landyacht.: thanks! There was a PR for Cro that I updated and it’s merged with part of those features… I’m preparing a new PR to add the rest of the features too. 14:55
disbot <.landyacht.> Oh nice, so it will be part of Cro itself soon probably 14:56
SmokeMachine I suppose so! :) 14:57
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SmokeMachine I’ll try to finish this new PR soon… but I’m just having too much fun trying to write something to be able to so live coding like strudel.cc in Raku (no, I do not plan to play it… I’m not good at it, but only write it…) 14:59
(Im doing that based on strudel.cc and on this old post: www.perl.com/pub/2004/08/31/livecode.html/) 15:00
patrickb c: use nqp; my int8 $i = 5; say nqp::reprname($i); 15:04
committable6 patrickb, ¦use: «Cannot find this revision (did you mean “all”?)»
patrickb m: use nqp; my int8 $i = 5; say nqp::reprname($i); 15:05
camelia P6opaque
patrickb Why is this not P6int?
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lizmat because in Rakudo the $i gets upgraded to Int somewhere in the nqp:: arg handling 15:12
could be that it works in nqp
patrickb So there is basically no way to introspect the native types in Rakudo land? 15:14
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melezhik . 15:22
lizmat patrickb: hmmm.... not with nqp ops, I don't think? 15:30
m: my int8 $a = 42; say $a.REPR # meh 15:31
camelia P6opaque
lizmat m: my int8 $a = 42; say $a.VAR.HOW.^name # perhaps this ? 15:32
camelia Perl6::Metamodel::NativeRefHOW
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GreyTriangle arkiuat: are you here? 18:26
When I came here before, asking for recommendations for my first programming language, I think it was you that said that Python was dangerous because it might do damage or drive me insane or something 18:27
arkiuat GreyTriangle, yes, hello
GreyTriangle I was "AspiringCoder"
arkiuat hmm, no, I think that was antononcube
I was recommending Forth
GreyTriangle Ah, I see.
Well, is antononcube here? I've been wanting to ask for some time - what is the danger with Python as a first language? 18:28
arkiuat mostly that the libraries are very difficult to work with?
and there are a lot of them, so it's very sad
GreyTriangle Alright then. Thank you! 18:30
ds7832 I used Python before Raku, and always found it a pain to arrange Python libs with virtualenv and what not. But, from what people recently say,
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ds7832 with "uv" there seems to be a tool to make library management in python acceptable 18:30
arkiuat I've been thinking it over, and I'm less reluctant to recommend Raku as a first language than I was when you first asked 18:31
ds7832, that's great news for the pythonistas 18:32
GreyTriangle Interesting.
ds7832 yeah, people are quite enthused about it as far as I've seen
In general, the decision of 1st programming language should probably take into account what role you wish it to play in your life, and your personal inclinations 18:33
arkiuat I'd say it should also take into account whether you are planning to learn several different languages, or just want to settle down in your first language 18:34
ds7832 e.g. near-term employability? tool for crafting tools for home use? tinkering, hobby projects?
arkiuat and ds7832 is quite correct here 18:35
ds7832 and if employability plays a role: Aim for developping new applications? Or (probably) less flashy but more stable and decently-paid job administering or maintaining existing systems? In the latter case Perl 5 could well be worth considering 18:36
(but take my word on this with a few grains of salt) 18:37
GreyTriangle I'm not looking to work as a software engineer, but I do aspire to work with 3D models and animation. I think Python goes well wit Blender.
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ds7832 Ah, well then yes, go by what language Blender has a good interface for and where good libraries exist 18:39
GreyTriangle :)
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Voldenet "near-term employability" would imply that the best language is some java or something equally boring 19:07
I'd say whatever's fun is the best language
java could be fun, but not in typically employable spring-like stack 19:09
and if someone is starting out, they won't get competitive soon, so with very long term goal in mind, it's important they don't drop programming before learning things 19:10
to me, java is burnout language, it's rigid and tries to avoid any form of fun 19:12
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Voldenet python is not great, but definitely more fun than java 19:13
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ab5tract anyone have access to a threadripper from the last 5 years? I'd love to see some Rakudo core setting compilation times 19:44
Voldenet: have you tried Kotlin? 19:47
I was just getting to the point of feeling like I had pared down my Java to a relatively sleek style
and then tried Kotlin, which makes quite a few excellent design decisions that amount to a somewhat similar feeling as to coding in Raku 19:48
dead easy class creation syntax is one that comes to mind, though I remember noticing a few others 19:49
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Voldenet ab5tract: yes, imo it's great, but for some reason many teams don't like kotlin sadly :( 20:37
ab5tract yeah, it boggles my mind :(
Voldenet so in the end people make you use some outdated java, you can consider yourself lucky if you use quarkus or micronaut 20:38
or can use virtual threads
ab5tract we are wedded to spring(boot) at work. I don't hate it. streams and lambdas are a must in terms of java version tho 20:44
records too
disbot <antononcube> @GreyTriangle You can start here : pythonforprediction.wordpress.com/...-projects/ 20:52
<antononcube> Especially, find and contemplate on “TSBEO-APOO-OWTDI” — it is a big reason not to use Python and see it as a detrimental first programming language. 20:54
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