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Set by lizmat on 8 June 2022.
tonyo do a quick search to read hundreds of pages on monads and still not understand what they are or how to use them 00:14
watch a few hours of bartosz to still not understand what they are 00:15
just use ruby
Nemokosch Monads are glorified decorator pattern, change my mind 06:26
lizmat
.oO( does Go have monads? :-)
06:31
Nemokosch Ruby is like the Smalltalk of Python 06:36
Those who use it swear that it's the best programming language ever
But they very apparently fail to convince most people about it
Voldenet monads are just monoids in the category of endofunctors 09:14
Nemokosch okay okay, flaunt with category theory -.- 09:15
Voldenet it's an old haskell joke ;D
Nemokosch the overthinker's math 09:16
Anton Antonov First, of all I agree with that statement. It is a little oversimplifying, but it is “to the point”, especially for people with OOP background. 12:25
<@297037173541175296> Now, trying to “change your mind”. For me the main benefit of using monads is that they make the code written with them to have algebraic properties. I use monadic designs as “developer-user interfaces”, not necessarily to implement or design functionalities. That said, my DSLs that generate programming code are heavily based on “monadic” properties observed in the computatio 12:30
Nemokosch this sounded quite cryptic 😅 14:27
MitarashiDango[m Does anyone have any feedback on these < 100 character descriptions of Raku? I sourced and adapted them from various places such as the homepage, marketing repo, etc github.com/exercism/raku/pull/533/files 15:09
There's up to 6 total, using icons from github.com/exercism/docs/blob/6f87...ture-icons 15:13
Voldenet MitarashiDango[m: icon for `concise` should be `small` imo 16:21
MitarashiDango[m Voldenet: Good choice, I might reuse powerful for regexes and grammars. 16:24
Voldenet + worth mentioning how the language can be type-checked during compilation 16:25
MitarashiDango[m Maybe, but I'd likely have to take something else out to replace it, there's no more space 😅 16:26
Voldenet I'm not sure about expressiveness, reality is that anything but OOP will be tough
it's a statement that's hard to evaluate and easy to invalidate 16:30
Nemokosch > anything but OOP will be tough 16:35
wait what
also I don't think anyone is interested in hunting down subjective-ish statements 16:36
if you have used Raku for more than 2 weeks, it's pretty easy to get a feeling for this proclaimed "expressiveness" 16:37
and it has nothing to do with OOP that's for sure
Voldenet it's all subjective 16:38
MitarashiDango[m The statement is an extract from the intro in marketing.raku.org/id/1516098660/any
Nemokosch if there is anything not subjective, it's that it has nothing to do with OOP, lol 16:39
also, whether you consider it a useful measure or not, the length of the code is a measure, moreover an objective measure 16:41
Voldenet I see that I misunderstood this point
Nemokosch and if I understand it right, these are like catch phrases for someone who has never heard of Raku, and would like to get to know it for example 16:43
Voldenet 'you can use it for one-liners and full stack dev' describes not the expressiveness but adaptability to various styles
'you can use it for one-liners and full stack dev' describes not the expressiveness but adaptability to various styles 16:44
Nemokosch indeed but who was talking about that?
Voldenet the pdf linked
Nemokosch the message doesn't say that, though 16:45
rightfully, I think
"Raku is a supremely flexible and mutable language, adaptable to your own style of programming." 16:46
this absolutely makes sense and it's not about "from one-liners to full stack dev"
Voldenet >is a supremely flexible language, adapting to your style of programming, whether that be quick oneliners for sysadmins, scripts to manage a database import, or the full stack of modules necessary to realise an entire website.
that's why I said I misunderstood that 16:47
Nemokosch okay, perhaps I cannot keep up with the topic
Voldenet I totally agree with that point, just I'm not sure if I'd describe that as expressive 16:48
but maybe I'm wrong
but maybe I'm wrong 16:49
Nemokosch the "from oneliners to full stack" point? 16:52
if I were to guess, the idea was to somehow register that Raku offers a lot, syntax-wise and structure-wise 16:54
which I do think is worth noting
if there was no other reason, at least as a tribute to the insane amount of work put into the language
MitarashiDango[m For context Go has its own on this page (under key features) exercism.org/tracks/go/about 17:08
MitarashiDango[m Raku currently doesn't have any so I might merge this later today and then potentially tweak if further adjustments are desired. 17:09
Nemokosch If Go can be labeled expressive then 17:23
You know, Raku is like Bertrand Russell tier 17:25
stevied that's a good marketing document. someone should update it for Raku 17:31
lizmat stevied: want a commit bit? :-) 18:05
tellable6 lizmat, I'll pass your message to stevied
Xliff \o 18:06
stevied lizmat, commit to what? 19:12
Voldenet >good marketing document. someone should update 21:34
probably this ;) 21:35
stevied `s/Perl 6/Raku/g` 22:19
there, donde
there, done 🙂 22:19
is there a raku marketing team, btw? 23:08