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| brrt | good *, ring-ding-ding-ding-ding | 09:13 | |
| jnthn | banana phone! | 09:14 | |
| oh wait, wrong song :P | |||
| brrt | i'm not sure i'm that far along in the series :-) | 09:20 | |
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| brrt | hmm, i'm pondering agile-ness in relation to the JIT development | 11:00 | |
| there are two observations here | 11:01 | ||
| jnthn | .oO( 0. We should continue not doing scrum :P ) |
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| brrt | a): i can't make progress unless i set small goals which are doable in at most, about 4 hours, because i don't have timeframes larger than that | ||
| b): i can't make progress unless these changes at each time yield something which works | 11:02 | ||
| c): i can't actually make such small changes and be sure to end up at the end, unless is analyze and design my trajectory upfront | 11:03 | ||
| or, rather | |||
| jnthn | I like how your observations were agile enough to grow an extra one :) | ||
| brrt | c): if i analyze my trajectory upfront, it becomes much more feasilbe to divide the work into pieces that satisfy a and b | ||
| jnthn | fwiw, I often - before digging into things - write myself a short list of steps in my text editor, that I work through | 11:04 | |
| If it's anything non-small | |||
| brrt | my 2 secret weapons are fear, surprise, ruthless efficiency... | ||
| well, that's design and analysis, isn't it? | |||
| i'm using org-mode for all of that these days, and i've been very happy about that | |||
| jnthn | Pretty much, yes :) | 11:05 | |
| brrt | soooo... A and B are just about the agile manifesto repeated, C is almost the antithesis? | ||
| jnthn | I don't really think agile is "go wander off in some direction and hope it'll all be OK" | 11:06 | |
| Though I've seen it treated a bit like that | |||
| But it's reacting to change *over* following a plan | |||
| That doesn't mean "don't plan" | |||
| It means don't follow a plan when the circumstances change | 11:07 | ||
| brrt | hmmm | ||
| jnthn | And render the plan possibly less valuable | ||
| brrt | that almost sounds like its just engineering | ||
| :-P | |||
| jnthn | Which does carry an implication of not making plans that are doomed to become invalid. | ||
| But yeah, I've seen "let's do agile" lead to "we don't need to plan" | 11:08 | ||
| brrt | i have so many stories about that, that it wouldn't be at all a good idea to write about on a logged channel | ||
| interestingly, i think i have a plan for adding the requisite spill-load capacities, correctly even | 11:12 | ||
| it's just a long road :-o | 11:13 | ||
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| nwc10 | jnthn: I almost had a bootstrapping problem. I put the saucer onto the coffee machine, not the cup. Fortunately I realised before I pushed the button. | 12:38 | |
| jnthn | Coffee flood narrowly averted! | 12:39 | |
| nwc10 | aye, but also "clearly coffee needed here as a pre-req for correctly making coffee" | 12:40 | |
| jnthn | ...do you normally take a saucer to go with the cup? :) | 12:41 | |
| nwc10 | yes. some sort of obsession | 12:43 | |
| jnthn | Curious. :) | 12:48 | |
| I mean, with tea it feels like a saucer is natural. But coffee... | 12:49 | ||
| nwc10 | it's a (sort of) hemispherical cup shaped like a tea cup | 13:03 | |
| so it feels like it needs the saucer | |||
| (as hemispherical as a tea cup is hemispherical) | |||
| jnthn | ah | 13:04 | |
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| japhb | .oO( Geometrically hemispherical and topologically toroidal ) |
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