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Set by ChanServ on 14 October 2019.
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AlexDaniel SmokeMachine: now it's easy: github.com/FCO/RedBot/commit/c19ef...0f5117468c 00:12
Geth whateverable: 90c0b66989 | (Aleks-Daniel Jakimenko-Aleksejev)++ | 3 files
Make a bunch of config values optional

By either ignoring or autoinitializing them.
AlexDaniel SmokeMachine: but you need to update Whateverable (maybe with --force again?) 00:14
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Geth whateverable: 62603b4dfa | (Aleks-Daniel Jakimenko-Aleksejev)++ | 3 files
Add default path for multifile gists

Also make it configurable.
AlexDaniel SmokeMachine: ok, I think I'm done :) I left some blanks for you to fill in, but otherwise it should be fully functional now github.com/FCO/RedBot/tree/whateverable 01:42
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sjn raku: say !False; # testing if a bot answers 03:03
p6: say !False; # testing if a bot answers
camelia True
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Geth ¦ problem-solving: Kaiepi assigned to jnthn Issue IO::Socket::INET and IO::Socket::Async need a redesign in v6.e github.com/perl6/problem-solving/issues/125 04:48
whateverable: f40214c9da | (Aleks-Daniel Jakimenko-Aleksejev)++ | 2 files
Support `raku:` shortcut

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AlexDaniel raku: say 42 05:27
evalable6 42
AlexDaniel sjn: ↑
u: 👹 05:41
unicodable6 AlexDaniel, U+1F479 JAPANESE OGRE [So] (👹)
tadzik why do characters like these exist 05:42
what happened to "a universal alphabet" :(
AlexDaniel tadzik: nothing wrong happened! 𓂺 05:44
tadzik: I can't find the proposal for that symbol, but seems like there are many fantasy beings in unicode 05:51
interestingly, people are arguing that there should be a symbol for trolls
tadzik AlexDaniel: I can *kind of* understand people arguing for "internet language" to have some sort of representation, but I still don't see it as sensible to dedicate characters to it 05:53
we have a perfectly good textual representation of the word "troll". It's the word "troll", 5 letters :)
moritz as somebody who's married to a half-Norwegian, I'm sad there's no troll emoji 05:54
tadzik 20 years on the internet I never felt like there needs to be a symbol for it. I have used a smiley fice probably every day, and so the symbol for a smiley feels a bit more appropriate
AlexDaniel btw I asked unicodable about that symbol because it was sent to me, so clearly it's useful for communication…
tadzik AlexDaniel: why, but that's exactly my point! Someone tried to communicate with you, and you needed a lookup software to determine what they meant. Is that good communication? 05:55
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AlexDaniel tadzik: it's clearly a red-faced monster thing, that was immediately clear to me, I just want to know a bit more :) 05:57
tadzik AlexDaniel: ah, that's not bad then :)
discord6 <Aearnus> u: 𓂺
unicodable6 Aearnus, U+130BA EGYPTIAN HIEROGLYPH D053 [Lo] (𓂺)
tadzik I don't really mind when it's just there, amplifying a message, but I can't stand it when people try to replace words with it 05:58
AlexDaniel Aearnus: yeah… this one you just need to see…
tadzik "don't be such a <Garbled mess>! Sign up for <garbled mess> on our <garbled mess> to receive a new <garbled mess>!"
and of course every platform renders these sligthly differently so I never really know if they meant what they said 05:59
AlexDaniel Aearnus: I'm not sure why it doesn't have a descriptive name
discord6 <Aearnus> no, I saw it hahah 06:02
<Aearnus> but I needed to know the story behind it 06:03
AlexDaniel it's not emoji, so no funny proposal document :) 06:04
here's one I'm looking at right now: www.unicode.org/L2/L2019/19334-river-emoji.pdf
I wouldn't mind a river emoji, but the argumentation is just weird :D 06:05
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discord6 <Aearnus> It's always so funny to me when emoji proposals have to explain the rationale behind something as basic as a "river" 06:15
<Aearnus> It's like an alien learning about Earth
moritz it's not as if the concept of river has to be justified, just why it needs an emoji 06:16
I mean, is the plan to create a full pictogram language?
emojis were for expressing emotions, hence the name. I never felt river. 06:17
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El_Che moritz: maybe you should once in a while 06:45
nine tadzik: FWIW I'm fully with you on that. I've yet to see the need for emojis and they definitely make communication harder 06:46
tadzik moritz: the only river-like emotion I can think of is "cry me a river" – but that would require combining characters, and I'm not sure if that can even be done in unicode :) 06:49
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tadzik maybe the authors are trying to tell us something... that PDF sure feels like someone bet they can put *anything* in unicode and are now putting up the most elaborate trolling attempt they can think of 06:49
ZzZombo Somebody request a symbol for Raku. 06:50
nine Feels like "a picture is worth a thousand words" - but try to paint a picture that conveys this sentence 06:51
Grinnz emojis are a supplement, not a replacement - it's quite difficult for me to adequately express 🤦🏻 in words ;) 06:52
the weird ones... 🌠 🌉 🌃 for some reason we have paintings? 06:54
tadzik then there's the crowd favourite, FRONT FACING BABY CHICK and sawyer's favourite AVOCADO 06:56
nine OTOH I had to paste 🤦🏻into a website's input field and raise the zoom to 300 % to identify a the facepalm 07:02
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El_Che did someone already mentioned the ancient Egyptians? 07:04
ufobat does anyone know when the next rakudo star release is going to happen? 07:08
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tyil doesn't seem like it, but I've been playing around with building a R* for GNU+Linux users in my spare time 07:37
not sure if that's of any help to you, tho
nine I'd be glad to see a rakudo release for a start. That next release would certainly be a good candidate for R* 07:39
discord6 <Aearnus> 🦋🐫🏺 07:41
<Aearnus> Raku emojis
SmokeMachine Thank you so much AlexDaniel! I'll take a look at it when I come home! Thanks! 07:44
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ufobat the current version seems to be 2019.03, which is quite old, isnt it? 08:13
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tyil compared to ubuntu's default 2018.03, it's not 09:35
but it is over half a year old, which could be considered old
idk what has been improved over the course of this time, so I'm not sure if it affects anything big
HoboWithAShotgun is there an equivalent of Module::ScanDeps for raku? 09:53
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Kaiepi shit 10:26
HoboWithAShotgun happens?
Kaiepi me closing the problem solving issue i opened earlier was a misclick 10:27
i think something like scanning for the dependencies of a module may be fairly simple to write, depending on how zef stores them 10:32
actually, zef wouldn't be needed, the compunit classes already know what a module's dependencies are iirc 10:33
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Kaiepi m: say so qx[zef locate zef].IO 10:47
camelia /bin/sh: zef: command not found
Must specify something as a path: did you mean '.' for the current directory?
in block <unit> at <tmp> line 1
Kaiepi whoops, forgot a try
m: say %*ENV<PERL6_HOME>:exists 10:48
camelia False
Kaiepi m: say $?FILE.IO.parent.sibling('META6.json').IO.e; CATCH { default { } } 10:49
camelia False
Kaiepi m: say $?FILE.IO.sibling('META6.json').IO.e; CATCH { default { } }
camelia False
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Ulti oh neat 10:50
how many people are here for the pottery though >:3
Kaiepi m: my $path = $?FILE.IO; say CompUnit::PrecompilationStore::File.new-unit(:$path).dependencies 10:53
camelia []
lizmat Ulti: none, as the channel did not exist before being created for the Raku Programming Language 11:04
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HoboWithAShotgun so, single quotes vs double quotes, what's your philosophy? 12:05
tyil whatever works for you
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sena_kun HoboWithAShotgun, whatever works in this situation. sticking to a single case is weird, because of interpolation 12:11
HoboWithAShotgun I tend to always use double quotes, except for when i explicitly don't want interpolation 12:18
sjn AlexDaniel++ thanks! ^^ 12:19
HoboWithAShotgun I think the "single quotes tell me i don't have to look into the string" argument is a moot point nowadays
at least for me, commas highlighter is really excellent
discord6 <noelsken> m: my $either = <double single>; .say with 'I like \qq[$either.pick()] quotes' x 3 # :) 12:36
evalable6 I like single quotesI like single quotesI like single quotes
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discord6 <noelsken> my $either = <double single>; .say with 'I like \qq[$either.pick()] quotes ' xx 3 12:38
evalable6 (I like single quotes I like single quotes I like single quotes )
discord6 <noelsken> my $either = <double single>; (.say with 'I like \qq[$either.pick()] quotes ') xx 3 # ! 12:39
evalable6 I like single quotes
I like double quotes
I like double quotes
discord6 <noelsken> there's no x or xx on a lower precedence is there?
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nine What? this channel isn't about pottery? 13:13
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Juerd hides the pot 13:40
xinming Hi, just for confirmation, is 'given' and 'with' are the same? except given is used in prefix, and with is used as postfix? 14:14
except these, What differences are there?
sena_kun m: my $a; given $a { .say } 14:22
camelia (Any)
Altreus I may be mistaken but I'm sure given will run even with undef
sena_kun m: my $a; when $a { .say }
camelia (Any)
Altreus my $a; .say with $a; 14:23
moritz m: with Any { say "foo" }
camelia ( no output )
Altreus m: my $a; .say with $a;
camelia ( no output )
sena_kun ugh
Altreus m: my $a; .say given $a;
camelia (Any)
moritz with = if defined
Altreus xinming: I was right ^
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xinming Got it, Thanks. 15:11
I forgot that.
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albertferrico m: say 42 15:22
camelia 42
albertferrico m: say 42; say 13
camelia 42
albertferrico m: say 42;␤say 13 15:24
camelia 42
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Doc_Holliwood haha, accidentally put two identical `also does X` statements in one file and spent 20 minutes searching for the error 15:55
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lizmat m: role A { method a() { "foo" } }; class B does A does A { } # that's definitely a LTA error 16:31
camelia 5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling <tmp>
Method 'a' must be resolved by class B because it exists in multiple roles (A, A)
at <tmp>:1
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AlexDaniel HoboWithAShotgun: “I tend to always use double quotes, except for when i explicitly don't want interpolation” what about always using single quotes, except when you want interpolation? ;) 16:41
tellable6 AlexDaniel, I'll pass your message to HoboWithAShotgun
xinming m: multi x (Bool :$flag? where * === True) { "flag".say; }; multi x () { "default".say }; x(:flag); x(); 16:59
camelia flag
xinming In this example, What is the right way to write the first x to make it shorter?
I just realized that I should use Bool :$flag! rather than Bool :$flag? 17:04
AlexDaniel m: multi x (Bool :$flag! where .so) { "flag".say; }; multi x(*%) { "default".say }; x(:flag); x(:!flag); x(); 17:11
camelia flag
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brass Is the Raku standard library going to include an HTTP client at some point? 19:18
AlexDaniel brass: there are no plans for it. There are many users who use Rakudo Star, which does come with some HTTP stuff (but not Cro) 19:25
maybe there are compelling reasons to do it, but I don't think I've heard them yet :) 19:26
so for now just install a module
Grinnz don't you need http to install a module (I say, ignorant of how it works) 19:27
brass I figure most languages come with at least a barebones HTTP client since it seems to be the modern transport layer for everything :p 19:28
Do you know what the rakudo star http module is called?
Grinnz (this is why HTTP::Tiny ended up core in perl)
AlexDaniel brass: I think this is the list: github.com/rakudo/star/tree/master/modules
HTTP::UserAgent is what you're looking for, I think 19:29
brass AlexDaniel: Oh perfect, thanks! 19:30
AlexDaniel Grinnz: well, realistically you'll need a module manager too (like zef), so that one you'd need to install separately
Grinnz right, i guess i wasn't aware zef isn't core 19:31
AlexDaniel and while zef seems to find a way around it, even though it doesn't depend on anything
Grinnz well, cpanm in perl works similarly, it will use HTTP::Tiny or LWP if available but otherwise gets on fine with wget or curl
AlexDaniel wget or curl is what zef does, I think 19:32
Grinnz which is important since there's no core SSL support...
why does SSL have to be so difficult :)
AlexDaniel mmm PowerShell::download on windows
and Pakku simply depends on a bunch of modules :) github.com/hythm7/Pakku/blob/26f32...son#L8-L18 19:33
yeah, no idea how that's going to work, but hey it's in larva stage :) 19:35
Grinnz is glad to not be in the business of "modules which implement SSL support that require SSL support" 19:36
mspo brass: I think it's expected that ~everything runs star 19:38
everyone I mean
brass Ah 19:40
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El_Che mspo: I pretty much disagree with that statement 19:59
I think most windows people do 20:00
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Tirifto Hello all!~ 20:33
mspo El_Che: k 20:34
Tirifto Question: In a Raku script, is it possible to read and use subroutines stored in a separate Raku file/module, with the names of neither the file nor the subroutines within being known beforehand? I thought of making a script extensible by automatically reading other scripts from a given directory, and letting them (make it) do whatever. (I'm still getting familiar with Raku and don't know if this is a good way to achieve the desired effect 20:43
at all, so let me know if I should just keep doing more research. :-))
Grinnz i don't know about the raku part of it, but from a general programming perspective, i favor the "explicitly load these plugins which i created a defined api for them to hook into" 20:45
there are a few cases where you need to do the "everything available" approach, such as when the user requests a list of what's available, but otherwise it usually does more harm IMO 20:47
Tirifto Grinnz: Ah, I was actually thinking of only passing them some data which either the program already has anyways, or the user has added specially for the ‘plugin’… well, the idea is for them to work with those, at the very least! :-) I guess that might count as an API? I don't think I ever worked with one, but now that you brought it up, it's probably the right keyword to search for! 20:49
Grinnz an API is, abstractly, any interface you set up for the purpose of something using externally 20:50
it's much better than the "api" of having things dig into internals :P 20:51
Tirifto Right! :P I'll have to see what's a decent way to go about that… and check my findings here because Raku making stuff neater seems to be a recurring pattern. 20:53
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