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TreyHarris Of course it makes more sense to write it like this, but it doesn't seem as magical to me 00:01
m: say((^20).pick(20).sort: *.Str)
camelia (0 1 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9)
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discord6 <theangryepicbanana> why doesn't this work? repl.it/@theangryepicbanana/AwareInformalLevels 00:47
<theangryepicbanana> I'd really like to be able to have access to stubs across files in a module
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discord6 <theangryepicbanana> I know that you can't have circular dependencies but I should be able to access stubs that I defined in the main module file in other files 00:49
<theangryepicbanana> if anyone has any ideas please ping me 00:51
leont Yeah, I've run into something very similar before, I don't have a solution though 00:53
It does stop me from splitting up a rather large module into separate files 00:54
discord6 <theangryepicbanana> yea 00:56
<theangryepicbanana> I'd rather not put them all in one file
<theangryepicbanana> I tried using EVAL but apparently local directories go out the window when using the module from zef 00:57
<theangryepicbanana> i.e my current solution github.com/ALANVF/Raku-LLVM/blob/m...b/LLVM.pm6
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atweiden-air i'm trying to update rakudo to 2020.01 on homebrew for macos rn 01:29
it's been months since i've gotten the moarvm tests to pass 01:30
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atweiden-air wget rakudo.org/dl/nqp/nqp-2020.01.tar.gz 01:31
tar xvzf nqp-2020.01.tar.gz
cd nqp-2020.01/src/vm/moar/stage0
moar nqp.moarvm -e 'for (0,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9) { print($_) }'
run it with moarvm-2020.01.1 and it keeps segfaulting. it has been segfaulting since last year 01:32
the last release that worked was 2019.07
am i committing an error here? github.com/atweiden/homebrew-core/...8360c9a9d7 01:34
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juliusdeane Is there a way to tweak were zef looks for system libraries? 02:14
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guifa TreyHarris: yeah, the difference is in the first one, you’re basically asking it to coerce everything to before doing cmp on the values, and on the second one, you’re telling it to use a custom compare function — in which you’re using the default cmp operator. It goes to show how good multi design can make things very intuitive 02:44
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cpan-raku New module released to CPAN! Sys::HostAddr (0.1.2) by 03JMASLAK 03:48
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cpan-raku New module released to CPAN! App::GTD (0.2.1) by 03TYIL 04:35
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peba Hi, is it possible to skip the (re)parse stage on starting a raku/moarvm program ? My raku spends > 100 mSeconds even in onliners 09:35
Stage parse : 0.133 09:36
raku -version
This is Rakudo version 2020.01 built on MoarVM version 2020.01.1
implementing Perl 6.d.
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lizmat see answer on stackoverflow.com/questions/600363...8#60036558 09:41
afk for a few hours& 09:43
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peba @lizmat: Wasting > 100 mS in the (re)parsing stage looks like a design error ? Why always (re)parse the same raku code ? Please have a look at other language designs. 10:03
time raku --stagestats hello_world.pl 10:04
Stage start : 0.000
Stage parse : 0.133
Stage syntaxcheck: 0.000
Stage ast : 0.000
Stage optimize : 0.002
Stage mast : 0.006
Stage mbc : 0.001
Stage moar : 0.000
tyil peba: please don't spam in here, use a paste service instead 10:05
peba ok
tyil you can pipe output of commands through `nc tyil.nl 9999` if you need :)
I agree with your assesment, though, the startup time is quite slow compared to most other languages, but I know some very talented people are hard at work at improving things 10:06
I'm sadly not talented enough to shine in that department, but if you have the required skills I'm sure they're more than welcome to get you started
peba @tyil maybe ther's a way to say skip parsing stage ? 10:09
tyil perhaps, I don't know much about the inner workings of the language :(
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jnthn peba: It's almost certainly the time taken to load the (pre-compiled) built-ins. It just shows up under the parse stage because it's the parser that first asks for the builtins. 10:13
(The parse stage of the builtins is *much* longer than that.) 10:14
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peba @jnthn: thank you 10:16
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timotimo we might want to put the link to the resources page a bit further to the top on docs.raku.org and/or switch Documentation and Resources around in raku.org's menu bar thingie 12:01
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rba Webhost (*.raku*.org/*.perl6.org) VM migration this evening (~20:00 Europe/Vienna TZ), expect up to 30 minutes downtime. 13:01
tellable6 2020-02-01T17:11:12Z #raku-dev <patrickb> rba The same URL as above now contains a rakubrew-1.tgz with a new release. Can you put them on rakubrew.org?
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nine tyil: it's got nothing at all to do with talent. It's all about investing the time to get acquainted with the code base. When I got started literally the only things I knew about compilers were from one of jnthn's talks: "compilers are all about trees" and "compilers are easy to test because the take input, process it and produce output" 13:02
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liubianshi :q 13:09
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Tirifto Aha! To import modules from a custom path set at runtime, it looks like I can do ‘%*ENV<PERL6LIB> = $path’, followed by ‘require ::($plugin)’. I guess that’s the best way to do it available? :P 13:17
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nine Tirifto: to do what exactly? 13:20
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dakkar Tirifto: or maybe docs.raku.org/type/CompUnit::Repos...FileSystem 13:37
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dakkar actually I don't know how to use stuff loaded by a CompUnit::Repository 14:08
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fluca1978 hi, I'm searching for an hint about the shortest way to rotate a matrix. For instance @a = [1,2], [a,b] I would like to obtain @b = [1,a], [2,b]. Any suggestion? 14:24
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stoned75 m: my @m = [1,2],[3,4]; say [Z] @m; 14:32
camelia ((1 3) (2 4))
fluca1978 stoned75: thanks, I didn't remember Z! 14:36
stoned75 see book "using raku" challenge 67: andrewshitov.com/2019/10/13/using-...free-book/ 14:37
Geth doc/str-version: 0efcb72704 | (Stoned Elipot)++ | doc/Type/Str.pod6
Document Str.Version
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Geth doc: stoned++ created pull request #3197:
Document Str.Version
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nine dakkar: CompUnit::Repositorys load modules. The should be pretty straight forward to use :D 14:51
dakkar that's what I thought ☺ but then I can't seem to get raku to see the symbols that those modules declare 14:52
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nine dakkar: it won't because the repository will load the module for you and return a CompUnit through which you can access it. The CompUnit's .handle e.g. contains the .globalish-package in which global symbols (e.g. declared packages) will reside. 14:56
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nine `use` statements handle that for you: github.com/rakudo/rakudo/blob/mast....nqp#L1505 14:57
dakkar aha! now if only docs.raku.org/type/CompUnit mentioned any of that…
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nine dakkar: it also contains an .export-package which contains exported symbols (i.e. `is export` stuff). Again `use` does it for you behind the scenes: github.com/rakudo/rakudo/blob/mast....nqp#L1090 14:59
dakkar gist.github.com/dakkar/cd146eb3f4f...5eebce8b03 15:01
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dakkar Tirifto: that gist contains a working example of "load a module from a particular directory" that could be sensible for plugins 15:03
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nine dakkar: why not have plugins installed like all other modules and get the same benefits? 15:04
dakkar I don't know, I was just playing around in the spirit of the question 15:05
«To import modules from a custom path set at runtime»
nine That's why I asked Tirifto what they were trying to achieve exactly. My guess is it was the wrong question in the first place
Tirifto dakkar: Thank you; I should probably play around with that, in turn! 15:17
dakkar Tirifto: but also think about what you really need, as nine says 15:18
(nine knows things, I just pretend ☺)
Tirifto nine: I have a script (for assembling simple websites) and would like to make it extensible to a degree. The idea is placing the extensions, which are Raku modules, into the website’s configuration directory, and have the script run the subroutines defined therein on its data. 15:21
(I don’t know if that’s a decent way to allow extensions generally, but it’s the simplest I came up with.) 15:23
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nine Tirifto: my guess is that at some point you will want to install the extensions properly and store some configuration into the website directory. Code has a tendency to grow and to become more complex. If you store it in the website directory, using it for another website means copying it. At some point you will resent the chaos 15:27
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Tirifto nine: That’s a good point. Fortunately the code should be easy to adapt for this, as the configuration for each extension is already separate, so it’s just the question of where the modules are loaded from. And I reckon it could look for them both in the website directory *and* the standard repository. 15:34
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Tirifto My main motivation for having them in the website’s directory is that it might potentially be more straightforward for simple programs that only concern the website than getting the operating system’s or Raku’s package management tools involved. But I’ll mind that option as well; thank you for your insight! 15:40
nine Tirifto: just load it as a module. %*ENV<RAKULIB> gives the user plenty of possibility to add additional locations.
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nine You can use CompUnit::Repository::Installation.installed to find your plugins 15:43
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holyghost I inserted Gauss curve interal probabilities, in github.com/theholyghost2/p6-Game-Bayes, debugging and compiling later on 16:12
s/interal/integral 16:13
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stoned75 lizmat: thanks for your comment! And, am I get things right when I say that Str.Version is a rakudo addition, not a Raku addition ? 16:23
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[Coke] I didn't think Str.Version was rakudo specific. 16:33
(I also didn't see text related to that in the PR)
stoned75 lizmat added Str.Version to src/core.c/Str.pm6 does it mean it a raku 6.c feature ? 16:36
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lizmat no, it is actually a 6.e feature 16:37
[Coke] I don't think we're currently tracking 6.c vs. 6.d in the docs.
lizmat with 6.d you can *not* be sure it is supported
[Coke] we do have points in the docs where we say it's available starting in YYYY.MM release, though
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[Coke] while the release note is rakudo specific, the features themselves are usually not considered such. 16:38
(there are a small number of things that are Rakudo specific, like RAKUDO_ env vars, and 'dd')
stoned75 or so it is a raku feature from 6.e 16:39
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[Coke] it's available today. it won't be part of spec until 6.e 16:42
stoned75 ok. doc repo already have a couple of references to 6.e so I guess I could mention 6.e about Str.Version, alongside rakudo 2020.01 16:45
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stoned75 version mentions in doc repo are not consistent, a nice rototill would be needed :) 17:26
Geth doc/str-version: 038fd29668 | (Stoned Elipot)++ | doc/Type/Str.pod6
Add version information for Str.Version
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Geth doc: 0efcb72704 | (Stoned Elipot)++ | doc/Type/Str.pod6
Document Str.Version
linkable6 Link: docs.raku.org/type/Str
doc: 038fd29668 | (Stoned Elipot)++ | doc/Type/Str.pod6
Add version information for Str.Version
doc: 3ce7d84454 | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ (committed using GitHub Web editor) | doc/Type/Str.pod6
Merge pull request #3197 from Raku/str-version

Document Str.Version
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lizmat and another Rakudo Weekly News hits the Net: rakudoweekly.blog/2020/02/03/2020-...eleasalot/ 18:04
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Doc_Holliwould m: say so 8 %% 2 18:16
camelia True
Doc_Holliwould do you believe me when I say that says "False" on my build?
m: say so 8 % 2 18:17
camelia False
Doc_Holliwould acg
shell issue 18:18
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Geth doc: 56cb198c7f | Coke++ | doc/Type/Callable.pod6
fix compilation
linkable6 Link: docs.raku.org/type/Callable
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thundergnat lizmat: Weekly squashathon January 8 should be February 8? 18:30
lizmat++ for the weekly 18:31
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Grinnz lizmat: my post was actually about files already categorized as raku code now being labeled as Raku instead of Perl 6 - the new extensions aren't categorized yet (as commented) 18:31
Geth doc: 8b65a4a7ed | Coke++ | 2 files
emphasize that we mean the auth option to use

Closes #3164
linkable6 DOC#3164 [closed]: github.com/Raku/doc/issues/3164 [RFE][docs] "auths" unclear.
stoned75 I am a bit surprised that Any.repeated/repeated() and Supply.repeated do not have a similar behaviour 18:35
m: my @l = 1,2,3,3,4,3; say repeated(@l); say Supply.from-list(@l).repeated.list; 18:36
camelia (3 3)
stoned75 am I missing something ? 18:37
Geth doc: 857368655c | Coke++ | doc/Type/IO/Handle.pod6
Avoid run-on sentence
linkable6 Link: docs.raku.org/type/IO::Handle
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Geth doc: 21b3e04eb5 | Coke++ | 2 files
learn new words

  (sort and lowercase also)
Closes #3182
linkable6 DOC#3182 [closed]: github.com/Raku/doc/issues/3182 [bug] spell check failures
wildtrees so i call $s.split('',:skip-empty) how do I get it's size? 18:56
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wildtrees where $s = "hello" or something 18:56
stoned75 wildtrees: use .elems method ? 18:58
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wildtrees stoned75, thanks that seems to work 19:19
lizmat thundergnat++ # fixed
Grinnz++ # fixed 19:20
[Coke] wildtrees: you can also get the length of the original string with .chars if that helps. 19:21
MasterDuke atweiden-air: your example works for me in linux. don't know what's up 19:22
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tellable6 MasterDuke, I'll pass your message to atweiden-air 19:22
MasterDuke lizmat: could you give it a try in macos? 19:23
lizmat MasterDuke: not sure what you want me to try ?
MasterDuke colabti.org/irclogger/irclogger_lo...-02-03#l25
lizmat don't we need libtommath ??? 19:24
MasterDuke i think that change is to use the moarvm supplied one, not the system one 19:25
lizmat .tell atweiden-air why removing the --has-libtommath ?
tellable6 lizmat, I'll pass your message to atweiden-air
lizmat ah, hmmm... 19:26
MasterDuke: last time I used homebrew, it set of a chain of nasty problems for me 19:30
so I'm not too fond of it
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MasterDuke what about just cd'ing into that directory in your nqp checkout and running that command? 19:31
lizmat eh, which command ?
MasterDuke that's what i meant by worked for me
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MasterDuke cd nqp-2020.01/src/vm/moar/stage0; moar nqp.moarvm -e 'for (0,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9) { print($_) }' 19:32
lizmat Unhandled exception: Unsupported serialization format version 22 (current version is 21) 19:33
at <unknown>:1 (ModuleLoader.moarvm:<dependencies+deserialize>)
from <unknown>:1 (nqp.moarvm:<dependencies+deserialize>)
wait, that may be not up to date yet :-)
nope, after a reconfig and make, still same error ? 19:34
MasterDuke huh. maybe a difference because i have a separate moarvm checkout i use instead of having nqp gen it? 19:36
lizmat no idea... :-( 19:37
wildtrees p6: "hello".split('',:skip-empty).say ;
camelia (h e l l o)
wildtrees is that the way to get a list-like sequence of characters from a string in raku? 19:38
lizmat m: say "hello".comb # faster and better optimised 19:39
camelia (h e l l o)
lizmat wildtrees ^^
wildtrees ok thanks
stoned75 lizmat: may I bother you about Supply.repeated ? 19:40
lizmat you may :)
stoned75 I am a bit surprised that Any.repeated/repeated() and Supply.repeated do not have a similar behaviour
m: my @l = 1,2,3,3,4,3; say repeated(@l); say Supply.from-list(@l).repeated.list; 19:41
camelia (3 3)
wildtrees is * a symbol or something?
lizmat install/bin/moar nqp.moarvm -e 'for (0,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9) { print($_) }' 0123456789 # Masterduke
stoned75: that looks like a bug
hmmm 19:42
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MasterDuke huh. must be something weird with their system, not something i can debug here and now 19:42
stoned75 Any.repeated/repeated() consider anu repetition whereas Supply.repeated considers only successive repetition
a lookup hash is used by Any.repeated/repeated()
lizmat yeah, looks like I implemented squish semantics for Supply.repeated :-)
good catch, will fix right away 19:43
stoned75 cool! many thanks
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chloekek Ugh I accidentally forked something to raku-community-modules instead of to my own GH user. 20:33
lizmat oh jee 20:34
chloekek I deleted the fork, no worries. :P
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zaergtfhj HI 21:28
Is it true that Raku is not interpreted, it run on a virtual machine ? 21:29
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Grinnz depending on your definition of interpreted, some have said the same about Perl 21:31
i choose to not look at it that technically, but in my usability
zaergtfhj run on virtual machine, mean a program compile the whole program in bytecode, then interprete the bytecode 21:33
MasterDuke same with many of the common "interpreted" languages, e.g., python, ruby, php
tadzik iirc that's true for everything except tcl
or maybe not even that
MasterDuke but yes, rakudo compiles raku down to a bytecode that's run by the Moar VM
Grinnz raku has a more explicit separation of components though
zaergtfhj Is there a program which read a script line by line 21:34
i mean an interpreter for Raku 21:35
Grinnz lizmat: it doesn't seem changed...
zaergtfhj ?
Grinnz zaergtfhj: why? 21:36
zaergtfhj Grinnz why what ?
Grinnz most of these languages such a thing would either be impossible or needlessly inefficient
zaergtfhj impossible ? 21:37
what is impossible ?
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Grinnz raku and scripts of these other languages are not executed strictly sequentially 21:38
so reading them sequentially and immediately executing that would not work correctly
zaergtfhj for example : 21:39
#!/usr/bin/python3print("Hi !");bullshit
Grinnz oh, you're just looking for a repl?
zaergtfhj will still print "Hi!"
even if it does not understand the next line
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zaergtfhj that's not possible, cause it is read lsequentially 21:40
by the interpreter
tadzik it understands the next line, it crashes after it compiles it
it's just a symbol lookup, and the symbol happens to not exist
if you put the proper compilation error in there, it won't print anything
try a " without an ending " 21:41
echo "print('a')\n'" | python3 for instance
zaergtfhj such script will not compiled 21:43
and not work with a VM
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zaergtfhj So there is no interpreter for Raku ? 21:44
tadzik nope 21:46
like Grinnz says, it really doesn't make sense
zaergtfhj Catastophic. Is someone planning to provide an interpreter ? 21:47
tadzik ...why?
what are you looking for? I don't think it's an interpreter for the sake of having an interpreter
zaergtfhj You are right I will no longer searched for a VM. 21:49
an interpeter
a VM is better 21:50
tadzik well, an interpreter will really work for a very, very simplistic language – that's why there really isn't one around anymore, for any language
not for python, not for perl 5, and not for raku either :)
zaergtfhj Catastrophic. 21:51
tadzik why :) 21:52
what's catastrophic about VMs?
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leont Shell is typically interpreted, but then again shell is "simple" 21:53
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TreyHarris Is there a DRY way to define a type method? i.e., so you don't have to say B twice in `class B { method (B:U: ...) ... }`? 23:23
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discord6 <theangryepicbanana> you could always add some sort of custom is static attribute 23:26
<theangryepicbanana> not sure if signatures are mutable
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TreyHarris theangryepicbanana: not trying to do this at runtime. I'm literally asking if in my B.rakumod I can avoid typing `B` literally throughout 23:29
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discord6 <theangryepicbanana> oh 23:31
<theangryepicbanana> I don't think so
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cpan-raku New module released to CPAN! Sparrowdo (0.1.3) by 03MELEZHIK 23:31
New module released to CPAN! Sparrow6 (0.0.12) by 03MELEZHIK 23:32
discord6 <theangryepicbanana> there's always ::?CLASS:U: which works anywhere
<theangryepicbanana> also yay I finally fixed all of this by putting everything in one file github.com/ALANVF/Raku-LLVM/blob/m...b/LLVM.pm6 23:39
<theangryepicbanana> was it a design choice or a technical limitation for not allowing .circular dependencies?
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