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cpan-raku New module released to CPAN! Vikna (0.0.2) by 03VRURG 02:04
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Geth doc/master: 5 commits pushed by (Tim Smith)++, (Juan Julián Merelo Guervós)++ 06:47
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suman Is there another way to sort strings? I know this 07:28
m: say "seconds".comb.sort;
camelia (c d e n o s s)
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moritz suman: why do you want another way? 08:14
there are infinitely many other ways, but none that I'm aware of that are idiomatic, fast and convenient
suman moritz So that I can sort a large string faster. This approach has two methods. I was just thinking if there is any other faster way. 08:16
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suman I want to first sort an array (string), do binary search to find first index and last index of each unique character, get number of times of occurrence of each unique character by subtracting first index from last index. I know this can be done with .com.Bag.hash but I wanted to experiment with this algorithm. 08:21
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moritz suman: sounds like iterating over each character and keeping track of the information you want might be better than sorting 08:27
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guer my $TID = regex { <.wb> \d\d? [ <[.:\h]>+ \d\d? ] ** 1..2 <.wb> }; 08:29
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guer $VERSRAD = regex { ^^ ['*'? $TID '*'?]? <!lower>+? \n } 08:29
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guer my $v = $s ~~ m/ $VERSRAD /; 08:31
say $v
suman @moritz Yes I have done that. Iterating and keeping track with map. See here the last code under functional programming sumankhanal.netlify.app/post/raku/count_dna/
wondering if I could do $sequence.comb.hyper.map(&count_each_char); 08:32
But it significantly slows down the execution
timotimo it's probably not enough work per item to really get faster that way, and also i assume you're updating a hash? you'd really want to lock or at least pre-fill the slots and then atomic-increment 08:33
but you can try upping the :batch parameter on the hyper
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guer Anyone able to see any problems with $VERSRAD above? It doesnt terminate. 08:34
ShimmerFairy Not seeing the termination issue, but <[\h]> isn't doing what you think it is. 08:39
guer well, it works when i tried it ... why cant i use it? 08:41
timotimo recompiling my rakudo without asan exploding all over the place so i can run Grammar::Tracer on it
ShimmerFairy I'd be very surprised if you could put \h inside a character class and have it work.
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timotimo m: say "... " ~~ /<[.:]+\h>/ 08:42
camelia 5===SORRY!5=== Error while compiling <tmp>
Unable to parse expression in metachar:sym<assert>; couldn't find final '>' (corresponding starter was at line 1)
at <tmp>:1
------> 3say "... " ~~ /<[.:]+7⏏5\h>/
expecting any of:…
ShimmerFairy m: say " " ~~ /(<[\h]>+)/
timotimo m: say "... " ~~ /<[.:\h]>/
camelia 「 」
0 => 「 」
timotimo m: say "... " ~~ /<[.:\h]>+/
camelia 「... 」
ShimmerFairy I'd call that a bug, there's nothing in S05 to suggest backslash stuff should work in there (what if some jerk defines a \] rule in their regex?) 08:45
guer what's the use of char classes if you don't are allowed to make complex ones? 08:46
moritz ShimmerFairy: re "what if some jerk defines a \] rule in their regex?" then it's their own problem. They are a jerk anyway. 08:48
ShimmerFairy \h isn't a set of characters, it's a rule. You're supposed to do something like <+[abc] + myrule> or [<[abc]> | \h ]
moritz \h isn't a rule 08:50
I can't call <\h> like I can with a normal rule 08:51
it's syntax
you can call it a bug in S05 if you want
ShimmerFairy It is though, much like how + is still a sub, even if you use it funny.
moritz don't mix regexes and regular slang where they aren't comparable 08:52
cpan-raku New module released to CPAN! Log::Colored (0.1.1) by 03TYIL
ShimmerFairy At least in S05, it would be a backslash:sym<h>
moritz that's how it's parsed
everything is parsed by a rule
that doesn't make everthing a rule
ShimmerFairy So by that logic, "3 + 7" isn't invoking a subroutine, that's just how it's parsed? 08:53
moritz no, by that logic, you cannot infer from how it's parsed that "3 + 7" invokes a subroutine 08:54
suman Is to possible to initialise a hash with only the keys?
timotimo ah
moritz suman: well, what should the values be?
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suman So that I can update values later 08:55
timotimo m: say "OHAI" ~~ / <!lower>+? /
camelia 「」
moritz if a hash has a key, it has a value for it (could be Any or so, but it still has a value)
suman: you can always update the value later; hashes are mutable
ShimmerFairy But \h being a rule isn't the issue here. My problem is that <[\h]> is way more magical than I've ever seen character classes being, and since it's not mentioned anywhere in S05 that I can see, I'd love to know where it was decided upon.
moritz ShimmerFairy: well, the test suit and at least three different implementations (STD.pm, rakudo, niecza; possibly even pugs) did it this way. Possibly it was just inherited from perl 5 08:56
suman m: my %base_hash = A => Any, G => Any, C => Any, T => Any;
camelia ( no output )
suman @moritz Is it valid? m: my %base_hash = A => Any, G => Any, C => Any, T => Any; 08:57
moritz m: my %base = <A G C T> X Any; say %base
camelia Use of uninitialized value of type Any in string context.
Methods .^name, .raku, .gist, or .say can be used to stringify it to something meaningful.
{A => (G (Any)), C => (T (Any))}
in block <unit> at <tmp> line 1
Use of uninitialized valu…
suman m: my %base_hash = A => Any, G => Any, C => Any, T => Any;
camelia ( no output )
moritz m: my %base = <A G C T> X=> Any; say %base
camelia {A => (Any), C => (Any), G => (Any), T => (Any)}
moritz suman: shorter :D
m: my %base; %base<A G C T> = (); say %base; 08:58
camelia {A => (Any), C => (Any), G => (Any), T => (Any)}
moritz also works
ShimmerFairy You know what, maybe it was a good thing the synopses were deprecated after all, because I'm so goddamn tired of them not explaining shit because they assume you know Perl 5.
moritz ShimmerFairy: you're welcome to update them if you still like them
timotimo somehow the <!lower>+? seems to be involved in the breakage
moritz timotimo: <!lower> is a zero-width assertion 08:59
timotimo: quantifiying it is a bad idea
timotimo i thought that too
m: say "OHAI" ~~ / <!lower>+? /
camelia 「」
timotimo but this works fine?
ah becaus it matches immediately
m: say "OHAI" ~~ / <!lower>+? I /
so my test was bogus, great :) 09:00
guer: so there's your answer
camelia (signal XCPU)
cpan-raku New module released to CPAN! Log::Simple (0.1.1) by 03TYIL
moritz just use <!lower> instead of <!lower>+?
ShimmerFairy moritz: I've thought about doing them over from scratch, because I maintain that the spectests are a crummy way for a new team of humans to understand the language. I'm just gonna redirect my annoyance with <[\h]> at the people who thought they didn't need to explain things.
moritz or <-lower>+? if that's what you mean
suman moritz my %base = <A G C T> X=> Any; say %base What is this X? in X => Any
moritz suman: it's the cross product meta operator
m: say <a b c d> X <1 2> 09:01
camelia ((a 1) (a 2) (b 1) (b 2) (c 1) (c 2) (d 1) (d 2))
timotimo m: say "OHAI THERE" ~~ m/ <-lower>+? /
camelia 「O」
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timotimo m: say "OHAI THERE" ~~ m/ <-lower>+? $ / 09:01
camelia 「OHAI THERE」
moritz huh
ah no, that's right
suman @moritz thank you
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moritz suman: you're welcome 09:05
ShimmerFairy: there have been made several attempts at explaining raku in human-friendly way in the form of books; none of them were a reference though. A reference book would be very welcome :D 09:08
guer moritz, timotimo: thxs a lot! if i understand you correctly it is all about bad negation with '!' 09:09
ShimmerFairy The main reason why I'd like to "redo" rather than "update" is because I expect the test suite to have diverged from the synopses way too much by now (and because, y'know, I'd miss all the implied holdovers from P5 if I didn't base new docs on roast)
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moritz guer: correct. The negation with <!thing> generally means "There isn't a <thing> at the current position", but it doesn't consume any characters from the input string 09:12
plug: you can learn all of these gory details in www.apress.com/us/book/9781484232279 :D 09:13
guer thanks again! 09:20
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sour What json (de)serializing module do you guys use? I've gone with JSON::Tiny and it is crushingly slow, I haven't done any proper benchmarking, but it feels quadratic. Also, some other (very) basic file processing that I did (linewise, 208k lines) on a 59MB file was also incredibly slow, anyone had to deal with such a thing? 09:29
moritz JSON::Fast is faster
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sour ah well, I see on the raku performance page that string handling is, in general, a performance bummer :( 10:00
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Geth problem-solving: JJ++ created pull request #202:
Solution for issue #72: spin off module publishing tutorial in the documentation.
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sour yeah, even with JSON::Fast, this string processing is extremely slow, I tried to change some things to maybe make it go faster, but it's still so many order of magnitudes slower than the equivalent in python 11:52
for reference, going line by line in a file and splitting by a single space character in python takes less than a second, and the equivalent in raku takes a couple minutes aparently, still going 11:53
is it known what's causing this big slowdown?
ShimmerFairy Have you tried doing a similar operation with Uni-based strings, or even with raw Bufs/Blobs? 11:56
With a Uni string (or derivative), you'd be able to see if the issue is with NFG stuff or with strings in general. 11:57
sour No, I haven't really tried much, mostly changing things from line ending splitting to using "".IO.lines, which I assumed was better, and splitting strings based on strings instead of regexes
the code's pretty simple, it's the data volume that's a bit large I guess, ~60 MB
I will do some looking around at some point 11:58
ShimmerFairy the Uni-based classes are a bit lacking in methods, however, so splitting will be a bit more low-level. 12:00
lizmat ShimmerFairy: care to elaborate on what you think is missing ? 12:02
ShimmerFairy Well, I tried .split and it didn't work. I just generally mean stuff to manipulate strings. 12:03
m: say Str.^methods.map(*.name)
camelia (BUILD Capture Int Num Version chomp pred succ match subst-mutate parse-base samecase samemark samespace word-by-word trim-leading trim-trailing trim encode NFC NFD NFKC NFKD unival univals wordcase trans parse-names uniparse indent codes chars uc lc …
ShimmerFairy m: say Uni.^methods.map(*.name)
camelia (new list Uni NFC NFD NFKC NFKD codes elems Numeric Int of Str Bool EXISTS-POS AT-POS gist raku BUILDALL)
lizmat well, split with regexen is going to be difficult with Uni 12:04
ShimmerFairy I don't think it's a big deal or a huge priority (since 99% of the time Str is what you want), but it is kind of empty.
lizmat I once tried to get JSON::Fast.from_json faster by using Uni, but failed
ShimmerFairy Maybe someday I'll actually add those :nfc etc. adverbs to regexes like I proposed way way back. (I actually finally ran into a case where that would've been handy, parsing my .XCompose file.) 12:05
sour my bad, I did some quick check and apparently the string parsing and splitting is alright, It's surprising to see that some other step is at fault, probably the fact that the JSON parsing was slow got me biased, thanks :P
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ShimmerFairy no problem :) 12:06
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ctilmes sour: I have a work in progress (hopefully release soon) that parses JSON faster, but still takes a long time to build Raku data structures 12:10
sour what do you mean by 'takes a long time to build Raku data structures'?
do you have a link to the repo, if it's public? I'm curious as to how it's different from JSON::Fast 12:11
ctilmes I used a CPP library (simdjson.org) to parse which is blazing fast, but then I have to pull the strings/arrays/objects/ etc. back with NativeCalls, then construct arrays, hashes, strings, etc. to return them 12:12
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ctilmes I have replace associative/positional handling, so you can query the objects from C without pulling everything back.. That is actually much faster than JSON::Fast 12:13
It's all ready to go, just waiting for @work permission to release
sour ohhhh nice
ctilmes It even supports JSON Paths, so you can ask for $object<foo/bar/3/something> and it jumps right to it. 12:15
sour let us know when / if you open source it :) 12:17
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ctilmes Four approvals done, only 7 more to go and I can open source it! 12:24
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lucs ▸ zef test t/01-basic.t 12:29
Invalid json? File: t/01-basic.t
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lucs Wut? 12:30
I got that message after trying that command instead of 'zef test .' which just keeps complaining of not finding Foo::Bar::This and Foo::Bar::That, which are present, but not a peep about "invalid json". 12:34
What's going on?
What json is it talking about? 12:35
The META6.json looked alright to me, but how can I know if it is?
Then I removed that META6.json file, and got the same "Invalid json" message. 12:36
lucs is tired of fighting with this :(
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lucs And that 01-basic.t contains only this: use v6.c; use Test; use-ok('Foo::Bar'); done-testing; 12:38
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lucs Let me be clearer. 12:59
In my module directory, I run "zef test t/01-basic.t". 13:00
I get the response "Invalid json? File: t/01-basic.t"
What the hell does that mean!?
tadzik looks like some silly exception
lucs thinks of the Seinfeld clip when he says that :)
tadzik does the same thing happen when you just run the file?
(with raku -Ilib or whatever) 13:01
lucs Yes, it runs correctly. 13:02
The silly exception is preventing me from installing the module in my environement :( 13:03
lucs should have said: "No. Running the test without zef works correctly." 13:04
tadzik sounds like it's caused by zef itself then. Odd
which could mean that the META6.json is wrong? Is it correct json?
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lucs FWIW, I get the same message when I remove the json file. 13:04
Is it correct json? As far as I can tell, yes. 13:05
tadzik if you remove it then it's still invalid JSON, I suppose :P
lucs tadzik: :)
tadzik I wish I could be more helpful, but it's been some years since I wrote a module, and zef wasn't really a thing then :P
lucs Is the json file missing critical info? Dunno.
tadzik lucs: do you have your code available somewhere?
lucs Is this documented somewhere?
tadzik I'd think so, but I don't know where 13:06
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sour yes it is documented 13:06
lucs Not really. It's a pretty big thing, and I don't really feel like golfing it down.
lucs might golf it down if push comes to shove.
tadzik lucs: does any other zef command work? 13:07
sour design.raku.org/S22.html#META6.json
lucs tadzik: Which commands are you thinking of? (note: zef works well elsewhere)
sour: Thanks. 13:08
sour np
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lucs Hmm... Reading that, looks like "provides" needs to list anything which is "use"d? 13:09
I'll try that and see what happens.
tadzik lucs: oh, no, it's the other way around 13:10
if you're writing My::Module, that's what provides needs to contain
lucs What do you mean?
Yeah, that's what I had.
tadzik see in zef itself: github.com/ugexe/zef/blob/master/META6.json#L13 13:11
lucs Oh, I get it.
tadzik: Yeah, that's what I meant, I misspoke kind of. 13:12
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lucs I didn't mean _all_ the modules that were used by my module, but the ones that it, right, provides. 13:12
sour I personally use mi6 for project scaffolding, it already provided a META6.json which is easy to modify: github.com/skaji/mi6 13:13
lucs sour: That's what I started with (mi6).
I'll try tweaking that "provides" entry and see if it helps.
sour 👍 13:14
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Kaiepi i use mi6 to make new projects atm, but idr like the project template it uses 13:15
lucs idr?
Kaiepi i don't really
lucs Ah 13:16
Kaiepi iirc jjmerelo has a template repo for projects he made recently?
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Kaiepi found it github.com/JJ/raku-dist-template 13:25
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Geth ecosystem: khalidelboray++ created pull request #498:
Add Text::Slugify
rbt Is there a recommended set of Raku versions for modules to support? What's the oldest reasonable version in the wild?
lucs My zef version is 0.8.3, makes sense? 13:43
ShimmerFairy I would just target language version v6.c for maximum compatibility. 13:45
lucs I've golfed it down, get the same error. 13:47
Anyone have time to try it out?: scullucs.com/Lucs-Volumes.tgz 13:48
lucs is afraid it will turn out to be some stupid stupid mistake he is making... 13:49
[Coke] ShimmerFairy: ... what about d? 13:50
Or do you mean "as far as old versions go"?
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ShimmerFairy Sure, but that's not as maximum as the first official version of the language :) 13:55
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[Coke] it is the *current* version of the language, though 14:01
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lucs Ok, ugexe explained that "zef test 「some test file」 is not a valid invocation; a valid invocation is "... 「path to distribution」". 14:49
And adding my module supplied .pm6 to the META6.json fixes everything. 14:56
tadzik ha
the error message could be better I guess :)
lucs I guess, yeah. 14:57
Two cases come to mind: no META6.json found in the supposed 「path to distribution」, and the supposed 「path to distribution」 is not even a directory. 14:59
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Geth ecosystem: f7134a2ebd | (Khaled Mohamed Elborey)++ (committed using GitHub Web editor) | META.list
Add Text::Slugify
ecosystem: ccd4f44737 | (Juan Julián Merelo Guervós)++ (committed using GitHub Web editor) | META.list
Merge pull request #498 from khalidelboray/patch-1

Add Text::Slugify Looks great. Thanks!
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[Coke] ^^ that module is a fork of another module, and it looks like the forker added a LICENSE that didn't exist in the original 15:07
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sena_kun wonders if uzl[m] was contacted at all about this, why not merge work instead of forking 15:19
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Xliff \o 15:38
What would be the direct way to redirect $*OUT to an external program?
Are there examples in the docs?
jnthn: Did you see my questions regarding Spreadsheet::XLSX from last night? 15:39
jnthn Xliff: Uh, yes, but I was confused; I didn't see such a module on modules.raku.org? 15:42
Or did you mean the Perl 5 module? 15:43
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[Coke] Xliff: create a new Proc::Async and use .bind-stdin to bind $*OUT, probably. 15:53
jdv79 ctilmes: what ways did you try to do the marshalling? 15:57
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jdv79 and/or what were teh bottlenecks, if you noticed 15:58
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Xliff jnthn: XLSX::Writer is a raku module. I guess you missed it? 16:01
jnthn Xliff: modules.raku.org/search/?q=xlsx%3A%3Awriter is empty 16:02
Xliff [Coke]: That is the path I am currently travelling, however it's not working. Currently trying to bind $*OUT to 'less -RXF'
jnthn Xliff: Doesn't show up under modules.raku.org/search/?q=xlsx either
Xliff Interesting. Here it is: github.com/evanmiller/XLSX-Writer
jnthn OK, well, if it ain't in the ecosystem... 16:03
Xliff Heh. I figured. OK.
jnthn Oh, interesting, it's a binding to a C library
Xliff I've used it. It works well.
jnthn Nice, but I wonder why it isn't listed... 16:04
Xliff Yeah. I think it was mentioned in a weekly? Weird. Don't know how I found it.
Here's my latest attempt at sending output to `less`, but It doesn't pause. 16:11
timotimo but xslx::writer doesn't seem to read xsls files?
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Xliff Thinking maybe I'm still doing something wrong. 16:11
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[Coke] modules.raku.org/ should have a note about how to add a module 16:12
xls and xlsx are waaay different. 16:13
jnthn timotimo: The name would imply not. :) 16:14
timotimo but the jnmod does 16:15
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Xliff So if I Proc::Async.bind($*OUT), is $*OUT still going to the console? 16:17
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[Coke] bind or bind-stdin? 16:20
Kaiepi do really long method signatures in the docs get wrapped automatically? 16:21
Xliff [Coke]: bind-stdin 16:23
[Coke] Kaiepi: not in generated text. maybe by the HTML 16:24
(I assume you mean on the doc site)
Kaiepi yeah 16:25
i'm documenting Attribute.new and tried writing its signature over a few lines, but it wound up getting tested like normal code by xt/examples-compilation.t 16:26
[Coke] docs.raku.org/routine/match
Kaiepi i just have :skip-test on it atm, not sure what the style for this is
[Coke] yup, looks like it wraps, but not prettily
Kaiepi: there's a tag for that.
Xliff Has anyone gotten around to documenting Proc::Async::Pipe? 16:27
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[Coke] github.com/Raku/doc/blob/master/wr...md#methods 16:27
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Xliff [Coke]: ? 16:30
Looks like I need to dup the file-handle. That would involve .native-descriptor, yes? 16:32
[Coke] Xliff: yes? 16:34
(several of my recent sends were to Kaiepi)
Xliff [Coke]: OK, I'm going to try and use a native call to dup2() to see if I can solve my problem. 16:36
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[Coke] good luck! 16:36
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[Coke] ... I just increased the font size and everything turned ... greek? for a secon. 16:38
(in IRC, not in raku code.)
timotimo bautiful
nature is healing
languages thought long dead are coming back
Geth doc: Kaiepi++ created pull request #3440:
Set the TERM environment variable's value in xt/p6doc-blackbox.t
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Xliff It seems trying to pipe into perl6 is much easier than trying to pipe from perl6 to an external command. 16:45
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Geth doc: 8aa0fcb177 | (Ben Davies)++ | xt/p6doc-blackbox.t
Set the TERM environment variable's value in xt/p6doc-blackbox.t

On OpenBSD, more doesn't like when TERM is unset, causing tests run here to fail.
doc: a859c57ba2 | (Juan Julián Merelo Guervós)++ (committed using GitHub Web editor) | xt/p6doc-blackbox.t
Merge pull request #3440 from Kaiepi/blackbox-more

Set the TERM environment variable's value in xt/p6doc-blackbox.t
[Coke] If you don't need $*OUT remapped, it's not bad.
Xliff [Coke]: How would I get .say to output to the external command, then? 16:51
But I do see your point. 16:52
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Geth doc: Kaiepi++ created pull request #3441:
Revise and add to Attribute's documentation
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Geth doc: 4eb808199a | (Luis F. Uceta)++ | doc/Language/functions.pod6
Add few examples for named arguments as adverbs

This was already documented. The new examples just showcases the use of positional arguments with named arguments as adverbs.
Refs: #3389
linkable6 Link: docs.raku.org/language/functions
Geth doc: 87bccb7c30 | (Luis F. Uceta)++ | doc/Language/functions.pod6
Make changes as requested
linkable6 DOC#3389 [open]: github.com/Raku/doc/issues/3389 [docs][new] Document named arguments as adverbs
doc: d24b00a360 | (Juan Julián Merelo Guervós)++ (committed using GitHub Web editor) | doc/Language/functions.pod6
Merge pull request #3438 from uzluisf/master

Add few examples for named arguments as adverbs
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melezhik .tell jnthn RakuDist test fails for Spreadsheet::XLSX 18:33
tellable6 melezhik, I'll pass your message to jnthn
melezhik probably needs to increase the verbosity on zef side
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[Coke] grants.perlfoundation.org/#raku - if someone has suggestions about possible grants for the Raku community, but can't implement the proposal, please consider adding the suggestion to this page. (link to github at top) 18:57
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timotimo rakudo/rakudo on github has a "used by" that says you can install rakudo via npm, and it lists perl6-js-roast-test-runner as a dependent; anything we can do to make it not look as barren? 20:09
the only mention of "javascript" in the readme is "ALL refers to moar, jim, and javascript backends" 20:11
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melezhik I just began one course on algorithms and data structures, all the examples are given in java. I am pretty sure it's possible to find a Raku implimentation 20:33
say I need stacks and queues , nothing fancy , just basic things
where can I find Raku examples ( in any forms - code and blog posts ) 20:34
timotimo rosettacode.org/wiki/Queue/Definition#Raku - sadly, this just uses the fact that you can use an array to behave exactly like a fifo; i assume your datastructures course begins with linked-list based queues and such? 20:42
rosettacode.org/wiki/Stack#Raku - same situation here 20:43
melezhik yeah
timotimo there's Concurrent::Queue and perhaps also Stack?
but they are a bit extra special because lockless and built for multithreaded operation
melezhik anyway, thanks I will probably take a look
rosettacode.org/wiki/Queue/Definition#Raku is probably what I looked, thanks! 20:44
timotimo modules.raku.org/dist/Concurrent::...ack.pm6#L8
melezhik this one is probable for stack built by linked lists? 20:45
timotimo yes, it uses nodes building up a linked list, and the nodes are read-only 20:46
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timotimo that's how it can do its thing safely 20:46
cpan-raku New module released to CPAN! Font::FreeType (0.2.3) by 03WARRINGD 20:47
melezhik I wonder what is _main_ difference from classical queue? it deals with concurrent push/pops? sorry if it's silly question ))) 20:48
timotimo probably mostly "the stuff about concurrency looks strange if you're not used to what it does"? 20:49
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Geth ecosystem: ea1f3b6ead | thundergnat++ (committed using GitHub Web editor) | META.list
Add SDL2-ttf

See github.com/thundergnat/SDL2-ttf Mostly working. Need to track down tests that fail during CI but not locally.
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